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islamirama
10-25-2008, 04:47 AM
Pig farms bloom in Muslim Morocco thanks to tourism


AGADIR, Morocco — Shunned by most Muslim countries where pork consumption is a religious taboo, pig farming is blooming in Morocco thanks to a growing tourist industry and pragmatic breeders like 39-year-old Said Samouk.

"If there's tourism, it would be better to have pigs," said Samouk, who raises 250 pigs at his farm 28 kilometres (17 miles) from the seaside town of Agadir.

After being battered by a wave of bird flu, the Moroccan farmer launched a pig operation 20 years ago in partnership with an elderly French man.
Today, Samouk spins dreams of doubling his production within three years to help meet the demands of some 10 million tourists expected to visit Morocco in 2010 -- up from 7.5 million who flocked to the north African country in 2007.

"I'm a practising Muslim. I don't eat pork and I don't drink alcohol but it's just a breeding operation like any other and no Imam has ever reprimanded me for it," he said of raising pigs -- whose consumption is prohibited in both Islam and Judaism.

Outlawed in Algeria, Mauritania and Libya, pig farming is nonetheless authorised in Tunisia as in Morocco, to cater to the flocks of European and other non-Muslim tourists who head to north Africa's spectacular beaches and deserts.

"Our clientele is 98 percent European. They want bacon for breakfast, ham for lunch and pork chops for dinner," said Ahmad Bartoul, a buyer for a large Agadir hotel. Signs are posted on buffet tables to avoid any confusion about the meat's origin.

Morocco's swine industry comprises some 5,000 pigs raised on seven farms located near Agadir, Casablanca and the north-central city of Taza. The breeders include a Christian, two Jews and four Muslims.

Annual production is currently estimated at 270 tonnes of meat, bringing in some 12 million dirhams (1 million euros, 1.6 million dollars) in revenue.
The breeders include Jean Yves Yoel Chriquia, a 32-year-old Jew who owns the country's main pork processing factory along with a farm of 1,000 pigs. Chriquia also buys pigs from Samouk and another local farmer at 22 dirhams a kilo.

Four times a month, he goes to the slaughter house in Agadir -- but must enter from a door other than that used for deliveries of meat that is Halal, or authorised under Islam.

"We have a special place for this sort of slaughter. After cutting up the meat and getting the veterinarian's stamp, we transport it to the factory and put it in cold storage," Yoel said.

Almost 80 percent of his products are earmarked for hotels in Agadir and Marrakech. The rest heads to supermarkets and butcher shops -- and to feed some 220 Chinese workers building a nearby motorway.

"My wife was certain we would never find pork because we were in a Muslim country," said French retiree Bernard Samoyeau, as he ordered pork at from a butcher in Agadir. "We have been pleasantly surprised."
Yoel is also pleased.

"We have more than doubled our sales in three years and it's starting to snowball. But since we rely on tourism, we must be careful," he said.
The Moroccan farmer speaks from experience: the 1990 Gulf war, the 2001 attacks on New York and Washington and the 2003 invasion of Iraq ultimately forced him to shutter his last business burdened by 2.8 million dirhams of unpaid bills.

Three years ago, he opened up a new company that employs 31 people.
"Hotels all over Morocco are calling me up for deliveries, but for the time being I can't respond to all the demands. We're getting there, little by little," Yoel said.

Nor does he see a conflict between his job and his Jewish faith.
"Religion is a private matter. What I do is just another way to earn a living and my Rabbi has never said anything about it," he said.

http://www.eturbonews.com/1872/pig-farms-bloom-muslim-morocco-thanks-tourism

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What does Islam says about this?

These verses of the Qur'an and the ahadith clearly state that not only eating but selling it is forbidden also.

Say (O Muhammad SAW): "I find not in that which has been inspired to me anything forbidden to be eaten by one who wishes to eat it, unless it be Maytatah (a dead animal) or blood poured forth (by slaughtering or the like), or the flesh of swine (pork, etc.) for that surely is impure, or impious (unlawful) meat (of an animal) which is slaughtered as a sacrifice for others than Allâh (or has been slaughtered for idols, etc., or on which Allâh's Name has not been mentioned while slaughtering). But whosoever is forced by necessity without willful disobedience, nor transgressing due limits, (for him) certainly, your Lord is Oft*Forgiving, Most Merciful."Qur'an (6:145)

The Messenger (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) taught us an important principle when he said: “When Allaah forbids a thing, He (also) forbids its price.” Narrated by Abu Dawood, 3488; classed as saheeh by Shaykh al-Albaani in Ghaayat al-Maraam, 318.

It was narrated from Jaabir ibn ‘Abd-Allaah (may Allaah be pleased with him) that he heard the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) say when he was in Makkah at the time of the Conquest: “Allaah and His Messenger have forbidden the sale of alcohol, dead meat, pork and idols.” It was said: “O Messenger of Allaah, what do you think of the fat of dead animals, for ships are caulked with it and animal skins are daubed with it, and the people use it to light their lamps?” He said: “No, it is haraam.” Then the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “May Allaah curse the Jews, for when Allaah forbade them animal fat, they melted it down and sold it, and consumed its price.” Narrated by al-Bukhaari, 1212; Muslim, 1581

To read the Islamic ruling on this visit this link: http://www.islamqa.com/en/ref/40651
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Trumble
10-25-2008, 06:58 PM
It's odd.... I'm a veggie now, of course, but even prior to that I would never think to order a pork dish if I was visiting a muslim country (or Israel, come to that). It would be very disrespectful, I think. It's not as if you can't make sausages out of something other than pork.
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جوري
10-26-2008, 12:44 AM
It is more sad than odd.. the entire 'Muslim world' is an abomination for reasons I have stopped counting!
thanks for the article and your input Trumble.. Hope you are supplementing your diet otherwise with vits that can only be attained through red meat!
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The Khan
10-26-2008, 12:48 AM
There's a reason why it's called "filthy lucre". :D
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afzalaung
10-26-2008, 05:10 PM
why can't they just import the pork?:S
tourism's a very pathetic reason to breed pigs.
Personally i find people who sacrifice their ethics to appease foreign tourists very annoying. I'm sure even the tourists would want something local, rather then food available at their own country.
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The_Prince
10-26-2008, 11:44 PM
lol i dont think westeners who go to morroco are looking for pork! they are going to morroco to try out the local dishes, as well as checking out the sights etc hence the term TOURIST.
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Chuck
10-27-2008, 12:13 AM
Morocco is exporter of wine too. But they should have learned lessons from Indonesia. Brain disease is common in Indonesia among pig farmers that is caused by a worm found in pigs.
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north_malaysian
10-27-2008, 12:28 PM
In 2008, there are about 1,804,820 pigs all over Malaysia... and in 1996 it was 2,448,020 pigs.

http://www.jphpk.gov.my/English/pig_...n_malaysia.htm

the reason of the sudden drop of pigs in Malaysia is because of the deadly "Nipah virus"

from wikipedia:

"Nipah virus was identified in 1999 when it caused an outbreak of neurological and respiratory disease on pig farms in peninsular Malaysia, resulting in 105 human deaths and the culling of one million pigs.[7] In Singapore, 11 cases including one death occurred in abattoir workers exposed to pigs imported from the affected Malaysian farms. The Nipah virus has been classified by the CDC as a Category C agent "

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Henipavirus

The virus outbreak happened in the state of Negeri Sembilan (about 60% of the population are Muslims)... in 1996 there are 659,730 pigs in Negeri Sembilan making it the largest pig population in Malaysia...and now there are only 1,300 pigs in Negeri Sembilan.

However, none of Malaysian pig farms owners are Muslims. But there are cases of Indonesian Muslims working in these farms.
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The Khan
10-28-2008, 04:03 AM
I've come across pictures of hijabi Malay girls posing with pigs. I wonder what was the meaning of that, lol. As far as I understand, Allah (SWT) has created every creature for a purpose. He has forbidden us from eating pork, that's all. So, what's wrong with working in a pig farm? I haven't come accross any aya stating that it's forbidden to own pigs for any purpose apart from eating them. I mean, pigs are a good source of leather, after all.

Intolerance. Pure intolerance.
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doorster
10-28-2008, 11:46 AM
format_quote Originally Posted by The Khan
I've come across pictures of hijabi Malay girls posing with pigs. I wonder what was the meaning of that, lol. As far as I understand, Allah (SWT) has created every creature for a purpose. He has forbidden us from eating pork, that's all. So, what's wrong with working in a pig farm? I haven't come accross any aya stating that it's forbidden to own pigs for any purpose apart from eating them. I mean, pigs are a good source of leather, after all.

Intolerance. Pure intolerance.
if you do not stop posting such things I'll start replying to you which will annoy everyone and I'll be told off for "stalking" you, so please stop it before I get myself in to trouble.

BTW. can you post me something which supports your claim of "halal pig leather"
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maryam87
10-28-2008, 11:53 AM
format_quote Originally Posted by doorster
if you do not stop posting such things I'll start replying to you which will annoy everyone and I'll be told off for "stalking" you, so please stop it before I get myself in to trouble.

BTW. can you post me something which supports your claim of "halal pig leather"
ill join ya :D:D
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IbnAbdulHakim
10-28-2008, 12:04 PM
"I'm a practising Muslim. I don't eat pork and I don't drink alcohol but it's just a breeding operation like any other and no Imam has ever reprimanded me for it," he said of raising pigs -- whose consumption is prohibited in both Islam and Judaism.
AND CHRISTIANITY!

they always fail to mention that eh !
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buddy1
10-28-2008, 12:05 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Trumble
It's odd.... I'm a veggie now, of course, but even prior to that I would never think to order a pork dish if I was visiting a muslim country (or Israel, come to that). It would be very disrespectful, I think. It's not as if you can't make sausages out of something other than pork.
You can get beef sausages and Quorn for Veggies.
Reply

IbnAbdulHakim
10-28-2008, 12:06 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by The Khan
I've come across pictures of hijabi Malay girls posing with pigs. I wonder what was the meaning of that, lol. As far as I understand, Allah (SWT) has created every creature for a purpose. He has forbidden us from eating pork, that's all. So, what's wrong with working in a pig farm? I haven't come accross any aya stating that it's forbidden to own pigs for any purpose apart from eating them. I mean, pigs are a good source of leather, after all.

Intolerance. Pure intolerance.
what happened to you man, you use to be cool !
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SixTen
10-28-2008, 12:08 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by The Khan
I've come across pictures of hijabi Malay girls posing with pigs. I wonder what was the meaning of that, lol. As far as I understand, Allah (SWT) has created every creature for a purpose. He has forbidden us from eating pork, that's all. So, what's wrong with working in a pig farm? I haven't come accross any aya stating that it's forbidden to own pigs for any purpose apart from eating them. I mean, pigs are a good source of leather, after all.

Intolerance. Pure intolerance.

Although you have some technical valid points - the problem is - the intent of those farms, that is, sell off pork for people to eat - albeit them being non-muslim.

This itself is not allowed, as is, you can't sell alcohol to non-muslims.
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Chuck
10-28-2008, 07:25 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by The Khan
I've come across pictures of hijabi Malay girls posing with pigs. I wonder what was the meaning of that, lol. As far as I understand, Allah (SWT) has created every creature for a purpose. He has forbidden us from eating pork, that's all. So, what's wrong with working in a pig farm? I haven't come accross any aya stating that it's forbidden to own pigs for any purpose apart from eating them. I mean, pigs are a good source of leather, after all.

Intolerance. Pure intolerance.
I posted a scientific study before and living near pigs can cause serious diseases. I'll try to search it post it here. Now that is a medical pov, but there is no such thing as halal pork leather :D

When Jesus (p) returns he will kill all pigs, and after reading some reports I can see the reason why.
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north_malaysian
10-29-2008, 01:47 AM
format_quote Originally Posted by The Khan
I've come across pictures of hijabi Malay girls posing with pigs.
Do you mean this pic?



She's not working in a pig farm. She's a university student.

That pic is so controversial in Malaysia.

Many people accused her for being insensitive with the Malay culture etc.

This is her reply to the public from her Myspace:

"who am i??? im a vet student from UPM, serdang....a Shah Alam girl with a dream to help those suffered animal,to be respected,to skim the cream in this field and to love these kind of cute creatures....i dont want to bring sumone to book ( those senders) but i love to clear the things out and to tell people out there (especially to those who lack in knowledge about halal and haram) what vet is and how we especially Muslim handle any case that involved the "Najis Mughalazah" thing. i dont blame them because this is not their profession....ya, for human being, we just learn deeper about any kind of stuff if only we have to...well, anything that is good came from Allah and anything bad came from ourselves...so people outhere, if you want to judge other people, please full up your mind with knowledge first,k."

http://hembusan.blogspot.com/2007/08...bi-anjing.html


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The Khan
10-30-2008, 12:58 AM
Ah, exactly!! She's the one I'm talking about.

format_quote Originally Posted by doorster
if you do not stop posting such things I'll start replying to you which will annoy everyone and I'll be told off for "stalking" you, so please stop it before I get myself in to trouble.

BTW. can you post me something which supports your claim of "halal pig leather"
Can you please post an aya from the Qur'an proving that it is not? Allah (SWT) has created every creature, big and small, for a purpose, and we must utilise what we can in a halal way.

format_quote Originally Posted by SixTen
Although you have some technical valid points - the problem is - the intent of those farms, that is, sell off pork for people to eat - albeit them being non-muslim.

This itself is not allowed, as is, you can't sell alcohol to non-muslims.
You're right bro.

format_quote Originally Posted by Chuck
I posted a scientific study before and living near pigs can cause serious diseases. I'll try to search it post it here. Now that is a medical pov, but there is no such thing as halal pork leather :D

When Jesus (p) returns he will kill all pigs, and after reading some reports I can see the reason why.
Really? I didn't know that. Is it due to the unsanitary conditions or the pigs themselves?
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doorster
10-30-2008, 02:06 AM
format_quote Originally Posted by The Khan
Ah, exactly!! She's the one I'm talking about.



Can you please post an aya from the Qur'an proving that it is not? Allah (SWT) has created every creature, big and small, for a purpose, and we must utilise what we can in a halal way.



You're right bro.



Really? I didn't know that. Is it due to the unsanitary conditions or the pigs themselves?
No! I will not refute any fakers any more unless I get backing and a guarantee from a Moderator any Moderator in open forum, that if I prove any of you as liars and/or that you are here to mislead, that they confirm so at the very least if not remove you completely.

I am being overwhelmed by the shunning by the staff and onslaught of kafirs and fakers, I am getting flustered/confused and am making many mistakes therefore I am going to sign off for a long time before I lose what little I have left of my sanity, they can contact me via email to take up my offer.
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The Khan
10-30-2008, 02:17 AM
O_o

All I'm saying is that the Qur'an only forbids eating of swine bro...

He has only forbidden you dead meat, and blood, and the flesh of swine, and any (food) over which the name of other than Allah has been invoked. But if one is forced by necessity, without wilful disobedience, nor transgressing due limits,- then Allah is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful. (16:115)

He hath only forbidden you dead meat, and blood, and the flesh of swine, and that on which any other name hath been invoked besides that of Allah. But if one is forced by necessity, without wilful disobedience, nor transgressing due limits,- then is he guiltless. For Allah is Oft-forgiving Most Merciful. (2:173)

Say: "I find not in the message received by me by inspiration any (meat) forbidden to be eaten by one who wishes to eat it, unless it be dead meat, or blood poured forth, or the flesh of swine,- for it is an abomination - or, what is impious, (meat) on which a name has been invoked, other than Allah's". But (even so), if a person is forced by necessity, without wilful disobedience, nor transgressing due limits,- thy Lord is Oft-forgiving, Most Merciful. (6:145)

Forbidden to you (for food) are: dead meat, blood, the flesh of swine, and that on which hath been invoked the name of other than Allah; that which hath been killed by strangling, or by a violent blow, or by a headlong fall, or by being gored to death; that which hath been (partly) eaten by a wild animal; unless ye are able to slaughter it (in due form); that which is sacrificed on stone (altars); (forbidden) also is the division (of meat) by raffling with arrows: that is impiety. This day have those who reject faith given up all hope of your religion: yet fear them not but fear Me. This day have I perfected your religion for you, completed My favour upon you, and have chosen for you Islam as your religion. But if any is forced by hunger, with no inclination to transgression, Allah is indeed Oft-forgiving, Most Merciful. (5:3)

I think Allah (SWT) has made it quite clear. Please prove me wrong if I'm incorrect.

:w:
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