Christ in the Three Abrahamic Faiths

**Ansar Al-'Adl** · **Christ in the Three Abrahamic Faiths -** 03-13-2005

Here we can discuss the message of Prophet Jesus and what is his true position as each abrahamic religion takes a different stance on him.

We will examine his teachings and prophecies and compare the evidence brought by each group.

mule · **Re: Christ in the Three Abrahamic Faiths -** 03-14-2005

These are some of the prophecies that Christians hold dear.

Gen. 49:10. The scepter shall not depart from Judah, nor the student of the law from between his feet, until Shiloh comes, and to him will be a gathering of peoples.

Gen. 3:15
14. And the Lord God said to the serpent, "Because you have done this, cursed be you more than all the cattle and more than all the beasts of the field; you shall walk on your belly, and you shall eat dust all the days of your life.
15. And I shall place hatred between you and between the woman, and between your seed and between her seed. He will crush your head, and you will bite his heel."

Isaiah 7:14 Therefore, the Lord, of His own, shall give you a sign; behold, the young woman is with child, and she shall bear a son, and she shall call his name Immanuel.

Micah 5:1. And you, Bethlehem Ephrathah-you should have been the lowest of the clans of Judah-from you [he] shall emerge for Me, to be a ruler over Israel; and his origin is from of old, from days of yore.

Is.11:1. And a shoot shall spring forth from the stem of Jesse, and a twig shall sprout from his roots.
2. And the spirit of the Lord shall rest upon him, a spirit of wisdom and understanding, a spirit of counsel and heroism, a spirit of knowledge and fear of the Lord.
3. And he shall be animated by the fear of the Lord, and neither with the sight of his eyes shall he judge, nor with the hearing of his ears shall he chastise.
4. And he shall judge the poor justly, and he shall chastise with equity the humble of the earth, and he shall smite the earth with the rod of his mouth and with the breath of his lips he shall put the wicked to death.
5. And righteousness shall be the girdle of his loins, and faith the girdle of his loins.

Is. 40:3. A voice calls, "In the desert, clear the way of the Lord, straighten out in the wilderness, a highway for our God."

Isaiah - Chapter 53
1. Who would have believed our report, and to whom was the arm of the Lord revealed?
2. And he came up like a sapling before it, and like a root from dry ground, he had neither form nor comeliness; and we saw him that he had no appearance. Now shall we desire him?
3. Despised and rejected by men, a man of pains and accustomed to illness, and as one who hides his face from us, despised and we held him of no account.
4. Indeed, he bore our illnesses, and our pains-he carried them, yet we accounted him as plagued, smitten by God and oppressed.
5. But he was pained because of our transgressions, crushed because of our iniquities; the chastisement of our welfare was upon him, and with his wound we were healed.
6. We all went astray like sheep, we have turned, each one on his way, and the Lord accepted his prayers for the iniquity of all of us.
7. He was oppressed, and he was afflicted, yet he would not open his mouth; like a lamb to the slaughter he would be brought, and like a ewe that is mute before her shearers, and he would not open his mouth.
8. From imprisonment and from judgment he is taken, and his generation who shall tell? For he was cut off from the land of the living; because of the transgression of my people, a plague befell them.
9. And he gave his grave to the wicked, and to the wealthy with his kinds of death, because he committed no violence, and there was no deceit in his mouth.
10. And the Lord wished to crush him, He made him ill; if his soul makes itself restitution, he shall see children, he shall prolong his days, and God's purpose shall prosper in his hand.
11. From the toil of his soul he would see, he would be satisfied; with his knowledge My servant would vindicate the just for many, and their iniquities he would bear.
12. Therefore, I will allot him a portion in public, and with the strong he shall share plunder, because he poured out his soul to death, and with transgressors he was counted; and he bore the sin of many, and interceded for the transgressors.

Psalms 22
1. For the conductor, on the ayeleth hashachar, a song of David.
2. My God, my God, why have You forsaken me? [You are] far from my salvation [and] from the words of my moaning.
3. My God, I call out by day and You do not reply, and at night I do not keep silent.
4. But You are holy; You await the praises of Israel.
5. Our ancestors trusted in You; they trusted and You rescued them.
6. They cried out to You and they escaped; they trusted in You and they were not shamed.
7. But I am a worm and not a man; a reproach of man, despised by peoples.
8. All who see me will mock me; they will open their lips, they will shake their head.
9. One should cast his trust upon the Lord, and He will rescue him; He will save him because He delights in him.
10. For You drew me from the womb; You made me secure on my mother's breasts.
11. Upon You, I was cast from birth; from my mother's womb You are my God.
12. Do not distance Yourself from me, for distress is near; for there is none to help.
13. Great bulls have surrounded me; the mighty ones of Bashan encompassed me.
14. They opened their mouth against me [like] a tearing, roaring lion.
15. I was spilled like water, and all my bones were separated; my heart was like wax, melting within my innards.
16. My strength became dried out like a potsherd, and my tongue cleaves to my palate; and You set me down in the dust of death.
17. For dogs have surrounded me; a band of evildoers has encompassed me, like a lion, my hands and feet.
18. I tell about all my bones. They look and gloat over me.
19. They share my garments among themselves and cast lots for my raiment.
20. But You, O Lord, do not distance Yourself; my strength, hasten to my assistance.
21. Save my soul from the sword, my only one from the grip of the dog.
22. Save me from the lion's mouth, as from the horns of the wild oxen You answered me.
23. I will tell Your name to my brothers; in the midst of the congregation I will praise You.
24. You who fear the Lord, praise Him; all the seed of Jacob, honor Him, and fear Him, all the seed of Israel.
25. For He has neither despised nor abhorred the cry of the poor, neither has He hidden His countenance from him; and when he cried out to Him, He hearkened.
26. Because of You is my praise in the great congregation; I pay my vows in the presence of those who fear Him.
27. The humble shall eat and be sated; they shall praise the Lord, those who seek him; your hearts shall live forever.
28. All the ends of the earth shall remember and return to the Lord, and all the families of the nations shall prostrate themselves before You.
29. For the kingship is the Lord's, and He rules over the nations.
30. They shall eat all the best of the earth and prostrate themselves; before Him shall all those who descend to the dust kneel, and He will not quicken his soul.
31. The seed that worships Him; it shall be told to the generation concerning the Lord.
32. They shall come and tell His righteousness to the newborn people, that which He has done.

Psalms 118:22. The stone that the builders rejected became a cornerstone.
23. This was from the Lord; it is wondrous in our eyes.

psalms 2:7. I will tell of the decree; The Lord said to me, "You are My son; this day have I begotten you.

Psalms 16:9. Therefore, my heart rejoiced, and my soul was glad; even my flesh shall dwell in safety.
10. For You shall not forsake my soul to the grave; You shall not allow Your pious one to see the pit.

zeck. 9:99. Be exceedingly happy, O daughter of Zion; Shout, O daughter of Jerusalem. Behold! Your king shall come to you. He is just and victorious; humble, and riding a donkey and a foal, the offspring of [one of] she-donkeys.

Isaiah 52;13. Behold My servant shall prosper; he shall be exalted and lifted up, and he shall be very high.
1. 14. As many wondered about you, "How marred his appearance is from that of a man, and his features from that of people!"
15. So shall he cast down many nations; kings shall shut their mouths because of him, for, what had not been told them they saw, and [at] what they had not heard they gazed.

Gen. 49:10. The scepter shall not depart from Judah, nor the student of the law from between his feet, until Shiloh comes, and to him will be a gathering of peoples.

mule

SpaceFalcon2001 · **Re: Christ in the Three Abrahamic Faiths -** 03-14-2005

all are answered at messiahtruth.com

**Ansar Al-'Adl** · **Re: Christ in the Three Abrahamic Faiths -** 03-14-2005

When you get a chance, could you post the refutations?

SpaceFalcon2001 · **Re: Christ in the Three Abrahamic Faiths -** 03-14-2005

Quote:

Gen. 3:15

http://messiahtruth.com/gen315.html

Quote:

Isaiah 7:14

http://messiahtruth.com/is714a.html

Quote:

Isaiah - Chapter 53

http://messiahtruth.com/isai53a.html
http://messiahtruth.com/isai53b.html
http://messiahtruth.com/isai53c.html

Quote:

Psalms 22

http://messiahtruth.com/psa22.html

Quote:

psalms 2:7

http://messiahtruth.com/psal2.html
and so on, and so forth

mule · **Re: Christ in the Three Abrahamic Faiths -** 03-14-2005

There is nothing to refute. They just are.

SpaceFalcon2001 · **Re: Christ in the Three Abrahamic Faiths -** 03-14-2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by mule

There is nothing to refute. They just are.

Enter groundless acceptance.

Sephiroth · **Re: Christ in the Three Abrahamic Faiths -** 03-14-2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by SpaceFalcon2001

Enter groundless acceptance.

Otherwise known as faith...

mule · **Re: Christ in the Three Abrahamic Faiths -** 03-14-2005

SpaceFalcon2001,

Quote:

Enter groundless acceptance.

I see no reason why these prophecies should not apply to the messiah. I took them from your bible.

mule

SpaceFalcon2001 · **Re: Christ in the Three Abrahamic Faiths -** 03-14-2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by mule

I see no reason why these prophecies should not apply to the messiah. I took them from your bible.

As you apparently did not read into the links the unquestionably disprove their relating to Jesus, and you ignore the real verses that apply to the messiah, no one can help you.

SpaceFalcon2001 · **Re: Christ in the Three Abrahamic Faiths -** 03-14-2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sephiroth

Otherwise known as faith...

In the unreliable NT, sure.

**Ansar Al-'Adl** · **Re: Christ in the Three Abrahamic Faiths -** 03-14-2005

Okay, let's add some substance to the discussion.

Say: O People of the Scripture! Come to an agreement between us and you: that we shall worship none but Allah, and that we shall ascribe no partner unto Him, and that none of us shall take others for lords beside Allah. And if they turn away, then say: Bear witness that we are they who have surrendered (unto Him)

2:136 “Say (O Muslims): We believe in Allah and that which has been sent down to us and that which has been sent down to Abraham, Ishmael, Isaac, Jacob, and the tribes, and that which has been given to Moses and Jesus, and that which has been given to (all) prophets from their Lord. We make no distinction between any of them, and to Him (Allah) we submit.

The Christians say that Christ is the Son of God.
The Jews declare him a blasphemer.

The Muslims stand somewhere in the middle and describe him as a Prophet of God. Is this logical? What does the Qur'an say?

61:6 “And (remember) when Jesus of Mary said: ‘O Children of Israel! Indeed I am the messenger of Allah (sent) to you, confirming the Torah (which came) before me, and giving glad tidings of a messenger to come after me, whose name is Ahmad! But when he came to them with clear proofs, they say: This is mere magic.”

For more info: http://thetruereligion.org/modules/w...?articleid=121

We believe that he was not crucified but was raised up to heaven. He will return and unite the Christians, Jews and Muslims.
http://www.jesuswillreturn.com

I don't think he was God because the Bible does not describe him as God. It depicts him as a human.

Quote:

THE BIRTH OF "GOD"

"God" was created from the seed of David: "Concerning his Son Jesus Christ our Lord, which was made of the SEED of David according to the flesh." (Romans, 1:3)

"God" was the fruit of the loins of David: "Therefore being a prophet, and knowing that God had sworn with an oath to him, that of the fruit of his loins, according to the flesh, he would raise up Christ to sit on his throne." (Acts, 2:30)

The Ancestors of "God": "The generations of Jesus Christ, the son of David, the son of Abraham." (Matthew, 1:1)

The Sex of "God": "And when eight days were accomplished for the circumcising of the child, his name was called Jesus." (Luke, 2:21)

How Mary Conceived and Delivered "God". Mary conceived Jesus like any other woman: "The days were accomplished that she should be delivered," (Luke, 2:6) which means that she went through all the normal stages of pregnancy. Nor was her delivery any different from other expectant mothers: "And she being with child cried, travelling in birth, and pained to be delivered." (Revelation, 12:2)

"God" Sucked The Paps of a Woman: "And it came to pass, as he spake these things, a certain woman of the company lifted up her voice, and said unto him, Blessed is the womb that bare thee, and the paps which thou hast sucked." (Luke, 11:27)

The Country of Origin of "God": "Jesus was born in Bethlehem of Judaea in the days of Herod the king. (Matthew, 2:1)

The Occupation of "God": "Jesus was a carpenter by trade." (Mark, 6:3), "and the son of a carpenter." (Matthew, 13:55)

The Transport of "God": "Behold, thy king cometh unto thee, meek, and sitting upon an ass." (Matthew, 21:5) "And Jesus, when he had found a young ass, sat thereon." (John, 12:14)

The Wining and Dining of "God": "The Son of man came eating and drinking, and they say, behold a man gluttonous, and a winebibber, a friend of publicans and sinners." (Matthew, 11:9; Luke, 7:34)

The Poverty of "God": "And Jesus saith unto him, the foxes have holes, and the birds of the air have nests; but the Son of man hath not where to lay his head." (Matthew, 8:20)

The Meagre Possessions of "God": "Shoes of Jesus" (Luke, 3:16), "Garments and coat of Jesus" (John, 19:23)

"God" Was a Devout Jew: "And in the morning, rising up a great while before day, he went out, and departed into a solitary place, and there prayed." (Mark, 1:35)

"God" Was a Loyal Subject: Jesus was a good citizen, he was loyal to Caesar. He said: "Render therefore unto Caesar the things which are Caesar's; and unto God the things that are God's." (Matthew, 22:21) He paid his tax regularly. (Matthew, 17:24-27)

THE FAMILY OF "GOD"

"God" Was the Son of Joseph: "Philip findeth Nathanael, and saith unto him, we have found him, of whom Moses in the law, and the prophets, did write, Jesus of Nazareth, the son of Joseph" (John, 1:45)

Brothers and Brothers-in-law of "God": "And when he was come into his own country, he taught them in their synagogue, insomuch that they were astonished, and said, whence hath this man this wisdom, and these mighty works? Is not this the carpenter's son? Is not his mother called Mary? and his brethren, James, and Joses, and Simon, and Judas? And his sisters, are they not all with us? Whence hath this man all these things? (Matthew, 13:54-56)

THE DEVELOPMENT OF "GOD"

Spiritual Development of "God": "And the child grew, and waxed strong in spirit, filled with wisdom." (Luke, 2:40)

Mental, Physical and Moral Development of "God": "And Jesus increased in wisdom and stature, and in favor with God and man." (Luke, 2:52)

"God" Was 12 Years Old When His Parents Took Him to Jerusalem: "Now his parents went to Jerusalem every year at the feast of the passover. And when he was twelve years old, they went up to Jerusalem after the custom of the feast." (Luke, 2:41-42)

The Powerless "God" (Jesus) said: "I can of mine own self do nothing." (John, 5:30)

"God" Was Ignorant of the Time. Jesus said: "But of that day and that hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels which are in heaven, neither the Son, but the Father." (Mark, 13:32)

"God" Was Ignorant of the Season: "And on the morrow, when they were come from Bethany, he (Jesus) was hungry: and seeing a fig tree afar off having leaves, he came, if haply he might find anything thereon: and when he came to it, he found nothing but leaves; for the time of figs was not yet." (Mark, 11:12-13)

"God" Was Unlettered: "Now about the midst of the feast Jesus went up into the temple, and taught. And the Jews marvelled, saying, How knoweth this man letters, having never learned?" (John, 7:14-15)

"God" Learnt Through Experience: "Learned he obedience by the things which he sufered." (Hebrews, 5:8)

THE TEMPTING OF "GOD"

The Devil Tempted "God" For 40 Days: "And immediately the spirit driveth him into the wilderness. And he was there in the wilderness forty days, tempted of Satan." (Mark, 1:12-13)

The Devil Tempted "God" Continuously: "And when the devil had ended all the temptation, he departed from him for a season." (Luke, 4:13)

Like the Sinners, "God" Was Tempted In All Things: "But (he) was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin." (Hebrews, 4:15)

True God Cannot be Tempted With Evil: "God cannot be tempted with evil, neither tempteth he any man." (James, 1:13)

Only The Ungodly Are Tempted With Evil: "But every man is tempted, when he is drawn away of his own lust, and enticed." (James, 1:14)

THE MISSION OF "GOD"

The Confession and Repentance of "God": before the beginning of his public ministry: "Jesus was baptized by John the Baptist" (Matthew, 3:13), "which signified the confession of sins" (Matthew, 3:6), "and repentance from sins (Matthew, 3:11).

"God" Did Not Come to Save the Sinners: "And when he was alone, they that were about him with the twelve asked of him the parable. And he said unto them, unto you it is given to know the mystery of the kingdom of God: but unto them that without, all these things are done in parables: That seeing they may see, and not perceive; and hearing they may hear, and not understand; lest at any time they should be converted, and their sins should be forgiven them." (Mark, 4:10-12)

THE RACIAL "GOD"

"God" Was a Tribal Jew: "The lion of the tribe of Juda." (Revelation, 5:5)

"God" Came For The Jews Only: "But he answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel."* (Matthew, 15:24)

Racial Discrimination of "God": "These twelve Jesus sent forth, and commanded them, saying, Go not into the way of the Gentiles, and into any city of the Samaritans enter ye not: But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel." (Matthew, 10:5-6)

According to "God", The Gentiles Are Dogs: "It is not meet to take the children's bread, and to cast it to dogs." (matthew, 15:26)

The Kingdom of "God": And he (Jesus) shall reign over THE HOUSE OF JACOB for ever; and of his kingdom there shall be no end." (Luke, 1:33)

The Titles of "God": "The king of the Jews" (Matthew, 2:2), "The king of Israel" (John, 1:49; 12:13)

A "GOD" UNLIKE THE GOD

A Hungry "God": "And when he had fasted forty days and forty nights, he was afterward an hungered." (Matthew 4:2), "Now in the morning as he returned into the city, he hungered." (Matthew, 21:18), "and on the morrow, when they were come from Bethany, he was hungry." (Mark, 11:12)

A Thirsty "God": "(He) saith, I thirst." (John, 19:28)

A Sleepy "God": "He was asleep." (Matthew, 8:24), "He fell asleep" (Luke, 8:23), "And he was in the hinder part of the ship, asleep on a pillow." (Mark, 4:38)

A Weary "God": Jesus therefore, being wearied with his journey, sat thus on the well." (John, 4:6)

A Groaning "God": "He groaned in the spirit, and was troubled." (John, 11:33), "Jesus therefore again groaning in himself cometh to the grave." (John, 11:38)

A Weeping "God": "Jesus wept." (John, 11:35)

A Sorrowing "God": "And (he) began to be sorrowful and very heavy." (Matthew 26:37). "Then saith he unto them, my soul is exceeding sorrowful, even unto death." (Matthew, 26:38)

A Hysterical "God": "And (he) began to be soreamazed and to be very heavy." (Mark, 14:33)

A Weak "God": "And there appeared an angel unto him from heaven, strengthening him." (Luke, 22:43)

THE WARRING "GOD"

The Strong-Arm Method of "God": "And he went into the temple, and began to cast out them that sold therein, and them that bought." (Luke, 19:45). "And the Jews' passover was at hand, and Jesus went up to Jerusalem, and found in the temple those that sold oxen and sheep and doves, and the changers of money sitting: and when he had made a scourge of small cords, he drove them all out of the temple, and the sheep, and the oxen; and poured out the changers' money, and overthrew the tab les."(John, 2:13-15)

The "God" of War: Jesus said: "Think not that I am come to send peace on earth: I came not to send peace, but a sword." (Matthew, 10:34)

The Sabre-Rattling "God": Jesus said: "And he that hath no sword, let him sell his garment, and buy one." (Luke, 22:36)

The "GOD" ON THE RUN

"God" Was Panic-Stricken: "After these things Jesus walked in Galilee: for he would not walk in Jewry, because the Jews sought to kill him." (John, 7:1)

"God" Walked in Fear of the Jews: "Then from that day forth they took counsel together for to put him to death. Jesus therefore walked no more openly among the Jews." (John, 11:53-54)

"God" Has Shown a Clean Pair of Heels: "Therefore they sought again to take him: but he escaped out of their hand." (John, 10:39)

"God" Fled in Disguise: "Then took they up stones to cast at him: but Jesus hid himself, and went out of the temple, going through the midst of them, and so passed by." (John, 8:59)

THE CAPTURE OF "GOD"

A Friend Betrayed the Secret Hiding Place of "God": "And Judas also, which betrayed him, knew the place: for Jesus off-times resorted thither with his disciples. Judas then, having received a band of man and officers from the chief priests and Pharisees, cometh thither with lanterns and torches and weapons." (John, 18:2-3)

"God" Was Arrested, Bound and Led Away: "Then the band and the captain and officers of the Jews took Jesus, and bound him, and led him away." (John, 18:12-13)

"God" Was Humiliated: "And the men that held Jesus mocked him, and smote him. And when they had blindfolded him, they struck him on the face." (Luke, 22:63-64). "Then did they spit in his face, and buffeted him; and others smote him with the palms of their hands." (Matthew, 26:67)

"God" Was Defenseless: "One of the officers which stood by struck Jesus with the palm of his hand", he said: "Why smitest thou me?" (John, 18:22-23)

"God" Was Condemned to Death: "And they all condemned him to be guilty of death." (Mark, 14:64). "They answered and said, he is guilty of death." (Matthew, 26:66)

The Dumb and Docile "God": "He was led as a sheep to the slaughter; and like a lamb dumb before his shearer, so opened he not his mouth." (Acts, 8:32)

THE SUPPOSED END OF "GOD"

The Dying "God": "And Jesus cried with a loud voice, and gave up the ghost." (Mark, 15:37)

The "God" That Was Supposed Dead and Defunct: "Christ died." (Romans, 5:6). "He was dead". (John, 19:33)

The Supposed Corpse of "God": "he (Joseph of Arimathaea) went to Pilate, and begged the body of Jesus. Then Pilate commanded the body to be delivered." (Matthew, 27:58)

The Shroud of "God": "And when Joseph had taken the body, he wrapped it in a clean linen cloth." (Matthew, 27:59)

The Orbituary of The Late And Lamented "God": "Now when the centurion saw what was done, he glorified God, saying, certainly this was a righteous man." (Luke, 23:47)

A couple of questions to ask...
Is it possible from a Jewish perspective, for Christ to be a Prophet? Remember, we are talking about possibility, not whether he was or wasn't.

Is it possible from a Christian perspective, for Christ to be a Prophet? Remember we are talking about possibility, not whether he was or wasn't.

yoshiyahu · **Re: Christ in the Three Abrahamic Faiths -** 03-14-2005

Quote:

Is it possible from a Jewish perspective, for Christ to be a Prophet? Remember, we are talking about possibility, not whether he was or wasn't.

No, because the prophetic era ended before his coming. The prophetic era can only be restored by Eliyahu (Elijah) the Prophet.

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Is it possible from a Christian perspective, for Christ to be a Prophet? Remember we are talking about possibility, not whether he was or wasn't.

I believe that in Christianity, Jesus could be considered a prophet since he is said to have done many things that prophets do (and more)

**Ansar Al-'Adl** · **Re: Christ in the Three Abrahamic Faiths -** 03-14-2005

Quote:

No, because the prophetic era ended before his coming. The prophetic era can only be restored by Eliyahu (Elijah) the Prophet.

Can I have the source please?

mule · **Re: Christ in the Three Abrahamic Faiths -** 03-14-2005

Ansar,

Quote:

Can I have the source please?

Mal 4:5 Behold, I will send you Elijah the prophet before the coming of the great and dreadful day of the LORD:

Yoshiyahu,

Quote:

I believe that in Christianity, Jesus could be considered a prophet since he is said to have done many things that prophets do (and more)

You are correct, Jesus could be.

mule

	(#1 (permalink))
Ansar Al-'Adl Administrator Status: Offline Posts: 5,161 Reputation: 13017 Rep Power: 45 Join Date: Dec 2004 Gender: Way of Life: Muslim	Christ in the Three Abrahamic Faiths - 03-13-2005 Here we can discuss the message of Prophet Jesus and what is his true position as each abrahamic religion takes a different stance on him. We will examine his teachings and prophecies and compare the evidence brought by each group. __________________ The Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: "Surely I was sent to perfect the qualities of righteous character" [Musnad Ahmad, Muwatta Mâlik] Visit Ansâr Al-'Adl's personal page HERE. Excellent resources on Islam listed HERE.

	(#2 (permalink))
mule Member Status: Offline Posts: 76 Reputation: 10 Rep Power: 23 Join Date: Mar 2005 Gender:	Re: Christ in the Three Abrahamic Faiths - 03-14-2005 These are some of the prophecies that Christians hold dear. Gen. 49:10. The scepter shall not depart from Judah, nor the student of the law from between his feet, until Shiloh comes, and to him will be a gathering of peoples. Gen. 3:15 14. And the Lord God said to the serpent, "Because you have done this, cursed be you more than all the cattle and more than all the beasts of the field; you shall walk on your belly, and you shall eat dust all the days of your life. 15. And I shall place hatred between you and between the woman, and between your seed and between her seed. He will crush your head, and you will bite his heel." Isaiah 7:14 Therefore, the Lord, of His own, shall give you a sign; behold, the young woman is with child, and she shall bear a son, and she shall call his name Immanuel. Micah 5:1. And you, Bethlehem Ephrathah-you should have been the lowest of the clans of Judah-from you [he] shall emerge for Me, to be a ruler over Israel; and his origin is from of old, from days of yore. Is.11:1. And a shoot shall spring forth from the stem of Jesse, and a twig shall sprout from his roots. 2. And the spirit of the Lord shall rest upon him, a spirit of wisdom and understanding, a spirit of counsel and heroism, a spirit of knowledge and fear of the Lord. 3. And he shall be animated by the fear of the Lord, and neither with the sight of his eyes shall he judge, nor with the hearing of his ears shall he chastise. 4. And he shall judge the poor justly, and he shall chastise with equity the humble of the earth, and he shall smite the earth with the rod of his mouth and with the breath of his lips he shall put the wicked to death. 5. And righteousness shall be the girdle of his loins, and faith the girdle of his loins. Is. 40:3. A voice calls, "In the desert, clear the way of the Lord, straighten out in the wilderness, a highway for our God." Isaiah - Chapter 53 1. Who would have believed our report, and to whom was the arm of the Lord revealed? 2. And he came up like a sapling before it, and like a root from dry ground, he had neither form nor comeliness; and we saw him that he had no appearance. Now shall we desire him? 3. Despised and rejected by men, a man of pains and accustomed to illness, and as one who hides his face from us, despised and we held him of no account. 4. Indeed, he bore our illnesses, and our pains-he carried them, yet we accounted him as plagued, smitten by God and oppressed. 5. But he was pained because of our transgressions, crushed because of our iniquities; the chastisement of our welfare was upon him, and with his wound we were healed. 6. We all went astray like sheep, we have turned, each one on his way, and the Lord accepted his prayers for the iniquity of all of us. 7. He was oppressed, and he was afflicted, yet he would not open his mouth; like a lamb to the slaughter he would be brought, and like a ewe that is mute before her shearers, and he would not open his mouth. 8. From imprisonment and from judgment he is taken, and his generation who shall tell? For he was cut off from the land of the living; because of the transgression of my people, a plague befell them. 9. And he gave his grave to the wicked, and to the wealthy with his kinds of death, because he committed no violence, and there was no deceit in his mouth. 10. And the Lord wished to crush him, He made him ill; if his soul makes itself restitution, he shall see children, he shall prolong his days, and God's purpose shall prosper in his hand. 11. From the toil of his soul he would see, he would be satisfied; with his knowledge My servant would vindicate the just for many, and their iniquities he would bear. 12. Therefore, I will allot him a portion in public, and with the strong he shall share plunder, because he poured out his soul to death, and with transgressors he was counted; and he bore the sin of many, and interceded for the transgressors. Psalms 22 1. For the conductor, on the ayeleth hashachar, a song of David. 2. My God, my God, why have You forsaken me? [You are] far from my salvation [and] from the words of my moaning. 3. My God, I call out by day and You do not reply, and at night I do not keep silent. 4. But You are holy; You await the praises of Israel. 5. Our ancestors trusted in You; they trusted and You rescued them. 6. They cried out to You and they escaped; they trusted in You and they were not shamed. 7. But I am a worm and not a man; a reproach of man, despised by peoples. 8. All who see me will mock me; they will open their lips, they will shake their head. 9. One should cast his trust upon the Lord, and He will rescue him; He will save him because He delights in him. 10. For You drew me from the womb; You made me secure on my mother's breasts. 11. Upon You, I was cast from birth; from my mother's womb You are my God. 12. Do not distance Yourself from me, for distress is near; for there is none to help. 13. Great bulls have surrounded me; the mighty ones of Bashan encompassed me. 14. They opened their mouth against me [like] a tearing, roaring lion. 15. I was spilled like water, and all my bones were separated; my heart was like wax, melting within my innards. 16. My strength became dried out like a potsherd, and my tongue cleaves to my palate; and You set me down in the dust of death. 17. For dogs have surrounded me; a band of evildoers has encompassed me, like a lion, my hands and feet. 18. I tell about all my bones. They look and gloat over me. 19. They share my garments among themselves and cast lots for my raiment. 20. But You, O Lord, do not distance Yourself; my strength, hasten to my assistance. 21. Save my soul from the sword, my only one from the grip of the dog. 22. Save me from the lion's mouth, as from the horns of the wild oxen You answered me. 23. I will tell Your name to my brothers; in the midst of the congregation I will praise You. 24. You who fear the Lord, praise Him; all the seed of Jacob, honor Him, and fear Him, all the seed of Israel. 25. For He has neither despised nor abhorred the cry of the poor, neither has He hidden His countenance from him; and when he cried out to Him, He hearkened. 26. Because of You is my praise in the great congregation; I pay my vows in the presence of those who fear Him. 27. The humble shall eat and be sated; they shall praise the Lord, those who seek him; your hearts shall live forever. 28. All the ends of the earth shall remember and return to the Lord, and all the families of the nations shall prostrate themselves before You. 29. For the kingship is the Lord's, and He rules over the nations. 30. They shall eat all the best of the earth and prostrate themselves; before Him shall all those who descend to the dust kneel, and He will not quicken his soul. 31. The seed that worships Him; it shall be told to the generation concerning the Lord. 32. They shall come and tell His righteousness to the newborn people, that which He has done. Psalms 118:22. The stone that the builders rejected became a cornerstone. 23. This was from the Lord; it is wondrous in our eyes. psalms 2:7. I will tell of the decree; The Lord said to me, "You are My son; this day have I begotten you. Psalms 16:9. Therefore, my heart rejoiced, and my soul was glad; even my flesh shall dwell in safety. 10. For You shall not forsake my soul to the grave; You shall not allow Your pious one to see the pit. zeck. 9:99. Be exceedingly happy, O daughter of Zion; Shout, O daughter of Jerusalem. Behold! Your king shall come to you. He is just and victorious; humble, and riding a donkey and a foal, the offspring of [one of] she-donkeys. Isaiah 52;13. Behold My servant shall prosper; he shall be exalted and lifted up, and he shall be very high. 1. 14. As many wondered about you, "How marred his appearance is from that of a man, and his features from that of people!" 15. So shall he cast down many nations; kings shall shut their mouths because of him, for, what had not been told them they saw, and [at] what they had not heard they gazed. Gen. 49:10. The scepter shall not depart from Judah, nor the student of the law from between his feet, until Shiloh comes, and to him will be a gathering of peoples. mule

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SpaceFalcon2001 اليهودي Status: Offline Posts: 311 Reputation: 68 Rep Power: 23 Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Ohio, USA Gender: Way of Life: Jewish	Re: Christ in the Three Abrahamic Faiths - 03-14-2005 all are answered at messiahtruth.com __________________ سلام الله اكبر لا إله إلا الله أمّة إسرائيل حيّه هذا أرضي و بلدي

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Ansar Al-'Adl Administrator Status: Offline Posts: 5,161 Reputation: 13017 Rep Power: 45 Join Date: Dec 2004 Gender: Way of Life: Muslim	Re: Christ in the Three Abrahamic Faiths - 03-14-2005 When you get a chance, could you post the refutations? __________________ The Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said: "Surely I was sent to perfect the qualities of righteous character" [Musnad Ahmad, Muwatta Mâlik] Visit Ansâr Al-'Adl's personal page HERE. Excellent resources on Islam listed HERE.

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mule Member Status: Offline Posts: 76 Reputation: 10 Rep Power: 23 Join Date: Mar 2005 Gender:	Re: Christ in the Three Abrahamic Faiths - 03-14-2005 There is nothing to refute. They just are.