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View Full Version : Islam is real threat to church, says Synod member



Uthman
06-29-2008, 01:17 PM
By Martin Beckford, Religious Affairs Correspondent in Jerusalem

Divisions in the Church of England over homosexuality and women bishops are nothing compared with the threat it faces from Islam, a prominent member of its governing body has warned.

More than 1,000 conservative Anglicans have been meeting in Jerusalem this week to develop a new movement within the worldwide Communion, in order to combat liberals who they say are departing from the Bible's teaching by supporting gay clergy.

Next week the General Synod, the Church of England's parliament, gathers in York to discuss the introduction of women bishops without provisions for those who oppose the historic move, which could see dozens of conservative clergy leave the church and claim millions in compensation.

But Alison Ruoff, an evangelical lay member of the Synod and a former magistrate who is at the Gafcon summit in Jerusalem, told The Daily Telegraph that the church needs to get past these divisions and concentrate on fighting the rise of Islam in Britain.

She says that under an Archbishop of Canterbury who said it is inevitable that elements of Sharia will be introduced in the UK, the church has not done enough to put its message across.

And she believes the Government, out of politically correct sensitivity, is not preventing the growth of Muslim communities which do not integrate with those around them.

Mrs Ruoff, who earlier this year called for a halt to mosque building in Britain, said: "The problems of homosexuality and women bishops which face the Church of England are minor compared with the threat to the church and the nation from Islam.

"The church is sleepwalking into an Islamic state. Hopefully we can unite against it.

"The leaders of the church have lost their confidence in the Gospel. We have got an Archbishop of Canterbury who doesn't stand up for Christianity but wants a degree of Sharia law.

"The church should be getting out with the Christian message.

"Our Government is allowing it to happen out of political correctness, but it should be protecting our values and heritage."

She added that many people share her fears but do not like to speak out about it in case they are criticised.

"People are genuinely worried. There's a general concern in the nation about its building blocks being rapidly eroded.

"But we are very afraid of the law and of being persecuted. The police in many respects are standing up for Islam rather than Christianity."

Mrs Ruoff believes the problem with the growth of Islam in Britain is that some communities do not integrate, and that some immigrant imams do not learn English, leading to segregation.

She fears that if these communities introduce Islamic law, all non-Muslims and women will be treated as second-class citizens by them.

Gafcon leaders are still working on a statement which will determine the structure of their new movement, which is more likely to be an organization for traditional Anglicans worldwide rather than an outside rival.

However Mrs Ruoff believes a complete split is justified as liberals, particularly in America, have departed so far from the traditional teaching of the Bible and church rules by consecrating an openly gay bishop.

Yesterday, Gafcon leaders said the conference was itself an ultimatum and a challenge to the Archbishop of Canterbury and the existing structures of the Anglican Communion.

Dr Peter Jensen, the Archbishop of Sydney, said: “Gafcon poses a challenge now. If all we did was meet here it would pose a challenge to others in the Communion and the leadership.

“The fact that Gafcon has now come into existence as a conference and possibly a movement, that has got to be taken into account.

“All around the world, the sleeping giant of orthodox Anglicanism has been awoken.”

He said it was an “act of folly” for the liberal Americans to consecrate a gay bishop without thinking there would be serious consequences.

Archbishop Greg Venables, Primate of the Anglican Province of the Southern Cone, said he was sorry that more conservative church leaders at Gafcon were not also going to the Lambeth Conference, the once-a-decade gathering of Anglican bishops, as he is.

“I personally would have liked us all to be there,” he said.

A final statement is expected to be signed by Gafcon leaders on Sunday.

Source
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The_Prince
06-29-2008, 03:54 PM
we are a threat, i concur, cause were smashing the falsehood and bringing the truth, and this worries them :) we should continue on course, rather than call for inter-faith dialog, we dont need inter-faith dialog, Islam is growing and growing, even with all the Islamophobia, interfaith dialog simply wants to make a status quo, which i dont want, i want to keep on exposing the falsehood and letting the truth be known!
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suffiyan007
06-29-2008, 04:08 PM
Marriages for lesbianism and homosexualism are OK in church actually.Mostly like Sir George Michael & Sir Elton John...they all are Gay...and They can married in church with their boyfriend...Talk about same sex marriage in church, the pope,cardinals,bishop and arcbishop making money cause the people offering money to the priest to make the wedding that so grand and happening,According in bible reading, no one can married each other of same sex, look what's happened to "Sodom and Gomorrah"..is this Good to people practise like the follower of prophet Luth...who's gay? Why Should God created Man And Woman? Simply! A woman has been made from the rib of a man....A man should love their wife!. Why in islam the people prohibited in this issue.Because the Ahzab of Allah is True....we should fear of the lord!.....
lotsa statement stated in bible...u should fear of the Lord...whY christianity fear not to the Lord..is JESuS powERful than God?
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TrueStranger
06-29-2008, 04:13 PM
:sl:

Muslims today are truly WEAK, DIVIDED, and FIGHTING WITH EACH OTHER, and they still say we pose a threat????

Imagine how dreadful they will be of us once we get our acts together :D

But on a serious note, this lady is just trying to change the topic and create a bigger threat, and enemy. She probably learned it from Bushy.

:w:
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suffiyan007
06-29-2008, 04:21 PM
Whom to Fear?

" I tell you,my friends, do not be afraid of those who kill the body but cannot afterwards do anything worse. I will show whom to fear; fead God,who,after killing,has the authority to throw into hell.Believe me,he is the one you must fear!"Aren't five sparrows sold for two pennies? Yet not one sparrow is forgotten by God. Even the hairs of your head have all been counted.So do not be afraid; you are worth much more than many sparrows!.
(Luke 12:4-7)

Jesus speaks about Fear of The lord in bible does christians fear of God? after been sinning to have affair with same sex?
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suffiyan007
06-29-2008, 04:27 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by TrueStranger
:sl:

Muslims today are truly WEAK, DIVIDED, and FIGHTING WITH EACH OTHER, and they still say we pose a threat????

Imagine how dreadful they will be of us once we get our acts together :D

But on a serious note, this lady is just trying to change the topic and create a bigger threat, and enemy. She probably learned it from Bushy.

:w:
Are this you address to me? i am a man...not woman!
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Uthman
06-29-2008, 04:42 PM
:sl:

format_quote Originally Posted by Suffiyan007
Are this you address to me? i am a man...not woman!
I believe the sister was on about the woman in the article. :)

:w:
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Musaafirah
06-29-2008, 04:42 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Suffiyan007
Are this you address to me? i am a man...not woman!
I think she's actually talking about Mrs. Ruoff, the woman that's coming up with these ideas about Islam being a threat..
Anyway, I don't understand how Christianity is seen as a culture..I thought it was a religion?..And what's this about Christians losing their way of life...
I don't see people being blackmailed into becoming muslims..
But yeah..I agree with sis True Stranger..she definitely is trying to make it seem like Islam is a 'threat'..
:muddlehea
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suffiyan007
06-29-2008, 05:24 PM
can someone help...how to post my own new thread? i cant find the button?
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Woodrow
06-29-2008, 06:00 PM
Truth is truth. we do pose a threat to those who are not following the teachings of Allaah(swt) and those who are spreading falsehoods.

But, we do not pose any physical or coercive threats.

If the truth is a threat than we are a major threat.
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suffiyan007
06-29-2008, 06:28 PM
story of prophet luth:

We also sent Luth: He said to his people: "Do ye commit lewdness such as no people creation ever committed before you? For ye practise your lusts on men in preference to women:" ye are indeed a people transgressing beyond bounds". And his people gave no answer but this: they said,"Drive them out of your city: these are indeed men who want to be clean and pure! But we saved him and his family, except his wife, she was of those who lagged behind.And we rained down on them a shower of brimstone: then see what was the end of those who indulged in sin and crime!( Surah Al-A'raf 80-84)...

Allah is angry but he patience who doing homosex and lesbian!
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The_Prince
06-29-2008, 11:13 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Woodrow
Truth is truth. we do pose a threat to those who are not following the teachings of Allaah(swt) and those who are spreading falsehoods.

But, we do not pose any physical or coercive threats.

If the truth is a threat than we are a major threat.
true that, there is no Muslim army invading their lands with a sword shouting convert or die! the threat we pose is a threat to destroy their falsehood and corrupt ways, just like Jesus was a threat to some Jewish authorities.
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north_malaysian
06-30-2008, 12:43 AM
if they want to stop Islam from rising in England... they must ban the internet....:D
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Abdul-Raouf
06-30-2008, 01:07 AM
GEORGE BERNARD SHAW said: (Sir George Bernard Shaw in 'The Genuine Islam,' Vol. 1, No. 8, 1936.)

"If any religion had the chance of ruling over England, nay Europe within the next hundred years, it could be Islam."

"I have always held the religion of Muhammad in high estimation because of its wonderful vitality. It is the only religion, which appears to me to possess that assimilating capacity to the changing phase of existence,
which can make itself appeal to every age."

"I have studied him - the wonderful man and in my opinion for from being an anti-Christ, he must be called the Savior of Humanity."

"I believe that if a man like him were to assume the dictatorship of the modern world he would succeed in solving its problems in a way that would bring it the much needed peace and happiness"

"I have prophesied about the faith of Muhammad that it would be acceptable to the Europe of tomorrow as
it is beginning to be acceptable to the Europe of today.”






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Eric H
06-30-2008, 06:14 AM
Greetings and peace be with you Osman my friend;

The greater threat to Christianity and probably Islam too is apathy, wealth and intellectuals. There are far too many temptations in this world; and as people become more independent and wealthy, they can sort all their own problems out, they do not need God.

As Muslims integrate into British Society they will be faced with all the temptations of a very secular society.

We thank God in the good times, and in doing so we are reminded that all things come from God.

So I do not see Islam as a threat to Christianity, we can live together side by side in friendship and peace.

In the spirit of praying for a greater faith and trust in God,

Eric
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Whatsthepoint
06-30-2008, 01:30 PM
Islam certainly poses a demographic threat, not only to Christianity, but also to Europe's secular order.
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MKE Brother
06-30-2008, 01:46 PM
What I find striking is that this Mrs Ruoff believes it is the governments job to protect Christianity as well.
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Izyan
06-30-2008, 02:40 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by The_Prince
we are a threat, i concur, cause were smashing the falsehood and bringing the truth, and this worries them :) we should continue on course, rather than call for inter-faith dialog, we dont need inter-faith dialog, Islam is growing and growing, even with all the Islamophobia, interfaith dialog simply wants to make a status quo, which i dont want, i want to keep on exposing the falsehood and letting the truth be known!
What is truth and what is Falsehood? What's wrong with inter-faith dialogue?
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suffiyan007
06-30-2008, 02:43 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by MKE Brother
What I find striking is that this Mrs Ruoff believes it is the governments job to protect Christianity as well.

yes, i believe you thought.ThaT government of either England or America still protect christianity from homosexuality and lesbian.CausE to believe, the church still accept the same sex marriage...
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Izyan
06-30-2008, 02:54 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Suffiyan007
yes, i believe you thought.ThaT government of either England or America still protect christianity from homosexuality and lesbian.CausE to believe, the church still accept the same sex marriage...
The US government has never protected any religion from anything other than hate crimes.
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MKE Brother
06-30-2008, 03:02 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Izyan
The US government has never protected any religion from anything other than hate crimes.
In the deep past it has but it is true that in recent history it has distanced itself but to say that it doesn't LEAN toward Christianity would be false.
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suffiyan007
06-30-2008, 03:03 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Izyan
The US government has never protected any religion from anything other than hate crimes.

That's true....i didnt know that...but lotsa church accept the case of same sex marriage but still held in church..either Roman Catholic or protestant church...but truly prohibited in islam..by following the law of syariah. i really wonder why...God Religion still accept same sex marriage....
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Izyan
06-30-2008, 03:09 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by MKE Brother
In the deep past it has but it is true that in recent history it has distanced itself but to say that it doesn't LEAN toward Christianity would be false.
Can you give me an example? Thomas Jefferson, Adams, and Franklin were strongly for the seperation of church and state. It even says it in the constitution that there can not be any state sponsored religion.
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Izyan
06-30-2008, 03:11 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Suffiyan007
That's true....i didnt know that...but lotsa church accept the case of same sex marriage but still held in church..either Roman Catholic or protestant church...but truly prohibited in islam..by following the law of syariah. i really wonder why...God Religion still accept same sex marriage....
Roman Catholic church? Are you sure? If they are they are going against Vatican law and are risking excommunication. As for Protestants there are a few rogue churches out there. Homosexuality is against the Holy Bible. It does not change.
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The_Prince
06-30-2008, 04:14 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Izyan
What is truth and what is Falsehood? What's wrong with inter-faith dialogue?
how can you have inter-faith dialog when the other side comes up saying your religion is a threat? does this make sense to you? she isnt the first christian to have come up making such comments since the inter faith dialog scheme, you had a catholic priest saying something else. so why should we have inter-faith dialog?

so i say whats the use in inter-faith dialog, in all honesty we Muslims dont need it, Christians need it, Islam is growing everyday, we dont need any dialog, Islamophobia will ALWAYS be here, so whats the use in having this dialog? there is no use, it will simply strengthen Christianity and lead to a status quo where it will become shunned to critisize and speak against Christianity which is what we need to do right now since Christianity is weak.

Truth is Islam, falsehood is all that disagree with Islam.

:thumbs_up
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Izyan
06-30-2008, 04:29 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by The_Prince
how can you have inter-faith dialog when the other side comes up saying your religion is a threat? does this make sense to you? she isnt the first christian to have come up making such comments since the inter faith dialog scheme, you had a catholic priest saying something else. so why should we have inter-faith dialog?

so i say whats the use in inter-faith dialog, in all honesty we Muslims dont need it, Christians need it, Islam is growing everyday, we dont need any dialog, Islamophobia will ALWAYS be here, so whats the use in having this dialog? there is no use, it will simply strengthen Christianity and lead to a status quo where it will become shunned to critisize and speak against Christianity which is what we need to do right now since Christianity is weak.

Truth is Islam, falsehood is all that disagree with Islam.

:thumbs_up
So there is no need for inter-sect dialogue either since most Sunni's feel like Shia aren't true muslims? Why is it ok when a muslim do or say something outside of Islam it's ok to say well they weren't really muslim but we can say that these people are not indicitive of christianinty. Why is it ok to speak out against christianity? Isn't that Christianphobia?
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Keltoi
06-30-2008, 04:37 PM
I believe the Christian faith in general, regardless of denomination, is beginning to become a lot less apathetic to what they percieve as their role in the world and in their communities. I'm not that familiar with the British church tradition, at least not in the modern sense, but I would guess they see the threat as demographic in nature. For many, many centuries, western Europe was dominated by the Roman Catholic tradition, and eastern Europe by the Greek Orthodox. As demographics change the role of religion will change. Understandably many Christian leaders are disturbed by this. Not only about changing demographics, but also by the sharp increase in religious apathy in European society.
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Izyan
06-30-2008, 04:39 PM
Truth is Islam, falsehood is all that disagree with Islam.
How do you know this to be the case?
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Amadeus85
06-30-2008, 04:46 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Woodrow
Truth is truth. we do pose a threat to those who are not following the teachings of Allaah(swt) and those who are spreading falsehoods.

But, we do not pose any physical or coercive threats.

If the truth is a threat than we are a major threat.
Reality is not so simple as you try to suggest Woodrow.
Few weeks ago algerian islamic authorities called evangelical christianity as a threat to their country.
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The_Prince
06-30-2008, 04:50 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Izyan
So there is no need for inter-sect dialogue either since most Sunni's feel like Shia aren't true muslims? Why is it ok when a muslim do or say something outside of Islam it's ok to say well they weren't really muslim but we can say that these people are not indicitive of christianinty. Why is it ok to speak out against christianity? Isn't that Christianphobia?
which most Sunnis dont believe Shias arent Muslims? i havent personally met one Sunni Muslim with this opinion, yes there are Sunnis who hold this belief, but they are not in the majority.

Its ok to speak against Christianity because Christians speak against Islam, i never used to speak against Christianity, i knew NOTHING about Christianity, and very little about Islam , then i started seeing so many Christians attacking Islam, so i began to learn my religion, and also began to learn Christianity and speak against it, hence i am reacting only, and i have just gotten started! blame the Christians for creating this monster :D

i dont have Christianphobia at all, if i see a Christian i wont say u evil cross worshiper leave this false faith! i only argue with those who argue against me, if your a Christian who doesnt insult or attack my faith i wont argue against you. but if u are a Christian who does attack my faith then be braced for a very forceful debate-argument beat down. :)

Lastly, i have a Christian LIVING IN MY HOUSE! so how can i have Christianphobia?
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The_Prince
06-30-2008, 04:51 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Aaron85
Reality is not so simple as you try to suggest Woodrow.
Few weeks ago algerian islamic authorities called evangelical christianity as a threat to their country.
lol which Islamic authority? the same authority who stole the elections when the true Islamic party won?!!!!!!!!!!!! get real man!
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The_Prince
06-30-2008, 04:56 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Izyan
How do you know this to be the case?
because i know Islam is the truth, all the evidence points to its truth. :)
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Izyan
06-30-2008, 05:02 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by The_Prince
because i know Islam is the truth, all the evidence points to its truth. :)
What evidence? I want to know the truth present your evidence.
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Amadeus85
06-30-2008, 05:08 PM
A few years ago I was watching a debate about very similar topic. One of the speakers said things that are very close to my views. He said that bigger threat to Europe are those called by him as "our own barbarians". Those who are europeans but with hatred to christianity and our tradition, those wh can be easily(too easily?) described as rainbow-green-red alignment.
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The_Prince
06-30-2008, 05:13 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Izyan
What evidence? I want to know the truth present your evidence.
ill give you a small piece of evidence, Allah says while the enmies plan, he plans as well, and is the best of planners.

today you see Islamophobia and attacks against Muslims at an all time high, yet is this diminishing Islam's reach and growth? no! the opposite, what makes this more amazing is that Islam continues to grow and get stronger, and where is it growing and getting stronger? right in the heart of its enemies fortress where most of the Islamophobia is occuring, Europe and the US!

this should be a sign to open anyone eyes to make them think hmmm all this happens, yet they still grow, and get more interest, rather than falling apart and getting weaker, how is that?! The answer is given in the Quran, as you plan, God plans!

more evidence is in the character of Muslims themselves, compare us to any other group of faith, you insult Christianity or any other religion their followers say oh its okay! when you insult a Muslims faith we will not rest until we make you regret it and refute you, and i dont mean physical harm, some will cause physical harm, but they are in a minority. you will say oh this shows none Muslims are more tolerant, nay! rather this shows Muslims have TRUE BELIEF and LOVE for their religion, unlike others who let their religion become a play thing for mockery and stand up comedians.
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Izyan
06-30-2008, 05:38 PM
That's pretty shoddy proof

today you see Islamophobia and attacks against Muslims at an all time high, yet is this diminishing Islam's reach and growth? no! the opposite, what makes this more amazing is that Islam continues to grow and get stronger, and where is it growing and getting stronger? right in the heart of its enemies fortress where most of the Islamophobia is occuring, Europe and the US!
Now let's change a few words:

today(1960's) you see racism and attacks against black people(mostly christians) at an all time high, yet is this diminishing black's reach and growth? no! the opposite, what makes this more amazing is that black people continues to grow and get stronger, and where is it growing and getting stronger? right in the heart of its enemies fortress where most of the racism is occuring, Europe and the US!
If this is proof that Islam is the truth wouldn't it be the same for christianity and Islam? Potentially by the time next year we could have a black christian president.


more evidence is in the character of Muslims themselves, compare us to any other group of faith, you insult Christianity or any other religion their followers say oh its okay! when you insult a Muslims faith we will not rest until we make you regret it and refute you, and i dont mean physical harm, some will cause physical harm, but they are in a minority. you will say oh this shows none Muslims are more tolerant, nay! rather this shows Muslims have TRUE BELIEF and LOVE for their religion, unlike others who let their religion become a play thing for mockery and stand up comedians
.
You must not have heard of Pat Robertson. He is just as fantical about christianity as you are about islam. Let's take a look at another religion, communism. Let's see what would happen to you if you spoke ill of communism in the former soviet union or Cuba. You'd either end up in an re-education camp, a work camp, or with a bullet headache. Your evidence isn't evidence it's opinion.
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Izyan
06-30-2008, 05:39 PM
By the way Notsrodemus made predictions about the end times too that appear to be coming true also. Should we hold his works in the same regards as the Quran?
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MKE Brother
06-30-2008, 07:18 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Izyan
By the way Notsrodemus made predictions about the end times too that appear to be coming true also. Should we hold his works in the same regards as the Quran?
I predicted the Celtics would win the NBA championshop pre-season last year but I certainly would not say I have the same foresight as Allah, as can be said for Nostradamus
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Izyan
06-30-2008, 07:20 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by MKE Brother
I predicted the Celtics would win the NBA championshop pre-season last year but I certainly would not say I have the same foresight as Allah, as can be said for Nostradamus
How do you know that?
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suffiyan007
06-30-2008, 07:35 PM
i heard that Nostradamus predict that end of the world 2019...i dont know that's true or not...and the NYC 11 sept has been bang by a plane also nostradamus prediction...i believe so so only...50 50...on the clairvoyance..!
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Izyan
06-30-2008, 07:44 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Suffiyan007
i heard that Nostradamus predict that end of the world 2019...i dont know that's true or not...and the NYC 11 sept has been bang by a plane also nostradamus prediction...i believe so so only...50 50...on the clairvoyance..!
How can you say 50 50? 2019 isn't here yet. For all you know that super collider that CERN is firing up could fashion the destruction of earth by creating strange matter.
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Chuck
06-30-2008, 07:50 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Izyan
For all you know that super collider that CERN is firing up could fashion the destruction of earth by creating strange matter.
not true.
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Izyan
06-30-2008, 07:54 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Chuck
not true.
Highly unlikely but not untrue. Same with the mini black hole theory.
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AvarAllahNoor
06-30-2008, 07:54 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Abdul-Raouf
GEORGE BERNARD SHAW said: (Sir George Bernard Shaw in 'The Genuine Islam,' Vol. 1, No. 8, 1936.)

"If any religion had the chance of ruling over England, nay Europe within the next hundred years, it could be Islam."

"I have always held the religion of Muhammad in high estimation because of its wonderful vitality. It is the only religion, which appears to me to possess that assimilating capacity to the changing phase of existence,
which can make itself appeal to every age."

"I have studied him - the wonderful man and in my opinion for from being an anti-Christ, he must be called the Savior of Humanity."

"I believe that if a man like him were to assume the dictatorship of the modern world he would succeed in solving its problems in a way that would bring it the much needed peace and happiness" ]
Europe would never become all Islamic.
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Izyan
06-30-2008, 07:56 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by AvarAllahNoor
Europe would never become all Islamic.
A church did rule England for many years the church of England and before that the Holy Roman Church.
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Chuck
06-30-2008, 07:56 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Izyan
Highly unlikely but not untrue. Same with the mini black hole theory.
What they are creating happens naturally around the earth.
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Izyan
06-30-2008, 07:58 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Chuck
What they are creating happens naturally around the earth.
But their orgins are far away from earth so by the time it get's here it's at a low yeild. The problem with creating it here is the potential of it being stuck in our gravitational pull and not disappating.
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suffiyan007
06-30-2008, 08:03 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by AvarAllahNoor
Europe would never become all Islamic.
kada vale! kada vale!... Hmm! what i gonna say in the world islam and Christianity are wide population of the believers..Jews is minority...but is the same God religion...The Christianity is called by pope paulus...but real religion similar to christianity is Nassara(NAsrani)...this the religion bringing by Jesus is Nassara...that why Jesus of Nazereth...meaning nassara...!....Nassara never believe in trinity and believe in one God just like islam!...
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Izyan
06-30-2008, 08:10 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Suffiyan007
kada vale! kada vale!... Hmm! what i gonna say in the world islam and Christianity are wide population of the believers..Jews is minority...but is the same God religion...The Christianity is called by pope paulus...but real religion similar to christianity is Nassara(NAsrani)...this the religion bringing by Jesus is Nassara...that why Jesus of Nazereth...meaning nassara...!....Nassara never believe in trinity and believe in one God just like islam!...
They called him Jesus of Nazareth because he was from Nazareth. Christians believe in one God.
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suffiyan007
06-30-2008, 08:28 PM
yeah...that's why lotsa doubt in christianity....! when come to gospel of jesus...lotsa commentation...and dont know who the right to believe...?
cause we never witness Jesus life's and why he had to died on the cross..? we dont know...but we just believe die on the cross....but we dont know who manipulate the truth? i know christianity pray to one God...but why Jesus
have to sacrifice himself to die on the cross to takes away the sins of the world? a messenger sent by God and must be crucify...meaning God kills jesus!right?:blind:
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Izyan
06-30-2008, 08:33 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Suffiyan007
yeah...that's why lotsa doubt in christianity....! when come to gospel of jesus...lotsa commentation...and dont know who the right to believe...?
cause we never witness Jesus life's and why he had to died on the cross..? we dont know...but we just believe die on the cross....but we dont know who manipulate the truth? i know christianity pray to one God...but why Jesus
have to sacrifice himself to die on the cross to takes away the sins of the world? a messenger sent by God and must be crucify...meaning God kills jesus!right?:blind:
There was a witness to Jesus's life in Titus Flavius Josephus. Look him up. God didn't kill anyone Jesus sacrificed his own life in order to save all man. At any time he could have called on the Father to take him home and be done with it.
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Chuck
06-30-2008, 08:36 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Izyan
But their orgins are far away from earth so by the time it get's here it's at a low yeild. The problem with creating it here is the potential of it being stuck in our gravitational pull and not disappating.
these collisions happen in nature on earth. Relativistic Heavy Ion Collider (RHIC) is running since 2000 in NY. Get real.
Reply

Izyan
06-30-2008, 08:39 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Chuck
these collisions happen in nature on earth. Relativistic Heavy Ion Collider (RHIC) is running since 2000 in NY. Get real.
Not on this scale. This collider is 10 times the size of the one in NY. I'm not saying it's going to happen. It's highly unlikely. I was working off a hypothetical.
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AvarAllahNoor
07-01-2008, 03:21 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Izyan
A church did rule England for many years the church of England and before that the Holy Roman Church.
Islamic and Christian, two separate religions no...?
Reply

suffiyan007
07-01-2008, 04:16 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by AvarAllahNoor
Islamic and Christian, two separate religions no...?
Kada vale! Kada vale!

Islamic and christian...is not saparate after paulus founder of trinity in christian it makes christian and islam a big gap in Faith...cause God has sent :


<<< ONE TRUE GOD,THE CREATOR>>>>

HAS SENT:

ADAM----> TO CONVEY----->ONE TRUE GOD

MOSES---->TO CONVEY----->ONE TRUE GOD

NOAH------>TO CONVEY------>ONE TRUE GOD

JESUS------>TO CONVEY------>ONE TRUE GOD

MUHAMMAD------->TO CONVEY----->ONE TRUE GOD


Christian Nearness to islam


Curse s were pronounced on those among the children of israel who rejected faith,by the tongue of David and of Jesus son of Mary; because they disobeyed and persisted in excesses,nor did they usually forbid one another the iniquities which they committed; evil indeed were the deeds which they did.Thou seest many of them turning in friendship to the unbelievers,Evil indeed are the works which their souls have sent forward before them(with the result),that God's wrath is on them,that in torment will they abide.If only they had believed in God, the messenger, and in what hath been revealed to him,never would they have taken them for friends and protectors,but most of them are rebellious wrong-doers.Strongest among men in emnity to the believers wilt thou find the Jews and pagans; and nearest among them in love to the believers wilt thou find those who say, "WE ARE CHRISTIANS".
Because amongst these are men devoted to learning and men who have renounded the world,and they are not arrogant.(Surah Al-maidah 78-86)

THE ONE TRUE GOD IN THE BIBLE
(OLD TESTAMENT)

---->

1) Hear, O Israel: The Lord our God is one Lord.(Deutronomy 6:4)

2) Has not the one God made and sustained for us the spirit of life(Malachi 2:15)

3. You may know and believe Me and understand that I am He. Before Me no
God was formed,nor shall there be any after ME,I, I am the lord,and besides Me there is no Saviour.


(NEW Testament)

- Now this is life eternal, that they know you.the only true God,and Jesus Christ ,whom you have sent(John 17-3)

(Quran)
There is no god but I;so worship Me(21:25)....
Reply

James1992
07-01-2008, 08:34 PM
England is a democracy people can be Muslim or christian...
Reply

AvarAllahNoor
07-02-2008, 12:03 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Suffiyan007
Kada vale! Kada vale!

Islamic and christian...is not saparate after paulus founder of trinity in christian it makes christian and islam a big gap in Faith...cause God has sent :


<<< ONE TRUE GOD,THE CREATOR>>>>

HAS SENT:

ADAM----> TO CONVEY----->ONE TRUE GOD

MOSES---->TO CONVEY----->ONE TRUE GOD

NOAH------>TO CONVEY------>ONE TRUE GOD

JESUS------>TO CONVEY------>ONE TRUE GOD

MUHAMMAD------->TO CONVEY----->ONE TRUE GOD


Christian Nearness to islam


Curse s were pronounced on those among the children of israel who rejected faith,by the tongue of David and of Jesus son of Mary; because they disobeyed and persisted in excesses,nor did they usually forbid one another the iniquities which they committed; evil indeed were the deeds which they did.Thou seest many of them turning in friendship to the unbelievers,Evil indeed are the works which their souls have sent forward before them(with the result),that God's wrath is on them,that in torment will they abide.If only they had believed in God, the messenger, and in what hath been revealed to him,never would they have taken them for friends and protectors,but most of them are rebellious wrong-doers.Strongest among men in emnity to the believers wilt thou find the Jews and pagans; and nearest among them in love to the believers wilt thou find those who say, "WE ARE CHRISTIANS".
Because amongst these are men devoted to learning and men who have renounded the world,and they are not arrogant.(Surah Al-maidah 78-86)

:25)....
What on earth is KADE VALE??

Yes, I'm aware of that. But for obvious reasons it's two separate religions. If it wasn't then you'd merge with each other wouldn't you.
Reply

James1992
07-02-2008, 12:32 PM
I meant Britain....
Reply

Grace Seeker
07-02-2008, 02:31 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Suffiyan007
That's true....i didnt know that...but lotsa church accept the case of same sex marriage but still held in church..either Roman Catholic or protestant church...but truly prohibited in islam..by following the law of syariah. i really wonder why...God Religion still accept same sex marriage....
"Lots" is a relative term. What might seem like lots to you might seem like a few to me, or vice versa. Can you be more specific, please?

Please provide a list of those churches that accept same sex marriage. There are some, I grant, but I believe I will be able counter with 100 that do not for every one that you say does. And I don't mean that number as any form of exaggeration, either. From my experience, the opposition to same sex marriages within the church is much bigger than the move for acceptance. Further, my guess is that some that you think do accept it actually do not.




OK. That discussion is off topic. My apologies to those wanting to discuss the primary issue of this thread, for I understand the value of staying on topic. It is just that I have seen this comment interspersed on many threads recently, and given its baseless charge had to find someplace to correct the suppositions that it asserts as if they were fact when they are not.
Reply

The_Prince
07-02-2008, 03:01 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Izyan
There was a witness to Jesus's life in Titus Flavius Josephus. Look him up. God didn't kill anyone Jesus sacrificed his own life in order to save all man. At any time he could have called on the Father to take him home and be done with it.
i suggest you go do your homework as scholars unanimously agree the supposed josephus documents that are a witness to Jesus is a forgery. no real actual scholar who isnt a biased evangelical ever refers to Josephus for historical approval.

Secondly, are you a Christian now? you say Jesus could have lived at any moment he asked the Father to save him, obviously you believe this stuff then, so why you act like your not Christian?

Thirdly, the Gospels dont even agree with one another, go read the Gospel of Luke as well as acts of the apostles, it doesnt teach that Jesus died for all men, or for you, rather it teaches he was a martyr who was a victim of an underserved death.

http://www.call-to-monotheism.com/la...t_in_luke_acts
Reply

searcheroftruth
07-03-2008, 04:22 AM
format_quote Originally Posted by Chuck
these collisions happen in nature on earth. Relativistic Heavy Ion Collider (RHIC) is running since 2000 in NY. Get real.
i herd that the chances of something going wrong with the collider r 50 million to 1 which roughly is the same as someone winning the lotto
Reply

James1992
07-03-2008, 05:58 PM
Taht can happen though..
Reply

James1992
07-03-2008, 05:58 PM
That can happen though thats what i ment...
Reply

KAding
07-03-2008, 11:49 PM
Muslims are a very small minority at 3%. I really don't see how they are going to 'take over'? Much ado about nothing.
Reply

The_Prince
07-04-2008, 01:26 AM
format_quote Originally Posted by KAding
Muslims are a very small minority at 3%. I really don't see how they are going to 'take over'? Much ado about nothing.
we will run tv ADS, but what you dont know is that the ADS have subconcious effects on your brain that brainwashes you into making you subservant to Muslims......also our foods, such as shawarma and falafel, we are putting special powder in those foods, that also make you subservant to us, be careful.
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