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mrismail
06-23-2008, 07:54 AM
Assalamu Aleikom,

To those who have better knowledge than me, I met this fantastic potential future wife about 4 years ago. She is Catholic, however. Ever since I've found out, i've been trying to convince her about having one wedding, yet, she wants to have two weddings, one on the Islamic way and the other in a church. Now I know many will disagree about why I even am involved with a Christian female. But, I know its not haram and I hope for only the best to have her convert sooner or later. However, the question I seek an answer(s) to is, is it haram for me to get married in a church without going through the whole thing? what i mean is just being there physically. Opinions and scholar answers are welcomed.
Jazakom Allah Khayran.
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Nσσя'υℓ Jαииαн
06-25-2008, 04:27 PM
*bump*
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Umar001
06-25-2008, 04:38 PM
Wa Alaykum Salam,

A person who lies upon the one who created you is nice? Anyhow, what do you mean 'without going through the whole thing'?

Plus, will the priest bless you in the name of God the Father the Son and the Holy Spirit?
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UmmSqueakster
06-25-2008, 04:41 PM
:w:

To the best of my knowledge, the catholic church won't marry you. And if it does, you have to promise to raise your children as catholics. Under those circumstances, no way in heck could a marriage ceremony in the church be considered halal, even if you're not participating.
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aamirsaab
06-25-2008, 04:53 PM
:sl:
I think he meant have the islamic wedding ceremony in a church. So it's sort of like a trade off with his 'wfie': we do it islamic but it will take place in a church.

I think that's what he meant...
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glo
06-25-2008, 04:59 PM
Originally Posted by aamirsaab
:sl:
I think he meant have the islamic wedding ceremony in a church. So it's sort of like a trade off with his 'wfie': we do it islamic but it will take place in a church.

I think that's what he meant...
I cannot imagine that that is possible in any church, let alone a Catholic one!

But I think the OP is talking about two separate weddings:
yet, she wants to have two weddings, one on the Islamic way and the other in a church
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Umar001
06-25-2008, 05:00 PM
Originally Posted by aamirsaab
:sl:
I think he meant have the islamic wedding ceremony in a church. So it's sort of like a trade off with his 'wfie': we do it islamic but it will take place in a church.

I think that's what he meant...
Originally Posted by mrismail
Ever since I've found out, i've been trying to convince her about having one wedding, yet, she wants to have two weddings, one on the Islamic way and the other in a church.
I thought it meant like have one wedding, like a Muslim one, then have another the Christian one?
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Whatsthepoint
06-25-2008, 05:01 PM
Originally Posted by aamirsaab
:sl:
I think he meant have the islamic wedding ceremony in a church. So it's sort of like a trade off with his 'wfie': we do it islamic but it will take place in a church.

I think that's what he meant...
That's not what he meant. They're having two ceremonies, one in a mosque and one in a church. As far as I know, the catholic church allows interreligious marriages, where only the catholic spuose, in this case his wife, receives the blessings and all that.
I have no idea whether this is halal though.
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Umar001
06-25-2008, 05:03 PM
Originally Posted by glo
I cannot imagine that that is possible in any church, let alone a Catholic one!
Well all it would be, from what I have seen in mosques, the father of the lady and the groom sit, with the priest/imam and then the woman is also there kinda, depending on segregation and building structure, they ask if she agrees and if he agrees, they ask about the present given and kablam, hmm, maybe the short speech given may not be allowed.
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aamirsaab
06-25-2008, 05:07 PM
Originally Posted by Glo
I cannot imagine that that is possible in any church, let alone a Catholic one!
Heh, I learnt something new today.


Originally Posted by Al Habeshi
I thought it meant like have one wedding, like a Muslim one, then have another the Christian one?
Originally Posted by whatsthepoint
That's not what he meant. They're having two ceremonies, one in a mosque and one in a church....
That's what his 'wife' said. At the end of his post he said:

...However, the question I seek an answer(s) to is, is it haram for me to get married in a church without going through the whole thing? what i mean is just being there physically. Opinions and scholar answers are welcomed.
Jazakom Allah Khayran
But I guess we should let him clarify this statement.
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glo
06-25-2008, 05:10 PM
Originally Posted by aamirsaab
Heh, I learnt something new today.
Don't take my word for it.
Whatsthepoint seems to think otherwise, and I could well be wrong!

Thing is, how can you really declare a marriage 'before God', if there are differences in beliefs between the spouses? :?
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Whatsthepoint
06-25-2008, 05:13 PM
Originally Posted by aamirsaab
That's what his 'wife' said. At the end of his post he said:
I guess what he meant was that only his wife will receive the blessing and do all the catholic stuff. He'll just have to stand there.
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Whatsthepoint
06-25-2008, 05:17 PM
Originally Posted by glo
Don't take my word for it.
Whatsthepoint seems to think otherwise, and I could well be wrong!

Thing is, how can you really declare a marriage 'before God', if there are differences in beliefs between the spouses? :?
The catholic church allows it, though I think the uncatholic spuse needs to be baptised.

an article about it from teh Catholic encyclopadaedia
http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/09698a.htm
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Nσσя'υℓ Jαииαн
06-25-2008, 05:19 PM
I'm not sure how this is halal....:X

Allahu Alam
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snakelegs
06-25-2008, 05:25 PM
don't catholics, in order to be married by a priest to a non-cathoic, have to promise to raise their children catholics?
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mrismail
06-25-2008, 06:47 PM
Thank you all for your thought towards this subject, its really driving me crazy. Kinda giving me one choice only is to give her an ultimatum to convert or end it.

Originally Posted by Whatsthepoint
I guess what he meant was that only his wife will receive the blessing and do all the catholic stuff. He'll just have to stand there.
This is exactly what i meant. But Im not sure how the Catholic church works... like some of you said that I must promise the kids grow up catholic, blessed by the priest in the name of the Son, the God, and the Holy Spirit, ... etc.



Originally Posted by Whatsthepoint
The catholic church allows it, though I think the uncatholic spuse needs to be baptised.

an article about it from teh Catholic encyclopadaedia
http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/09698a.htm
She's not even baptized.


However, heres the complete scenario. Her father is Muslim, however, hes not religious. Her mother is the catholic one. This discussion has been between she and I, her father has not been involved, yet. But im not sure it'll make a difference. My whole tattle tale is getting through her idea of a perfect wedding without me getting into haram or sin.
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snakelegs
06-25-2008, 08:01 PM
Originally Posted by mrismail
Thank you all for your thought towards this subject, its really driving me crazy. Kinda giving me one choice only is to give her an ultimatum to convert or end it.
not so simple - it is forbidden to convert for the sake of marriage or convenience.
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glo
06-25-2008, 08:51 PM
To be honest, is a 'religious marriage' not meaningless, unless both spouses whole-heartedly agree to it? :?

Presumably just having a legal marriage would not be acceptable for you too either?
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Pk_#2
06-25-2008, 09:03 PM
Originally Posted by snakelegs
not so simple - it is forbidden to convert for the sake of marriage or convenience.
Oh my days, so agree, don't force her into it! :skeleton:

Get married on a bus, PROBLEM SOLVED, nah serious I know a couple who did that,

All the best with your marriage life, May Allah (Subhana Wa Ta'ala) guide her and help you, Ameen,

AsalamuAlaykum Warahmatullahi Wabarakatuh.
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'Abd-al Latif
06-25-2008, 09:27 PM
Originally Posted by mrismail
Assalamu Aleikom,

To those who have better knowledge than me, I met this fantastic potential future wife about 4 years ago. She is Catholic, however. Ever since I've found out, i've been trying to convince her about having one wedding, yet, she wants to have two weddings, one on the Islamic way and the other in a church. Now I know many will disagree about why I even am involved with a Christian female. But, I know its not haram and I hope for only the best to have her convert sooner or later. However, the question I seek an answer(s) to is, is it haram for me to get married in a church without going through the whole thing? what i mean is just being there physically. Opinions and scholar answers are welcomed.
Jazakom Allah Khayran.
The Muslim should be in charge. So it should not be stipulated that they get married in the church, or that the children should follow her religion, or anything else in which she and her religion are given precedence at the expense of his religion. Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

“And never will Allaah grant to the disbelievers a way (to triumph) over the believers”

[al-Nisa’ 4:141].
http://www.islamqa.com/en/ref/95572
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mediadave
06-25-2008, 11:47 PM
This is exactly what i meant. But Im not sure how the Catholic church works...

She's not even baptized.
I suspect it will be impossible for you to get married in a proper Catholic church, by a proper Catholic priest. The Church doesn't do things by half measures - even if you were both 'kinda' catholics, not being baptised and regular attendees of that church would scupper it. And yes, the Catholic church only sanctions marriages to non Catholics if the kids are brought up Catholic.

I'd look for a compromise. I don't know where you live, but if you're in Europe there will doubtless be a no doubt scenic ruined church relatively near - I know of several in London (Ruined, but maintained as public gardens). If she knows a priest or lay practitioner, maybe you could get a blessing in the grounds of the church? Sure it won't be 'proper', but if she's not worried about being unbaptised I suspect its just for traditions sake in any case.
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snakelegs
06-25-2008, 11:55 PM
how would you feel if you saw your children bowing down before a crucifix?
obviously, your religion is at least somewhat important to you.
i think you should give this whole thing A Major Re-Think.
i know you are permitted to marry a woman "of the book" but i still think it's a really lousy idea. it's hard enough to make a marriage work without extra complications.
being "in love" is often quite damaging to the brain.
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samirasabir
06-26-2008, 12:20 AM
Originally Posted by mrismail
Assalamu Aleikom,

To those who have better knowledge than me, I met this fantastic potential future wife about 4 years ago. She is Catholic, however. Ever since I've found out, i've been trying to convince her about having one wedding, yet, she wants to have two weddings, one on the Islamic way and the other in a church. Now I know many will disagree about why I even am involved with a Christian female. But, I know its not haram and I hope for only the best to have her convert sooner or later. However, the question I seek an answer(s) to is, is it haram for me to get married in a church without going through the whole thing? what i mean is just being there physically. Opinions and scholar answers are welcomed.
Jazakom Allah Khayran.
i think first of all congratulations on finding the woman of your dreams however i believe that if you are in love no doubt you would want her to become a muslim at some point also regardless of whether your future children will be muslim, wouldn't you want the one you love to be following the true faith also? Secondly the fact that she hasn't been baptised herself it seems silly that she wants a wedding in a church purely to have the wedding of her dreams. she can have the wedding of her dreams without being in a catholic church for appearaces sake. Many do including myself.
Also I don't know whether it is against Islam to stand before a priest whilst he marries you. Honestly bro I think that you need to ask her whether it is for religious purposes that she wants to marry in church if not it really does not make sense.
I know some christians that do not follow the bible nor do they attend the church throughout the whole of their lives but as soon as the word Marriage is put in the mix they suddenly want to be married in church, I don't understand it.
If she does want it for religious purposes and she is a staunch believer of the bible and attends church regularly then I have nothing to say apart from good luck and may Allah bless you both.
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north_malaysian
06-26-2008, 12:57 AM
How about civil marriage?

I mean, the Islamic wedding is just a contract between husband and wife right?

It doesnt need Imam's blessing, or to give oath to God or something right?
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Nσσя'υℓ Jαииαн
06-26-2008, 01:16 AM
Why would u get married without the Islamic way...? Especially if it was prescribed for Muslims.
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suffiyan007
06-26-2008, 05:51 AM
doing for two function of marriages is haram...u believe in Allah...but in same time u believe in Name of the Father,the son and holy spirit.....this really a foolish job....causE u are a muslim and why u going bck to darkness.... is like hypocrites....so asked or patronise her....in gentle way...!once u r in islam no way of turning bck..insyaallah will help...pray lot..and zikir..(zikrullah....) peace be upon you...!!!!!!!!!!!!.....
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Nσσя'υℓ Jαииαн
06-26-2008, 02:44 PM
Originally Posted by Muslim Knight
You can just save all the troubles by marrying a Muslimah. Plenty of those right here in LI. Do you want me to make some recommendations as well? I know a few sisters...
Loool, that's interesting.
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suffiyan007
06-26-2008, 04:10 PM
jusT patronise him...so he will convert to islam...u must tell him that he live in islam is a really gift from Allah...is your test to him about Deen oF Allah...We as a muslimin and muslimah...we must fight for the right...cause we in the Deen of Nabi SAW....we must jihad for our right...we must not let non-muslim take charge of You...u r in jeWel oF Allah...so appreciated....! u seek for happiness so must struggle for it....want him to married in islam way...no mean u must leave this guy at oncE...men are anyway...choose the right want for you...and choose that he really interested in islam and understanding if not no way we gonna marry right...be happy...my sister of islam pray hard and doing lotsa additional prayer like istikhara...and etc...insyaallah Allah guides you anyway...i hope u you get happiness and married happily.... :sl::D
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