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Thread: Why is matam haram?

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    Account Restricted Array Zuzubu's Avatar
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    Default Why is matam haram?


    Shi'a people are hitting themselves in the day of Ashoura as we all know. But why is that haram? (provide hadith and verses please).

    I've been looking many places over the net, and they all say Matam is halal, so please explain why it is haram to mourn for those pll at Karbala wars..


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    ★ Islam is THE way ★ Array Insaanah's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why is matam haram?




    Al-Bukhaari (1294) and Muslim (103) narrated that ‘Abd-Allaah ibn Mas’ood (may Allaah be pleased with him) said: The Prophet said: “He is not one of us who strikes his cheeks, rends his garment, or cries with the cry of the Jaahiliyyah.”

    Read more here:

    http://www.islamqa.com/en/ref/101268/shia%20ashoora

    Last edited by Insaanah; 03-07-2011 at 08:58 PM.


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    Those who bear the Throne, and all who are round about it, glorify the praises of their Lord and believe in Him and ask forgiveness for those who believe (saying): "Our Lord, You have encompassed all things in mercy and knowledge, so forgive those who have repented and followed Your way and protect them from the punishment of Hellfire.
    Our Lord, and admit them to Gardens of Eden which You have promised them and whoever was righteous among their fathers, their spouses and their offspring. Indeed, it is You who is the Exalted in Might, the Wise.
    And protect them from the evil consequences [of their deeds]. And he whom You protect from evil consequences that Day - You will have given him mercy. And that is the great attainment." (40:7-9)
    And you will see the angels surrounding the Throne, glorifying the praises of their Lord. And it will be judged between them in truth, and it will be said, "Praise be to Allah, Lord of the worlds!" (39:75)

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    On vacation. Array aamirsaab's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why is matam haram?


    Because it's retarded.


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    Default Re: Why is matam haram?


    Aamirsaab I know it is, but I still respect what some people believe, so where is your source? There has a message of each subject to thou, in the holy books.


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    Default Re: Why is matam haram?


    ^Insaanah has provided you with it.




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    Default Re: Why is matam haram?


    Is it true that the prophet (saw) celebrated the day of Ashura?(and fasted) As saying that it is the day Musa protected Banu Israel from the enemies? I read an hadith saying that, but do anyone know about this? Because the link says that celebrating it is haram.


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    Default Re: Why is matam haram?





    Fasting on the Day of 'Ashura because Allah SubHanahu wa Ta'ala saved Musa 'Alaihis Salam and Bani Israeel on that day from Fir'aun is entirely different than matam.
    Matam is wailing for the Shuhada of Karbala which is not allowed.


    Even if wailing was allowed, you would wail for people who are dead. But the Shuhada are not dead. Think not of those, who are slain in the way of Allah, as dead. Nay, they are living. With their Lord they have provision. [3:169] It would be foolish to lament on someone who's not dead.




    And complete the Hajj and 'umrah for Allah. But if you are prevented, then [offer] what can be obtained with ease of sacrificial animals. And do not shave your heads until the sacrificial animal has reached its place of slaughter. And whoever among you is ill or has an ailment of the head [making shaving necessary must offer] a ransom of fasting [three days] or charity or sacrifice. And when you are secure, then whoever performs 'umrah [during the Hajj months] followed by Hajj [offers] what can be obtained with ease of sacrificial animals. And whoever cannot find [or afford such an animal] - then a fast of three days during Hajj and of seven when you have returned [home]. Those are ten complete [days]. This is for those whose family is not in the area of al-Masjid al-Haram. And fear Allah and know that Allah is severe in penalty. [Surah Al-Baqarah: 196]
    Read More ...



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    Default Re: Why is matam haram?


    Then why is so many shi'a schoolars all over Iraq, Iran, Kuwait, Lebanon claiming that Matam is good?


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    Default Re: Why is matam haram?


    Quote Originally Posted by Zuzubu View Post
    Is it true that the prophet (saw) celebrated the day of Ashura?(and fasted)
    Depends on the definition of celebrating, some see it as dancing and singing, others as fasting. Also never read a hadith and automatically think it's true, how sure do you know it is authentic? Not fabricated etc. Post the hadith you read for more insight iA...




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    ★ Islam is THE way ★ Array Insaanah's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why is matam haram?


    Quote Originally Posted by Zuzubu View Post
    Because the link says that celebrating it is haram.
    It says that what shi3as do on ashoora, and the reason they are doing it, is wrong. But we fast on ashoora, following the sunnah. We don't celebrate and we don't mourn.

    What the Shi’ah do on ‘Ashoora’ of beating their chests, slapping their cheeks, striking their shoulders with chains and cutting their heads with swords to let the blood flow are all innovations that have no basis in Islam.
    Quote Originally Posted by Zuzubu View Post
    Is it true that the prophet (saw) celebrated the day of Ashura?(and fasted) As saying that it is the day Musa protected Banu Israel from the enemies?
    With regard to the reason why the Prophet fasted on the day of ‘Ashoora’ and urged the people to do likewise is mentioned in the hadeeth narrated by al-Bukhari (1865) from Ibn ‘Abbaas (may Allah be pleased with him), who said: The Prophet came to Madinah and saw the Jews fasting on the day of ‘Ashoora’. He said, “What is this?” They said, “This is a good day, this is the day when Allah saved the Children of Israel from their enemy and Musa fasted on this day.” He said, “We have greater right to Musa than you.” So he fasted on this day and told the people to fast.

    You can read more about what to do an Ashoora and why, and what the benefits are for us, according to the sunnah, here:

    http://www.islamqa.com/en/ref/21775/ashoora

    Quote Originally Posted by Zuzubu View Post
    Then why is so many shi'a schoolars all over Iraq, Iran, Kuwait, Lebanon claiming that Matam is good?
    Because they are shi'a. Anyone who follows the sunnah of the Prophet will never say that.

    We don't follow shi'a scholars, nor take our deen from them. We follow the sunnah of our beloved Prophet

    Last edited by Insaanah; 03-08-2011 at 06:34 PM.


    (Click on the pink)
    Those who bear the Throne, and all who are round about it, glorify the praises of their Lord and believe in Him and ask forgiveness for those who believe (saying): "Our Lord, You have encompassed all things in mercy and knowledge, so forgive those who have repented and followed Your way and protect them from the punishment of Hellfire.
    Our Lord, and admit them to Gardens of Eden which You have promised them and whoever was righteous among their fathers, their spouses and their offspring. Indeed, it is You who is the Exalted in Might, the Wise.
    And protect them from the evil consequences [of their deeds]. And he whom You protect from evil consequences that Day - You will have given him mercy. And that is the great attainment." (40:7-9)
    And you will see the angels surrounding the Throne, glorifying the praises of their Lord. And it will be judged between them in truth, and it will be said, "Praise be to Allah, Lord of the worlds!" (39:75)

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    Account Restricted Array Zuzubu's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why is matam haram?


    Quote Originally Posted by Insaanah View Post
    al-Bukhari (1865) from Ibn ‘Abbaas (may Allah be pleased with him), who said: The Prophet came to Madinah and saw the Jews fasting on the day of ‘Ashoora’. He said, “What is this?” They said, “This is a good day, this is the day when Allah saved the Children of Israel from their enemy and Musa fasted on this day.” He said, “We have greater right to Musa than you.” So he fasted on this day and told the people to fast.
    Yes it is this hadith. =)

    Is there not a verse from qur'an saying that you can't hit yourself? Is it only some hadith?


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    ★ Islam is THE way ★ Array Insaanah's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why is matam haram?


    Quote Originally Posted by Zuzubu View Post
    Is there not a verse from qur'an saying that you can't hit yourself? Is it only some hadith?
    What do you mean by "only some hadeeth"? The two sources for our deen our Qur'an and sunnah. The sunnah (which is a type of revelation from Allah to the prophet ) is recorded in the hadeeth. So, if the Messenger of Allah is telling you that:

    “He is not one of us who strikes his cheeks, rends his garment, or cries with the cry of the Jaahiliyyah.”

    Is the command of the messenger of Allah not important? Allah, in the Qur'an, actually commands us to obey his Prophet. And remember that not every ruling is in the Qur'an - for example, how to pray each salaat. That does not mean because the details are not in the Qur'an that we make up or own method of prayer. We pray as the Prophet ordered us to.

    Allah has ordered us in many places in the Qur'an to obey the Prophet. Here are only a few:

    Say, (O Muhammad, to mankind): If ye love Allah, follow me; Allah will love you and forgive you your sins. Allah is Forgiving, Merciful. Say: Obey Allah and the messenger. But if they turn away, lo! Allah loveth not the disbelievers (in His guidance). (3:31-32)

    O ye who believe! Obey Allah and obey the messenger, and render not your actions vain. (47:33)

    He who obeys the Messenger has obeyed Allah ; but those who turn away - We have not sent you over them as a guardian. (4:80)


    Therefore, not following the commands of the Prophet is no different from not following the commands of Allah.

    Our bodies are a trust from Allah that we have to look after and respect. If to hit someone else is wrong, then to hit our own bodies is wrong.

    Last edited by Insaanah; 03-08-2011 at 08:00 PM.


    (Click on the pink)
    Those who bear the Throne, and all who are round about it, glorify the praises of their Lord and believe in Him and ask forgiveness for those who believe (saying): "Our Lord, You have encompassed all things in mercy and knowledge, so forgive those who have repented and followed Your way and protect them from the punishment of Hellfire.
    Our Lord, and admit them to Gardens of Eden which You have promised them and whoever was righteous among their fathers, their spouses and their offspring. Indeed, it is You who is the Exalted in Might, the Wise.
    And protect them from the evil consequences [of their deeds]. And he whom You protect from evil consequences that Day - You will have given him mercy. And that is the great attainment." (40:7-9)
    And you will see the angels surrounding the Throne, glorifying the praises of their Lord. And it will be judged between them in truth, and it will be said, "Praise be to Allah, Lord of the worlds!" (39:75)

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    Soldier Through It! Array جوري's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why is matam haram?


    I didn't even understand the question.. sob7an Allah.. you learn something new everyday.. Jazaki Allah khyran sis insaanah.. you're the sweetest of all sweethearts




    If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him.اتبع طرق الهدى ولا يضرك قلة السالكين
    وإياك وطرق الضلالة ولا تغتر بكثرة الهالكين





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    ★ Islam is THE way ★ Array Insaanah's Avatar
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    Default Re: Why is matam haram?


    ^ Baaraka Allahu feeki dearest of all sisters...

    He was asking why Shi3as hitting and beating themselves (as they do with their hands, with knives and chains etc), ripping their clothes, wailing and shouting etc on 10th Muharram (the day which is 3ashoorah), in memory of the Prophets grandson's death/martyrdom, is not allowed. That "mourning" of theirs is called maatam...
    Last edited by Insaanah; 03-09-2011 at 03:52 PM.


    (Click on the pink)
    Those who bear the Throne, and all who are round about it, glorify the praises of their Lord and believe in Him and ask forgiveness for those who believe (saying): "Our Lord, You have encompassed all things in mercy and knowledge, so forgive those who have repented and followed Your way and protect them from the punishment of Hellfire.
    Our Lord, and admit them to Gardens of Eden which You have promised them and whoever was righteous among their fathers, their spouses and their offspring. Indeed, it is You who is the Exalted in Might, the Wise.
    And protect them from the evil consequences [of their deeds]. And he whom You protect from evil consequences that Day - You will have given him mercy. And that is the great attainment." (40:7-9)
    And you will see the angels surrounding the Throne, glorifying the praises of their Lord. And it will be judged between them in truth, and it will be said, "Praise be to Allah, Lord of the worlds!" (39:75)

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