Christian Ideas..

['Abd al-Baari]

Assalamu Alaykum Warahmatullah/Greetings,

As part of coursework i have to write an essay on different Christian Ideas about Good & Evil, its origins, and how Good & Evil affects a Christian on a day to day basis.

I would really appreciate it if some Christian Members could share some of their ideas and thoughts on this..

Many thanks!

:peace:

[glo]

How soon do you need this, Abdul?

['Abd al-Baari]

Not until the end of the week. :)

:peace:

[glo]

No pressure then ... :D
I'm not promising anything, but I see if I can find something useful for you.
(Will I get a mention in your essay?? :giggling:)

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['Abd al-Baari]

I'm not promising anything, but I see if I can find something useful for you.
(Will I get a mention in your essay?? )

No worries, and thanks anways :)

lol^ :D, i can write a sister by the name of glo helped with my research in the bibliography..:D

[Umar001]

You could speak about the armor of God that Paul speaks of in his letters, the narrow and wide road in the parables of Jesus, the tongue being the guide of the body in James.

What type of essay you writing? Like, one which you write yourself or are you meanto just compile scholarly works? I.e. School or Uni level?

['Abd al-Baari]

:sl:

It's a piece for GCSE Philosophy & Ethics, so its one that you write yourself. I'm just looking for different ideas as part of "Research."

:w: :)

[Umar001]

Wa Alaykum Salam, wow.

['Abd al-Baari]

:sl:

Wa Alaykum Salam, wow.

Why the 'wow'? lol

Just a quick question, do all Christians belive that Sin entered the world when Eve ate from the tree, in the Garden of Eden?

[Umar001]

:sl:

Why the 'wow'? lol

Just a quick question, do all Christians belive that Sin entered the world when Eve ate from the tree, in the Garden of Eden?

Wa Alaykum Salam,

Because that GCSE seems hard.

I don't know if you can say 'all' brother, you can say a majority maybe I dont know.

I think there may be a passage that through Adam sin entered the world, but it may not mean that it was Adam himself, I think it may have been a passage indicating that Jesus is the second Adam, because another passage says 'Adam was not the one deceived; it was the woman who was deceived and became a sinner.'1Tim2:14

Here is the passage I was speaking about:

Therefore, just as sin entered the world through one man, and death through sin, and in this way death came to all men, because all sinned— for before the law was given, sin was in the world. But sin is not taken into account when there is no law.Rom5:11-13

['Abd al-Baari]

:sl:

Alhamdulillah, its quite easy actually. The ethics is done through Islam, so that essay was very easy, :p Alhamdulillah!

JazakAllah Khayr for the quotes^. I haven't read that one before, quite intersting.

:w: :)

[Eric H]

Greetings and peace be with you Abdul Baari; these are questions i have thought about a lot over the years.

Some thoughts, but with no proof.

In an ideal world there would not be the need for any law or punishment, because everyone would be morally good by choice.

Adam and Eve only had one rule they could break; eating from the tree of knowledge. This suggested to me that God’s intention was that we should be good freely and willingly; without the need for all the individual moral laws.

It seems that Adam and Eve were created to be immortal and not to die physically as they were in heaven already. They disobeyed God and ate from the tree of knowledge, so they were evicted from their heaven. They were given the knowledge of good and evil, so again they knew what was right and wrong.

When Cain killed Abel there was not a law saying do not kill. God asked Cain ‘why were you angry with your brother; God did not ask Cain why did you kill your brother. The law of not killing was given to Mosses many generations later because mankind chose not to obey God freely and willingly.

Between the time of Adam and Moses there were no laws to break, which seemed to mean people could choose to do as they wanted and not be guilty of breaking any law.

If we reach salvation and enjoy immortality, the law of thou shall not kill will become meaningless because we cannot be killed. If we have everything in heaven the law of thou shall not steal will loose its meaning.

There are the two greatest commandments that seem relevant in both heaven and Earth.

Love the Lord your God with all your heart, soul, mind and strength.
Love your neighbour as you love yourself.
All the law and prophets hang on these two commandments.

If every generation between Adam and Moses lived their lives willingly by the two greatest commandments; then there would not have been the need for God to introduce laws through Moses. When people break laws they are condemned by the law.

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Christian law favours justice for the poor, the oppressed, the widows and orphans and these are the people who should be protected by Christian law.

However the law of the land is written by wealthy and powerful people who often have a different agenda. They became wealthy and powerful by taking advantage of the poor; if I can give just one example by going back in history.

In 1066 William the Conqueror invaded England and divided the land out between his nobles. You could call this theft or you could say, to the victor go the spoils.

Many of the people who own these large country estates today can trace their ancestors back to Williams’s noble men. In the eyes of the law the present owners legally own these estates today; even though they were taken by force by their ancestors.

If I was caught breaking into one of these houses today to steal their silver I would be convicted of theft. The irony might be that one of my ancestors in 1066 was evicted from this estate that I was trying to break into.

In this case the law protected a powerful invading army, and the law still protects those powerful families.

If someone stole £100 from me, and someone else stole a £1,000, 000 from a rich man, we can imagine the law would be more concerned about justice for the rich man, even though the £100 may seem like a greater loss to me.

I believe the greater way to try and search for the question of good and evil is to try and understand injustice, anger and forgiveness, and the two greatest commandments.

In the spirit of searching for a just and loving God

Eric

['Abd al-Baari]

Greetings and peace be with you too Eric!

Thank you for the post, i enjoyed reading it and i think that it will help me a lot when i come to writing up the essay, Insha'Allah. :)

Thanks again for your time.

:peace:

[glo]

Hello again, Abdul

I will try to break my answer into different sections. I hope it helps.

ORIGINAL SIN

Eric has already mentioned the story of Adam and Eve in the garden of Eden.
The basic plot is here:

Now the LORD God had planted a garden in the east, in Eden; and there he put the man he had formed. And the LORD God made all kinds of trees grow out of the ground—trees that were pleasing to the eye and good for food. In the middle of the garden were the tree of life and the tree of the knowledge of good and evil.
[...]
The LORD God took the man and put him in the Garden of Eden to work it and take care of it. And the LORD God commanded the man, "You are free to eat from any tree in the garden; but you must not eat from the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, for when you eat of it you will surely die."
[...]
Now the serpent was more crafty than any of the wild animals the LORD God had made. He said to the woman, "Did God really say, 'You must not eat from any tree in the garden'?"

The woman said to the serpent, "We may eat fruit from the trees in the garden, but God did say, 'You must not eat fruit from the tree that is in the middle of the garden, and you must not touch it, or you will die.' "

"You will not surely die," the serpent said to the woman. "For God knows that when you eat of it your eyes will be opened, and you will be like God, knowing good and evil."

When the woman saw that the fruit of the tree was good for food and pleasing to the eye, and also desirable for gaining wisdom, she took some and ate it. She also gave some to her husband, who was with her, and he ate it. Then the eyes of both of them were opened, and they realized they were naked; so they sewed fig leaves together and made coverings for themselves.

Then the man and his wife heard the sound of the LORD God as he was walking in the garden in the cool of the day, and they hid from the LORD God among the trees of the garden. But the LORD God called to the man, "Where are you?"

He answered, "I heard you in the garden, and I was afraid because I was naked; so I hid."

And he said, "Who told you that you were naked? Have you eaten from the tree that I commanded you not to eat from?"

The man said, "The woman you put here with me—she gave me some fruit from the tree, and I ate it."

Then the LORD God said to the woman, "What is this you have done?"
The woman said, "The serpent deceived me, and I ate."
[...]
The LORD God made garments of skin for Adam and his wife and clothed them. And the LORD God said, "The man has now become like one of us, knowing good and evil. He must not be allowed to reach out his hand and take also from the tree of life and eat, and live forever." So the LORD God banished him from the Garden of Eden to work the ground from which he had been taken. After he drove the man out, he placed on the east side of the Garden of Eden cherubim and a flaming sword flashing back and forth to guard the way to the tree of life.
(Genesis 2:8-9, 15-17, Genesis 3:1-13, 21-24)

Before eating the apple, Adam and Eve were innocent and pure ... but after eating it they understood the difference between good and evil.
By disobeying God, they had allowed evil to enter into their hearts, and they knew it!
This describes what Christians call 'the original sin' - an inborn human desire to fulfill our own desires and give in to sin, rather than obey God.

Some Christians believe the above story to be a real and literal account of how sin entered into us humans, other take it as a symbolic story.

Either way, it is very much part of Christian thinking that we are all prone to sin, and that in our own strength we are quite incapable of 'being good'.
Apart from Jesus himself, who we believe to be perfect and without sin, none of the people and prophets mentioned in the Bible were without flaws and faults. They all carried the same human condition of weakness and sinfullness.

(For the whole story read Genesis 2 and 3. I have been told that I should not post links to Christian websites, but I will try to send you some Bible commentaries in a PM)

**************************

[glo]

SATAN

Like Muslims, Christians believe that we are constantly exposed to temptations to turn away from God and turn towards sin, to commit evil rather than do good.

Some Christians believe Satan to be a real entity (a fallen angel, who himself chose to turn away from God), others believe him to be symbolic for our internal human tendency to want to give in to temptation and to fulfill our own desires.
Either way, we believe that there is a struggle going on between good and evil, and we all make choices between them on a daily basis.

The NT describes how Jesus himself was tempted by Satan, after he had fasted in the desert for forty days and before he started his ministry:

Then Jesus was led by the Spirit into the desert to be tempted by the devil. After fasting forty days and forty nights, he was hungry. The tempter came to him and said, "If you are the Son of God, tell these stones to become bread."

Jesus answered, "It is written: 'Man does not live on bread alone, but on every word that comes from the mouth of God.'"

Then the devil took him to the holy city and had him stand on the highest point of the temple. "If you are the Son of God," he said, "throw yourself down. For it is written:
" 'He will command his angels concerning you,
and they will lift you up in their hands,
so that you will not strike your foot against a stone.'"

Jesus answered him, "It is also written: 'Do not put the Lord your God to the test.'"

Again, the devil took him to a very high mountain and showed him all the kingdoms of the world and their splendor. "All this I will give you," he said, "if you will bow down and worship me."

Jesus said to him, "Away from me, Satan! For it is written: 'Worship the Lord your God, and serve him only.'"

Then the devil left him, and angels came and attended him.
(Matthew 4:1-11)

Satan (of you believe him to be a real entity) knows our weaknesses, and will try to tempt us with exactly those.
Jesus was tempted with food (since he was hungry), with demonstrating his divine power, and with wealth.

This passage also shows that Jesus counters Satan's attempts by quoting scripture at him, by being true to God's word and not straying from it.
That is a strong principle for Christians too ... to look in scripture for help and guidance against sin and temptation.

[glo]

HOW TO STAND UP TO EVIL

As I already said, it is very much part of Christian thinking that we are quite unable to stand up against Satan, against evil and against temptation - in out own strength, that is!

For us the only way to avoid evil and do what's right in God's eyes, is to seek refuge in God, in his Word and in prayer.

The Bible is full of symbolic language, which describes God as a protective and loving God:
*For you have been my refuge, a strong tower against the foe.
*I long to dwell in your tent forever and take refuge in the shelter of your wings (Both from Psalm 61)
*May you be richly rewarded by the LORD, the God of Israel, under whose wings you have come to take refuge. (Ruth 2:12)
*The LORD is my shepherd, I shall not be in want. [...] Even though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, I will fear no evil, for you are with me; your rod and your staff, they comfort me.(Psalm 23)
*"I am the good shepherd. The good shepherd lays down his life for the sheep." (John 10:11)
*In the same way, let your light shine before men, that they may see your good deeds and praise your Father in heaven. (Matthew 5:16)

Perhaps this shows that our strength to stand up against evil lies in God alone. Without him we are nothing!

Most Christians certainly believe that there is a very real struggle between good and evil.
This passage demonstrates this quite well.

It describes the 'armour of God'. You can see from the first lines that it refers to spiritual struggles between good and evil, rather than physical ones ... (see underlined)

Finally, be strong in the Lord and in his mighty power. Put on the full armor of God so that you can take your stand against the devil's schemes. For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the authorities, against the powers of this dark world and against the spiritual forces of evil in the heavenly realms.
Therefore put on the full armor of God, so that when the day of evil comes, you may be able to stand your ground, and after you have done everything, to stand.
Stand firm then, with the belt of truth buckled around your waist, with the breastplate of righteousness in place, and with your feet fitted with the readiness that comes from the gospel of peace.
In addition to all this, take up the shield of faith, with which you can extinguish all the flaming arrows of the evil one.
Take the helmet of salvation and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God.
And pray in the Spirit on all occasions with all kinds of prayers and requests. With this in mind, be alert and always keep on praying for all the saints.
(Ephesians 6:10-18)

At times when I feel troubled, or my faith is weak, or I feel spiritually attacked, I find this passage very powerful. I sometimes visualise putting on the armour of God and standing firm in his will and his power. :statisfie

Christians, of course, believe that by 'inviting Jesus into our lives' (i.e. recognising him to be our saviour and the Son of God) we enter into a deep and personal relationship with God, and he will change us through his Spirit. By constant walking with God and striving to be in close relationship with him, we believe that he will gradually make us more godly people.

Right, I think that will do. :D
Any questions, you know where to find me ...

Peace

['Abd al-Baari]

Greetings,

Awesome posts sis, specially the last one. I really appreciate it.

Many thanks!!

:peace:

[glo]

^
No problem, Abdul.
A little midnight shift was all it took ... and I enjoyed it very much!

The rest is up to you. Good luck with your essay! :)

Peace