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smartcard
07-15-2008, 07:07 PM
How can we help this child to come out of this hell?
Is this democracy?
Is this peace?

A sobbing Canadian teenager begged for help as he was interrogated at the US "war on terror" camp at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba, in the very first video glimpse of any such questioning released on Tuesday.

The video was posted online by attorneys for terror suspect Omar Khadr, who is shown being questioned at the prison by Canadian Security Intelligence Service (CSIS) agents in February, 2003.

Khadr is the youngest detainee at Guantanamo, accused of killing a US soldier in a firefight in Afghanistan.

He has been held at the US facility naval since his arrest in 2002, when he was 15 years old, and faces an upcoming US military commission on terrorism charges.

"Help me, help me, help me," Khadr says in the video, weeping, holding his head in his hands.

The footage covers seven and a half hours of questioning over three days. It depicts a dejected young man, tense from the pang of injuries suffered in a brush with US soldiers six months earlier.

In one excerpt, Khadr tugs at his hair, and pulls his orange prisoner suit over his head to show his interrogator his battle scars.

"I lost my eyes. I lost my feet. Everything," he says.

The US government alleges Khadr was the lone survivor of a four-hour US bombardment of an Al-Qaeda compound in Afghanistan in 2002, who rose from the rubble and killed a US sergeant with a grenade.

Khadr's US lawyer Lieutenant-Commander Bill Kuebler instead described him to a Canadian Commons committee as a "frightened, wounded, 15-year-old boy ... who sat slumped against a bush while a battle raged around him."

During the melee, Khadr was shot at least twice in the back by US soldiers and was about to be executed when another soldier intervened. He is said to have no vision in one eye, and sight in the other is deteriorating because of shrapnel embedded in the eye membrane.

"You look like you're doing well to me," the interrogator says in the video, his face blurred. "I'm not a doctor but I think you're getting good medical care."

"You say this is healthy?" Khadr asks. "I can't move my arm."

"No, you still have your eyes, and your feet are still at the ends of your legs," his interrogator replies, urging him to cooperate.

"You don't care about me," Khadr tells the interrogator. "Nobody cares about me."

An eight-minute video was initially posted on the Internet and a complete version was due to be issued later on Tuesday by Khadr's lawyers, following a Canadian court order.

In the video, apparently shot through the flaps of a ventilation shaft, Khadr is asked what he knows about Al-Qaeda and questioned about his Islamic faith.

At one point, an interrogator tries to calm Khadr, who is clearly distraught, saying he needs to get a "bite to eat" and adding: "I understand this is stressful."

When Khadr complains his compatriots have not helped his case, the interrogator replies: "We can't do anything for you."

The video shows no beating or physical abuse of Khadr.

But his Canadian lawyer Nathan Whitling said US authorities "manipulated Omar's environment outside the interrogation room before Canadian interrogations to induce cooperation within the interrogation room," citing documents released last week.

According to files from the Foreign Intelligence Division of Canada's Foreign Affairs department, Khadr was forcibly sleep deprived by his US captors in Guantanamo Bay to soften him up for questioning by Canadian officials.

"At three-hour intervals he is moved to another cell block, thus denying him uninterrupted sleep and a continued change of neighbors," said the files.

The documents also said that after Canadian officials met with Khadr in March 2004, he was due to be placed in isolation for three weeks before being interviewed again.

A Canadian federal judge studying the documents said Khadr's treatment violated international laws on human rights, and ordered them released to Khadr's lawyers last month.

Human rights groups have also demanded Khadr be released from Guantanamo, saying his age at the time of capture precludes any war crime proceeding.

"The treatment of Omar Khadr throughout his detention violates the USA's obligations under international law," said Amnesty International. "No one who was a child at the time of their alleged crime should be tried by military commissions."

Canadian Prime Minister Stephen Harper told reporters at a G8 summit in Japan earlier this month that he would not ask the US government to repatriate Khadr.
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Keltoi
07-16-2008, 12:03 AM
What do you expect? He was captured after killing a medic with a grenade. The video of this interrogation doesn't show any form of abuse or mistreatment. Are you suggesting he should simply be freed? On what grounds?
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The_Prince
07-16-2008, 01:21 AM
the evidence speaks for itself, hes 15, lone survivor in a compound, the americans come in, what do you think a teen in such a condition and experiance would do? go out laughing and wanting a hug from them? get a life will you, this is what you call the war on terrorism? keeping a 15 year old in jail for more than 6 years? well seeing that you americans and israelis have killed thousands and thousands of 15 year olds, its good you only kept this one in jail and spared him, there is hope! hopefully the next step will be that you stop oppressing 15 year olds and leave them alone PERIOD!
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smartcard
07-16-2008, 06:50 AM
format_quote Originally Posted by Keltoi
What do you expect? He was captured after killing a medic with a grenade. The video of this interrogation doesn't show any form of abuse or mistreatment. Are you suggesting he should simply be freed? On what grounds?
What do I expect....

1) Treat him while considering his age
2) Charge him under a legally and acceptable court / country
3) Respect the international court of law

At an age of 15-16 it was not his choice to fight or not to fight Americans, possibly the family environment drag him there, but the poor child should be handled with humanly
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Keltoi
07-16-2008, 01:52 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by The_Prince
the evidence speaks for itself, hes 15, lone survivor in a compound, the americans come in, what do you think a teen in such a condition and experiance would do? go out laughing and wanting a hug from them? get a life will you, this is what you call the war on terrorism? keeping a 15 year old in jail for more than 6 years? well seeing that you americans and israelis have killed thousands and thousands of 15 year olds, its good you only kept this one in jail and spared him, there is hope! hopefully the next step will be that you stop oppressing 15 year olds and leave them alone PERIOD!
So what? You live with your decisions. Don't pretend this was a little boy playing with teddy bears before he was captured. He knew exactly what he was doing.
Reply

Keltoi
07-16-2008, 01:57 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by smartcard
What do I expect....

1) Treat him while considering his age
2) Charge him under a legally and acceptable court / country
3) Respect the international court of law

At an age of 15-16 it was not his choice to fight or not to fight Americans, possibly the family environment drag him there, but the poor child should be handled with humanly
Treat him while considering his age? What does that even mean?

Charge him under a legally and acceptable court/country? What would be legally acceptable to you? Send him back to Canada and let him go of course. :rolleyes:

Respect the international court of law? What international court of law? Are you referring to the Geneva Convention? By all evidence he was treated much better than the Geneva Convention even requires.
Reply

smartcard
07-16-2008, 02:43 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Keltoi
Treat him while considering his age? What does that even mean?

Charge him under a legally and acceptable court/country? What would be legally acceptable to you? Send him back to Canada and let him go of course. :rolleyes:

Respect the international court of law? What international court of law? Are you referring to the Geneva Convention? By all evidence he was treated much better than the Geneva Convention even requires.
Illegal practice. Those who think this boy’s ill treatment is justified or even funny should be ashamed of themselves. At the end of the day, in a civilized society, people should be charged and tried in court according to law, not just get kidnapped and tortured as we see now.

This is 100% Human Rights Violation The kid is 15 when he gets captured, and interrogated at age 16 when the video was shot. He has been in jail for 5 years.
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ayesha309
07-16-2008, 03:32 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Keltoi
Treat him while considering his age? What does that even mean?

Charge him under a legally and acceptable court/country? What would be legally acceptable to you? Send him back to Canada and let him go of course. :rolleyes:

Respect the international court of law? What international court of law? Are you referring to the Geneva Convention? By all evidence he was treated much better than the Geneva Convention even requires.
I see a lot of ignorance in your talk. the kid was 15 when he went to guantanamo. more than 1/3 of his life has been spent there. while there he lost an eye, has been shot at, suffers breathing problems (he was shot near the lungs i blieve) has been beaten, etc. This is not humane treatment. if someone did that to an american, or even to an animal, to a dog for example, wouldn't animal rights be out there complaining??? and then thers weirdos like you who find this "humane treatment".
this boy is in guantanmo bay cuz he shot an american soldier. but don't forget the american soldier did kill three of his friends who wer with him. he just killed the american soldier in self-defence. if he dint kill the american soldier, the american soldier would've killed him. muder is allowed in self-defence even in international law
even if he was sent back to canada, he woudn't be free there. their laws arent soo lenient. but at least he would provided a more humane treatment in prison. perhaps his family might be allowed to see him, even if it is once a month. perhaps he may began to get treatment for the dozens of wounds he has suffered. perhaps. but unfortuantely the canadian government refuses to ask for their citizen. britain has done it, but canada is too afraid to make its ally "unhappy"; a humiliation on the part of the canadian government
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S_87
07-16-2008, 03:35 PM
may Allah help him and all of those like him :(
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Izyan
07-16-2008, 05:22 PM
Seeing that he's a Canadian citizen with no connection to Afghanistan, what was he doing there? A fair trial? How much of a trial was Daniel Pearl or Nick Berg Afforded. Under the Geneva Convictions he could have been executed on the spot as an enemy combatant. Don't blame the US for his predicament blame his nutty parents.
Reply

Keltoi
07-16-2008, 05:27 PM
I keep hearing about torture and beatings, but there is nothing to suggest any of that occurred. What happens in the U.S. when an underage teen kills somebody? He is imprisoned. The length of time is the question. If he is sent back to Canada, the deal would involve a lengthy prison sentence.

As for the guy's injuries, those were sustained in Afghanistan. Not in Gitmo. He was given medical care. There is no way around this simple reality. He was captured on the battlefield after killing a Marine medic with a hand grenade. He knew exactly what he was doing and why he was in Afghanistan in the first place. Decisions have consequences. More than likely he will be sent back to Canadian custody and will spend time in prison. All things considered, he is lucky he isn't dead.
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Keltoi
07-16-2008, 05:32 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by ayesha309
I see a lot of ignorance in your talk. the kid was 15 when he went to guantanamo. more than 1/3 of his life has been spent there. while there he lost an eye, has been shot at, suffers breathing problems (he was shot near the lungs i blieve) has been beaten, etc. This is not humane treatment. if someone did that to an american, or even to an animal, to a dog for example, wouldn't animal rights be out there complaining??? and then thers weirdos like you who find this "humane treatment".
this boy is in guantanmo bay cuz he shot an american soldier. but don't forget the american soldier did kill three of his friends who wer with him. he just killed the american soldier in self-defence. if he dint kill the american soldier, the american soldier would've killed him. muder is allowed in self-defence even in international law
even if he was sent back to canada, he woudn't be free there. their laws arent soo lenient. but at least he would provided a more humane treatment in prison. perhaps his family might be allowed to see him, even if it is once a month. perhaps he may began to get treatment for the dozens of wounds he has suffered. perhaps. but unfortuantely the canadian government refuses to ask for their citizen. britain has done it, but canada is too afraid to make its ally "unhappy"; a humiliation on the part of the canadian government
Do you even realize how absurd that sounds? "he just killed the american soldier in self-defence. if he dint kill the american soldier, the american soldier would've killed him." The guy is alive! After killing a medic he is lucky they didn't fill him with enough led to make a human pencil. More than likely he is alive because they saw his age and had mercy on him.
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Ninth_Scribe
07-16-2008, 05:33 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Keltoi
So what? You live with your decisions. Don't pretend this was a little boy playing with teddy bears before he was captured. He knew exactly what he was doing.
Way to go Keltoi! You've just completely destroyed the propaganda the U.S. military used in Iraq this past month. They caught two teen-agers and got them to "testify" that they were forced by Al Qaeda in Iraq to train as Mujahideen! The U.S. military thought this was "disgraceful" but apparently you seem to feel that anyone at any age is fair game. They couldn't possibly have been lured into combat, as these generals have claimed, for food and shelter. To quote you: They "knew exactly what they were doing."

As for your comment that nothing suggests these boys or men were tortured, there are quite a number of people who beg to differ, but you haven't SEEN anything. Like a good little monkey, you cover your ears and eyes... pity you can't cover your mouth too.

The Ninth Scribe
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Ali.
07-16-2008, 05:34 PM
Keltoi, so you think he deserves to be where he is?
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Keltoi
07-16-2008, 05:40 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Ali.
Keltoi, so you think he deserves to be where he is?
Absolutely. He was captured on a battlefield in Afghanistan after killing a medic...where else should he be? He should be thankful he isn't dead. More than likely he will be released to Canadian custody and will probably be able to return to society in 10 or 20 years.
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Keltoi
07-16-2008, 05:42 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Ninth_Scribe
Way to go Keltoi! You've just completely destroyed the propaganda the U.S. military used in Iraq this past month. They caught two teen-agers and got them to "testify" that they were forced by Al Qaeda in Iraq to train as Mujahideen! The U.S. military thought this was "disgraceful" but apparently you seem to feel that anyone at any age is fair game. They couldn't possibly have been lured into combat, as these generals have claimed, for food and shelter. To quote you: They "knew exactly what they were doing."

The Ninth Scribe
How does that have anything to do with the topic at hand? I'm sure Al-Qaeda is promoting teens to their cause. I agree it is disgraceful. How does that change the reality of what happens to them when they are captured as enemy combatants?
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Ninth_Scribe
07-16-2008, 05:47 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Keltoi
How does that have anything to do with the topic at hand? I'm sure Al-Qaeda is promoting teens to their cause. I agree it is disgraceful. How does that change the reality of what happens to them when they are captured as enemy combatants?
How do you know this boy wasn't lured too? Because he was caught with a gun? So were the two Iraqi boys! Yes, it's related. You can't say one is guilty without condemning them all. There is no picking and choosing between favorites. A boy is a boy. If he's considered fair game, they ALL are. Otherwise the statements contradict themselves... and you know me... I hate contradictions. I hate them in holy law and I hate them in military statistics.

The Ninth Scribe
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Keltoi
07-16-2008, 05:54 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Ninth_Scribe
How do you know this boy wasn't lured too? Because he was caught with a gun? So were the two Iraqi boys! Yes, it's related. You can't say one is guilty without condemning them all. There is no picking and choosing between favorites. A boy is a boy. If he's considered fair game, they ALL are. Otherwise the statements contradict themselves... and you know me... I hate contradictions. I hate them in holy law and I hate them in military statistics.

The Ninth Scribe
That may be fine if the "boys" weren't involved in the deaths of U.S. soldiers. Once they cross that line they cannot simply be released with a pat on the back and a Coca-Cola. Don't kill them unless you have no other choice, but it isn't very smart to simply let them go either.
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smartcard
07-16-2008, 05:58 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Keltoi
More than likely he will be released to Canadian custody and will probably be able to return to society in 10 or 20 years.
This is what I would like to end this case. Why the boy is in Guantanamo Bay where there is no law!

What is best is Canada demand him to be return back (like other countries) and do the needful law procedures according to Canadian judicial system.
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Keltoi
07-16-2008, 06:01 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by smartcard
This is what I would like to end this case. Why the boy is in Guantanamo Bay where there is no law!

What is best is Canada demand him to be return back (like other countries) and do the needful law procedures according to Canadian judicial system.
There is law in Gitmo. Many detainees have been released even recently. The military tribunals are being very strict on rules of evidence. Most of those kept at Gitmo these days are the worst of the worst. People like Khalid Sheik Mohammed.
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Ninth_Scribe
07-16-2008, 06:07 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Keltoi
That may be fine if the "boys" weren't involved in the deaths of U.S. soldiers. Once they cross that line they cannot simply be released with a pat on the back and a Coca-Cola. Don't kill them unless you have no other choice, but it isn't very smart to simply let them go either.
Ah, but you don't actually know what they Iraqi boys are responsible for. You're just assuming the operation they were caught in was their first. Let's be real here. There is most definately a contradiction. A picking and choosing based on what testimony (and I use that term loosely) is usable and which isn't. The situation for the Afghan boy isn't any different in nature from the Iraqi boys, but the rule of law was bent for one and not the other. Funny how that works out, but it's not your problem... it's mine, and I'll deal with it.

The Ninth Scribe
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Keltoi
07-16-2008, 06:14 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Ninth_Scribe
Ah, but you don't actually know what they Iraqi boys are responsible for. You're just assuming the operation they were caught in was their first. Let's be real here. There is most definately a contradiction. A picking and choosing based on what testimony (and I use that term loosely) is usable and which isn't. The situation for the Afghan boy isn't any different in nature from the Iraqi boys, but the rule of law was bent for one and not the other. Funny how that works out, but it's not your problem... it's mine, and I'll deal with it.

The Ninth Scribe
Yeah ok, you deal with it.
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smartcard
07-16-2008, 06:18 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Keltoi
There is law in Gitmo. Many detainees have been released even recently. The military tribunals are being very strict on rules of evidence. Most of those kept at Gitmo these days are the worst of the worst. People like Khalid Sheik Mohammed.
Which law and court you are talking about. Under which legal law one can detain for six years without any trial?
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Ninth_Scribe
07-16-2008, 06:28 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by smartcard
Which law and court you are talking about. Under which legal law one can detain for six years without any trial?
You're nuts if you think he can actually name one. The courts are secret and the names of those in charge are classified. In fact, Bush classifies everything that could cause his administration problems... he even classified the employee records of several "civilian" contractor firms via his sweetie in the State Department, Condoleeza Rice!

The Ninth Scribe
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Izyan
07-16-2008, 06:34 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Ninth_Scribe
How do you know this boy wasn't lured too? Because he was caught with a gun? So were the two Iraqi boys! Yes, it's related. You can't say one is guilty without condemning them all. There is no picking and choosing between favorites. A boy is a boy. If he's considered fair game, they ALL are. Otherwise the statements contradict themselves... and you know me... I hate contradictions. I hate them in holy law and I hate them in military statistics.

The Ninth Scribe
Is he considered a boy in Islam?
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Izyan
07-16-2008, 06:38 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Ninth_Scribe
You're nuts if you think he can actually name one. The courts are secret and the names of those in charge are classified. In fact, Bush classifies everything that could cause his administration problems... he even classified the employee records of several "civilian" contractor firms via his sweetie in the State Department, Condoleeza Rice!

The Ninth Scribe
To protect themselves and their family. Do you know how many lawsuits and physical attacks they would endure if their names were a part of public record?
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Fishman
07-16-2008, 06:47 PM
:sl:
If he is innocent he should be sent home, if he is guilty he is a child soldier and should be treated as other child soldiers are treated, ie. rehabilitated humanely. Either way he shouldn't be staying in an illegal torture centre that only exists because of the huge field of landmines that surrounds it. Guantamano Bay should be given over to Castro. I bet even he has a better justice system than this.
:w:
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Ninth_Scribe
07-16-2008, 06:54 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Izyan
To protect themselves and their family. Do you know how many lawsuits and physical attacks they would endure if their names were a part of public record?
Oh give me a break! They don't want the names published because it would change the death count Bush tricked the American public into believing and it would open the doors of investigation into several claims made by the U.S. military in Iraq. Then, of course, there is my personal favorite... Nick Berg. Bush made quite a display, describing him as this poor kid, just a civilian telecommunications specialist fresh out of college who only went to Iraq to look for some work. BS! And, if what you say is true, why on earth would they need to protect the life of a DEAD guy? They don't. His record is classified to protect something else.

The Ninth Scribe
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Keltoi
07-16-2008, 06:57 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Fishman
:sl:
If he is innocent he should be sent home, if he is guilty he is a child soldier and should be treated as other child soldiers are treated, ie. rehabilitated humanely. Either way he shouldn't be staying in an illegal torture centre that only exists because of the huge field of landmines that surrounds it. Guantamano Bay should be given over to Castro. I bet even he has a better justice system than this.
:w:
Illegal according to who? And while I'm sure you are just being sarcastically dramatic, there has been no evidence of torture at Gitmo. Plenty of accusations from former detainees, but nothing the Red Cross or any other humanitarian body who has been given access to Gitmo can collaborate. Gitmo is one of those places were fact and fiction don't really matter, it is a symbol now. Would the detainees like it better in Pelican Bay? Maybe Leavenworth? The conditions at those public American prisons would make Gitmo feel like a resort and casino.
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Pygoscelis
07-16-2008, 06:58 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Keltoi
Absolutely. He was captured on a battlefield in Afghanistan after killing a medic...where else should he be? He should be thankful he isn't dead. More than likely he will be released to Canadian custody and will probably be able to return to society in 10 or 20 years.
Didn't I hear about a month ago something about him maybe not being the one who killed that soldier? Has he had any sort of trial yet? We surely can't conclude he killed that medic without any evidence of that.
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Izyan
07-16-2008, 07:04 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Pygoscelis
Didn't I hear about a month ago something about him maybe not being the one who killed that soldier? Has he had any sort of trial yet? We surely can't conclude he killed that medic without any evidence of that.
They've tried to have his trial 3 times but can't until his lawyers finish their appeals to the US Supreme Court and the Canadian Courts.
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Ninth_Scribe
07-16-2008, 07:04 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Keltoi
Absolutely. He was captured on a battlefield in Afghanistan after killing a medic...where else should he be? He should be thankful he isn't dead. More than likely he will be released to Canadian custody and will probably be able to return to society in 10 or 20 years.
He should be THANKFUL he isn't dead? Have you even bothered to READ the statements made by those who were released from Gitmo? They most certainly wished they were killed and quite a number of them couldn't even think about having a life after their experience there. Their hatred for America became so cemented, all they could dream about was how to kill themselves and any Americans they could take with them, just like Abu Saleh al Ajmi.

Military documents previously released to AP show that al-Ajmi was "constantly in trouble" while in Guantanamo and held in disciplinary blocks during his detention. He also allegedly told officials in August 2004 that "he now is a jihadist, an enemy combatant, and that he will kill as many Americans as he possibly can." Tom Wilner, a lawyer who represented Kuwaiti prisoners at Guantanamo, said al-Ajmi had a broken arm during one of their meetings at the base in Cuba and that he alleged he had been injured by guards who interrupted him while he prayed.

Source: http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2008/...n4077969.shtml
I have reports on American prisons that would make your head spin, and these prisons have over-sight. Gitmo doesn't so even if I just double the events, types and numbers ~ it's pretty disgusting!

The Ninth Scribe
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Ninth_Scribe
07-16-2008, 07:11 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Pygoscelis
Didn't I hear about a month ago something about him maybe not being the one who killed that soldier? Has he had any sort of trial yet? We surely can't conclude he killed that medic without any evidence of that.
They charged him with it, as they did the others who were taken. They don't know for certain who did it, but the charge is enough to hold them all.

The Ninth Scribe
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Fishman
07-16-2008, 07:36 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Keltoi
Illegal according to who?
:sl:
Illegal according to the people who say you can't be held prisoner without trial!

As for 'no evidence for torture', what is waterboarding then? What is chaining people to the floor in painful positions?
:w:
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S_87
07-16-2008, 08:30 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Izyan
Seeing that he's a Canadian citizen with no connection to Afghanistan, what was he doing there? A fair trial? How much of a trial was Daniel Pearl or Nick Berg Afforded. Under the Geneva Convictions he could have been executed on the spot as an enemy combatant. Don't blame the US for his predicament blame his nutty parents.
'his nutty parents' for what?

whatd he do, invade a country and kill a load of people? Who are the terrorists here?
what has he and all those people in guatanamo there for? what is their crime? where is the proof against them? do the terrorists who are keeping them there even know why they are there? Do they deserve to be tortured? Do they deserve to be treated worse than animals?
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Izyan
07-16-2008, 08:32 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by amani
'his nutty parents' for what?
For filling his head with nonsense and sending him to a warzone in Afghanistan.
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Fishman
07-16-2008, 08:33 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by amani
'his nutty parents' for what?
:sl:
Being friends with Bin Laden and going to Afganistan to help al-Qaeda. They are at fault, he's just a child soldier who got caught up in it. The Americans are also at fault for keeping him in Gitmo and abusing him rather than realising the fact that he's been 'brainwashed' and needs help.
:w:
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Cabdullahi
07-16-2008, 08:45 PM
[QUOTE=Izyan;975009]For filling his head with nonsense and sending him to a warzone in Afghanistan.[/QUOTE

I dont know why he was there,Izyan you,yourself dont know why his family took him there and nor does fishman know, we are told by the media that he went there to fight,ok if he did go and kill a soldier that came and took over the country with no legitimate basis then mashallah ,allah will liberate him and afghanistan inshallah because america is in no position to invade iraq and afghansitan and they are in no position to take any kid they want and torture them
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S_87
07-16-2008, 08:53 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Izyan
For filling his head with nonsense and sending him to a warzone in Afghanistan.
and are you sure they did that? because had there actually been proof of that, they wouldnt be at home but would have been arrested and put under trial!
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S_87
07-16-2008, 08:54 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Fishman
:sl:
Being friends with Bin Laden and going to Afganistan to help al-Qaeda. They are at fault, he's just a child soldier who got caught up in it. The Americans are also at fault for keeping him in Gitmo and abusing him rather than realising the fact that he's been 'brainwashed' and needs help.
:w:
And do you have proof his parents were friends with bin laden and sent him to help al qaeda? refer to my post above
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Izyan
07-16-2008, 08:57 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by amani
and are you sure they did that? because had there actually been proof of that, they wouldnt be at home but would have been arrested and put under trial!
Actually his father and his brother has been arrested and under trial
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Fishman
07-16-2008, 09:04 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by amani
And do you have proof his parents were friends with bin laden and sent him to help al qaeda? refer to my post above
:sl:
The article in the other thread about this issue says so, and there are videos that have been found showing him playing with explosives that the family were using. Although the only evidence comes from US sources, I bet you don't have anything better.

I dont know why he was there,Izyan you,yourself dont know why his family took him there and nor does fishman know, we are told by the media that he went there to fight
We don't know whether American soldiers disrespected the Quran in Gitmo for definite either. But its pretty hard to know anything for definite, so we have to take the evidence into account. At the moment, the evidence says that his family went there to help al-Qaeda. This might be faked, and there might be other evidence against this that we don't know about. But since we don't know that yet we have to judge on what we do know.
:w:
Reply

Cabdullahi
07-16-2008, 09:12 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Izyan
Actually his father and his brother has been arrested and under trial
A country that brings hypocrisy will not bring democracy, no chance!

47 women and children killed and there is no one that would bring justice and imprison those that did this,and we come here argue and fight about a 15 year old boy,'he deserves it'! 'no his mother deserves to be punished' as if he is a vile and vulturous war criminal
Reply

Keltoi
07-16-2008, 09:12 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Pygoscelis
Didn't I hear about a month ago something about him maybe not being the one who killed that soldier? Has he had any sort of trial yet? We surely can't conclude he killed that medic without any evidence of that.
I certainly haven't heard that, but perhaps. I'm sure there were plenty of eyewitnesses if that guy was a medic. Medics usually don't go into warzones by themselves.
Reply

Cabdullahi
07-16-2008, 09:20 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Fishman
:sl:We don't know whether American soldiers disrespected the Quran in Gitmo for definite either. But its pretty hard to know anything for definite, so we have to take the evidence into account. At the moment, the evidence says that his family went there to help al-Qaeda. This might be faked, and there might be other evidence against this that we don't know about. But since we don't know that yet we have to judge on what we do know.
:w:
So what!! the CIA also helped alqaeda against the soviets. you know what that means it means they can fight the soviets against invasion but when america invades afghanistan and they retaliate atomatically they become terrorists. utter crap! america doesnt own the people!!!
Reply

Fishman
07-16-2008, 09:29 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Ahmedjunior
So what!! the CIA also helped alqaeda against the soviets. you know what that means it means they can fight the soviets against invasion but when america invades afghanistan and they retaliate atomatically they become terrorists. utter crap! america doesnt own the people!!!
:sl:
They were terrorists before the invasion of Afganistan. The USA funds terrorist organisations when its in their interests.
:w:
Reply

Cabdullahi
07-16-2008, 09:34 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Fishman
:sl:
They were terrorists before the invasion of Afganistan. The USA funds terrorist organisations when its in their interests.
:w:
Even margaret thatcher used to applaud the mujahideen ,the same mujahideen that they are fighting now. sh@t is twisted there are many things that only allah knows, that is hidden from us
Reply

Fishman
07-16-2008, 09:39 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Ahmedjunior
Even margaret thatcher used to applaud the mujahideen ,the same mujahideen that they are fighting now. sh@t is twisted there are many things that only allah knows, that is hidden from us
:sl:
I bet if the 'Iron Witch' was the PM today she would be straight off with Bush and the Republicans to war in Afganistan and Iraq.
Reply

ayesha309
07-16-2008, 09:43 PM
Keltoi you honestly live under a closed world full of american propoganda. if you think there were/are no abuses done in gitmo, then ur a hopeless person who honestly needs to wake up. I pray Allah gives you hidaya

His father is dead, his one older bro is in a candian prison facing extradition to gitmo.

his other older bro was in gitmo, is out now. is not doing the right things. i think he even made a documentary or something about his life.

his older sister is "stuck" in canada. (her passport has been confiscated by the canadian gov't and has not been released to her, therefore she is "stuck")

this boy is a child soldier needs to be freed. he has faced ruthless tortures, inhumane treatment, has been shot at while in gitmo, his one eye was damaged while in afghanistan, but becuase of lack of medical treatment in gitmo, he has lost eye sight from that eye. his other eye has been damaged while in gitmo. i believe he was shot twice while in gitmo (once near the lungs) he has been used as a human mop to clean his own urine, excretment. he has faced and perhaps continues to face other such ruthless tortures. dont tell me this is "humane treatment".
like i said, the canadian government will most probably let him stay in gitmo becuase the current canadian conservative gov't worships the US and wont do anything against their will.

its interesting how the soldier who he supposedly killd (no evidcne to prove it yet) is often called a medic.

http://www.rollingstone.com/politics...a_gitmo_cell/9

http://www.nightslantern.ca/law/omarkhadr.html

http://www.cbc.ca/news/background/guantanamo/
Reply

Musaafirah
07-16-2008, 09:46 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Ahmedjunior
Even margaret thatcher used to applaud the mujahideen ,the same mujahideen that they are fighting now. sh@t is twisted there are many things that only allah knows, that is hidden from us
I know this is off topic, but can i ask how'd you know Margaret Thatcher applauded the Mujahideen. Do you have any quotes?(If I sound rude, I don't mean to be)
Reply

Keltoi
07-16-2008, 10:01 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by ayesha309
Keltoi you honestly live under a closed world full of american propoganda. if you think there were/are no abuses done in gitmo, then ur a hopeless person who honestly needs to wake up. I pray Allah gives you hidaya

His father is dead, his one older bro is in a candian prison facing extradition to gitmo.

his other older bro was in gitmo, is out now. is not doing the right things. i think he even made a documentary or something about his life.

his older sister is "stuck" in canada. (her passport has been confiscated by the canadian gov't and has not been released to her, therefore she is "stuck")

this boy is a child soldier needs to be freed. he has faced ruthless tortures, inhumane treatment, has been shot at while in gitmo, his one eye was damaged while in afghanistan, but becuase of lack of medical treatment in gitmo, he has lost eye sight from that eye. his other eye has been damaged while in gitmo. i believe he was shot twice while in gitmo (once near the lungs) he has been used as a human mop to clean his own urine, excretment. he has faced and perhaps continues to face other such ruthless tortures. dont tell me this is "humane treatment".
like i said, the canadian government will most probably let him stay in gitmo becuase the current canadian conservative gov't worships the US and wont do anything against their will.

its interesting how the soldier who he supposedly killd (no evidcne to prove it yet) is often called a medic.

http://www.rollingstone.com/politics...a_gitmo_cell/9

http://www.nightslantern.ca/law/omarkhadr.html

http://www.cbc.ca/news/background/guantanamo/
The soldier was called a medic because that is what he was. A Special Forces medic.

As for the rest of that, it is not true. He was not shot at Gitmo, he was shot in Afghanistan. He was near death from injuries when they took him into custody.
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Cabdullahi
07-16-2008, 10:03 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Musaafir
I know this is off topic, but can i ask how'd you know Margaret Thatcher applauded the Mujahideen. Do you have any quotes?(If I sound rude, I don't mean to be)
nah sister you dont sound rude,you sound like you are hungry for knowledge ..thats all

Look margaret was with ronald reagan and she backed his ideas that the soviets were to be fought and defeated so therefore they used the mujahideen to do all the dirty work while they funded them.. so technically she was a supporter
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Amadeus85
07-16-2008, 10:09 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Ahmedjunior
Even margaret thatcher used to applaud the mujahideen ,the same mujahideen that they are fighting now. sh@t is twisted there are many things that only allah knows, that is hidden from us
Americans and Nato forces now fight aganst Talebans, not Mujahedeens.They are two different groups if im not mistaken. Didint talebans and mujahedeens fight in 90's about power in Afghanistan?
It is sad but true but countries have their national interests and they often make alliances with "enemies of their enemies". Just like USA supported mujahedeens in their fight against Soviet Union.
The same way Iran and Syria make buisness with Putin's Russia which killed 100 000 muslims in Chechenia and whole muslim world makes buisness with China which kills muslim Uighurs since dozens of years.
This is brutal but this is life.
Reply

AvarAllahNoor
07-16-2008, 10:13 PM
Well, at least it's known now, not like it was a secret. USA brings it all upon itself, then stands back all bewildered, wondering erm why us. What have we done to inccur bombings in our country!

Al - Queda have added 6 more USA soldiers to the body count today...
Reply

Cabdullahi
07-16-2008, 10:16 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Aaron85
Americans and Nato forces now fight aganst Talebans, not Mujahedeens.They are two different groups if im not mistaken. Didint talebans and mujahedeens fight in 90's about power in Afghanistan?
It is sad but true but countries have their national interests and they often make alliances with "enemies of their enemies". Just like USA supported mujahedeens in their fight against Soviet Union.
The same way Iran and Syria make buisness with Putin's Russia which killed 100 000 muslims in Chechenia and whole muslim world makes buisness with China which kills muslim Uighurs since dozens of years.
This is brutal but this is life.
So where are the mujahideen now, when i say mujahideen i am talking about ayman azawahri,osama and many others, they support the taleban and those who were part of the mujahideen in the eiighties and nineties are a part of the taleban now! thats what the media tells us
Reply

ayesha309
07-16-2008, 10:46 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Keltoi
The soldier was called a medic because that is what he was. A Special Forces medic.

As for the rest of that, it is not true. He was not shot at Gitmo, he was shot in Afghanistan. He was near death from injuries when they took him into custody.
once again you ignore facts and live in your propoganda world. you have no proof that he wasnt tortured. bush is knows for his lies. rusmfield was known for his lies. ther is a reson why bush is voted as the worst president in american history and rumsifeld was almost kiked out. you're gona follow and listen to such liars?? try to get more authentic info before stating useless stuff. even gitmo guards have admited they have tortued detainees. i honestly dont know wher u get ur thinking from.
Reply

Keltoi
07-16-2008, 10:58 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by ayesha309
once again you ignore facts and live in your propoganda world. you have no proof that he wasnt tortured. bush is knows for his lies. rusmfield was known for his lies. ther is a reson why bush is voted as the worst president in american history and rumsifeld was almost kiked out. you're gona follow and listen to such liars?? try to get more authentic info before stating useless stuff. even gitmo guards have admited they have tortued detainees. i honestly dont know wher u get ur thinking from.
I have no proof that he wasn't tortured? Do you have proof that he was tortured? No.
Reply

Keltoi
07-16-2008, 10:59 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by AvarAllahNoor
Well, at least it's known now, not like it was a secret. USA brings it all upon itself, then stands back all bewildered, wondering erm why us. What have we done to inccur bombings in our country!

Al - Queda have added 6 more USA soldiers to the body count today...
What wisdom. Wanna know who else is on the body count? 6 children killed in a car bombing.
Reply

Cabdullahi
07-16-2008, 11:12 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Keltoi
I have no proof that he wasn't tortured? Do you have proof that he was tortured? No.
The brother is right we have to reason with him because if a person goes into a shopping mall,you cant say this person has definetly bought something he/she might have looked around and just came out,its the same with the teenager hes in guantanamo but it might not be that he is tortured there.in that notion i agree with keltoi for the sake of argument but we have to be clear and ask ourselves what was gitmo created for?,at the end of the it was created for muslim torture only,
Reply

Keltoi
07-16-2008, 11:53 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Ahmedjunior
The brother is right we have to reason with him because if a person goes into a shopping mall,you cant say this person has definetly bought something he/she might have looked around and just came out,its the same with the teenager hes in guantanamo but it might not be that he is tortured there.in that notion i agree with keltoi for the sake of argument but we have to be clear and ask ourselves what was gitmo created for?,at the end of the it was created for muslim torture only,
I think it is a stretch to characterize it as a place created "for muslim torture only." It is a place to hold and interrogate enemy combatants. Those enemies come from predominantly Muslim countries. If we were at war in the Congo or Zimbabwe, it would be black detainees.
Reply

Izyan
07-17-2008, 12:06 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Fishman
:sl:
They were terrorists before the invasion of Afganistan. The USA funds terrorist organisations when its in their interests.
:w:
Not exactlly, the motive behind the Soviet and American invasions are different. The Soviets invaded for expansion reasons. America invade because of 9/11. Besides the Mujahdeen the US supported became the Northern Alliance not al-queda or the Taliban. When the US was supplying the Mujahdeen through Pakistan Bin Laden was in Sudan.
Reply

Izyan
07-17-2008, 12:09 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Keltoi
I think it is a stretch to characterize it as a place created "for muslim torture only." It is a place to hold and interrogate enemy combatants. Those enemies come from predominantly Muslim countries. If we were at war in the Congo or Zimbabwe, it would be black detainees.
To prove that Gitmo was orginially built to hold Haitian refugees.
Reply

Fishman
07-17-2008, 12:54 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Izyan
Not exactlly, the motive behind the Soviet and American invasions are different. The Soviets invaded for expansion reasons. America invade because of 9/11. Besides the Mujahdeen the US supported became the Northern Alliance not al-queda or the Taliban. When the US was supplying the Mujahdeen through Pakistan Bin Laden was in Sudan.
:sl:
Soviets invaded because Islamist fighters overthrew the Communist regime. They may have wanted expansion as well, but the reason they gave was about protecting their Communist allies.
:w:
Reply

AvarAllahNoor
07-17-2008, 02:27 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Keltoi
What wisdom. Wanna know who else is on the body count? 6 children killed in a car bombing.
And thousands of civilains killed by the soldiers.
Reply

Izyan
07-17-2008, 02:30 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by AvarAllahNoor
And thousands of civilains killed by the soldiers.
And hundreds of thousands killed by fellow muslims.
Reply

S_87
07-17-2008, 02:47 PM
The article in the other thread about this issue says so, and there are videos that have been found showing him playing with explosives that the family were using. Although the only evidence comes from US sources, I bet you don't have anything better.
ok say thats true. Does it justify him being treated like that?
Reply

Cabdullahi
07-17-2008, 03:06 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Izyan
And hundreds of thousands killed by fellow muslims.
As a result of the illegal occupation duhh!! and where did you get that figure from??? i know, cnnabccbs :rolleyes: and thanks for pointing it out brother:thumbs_do
Reply

Keltoi
07-17-2008, 03:07 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by amani
ok say thats true. Does it justify him being treated like that?
Treated like what exactly?
Reply

Izyan
07-17-2008, 03:38 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Ahmedjunior
As a result of the illegal occupation duhh!! and where did you get that figure from??? i know, cnnabccbs :rolleyes: and thanks for pointing it out brother:thumbs_do
I'm going to let you reread your post and give you time to rethink that logic
Reply

ayesha309
07-17-2008, 03:43 PM
even the Red Cross says gitmo used torture
watch this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M3PvIFx-WDE
Reply

Pygoscelis
07-17-2008, 04:09 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Keltoi
I think it is a stretch to characterize it as a place created "for muslim torture only." It is a place to hold and interrogate enemy combatants. Those enemies come from predominantly Muslim countries. If we were at war in the Congo or Zimbabwe, it would be black detainees.
So... its not for muslim torture only. Its for torture of others too? lol
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Sarada
07-17-2008, 04:11 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Keltoi
Absolutely. He was captured on a battlefield in Afghanistan after killing a medic...where else should he be? He should be thankful he isn't dead. More than likely he will be released to Canadian custody and will probably be able to return to society in 10 or 20 years.
And you call yourself a Christian, Keltoi! Your opinions are hateful and bigoted!
Is this the attitude that Jesus would have had?

Matthew ch 25 vs 40:

... 'I tell you the truth, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers of mine, you did for me.'

God is compassionated and merciful. You're statements are self-righteous, judgemental and ignorant.

May God have mercy upon you!

Omar Khadr was a child soldier, and whatever he may or may not have done, the United Nations mandate is that all child soldiers are to be rescued and rehabilitated.

If we can do this for child soldiers in Africa and South East Asia, why do we not offer Omar the same compassion?

Venomous opinions such as yours make me want to vomit!
Reply

Somalina
07-17-2008, 04:40 PM
May Allah swt Increase his Iman and keep him strong.
As reported in Al-Bukhari, Abu Hurairah narrated that Prophet Muhammad (peace and blessings be upon him) said, "No fatigue, nor disease, nor sorrow, nor sadness, nor hurt, nor distress befalls a Muslim, even if it were the prick he receives from a thorn, but that Allah expiates some of his sins for that."

What does one expect when Psychologists from The American Psychological Association are involved in these operations?
Reply

Keltoi
07-17-2008, 04:58 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Pygoscelis
So... its not for muslim torture only. Its for torture of others too? lol
It isn't for torture of anyone. Waterboarding and other methods were used on Khalid Sheik Mohammed and I'm sure others, but the use of the word torture is for shock value and drama. Torture was Abu Ghraib, and the U.S. deserves to be blamed and held accountable for that. Gitmo is a detention facility for enemy combatants. The same kind of place used to house German POWs in WWII. Although legally we can't call them POWs because they don't represent a nation state.
Reply

Keltoi
07-17-2008, 05:08 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Sarada
And you call yourself a Christian, Keltoi! Your opinions are hateful and bigoted!
Is this the attitude that Jesus would have had?

Matthew ch 25 vs 40:

... 'I tell you the truth, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers of mine, you did for me.'

God is compassionated and merciful. You're statements are self-righteous, judgemental and ignorant.

May God have mercy upon you!

Omar Khadr was a child soldier, and whatever he may or may not have done, the United Nations mandate is that all child soldiers are to be rescued and rehabilitated.

If we can do this for child soldiers in Africa and South East Asia, why do we not offer Omar the same compassion?

Venomous opinions such as yours make me want to vomit!
Yes, if the world lived by the example of Jesus Christ there wouldn't be wars to begin with. As for being self-righteous, hateful, and bigoted, I find that remark to be a little hypocritical.

Furthermore, child soldiers in Africa and elsewhere aren't responsible for the death of a member of the U.S. military during war time. The fact that he was young is probably the only reason he is still alive. Rehabilitation should be a goal obviously, and that will happen after his sentencing.
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Ninth_Scribe
07-17-2008, 05:59 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by ayesha309
even the Red Cross says gitmo used torture
watch this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M3PvIFx-WDE
You're wasting your breath trying to have discussions like this with Keltoi. It doesn't matter what the Muslims said about Abu Ghraib, it was disqualified as "propaganda" stories and no one took it seriously until well AFTER the proof was leaked over the internet. Even so, Keltoi would say it's a "rare" occurance that doesn't matter in light of what Muslims do to themselves. He ALWAYS justifies this crap. The Red Cross and other qualified organizations can come foward too, but it means NOTHING to him. He has all the answers he needs, so I'm going to give you some good advice.

Don't waste your time arguing to a brick wall. For all the time and energy you wasted here debating with this brick wall, you could have been writing letters to some of these groups asking them what you can do to help THEIR cause. Pick and choose your battles more carefully so you can be sure your energy goes to situations you can change. There are tons of American groups who oppose Gitmo and you should be looking them up online and writing THEM! You do NOT need Keltois approval and you'll never get it no matter what you say, so just go over his head.

The Ninth Scribe
Reply

Sarada
07-18-2008, 02:04 AM
I agree with you, Ninth.

The best thing we can do is to join together and put pressure on our governments. As a Canadian, I will write to as many Canadian government officials as I can.

I hope Americans will do the same.

I should know better than to let Keltoi provoke me to anger. Anger never solved anything. Standing up and being counted for a just cause CAN effect positive change.
Reply

smartcard
07-18-2008, 06:01 AM
format_quote Originally Posted by Sarada
I agree with you, Ninth.

The best thing we can do is to join together and put pressure on our governments. As a Canadian, I will write to as many Canadian government officials as I can.

I hope Americans will do the same.

I should know better than to let Keltoi provoke me to anger. Anger never solved anything. Standing up and being counted for a just cause CAN effect positive change.
Agree 100% let's spend our time on something which will help this poor child.
Reply

AvarAllahNoor
07-18-2008, 11:08 AM
I agree Keltoi is very agressive, Not Christian like at all. I bet he's the kind who are memebers of Jesus Camp, who worship Dubya, and think all the worlds relgions are wrong, and they sould all convert to Christainity! - I depise such people.
Reply

AvarAllahNoor
07-18-2008, 11:12 AM
format_quote Originally Posted by Izyan
And hundreds of thousands killed by fellow muslims.
It's a war, ifyou side with the enemy you become the enemy! - Sadly you'll get a few innocent people die, but that's just collateral damage.

Invaders take over your country, and other Islamic countries watch and do nothing. They should have united and taken on the USA, they'd then think twice about going into foreign lands!
:mad:
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Keltoi
07-18-2008, 02:38 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by AvarAllahNoor
It's a war, ifyou side with the enemy you become the enemy! - Sadly you'll get a few innocent people die, but that's just collateral damage.

Invaders take over your country, and other Islamic countries watch and do nothing. They should have united and taken on the USA, they'd then think twice about going into foreign lands!
:mad:
They sure showed Israel back in 67...:D

Perhaps the "other Islamic countries" didn't have much of a problem with Saddam being deposed.
Reply

Gator
07-18-2008, 03:09 PM
See the problem here is that war is horrible. Yeah people are going to get killed. As Izyan pointed out, muslims have killed hundreds of thousands of fellow muslims. If a militant tries to IED a US/Nato patrol and wipes out a bunch of muslims, yeah that's collateral damage. In war that happens.

The problem I have is the blind eye to the fact that most of the muslims killed by muslims were sectarian torture and killing. These people were kidnapped, tortured and killed. We're still finding mass graves where Alqueda in Iraq and other militant organization dumped their victims. This is as far from collateral damage as you can get and it far outweighs the number of collateral damage.

That is not part of war. That is what will happen when they are in control. Barbers in Baghdad were being shot. Unveiled women in Basra where being kidnapped tortured and killed. University professors slaughtered. You tell me that's war?

What happens when US soldiers push the militants out? Do the US soldiers start lining up thousands and thousands of people to be shot? No, people are allowed to rebuild their lives.

Yes war is horrible and people get killed, but its what your fighting for that counts.

Here's what's happens when the Taliban are in control.

http://news.yahoo.com/nphotos/Afghan...2f5c8fdbdf3837

http://news.yahoo.com/nphotos/Afghan...1cc498de6f1441


Brutal repression and doctrinal killing.

I was against the Iraq war, am a hardcore Democrat, want bush tried, but the simplistic equivocating and implicit support for these insane murderers by some of the people on this board makes me sick.
Reply

AvarAllahNoor
07-18-2008, 03:36 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Keltoi
They sure showed Israel back in 67...:D
Handing it all back now aren't they eh. :rolleyes:
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Keltoi
07-18-2008, 04:44 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by AvarAllahNoor
Handing it all back now aren't they eh. :rolleyes:
handing what back?
Reply

Fishman
07-18-2008, 04:54 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by AvarAllahNoor
I agree Keltoi is very agressive, Not Christian like at all. I bet he's the kind who are memebers of Jesus Camp, who worship Dubya, and think all the worlds relgions are wrong, and they sould all convert to Christainity! - I depise such people.
:sl:
That's a bit harsh, Keltoi is quite moderate most of the time. If you think Keltoi is a Republican fanatic you probably haven't met a real one. We don't have any on LI as they are too busy making up stories about Obama's terrorist fist jabs...
:w:
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Amadeus85
07-18-2008, 05:30 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by AvarAllahNoor
I agree Keltoi is very agressive, Not Christian like at all. I bet he's the kind who are memebers of Jesus Camp, who worship Dubya, and think all the worlds relgions are wrong, and they sould all convert to Christainity! - I depise such people.
:uuh:

I must say that you dont know Keltoi enough since you say such things.
He is very calm and moderate as far as i see his posts. Much more than me. :smile:
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Ninth_Scribe
07-18-2008, 07:36 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by AvarAllahNoor
Invaders take over your country, and other Islamic countries watch and do nothing. They should have united and taken on the USA, they'd then think twice about going into foreign lands! :mad:
Oh, I wouldn't worry too much about that. I've read the history of this world and one thing has been made perfectly clear to me. There is no nation that has escaped corruption, and by corruption, they have all been laid to waste. You may think America is all big and bad, but it's being wiped out as we speak. They still haven't figured out how to put out the fires in the west or deal with the mosquitoes that have enjoyed the floods in the heart-land... tiny insects that carry EEE and West Nile Virus. They can take all the oil they want, but they won't ENJOY a drop of it.

And, it's not even summer time yet. :shade:

The Ninth Scribe
Reply

Ninth_Scribe
07-18-2008, 07:45 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Sarada
I agree with you, Ninth.

The best thing we can do is to join together and put pressure on our governments. As a Canadian, I will write to as many Canadian government officials as I can.

I hope Americans will do the same.

I should know better than to let Keltoi provoke me to anger. Anger never solved anything. Standing up and being counted for a just cause CAN effect positive change.
Every letter counts. You might not think so, but if everone writes one, it will take a fleet of trucks to deliver them! There are also quite a number of cracks in the legal foundation ~ and I have no doubt that horrible place will come down like a house of cards.... just have to pull out the correct brick.

Write your heart out sis. Maybe try writing the letter a few times, so it comes out perfectly. You can do this.

The Ninth Scribe
Reply

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