Originally Posted by Al-Zaara

Hello, people. Just read that a few times. And go read how women suffered, read what rights they were denied and islam didn't exist there. You can't go saying "Oh if Islam had been there everything would have been good" in an ideal world of a Muslim, YES, there have been very good times yes, but it went downwards all the time. Women have been surpressed for centuries, even in Islamic countries, or current Islamic countries.

Now don't be ignorant, bad sides are everywhere, everyone knows that. But to say feminism is all bad, hasn't given anything good, is just... Ridicilous and ignorant. Yes, extreme/radical feminism is bad. But when a Muslim daugther fights for her right to say No to a marriage, but her Muslim parents refuse, YOU'd say "they don't know Islam well" and her parents would say "she's such a feminist". See? There are different sides, don't get so one-sided.

Read again my comment with the example with Islam. I think if you're sincere, you'd understand... But well, in the end. Everyone to their own opinion. I'm out.

Agreed, well said. Feminism, with all isms, have its positives and negatives. Also, since it stemmed in a non-muslim society - we shouldn't get our Islamscope on the issue.

Oh, my previous comment, was just to break the tension - I wasn't being serious, except for the shoes part! I know you hiding them!

After men are feminists the women which dare to raise their voice against them, doesn't matter which issue its in discussion.

Originally Posted by Al-Zaara

Hello, people. Just read that a few times. And go read how women suffered, read what rights they were denied and islam didn't exist there. You can't go saying "Oh if Islam had been there everything would have been good" in an ideal world of a Muslim, YES, there have been very good times yes, but it went downwards all the time. Women have been surpressed for centuries, even in Islamic countries, or current Islamic countries.

Now don't be ignorant, bad sides are everywhere, everyone knows that. But to say feminism is all bad, hasn't given anything good, is just... Ridicilous and ignorant. Yes, extreme/radical feminism is bad. But when a Muslim daugther fights for her right to say No to a marriage, but her Muslim parents refuse, YOU'd say "they don't know Islam well" and her parents would say "she's such a feminist". See? There are different sides, don't get so one-sided.

Read again my comment with the example with Islam. I think if you're sincere, you'd understand... But well, in the end. Everyone to their own opinion. I'm out.

As I see it, I am an Islamist first. If Islam gives a right, to either men or women, which the other sex tries to deny, I try to back what Islam claims.

But as I see it, feminists (atleast the rabid kind), finding that Islam does not suit their pre-conceived ideas about how things should be, are forced to either deny that these rules exist in Islam, or to reject Islam itself because it is an 'unfair' religion.

If Islam said that women have no right to say 'no' to any marriage arranged for them, or to vote, or any other right that we presently enjoy, I would support that position too, because who am I to judge what Allah, the Almighty orders. I do not follow this religion because its Sharia appeals to me, but because I believe in Allah and think that following his orders will save me from hell-fire and grant me Jannat.

"Their's not to reason why,
Their's but to do and die:"
by Alferd, Lord Tennyson

^ jizakAllaah khair

What femenist?

I dislike the radical feminist who hate men but try in every way to be like them.

But I deeply admire a woman who stands up for her rights and doesnt let a man step all over her. And is brave enough to speak up for herself.

Every woman who loves herself will have a bit of feminism in her. Just some women let it out to the extreme.

^^ the word feminist is always used to describe the extreme ones though right?

we wouldnt call a woman who stands up for her rights a feminist, but those who think they should dress exactly as they want and men should control themselves, those who treat their husbands etc like dirt by saying things such as "IM NOT A SLAVE!!!" etc, i myself know many sisters affected by this feminist mentality. and it really is sad to see...


i know an extreme feminist at work aswell, on her door is written "women are far greater workers then men" lol

Women were emancipated in West long before feminists came out with their demands and marches. Women began to work thanks to industralization and urbanization, then after two world wars and millions of men' death , women simply had to go to factories or wherever else and start a work. Feminists dont want any equality, they want to change the cultural roles of men and woman, the vision of family which is all backwardness in their neo marxist thinking.
The positive thing is that nowadays in 2008 many people stopped taking them serious. Maybe its just my observation but they became some kind of folklore, remain of XX century, like "working class" or hippies.

Originally Posted by Faye

As I see it, I am an Islamist first. If Islam gives a right, to either men or women, which the other sex tries to deny, I try to back what Islam claims.

Of course.

But as I see it, feminists (atleast the rabid kind), finding that Islam does not suit their pre-conceived ideas about how things should be, are forced to either deny that these rules exist in Islam, or to reject Islam itself because it is an 'unfair' religion.

Well there you go. Some feminists, not all. And as I have said many times, I say I can understand some because they fought for their rights which the men came and said this and this is how it should be. Now where the heck do the men get their idea, why couldn't a woman? All I'm saying is, feminism is like an reaction to chauvinism. It wanted to gain rights men made seem as if they didn't deserve, to be able to vote, or work on some feild they'd want to 'cause "it didn't suit them'.

Then again, if feminists start talking how women are opressed in Islam, of course I am against their opinion. The issue here is, feminism wasn't all bad during the times it made life fairer to the women then.

If Islam said that women have no right to say 'no' to any marriage arranged for them, or to vote, or any other right that we presently enjoy, I would support that position too, because who am I to judge what Allah, the Almighty orders. I do not follow this religion because its Sharia appeals to me, but because I believe in Allah and think that following his orders will save me from hell-fire and grant me Jannat.

Allah is God and some say Allah and are Christians. To them Christianity is what saves them from Hell or grants them Paradaise, to them, the Christian "Shariah" is right and must be followed. I believe in Allah/God and follow Islam. There are many monothestic religions, believing in one God, now why did you choose Islam? Because it appeals to you and you have learned to believe in it.

That idea you gave again would go against much other that goes into Islam, it fairness and justice, that is why I find it absolutely not needed to forward an hypothesis 'if Islam said this, what would I do'. And there are difference of opinions in Fiqh-rules anyways. I won't bother to voice my opinion if I would follow Islam then or not, it's just unnecessary.

Originally Posted by IbnAbdulHakim

^^ the word feminist is always used to describe the extreme ones though right?

we wouldnt call a woman who stands up for her rights a feminist, but those who think they should dress exactly as they want and men should control themselves....etc

Hold on...is that point trying to say that men shouldn't be put into a situation were they need to practice control? That men shouldn't 'need' to control themselves?? Im hoping...really hoping Ive misinterpretted that statement above. i am not saying that woman sholdnt dress appropriately they should, but to make it seem as though a woman is saying something extreme when she expects a man to control himself....what?

^ yep i'd say you greatly misinterpretted aswell :|

course men should control themselves too

http://theoccidentalquarterly.com/ar...linTOQV6N2.pdf consequentially i found this informative

Why need feminism when we have Islam? Alhamdulillah. I dont really care for other movements. Islam is enough for me...it's got all I need. Yes when feminism started it was okay now it ain't so I dont like it lol.

Btw bro Alpha dude, that article was posted earlier on in the thread

I know a lot of feminists, but I don't really care. I know what I want my wife to be like, and I hope she is, but I don't really care if some women want more rights or not, if they want them, fight for them is all I can say.

I don't like extreme Feminism. I met women who hated me just because I held the door open or when I let them take my seat on the bus when they had no where else to sit. They had a go at me and saying I'm sexist.>_>

Honestly I don't even know why I even try to be kind.

^^ how can anyone hate you for that? phsawwwww
pl go ask any woman what she wants, she'll never say I want to be treated equal to you, if she is honest she'll say 'I want to be treated better'

open the door and give up seats, women folk all over will appreciate it