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islamirama
04-20-2008, 07:55 PM
"Austrian minister sparks controversy over teachers wearing headscarves"

(AFP, March 09, 2005)

Austria’s education ministry said Wednesday that public school teachers would not be banned from wearing the traditional Islamic headscarf despite controversial comments by the country’s new interior minister.

Liese Prokop, speaking to the weekly Falter, said she found teachers wearing the headscarf in public schools shocking.

“I don’t know if a ban of the headscarf is legally possible, but I am in favor of it,” the new minister of the governing conservative party was quoted as saying Tuesday. “I find it shocking because it does not correspond to the values of our society and tolerance is going too far.”

Prokop also denounced forced marriages, honor killings and wife battery in Austria’s minority Muslim community.

Omar Al-Rawi, a Muslim community leader, said the statements amounted to “a slap in the face of Muslim women.”

On Wednesday, education ministry spokesman Ronald Zecha told AFP that there was no proposal to bar teachers from wearing the headgear in public schools.

“There is no problem in Austria, because we have a system of good cooperation and of reciprocal tolerance with the different religious communities,” Zecha said.

Austria established freedom of religion in 1912, he said.

The wearing of the Islamic headscarf has been the subject of heated debate across Europe. In France, it was banned in public schools after a protracted legal and political battle.
http://www.wwrn.org/article.php?idd=2174&sec=33&con=44
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Roasted Cashew
04-22-2008, 08:11 AM
One expects these so called "Conservatives" to be more tolerant and accepting of their fellow believers but it's always the opposite.
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Al-Zaara
04-22-2008, 08:37 AM
“I find it shocking because it does not correspond to the values of our society and tolerance is going too far.”
When it doesn't satisfy your eye, it's gone too far. The hijab is meant to resemble modesty, now is he against modesty? No, of course not.

Eeverybody can dress however they like. Have they ever seen how some Goths or Anime-freaks dress here in Finland for example? No? Take a look. They really stand out. And nobody is bothered. A headscarf won't make a woman's brain disappear neither do they force it on other women, so what's the problem? He's just intolerant.
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north_malaysian
04-22-2008, 08:42 AM
Originally Posted by Al-Zaara
Eeverybody can dress however they like. Have they ever seen how some Goths or Anime-freaks dress here in Finland for example?.
In Finland too? I thought these Gothic and Anime people are only available in Asian countries such as Japan, Taiwan, Korea, Malaysia and Singapore.

And interestingly, most of Gothic and Anime people in Malaysia are Muslims.
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Al-Zaara
04-22-2008, 08:48 AM
Originally Posted by north_malaysian
In Finland too? I thought these Gothic and Anime people are only available in Asian countries such as Japan, Taiwan, Korea, Malaysia and Singapore.
No way! I always thought the Gothic people are pre-dominant in the North, the Nordic countries... I can't imagine Asians being Goths. Goths are ought to be pale white, no? :D lol

The Anime hype on the other hand may not be as visible as the Gothic, but it's becoming more and more common. We've got plenty of Japanese tourists yearly in Finland. ;D And more and more Finns are interested in living in Japan.. Mangas are popular here.

And interestingly, most of Gothic and Anime people in Malaysia are Muslims.
GOTHIC MUSLIMS?! Whoa. Now I've heard everything. ;D
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north_malaysian
04-22-2008, 08:59 AM
Originally Posted by Al-Zaara
Goths are ought to be pale white, no?
most northeastern Asians are pale too... for those who live in the southeastern part of Asia... they put lot of whitening stuff on their faces...

Originally Posted by Al-Zaara
GOTHIC MUSLIMS?! Whoa. Now I've heard everything. ;D
We got Black Metal Muslims, Ska Muslims, Punk Muslims, Skinhead Muslims, Rasta Muslims etc.. whatever you got in US or Europe...we got it here...

Japanese fashion is very famous in Malaysia and is known as "Kawaai"... Manga is 1000 times more popular than US Comics...
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Al-Zaara
04-22-2008, 09:01 AM
Originally Posted by north_malaysian
most northeastern Asians are pale too... for those who live in the southeastern part of Asia... they put lot of whitening stuff on their faces...
Duh! Of course. :skeleton:

We got Black Metal Muslims, Ska Muslims, Punk Muslims, Skinhead Muslims, Rasta Muslims etc.. whatever you got in US or Europe...we got it here...

Japanese fashion is very famous in Malaysia and is known as "Kawaai"... Manga is 1000 times more popular than US Comics...
Help!! Haha, OK, I'd probably get a culture-shock then...
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Suomipoika
04-22-2008, 09:50 AM
Originally Posted by Al-Zaara
Eeverybody can dress however they like. Have they ever seen how some Goths or Anime-freaks dress here in Finland for example? No? Take a look. They really stand out. And nobody is bothered. A headscarf won't make a woman's brain disappear neither do they force it on other women, so what's the problem? He's just intolerant.
Thats not entirely true. Plenty of people are bothered. Employers. In the customer service jobs Ive had, I had to follow all sorts of dresscodes. Im pretty sure that the various Anime and Goth freaks will have to wear the same uniforms and follow the same rules in regards of make up and jewelry as everyone else does, rules which do exist in various workplaces here in Finland too.

Personal opinion, I think women should be allowed to wear Hijab in workplaces but its up to the employer to decide if they want to allow that or not, like with every other dresscode they set up. Its the employers property and he or she can set the rules there, even limiting freedom of religion, similarly like the owners of these forums can and do limit freedom of speech. Just because the state is the employer and owner doesnt really change a thing.
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Al-Zaara
04-22-2008, 10:01 AM
Originally Posted by Suomipoika
Thats not entirely true. Plenty of people are bothered. Employers. In the customer service jobs Ive had, I had to follow all sorts of dresscodes. Im pretty sure that the various Anime and Goth freaks will have to wear the same uniforms and follow the same rules in regards of make up and jewelry as everyone else does, rules which do exist in various workplaces here in Finland too.
True, you cannot go and dress like a total Goth when working as a nurse. :D But see, in that particular field for example I wouldn't understand why the hijab wouldn't be allowed. It's more hygienic, the hair won't fall anywhere. Or for example if you're a lawyer.

But then PUBLIC school, banning headscarves were Goths and Anime freaks dress very "unusually"? Nope, that's hypocritical.

I too had to follow dresscodes while working different jobs, and yes they were a bit reluctant when seeing I wore a Hijaab, but then honestly they realized it didn't hurt in any way. When I worked as a waitress, I could still dress modestly and fulfill the dress-codes of the house. Of course it cannot be like this everywhere! Yet it's no excuse for a minister to go and wish for a law prohibiting the headscarf in every workplace. I do understand if the owner has a problem, OK, his(her place. But to make a law about it is a whole different thing.

Personal opinion, I think women should be allowed to wear Hijab in workplaces but its up to the employer to decide if they want to allow that or not, like with every other dresscode they set up. Its the employers property and he or she can set the rules there, even limiting freedom of religion, similarly like the owners of these forums can and do limit freedom of speech. Just because the state is the employer and owner doesnt really change a thing.
I definitely agree, your place your rules sure. But I do not agree this to be set as a general law, 'headscarves banned'.
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*Hana*
04-22-2008, 10:11 AM
I wonder if these people have the same opinion about Nuns that cover and teach in public schools? Or Volunteer their time in the public sector. Would this Minister be so quick to tell her to remove her Habit, which includes her head covering. Would he tell a priest to remove his white collar?

These people are intimidated by a simple piece of cloth and they are the ones running our countries?? Now THAT'S scary!!!!

Wasalam,
Hana
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Suomipoika
04-22-2008, 05:34 PM
Originally Posted by Al-Zaara
But then PUBLIC school, banning headscarves were Goths and Anime freaks dress very "unusually"? Nope, that's hypocritical.
Schools are very hypocritical places, they limit our freedoms at their own whim. Opinions, behaviour, dressing certain way (I could be wrong but Im pretty sure in Finland too, at some point the schools will not allow you to attend while wearing something they deem unsuitable) and all kinds of issues that are perfectly legal are banned in schools very arbitrary. (I still have traumas of not being allowed to wear baseball caps or any hat inside the school building during the mid 90's to teach me proper gentleman manners while the girls could wear anything. :cry:)

Teachers and students however are two totally different things, I really dont know, do they allow teachers dressed as Anime freaks and Goths in Austrian schools?

I definitely agree, your place your rules sure. But I do not agree this to be set as a general law, 'headscarves banned'.
I had to reread the original article but I dont see anyone wanting to impose new law, rather just ban teachers from wearing headscarfs.
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north_malaysian
04-24-2008, 05:25 AM
Originally Posted by Suomipoika
Schools are very hypocritical places, they limit our freedoms at their own whim. Opinions, behaviour, dressing certain way (I could be wrong but Im pretty sure in Finland too, at some point the schools will not allow you to attend while wearing something they deem unsuitable) and all kinds of issues that are perfectly legal are banned in schools very arbitrary. (I still have traumas of not being allowed to wear baseball caps or any hat inside the school building during the mid 90's to teach me proper gentleman manners while the girls could wear anything. :cry:)

Teachers and students however are two totally different things, I really dont know, do they allow teachers dressed as Anime freaks and Goths in Austrian schools?



I had to reread the original article but I dont see anyone wanting to impose new law, rather just ban teachers from wearing headscarfs.
Finnish students dont wear school uniforms like Americans too...

We in Malaysia, Singapore and Indonesia have school uniforms... so the rich kids and poor kids would look alike and equal...
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Muezzin
04-24-2008, 09:02 AM
What a pity this lady couldn't be on the list of 'cool folks' that Austria has brought us. Mozart. Freud. Schwarzenegger.
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