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    Allah Is Above the Throne.Not Everywhere.

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    1)-Imaam at-Talamankee (d. 429H) said, “There is Ijmaa(concensus) from Ahlus-Sunnah that Allaah ascended over HisThrone bid-dhatihi (with His Self) ... There is Ijmaa from theAhlus-Sunnah that Allaah ascended over His Throne alalhaqeeqah(in a real sense), not alal-majaaz (metaphorically).”
    Reported by adh-Dhahabee in Siyaar A’laamin-Nubulaa, 17/566
    2)-Ibn Jareer at-Tabaree (d. 310H) said concerning the saying ofAllaah, the Most High:
    “The Most Merciful made Istiwaa over the Throne.” meaning: ‘Rising above and Ascending.
    Jaami’ul-Bayaan ‘an-Ta’weelil-Qur’aan, 16/137
    3)-‘Alee ibn al-Hasan ibn ash-Shaqeeq said, “I said to ‘Abdullaah ibn al--Mubaarak (d. 181H), “How are we to know our Lord?” He said, “He isabove the Seventh Heaven above His Throne and we do not say as the Jahmiyyah say, ‘He is here upon the earth.’ So that was mentioned toAhmad ibn Hanbal and he said, “That is how it is with us.” Reported byad-Daariniee in Ar-Radd alal-Mareesee’, pp. 24 and 103 and Ar-Radd‘olal-Jahmiyyah, p. 50
    4)-Aboo Mutee al-Hakam ibn ‘Abdullaah al-Balkhee said, “I asked AbooHaneefah about the one who says, ‘I do not know whether my Lord is inthe sky or the earth.’ So he said, ‘He is a Kaafir, since Allaah, the MostHigh, says:The Most Merciful has ascended over the ThroneSoorah Taa-Haa (20):5And His ‘Arsh (Throne) is above the Heavens.’ So I said, ‘If he says, Isay that He ascended above the ‘Arsh, but I do not know whether the‘Arsh is in the heavens or the earth. He said, ‘If he denies that He isabove the sky then he is a Kaafir.”’ Reported by adh-Dhahahee inMukhtasirul Uluww, no. 18
    5)-‘Abdullaah ibn al-Mubaarak (d. 181H) said, “We do not say as theJahmiyyah say, that Allah is on the earth, rather He has risen over HisThrone.” And it was said to him, “How should we know our Lord?” Hesaid, “Above the Heavens, over (‘alaa) His Throne.” Khalq Af’aalul-Ibaadof Imaam al-Bukhaaree, no. 13
    6)-Muhammad ibn Yoosuf (one of the teachers of Imaam Bukhaaree) said,“The one who says that Allah is not over (‘aLa) His Throne is a kaafir.And the one who thinks that Allaah did not speak to Moses is a kaafir.”Khalq Af’aalul-’lbaad of Imaam al-Bukhaaree, no. 66.
    7)-‘Abdullaah ibn Mas’ood said about His saying, “Then He rose over the Throne,” “The Throne is over the water, and Allaah is above (fawqa) theThrone, and He knows what you are upon.” Khalq Af’aalul-’Ibaad ofImaam al-Bukhaaree, no. 103.
    8)-Adullaah ibn ‘Abbaas said, “Verily Allaah was above His Throne beforeHe created anything, then He created the creation and decreed whatwas to exist until the Day of Judgement.” Sharh Usoolul-l’tiqaad of alLaalikaa’ee,no. 660.
    9)-Imaam al-Bukhaaree (d. 256H) said, “Mujaahid (d. 104H) saidabout Istiwaa: ‘Rising over the Throne.”
    10)-Abul-Hasan al-Ash’aree (d. 324H) said, “If it is said, ‘Why doyou deny that His saying:“Do they not see that We have created for them what Our OwnHands have created.” And His saying:
    “Whom I have created with My Own (Two) Hands.”
    are rnajaaz (metaphorical)?’ To him it is said, ‘The rulingconcerning the Speech of Allah, the Mighty and Majestic, is thatit is taken upon its dhaahir (apparent) and haqeeqah (real)meaning. Nothing is removed from its dhaahir (apparent)meaning to majaaz (a metaphorical) one, except with a proof... Likewise, the saying of Allaah, the Mighty and Majestic:
    “Whom I have created with My Own (Two) Hands.”
    Its dhaahir and haqeeqah meaning is affirming Yadain (twoHands of Allaah). So it is not permissible to alter it from thedhaahir meaning of Yadain to that which our opponents claim,except with a proof ... Consequently, about His saying:
    “Whom I have created with My Own (Two) Hands.”
    It is obligatory to affirm two Hands for Allaah, the Most High, inits haqeeqah (real) meaning, not with the meaning of ni’matayn(two bounties of Allaah).”
    Al-Ibaanah ‘an Usoolid-Diyaanah, p. 133. The ascription of this bookto Abul-Hasan al-Ash’aree, and that it was his ‘final book concerning‘aqeedah, has been testified to by a number of Scholars, from them, alHaafidhIbn ‘Asaakir in Tabyeenul – Kadhabul - Muftaree, p. 152, alBayhaqeein Al-I’tiqaad, p. 31, Imaam adh-Dhahabee in Al-Uluww, no.276 and Ibnul-’Imaad in Shadhraatudh-Dhahab, p. 303. Refer also toChapter Ten: The ‘Aqeediah of Abul-Hasan al-Ash’aree and a Refutationof the Ash’ariyyah.

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    CONSENSUS THAT ALLAH IS ABOVE THE THRONE.
    http://www.systemoflife.com/articles...#axzz5FSWXcaYC

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    http://as-salaf.com/article.php?aid=67&lang=en

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    The Asharis and the Mu'tazillah need to read this post.

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    Imaam al-Qurtubee (d. 671H) said, “Not a single person fromthe Salafus-Saalih (Pious Predecessors) denied Istiwaa (AllaahAscending) over the Throne to be haqeeqah (in a real sense)…The reality of its kaifiyyah (how He Ascends) is not known.Imaam Maalik said that al-Istiwaa is known, how is unknownand asking questions concerning it is an innovation.”
    Al-Jaami’ li-Ahkaamil-Qur’aan, 18/216

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    Ümit's Avatar
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    Re: Allah Is Above the Throne.Not Everywhere.

    Yes, that is the correct interpretation. Allah can be anywhere and everywhere at any time...if he wishes that...but he does not have to do that...he is above his throne.
    So to say that Allah is everywhere is technically wrong and would be a form of polytheism if you would really believe that.
    How that actually looks like goes beyond our comprehensive ability...we can never understand it.

    I made this mistake myself also when I did not know a lot about my religion. Not that I believed that Allah was inside every living and non living things...but somehow that Allah was just everywhere...I did not put much thought in it...because I could not fully comprehend that...
    Then finally someone pointed out to me that Allah is above his throne...not everywhere. That he can reach everywhere at any time without actually being everywhere...so that saying that Allah is everywhere is wrong.

    And indeed, I never found a verse which said that Allah was everywhere...I could only find these hadeeth you already mentioned that He is above his throne.

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    Re: Allah Is Above the Throne.Not Everywhere.

    @MuhammadHamza1

    Why do you take interest in such matters which entail even fear of losing iman.....?

    We accept the unapparent verses without discussing kaifiya or meaning. And this is the opinion of ashari and maturudi but if some deviant sects like anthropomorphists take the verses literally and try to prove what is against His Majesty then they interprete the verses which is most suitable to His Majesty.

    E.g.

    See this hadith.

    It was narrated by al-Bukhaari in hisS aheeh(1145) and by Muslim (1261) from Abu Hurayrah (may Allaah be pleased with him), that the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “The Lord descends every night to the lowest heaven when one-third of the night remains and says: ‘Who will call upon Me, that I may answer Him? Who will ask of Me, that I may give him? Who will seek My forgiveness, that I may forgive him?’”
    This hadeeth was narrated from the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) by approximately twenty-eight of the Sahaabah (may Allaah be pleased with them) and the Ahl al-Sunnah are unanimously agreed that it is to be accepted.
    https://islamqa.info/en/20081?_e_pi_...0%2C9657010326

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    MuhammadHamza1's Avatar
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    Re: Allah Is Above the Throne.Not Everywhere.

    @azc
    How can it be losing your faith when the correct understanding of Salaff is presented along with Ijmaa'?I implore you how is this misguidance when Ijmaa' and quotations of the Salaf are presented?I can go on Alhamdulillah and even show you that the all of the four imams had the same understanding as presented aboce in this post.How can you call it misguidance then?There is no danger of misguidance when the Sahabah and Ijmaa' and prominent scholors are mentioned.My topic is not why you do it.But rahter to show that your understanding is wrong.

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    Re: Allah Is Above the Throne.Not Everywhere.

    Quote Originally Posted by MuhammadHamza1 View Post
    @azc
    How can it be losing your faith when the correct understanding of Salaff is presented along with Ijmaa'?I implore you how is this misguidance when Ijmaa' and quotations of the Salaf are presented?I can go on Alhamdulillah and even show you that the all of the four imams had the same understanding as presented aboce in this post.How can you call it misguidance then?There is no danger of misguidance when the Sahabah and Ijmaa' and prominent scholors are mentioned.My topic is not why you do it.But rahter to show that your understanding is wrong.
    In AZC's defence, i think he meant to say that if you are investigating such issues you might stumble upon misinformation without knowing it and that may cause you to believe in it and therefore to lose your faith.
    So, to some level I can understand AZC's fear.
    But then, if your Imaan is strong enough, your own reasoning should interfere in time which forces you to investigate a little deeper to find the truth.

    I think such fear should not stop people from looking for the right answers.
    On the contrary, I think your post makes people aware of this mistake that Allah is everywhere (like in my case when I was younger) and give them the possibility to correct this.

    So, well done and thank you for your contribution.
    1 | Likes Abz2000 liked this post

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    Re: Allah Is Above the Throne.Not Everywhere.

    Is He not surrounding all things? 41 : 54

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    Re: Allah Is Above the Throne.Not Everywhere.

    Quote Originally Posted by beleiver View Post
    Is He not surrounding all things? 41 : 54
    (Verily, He is surrounding all things!) means, all of creation is subject to His control, dominion and knowledge; He is controlling all things by His power, so whatever He wills happens, and whatever He does not will does not happen, and there is no god worthy of worship apart from Him. This is the end of the Tafsir of Surah Fussilat. To Allah be praise and blessings.
    Quoted from tafsir ibn Kathir


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    Quote Originally Posted by umie View Post
    In AZC's defence, i think he meant to say that if you are investigating such issues you might stumble upon misinformation without knowing it and that may cause you to believe in it and therefore to lose your faith.
    So, to some level I can understand AZC's fear.
    But then, if your Imaan is strong enough, your own reasoning should interfere in time which forces you to investigate a little deeper to find the truth.

    I think such fear should not stop people from looking for the right answers.
    On the contrary, I think your post makes people aware of this mistake that Allah is everywhere (like in my case when I was younger) and give them the possibility to correct this.

    So, well done and thank you for your contribution.
    Thank you for your kind words.

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    Re: Allah Is Above the Throne.Not Everywhere.

    Quote Originally Posted by MuhammadHamza1 View Post
    (Verily, He is surrounding all things!) means, all of creation is subject to His control, dominion and knowledge; He is controlling all things by His power, so whatever He wills happens, and whatever He does not will does not happen, and there is no god worthy of worship apart from Him. This is the end of the Tafsir of Surah Fussilat. To Allah be praise and blessings.
    Quoted from tafsir ibn Kathir


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    And like wise, He can control His creation because He is surrounding all things?

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    Re: Allah Is Above the Throne.Not Everywhere.

    Quote Originally Posted by beleiver View Post
    And like wise, He can control His creation because He is surrounding all things?
    Salaf never debated on such issues and those who debate on unapparent verses or ahadith are disliked in Quran.

    Ponder over these ayat:

    “He [Allah] is the One who has revealed to you the Book [the Qur’an]. Out of it there are verses that are muhkamat[of established meaning], which are the principal verses of the Book, and some others are mutashabihat[whose definite meanings are unknown]. Now those who have perversity in their hearts go after the mutashabih of it, seeking [to create] discord, and searching for its interpretation [that meets their desires], while no one knows its interpretation except Allah; and those well-grounded in knowledge say: We believe therein; all is from our Lord. Only the men of understanding observe the advice.” (Qur’an 3:7)

    Plz see this link:

    http://islamqa.org/hanafi/daruliftaa/7887

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    Re: Allah Is Above the Throne.Not Everywhere.

    Surrounding his creation is not be taken as literal.Now the Ash'aris will say you are doing Taweel.We are not.JUst notice the first part Believer.

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    Re: Allah Is Above the Throne.Not Everywhere.

    Quote Originally Posted by azc View Post
    Salaf never debated on such issues and those who debate on unapparent verses or ahadith are disliked in Quran.

    Ponder over these ayat:

    “He [Allah] is the One who has revealed to you the Book [the Qur’an]. Out of it there are verses that are muhkamat[of established meaning], which are the principal verses of the Book, and some others are mutashabihat[whose definite meanings are unknown]. Now those who have perversity in their hearts go after the mutashabih of it, seeking [to create] discord, and searching for its interpretation [that meets their desires], while no one knows its interpretation except Allah; and those well-grounded in knowledge say: We believe therein; all is from our Lord. Only the men of understanding observe the advice.” (Qur’an 3:7)


    Plz see this link:



    http://islamqa.org/hanafi/daruliftaa/7887
    I Quoted the Quran as i read it..Its those words that I bleieve in..How can that be in any way wrong?
    Saying those words mean something different to what they say is wrong , no?
    Or distorting words?

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    Re: Allah Is Above the Throne.Not Everywhere.

    @beleiver:

    First, Plz open the link and read,
    http://islamqa.org/hanafi/daruliftaa/7887

    Is Allah Everywhere or is He on His Throne? - IslamQA
    Some people say Allah is everywhere, some say He is above the heavens, some say He is on His throne; and everyone seems to present tons of evidences to prove their point. I am so confused about the whole issue. Where is Allah? Please explain! ANSWER In the name of Allah, Most Compassionate, Most Merciful, The short...

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    Re: Allah Is Above the Throne.Not Everywhere.

    Quote Originally Posted by azc View Post
    @beleiver:

    First, Plz open the link and read,
    http://islamqa.org/hanafi/daruliftaa/7887

    Is Allah Everywhere or is He on His Throne? - IslamQA
    Some people say Allah is everywhere, some say He is above the heavens, some say He is on His throne; and everyone seems to present tons of evidences to prove their point. I am so confused about the whole issue. Where is Allah? Please explain! ANSWER In the name of Allah, Most Compassionate, Most Merciful, The short...
    Thanks, i will read that later, inshallah..

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    Re: Allah Is Above the Throne.Not Everywhere.

    Quote Originally Posted by beleiver View Post
    I Quoted the Quran as i read it..Its those words that I bleieve in..How can that be in any way wrong?
    Saying those words mean something different to what they say is wrong , no?
    Or distorting words?
    Why can't you both be correct at the same time?
    Just because Allah says in Surah 20 Verse 5 [The Most Merciful [who is] above the Throne established.] doesnt mean that he does not encompass all of His creation.

    If we read the most known ayaa of the Quran (2:255) we will see that Allah's Kursi (interpretation of this word varies from Footstool/Chair/Throne -> Link: http://tafsir.io/2/255 ) is said to extend over the heavens and earth. If Allah Almighty is established above his throne and above his chair then that basically means that he surrounds all of existence.
    I think whats stopping some from understanding or imagining this is that they are constraining themselves to the understandings of this dunya. Allah almighty is unlike anything we can imagine. I'd like to think that Allah is not in humanoid form like many Christians depict Him to be. Instead he is a being that encompasses the entire universe (something that is impossible to achieve when your in a human form)
    2 | Likes beleiver, Umm♥Layth liked this post

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    Re: Allah Is Above the Throne.Not Everywhere.

    Allah (Subhanahu Wa Talaa) does not resemble any of his creation. Allah is perfect and absolute, he does not have a shape or body he does not have a gender he does not resemble any of his creation period and he exist without a place. He does not have a beginning and he does not have an end period. He sees everyone no matter where we go in the universe, he hears everyone no matter where we go in the universe. No one can escape him and no one can hide from him. It impossible to get out of his kingdom and hide from him. Impossible. We should just focus on worshiping him and not commit shirk. Simple.

    One of the biggest reason why the Christian are mushrikeen because they believe that God is in a shape of a human and actually can visit humans on Earth and thus he occupies some space or place on Earth. They also believe in three Gods, female, male God and they believe a God have a son and and and. Those are all shirk believes and thus how Pagans pushed it by worshiping trees, horses, suns, moons, stars etc. Isn't a person wishing in a star a form of a shirk? It is. How is wishing in a star no different than worshiping a ball of fire that is millions of years away from us and all that ball of fire is doing is worshiping Allah (Subhanahu Wa Talaa).

    As a human being one should be offended that the person worships a star while that star worships Allah (Subanaha Wa Talaa). Why should the star worship Allah and not me? No...I am better than that star, *I* am worshiping Allah and nothing else. That is a smart human. Not an idiot human who must see something and physically touch something to worship it.
    Last edited by xboxisdead; 05-14-2018 at 07:37 PM.
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    Re: Allah Is Above the Throne.Not Everywhere.

    Isn't it easier and more accurate to say that His throne (KURSI) encompasses the heavens and the earth, and that the heavens and the earth cannot contain Him.

    How then does He "come to the nearest heaven to listen to calls in the final third watch of the night"? A question of reception maybe? Logically, since reception is bad and distorted by the heart weak in faith, and reception is good from a faithful heart - regardless of time, it may simply mean that His reception of prayers is stronger for those who make the sincere and pious effort to seek assistance at that time when sleep feels sweet and forsaking one's enjoyment for prayer requires a serious heart willing to sacrifice - since the earth is round-ish/spherical-ish and there's always a third part of the night running with the rotation of the planet. Otherwise faithful people would never have worked night shifts - also, the advice to calculate prayer times during the age of deception indicates that the times are simply markers for convenience and not exclusively markers of Allah's mercy in and of themselves.

    Their meats will never attain pertain to Allah, nor their blood; (Literally: bloods) but piety from you will reach Him. Thus He has subjected them to you, that you may magnify Allah for that He has guided you. And give good tidings to the fair-doers.


    It is neither their meat nor their blood that reaches Allah, but it is piety from you that reaches Him. Thus have We made them subject to you that you may magnify Allah for His Guidance to you. And give glad tidings (O Muhammad SAW) to the Muhsinun (doers of good).

    From Quran chapter 22




    And Allah swt knows best.
    The question does sound a bit insignificant sometimes but it can bother a person who's trying to get their head around it, and we can only try with good intention.
    1 | Likes Umm♥Layth liked this post
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    Re: Allah Is Above the Throne.Not Everywhere.

    Do not waste your time on complex scholarly matters that have not and will probably never be fully resolved. These matters are not for the lay person. Allah will not ask you on the day of Judgement whether you believed he was "only above the throne or not". For we have far more pressing matters to attend to before our last breaths!
    2 | Likes azc, noorzaiin liked this post
    Allah Is Above the Throne.Not Everywhere.

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