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kadafi
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Default Why do you reject Islam - 03-24-2005

Peace!

A brother on an another inspired me with this idea of askin' the non-muslims why they reject Islam

What are your reasons that enables you not to embracing Islam?

Thanks in advance!
   
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Osman
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Default Re: Why do you reject Islam - 03-24-2005



Yeah, thats a good question.

Instead of asking 'Why do you not accept Islam' ask 'Why do you reject Islam'? Which is kinda different as the intelligent ones amongst us will have gathered . . .


   
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Sinner
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Default Re: Why do you reject Islam - 03-25-2005

As a Christian, it is not so much a case of rejecting Islam as it is accepting the Biblical Christ. There is a leap of faith involved but it is not a blind one. Islam provides a version of Jesus which is opposed and opposite to that of the Gospels. Logically both may be wrong but both can not be right. Accepting the Christ and message of the Bible, means automatic rejection of other claims.
   
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root
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Default Re: Why do you reject Islam - 03-25-2005

Islam is nothing more than a religous beleif the same as Judaism and christianity but in a slightly different flavour.
   
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Default Re: Why do you reject Islam - 03-25-2005

Quote:
Originally Posted by root
Islam is nothing more than a religous beleif the same as Judaism and christianity but in a slightly different flavour.
yes the slight difference in flavour being islam was the latter being the last and final message to the whole of mankind.

the similarity being they all came from the same god.
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Brother_Mujahid
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Default Re: Why do you reject Islam - 03-25-2005

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sinner
As a Christian, it is not so much a case of rejecting Islam as it is accepting the Biblical Christ. There is a leap of faith involved but it is not a blind one. Islam provides a version of Jesus which is opposed and opposite to that of the Gospels. Logically both may be wrong but both can not be right. Accepting the Christ and message of the Bible, means automatic rejection of other claims.
i dont understand, you accept the prophets that came before isa (jesus peace be upon him) yet you reject the prophet which came after. likewise the jews rejected two which proceeded the former.

i still don't understand how the conclusion that isa (as) was sent as a prophet and was taken to be the son of god or god himself. (astaghfirullah)
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Default Re: Why do you reject Islam - 03-25-2005

Although I would be satisfied with the Muslim definition of God, I could never accept the Quran which is too much of a compilation of Middle-Eastern religious traditions, which contains verses I would be ashamed to ascribe to God, and which is sometimes written in a rather bad literary style.
   
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Default Re: Why do you reject Islam - 03-25-2005

Quote:
Originally Posted by mansio
Although I would be satisfied with the Muslim definition of God, I could never accept the Quran which is too much of a compilation of Middle-Eastern religious traditions, which contains verses I would be ashamed to ascribe to God, and which is sometimes written in a rather bad literary style.
seems you have a problem with the translation
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Default Re: Why do you reject Islam - 03-25-2005

Quote:
Originally Posted by mansio
Although I would be satisfied with the Muslim definition of God, I could never accept the Quran which is too much of a compilation of Middle-Eastern religious traditions, which contains verses I would be ashamed to ascribe to God, and which is sometimes written in a rather bad literary style.
Is this the English translation because i very much doubt the classical arabic version can be described as bad?
   
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Default Re: Why do you reject Islam - 03-25-2005

Don't misunderstand me. I said the style of the Quran is SOMETIMES bad, not always.
In many instances the style is magnificent and that would be enough to rank its author among the great writers.
We are discussing about a book supposedly written by God. That book should be perfect from beginning to end as God is perfect.
   
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Default Re: Why do you reject Islam - 03-25-2005

Quote:
Originally Posted by mansio
Don't misunderstand me. I said the style of the Quran is SOMETIMES bad, not always.
In many instances the style is magnificent and that would be enough to rank its author among the great writers.
We are discussing about a book supposedly written by God. That book should be perfect from beginning to end as God is perfect.
true

so what imperfection do you see in the quran (it could just be a misunderstanding on your behalf)
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Default Re: Why do you reject Islam - 03-25-2005

Quote:
i dont understand, you accept the prophets that came before isa (jesus peace be upon him) yet you reject the prophet which came after. likewise the jews rejected two which proceeded the former.
The Prophets spoke of Christ -

Luk 24:44 And he said unto them, These are the words which I spake unto you, while I was yet with you, that all things must be fulfilled, which were written in the law of Moses, and in the prophets, and in the psalms, concerning me.
Luk 24:45 Then opened he their understanding, that they might understand the Scriptures,

What the disbelivers had to say of Jesus -

Joh 10:31 Then the Jews took up stones again to stone him.
Joh 10:32 Jesus answered them, Many good works have I showed you from my Father; for which of those works do ye stone me?
Joh 10:33 The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone thee not; but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God.

What the Angel had to say -

Luk 1:30 And the angel said unto her, Fear not, Mary: for thou hast found favor with God.
Luk 1:31 And, behold, thou shalt conceive in thy womb, and bring forth a son, and shalt call his name JESUS.
Luk 1:32 He shall be great, and shall be called the Son of the Highest: and the Lord God shall give unto him the throne of his father David:
Luk 1:33 And he shall reign over the house of Jacob forever; and of his kingdom there shall be no end.
Luk 1:34 Then said Mary unto the angel, How shall this be, seeing I know not a man?
Luk 1:35 And the angel answered and said unto her, The Holy Ghost shall come upon thee, and the power of the Highest shall overshadow thee: therefore also that holy thing which shall be born of thee shall be called the Son of God.

What the devils had to say -

Mat 8:29 And, behold, they cried out, saying, What have we to do with thee, Jesus, thou Son of God? art thou come hither to torment us before the time?

What Jesus disciples had to say -

Mat 16:15 He saith unto them, But whom say ye that I am?
Mat 16:16 And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.
Mat 16:17 And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Bar-jona: for flesh and blood
hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.

What the Scribes said -

The scribes standing by ask: "Who can forgive sins but God alone?" Jesus responds: "the Son of Man has authority on earth to forgive sins" (Luke 21, 24).

Jesus says he is the Lord of the Sabbath, that is to say, God -

Luk 6:5 And he said unto them, That the Son of man is Lord also of the sabbath.

Quote:
yet you reject the prophet which came after
Many prophets came after Jesus, he warned that they would, it is just a question of which ones one is willing to accept or reject.

Mat 7:15 Beware of false prophets, which come to you in sheep's clothing, but inwardly they are ravening wolves.

Paul writes -

Gal 1:6 I marvel that ye are so soon removed from him that called you into the grace of Christ unto another gospel:
Gal 1:7 Which is not another; but there be some that trouble you, and would pervert the gospel of Christ.
Gal 1:8 But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.

If Paul was so wrong about Jesus, why did the Apostles accept Paul as one of their own and claimed that his writings were Scripture? Was Jesus such a bad prophet that he choose disciples who would distort his own teachings and accept false teachers within a few years after he was gone? I don't think so.

Last edited by Sinner; 03-25-2005 at 05:43 PM.
   
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Ansar Al-'Adl
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Default Re: Why do you reject Islam - 03-25-2005

Mansio,
I'd be very interested to know which verses you find difficult to attribute to God.

Sinner,
Actually, the Islamic view of Christ as a Prophet is a stronger message in the New Testament, than the view that he is God.
I'd be happy to discuss this with you in the thread on Christ in the three abrahamic faiths.

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Default Re: Why do you reject Islam - 03-25-2005

Very intresting topic.

Yes I'd like to know too Mansio
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Default Re: Why do you reject Islam - 03-25-2005

Here are a few verses that shocked me :

2-228)... but men have precedence over them (the women)...

4-34)... and those (women) you fear their rebellion, admonish them, leave them alone in their rooms and beat them...

23-1) How happy the believers 5) who guard their chastity 6) except with their wives or their slave-girls...
[ The latter actually written the "belongings of their right" which means the slaves or captives a Muslim can acquire at war (his right hand holding a weapon) or on a market (his right hand holding a purse) ]

5-33) Such is the reward of those who make war against God or against his Messenger, and of those who spread corruption on the earth : they will be killed or crucified, or their hands and their opposite feet will be cut off, or they will be expelled from the country...

18-85) (Dhű l-Qarnayn) followed a way. 86) As he reached the setting of the sun, he found it setting in a boiling (or muddy) spring...

67-5) We have adorned the sky of the world with lamps, with which We made what is needed to pelt the devils...

Some childish stories from Jewish folktales about Solomon listening to ants, sending birds into battle, or from Christian stories about Jesus making birds of clay, speaking from the cradle ...

I would spend two or three days quoting all of them.
   
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