Gang Rape / Rape - Page 6

Musaafir · **Re: Gang Rape / Rape -** 10-02-2008

Execute em..no ifs no buts..The crime they commit is sick. There's no use in trying to be all soft towards them or anything. It's the sickest crime imaginable and the no-one but the victim would be able to know what they're going through.

Al-Zaara · **Re: Gang Rape / Rape -** 10-02-2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by alcurad

no it wouldn't lower you to their level,
why would it?

If you read my whole post in context, I think you'd better understand what I tried to say. These feelings and thoughts ain't easy to put into words.

It's easy to hurt someone, to hit them, to make them suffer. I could do it to someone, you could. And these rapists did that, they could do it too. Now to fight fire with fire, there are only ashes left in the end. Of course, one horrible person less, but what does this do to you? As a person, as a Muslim? Or the victim? I mean, we think by eliminating the factor that made the problems we have cleared our problems and the results of it. Not neccessarily.

I still feel life-time can also be used.

These rapists probably don't think anything horrible will happen after they die, so by hurting them there right that moment, it isn't even doing the purpose you want to. Make them suffer and stuff. Nothing of that is the same of what the victim goes through. I find it hard to say pay the same way, hurt them as much. By killing, you only give that moment of pain and then Allah. By keeping them alive, or tortuing all life-time, you give them long, life-time suffering, then Allah. It's not of course clear like this at all, but I think it's worth thinking of that side too.

I still have to agree with this, for I know my first thought would be to kill:

Quote:

I would get satisfaction through killing them only if I could do it myself.

sharknet · **Re: Gang Rape / Rape -** 10-02-2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by barrio79

There were several high profile gang rapes in Sydney Australia 5 years ago , and a some community groups complained and campaigned that the sentences meted out were far too strong/harsh as it was the victims fault in these sorts of crimes .
.

Whats dis post mean what sorta comunity would stick up for a pack rapest

abdunnur · **Re: Gang Rape / Rape -** 10-03-2008

There is no truth low without islamic low! But we can not fallow islamic low if it no exist. We must respect low of country where we live. We have no doubt, in Future world Allah will be LOW! There is very different country about low. About rape, America (USA) is better than more others. In Europe-the biggest problem is how to make comfortable jale(prison) for man of rape and crime deeds-. In Pakistan is normal to some cruel and stupid gay attack to a woman by acid and MADE her blind and -with unhuman ugly face-, or cut her part of face...cos SHE DOESNT WANT HIM LIKE HER HUSBAND!!!!!!
For govermant and police in Pakistan it is normal?????? Pakistan is full of good muslims, i dont know what they do to try stop it.
In my country (Bosnia) persons under 18 can do all kind of crimes, low is -no exist for them. In this year,they made fire (burn) an old woma, killed child in tram,...
THEY ARE UNDER 18!?
How can i see, in America is better.
Rape is awfull things, raper become in prison more cruel, and victim will have big problems to back in normal life. Rape is destroying of being,and lot of people cant understand that prostitute woman can be raped. For us, muslims, patience is the most important. This life is short and after ....

**Saifur-Rahmaan** · **Re: Gang Rape / Rape -** 10-07-2008

The law of Allaah (subhaanahu wa ta'aala) is clear!

Quote:

What is the ruling on the crime of rape in Islam?.

Praise be to Allaah.

The Arabic word ightisaab refers to taking something wrongfully by force. It is now used exclusively to refer to transgression against the honour of women by force (rape).

This is an abhorrent crime that is forbidden in all religions and in the minds of all wise people and those who are possessed of sound human nature. All earthly systems and laws regard this action as abhorrent and impose the strictest penalties on it, except a few states which waive the punishment if the rapist marries his victim! This is indicative of a distorted mind let alone a lack of religious commitment on the part of those who challenge Allaah in making laws. We do not know of any love or compassion that could exist between the aggressor and his victim, especially since the pain of rape cannot be erased with the passage of time – as it is said. Hence many victims of rape have attempted to commit suicide and many of them have succeeded, The failure of these marriages is proven and they are accompanied by nothing but humiliation and suffering for the woman.

Islam has a clear stance which states that this repugnant action is haraam and imposes a deterrent punishment on the one who commits it.

Islam closes the door to the criminal who wants to commit this crime. Western studies have shown that most rapists are already criminals who commit their crimes under the influence of alcohol and drugs, and they take advantage of the fact that their victims are walking alone in isolated places, or staying in the house alone. These studies also show that what the criminals watch on the media and the semi-naked styles of dress in which women go out, also lead to the commission of this reprehensible crime.

The laws of Islam came to protect women's honour and modesty. Islam forbids women to wear clothes that are not modest and to travel without a mahram; it forbids a woman to shake hands with a non-mahram man. Islam encourages young men and women to marry early, and many other rulings which close the door to rape. Hence it comes as no surprise when we hear or read that most of these crimes occur in permissive societies which are looked up to by some Muslims as examples of civilization and refinement! In America – for example – International Amnesty stated in a 2004 report entitled “Stop Violence Against Women” that every 90 seconds a woman was raped during that year. What kind of life are these people living? What refinement and civilization do they want the Muslim women to take part in?

The punishment for rape in Islam is same as the punishment for zina, which is stoning if the perpetrator is married, and one hundred lashes and banishment for one year if he is not married.

Some scholars also say that he is required to pay a mahr to the woman.

Imam Maalik (may Allaah have mercy on him) said:

In our view the man who rapes a woman, whether she is a virgin or not, if she is a free woman he must pay a “dowry” like that of her peers, and if she is a slave he must pay whatever has been detracted from her value. The punishment is to be carried out on the rapist and there is no punishment for the woman who has been raped, whatever the case. End quote.

Al-Muwatta’, 2/734

Shaykh Salmaan al-Baaji (may Allaah have mercy on him) said:

In the case of a woman who is forced (raped): if she is a free woman, the one who forced her must pay her a “dowry” like that of her peers, and the hadd punishment is to be carried out on him. This is the view of al-Shaafa’i, and it is the view of al-Layth, and it was also narrated from ‘Ali ibn Abi Taalib (may Allaah be pleased with him).

Abu Haneefah and al-Thawri said: the hadd punishment is to be carried out on him but he is not obliged to pay the “dowry”.

The evidence for what we say is that the hadd punishment and the “dowry” are two rights, one of which is the right of Allaah and the other is the right of the other person. So they may be combined, as in the case of a thief whose hand is cut off and he is required to return the stolen goods. End quote.

Al-Muntaha Sharh al-Muwatta’, 5/268, 269

Ibn ‘Abd al-Barr (may Allaah have mercy on him) said:

The scholars are unanimously agreed that the rapist is to be subjected to the hadd punishment if there is clear evidence against him that he deserves the hadd punishment, or if he admits to that. Otherwise, he is to be punished (i.e., if there is no proof that the hadd punishment for zina may be carried out against him because he does not confess, and there are not four witnesses, then the judge may punish him and stipulate a punishment that will deter him and others like him). There is no punishment for the woman if it is true that he forced her and overpowered her, which may be proven by her screaming and shouting for help. End quote.

Al-Istidhkaar, 7/146

Secondly:

The rapist is subject to the hadd punishment for zina, even if the rape was not carried out at knife-point or gun-point. If the use of a weapon was threatened, then he is a muhaarib, and is to be subjected to the hadd punishment described in the verse in which Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

“The recompense of those who wage war against Allaah and His Messenger and do mischief in the land is only that they shall be killed or crucified or their hands and their feet be cut off from opposite sides, or be exiled from the land. That is their disgrace in this world, and a great torment is theirs in the Hereafter”

[al-Maaidah 5:33]

So the judge has the choice of the four punishments mentioned in this verse, and may choose whichever he thinks is most suitable to attain the objective, which is to spread peace and security in society, and ward off evildoers and aggressors.

And Allaah knows best

Source: http://www.islam-qa.com/en/ref/72338

dilkadr · **Re: Gang Rape / Rape -** 10-07-2008

Modern world is not the ideal world - so is its practices... Unfortunately, we have to spend given time in this world before we moved to next world i.e. janat

abdunnur · **Re: Gang Rape / Rape -** 10-07-2008

Uh... I kiss knowledge of safiuRahman!
I have problem with my english, and did not sure did I understand you well.
You said...same treatment for -zina and rape-?!
I can not understand and cant accept it. But, if I be sure that is islamic rules I will accept.
Zina is when two persons -want. Rape is when one person attack to other, and use power, strenght, bit, hit, violence...
In -zina- persons enjoy, in -rape- 1 person suffer, have trauma...
How can be same, how can be treated of low -like same?
selam

abdunnur · **Re: Gang Rape / Rape -** 10-07-2008

Selam Dilkadr!
Yes, all of muslims know that no absolute justice here, in the Earth...
But it is no answer for everything, sometime we must try to get answers Here. How I see you are from Pakistan. I dont accuse you for anything, and you are not guilty for happening in your country...but...
Do you have an idea what muslims should to do to try stop violence to woman in your country? I dont recommend agressive demonstration, but i think, muslims there must take it serious, speak about it and call(invite) progressive -forces- from other country to make pressure to goverment to punish and stop -cuting part of face, and acid attack. Violence is everywhere, but problem of Pakistan is goverment and judgement. When life of a girl or woman be destroyed -it is normal familly relationship-!
And muslims prefer silence!

north_malaysian · **Re: Gang Rape / Rape -** 10-08-2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by chacha_jalebi

personally, i think rapists should in turn be raped by gay men seriously and then they should be executed

gay men? I dont think Islam allows that....

Z-Blade · **Re: Gang Rape / Rape -** 10-08-2008

,

I say BURN the ANIMALS ALIVE!! BUurrn THEM!! Only kidding, we're not allowed to burn people alive as a punishment ASTAGHFIRULLAH (unless if someone murders someone this way then you can do it to them or something).

Stone them to death or whatever Allah has ordained as a punishment for these beasts. It's an insult to call them animals, animals would never do this, they are lower than animals and lower than DIRT.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Umu 'Isa

I know someone who was gang raped when she was 13 years old. She is now 29 mashaAllah.

I was only 6 years old, so I didn't know until recent years when she told me. The men that did it to her didn't even get punished because there was no evidence placing them at the scene except for her word. They did barbaric things to her and I believe she would of been a completely different person if that didnt happen. She grew up on drugs.. left home when she was 14, did only Allaah knows what... she is non-muslim btw.

The scummy men who do this to women deserve to be executed.

,

Subhanallah! Indeed they should be put to justice in the harshest way.

Quote:

Originally Posted by chacha_jalebi

personally, i think rapists should in turn be raped by gay men seriously and then they should be executed

Quote:

Originally Posted by north_malaysian

gay men? I dont think Islam allows that....

LOL yeah then we'll have to execute the gay men for sodomy straight after

.

Wassalam.

doorster · 03:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by youngsister

Well said, I always tend to put myself in the person shoes, Subxanallah!

Islamically their punishment is death and is so for a reason and Allah swt knows best.

I am not even going to bother looking at it from the rapist view (unless he is mentally ill), people dont realise the affect it has on people, it ruins a person life simple as.

Personally I wouldnt even killing them myself, but of course this isnt allowed so Isha allah the islamic law would take care of it.

May Allah swt keep us safe.

Jazakillah khair! well said,that is what would happen in a shariah state, however, some of us are not fortunate enough to be living in one thus have to make do with laws of lands where we live

.................................................. ..................................................

<snip>

me iz wondering why this thread is being allowed to go on and on, is it to see who can come up with the most inventive idea ever posted?

**Woodrow** · **Re: Gang Rape / Rape -** 10-08-2008

In my opinion what a rapist deserves as punishment, I would not put into writing. If one of my loved ones were to be raped, the perpetrator would strongly desire to face the police rather than meet me.

Some countries and states do have what are lenient laws regarding rape. the logic being that a victim will be more prone to report it. many victims are kind hearted and will not report a rape as they can not bring themselves to report it knowing the perpetrator will be executed.

It can be a long debate over if rape is more common in countries with lenient laws or if it is just that it will more likely be reported in those countries and more likely to be unreported or hidden in countries with stricter laws.

It is harder to get a conviction if the penalty for a crime is death, then it is to get a conviction if the penalty is less. (in most countries)

Here in the States the punishment for rape varies from State to State. some States are lenient, some harsher than others.

For example what is currently taking place in Louisiana.

Quote:

Kennedy v. Louisiana (07-343)

Oral argument: Apr. 16, 2008

Appealed from: Supreme Court of Louisiana (May 22, 2007)
CRUEL AND UNUSUAL PUNISHMENT, DEATH PENALTY, NON-HOMICIDE

A Louisiana jury found Patrick Kennedy guilty of aggravated rape of his eight-year-old stepdaughter under Louisiana's aggravated rape statute. This statute provided a sentence of death for the rape of a child under twelve years of age. After finding aggravating circumstances, as required by Louisiana law, the jury recommended that Kennedy be sentenced to death. After the Louisiana Supreme Court affirmed his conviction and sentence, Kennedy petitioned the United States Supreme Court to invalidate the sentence on either of two grounds: first, that imposing a death sentence for rape, where the victim does not die, constitutes disproportionate, and therefore "cruel and unusual punishment" under the Eighth Amendment; second, that the aggravating circumstances in the case-that the offender was perpetrating an aggravated rape and the victim was under twelve years old-merely repeated elements of the underlying crime and therefore did not sufficiently limit eligibility for a death sentence to avoid arbitrary sentencing. Kennedy's first contention asks the Court to revisit its decision in Coker v. Georgia, which invalidated, on Eighth Amendment grounds, a death sentence for the rape of a sixteen-year-old.

* [Question(s) presented]
* [Issue(s)]
* [Facts]
* [Discussion]
* [Analysis]

Question(s) presented

1. Whether the Eighth Amendment's Cruel and Unusual Punishment Clause permits a State to punish the crime of rape of a child with the death penalty.

2. If so, whether Louisiana's capital rape statute violates the Eighth Amendment insofar as it fails genuinely to narrow the class of such offenders eligible for the death penalty.

top
Issue(s)

Is it cruel and unusual punishment under the Eighth Amendment to sentence a person to death solely for the rape of a child? If not, does Louisiana's capital rape law nevertheless violate the Eighth Amendment by failing to providing sufficient narrowing guidance to juries concerning who, among those guilty of this crime, should be eligible for the death penalty?

top
Facts

The following facts are taken from the opinion of the Louisiana Supreme Court, State v. Kennedy, 957 So.2d 757 (La. 2007), and the Verdict, Agreement and Settlement of the District Court in this case, 2003 WL 2473647:

In 2003 a jury in the district court of the parish of Jefferson, Louisiana, found Patrick Kennedy guilty of the 1998 rape of his then eight-year-old stepdaughter. In line with the jury's recommendation, the court sentenced Kennedy to death.

The State had charged Kennedy with aggravated rape of a child under Louisiana's capital rape statute, R.S. 14:42 D.(2). At the time of Kennedy's trial, this statute made the death penalty (i.e., a "capital verdict") available for defendants who raped a child under twelve years of age. The alternative sentence was life imprisonment at hard labor without parole. The district attorney had sought the death penalty in Kennedy's case.

In the sentencing phase of the trial, the jury found two aggravating circumstances-the offender was engaged in the perpetration of aggravated rape and the victim was under twelve years old. A finding of at least one statutory aggravating circumstance is necessary before a court can impose a death sentence, according to a separate Louisiana law.

Kennedy appealed his conviction and sentence to the Louisiana Supreme Court. Among his sixty-nine allegations of error, Kennedy claimed that his death sentence violated the Eighth Amendment's prohibition against cruel and unusual punishment because it was a disproportionate penalty for a crime that did not result in loss of life. In its 1977 decision, Coker v. Georgia, the United States Supreme Court had struck down a death sentence for the rape of a sixteen-year-old on Eight Amendment grounds.

Kennedy also objected to the procedure Louisiana used to determine his eligibility for the death penalty-specifically, the means of satisfying the state's "aggravating circumstances" requirement. Both aggravating circumstances the jury had found had simply restated elements of Kennedy's crime. Kennedy said the procedure therefore did not sufficiently narrow the court's discretion to ensure that the death penalty wouldn't be imposed arbitrarily and capriciously.

The Louisiana Supreme Court affirmed the district court's conviction and sentence. It rejected Kennedy's claim that imposing the death sentence solely for rape was inherently unconstitutional, as a disproportionate penalty. The court reasoned that Coker had addressed only the rape of an adult. The Louisiana court also said evidence of public attitudes (which the U.S. Supreme Court looks to in determining sentences' proportionality) supported allowing death sentences for rape of a child.

The Louisiana Supreme Court said four states in addition to Louisiana had recently allowed the death penalty for such crimes. The Louisiana court acknowledged this number was small, but emphasized the emergence of a trend toward making rape of a child a capital crime. The court also looked at an increase in the availability of the death penalty for other non-homicide crimes, such as espionage and drug trafficking. Again, the court noted the trend was toward expanding availability of the death penalty for non-homicides.

Source: http://www.law.cornell.edu/supct/cert/07-343.html

north_malaysian · **Re: Gang Rape / Rape -** 10-08-2008

Quote:

Originally Posted by Z-Blade

Stone them to death or whatever Allah has ordained as a punishment for these beasts.

And the victim should be the first person to stone them.

north_malaysian · **Re: Gang Rape / Rape -** 10-08-2008

Capital Punishment for Rape

Excerpts from The Malay Ideals (2002)

If serious crimes were meted out with stricter and harsher punishments, we are confident that their numbers would reduce dramatically. In Malaysia, serious sexual offences such as rape is strikingly on the increase. In 1985 there were 522 reported cases of rape and by 1996 it had more than doubled to 1071.[1], [2] A later study announced that 2.4 cases were reported daily in 1993 and the figure had risen to 4.1 in 1998. For every reported case there were 10 others unreported. i.e. every 1.7 hours, a person is raped in Malaysia.[3] Perpetrators of such heinous crime are even willing to kill their victims[4] to avoid identification and indictment.[5] Since June 1995 up until June 2001, 70 teens had been raped and killed.[6] School children within school compounds have been targeted.[7] Young children are not safe either.[8] Even the elderly are not protected from such terrible ordeal. Rape is even committed by university students

View Poll Results: If the victim is your close one..what will be your reaction?
To Execute Those Animals.	38	64.41%
I wont agree with Execution.I will request Life Imprisonment for those animals.	19	32.20%
I whole heartedly agree with the law if its Few years imprisonment for those animals.	2	3.39%
Voters: 59. You may not vote on this poll

	(#76 (permalink))
Musaafir The Procrastinator.. Status: Offline Posts: 1,327 Reputation: 5111 Rep Power: 25 Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Wherever I am is of no concern to thee, but you'll most likely find me with lots of chocolatte. Yum. Gender: Way of Life: Muslim	Re: Gang Rape / Rape - 10-02-2008 Execute em..no ifs no buts..The crime they commit is sick. There's no use in trying to be all soft towards them or anything. It's the sickest crime imaginable and the no-one but the victim would be able to know what they're going through. __________________

	(#79 (permalink))
abdunnur Limited Member Status: Offline Posts: 32 Reputation: 142 Rep Power: 0 Join Date: Sep 2008 Gender: Way of Life: Muslim	Re: Gang Rape / Rape - 10-03-2008 There is no truth low without islamic low! But we can not fallow islamic low if it no exist. We must respect low of country where we live. We have no doubt, in Future world Allah will be LOW! There is very different country about low. About rape, America (USA) is better than more others. In Europe-the biggest problem is how to make comfortable jale(prison) for man of rape and crime deeds-. In Pakistan is normal to some cruel and stupid gay attack to a woman by acid and MADE her blind and -with unhuman ugly face-, or cut her part of face...cos SHE DOESNT WANT HIM LIKE HER HUSBAND!!!!!! For govermant and police in Pakistan it is normal?????? Pakistan is full of good muslims, i dont know what they do to try stop it. In my country (Bosnia) persons under 18 can do all kind of crimes, low is -no exist for them. In this year,they made fire (burn) an old woma, killed child in tram,... THEY ARE UNDER 18!? How can i see, in America is better. Rape is awfull things, raper become in prison more cruel, and victim will have big problems to back in normal life. Rape is destroying of being,and lot of people cant understand that prostitute woman can be raped. For us, muslims, patience is the most important. This life is short and after ....

	(#81 (permalink))
dilkadr Young @ Heart Status: Offline Posts: 152 Reputation: 319 Rep Power: 9 Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Gulshan-e-Iqbal, Karachi, Pakistan Gender: Way of Life: Muslim	Re: Gang Rape / Rape - 10-07-2008 Modern world is not the ideal world - so is its practices... Unfortunately, we have to spend given time in this world before we moved to next world i.e. janat

	(#82 (permalink))
abdunnur Limited Member Status: Offline Posts: 32 Reputation: 142 Rep Power: 0 Join Date: Sep 2008 Gender: Way of Life: Muslim	Re: Gang Rape / Rape - 10-07-2008 Uh... I kiss knowledge of safiuRahman! I have problem with my english, and did not sure did I understand you well. You said...same treatment for -zina and rape-?! I can not understand and cant accept it. But, if I be sure that is islamic rules I will accept. Zina is when two persons -want. Rape is when one person attack to other, and use power, strenght, bit, hit, violence... In -zina- persons enjoy, in -rape- 1 person suffer, have trauma... How can be same, how can be treated of low -like same? selam

	(#83 (permalink))
abdunnur Limited Member Status: Offline Posts: 32 Reputation: 142 Rep Power: 0 Join Date: Sep 2008 Gender: Way of Life: Muslim	Re: Gang Rape / Rape - 10-07-2008 Selam Dilkadr! Yes, all of muslims know that no absolute justice here, in the Earth... But it is no answer for everything, sometime we must try to get answers Here. How I see you are from Pakistan. I dont accuse you for anything, and you are not guilty for happening in your country...but... Do you have an idea what muslims should to do to try stop violence to woman in your country? I dont recommend agressive demonstration, but i think, muslims there must take it serious, speak about it and call(invite) progressive -forces- from other country to make pressure to goverment to punish and stop -cuting part of face, and acid attack. Violence is everywhere, but problem of Pakistan is goverment and judgement. When life of a girl or woman be destroyed -it is normal familly relationship-! And muslims prefer silence!