suicide - Page 2

north_malaysian · **Re: suicide -** 10-04-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by syilla

I'm so sad when hearing about the lives of young children shattered.
The case of pedophiles, child abuse, child prostitution, orphans...
It just keep disheartening... i was reading the crimeboard the other day on child abuse.... Astaghfirullah...it is sooo sad. I just can't imagine how they are surviving in this world. But i know Allah swt is fair in His judgement.

May they are been given guidance, taufiq and hidayah. And may the children be happy in this world and hereafter.

my sister live alone in Penang... because she dont want to have Iftar alone... she bring some of them to Bazaar Ramadan and have Iftar with her...

She told my mum that she want to bring all of them to our house on the first day of Eid... so we have to hide our "beef" delicacies when they come as many of those kids dont eat beef.

syilla · **Re: suicide -** 10-04-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by north_malaysian

my sister live alone in Penang... because she dont want to have Iftar alone... she bring some of them to Bazaar Ramadan and have Iftar with her...

She told my mum that she want to bring all of them to our house on the first day of Eid... so we have to hide our "beef" delicacies when they come as many of those kids dont eat beef.

why they don't eat beefs?

remind me of my son who doesn't eat beef because he watched qurban last two years. He asked me back why do we have to eat beef? I don't realy know how to answer him...

Sky_flower · **Re: suicide -** 10-05-2007

A good friend of mine committed suicide five years ago. He wasn't like one of those weird emo's "Nobody likes me blah... blah... I'm gona slit my wrist". But he was loved by all. It was just that he had a terrible childhood, and although he tried to be stonge and move on about it. He just couldn't take it anymore. So your right it is hard for people that love them, but for me and my friends we just remembered how much of great person he was, and thats all that mattered to us.

north_malaysian · **Re: suicide -** 10-05-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by syilla

why they don't eat beefs?

Hindus and some chinese dont eat beef. I asked my chinese friend, why some Chinese dont eat beef, do they believe it's holy as the Hindus believe.

He said, the word "cow" in Chinese has similar sound to "stupid" in Hokkien... so ... being superstitious... they dont eat beef as they afraid they would be stupid as the cows...

Da'watul-Allaah · **Re: suicide -** 10-05-2007

^^ LOL

anyways

erm ahh suicide.

Someone answer Bewildred's question.

syilla · 06:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bewildred

Please help me with the following : If Allah (sws) has written everyone's death's day.... How come people commit suicide????

S.

commit suicide is the same as the death's day.

The way they died...is just ways / reasons.

Quote:

Attempt to Commit Suicide

Q. Destiny (Taqdeer) is predetermined. Although Taqdeer Muallaq can be changed by supplication and prayers but certain things are categorized under Taqdeer Mubram, which is not to be changed like the birth or death of a person, the time, the place and cause of occurrence. But suicide is Haraam in Islam and the person committing the suicide is said to have committed a grievous sin. Since the cause of one’s death has already been determined, the suicidal deaths can also not be prevented, because a person’s death is predetermined and if one is destined to die as such, he will commit suicide.

(Farzana Feza ; Allahabad)

Ans. I do not remember any Hadith mentioning that the manner of death of a person is destined to remain unchanged. Even the time of death is extended through supplication and prayer. Anyway, whether the cause of death of a person is predetermined or subject to change according to Allah’s will, it does not alter the nature of sin of a person if he attempts suicide.

One thing is quite clear from Qur’an. A man is free to choose between the good or bad path for himself. Allah (swt) says: “We showed him the right path, whether he be grateful or ungrateful.” (76:3)

Although a human is free in opting for either way, he has no control over the actual happenings in this world. The occurrence after his attempt to act good or bad is in Allah’s control. He may shoot at an attacking beast in trying to save the life of a person but may in fact end up in killing the man instead. This happening is from Allah and while the dead was destined to die from his bullet, his act will be recorded as saving a man’s life. Similarly one may poison a person with the intention of killing him but if it so happens that the inadequate quantity of that particular poison cures him of a serious killer disease, the man who poisoned him shall get no reward for saving his life. His deed will be recorded as equivalent to murder.

Consider the following probabilities in context of a person attempting suicide.

1. He shoots himself and dies instantaneously.

2. After shooting himself, he goes into a coma and dies after a long time without ever recovering.

3. He shoots himself but before he could die of his own injury, he is bitten by a deadly snake and dies of its poison.

4. He shoots by placing the pistol over his temple but the only bullet misfires and he lives after that.

5. He attempts to shoot himself but another person intervenes and in the ensuing struggle, the one who wanted to save him gets killed by mistake.

In case 3 above, he was destined to die of snakebite at the same time and place he attempted to kill himself. It does not in any way wash him of his sin, which is same as in the earlier two cases. In cases 4 and 5, though the results are different, his sin remains the same. Whether he dies of his bullet immediately or later, or dies of some other cause at the same instant, or survives the attempt or kills someone else by mistake, the nature of his sin does not change. The results in all the five cases were in Allah’s control. He will be adjudged on the basis of his attempt to commit suicide, an act which he performed up to its end as far as he was concerned. Suicide was his act in all the above cases while the nature of his death, or his survival or some other person’s death in his place was the destiny ordained by God. It must be clear from the above that destiny does not affect a person’s free choice to do good or bad.

source

Da'watul-Allaah · **Re: suicide -** 10-05-2007

Praise be to Allaah, the Lord of the Worlds. The scholars and people who are religiously committed should not pray for this man and others like him, but the ordinary people should pray for him, just as the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) refrained from praying for a man who had committed suicide, and one who had stolen from the war-booty, but he said: “Pray for your companion.” They said to Samurah ibn Jundub: “Your son did not sleep last night.” He said, “Was it because he ate too much?” They said: “Yes.” He said: “If he had died I would not have prayed for him.” Samurah explained that if he died because he had eaten too much, he would not pray for him, because he would have killed himself by eating too much. And it is more appropriate that the scholars and those who are religiously-committed should refrain from offering the funeral prayer for this man who prevented others from killing the snake, and held it in his hand until it killed him, because he killed himself.

Al-Fataawa al-Kubra, 3/20, 21

-Ibn Taymiyyah

nocturne · **Re: suicide -** 10-05-2007

I am working in the ambulance service. This month, i have seen alot of muslims being involved in bad accidents early in the morning (Time of sahur)...

A couple got into the motorbike accident (one passed away and e other had severe injuries) and another guy was drinking during that time and jumped off a bridge into the sea(luckily he was found)..i hope they learn from this and become better muslims.

Ramlah · **Re: suicide -** 10-05-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by syilla

i don't know if anyone will agree with me on this...

But I think these days the youth are too ambitious but lack of 'humbleness' and being 'grateful'.

wassallam.

amoungst other things. no, i agree.

Protected_Diamond · **Re: suicide -** 10-05-2007

Sucide is on the rise and it's happening in the muslim community as well. Modern life makes people forget their deen and therefore they don't have a clear head to sort their problems out. I know someone who committed sucide coz they kept failing their exams at a degree level...subhana' Allah scary eh? but you get pressure from all directions and sometimes these people forget Allah s.w.a is there for them.

Shukri · **Re: suicide -** 10-05-2007

quick question I'm sort of confused on, how about the mentally ill and disturbed muslims. Does Allah give mercy or does he treat them like the rest?

syilla · **Re: suicide -** 10-05-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shukri

quick question I'm sort of confused on, how about the mentally ill and disturbed muslims. Does Allah give mercy or does he treat them like the rest?

"There are three kinds of people who are not held responsible for their actions: The sleeping person until he wakes up, the child until he reaches the age of puberty, and the mentally ill until he becomes sane." [Related by the Five and ad-Daarimi]

Shorty x · **Re: suicide -** 10-05-2007

Salaamz,

sorry for not replying to messages, been so busy at uni, thot id quickly just reply, before i have to hit my bed, ive got work in the morning !!!!!!

Thank you for all the information, much appreciated.

when someone suffers from depression, there are different types, and different levels, sometimes we can help them, but sometimes we cant.
Its a shame these things happen, and it hits us harder when we learn its a muslim brother or sister. with society changing and adjusting to life, more problems are around compared to when our parents were younger, or grandparents. All we can do is help them, and encourage those who stray along the path of islam.

In summer , the young boy aged 26, was married with a wife, and living in there house, because he was a heavy drug abuser, his wife left him taking there daughter with her, and in that year he was trying his best to get better, he stopped his drugs, but unfortunatly, had major side effects, and resulted in him, being admitted to hospital, and on medication.He also suffered from paranoia. His parents, especially his mum, helped him as much as they could, but to look after a 26 yr old man, who is stubborn and wont accept his illness, is hard. you cant control what they do, 24/7, 7 days a week. u cant control, where they go, young lads will do as they please. go see there mates, maybe do a few stuff which they shouldnt.

but when someone is suffering from depression, but in and out of his phases, etc u cant tell or know that he/she is going to do something stupid. Just as he was on the road to recovery, he was looking forward to seeing his daughter, even if he knew that things would never be the same between him n his wife. She rung him and told him , that shes leaving and going to pakistan with the kid, and that he will never see them again. News like that is going to hit him hard, and when he was acting normal, everyone thought he was getting better, but he was actually, getting ready to end his life. As he walked up to the nearest railway line, he just stepped in front of an on coming train.

People, say, it is the parents responsibility, etc , or carers who should look after there sons/daughters etc. but it is hard, to keep an eye on someone 24/7, especially someone who is 26 years old, living a seperate life, and gave the impression that he is all well.
Because his dad was my dads best friend, my mum n dad agreed to help out for the janaza, but i noticed that, my dad found it hard to hold his janaza in a mosque, if you told them what happend. why? does a mosque not carry out a janaza for someone who has committed suicide?

We did get a mosque eventually, but it was after a few attempts.

W'salaamz
shorty xx

**Woodrow** · **Re: suicide -** 10-05-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by Protected_Diamond

Sucide is on the rise and it's happening in the muslim community as well. Modern life makes people forget their deen and therefore they don't have a clear head to sort their problems out. I know someone who committed sucide coz they kept failing their exams at a degree level...subhana' Allah scary eh? but you get pressure from all directions and sometimes these people forget Allah s.w.a is there for them.

Suicide one of the biggest killers of teenagers in the world today.

The main identified causes in the USA are:

Quote:

Who Is At Risk?

Some teens, because of their biochemical makeup or life experiences, are at greater risk for suicide. Risk factors for suicide include:

* Previous suicide attempts - Teens that have attempted suicide in the past are much more likely than other teens to attempt suicide again in the future. Approximately a third of teen suicide victims have made a previous suicide attempt.6
* Depression and/or alcohol or substance abuse - Over 90% of teen suicide victims have a mental disorder, such as depression, and/or a history of alcohol or drug abuse.7
* Family history of mental disorders, substance abuse, or suicide - Teens who kill themselves have often had a close family member who attempted or committed suicide. Many of the mental illnesses, such as depression, that contribute to suicide risk appear to have a genetic component.8
* Stressful situation or loss - Teens who kill themselves almost always have serious problems, such as depression or substance abuse. When they experience losses or certain stressful situations, it can trigger a suicide attempt. Such stressful situations include: getting into trouble at school or with the police; fighting or breaking up with a boyfriend or a girlfriend; and fighting with friends.9, 10
* Easy access to guns - Teens are much more likely to kill themselves when they have access to guns. When teens shoot themselves, they most often do so in their own homes. Teens are at a far greater risk for suicide when there are loaded and accessible guns in their homes.11, 12
* Exposure to other teenagers who have committed suicide - Teens are more likely to kill themselves if they have recently read, seen, or heard about other suicide attempts.13

Other risk factors include a history of physical and/or sexual abuse, poor communication with parents, incarceration, and lack of access or an unwillingness to seek mental health treatment.14-17

Source: http://www.safeyouth.org/scripts/teens/suicide.asp

Something to keep in mind, not all of these factors need to be present. Anyone by it self can be enough.

Tania · **Re: suicide -** 10-06-2007

Quote:

Originally Posted by Woodrow

Over 90% of teen suicide victims have a mental disorder

I say 100%. They all have something mental because otherwise would not comit suicide. We have, like the animals too, the survival instinct. We should always avoid the death, at least to try to rescue us.

	(#18 (permalink))
Sky_flower Limited Member Status: Offline Posts: 8 Reputation: 5 Rep Power: 0 Join Date: Sep 2007 Gender: Way of Life: Undisclosed	Re: suicide - 10-05-2007 A good friend of mine committed suicide five years ago. He wasn't like one of those weird emo's "Nobody likes me blah... blah... I'm gona slit my wrist". But he was loved by all. It was just that he had a terrible childhood, and although he tried to be stonge and move on about it. He just couldn't take it anymore. So your right it is hard for people that love them, but for me and my friends we just remembered how much of great person he was, and thats all that mattered to us.

	(#20 (permalink))
Da'watul-Allaah 'Slightly' mental_ Status: Offline Posts: 8,066 Reputation: 28741 Rep Power: 59 Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: UK Way of Life: Muslim	Re: suicide - 10-05-2007 ^^ LOL anyways erm ahh suicide. Someone answer Bewildred's question. __________________ I request all brothers and sisters to make du'aa for ME. That Allah grants me shifaa. Abu-Darda' reported: I heard the Messenger of Allah (Salallahu Alayhi Wassalam) saying, "Whenever a Muslim supplicates for his Muslim brother in his absence, the angels say: `May the same be for you too'.''

	(#22 (permalink))
Da'watul-Allaah 'Slightly' mental_ Status: Offline Posts: 8,066 Reputation: 28741 Rep Power: 59 Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: UK Way of Life: Muslim	Re: suicide - 10-05-2007 Praise be to Allaah, the Lord of the Worlds. The scholars and people who are religiously committed should not pray for this man and others like him, but the ordinary people should pray for him, just as the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) refrained from praying for a man who had committed suicide, and one who had stolen from the war-booty, but he said: “Pray for your companion.” They said to Samurah ibn Jundub: “Your son did not sleep last night.” He said, “Was it because he ate too much?” They said: “Yes.” He said: “If he had died I would not have prayed for him.” Samurah explained that if he died because he had eaten too much, he would not pray for him, because he would have killed himself by eating too much. And it is more appropriate that the scholars and those who are religiously-committed should refrain from offering the funeral prayer for this man who prevented others from killing the snake, and held it in his hand until it killed him, because he killed himself. Al-Fataawa al-Kubra, 3/20, 21 -Ibn Taymiyyah __________________ I request all brothers and sisters to make du'aa for ME. That Allah grants me shifaa. Abu-Darda' reported: I heard the Messenger of Allah (Salallahu Alayhi Wassalam) saying, "Whenever a Muslim supplicates for his Muslim brother in his absence, the angels say: `May the same be for you too'.''

	(#23 (permalink))
nocturne LI Senior Member Status: Offline Posts: 111 Reputation: 134 Rep Power: 9 Join Date: Jan 2007 Gender: Way of Life: Muslim	Re: suicide - 10-05-2007 I am working in the ambulance service. This month, i have seen alot of muslims being involved in bad accidents early in the morning (Time of sahur)... A couple got into the motorbike accident (one passed away and e other had severe injuries) and another guy was drinking during that time and jumped off a bridge into the sea(luckily he was found)..i hope they learn from this and become better muslims.

	(#25 (permalink))
Protected_Diamond LI Oldskool Status: Offline Posts: 1,824 Reputation: 2460 Rep Power: 24 Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Dunya Gender: Way of Life: Muslim	Re: suicide - 10-05-2007 Sucide is on the rise and it's happening in the muslim community as well. Modern life makes people forget their deen and therefore they don't have a clear head to sort their problems out. I know someone who committed sucide coz they kept failing their exams at a degree level...subhana' Allah scary eh? but you get pressure from all directions and sometimes these people forget Allah s.w.a is there for them. __________________ “Whoever puts his trust in Allah, sufficient is Allah for him.” I never saw anyone as just as the world. As long as you pursue the world it will pursue you, but when you turn away from it and seek God, it will leave you alone and its glamour shall no longer fascinate you.

	(#26 (permalink))
Shukri Limited Member Status: Offline Posts: 22 Reputation: 42 Rep Power: 0 Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Utah Gender: Way of Life: Muslim	Re: suicide - 10-05-2007 quick question I'm sort of confused on, how about the mentally ill and disturbed muslims. Does Allah give mercy or does he treat them like the rest?

	(#28 (permalink))
Shorty x Limited Member Status: Offline Posts: 37 Reputation: 11 Rep Power: 0 Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: south east Gender: Way of Life: Muslim	Re: suicide - 10-05-2007 Salaamz, sorry for not replying to messages, been so busy at uni, thot id quickly just reply, before i have to hit my bed, ive got work in the morning !!!!!! Thank you for all the information, much appreciated. when someone suffers from depression, there are different types, and different levels, sometimes we can help them, but sometimes we cant. Its a shame these things happen, and it hits us harder when we learn its a muslim brother or sister. with society changing and adjusting to life, more problems are around compared to when our parents were younger, or grandparents. All we can do is help them, and encourage those who stray along the path of islam. In summer , the young boy aged 26, was married with a wife, and living in there house, because he was a heavy drug abuser, his wife left him taking there daughter with her, and in that year he was trying his best to get better, he stopped his drugs, but unfortunatly, had major side effects, and resulted in him, being admitted to hospital, and on medication.He also suffered from paranoia. His parents, especially his mum, helped him as much as they could, but to look after a 26 yr old man, who is stubborn and wont accept his illness, is hard. you cant control what they do, 24/7, 7 days a week. u cant control, where they go, young lads will do as they please. go see there mates, maybe do a few stuff which they shouldnt. but when someone is suffering from depression, but in and out of his phases, etc u cant tell or know that he/she is going to do something stupid. Just as he was on the road to recovery, he was looking forward to seeing his daughter, even if he knew that things would never be the same between him n his wife. She rung him and told him , that shes leaving and going to pakistan with the kid, and that he will never see them again. News like that is going to hit him hard, and when he was acting normal, everyone thought he was getting better, but he was actually, getting ready to end his life. As he walked up to the nearest railway line, he just stepped in front of an on coming train. People, say, it is the parents responsibility, etc , or carers who should look after there sons/daughters etc. but it is hard, to keep an eye on someone 24/7, especially someone who is 26 years old, living a seperate life, and gave the impression that he is all well. Because his dad was my dads best friend, my mum n dad agreed to help out for the janaza, but i noticed that, my dad found it hard to hold his janaza in a mosque, if you told them what happend. why? does a mosque not carry out a janaza for someone who has committed suicide? We did get a mosque eventually, but it was after a few attempts. W'salaamz shorty xx