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islamirama
04-30-2008, 04:34 AM
Nigerian Catholics told to be modest

By Elizabeth Blunt
BBC correspondent in Lagos



Modesty is a big issue in Nigeria these days.


Universities are introducing dress codes for their students.
The country's Muslims in particular are going to greater lengths than ever to be seen to be dressing modestly. Muslim women newsreaders appear on television swathed in scarves. Schoolgirls in the north, who would previously just have worn a small cotton headscarf with their uniform, now go to school in waist-length hijab, in somewhat Indonesian style.
Now the Catholic Church has joined the debate.


In his latest circular letter to parishes, the Archbishop of Lagos, Cardinal Anthony Okogie, under the heading "nudity", calls on priests not to allow in church what he calls "fashions promoting lust and immorality". He says that any of the faithful wearing "clothes which reveal sensitive parts of the body such as the bust, chest, belly, or upper arms, transparent clothing or dresses with slits above the knees" should be "quietly asked to worship outside". As for boys, it says there should be no "jerry curls [long curly hair], tight jeans or earrings".


Traditional dress

A Sunday morning visit to the Church of the Assumption, in the Ikoyi district of Lagos, showed the Archbishop's recommendations were being well observed. Apart from one boy in tight jeans, everyone was looking very modest. Most women said they liked to wear traditional Nigerian dress to church - a blouse, wraparound skirt and some form of head-dress.
Many Catholics come from south-east Nigeria, and Sunday best for Ibo women means a lacy white blouse, a wrapper of fine woven cloth and an elaborate head-tie of stiff brocade or taffeta.


Many young girls wore an updated version of Nigerian dress - a long skirt and a nicely tailored, matching blouse. The most devout covered their heads with black, lacy scarves. Some of the men were in loose, pyjama-style Nigerian suits, others in western clothes.


Everyone I spoke to had heard of the Archbishop's campaign for modest dressing, and said they were wholly in agreement. I heard outspoken condemnation of people who come to the house of God half-naked, diatribes against tight trousers, skimpy tops and "spaghetti straps".


Bride barred

Several women said they believed they should imitate the Holy Mother, Mary, and cover their heads, since she always appears in images with a veil. And several of the congregation raised the issue of wedding dresses and the current fashion for brides to wear strapless, low-cut, evening-dress style outfits. "It's very, very wrong," one woman told me. "Very, very wrong. Especially the ones showing the boobs - you don't do that in the presence of God."


In fact, the wedding dress problem may have been the start of this whole campaign.


I was told that in a particularly notorious case, the parish priest in one Lagos church had refused to let the bride into the church for her own wedding. He said he would wait for her all afternoon if he had to, but she would have to go home and put on more clothes.


Story from BBC NEWS:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/2/hi/africa/3549210.stm
Mary, the mother
of Jesus A nun

The Veil in Christianity: A common misconception is that Muslim women are the only ones who cover their hair. It may be true that Islam is the only religion in which most women follow its directives to cover the hair, but it is not the only religion to have such directives. It is particularly interesting to look at the case of Christianity, since Christianity is the predominant religion in the West, and it is Westerners, including observant Christians, who are often the first to criticize Islam because of the hijab (modest dress, including headcovering).
Do Any Christian Women Today Cover Their Heads? It is true that most Christian women do not, and many don't take other teachings of the Bible (against pre-marital sex, adultery, etc) literally either. However, there do seem to be a growing number of Christian women out there who are committed to following the Bible as it is written. Below are some webpages that I found that call for Christian women to cover their heads in accordance with the commandment of the Bible.
According to the Scriptures: Headcovering
Biblical Headcovering: The Scarf of Hidden Power
Headcoverings and the Christian Woman
Let Her Be Veiled
Nigerian Catholics told to be modest
No Such Custom?
She Maketh Herself Headcoverings
The Christian Veiling
The Headcoverings of Sisters
The Rites of Submission
The Significance of the Christian Woman's Veiling
The Veil
Is Covering the Hair a Religious Commandment for Christian Women?
Women's Headcovering and the Glory of God

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Nσσя'υℓ Jαииαн
05-06-2008, 11:17 PM
That's interesting. Sure does make sense though.
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ddz
05-06-2008, 11:27 PM
yeah, better to stay and dress humble :)
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Nσσя'υℓ Jαииαн
05-06-2008, 11:28 PM
^^True say.
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kirk
05-07-2008, 02:53 AM
The rule to cover the head only applied inside a church – not outside a church. The rule was lifted in the 1960’s

-
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islamirama
05-07-2008, 01:52 PM
Originally Posted by kirk
The rule to cover the head only applied inside a church – not outside a church. The rule was lifted in the 1960’s

-
The bible says to cover your head and the women who doesn't do it, shave off her head. The christians made rules up like "only in church" to make their own lives easy from following God's commands.
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Danah
05-07-2008, 02:06 PM
I think in terms of having a religion there is nothing called inside the place and outside the place, and nothing called before that time and after that time.

the religion has to be the same for everywhere and and anytime it is a static thing I guess
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Izyan
05-07-2008, 02:10 PM
When Jesus came back he made most of these rules obselete. For example, it was haram to perfom works on the Sabbath. Jesus went against this and upset the elders. Adultry was punishable by death and Jesus condemned it. Jesus said that the old rules still applied to a cerain extent but people are to have more compasion. He preached extensively on judging people on what you perceive as flaws.
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Izyan
05-07-2008, 02:12 PM
Originally Posted by SAYA
I think in terms of having a religion there is nothing called inside the place and outside the place, and nothing called before that time and after that time.

the religion has to be the same for everywhere and and anytime it is a static thing I guess
Are you sure about that? Death is death but did Isa not raise Lazarus from the dead? Is that not an exception?
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Danah
05-07-2008, 06:07 PM
Originally Posted by Izyan
Are you sure about that? Death is death but did Isa not raise Lazarus from the dead? Is that not an exception?
I mean in terms of instructions and laws in the religion, hope you get me
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Izyan
05-07-2008, 06:59 PM
Originally Posted by SAYA
I mean in terms of instructions and laws in the religion, hope you get me
In Mosaic Law you weren't supposed to perform acts on the Sabbath and yet Isa did.
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glo
05-07-2008, 08:33 PM
Originally Posted by Izyan
When Jesus came back he made most of these rules obselete. For example, it was haram to perfom works on the Sabbath. Jesus went against this and upset the elders. Adultry was punishable by death and Jesus condemned it. Jesus said that the old rules still applied to a cerain extent but people are to have more compasion. He preached extensively on judging people on what you perceive as flaws.
I agree that Jesus certainly spoke against blindly following laws, just for the sake of following them.

Examples, when he let his disciples pick grain on the Sabbath and when he healed on the Sabbath, demonstrate this.
His parable of the good Samaritan also shown that it was those who acted 'religiously', not wanting to make themselves unclean by tending to a bleeding, potentially dying man, were in the wrong.

Our attitude towards God and our neighbours are what matters.

With regards to the modesty issue, I dare to make this statement:
It is better to be modest in conduct and attitude, even when not covered, than to be covered from head to toe, but to do so with resentment.
(This is for discussion. I would love to hear people's views on this. Do you agree or disagree? And why?)

Peace
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Izyan
05-07-2008, 08:39 PM
Originally Posted by glo
I agree that Jesus certainly spoke against blindly following laws, just for the sake of following them.

Examples, when he let his disciples pick grain on the Sabbath and when he healed on the Sabbath, demonstrate this.
His parable of the good Samaritan also shown that it was those who acted 'religiously', not wanting to make themselves unclean by tending to a bleeding, potentially dying man, were in the wrong.

Our attitude towards God and our neighbours are what matters.

With regards to the modesty issue, I dare to make this statement:
It is better to be modest in conduct and attitude, even when not covered, than to be covered from head to toe, but to do so with resentment.
(This is for discussion. I would love to hear people's views on this. Do you agree or disagree? And why?)

Peace
I agree with you wholeheartedly.
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ddz
05-07-2008, 11:12 PM
It is better to be modest in conduct and attitude, even when not covered, than to be covered from head to toe, but to do so with resentment.
stole the words right out of my....fingers? or Mouth? lol but GOOD POINT INDEED!
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kirk
05-12-2008, 03:06 AM
Originally Posted by islamarama

The bible says……etc etc

The bible was written by men and the “cover the head in a church” rule was written by men


Originally Posted by glo
It is better to be modest in conduct and attitude, even when not covered, than to be covered from head to toe, but to do so with resentment.

Well said! That too is the view of Athiests!


I can already hear the Muslims responding: “The rules must be EXACT. 1cm of ankle exposed is OK but expose 2cm and you will burn for eternity!”


k
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YusufNoor
05-12-2008, 12:54 PM
Originally Posted by kirk
The bible was written by men and the “cover the head in a church” rule was written by men

Well said! That too is the view of Athiests!


now you are stereotyping atheists...


I can already hear the Muslims responding: “The rules must be EXACT. 1cm of ankle exposed is OK but expose 2cm and you will burn for eternity!”

k
i suggest that you see a doctor of some sort, MAYBE he or she can stop the voices...

:w:
Reply

wth1257
05-12-2008, 08:37 PM
Originally Posted by islamirama
The bible says to cover your head and the women who doesn't do it, shave off her head. The christians made rules up like "only in church" to make their own lives easy from following God's commands.
That's not really grounded in fact, not even the most traditional Catholics(that I know of) make their daughters cover their hair outside of Church, and to make a slight correction, it was in, I beleive, 1983, that cannon law dropped the requirment to cover hair in Church. Though the practice was really phased out in the 60's, along with segregated(by sex) seating

As for scripture, the only scriptural verse I am aware of commanding women to cover their hair is St. Paul in Corinthians, which is in context of Church, not outside, clearly Christianity dosen't consider hair to big a deal as Mary Magdalin washed Jesus's feet with her hair.
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Nσσя'υℓ Jαииαн
05-12-2008, 08:40 PM
? Whats that have to do with covering or not?
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جوري
05-12-2008, 08:41 PM
Originally Posted by YusufNoor
i suggest that you see a doctor of some sort, MAYBE he or she can stop the voices...

:w:
lol... that was brilliant ;D

:w:
Reply

wth1257
05-12-2008, 08:42 PM
Originally Posted by Jazzy
? Whats that have to do with covering or not?
?

Somehow the question got to the Christian view of hair covering, I simply tried to clear up the matter.
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Nσσя'υℓ Jαииαн
05-12-2008, 08:43 PM
It wasnt..thats why I asked.
Reply

wth1257
05-12-2008, 08:45 PM
Originally Posted by YusufNoor
i suggest that you see a doctor of some sort, MAYBE he or she can stop the voices...

:w:

:D


very clever
Reply

wth1257
05-12-2008, 08:46 PM
Originally Posted by Jazzy
It wasnt..thats why I asked.
I can be a bit dense at time, could you please spell out what your talking about, I'm a tad confused:?
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Nσσя'υℓ Jαииαн
05-12-2008, 08:46 PM
Waahhh so am I now lol. Ill just let it slide :p My mind isnt working right now.
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wth1257
05-12-2008, 08:47 PM
Originally Posted by Jazzy
Waahhh so am I now lol. Ill just let it slide :p
Fair enough:)
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