PDA

View Full Version : Syariah High Court lets Muslim convert renounce Islam and go back to Buddhism



north_malaysian
05-09-2008, 03:40 AM
Friday May 9, 2008

Syariah High Court lets Muslim convert renounce Islam and go back to Buddhism

By PRISCILLA DIELENBERG


PENANG: The Syariah High Court here allowed an application by Muslim convert Siti Fatimah Tan Abdullah, 39, to renounce Islam and revert to her original faith.

The decision by Perlis Syariah Court chief judge Othman Ibrahim, who presided over the case when he was based in Penang earlier, makes this the first of its kind in the country where a living Muslim convert is allowed to renounce Islam since the Syariah Court Civil Procedure (State of Penang) Enactment 2004 came into force on Jan 1, 2006.

“From the evidence, it is clear that the plaintiff had not practised the teachings of Islam and had maintained her Buddhist faith.

“Although this court views seriously such matters, this court has no choice but to give her the right to return to her original faith,” said Othman.

He granted Siti Fatimah a declaration that she was no longer a Muslim, and ordered the defendant, the state Islamic Religious Council (MAIPP), to cancel her certificate of conversion to Islam.

However, he did not grant her application to change the religious status on her identity card from Muslim to Buddhist, saying that it did not come under the court’s jurisdiction and she had to pursue the matter with the National Registration Department.

Siti Fatimah, whose Chinese name is Tan Ean Huang, filed the application in May 2006. In her affidavit, she said she converted to Islam in July 1998 for the sake of marrying an Iranian named Ferdoun Ashanian in 1999 but had not practised its teachings.

She said Ferdoun left her a few months after their marriage and she had no knowledge of his whereabouts.

Siti Fatimah, a hawker from Nibong Tebal, said she had maintained her Buddhist leanings and prayed to deities like Tua Pek Kong, Kuan Yin and Thi Kong.

Othman said that Ferdoun, as the person who brought Siti Fatimah into Islam, had failed to guide her in her new faith.

He also said he regretted that the council was not concerned about carrying out its duty involving the welfare of Muslim converts.

“The court regrets that the council did not take quick action to save the plaintiff’s faith,” said Othman.

He said the council should establish procedures to ensure proper supervision of new converts: “If this is not done, it is possible that in future there may be further cases of people coming to court to renounce Islam.”

In citing authorities, Othman said that this case had similarities to the Nyonya Tahir case in 2006 except that Siti Fatimah is still alive while the earlier case involved a person who had died.

He also said that the civil courts in the case of Lina Joy clearly stated that the jurisdiction came under the Syariah Court.

The council’s counsel Ahmad Munawir Abdul Aziz said the council would appeal within the 14-day period, adding that among the concerns was the status of Siti Fatimah’s marriage as her conversion did not dissolve the marriage.

Meanwhile, after leaving the court, Tan went to the Kuan Yin Temple in Jalan Mesjid Kapitan Keling here to offer thanksgiving prayers.

When pressmen approached her, Tan spoke in Mandarin and Teochew and said she had been waiting for this decision for such a long time.

Source: http://thestar.com.my/news/story.asp...502&sec=nation
Reply

Login/Register to hide ads. Scroll down for more posts
snakelegs
05-09-2008, 04:44 AM
good news!
Reply

barney
05-09-2008, 05:12 AM
Very nice of them. :)
Reply

north_malaysian
05-09-2008, 07:09 AM
I hope the National Registration Department would change her religious status on her ID card.
Reply

Welcome, Guest!
Hey there! Looks like you're enjoying the discussion, but you're not signed up for an account.

When you create an account, you can participate in the discussions and share your thoughts. You also get notifications, here and via email, whenever new posts are made. And you can like posts and make new friends.
Sign Up
north_malaysian
05-20-2008, 01:37 AM
Since the court's ruling by allowing her to revert back to her original religion...

lots of Muslims (including the born Muslims) are filing application to leave Islam...:exhausted
Reply

Nσσя'υℓ Jαииαн
05-20-2008, 01:41 AM
^^Bad bad bad..! But anyway Allah Ta'ala will bring in a people better than them, InshaAllah.
Reply

north_malaysian
05-20-2008, 02:34 AM
Originally Posted by Jazzy
But anyway Allah Ta'ala will bring in a people better than them, InshaAllah.
Amin, Ya Rabb!
Reply

Mawaddah
05-20-2008, 02:44 AM
Originally Posted by north_malaysian
Since the court's ruling by allowing her to revert back to her original religion...

lots of Muslims (including the born Muslims) are filing application to leave Islam...:exhausted
Really! I read about the revert back to Buddhism in The Star but I never followed the story..

Allahul Musta'aan
Reply

north_malaysian
05-20-2008, 02:47 AM
Originally Posted by Mawaddah
Really! I read about the revert back to Buddhism in The Star but I never followed the story..

Allahul Musta'aan
In Penang Shariah Court... as there are no punishments for ex-Muslims under Penang Shariah Enactments... and Penang Shariah Court is the only court to grant this.... many ex-Muslim wannabes are flocking to this island.
Reply

north_malaysian
05-20-2008, 02:48 AM
Originally Posted by Mawaddah
Really! I read about the revert back to Buddhism in The Star but I never followed the story..

Allahul Musta'aan
Many religious teachers in the northern region called her lawyer as "Ustaz La'natullah"
Reply

Nσσя'υℓ Jαииαн
05-20-2008, 03:00 AM
^^Meaning what?

Amin, Ya Rabb!
Ameen thumma Ameen!
Reply

north_malaysian
05-20-2008, 04:31 AM
Originally Posted by Jazzy
^^Meaning what?
Her lawyer is a religious teacher too... because of this case... many religious teachers calling him "Ustaz La'natullah"
Reply

arabianprincess
05-20-2008, 05:23 AM
i dont get it.. if this country is based on shar3a law..................... then ur livin under it .. n its like a capital punishment ... unless ur livin where religion is sperated from the country .. then fine but in that case thats different...
Reply

north_malaysian
05-20-2008, 05:29 AM
Originally Posted by arabianprincess
i dont get it.. if this country is based on shar3a law..................... then ur livin under it .. n its like a capital punishment ... unless ur livin where religion is sperated from the country .. then fine but in that case thats different...
Malaysia is a one "confused" country...

Malaysia is neither secular nor Islamic...

There are criminal matters under the Shariah Court's jurisdiction like adultery but the punishments are not as being prescribed under the Islamic laws...If I'm not mistaken for Zina, the punishment is only RM 3,000.00.

For the Nationalists (current Government) - Malaysia is an Islamic state
For the Secularists - Malaysia is meant to be a secular state
For the Islamists - Malaysia is not an Islamic state and should be one
Reply

arabianprincess
05-20-2008, 05:31 AM
Originally Posted by north_malaysian
Malaysia is a one "confused" country...

Malaysia is neither secular nor Islamic...

There are criminal matters under the Shariah Court's jurisdiction like adultery but the punishments are not as being prescribed under the Islamic laws...If I'm not mistaken for Zina, the punishment is only RM 3,000.00.

For the Nationalists (current Government) - Malaysia is an Islamic state
For the Secularists - Malaysia is meant to be a secular state
For the Islamists - Malaysia is not an Islamic state and should be one


oh i seeeeeeeeeeeeeeee thanks for makin it clear for me... salamz
Reply

north_malaysian
05-20-2008, 05:32 AM
Originally Posted by arabianprincess
oh i seeeeeeeeeeeeeeee thanks for makin it clear for me... salamz
But for most Malaysians... we're still so blurred on this issue...:blind:

Many prefer to ignore it....
Reply

Nσσя'υℓ Jαииαн
05-20-2008, 06:14 PM
Originally Posted by north_malaysian

For the Nationalists (current Government) - Malaysia is an Islamic state
For the Secularists - Malaysia is meant to be a secular state
For the Islamists - Malaysia is not an Islamic state and should be one
^That makes sense...sounds chaotic >.< That goes for any country I think.
Reply

north_malaysian
05-21-2008, 08:50 AM
Originally Posted by Jazzy
^That makes sense...sounds chaotic >.< That goes for any country I think.
But the nationalists are claiming that Malaysia is the truest Islamic country in the world especially with their "Islam Hadhari" campaign... and some Muslims believe it.
Reply

Amadeus85
05-21-2008, 02:38 PM
Originally Posted by north_malaysian
But the nationalists are claiming that Malaysia is the truest Islamic country in the world especially with their "Islam Hadhari" campaign... and some Muslims believe it.
And may I ask whats your opinion about what's the current system in malaysia now?
Reply

north_malaysian
05-22-2008, 05:26 AM
Originally Posted by Aaron85
And may I ask whats your opinion about what's the current system in malaysia now?
Under our Federal Constitution, there should be no laws above the Federal Constitution (which is in accordance to British Common Laws system), Malaysia is meant to be a secular nation.

But, under former Prime Minister (who claimed that his goverment is the true Islamic government) amended the Federal Constitution saying that Civil Court could never interfere Sharia Court's jurisdiction.

But our "Sharia Laws" are totally different then those prescribed in the Koran or HAdith ... and too limited. Not all crimes covered by Shariah Court.

In my opinion, the current government should stop potraying itself as the most Islamic government on earth.. as it would confuse the Muslims worldwide.

Less than 20% of Muslims understand what is the "actual" Islamic laws, as many mosques are controlled by the government, the teachings shall be in accordance to Government's interpretation of Islam.

For me, Malaysia should be declared a secular nation, but with total freedom of religion... which they should cease controlling the mosques and Islamic councils...

If the Islamists want to turn this country into pure Islamic state, they should given a chance to propagate Islam ... all out... to the whole population of Malaysia... then if all Malaysians want to be under ISlamic laws...I have no problem being a citizen ruled by Islamic laws and way of life totally.

But, the people should be educated first about the actual Islam.... and they have to convince the remaining 40% of the population who are not Muslims.
Reply

glo
05-22-2008, 08:53 AM
Originally Posted by north_malaysian
Since the court's ruling by allowing her to revert back to her original religion...

lots of Muslims (including the born Muslims) are filing application to leave Islam...:exhausted
Would being a 'Muslim on paper only' make any difference to Allah's final judgement?

What I mean is, if somebody doesn't consider themselves a Muslim, and doesn't practice the religion, it shouldn't make any difference if they actually leave the religion ... or should it?

Peace
Reply

Armand
05-22-2008, 10:40 AM
glo has a point.

And to the girl who brought up capital punishment, where exactly is it stated in the Qur'an or ahadith that the penalty for a Muslim who leaves Islam for personal reasons is death? In the Prophet's lifetime (saas), the munafiqs would apostate the faith and join the enemy's side, which counts as treason. It is understandable that this ruling would not apply in the case of the Malaysian lady.
Reply

Trumble
05-22-2008, 12:02 PM
Originally Posted by north_malaysian
Since the court's ruling by allowing her to revert back to her original religion...

lots of Muslims (including the born Muslims) are filing application to leave Islam...:exhausted

I agree with glo.. if people were only remaining muslims because the law forced them to could they ever have really been muslims (rather than Buddhists, Christians or whatever) in the first place? This decision, which is self-evidently correct, just allows people to express what they believe. No Court can decide what people believe, and even if they could they would have no right to. I would have thought that a religion that has to force people to stay within in it is a feeble and desperate religion. Islam is clearly no such thing, hence the Court made the only sensible decision.
Reply

north_malaysian
05-22-2008, 12:38 PM
For me, there is no meaning to call a person a Muslim, if he/she ceased to practice Islam.

But the Malays majority are very sensitive when the Malays are filing application to leave Islam... it's considered by them as betrayal.

...and I would stop commenting on this issue too as it might cause sensitivities among other Malaysian forummers here...

Sorry.
Reply

Tania
05-22-2008, 12:42 PM
Originally Posted by north_malaysian
it's considered by them as betrayal.

...
I think in he same way when i heard about catholics - betrayal :-[
Reply

Amadeus85
05-22-2008, 04:57 PM
Originally Posted by north_malaysian
For me, there is no meaning to call a person a Muslim, if he/she ceased to practice Islam.

But the Malays majority are very sensitive when the Malays are filing application to leave Islam... it's considered by them as betrayal.

...and I would stop commenting on this issue too as it might cause sensitivities among other Malaysian forummers here...

Sorry.
Ok so maybe change the topic bit if you dont mind :)

-Whats the level of knowledge of arabic language among Malays?

-Which culture has biggest influence on Malays(especially the youths),islamic(arabic),east asian(korean,japan,chinese) or western(american ,european,australian).
Reply

truemuslim
05-22-2008, 04:59 PM
:cry:
why?
:(
Reply

MartyrX
05-22-2008, 11:37 PM
Interesting
Reply

truemuslim
05-22-2008, 11:38 PM
^ sadly interesting
Reply

north_malaysian
05-23-2008, 01:03 AM
Originally Posted by Aaron85
Ok so maybe change the topic bit if you dont mind :)

-Whats the level of knowledge of arabic language among Malays?

-Which culture has biggest influence on Malays(especially the youths),islamic(arabic),east asian(korean,japan,chinese) or western(american ,european,australian).
Malays are well known as strict followers of Koranic recitation... when they read the Koran...they could read it clearly and in accordance to Koranic reading rules (Tajweed)...Malays also love "Tarannum", which reading the Koran in several rythms like Bayati, Husseini, Hijazi, Sikah, Jaharkah, Nahawand and Saba'. Malaysia produced lots of great Koran recitors and organises International Koranic Recitation competition every year.

But when it came to Arabic, less than 25% learnt the language. However, about 25% of words in Malay language are Arabic origin.

Originally, the biggest culture influence on Malays is Hindu-Buddhism culture originated from India. Even, when Malays started converting to Islam in the 15th century.. the Hindu-Buddhism practices still predominant. After the Iranian revolution, Islamisation started in Malaysia...where people try to be as close to Islam than before. In early 1980s, only 1% of Muslim women wear hijab...now...it's 95%.

Malays started rejecting unislamic cultures they inherit from their ancestors' Hindu-Buddhism cultures. Visiting a saint's tomb is almost unheard of these days. But still, some Malaysians still practice Folk Islam which blend the element of Hindu-Buddhism...but it's getting very unpopular today... many Muslims relate Folk Islam to Black Magic.

Regarding to our youth today, Islam is still a powerful way of life to 90% of them. Abstaining from pre-marital sex and drinking alcohol is still highly observed.

If you travel to KL, just look at any mosques or prayer rooms... lots of young people still observing the 5 daily prayers.

And of course the remaining 10% are influenced to their music genre culture like punk, black metal, gothic, kawaii (anime), hip hop etc. But still many of them still observing the 5 pillars of Islam. But non-practising Malay youth are growing slowly. Pre-marital sex and homosexuality is on the rise. I think homosexuality among Malaysian Muslims is higher than any Muslim nations.

While, sodomy is really unacceptable among great majority of Malays, but sissy people and transvetites are tolerated by almost all Muslims. As long as it has nothing to do with "sex".
Reply

Nσσя'υℓ Jαииαн
05-23-2008, 01:53 AM
Wow....so it's like, Islam is there but then it isn't. Hmm.
Reply

north_malaysian
05-23-2008, 02:38 AM
Originally Posted by Jazzy
Wow....so it's like, Islam is there but then it isn't. Hmm.
Maybe we are waiting for Imam Al Mahdi, before we could really be "Islamic".:blind:
Reply

Nσσя'υℓ Jαииαн
05-23-2008, 02:59 AM
Hmm, possibly =/ The most we can do is fix ourselves and let people take example of any good we do InshaAllah =]
Reply

north_malaysian
05-23-2008, 06:26 AM
Originally Posted by Jazzy
Hmm, possibly =/ The most we can do is fix ourselves and let people take example of any good we do InshaAllah =]
Inshallah...
Reply

Amadeus85
05-23-2008, 05:09 PM
[QUOTE=north_malaysian;948090]
Malays are well known as strict followers of Koranic recitation... when they read the Koran...they could read it clearly and in accordance to Koranic reading rules (Tajweed)...Malays also love "Tarannum", which reading the Koran in several rythms like Bayati, Husseini, Hijazi, Sikah, Jaharkah, Nahawand and Saba'. Malaysia produced lots of great Koran recitors and organises International Koranic Recitation competition every year.

But when it came to Arabic, less than 25% learnt the language. However, about 25% of words in Malay language are Arabic origin.
Wait, wait because i dont understand it.Malays muslims understand Quaran while reading it or not? I mean the sentences and words.because you said that just 25 % knows arabic. So the rest read translations ?

Originally, the biggest culture influence on Malays is Hindu-Buddhism culture originated from India. Even, when Malays started converting to Islam in the 15th century.. the Hindu-Buddhism practices still predominant. After the Iranian revolution, Islamisation started in Malaysia...where people try to be as close to Islam than before. In early 1980s, only 1% of Muslim women wear hijab...now...it's 95%
.

I was rather asking about the cultural influence like -movie,music, not religion/philosophy/way of life.But thnx for answer anyway.:)
Its interesting hwat you say,you have any idea why the revival began with iranian revolution? Iranians are shias and the mosque building in Malaysia is rather funding by Saudis and GULF states I guess.So its not direct influence but maybe just the example which gave Iranians that it is possible in XX century to make an islamic state?
Reply

north_malaysian
05-24-2008, 03:37 AM
Originally Posted by Aaron85

Wait, wait because i dont understand it.Malays muslims understand Quaran while reading it or not? I mean the sentences and words.because you said that just 25 % knows arabic. So the rest read translations ?
Malays are the best koran recitors in the world, but many of them still need to read the translation of Koran, as they dont know Arabic. There are rules on how to read the Koran called Tajweed of which the Malays follow it strictly...all Malay students must learn to read the Koran since 7 yr old at public schools. There are some suggestions to make Arabic language a compulsory subject for Malay students.

Originally Posted by Aaron85
I was rather asking about the cultural influence like -movie,music
Sorry. Malaysia is a multiracial country and it has no problem absorbing all kind of cultures from all over the world. Our tv channels have tv programmes in dozens of languages... Music? You can listen all sorts of music from all over the world in Malaysia. Movies too..

Originally Posted by Aaron85
Its interesting hwat you say,you have any idea why the revival began with iranian revolution? Iranians are shias and the mosque building in Malaysia is rather funding by Saudis and GULF states I guess.So its not direct influence but maybe just the example which gave Iranians that it is possible in XX century to make an islamic state?
After the Iranian revolution, there was a deviant Messianic (or Mahdic) group called Al Arqam in Malaysia... they were the first community where guys wear the turban and the women wear all black "purdah" which covers everything but the eyes. This group was only banned in 1995, after the leaders want to establish a govenrment.

The Al Arqam were very industrious and were the first group to publish islamic magazines, islamic songs and was very popular among Malaysians. In the earlier years, nobody outside their group know their actual beliefs and Muslims were very supportive to this group. Many Sunni clerics support al Arqam missionaries and many Muslims start turning back to Islam, especially the women.

The most drastic change was hijab. In 1980s, only 1 % wear hijab, in 1990s 50% wear hijab, in 2000s almost 95% wear hijab.

Al Arqam did trigger the Islamic awareness among Malaysians, but "Islamisation" done by our former Prime Minister during the 1990s is even better. Islamic banking was introduced (many are saying that Malaysia is the "mecca" for Islamic Finance institution), islamic university, islamic this and islamic that were introduced.... thanks to our former deputy Prime Minister, Anwar Ibrahim... lots of Muslim intellectuals migrated to Malaysia...

Personally, Muslims in Malaysia are practising Muslims, but when it comes to administration of the government... we're 1/2 Islamic...

In 1995, al Arqam was banned and all its 7,000+ members repented.

MAlaysia is a rich country that needs no funds from Saudi or Gulf nations, instead MAlaysia is funding lots of mosques and islamic institutions in the Asia Pacific and Balkan region. In fact, Malaysia is the headquarter of Islamic missionary in the Asia Pacific region. Our local mosque funds a group of Muslim missionaries spreading Islam among the Pagans and Christians in the deep jungle of Borneo.
Reply

Armand
05-24-2008, 07:00 AM
Originally Posted by Jazzy
Wow....so it's like, Islam is there but then it isn't. Hmm.
What's the difference? If she wasn't a believer in the first place (which is true), then are we to force someone to pretend to have faith?
Reply

Nσσя'υℓ Jαииαн
05-24-2008, 02:12 PM
WHAT are you talking about bro? Thats a response to what bro Malaysian was saying...not the article. And please elaborate on WHERE I said they should be forced? Seriously?
Reply

Umar001
05-24-2008, 02:20 PM
Originally Posted by north_malaysian
Malays are the best koran recitors in the world,
:omg::?:X

Somehow I beg to differ, I mean, I aint into nationalism and God knows I dont know any Eritrean Recitors, except for maybe Tawfiq As Sayegh, but the best? Malaysian? Erm, yea.
Reply

north_malaysian
05-24-2008, 04:11 PM
Originally Posted by Al Habeshi
:omg::?:X

Somehow I beg to differ, I mean, I aint into nationalism and God knows I dont know any Eritrean Recitors, except for maybe Tawfiq As Sayegh, but the best? Malaysian? Erm, yea.
We won the international Koranic recitation competitions many times...the Egyptians, Iranians and Indonesians are great too as they also won many time... but my favourite Koran recitors are Mustafa Ismail and Dr. Nuaina'... and both are Egyptians.
Reply

Armand
05-25-2008, 01:22 AM
As salaam alaikum Jazzy,

Originally Posted by Jazzy
WHAT are you talking about bro? Thats a response to what bro Malaysian was saying...not the article. And please elaborate on WHERE I said they should be forced? Seriously?
I never said you made such a comment. Forgive me if it came across as such.

Wa salaam
Reply

north_malaysian
05-25-2008, 11:31 AM
There is a reality show in Malaysia called "Akademi Al Qur'an" where young recitors from all over MAlaysia were enrolled into an academy and learn the tajweed (Koranic reading rules), qira'at (recitations of the Koran) and tarannum (reading the Koran in different rythms). About 800,000 people watch it every week... in the final of season 1 over 1.3 million people watching it.

This is Abdullah Fahmi, the winner of Season 1.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3c_EpdYOgr4

This is Anuar, the winner of Season 2.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=her7I...eature=related

Now it's Season 3.
Reply

north_malaysian
05-25-2008, 11:41 AM
Koranic recitation class for kids.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jue_0Qch6to
Reply

Nσσя'υℓ Jαииαн
05-25-2008, 12:31 PM
Originally Posted by Armand
As salaam alaikum Jazzy,



I never said you made such a comment. Forgive me if it came across as such.

Wa salaam
InshaAllah no big...=]
Reply

Hey there! Looks like you're enjoying the discussion, but you're not signed up for an account.

When you create an account, you can participate in the discussions and share your thoughts. You also get notifications, here and via email, whenever new posts are made. And you can like posts and make new friends.
Sign Up

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 1
    Last Post: 05-10-2011, 06:38 PM
  2. Replies: 7
    Last Post: 07-18-2008, 01:44 PM
  3. Replies: 3
    Last Post: 10-15-2006, 04:32 PM
  4. Replies: 3
    Last Post: 02-25-2006, 10:04 PM

IslamicBoard

Experience a richer experience on our mobile app!