A'salamu alaykum.
Anonymous poll.
And, is there anywhere that teaches the 4 Maddhabs simultaneously, so as to compare and contrast them? And just generally learn about them
Hanbali
Maliki
Shafi'i
Hanafi
None
Array
A'salamu alaykum.
Anonymous poll.
And, is there anywhere that teaches the 4 Maddhabs simultaneously, so as to compare and contrast them? And just generally learn about them
Snow liked this post
Ok brothers there, calm down both and shake the hands (or something similar). Back to topic please.
I am wondering why here isn´t any hanbalis (no votes for that option). Are they so rare?
azc liked this post
God given logic:format_quote Originally Posted by azc
You read my post where I said I didn't require a madhab.
The Prophet pbuh didn't inform me of any madhab - neither did he inform you of one.
I have no problems with those who wish to adopt a madhab - good for them, but for me, I never really questioned the Qur'an or the Sunnah to need explanations of matters which really do not affect me personally.
Seriously bro, I've seen people get twisted over which way to make salaah is the correct way, hands down by the sides, folded at the naval, or at the breast etc... stupid crap like this.
I was taught hanafi way, to make salaah, the majority do it this way, so I am fine - other things do not affect me either, and should I have an issue with some matter in Islam, I can do my own research, and also read the opinions of scholars and come to my own conclusion.
Allah gave me a brain, I don't need someone else to do my thinking for me. Others may, I have no issue with that. So far, I have not said anything on this forum which could be considered kufr, so I do not believe I have to change anything about myself in that sense.
You can opine away as much as you like, but you seem to ignore my posts in this thread because it all goes in one ear and out the other.
Naughty step, now. You been a bad little boy.
Pay attention to people when they take the time to respond to you, bro.
Islam is simple, matters of conflict are not. Glean from that what you will.
Scimi
when you discuss any topic with me, keep remember what you've written in other posts.format_quote Originally Posted by Scimitar
now hambalis are found in booksformat_quote Originally Posted by sister herb
sister herb liked this post
Compared with Hanafi, Shafi'i, and Maliki, yes, Hanbali are small minority. Their number even smaller than non-madhabi.format_quote Originally Posted by sister herb
I wish to meet a hambali, even on different forums I've not seen any hamabli.. Yet......format_quote Originally Posted by ardianto
Jazzak Allah Kheyr brother for your contribution and this scholarly definition, can you please rewrite it with common terms understandable by all of us, especially our revert brothers and sisters? Tjanks
azc liked this post
perhaps you are referring to post #91 wherein I defined what madhab is... It's my own definition of madhab. What are issues with madhab plz write them one by oneformat_quote Originally Posted by abuahmed
You haven't responded to my post and just wrote a blanket statement.format_quote Originally Posted by azc
What's the matter? Running out of scholars to quote? Scholars, who I may add, who have done nothing to convince me of following a madhab.
Come on bro, don't bail.
Liven it up. Work my brain, not my boredom.
Scimi
Last edited by Scimitar; 01-19-2017 at 04:17 PM.
who can compel you to follow a madhab..? Indeed, none, but logically there should be any sterling reason why don't you require a madhab. Sadly, you beat about the bush instead of proving your point logically. I asked you a very simple Q: How do you follow Islam..? I'm surprised to see you refrain from answering it..?format_quote Originally Posted by Scimitar
Brother azc, I have been following Islam. It't not difficult you know?format_quote Originally Posted by azc
How did the Sahabi follow Islam? With a madhab?
Our deen is simple bro.
You are looking rather ignorant, considering I have posted my answer to your question and even told you in another post, none of your business, because I see the question as "absolutely stupid".
How do you practice your Islam?
Come on bro, any sane person would tell you the same as I do - "with due dilligence". Duh.
Now, if you cannot understand the intended from my answer, it just proves you are fundamentally incapable of understanding anything yourself, and so - people like you - REALLY DO NEED MADHABS.
I simply, do not.
Scimi
assalamu alaikum brotherformat_quote Originally Posted by ScimitarBrother azc, I have been following Islam. It't not difficult you know?How did the Sahabi follow Islam? With a madhab?Our deen is simple bro.You are looking rather ignorant, considering I have posted my answer to your question and even told you in another post, none of your business, because I see the question as "absolutely stupid".How do you practice your Islam?Come on bro, any sane person would tell you the same as I do - "with due dilligence". Duh.Now, if you cannot understand the intended from my answer, it just proves you are fundamentally incapable of understanding anything yourself, and so - people like you - REALLY DO NEED MADHABS.I simply, do not. Scimi
Wa'alaikum salaam
Probably you have ever met or discuss with a Hanbali Muslim in this forum or others forums. But you didn't know.format_quote Originally Posted by azc
Implying they are 'sects'...format_quote Originally Posted by nbegam
I have yet to meet one Hanafi Imam that would say that either of the other 3 maddhab are wrong. Usually they go saying, all 4 of them are right and we choose the one that is closest to our beliefs. The beauty if maddhab is that it prevents a muslim from taking a wrong step. Look at the current problems of the middle-east, they are all caused by people who thought they knew better. They started to use the Quran in their own interest.
When I was a kid my Islam teacher always said that it was better to abstain from touching, speaking or even being in the same room with them a women. The reason could be that I 'might' fall into zina. Even though some people can stop themselves from falling to Zina there are still alot who might not be able to stop themselves. Which is why it is prohibited. You see this is what makes maddhab important. Maddhab builds a wall inbetween right and wrong. Also there's literally no difference between following a maddhab and not following a maddhab.
1 last thing, you just said that islam was broken into 4 'sects'. Yet your 'way' of not following any maddhab creates, maybe without intention, a new sect. It creates the sect of having no maddhab.
This is where your logic of not following a maddhab gets completely debunked. There's no such thing as following no maddhab. Had every single muslim in the world follown one of the four maddhab we would have 0 trouble in solving the problems inbetween these groups. Because these groups are not sects. It is the same Jamaah: we accept eachother and we can pray together.
but those who don't want to understand can't be convincedformat_quote Originally Posted by fyi
format_quote Originally Posted by fyi
Assalaamo alaikum'
You think that there is no difference between the four and we have no restrictions to follow anyone. If you observe the new Muslims in the west, you will see that they say; there are 4 schools of thoughts. Then a sincere new Muslim, instead of opening the Holy Quraan directly, will go into a big diversion and will search for the books written by people to find which of the class is the best to follow!!! So the Quraan which is the Book of Allah Almighty is left and forgotten about, also the Sunnah of the Prophet Muhammad salla Allaho alaihi wa sallam is left behind. What is chosen to study and understand will be the long books of fiqh written by common people.
Also you will see that many Muslims say that when you select one Madhhab then you remain sticking to it, you cannot change it to the other one!!! This is what makes me very upset. They made the scholar they follow as prophet and they believe that in the Hereafter they will be questioned about it!!!
I sincerely inform all readers that it is only Muhammad salla Allaho alaihi wa sallam Who has that status, we will be asked about Muhammad salla Allaho alaihi wa sallam and about the Quraan. These two are the first and the last/final to be followed. Any Muslim, a scholar or a non-scolar, who says things in accordance with these two, I accept their words and respect them.
The four scholars of the 4 madhahib didn't make madhahib. They only taught people the Quraan and Sunnah. Even about Imaam Hanbal I read a true story which proves that he didn't tell people his name so that they might not know him as a popular imam. But all these developments are the later happenings at the hands of others who want:
1. to complicate the understanding of Islam as a way of life'
2. to keep the Muslims away from Quraan and the Sunnah.
Just look at the result. Most of the Muslims became unaware of the Holy Quraan and the Sunnah and thus the Whole Ummah became so weak that the enemies find it very easy to wipe it out. Only this status of our Ummah is now the best proof to a sincere Muslim to understand that we are not on the right path.
The Final Words of Muhammad salla Allaho alaihi wa sallam for us are: I leave among you TWO THINGS, the Book of Allah and my Sunnah, whoever holds fast to these two will never go astray.
The words of the Prophet salla Allaho alaihi wa sallam shall remain true till the last Day. Then why are now so many Muslims going out of the fold of Islam???
The Answer is: The Muslims are not trying to understand the Quraan and Sunnah. There are many who divert them from the 2 sources towards many fiqh books. So they are ignorant and confused and those who divert them are
responsible in the COURT OF ALLH
Some people are under the misconception that Sunnah and Fiqh are mutually exclusive. That is not the case. In fact, Fiqh explains the Qur'an and Sunnah to the lay people.
Those who call towards Qur'an and Sunnah do not really mean Qur'an and Sunnah, rather they mean to say Qur'an and Hadith. Because Sunnah itself is derived from Hadith and that derivation needs understanding. And that understanding is known as Fiqh.
Let me pose some simple questions to explain why it is a fallacy to call lay people to abandon Fiqh and follow just Qur'an and Hadith:
Allahsays in the Qur'an:
أُحِلَّ لَكُمْ صَيْدُ الْبَحْرِ وَطَعَامُهُ مَتَاعًا لَّكُمْ وَلِلسَّيَّارَةِ ۖ وَحُرِّمَ عَلَيْكُمْ صَيْدُ الْبَرِّ مَا دُمْتُمْ حُرُمًا ۗ وَاتَّقُوا اللَّهَ الَّذِي إِلَيْهِ تُحْشَرُونَLawful to you is game from the sea and its food as provision for you and the travelers, but forbidden to you is game from the land as long as you are in the state of ihram. And fear Allah to whom you will be gathered. [5:96]
It is normally understood from this Ayah that seafood is Halal for us. But we find several types of creatures in the sea, such as sea snakes, tube worms, Squids, Jellyfish, octopus, seahorse, sea pig, frogs, crocodile etc. Are these all supposed to be halal? If not, then what is the criteria for finding out what is Halal from sea creatures and what is not?
The fuqhaha have studied the relevant Ayaat and Ahadeeth and presented some guidelines for determining which of these creatures would be Halal.
At another place, Allahۚ وَإِذَا حَلَلْتُمْ فَاصْطَادُوا ۚ... when you come out of ihram, then hunt. [5:2]
Can anyone say how important it is for a person to go hunting after coming out of ihram? Is it Fardh? because Allah
Now for a few examples from Hadith:
عَنْ عَائِشَةَ، أَنَّ النَّبِيَّ ـ صلى الله عليه وسلم ـ كَانَ إِذَا افْتَتَحَ الصَّلاَةَ قَالَ " سُبْحَانَكَ اللَّهُمَّ وَبِحَمْدِكَ تَبَارَكَ اسْمُكَ وَتَعَالَى جَدُّكَ وَلاَ إِلَهَ غَيْرُكَ " .It was narrated from ‘Aishahthat when the Prophet
started Salat he would say:
“Subhanak Allahumma wa bi hamdika, wa tabarakas- muka wa ta’ala jadduka, wa la ilaha ghayruk (Glory and praise is to You, O Allah, blessed is Your Name and exalted is Your majesty, none has the right to be worshipped but You).” [Ibn Majah]
What is the ruling for reciting the above at the start of prayer, is it Fardh, Wajib, Sunnah or Nafl?
If someone forgets to recite this, then does he have to repeat his whole prayer? Or does he have to perform Sajdah Sahw? Or he doesn't have to do anything and his prayer will be valid?
Another example:عَنِ ابْنِ عَبَّاسٍ، قَالَ تَوَضَّأَ النَّبِيُّ صلى الله عليه وسلم مَرَّةً مَرَّةً.Narrated Ibn `Abbas:
The Prophet
عَنْ عَبْدِ اللَّهِ بْنِ زَيْدٍ، أَنَّ النَّبِيَّ صلى الله عليه وسلم تَوَضَّأَ مَرَّتَيْنِ مَرَّتَيْنِ.Narrated `Abdullah bin Zaid
The Prophet
عَنِ ابْنِ شِهَابٍ، أَنَّ عَطَاءَ بْنَ يَزِيدَ، أَخْبَرَهُ أَنَّ حُمْرَانَ مَوْلَى عُثْمَانَ أَخْبَرَهُ أَنَّهُ، رَأَى عُثْمَانَ بْنَ عَفَّانَ دَعَا بِإِنَاءٍ، فَأَفْرَغَ عَلَى كَفَّيْهِ ثَلاَثَ مِرَارٍ فَغَسَلَهُمَا، ثُمَّ أَدْخَلَ يَمِينَهُ فِي الإِنَاءِ فَمَضْمَضَ، وَاسْتَنْشَقَ، ثُمَّ غَسَلَ وَجْهَهُ ثَلاَثًا، وَيَدَيْهِ إِلَى الْمِرْفَقَيْنِ ثَلاَثَ مِرَارٍ، ثُمَّ مَسَحَ بِرَأْسِهِ، ثُمَّ غَسَلَ رِجْلَيْهِ ثَلاَثَ مِرَارٍ إِلَى الْكَعْبَيْنِ، ثُمَّ قَالَ قَالَ رَسُولُ اللَّهِ صلى الله عليه وسلم " مَنْ تَوَضَّأَ نَحْوَ وُضُوئِي هَذَا، ثُمَّ صَلَّى رَكْعَتَيْنِ، لاَ يُحَدِّثُ فِيهِمَا نَفْسَهُ، غُفِرَ لَهُ مَا تَقَدَّمَ مِنْ ذَنْبِهِ ".Narrated Humran, (the slave of 'Uthman
All these are from Sahih Bukhari. Can a layman read these Ahadeeth and determine the Sunnah method of performing wudhu, is it washing the limbs once, or twice or thrice?
You will find several such examples in the Qur'an and Hadith where you will need to follow the guidelines shown by the Fuqaha to understand them properly. Otherwise, simply reading an Ayah or Hadith will cause confusion and there is a big chance of a person being misguided and led into waswasa.
That is why the scholars of the past would say: Hadith are a pitfall except for the Fuqaha’.
Imam Ibn Abi Zayd al-Qayrawani al-Maliki رحمه الله narrated that Imam Sufyan ibn Uyaynah رحمه الله said:
“ Hadith are a pitfall except for the Fuqaha’ –> {Legal Jurists},”
Imam Malik’s رحمه الله student and friend `Abd Allah ibn Wahb رحمه الله said:
“The meaning of every Hadith is a pitfall except for the Ulamah {scholars}, means that everyone who memorizes Hadith that does not have an Imam in Fiqh {Law} is misguided, and if Allah had not rescued us with Imam Malik and al-Layth, we would have been misguided.”
...
Imam ash-Shafi’i رحمه الله said: “You –> {the scholars of Hadith} are the pharmacists but we {the jurists} are the physicians.”
Mullah Ali al-Qari رحمه الله commented on this and said:
“The early scholars said:
The Hadith scholar without knowledge of Fiqh is like a seller of drugs who is no physician: he has them but he does not know what to do with them; and the Fiqh scholar without knowledge of Hadith is like a physician without drugs: he knows what constitutes a remedy, but does not have it available.”
Source: http://www.muwatta.com/the-hadith-scholar-without-knowledge-of-fiqh/
Scimitar liked this post
I agree with you on this point that we should follow Quran and Sunnah... Can you tell me who decides that which act is a sunnah and which one is not..? I wish to see that every sunnah be proven by the specific dalil whereby Prophet s.a.w himself declared a particular act as '' IT IS MY SUNNAH'' e.g. Al nikahu min sunnati (Nikah is my sunnah). Can you prove it in this way.... If not... Then who decides this matter...? (plz don't quote any hadith if it doesn't have the statement of RasulAllah s.a.w ''It is my sunnah)format_quote Originally Posted by nbegam
format_quote Originally Posted by azc
I could not understand your question. I am trying to explain a point. If it is not the answer, then please make your question clear.
Someone may wonder how to know about the sanad /truth of a hadeeth, whether it is truly from Muhammad salla Allaho alaihi wa sallam!
If a Muslim trusts Allah (and what type of Muslim will not trust Allah?), then he/she must start understanding the Holy Quraan by reading it with the translation and tafseer (explanation) little by little every day. He/she shall realize the miraculous nature of the Holy Quraan. In addition to the spiritual pleasure and peace of mind, he/she shall also get a very deep understanding and hikmah (wisdom) by the Mercy of Allah Azza wa Jall. So after that the Muslim shall be able to see a hadeeth in the light of the Holy Quraan and shall easily understand if the Hadeeth is true!!! To such a Muslim the matan (contents) of a hadeeth is important and not the chain of narrators. This is my experience and I heard the same from many scholars.
We must trust Allah that Allah has put such wisdom in HIS miraculous Book that a sincere person shall get fully guided and shall not feel any difficulty in the understanding of the true ahaadeeth. Such a reader will also be able insha-Allah to recognize forged hadeeth and discard it.
Scimitar liked this post
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