Israel prepared to attack Iran nuclear plants

[AvarAllahNoor]

Israel is drawing up plans to attack Iran's nuclear facilities and is prepared to launch a strike without backing from the US, it has been reported.

Officials in the Israeli Defence Ministry told the Jerusalem Post that while they prefer to act in consultation with the US, they were preparing plans that would allow them to act in isolation.

"It is always better to coordinate," a senior Defence Ministry official told the newspaper. "But we are also preparing options that do not include coordination."

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/new...cle5284173.ece




What will be the outcome for the rest of the world. if any? Will it be war for Iran and Israeal?

[crayon]

World War III.

Or is that too dramatic?..Hmm..

[islamirama]

This is all leading to WWIII. Russia is arming up quietly, China is arming up quietly, the arab states are buying weapons from US to blow each other up. USIsrael is destroy afghan, iraq and aiming for Iran, Libya, Syria, and Pakistan for the "greater israel" to be built for the coming of thier Messia The Dhajjal. Biden already said with certanity that there will be a Biological attack on US soil in 2013. I sense a rotten egg and another false flag op in the making, not to mention mass dentention camps of Muslims like the japs durin WWII.

[Whatsthepoint]

World War III.

Or is that too dramatic?..Hmm..

War War III will be triggered by assassinations of 4 heads of states and a conflict in Indonesia.

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[islamirama]

War War III will be triggered by assassinations of 4 heads of states and a conflict in Indonesia.

and this is based on?

[Whatsthepoint]

and this is based on?

Based on the prophecies of Baba Vanga.

[islamirama]

Based on the prophecies of Baba Vanga.

Whose baba vanga? sounds sikh...

[Whatsthepoint]

Whose baba vanga? sounds sikh...

A late blind bulgarian lady, said to have prophecies the WW2, the 9/11, the Kursk submarine...

[islamirama]

A late blind bulgarian lady, said to have prophecies the WW2, the 9/11, the Kursk submarine...

Just like nostradamus, yea ok :rollseyes

[AvarAllahNoor]

Whose baba vanga? sounds sikh...

:enough!:

Sikh? no baba vanga in Sikhism! lol

[Whatsthepoint]

Just like nostradamus, yea ok :rollseyes

We shall see ...

Anyway, her prophecies are cool, kinda sci fi:

2008 - Assassination attempts on 4 heads of state. Conflict in India. This would be one of the reasons of World War III.

2010 - The start of World War III. War would begin in November 2010 and end in October 2014. It would begin as usual, then nuclear and chemical weapons would be used.

2011 - As a result of the nuclear fallout the northern hemisphere would be left without any animals or vegetation. Then Muslims would wage war against Europeans with chemical weapons.

2014 - Most people would suffer skin cancer and other skin diseases (as a consequence of chemical warfare).

2016 - Europe would be almost empty.

2018 - New China becomes a world power. Developing countries in turn operated from exploiters.

2020 - All of North America form start to form into the Holy Empire of Britannia.

2023 - A little bit of change in the Earth’s orbit.

2024 - Holy Empire of Britannia starts controlling New Zealand, conquered Japan, and a portion of the Indochina Peninsula

2025 - Europe still little settled.

2028 - Creating a new energy source (probably a controlled thermonuclear reaction). Hunger is gradually being overcome. Launched a manned spacecraft to Venus.

2033 - The polar ice are melting. Greater levels of the oceans.

2043 - The world economy is thriving. In Europe, Muslims rule.

2046 - any bodies (organs) can be manufactured (cloning?). Replacing the bodies is becoming one of the best methods of treatment.

2066 - During the attack on the Muslim Rome, the United States used a new kind of weapon - the climate. The sharp cooling (instant freezing).

2076 - Classless Society (communism).

2084 - The restoration of nature.

2088 - A new disease - aging in a few seconds!

2090 - Aeolia Schenberg describes a potential solution to the global fuel crisis — the theoretical basis of the combined orbital elevator and photovoltaic energy system, the construction and defense of which he foresaw to employ humanoid machines not unlike mobile suits.

2097 - The rapid aging defeated.

2100 - Artificial sun illuminates the dark side of the Earth.

2111 - People become living robots.

2123 - The war between small nations. Big nations do not intervene.

2125 - Hungary will receive signals from space.

2130 - Colony under water (with the help of sympathetic councils).

2164 - Animals turn half-human.

2167 - A new religion.

2170 - Major drought.

2183 - A colony on Mars becomes a nuclear power, and demands independence from the Earth (like when - the United States from England).

2187 - Will stop 2 large eruption of volcanoes.

2195 - Sea Colony fully developed, abundant energy and food.

2196 - Complete mixing of Asians and Europeans.

2201 - At the Sun slowing thermonuclear processes. Temperature drops.

2221 - In the search for extraterrestrial life, humanity comes into contact with what - something terrible.

2256 - Spacecraft forgotten to Earth terrible new disease.

2262 - Planets gradually changing planetary orbit. Mars is threatened by comets.

2271 - Restart physical constants are changed. (Laws of physics changed?)

2273 - Mixing yellow, white and black races. New race.

2279 - Power from nothing (probably from a vacuum or a black hole).

2288 - Travel back in time (Time Travel invented?). New contacts with aliens.

2291 - The sun cools. Attempts were being made to light it again.

2296 - Powerful eruption on the Sun. Changing the force of gravity. Beginning to fall old space stations and satellites.

2299 - In France, guerrilla movement against Islam.

2302 - New important laws and secrets of the universe revealed.

2304 - Secrets of the Moon revealed.

2307 - As a result of the depletion of fossil fuels, humanity had to search for a new source of power. The power was found in the form of massive arrays of solar power collectors orbiting the Earth, and supported by three orbital elevators, each one serving one of the three "power blocs" on the planet. With this nearly inexhaustible source of energy benefiting only the major powers and their allies, constant warfare erupts around the globe among minor countries for fuels and energy. Countries that once economically relied on fossil fuels have plunged into poverty.

2308 - The formation of a private military organization, called Celestial Being, dedicated to eradicating war and uniting humanity through the use of four humanoid machines called Gundams.

2341 - Something terrible is approaching Earth from space.

2354 - An accident in one of the artificial Sun leads to drought.

2371 - The great famine.

2378 - A new fast-growing race. Voyager returns to Earth.

2480 - 2 artificial Suns collide. Land in the twilight.

3005 -The war on Mars. Violated the trajectory of the planet.

3010 - Comet hits Moon. Around the Earth - ring/zone of the stones and dust.

3797 - By this time on Earth killed all life, but mankind will be able to lay the foundations for a new life in another stellar system.

3803 - A new planet is populated by little. Fewer contacts between people. Climate new planet affects the organisms of people - they mutate.

3805 - The war between humans for resources. More than half of people dying out.

3815 - The war is over.

3854 - The development of civilization virtually stops. People live flocks as beasts.

3871 - New prophet tells people about moral values, religion.

3874 - New prophet receives support from all segments of the population. Organized a new church.

3878 - along with the Church to re-train new people forgotten sciences.

4302 - New cities are growing in the world. New Church encourages the development of new technology and science.

4302 - The development of science. Scientists discovered in the overall impact of all diseases in organism behavior.

4304 - Found a way to win any disease.

4308 - Due to mutation people at last beginning to use their brains more than 34%. Completely lost the notion of evil and hatred.

4509 - Getting to Know God. The man has finally been reached such a level of development that can communicate with God.

4599 - People achieve immortality.

4674 - The development of civilization has reached its peak. The number of people living on different planets is about 340 billion. Assimilation begins with aliens.

5076 - A boundary universe. With it, no one knows.

5078 - The decision to leave the boundaries of the universe. While about 40 percent of the population is against it.

5079 - End of the World.



I know this is off topic, but I think yet another Israel Iran thread is worth sacrificing.

[islamirama]

Sounds like she's been watching too much sci-fi and anime. This looks like a cut and paste from Code Geass, Chakats, Ghost in the Shell and a few others.

Thanks for the entertaining stories.

[Whatsthepoint]

Sounds like she's been watching too much sci-fi and anime. This looks like a cut and paste from Code Geass, Chakats, Ghost in the Shell and a few others.

Thanks for the entertaining stories.

She was a poor bulgarian lady who lost her eyesight before television was invented..

[mystifyed]

is she still alive ??

[Whatsthepoint]

is she still alive ??

She died in 1996.

Thats her

[mystifyed]

and she told all tht mentioned above before dieing

[Whatsthepoint]

and she told all tht mentioned above before dieing

No idea.

[Muezzin]

You reckon Baba Vanga foresaw this thread potentially getting closed for going off-topic?

[Whatsthepoint]

You reckon Baba Vanga foresaw this thread potentially getting closed for going off-topic?

haha
Well, there have been so many IL threads and most have strolled away from the main point.
You can give 2 pages to Baba.

[aamirsaab]

:sl:
Iran: we will wipe israel off the map
Israel: No, we will wipe YOU off the map!

If either party started an actual war with the other, they'd both be wiped off the map!

[MARTYR]

Israel prepared to attack Iran nuclear plants -


Salaams

If this is true, then we all lose,
there will be no winners.

[Woodrow]

Will it happen? In time, when it is supposed to happen it will.

This is simply the most dramatic example of man's stupidity and arrogance. Nuclear weapons and the thought of nuclear power is the fulfillment of man's desire to be godlike. As a species we just may be the most stupid of creatures to inhabit the earth. Either stupid or arrogant.

All is unfolding as it has been planned to unfold. The question is not what we do as a species, but what we each do as an individual.

We can not fall into the temptation of trying to pass our own sins off as a condition of the times. Now is the time for all to strive for the highest of eeman and know that we each are responsible for our own actions and we can not let ourselves get overcome by the actions of the idiots that have risen to power worldwide.

Only Allaah(swt) needs to be feared and only He needs to be obeyed. It is a temptation of the Shaytan to cast our souls at the mercy of human leaders. Obey, Allaah(swt) in all things and stop worrying about the actions of the Shaytan that think they rule the countries.

When I look at the actions of ALL of our current world leaders, all I can think is this is no different then the arrogance shown by Iblis. When man thinks he can rule the world, we need to remind ourselves that we can not become like such a man.

Be true to Allaah(swt) and do not fear the actions of Shaytan that walk and talk like humans.

[IbnAbdulHakim]

^ nice post uncle


theres so much i would like to say, but very inappropriate for forums.

[Keltoi]

Obviously Israel is talking about an air campaign. The issue is that they will have to use American controlled airspace to launch any such campaign. Obama will probably be president at that point, so unless he gives the nod there will be no green light for Israeli aircraft to cross that airspace. I doubt whether Obama would order American aircraft to intercept, but it would definitely cause a diplomatic crisis if Israeli ignores American airspace.

[Amadeus85]

I have heard statement that Obama became president because under his reigns it would be easier for USA to attack Iran if it attacks Israel.

[Wilma_Hum]

I have heard statement that Obama became president because under his reigns it would be easier for USA to attack Iran if it attacks Israel.

Do you think there is validity to the statement?

How is such a statement logical?

In the untold hours of convention coverage I witched I never seen or heard about such a thing.

How can such a well kept secret have an impact?

Just asking.

[Keltoi]

Do you think there is validity to the statement?

How is such a statement logical?

In the untold hours of convention coverage I witched I never seen or heard about such a thing.

How can such a well kept secret have an impact?

Just asking.

I assume he means that Bush's popularity was so low he could hardly expect congressional support for any attack on Iran. With Obama, who has alot of political capital, such a request would fly through the legislative branch.

[Wilma_Hum]

I assume he means that Bush's popularity was so low he could hardly expect congressional support for any attack on Iran. With Obama, who has alot of political capital, such a request would fly through the legislative branch.

Do you really think your assumptions cover "Obama became president because"?

[Keltoi]

Do you really think your assumptions cover "Obama became president because"?

I'm not sure what he meant by that in particular, but I'm sure he will clear it up when he posts again.

[Amadeus85]

I assume he means that Bush's popularity was so low he could hardly expect congressional support for any attack on Iran. With Obama, who has alot of political capital, such a request would fly through the legislative branch.

Thats one side. Of course Keltoi is right here. But on the other side the coming war would probably devastate the image and popularity of Obama. These two things might be connected.
It's not based on any facts btw. Just rumours that I heard from college friend who heard from his friend who heard from his friend....

[Chuck]

I think some of the stuff she saw in dreams and rest came from her imagination.

We shall see ...

Anyway, her prophecies are cool, kinda sci fi:

2008 - Assassination attempts on 4 heads of state. Conflict in India. This would be one of the reasons of World War III.

2010 - The start of World War III. War would begin in November 2010 and end in October 2014. It would begin as usual, then nuclear and chemical weapons would be used.

2011 - As a result of the nuclear fallout the northern hemisphere would be left without any animals or vegetation. Then Muslims would wage war against Europeans with chemical weapons.

2014 - Most people would suffer skin cancer and other skin diseases (as a consequence of chemical warfare).

2016 - Europe would be almost empty.

2018 - New China becomes a world power. Developing countries in turn operated from exploiters.

2020 - All of North America form start to form into the Holy Empire of Britannia.

2023 - A little bit of change in the Earth’s orbit.

2024 - Holy Empire of Britannia starts controlling New Zealand, conquered Japan, and a portion of the Indochina Peninsula

2025 - Europe still little settled.

2028 - Creating a new energy source (probably a controlled thermonuclear reaction). Hunger is gradually being overcome. Launched a manned spacecraft to Venus.

2033 - The polar ice are melting. Greater levels of the oceans.

2043 - The world economy is thriving. In Europe, Muslims rule.

2046 - any bodies (organs) can be manufactured (cloning?). Replacing the bodies is becoming one of the best methods of treatment.

2066 - During the attack on the Muslim Rome, the United States used a new kind of weapon - the climate. The sharp cooling (instant freezing).

2076 - Classless Society (communism).

2084 - The restoration of nature.

2088 - A new disease - aging in a few seconds!

2090 - Aeolia Schenberg describes a potential solution to the global fuel crisis — the theoretical basis of the combined orbital elevator and photovoltaic energy system, the construction and defense of which he foresaw to employ humanoid machines not unlike mobile suits.

2097 - The rapid aging defeated.

2100 - Artificial sun illuminates the dark side of the Earth.

2111 - People become living robots.

2123 - The war between small nations. Big nations do not intervene.

2125 - Hungary will receive signals from space.

2130 - Colony under water (with the help of sympathetic councils).

2164 - Animals turn half-human.

2167 - A new religion.

2170 - Major drought.

2183 - A colony on Mars becomes a nuclear power, and demands independence from the Earth (like when - the United States from England).

2187 - Will stop 2 large eruption of volcanoes.

2195 - Sea Colony fully developed, abundant energy and food.

2196 - Complete mixing of Asians and Europeans.

2201 - At the Sun slowing thermonuclear processes. Temperature drops.

2221 - In the search for extraterrestrial life, humanity comes into contact with what - something terrible.

2256 - Spacecraft forgotten to Earth terrible new disease.

2262 - Planets gradually changing planetary orbit. Mars is threatened by comets.

2271 - Restart physical constants are changed. (Laws of physics changed?)

2273 - Mixing yellow, white and black races. New race.

2279 - Power from nothing (probably from a vacuum or a black hole).

2288 - Travel back in time (Time Travel invented?). New contacts with aliens.

2291 - The sun cools. Attempts were being made to light it again.

2296 - Powerful eruption on the Sun. Changing the force of gravity. Beginning to fall old space stations and satellites.

2299 - In France, guerrilla movement against Islam.

2302 - New important laws and secrets of the universe revealed.

2304 - Secrets of the Moon revealed.

2307 - As a result of the depletion of fossil fuels, humanity had to search for a new source of power. The power was found in the form of massive arrays of solar power collectors orbiting the Earth, and supported by three orbital elevators, each one serving one of the three "power blocs" on the planet. With this nearly inexhaustible source of energy benefiting only the major powers and their allies, constant warfare erupts around the globe among minor countries for fuels and energy. Countries that once economically relied on fossil fuels have plunged into poverty.

2308 - The formation of a private military organization, called Celestial Being, dedicated to eradicating war and uniting humanity through the use of four humanoid machines called Gundams.

2341 - Something terrible is approaching Earth from space.

2354 - An accident in one of the artificial Sun leads to drought.

2371 - The great famine.

2378 - A new fast-growing race. Voyager returns to Earth.

2480 - 2 artificial Suns collide. Land in the twilight.

3005 -The war on Mars. Violated the trajectory of the planet.

3010 - Comet hits Moon. Around the Earth - ring/zone of the stones and dust.

3797 - By this time on Earth killed all life, but mankind will be able to lay the foundations for a new life in another stellar system.

3803 - A new planet is populated by little. Fewer contacts between people. Climate new planet affects the organisms of people - they mutate.

3805 - The war between humans for resources. More than half of people dying out.

3815 - The war is over.

3854 - The development of civilization virtually stops. People live flocks as beasts.

3871 - New prophet tells people about moral values, religion.

3874 - New prophet receives support from all segments of the population. Organized a new church.

3878 - along with the Church to re-train new people forgotten sciences.

4302 - New cities are growing in the world. New Church encourages the development of new technology and science.

4302 - The development of science. Scientists discovered in the overall impact of all diseases in organism behavior.

4304 - Found a way to win any disease.

4308 - Due to mutation people at last beginning to use their brains more than 34%. Completely lost the notion of evil and hatred.

4509 - Getting to Know God. The man has finally been reached such a level of development that can communicate with God.

4599 - People achieve immortality.

4674 - The development of civilization has reached its peak. The number of people living on different planets is about 340 billion. Assimilation begins with aliens.

5076 - A boundary universe. With it, no one knows.

5078 - The decision to leave the boundaries of the universe. While about 40 percent of the population is against it.

5079 - End of the World.



I know this is off topic, but I think yet another Israel Iran thread is worth sacrificing.

[جوري]

Good thing the Iranian president had the good sense to build his nuclear facilities near Jewish residence there are thousands of Jews in iran.. If Israel attacks they will attack their own.. it would be hilarious...
but then again, perhaps that will in fact be the reason of their mass exodus out of Iran to follow the anti-Christ as is predicted.. who knows..

:w:

[mohsen1985]

:sl:

As an Iranian, I think I should say a few (patriotic) words :D

Iran has been under pressure ever since the Islamic revolution, almost 30 years now. And all this pressure comes from the USA. Always threatening, always imposing embargos, spending millions upon millions for false advertising against Iran. Okay? So what's been achieved so far?

In the Iran-Iraq war, wasn't the whole world supporting Iraq? How did that end up? Where's saddam, where are we? Iran fought for 8 years, for a new government that's just come to power, that's not an easy thing.

Now israel? heh. They won't start a war that they've already lost, because I'll slap them back to the stone age! (J/P)

But seriously, Iran is fully armed and ready to take on isreal, they'll be wiped off the map before their fighter jets even reach the borders of Iran. It's not 25 years ago anymore, Iran has very advanced military technology, and purchases more advanced weapons etc from Russia.

...

One last thing, as I recall they said they'd wipe off hizbollah in less than a week? And they ended up losing? Jeez, how do they want to take on someone 1000x stronger than hizbollah? :ermm:

[mohsen1985]

Good thing the Iranian president had the good sense to build his nuclear facilities near Jewish residence there are thousands of Jews in iran.. If Israel attacks they will attack their own.. it would be hilarious...
but then again, perhaps that will in fact be the reason of their mass exodus out of Iran to follow the anti-Christ as is predicted.. who knows..

:w:

Sis, where did you hear that? The Iranian Jews aren't all concentrated in one lil area. They live all over the country. I have lots of Jewish neighbors, classmates, friends, ...

P.S israelis are not Jewish, even the Jewish people say so themselves.

[AntiKarateKid]

:sl:

As an Iranian, I think I should say a few (patriotic) words :D

Iran has been under pressure ever since the Islamic revolution, almost 30 years now. And all this pressure comes from the USA. Always threatening, always imposing embargos, spending millions upon millions for false advertising against Iran. Okay? So what's been achieved so far?

In the Iran-Iraq war, wasn't the whole world supporting Iraq? How did that end up? Where's saddam, where are we? Iran fought for 8 years, for a new government that's just come to power, that's not an easy thing.

Now israel? heh. They won't start a war that they've already lost, because I'll slap them back to the stone age! (J/P)

But seriously, Iran is fully armed and ready to take on isreal, they'll be wiped off the map before their fighter jets even reach the borders of Iran. It's not 25 years ago anymore, Iran has very advanced military technology, and purchases more advanced weapons etc from Russia.

...

One last thing, as I recall they said they'd wipe off hizbollah in less than a week? And they ended up losing? Jeez, how do they want to take on someone 1000x stronger than hizbollah? :ermm:

:thumbs_up
As an American Pakistani, I would gladly help in your war effort against those Zionazis.

( Just give us a little backing if the hindus in india get too bold :-[)

[جوري]

Sis, where did you hear that? The Iranian Jews aren't all concentrated in one lil area. They live all over the country. I have lots of Jewish neighbors, classmates, friends, ...

P.S israelis are not Jewish, even the Jewish people say so themselves.

:sl:
I read it on sultan.org sometime ago
I thought his plants were mostly in Isfahan?

p.s: this is a sincere question: I find most if not all Iranians I have come across that travel outside to western countries be very unreligious-- is this the case too inside Iran?

:w:

[mohsen1985]

I don't know how accurate that map is. And I can see how they would make the connection to Jews. There's this stereotype of people in Isfahan being greedy, and the stereotype on Jews being greedy...Weird connection, but it's not true. They're not built near Jewish areas (such a thing doesn't even exists, the live among other people)

Unfortunately that's true imsad I saw many of the women take off their hijab and put on other clothing just as the airplane left the borders:cry:

Inside Iran there is a "dress code". Women must have hijab when they're outside. But there are those people who don't listen and resist. There's also many non-Muslims living here, so can't expect them to wear their hijab properly. Same applies to the Iranians you see in the western countries, they're not all Muslims. It's a big mixture of Muslims, Christians, Jews, Zoroasters, and many more. But like any other country, it has its good Muslims and the Muslims-just-in-names.

[جوري]

Interesting thanks..
sadly the ones who are irreligious are supposedly Muslim.. and they speak often of being occupied by Muslims... which is rather strange.. for instance Egypt has had a long pharpnic history before Islam and yet they were happy to embrace it.. I don't find that the case with Iranians at all.. also many of them can't give up their pre-Islamic celebrations, but I suppose that is true of many cultures anyway...
You are right about every country has its good and bad.. I knew two amazing Iranians one a physicist and the other in med school unfortunately both overshadowed by all the other Iranians I have met...

:w:

[mohsen1985]

It's confusing for many. 99% of them aren't Muslims at all. They left Iran and are living in the western countries just so they don't have to be under Islamic rule.

The mosques are always filled up at prayer times, people help each other out, give to charity, a lot of them wear proper hijab, there's lots of good Muslims. There's also some corrupted people, and many paid spies to try and corrupt others. I can't explain it well, you have to be here and see it for yourself.

Now, just so that we don't go off topic, I'm going to load up my sling-shot to prepare for israel's attack.

[جوري]

:sl:
Maybe you can make a thread about Iran.. I have genuine interest to visit and learn more about it.. also if you can load some photos would be really great insha'Allah-- I have questions about the shah and his three wives and children etc

Jazaka Allah khyran

:w:

[Whatsthepoint]

Interesting thanks..
sadly the ones who are irreligious are supposedly Muslim.. and they speak often of being occupied by Muslims... which is rather strange.. for instance Egypt has had a long pharpnic history before Islam and yet they were happy to embrace it.. I don't find that the case with Iranians at all.. also many of them can't give up their pre-Islamic celebrations, but I suppose that is true of many cultures anyway...
You are right about every country has its good and bad.. I knew two amazing Iranians one a physicist and the other in med school unfortunately both overshadowed by all the other Iranians I have met...

:w:

In fact, Egypt was fully Christian before the Muslims invasion. All pharaonic tarditions were gone by that time, I think the hieroglyphics were banned because of their pagan origin.

[Whatsthepoint]

Now israel? heh. They won't start a war that they've already lost, because I'll slap them back to the stone age! (J/P)
But seriously, Iran is fully armed and ready to take on isreal, they'll be wiped off the map before their fighter jets even reach the borders of Iran. It's not 25 years ago anymore, Iran has very advanced military technology, and purchases more advanced weapons etc from Russia.
One last thing, as I recall they said they'd wipe off hizbollah in less than a week? And they ended up losing? Jeez, how do they want to take on someone 1000x stronger than hizbollah? :ermm:

Israel is stronger in terms of military power and has stronger and more willing allies, no 1 being the US with plenty of bases nearby.
No Iranian leader will be foolish enough to launch a preemptive strike on Israel.
I don't think Israel will ever attack Iran either.

[جوري]

In fact, Egypt was fully Christian before the Muslims invasion. All pharaonic tarditions were gone by that time, I think the hieroglyphics were banned because of their pagan origin.

Hieroglyphics are not banned.. I have a cousin who is well studied in hieroglyphics as well my own dad...

Egypt didn't see Monotheism as an invasion or negative change and I believe it goes back to the time of Moses and the pharoh.. as well some Pharaohs in Egypt were already monotheists like akhnaton..

peace

[جوري]

Israel is stronger in terms of military power and has stronger and more willing allies, no 1 being the US with plenty of bases nearby.
No Iranian leader will be foolish enough to launch a preemptive strike on Israel.
I don't think Israel will ever attack Iran either.

The interesting thing about Israel is it might have all that heavy artillery but it isn't strategically placed -- sort of like when you have an excellent restaurant and grade A chefs cooking the best meals.. but the neighborhood is dangerous-- no one will want to risk it to eat there...

Anything that they do even by way of nuclear war will annihilate its neighbors its true but will cascade right back to them!

[Whatsthepoint]

Hieroglyphics are not banned.. I have a cousin who is well studied in hieroglyphics as well my own dad...

Egypt didn't see Monotheism as an invasion or negative change and I believe it goes back to the time of Moses and the pharoh.. as well some Pharaohs in Egypt were already monotheists like akhnaton..

peace

I said they were banned.
Well, Arabs invaded and took over the land, I call that invasion. Its a whole different thing if the people like what the invaders brought.
egypt was monotheistic prior to the invasion, though I guess Christianity doesn't fit into your definition of monotheism.

[Whatsthepoint]

The interesting thing about Israel is it might have all that heavy artillery but it isn't strategically placed -- sort of like when you have an excellent restaurant and grade A chefs cooking the best meals.. but the neighborhood is dangerous-- no one will want to risk it to eat there...

Anything that they do even by way of nuclear war will annihilate its neighbors its true but will cascade right back to them!

You're right, the placing sucks though not as much as it may seem. I believe most of the neigboring countries would choose not to interfere, Egypt with its puppet government, Jordan with its peaceful king, I don't know about Lebanon and Syria, the latter would most probably go against Israel.
I don't understand the final sentence.

[جوري]

Egypt saw them as liberators not invaders-- you are right, if people don't like it, they will leave it behind.. considering Egypt had a long history of wars and tyrant Pharaohs--

and you are right, Christianity as we know it today doesn't fit the definition of monotheism-- but I have no doubt that at some point it was.. Egypt was one of the first places of Christianity I believe Jesus PBUH visited it as well when he returns he'll lead the people to a mount there (whose name now escapes me) away from Gog and Magog..

[Whatsthepoint]

Egypt saw them as liberators not invaders

How do you know that?

[جوري]

You're right, the placing sucks though not as much as it may seem. I believe most of the neigboring countries would choose not to interfere, Egypt with its puppet government, Jordan with its peaceful king, I don't know about Lebanon and Syria, the latter would most probably go against Israel.
I don't understand the final sentence.

The sentiment of the people is different of their dictators -- when/if war erupts and it is full scale you'll see the people of Egypt coming out.. in fact there is a hadith to that extent I wish someone would locate for me...
where Prophet Mohammed PBUH stated.. that when entering Egypt to pick of its soldiery for its inhabitants are in committed with war to the day of recompense!


and Allah swt knows best

[alcurad]

whatsthepoint, the Arabs were helped by the Copts during the invasion, and the it was the Byzantines being kicked out of Egypt, which was how many miles from Constantinople again?
the Egyptians accepted the Arabs, and the religion that came with them, mostly because of the repression they were undergoing from their christian 'brethren',what's your point?

[جوري]

How do you know that?

because they are my ancestors and all who chose to embrace Islam 90% of Egypt see it that way, else they would have remained copts-- prophet Mohammed PBUH also said to be gentle of the Copts of Egypt -- for the most part Egyptian Copts and Muslims have a great relationship --outside the fold of what goes in the media now a days and the human devils working to incite civil wars... yes there are evil copts and Muslims alike but mostly it is peaceful-- again if you ask how I know.. because I have lived there and I have see it :)

peace

[mohsen1985]

Israel is stronger in terms of military power and has stronger and more willing allies, no 1 being the US with plenty of bases nearby.
No Iranian leader will be foolish enough to launch a preemptive strike on Israel.
I don't think Israel will ever attack Iran either.

israel won't dare attack Iran. Like I said before, Iran fought half the world before empty handed, if war was to come, israel will be sorry for starting it.

[Whatsthepoint]

because they are my ancestors and all who chose to embrace Islam 90% of Egypt see it that way, else they would have remained copts-- prophet Mohammed PBUH also said to be gentle of the Copts of Egypt -- for the most part Egyptian Copts and Muslims have a great relationship --outside the fold of what goes in the media now a days and the human devils working to incite civil wars... yes there are evil copts and Muslims alike but mostly it is peaceful-- again if you ask how I know.. because I have lived there and I have see it :)

peace

Now you didn't live there in the 7th century, did you.
The fact that 90% of the population became Muslim in time doesn't mean that the people saw Arabs as liberators.

[Whatsthepoint]

israel won't dare attack Iran. Like I said before, Iran fought half the world before empty handed, if war was to come, israel will be sorry for starting it.

If either of them starts it, they will be sorry for it and so will the rest of the world. Why can't you and your just levae each other alone?

[جوري]

Now you didn't live there in the 7th century, did you.
The fact that 90% of the population became Muslim in time doesn't mean that the people saw Arabs as liberators.

Egypt had pre-Islamic wars galore and never came under the Influence of Greeks or Romans or whomever else.. the fact that they assimilated fully under Islam is its own testament to how well received as well that is what History books record.. it was very peaceful massive conversion.. and hence my original question about Iran.. whereas Most Egyptians see Islam as a blessing and have totally given up their previous pagan practices.. Iran can't seem to get over it is Persian pride..

peace

[alcurad]

in fact there is a hadith to that extent

أبو يعلى في مسنده (3/رقم1473) وعنه ابن حبان في صحيحه (15/رقم6677) وابن عبد الحكم في فتوح مصر (ص53) من طرق عن أبي هانئ الخولاني عن أبي عبد الرحمن الحبلي وعمرو بن حريث وغيرهما أن رسول الله -صلى الله عليه وسلم- قال: "إنكم ستقدمون على قوم جُعد رؤوسهم، فاستوصوا بهم خيرا، فإنهم قوة لكم، وبلاغ إلى عدوكم بإذن الله عز وجل -يعني قبط مصر-.
وسنده صحيح على شرط مسلم.

[mohsen1985]

If either of them starts it, they will be sorry for it and so will the rest of the world. Why can't you and your just levae each other alone?

They planned to attack our nuclear plants! They started it.

One more thing!!!!!!!!

Why won't they get rid of their nuclear weapons? What's a greater threat to the world? 1 - A country WITH nuclear weapons, already at war with a bunch of defenseless people, killing and bombing them or 2 - A country that is trying to build nuclear PLANTS purely for the purpose of producing electricity?

Do you know why the USA is terrified of Iran having nuclear plants?

Because with them, they burn less fossil fuels for energy! That way they have more oil and gas to play the world market. That's what they don't want! They couldn't care less if Iran had nuclear weapons, they know they'll never use them. They also know Iran can simply purchase any amount of nuclear weapons it wants from Russia, or any other country for that matter!

[جوري]

أبو يعلى في مسنده (3/رقم1473) وعنه ابن حبان في صحيحه (15/رقم6677) وابن عبد الحكم في فتوح مصر (ص53) من طرق عن أبي هانئ الخولاني عن أبي عبد الرحمن الحبلي وعمرو بن حريث وغيرهما أن رسول الله -صلى الله عليه وسلم- قال: "إنكم ستقدمون على قوم جُعد رؤوسهم، فاستوصوا بهم خيرا، فإنهم قوة لكم، وبلاغ إلى عدوكم بإذن الله عز وجل -يعني قبط مصر-.
وسنده صحيح على شرط مسلم.

Excellent Jazaka Allah.. can you find the other one too? I am not well navigated with Hadith as I am with the Quran..

the one about taking jund katheer from Egypt as they are fi jihad ila youm ad'deen :D

:w:

[alcurad]

عن عمر بن العاص حدثني عمر أنه سمع رسول الله صلى الله عليه وسلم يقول إذا فتح الله عليكم مصر بعدي فاتخذوا فيها جندا كثيفا فذلك الجند خير أجناد الأرض قال أبو بكر ولم ذاك يا رسول الله قال إنهم في رباط إلى يوم القيامة
but some scholars say it's its weak, not sure though.

as it were, the Israelis probably won't attack, it would be too costly. it's mostly propaganda me thinks.

[Whatsthepoint]

Egypt had pre-Islamic wars galore and never came under the Influence of Greeks or Romans or whomever else.. the fact that they assimilated fully under Islam is its own testament to how well received as well that is what History books record.. it was very peaceful massive conversion.. and hence my original question about Iran.. whereas Most Egyptians see Islam as a blessing and have totally given up their previous pagan practices.. Iran can't seem to get over it is Persian pride..

peace

Egyptians fully assimilated into at least 3 different cultures, Greek, Christian and Islamic.
Well, what I said in my first post is that they didn't have any pagan practices to give up, seeing how Egypt was aChristian land back then. That is unless you consider Christianity to be a pagan religion.

[Whatsthepoint]

They planned to attack our nuclear plants! They started it.

One more thing!!!!!!!!

Why won't they get rid of their nuclear weapons? What's a greater threat to the world? 1 - A country WITH nuclear weapons, already at war with a bunch of defenseless people, killing and bombing them or 2 - A country that is trying to build nuclear PLANTS purely for the purpose of producing electricity?

Do you know why the USA is terrified of Iran having nuclear plants?

Because with them, they burn less fossil fuels for energy! That way they have more oil and gas to play the world market. That's what they don't want! They couldn't care less if Iran had nuclear weapons, they know they'll never use them. They also know Iran can simply purchase any amount of nuclear weapons it wants from Russia, or any other country for that matter!

Nuclear weapons.. Its ok when US allies have them and bad when anyone else has them.. Its the way it is and will be for a significant number of years until the US ceases to be a world superpower.
I'm all pro you guys building a reactor or whatever it is your building.

[mohsen1985]

Nuclear weapons.. Its ok when US allies have them and bad when anyone else has them.. Its the way it is and will be for a significant number of years until the US ceases to be a world superpower.
I'm all pro you guys building a reactor or whatever it is your building.

Allies? They won't be allies forever :) Wasn't saddam an ally?

[جوري]

Egyptians fully assimilated into at least 3 different cultures, Greek, Christian and Islamic.
Well, what I said in my first post is that they didn't have any pagan practices to give up, seeing how Egypt was aChristian land back then. That is unless you consider Christianity to be a pagan religion.

Perhaps you should indeed pay old Egypt a Visit before making a conclusion of the assimilation... I do indeed consider Christianity to be a largely Pagan religion..

peace

[alcurad]

Pakistan was an ally too, only now they are moving more aggressively to take it out-think more Mumbay like attacks and drone strikes inside Pak territory escalating to what.

[Whatsthepoint]

Allies? They won't be allies forever :) Wasn't saddam an ally?

I think Saddam was a different category of ally than Israel, kinda like Georgia wasn't enough of an ally for the US to risk weakening ties with Russia.
Israel can never afford to break up with America.

[alcurad]

the lobby figures much in the special relationship status though, and the US never has permanent military alliances, except with Canada maybe.

[Whatsthepoint]

Perhaps you should indeed pay old Egypt a Visit before making a conclusion of the assimilation... I do indeed consider Christianity to be a largely Pagan religion..

peace

Did you visit Egypt in the 5th century to know how well the assimilated under Christianity?
And where exactly did I make any conclusions as to how well they are assimilated?

[Whatsthepoint]

the lobby figures much in the special relationship status though, and the US never has permanent military alliances, except with Canada maybe.

Sure, Jews are powerful in the US, presidential candidates have to wow their support of Israel, otherwise they lose every chance of being elected.
And its also the evangelicals. Most Zionists aren't even Jewish.

[Amadeus85]

I have never understood what is Iran's motive of such great hatred toward Israel. They have never had war with jews, iranian people are in large part well educated and open minded, of course with fanaticly anti western goverment (situation just contrary to arab countries). There are no shias in Gaze and West Bank, the islamic world sponsor Saudi Arabia is Iran's rival. Is it really such great dislike among average Persians to Israelis, or its just some way to get aplaud from the world sunni majority.

[جوري]

Did you visit Egypt in the 5th century to know how well the assimilated under Christianity?
And where exactly did I make any conclusions as to how well they are assimilated?

History books as well as the affect of the people best describes that... hence when I spoke of Iranians not fully accepting of Islam as the Egyptians-- simply the affect from century to century is the same for Iranians as well the same for Egyptians..

How people feel is carried on from generation to generation which you are obviously free to reject or accept --

I have no doubt that there were some pious Christians like Lucian viz Arius (250-336 A.D.) He was a Libyan by birth who accepted proper Christianity over lieutenant Athanasius/ as well Paulian type Christianity as we know it today-- and if such were the case indeed the natural order would be to embrace Islam!

peace

[جوري]

Sure, Jews are powerful in the US, presidential candidates have to wow their support of Israel, otherwise they lose every chance of being elected.
And its also the evangelicals. Most Zionists aren't even Jewish.

So they will indeed have you believe-- but I assure you it wasn't the Jews that put Obama in office this year.. I have seen Muslims vote in droves who otherwise wouldn't have voted at all .. ( I don't particularly care for this candidate) but the sentiment of Israel and the Jews in general if you were watching the election, their strong support for Mcain.. what can I say I guess we are seeing a shift!


peace

[Whatsthepoint]

So they will indeed have you believe-- but I assure you it wasn't the Jews that put Obama in office this year.. I have seen Muslims vote in droves who otherwise wouldn't have voted at all .. ( I don't particularly care for this candidate) but the sentiment of Israel and the Jews in general if you were watching the election, their strong support for Mcain.. what can I say I guess we are seeing a shift!


peace

Jews tend to vote democrat. I don't know for the top lobbying Jews though. From what I've read both candidates as well as the future secretary of state wowed their strong support for Israel several times. I remember Obama saying Jerusalem is to be the undivided capital of Israel, which took me by surprise, honestly.
Obama did address the Palestinian issue, commenting on their suffering. Hopefully form of peace will be achieved during his presidency.

[جوري]

Jews tend to vote democrat. I don't know for the top lobbying Jews though. From what I've read both candidates as well as the future secretary of state wowed their strong support for Israel several times. I remember Obama saying Jerusalem is to be the undivided capital of Israel, which took me by surprise, honestly.
Obama did address the Palestinian issue, commenting on their suffering. Hopefully form of peace will be achieved during his presidency.

I have no doubt that every candidate will parrot undying loyalty for Israel vowing to protect her from 'islamists/jihadists/extremists/fundamentalist' etc etc.. but it is a true fact that Israeli was to Mcain, and their disappointment quite visible after Obama's win was all over CNN.. which ever is the case it wouldn't matter who is in office anyway because ultimately their goals and style are the same.... be that as it may, it is a true fact, that it wasn't Jews who put him into office.. and I think as the yrs go by we'll see a shift in attitudes and politics..

It is my hope that America will concentrate on its own affairs and troubles for a change, but I am pretty sure that won't happen.. both those countries have a lot of biblical nonsense vested in each other...

if the colonial state isn't established then a republican Jesus couldn't descend down on his silver cloud for the 'rapture' -- and well they see that since God didn't have an active hand in assembling them back to their 'promised land' that they would go ahead and do it anyway including excavate beneath al-aqsa so it would collapse and they would conveniently build their third temple and that way their' Moschiach' will have it all set once he's unleashed upon the world..

peace and good night

[Whatsthepoint]

I have no doubt that every candidate will parrot undying loyalty for Israel vowing to protect her from 'islamists/jihadists/extremists/fundamentalist' etc etc.. but it is a true fact that Israeli was to Mcain, and their disappointment quite visible after Obama's win was all over CNN.. which ever is the case it wouldn't matter who is in office anyway because ultimately their goals and style are the same.... be that as it may, it is a true fact, that it wasn't Jews who put him into office.. and I think as the yrs go by we'll see a shift in attitudes and politics..

It is my hope that America will concentrate on its own affairs and troubles for a change, but I am pretty sure that won't happen.. both those countries have a lot of biblical nonsense vested in each other...

if the colonial state isn't established then a republican Jesus couldn't descend down on his silver cloud for the 'rapture' -- and well they see that since God didn't have an active hand in assembling them back to their 'promised land' that they would go ahead and do it anyway including excavate beneath al-aqsa so it would collapse and they would conveniently build their third temple and that way their' Moschiach' will have it all set once he's unleashed upon the world..

peace and good night

You do know that the Herzl was an atheist?

[Woodrow]

I think Saddam was a different category of ally than Israel, kinda like Georgia wasn't enough of an ally for the US to risk weakening ties with Russia.
Israel can never afford to break up with America.

To repeat and reiterate:

Israel can never afford to break up with America.

But, can we afford to not break up with Israel?

Israel is a very expensive step child and quite demanding. We need to re-evaluate if we are defending a helpless friend or if we are enabling a spoiled brat, that should have been kicked out of the fold in it's teen years.

[جوري]

I think the majority of Jews now are atheist according to a new study I have read.... very few are observant moral Jews.. but only God knows best of their true condition..

Anyhow I truly have no problems with Jews.. I just dislike the Zionist state of Israel-- I believe righteous Jews and righteous Christians will follow Jesus PBUH when he descends unto the correct path...

for now things are the way they are and will continue to be until such a time God sees this world fit for some peace

ok now I really must sign off
gnight

[جوري]

To repeat and reiterate:

Israel can never afford to break up with America.

But, can we afford to not break up with Israel?

Israel is a very expensive step child and quite demanding. We need to re-evaluate if we are defending a helpless friend or if we are enabling a spoiled brat, that should have been kicked out of the fold in it's teen years.

:haha: I liked that.. I think they have better artillery than the U.S --
anyhow I really hope that there will come the day, when U.S stops funneling all our collective tax money to aid Israel.. and focus either on internal affairs or countries that actually need help..

before you know it, America will have third world country economy as well as despots .. hope folks wake up before it is too late...

I am not putting much hope on Obama but I think he is better than the alternative though only time will tell

:w:

[Whatsthepoint]

I think the majority of Jews now are atheist according to a new study I have read.... very few are observant moral Jews.. but only God knows best of their true condition..

Not atheist, but secular yes.
If it weren't for the orthodox ones, the Palis would most probably have their state, though that' not what they really want.
For some reason I suspect observant moral Jews is a subtle reference to the Jews opposed to the state of Israel..

[alcurad]

To repeat and reiterate:

Israel can never afford to break up with America.

But, can we afford to not break up with Israel?

Israel is a very expensive step child and quite demanding. We need to re-evaluate if we are defending a helpless friend or if we are enabling a spoiled brat, that should have been kicked out of the fold in it's teen years.

add ungrateful to the list. the Israelis for the most part are the victims of their own actions though.

[mohsen1985]

Egypt had pre-Islamic wars galore and never came under the Influence of Greeks or Romans or whomever else.. the fact that they assimilated fully under Islam is its own testament to how well received as well that is what History books record.. it was very peaceful massive conversion.. and hence my original question about Iran.. whereas Most Egyptians see Islam as a blessing and have totally given up their previous pagan practices.. Iran can't seem to get over it is Persian pride..

peace

Sry sis, but I don't understand why you want Iran to give up its Persian pride. It's part of our history, part of who we are today. What I understand from your words is that you want us to either be Persians or Muslims? But we're both at the same time. Islam is our religion, but we still have our traditions from our ancestors. There's absolutely no conflicts with the traditions and Islam either. I'm proud of my country being one of the first civilizations on earth, to have such brilliant scientists like Zakariya, Abo Ali Sina, Aboreihan, such brilliant poets (with tons and tons of Islamic poetry as well), and many many more.

I don't think any culture gives up their traditions when they all convert, unless there's some kind of conflict. Would you tear down the pyramids as an act to give up your Egyptian pride?

[mohsen1985]

I have never understood what is Iran's motive of such great hatred toward Israel. They have never had war with jews, iranian people are in large part well educated and open minded, of course with fanaticly anti western goverment (situation just contrary to arab countries). There are no shias in Gaze and West Bank, the islamic world sponsor Saudi Arabia is Iran's rival. Is it really such great dislike among average Persians to Israelis, or its just some way to get aplaud from the world sunni majority.

If you ask me, it's all for show, to keep people entertained...

I don't really know what the government wants to achieve here, they're spending billions on palestine. Money which comes from oil exports. People here hate that, why spend so much money for someone else when the country itself needs it? Also, they see israel as a threat. First they take palestine, then they'll try to expand their borders....Another "motive" they have is that they're our brothers and sisters in Islam, so let's help them out.

Pretty much stuff like that, don't know if it's all true or not, but I stand on my statement that it's all for show. God knows, maybe Iran and USA are working together in the background to jack up the price of oil to $120+ or take it back down to $50 whenever they want, and all this rivalry between them is one beautifully planned movie.

[جوري]

Sry sis, but I don't understand why you want Iran to give up its Persian pride. It's part of our history, part of who we are today. What I understand from your words is that you want us to either be Persians or Muslims? But we're both at the same time. Islam is our religion, but we still have our traditions from our ancestors. There's absolutely no conflicts with the traditions and Islam either. I'm proud of my country being one of the first civilizations on earth, to have such brilliant scientists like Zakariya, Abo Ali Sina, Aboreihan, such brilliant poets (with tons and tons of Islamic poetry as well), and many many more.

I don't think any culture gives up their traditions when they all convert, unless there's some kind of conflict. Would you tear down the pyramids as an act to give up your Egyptian pride?

:sl:
No you utterly misunderstand.. to begin with I think taking pride is a deadly sin.. but I digress, I am talking about people who give up their Islam all together or worst yet speak very poorly of Islam in favor of their pre-Islamic days.. in other words up celebrating Zoroastrian holidays (spring solstice) etc while forgoing Ramadan.. I wouldn't mention it, except that I have seen it happen.. most people who give up something usually go on with their new lives but quite a few Iranians I have met who are actually originally Muslim seem to me to be worst than non-Muslims toward Islam..
I was/am genuinely curious if those inside Iran feel the same as those outside of it...

anyhow to address your last Q.. I draw satisfaction from the collective Islamic achievement not in any sub state in particular-- I don't believe there should be boundaries between Muslims...


:w:

[mohsen1985]

Ohhh, ok, it's clear now. We call those people monafeghin (think it's an Arabic word also). They're againt Islam, they're against the Iranian government, they plan terrorist attacks on Iran, and they all try to corrupt as many Iranians as they can (they're mostly funded by the American government). They try to plant bombs in mosques and public places every now and then, and they're caught by the police most of the time. Don't let these few ignorant people be a representation the rest of us to you.

As for the new year's celebration, it's not something zoroasterian. That's been around way before zoroasters. It's just part of the culture, it's nothing un-Islamic about it. Besides, all Islamic eids are celebrated and respected in Iran.

The oldest new years celebration tradition I know about goes way back when one of the Persian kings (don't remember his name) had built a building with a hole in its wall. That hole would let the sun's light trhough and at the first day of spring that light would hit a specific spot which they had pinpointed and marked on the ground, so they'd know it's the first day of spring. This is goes way before zoroasters. It's just Persian culture.... Hope I explained it well.

[Argamemnon]

:sl:
No you utterly misunderstand.. to begin with I think taking pride is a deadly sin.. but I digress, I am talking about people who give up their Islam all together or worst yet speak very poorly of Islam in favor of their pre-Islamic days.. in other words up celebrating Zoroastrian holidays (spring solstice) etc while forgoing Ramadan.. I wouldn't mention it, except that I have seen it happen.. most people who give up something usually go on with their new lives but quite a few Iranians I have met who are actually originally Muslim seem to me to be worst than non-Muslims toward Islam..
I was/am genuinely curious if those inside Iran feel the same as those outside of it...

anyhow to address your last Q.. I draw satisfaction from the collective Islamic achievement not in any sub state in particular-- I don't believe there should be boundaries between Muslims...


:w:

:sl:

Through online communication, I have also noticed that many Persians abandon Islam and are quite hostile to Islam as well. I mean those who are living abroad...

But then I have to admit that there are also Turks like that, so it's not a Persian thing. I once visited a Turkish atheist forum.. there was so much hostility towards Muslims and Islam, I was really shocked. The forum had thousands of members!

BTW, Turks and Iranians are quite similar; both are EXTREMELY nationalistic and proud. I'm totally against this attitude, it's very unislamic.

:w:

[جوري]

Ohhh, ok, it's clear now. We call those people monafeghin (think it's an Arabic word also). They're againt Islam, they're against the Iranian government, they plan terrorist attacks on Iran, and they all try to corrupt as many Iranians as they can (they're mostly funded by the American government). They try to plant bombs in mosques and public places every now and then, and they're caught by the police most of the time. Don't let these few ignorant people be a representation the rest of us to you.

As for the new year's celebration, it's not something zoroasterian. That's been around way before zoroasters. It's just part of the culture, it's nothing un-Islamic about it. Besides, all Islamic eids are celebrated and respected in Iran.

The oldest new years celebration tradition I know about goes way back when one of the Persian kings (don't remember his name) had built a building with a hole in its wall. That hole would let the sun's light trhough and at the first day of spring that light would hit a specific spot which they had pinpointed and marked on the ground, so they'd know it's the first day of spring. This is goes way before zoroasters. It's just Persian culture.... Hope I explained it well.

Jazaka Allah khyran that is very interesting--- yes they seem to be along the line of Salaman Rushdie which I find very disturbing.. la 7wala wla qiwta illa billah..

:sl:

Through online communication, I have also noticed that many Persians abandon Islam and are quite hostile to Islam as well. I mean those who are living abroad...

But then I have to admit that there are also Turks like that, so it's not a Persian thing. I once visited a Turkish atheist forum.. there was so much hostility towards Muslims and Islam, I was really shocked. The forum had thousands of members!

BTW, Turks and Iranians are quite similar; both are EXTREMELY nationalistic and proud. I'm totally against this attitude, it's very unislamic.

:w:

I wish you hadn't told me about this.. that makes very sad..
bas al7mdlilah I have many very observant Turkish friends..
Insha'Allah we'll regain Turkey back with two words as Allah SWT decrees

Eid Mubarak everyone

:w:

[Amadeus85]

I think the majority of Jews now are atheist according to a new study I have read.... very few are observant moral Jews.. but only God knows best of their true condition..

Great majority of jews believe in God. Its just that they difer in practicing. You have orthodox jews, conservative jews and liberal jews. Those jews who are atheists they dont call themselves jews anymore. They integrate in the society of the country where they live.

[mohsen1985]

Jazaka Allah khyran that is very interesting--- yes they seem to be along the line of Salaman Rushdie which I find very disturbing.. la 7wala wla qiwta illa billah..




I wish you hadn't told me about this.. that makes very sad..
bas al7mdlilah I have many very observant Turkish friends..
Insha'Allah we'll regain Turkey back with two words as Allah SWT decrees

Eid Mubarak everyone

:w:

Islam has a lot of enemies from all over the world. Can't pinpoint a single country and say they're all against Islam. Any country on earth has its rivals against Islam.

[جوري]

Islam has a lot of enemies from all over the world. Can't pinpoint a single country and say they're all against Islam. Any country on earth has its rivals against Islam.

Very true.. and I meant you no offense :-[

waslaam 3lykoum wr wb

[Argamemnon]

Eid Mubarak everyone

:w:

Eid is tomorrrow for us, but Eid Mubarak. :w:

Very true.. and I meant you no offense :-

You are not grouchy today... ;)

[جوري]

Yup -- today is 3arafah we are fasting here... Tomorrow is Eid insha'Allah
my brother in law is making Hajj.. may Allah yatawabal minh and bring him home safely to his family.. I am a bit jealous-- wish I were in Mecca now making pilgrimage ...imsad

:w:

[mohsen1985]

Very true.. and I meant you no offense :-[

waslaam 3lykoum wr wb

Oh none taken at all sis, I just hope I've helped in describing an accurate picture of how things are here. I'm glad to be of any kind of help. :thumbs_up:thumbs_up:thumbs_up