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themuffinman
12-09-2008, 02:33 AM
well what im concerned/confused about about dajjal. well a friend of mine told me a hadith regarding a certain ibn sayyad who was a contemporary in prophet muhammed time and umar ibn khattab swore on allah in front of the prophet that ibn sayyad was dajjal and the prophet did not say anything. also umar reported that he angered ibn sayyad and at that point he physically swole up and blocked his way. at first im like dude this hadith is probably fabricated to my friend and got angry at him but i was searching up for the story of ibn sayyad and ran across this.ALso another hadiths states that tamim al-daari a a christian revert told the prophet that he ran into dajjal on an island chained up and he would be let out soon. do these two hadiths contradict eachother, i just have a hard time beleiving both of them can be right and that great men like umar could be deceived.

Chapter 17: STORY OF IBN SAYYAD
Book 041, Number 6990:

'Abdullah reported: We were along with Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) that we happened to pass by children amongst whom there was Ibn Sayyad. The children made their way but Ibn Sayyad kept sitting there (and it seemed) as if Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) did not like it (his sitting with the children) and said to him: May your nose he besmeared with dust, don't you bear testimony to the fact that I am the Messenger of Allah? Thereupon he said: No, but you should bear testimony that I am the messenger of Allah. Thereupon 'Umar b. Khattab said: Allah's Messenger, permit me that I should kill him. Thereupon Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) said: If he is that person who is in your mind (Dajjal ), you will not be able to kill him.

Book 041, Number 6991:

'Abdullah reported: We were walking with Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) that Ibn Sayyad happened to pass by him. Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) said to him: I have concealed for you (something to test you, so tell me that). He said: It is Dukh. Thereupon Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) said to him: Be off. You cannot get farther than your rank, whereupon 'Umar said: Allah's Messenger, permit me to strike his neck. Thereupon Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) said: Leave him; if he is that one (Dajjal) whom you apprehend, you will not be able to kill him.

Book 041, Number 6994:

Abu Sa'id reported: I accompanied Ibn Sayyad to Mecca and he said to me: What I have gathered from people is that theu think that I am Dajjal. Have you not hearde Allah's Messenger (may peace upon him) as saying: He will have no no children, I said: Yes, of course. Thereupon he said: But I have children. Have you not heard Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) as saying: He would not enter Mecca and Medina? I said: Yes, of course. Thereupon he said I have been once in Medina and now I intend to go to Mecca. And he said to me at the end of his talk: By Allah: I know his place of birth his abode where he is just now. He (Abu Sa'id) said: This caused confusion in my mind (in regard to his identity).

Book 041, Number 6995:

Abu Sa'id Khudri reported: Ibn Sa'id said to me somethhing for which I felt ashamed. He said: I can excuse others; but what has gone wrong with you, O Companions of Muhammad, that you take me as Dajjal? Has Allah's Apostle (may peace be upon him) not said that he would be a Jew whereas I am a Muslim and he also said that he would not have children, whereas I have children, and he also said: veryly, Allah has prohibited him to enter Mecca whereas I have performed Pilgrimage, atid. he went on saying this that I was about to be impressed by his tallk. He (however) said this also: I know where he (Dajjal) is and I know his father abd I mother, and it was said to him: Won't you feel pleased if you would be the same person? Thereupon he said: If this offer is made to me, I would noT resent that.

Book 041, Number 6996:

Abu Sa'id Khudri reported: We came back after having pewrformed Pilgrimage or 'Umra and lbn Sa'id was along with us. And w, e encamped at a place and the people dispersed and I and he were left behind. I felt terribly frightend from him as it was said about him that he was the Dajjal. He brought his goods and placed them by my luggage and I said: It is intense heat. Would you not place that under that tree? And he did that. Then ther appeared before us a flock of sheep. He went and brought a cup of milk and said: Abu Sa'id, drink that. I said it is intense heat and the milk is also hot (whereas the fact was) that I did not like to drink from his hands or to opr to take it from his hand and he said: Abu Sa'id, I think that I should take a rope and suspend it by the tree and then coimmit sucide because of the talks of the people, and he furtlier said. Abu Sa'id he who is ingnoran of the saying of Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) (he is to be pardoned), but O people of Ansar, is this hadith of Allah's Messengern (may peace be upon him) concealed from you whereas you have the best konowledge of t this hadith of Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) amongst people? Did Allalt's Messenger (may peace be upon him) not say that he (Dajjal) would be a non believer whereas I am a believer? did Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) not say he would be barren and no child would be born to hirn, whereas I have left my children in Medina? Did Allh's Messenger (may peace upon him) not say: He would not get into Medina and Mecca whereas I have been coming from Medina and now I intend to go to Mecca? Abu Sa'id said: I was about to accept the excuse put forward by him. that he said: I know the place where he would be born and where he is now. So I said to him: May your whole dayb be spent

Book 041, Number 6999:

'Muhammad b. Munkadir reported: As I saw Jabir b. 'Abdullah taking an oath in the name of Allah that it was Ibn Sa'id who was the Dajjal I said: Do you take an oath in the name of Allah? Thereupon he said: I heard 'Umar taking an oath in the presence of Allah's Apostle (may peace be upon him) to this effect but Allah's Apostle (may peace be upon him) did not disapprove of it.

Book 041, Number 7000:

'Abdullah b. Umar reported: 'Umar b. Khattab went along with Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) in the company of some persons toIbn Sayyad that he found him playing with children near the bettlement of Bani Maghala and Ibn Sayyad was at that time just at the threshold of adolescence and he did not perceive (the presence of Holy Prophet) until Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) struck his back with his hands. Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) said: Ibn Sayyad, don't you bear witness that I am the messenger of Allah? Ibn Sayyad looked toward him and he said: I bear witness to the fact that you the messenger of the unlettered. Ibn Sayyad said to the Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him): Do you bear witness to the fact that I am the messenger of Allah? Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) rejected this and said: I affirm my faith in Allah and in His messengers. Then Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) said to him: What do you see? Ibn Sayyad said: It us a Dukh. Thereupon Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) said: May you be disgraced and dishonoured, you would not not be able to go beyond your rank. 'Umar b. Khattab said: Allah's Messenger, permit me that I should strike his neck. Therupon Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) said: If he is the same (Dajjal) who would appear near the Last Hour, you would not be able to overpower him, and he is not that ther is no good for you to kill him. 'Abdullah b. 'Umar further narrated that after some time Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) and Ubayy b. Ka'b went towards the palm trees where Ibn Sayyad was. When Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) went near the tree he hid himself behind a tree with the intention of hearing something from Ibn sayyad before Ibn Sayyad could see him, but Allah's Messenger (may pcxce be upon him) saw him on a bed with a blanket around him from which a murmuring sound was being heard and Ibn Sayyad's mother saw Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) behind the trunk of the palm tree. She said to Ibn Sayyad: Saf (that being his name), here is Muhammad. Thereupon Ibn Sayyad jumped up murmuring and Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) said: If she had left him alone he would have made things clear. Abdullah b. Umar told that Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) stood up amongst the people and lauded Allah as He deserved, then he made a mention of the Dajjal and said: I warn you of him and there is no Prophet who has not warned his people against the Dajjal. Even Noah warned (against him) but I am going to tell you a thing which no Prophet told his people. You must know that he (the Dajjal) is one-eyed and Allah, the Exalted and Glorious, is not one-eyed. Ibn Shihab said: 'Umar b. Thabit al-Ansari informed me that some of the Companions of Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) informed him that the day when Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) warned people against the Dajjal, he also said: There would be written between his two eyes (the word) Kafir (infidel) and everyone who would resent his deeds would be able to read or every Muslim would be about to read, and he also said: Bear this thing in mind that none amongst you would be able to see Allah, the Exalted and Glorious, until he dies.

Book 041, Number 7003:

Nafi' reported that Ibn 'Umar met Ibn Si'id on some of the paths of Medina and he said to him a word which enraged him and he was so much swollen with anger that the way was blocked. Ibn 'Umar went to Hafsa and informed her about this. Thereupon she said: May Allah have mercy upon you, why did you incite Ibn Sayyad in spite of the fact that you knew it would be the extreme anger which would make Dajjal appear in the world?




here is the link
http://www.usc.edu/schools/college/c....html#041.6990
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themuffinman
12-09-2008, 08:08 PM
can sum1 please clarify o,o
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themuffinman
12-11-2008, 03:00 AM
darn does no one kno? iv been trying to find an explanation but noone can gimme an answer
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Malaikah
12-11-2008, 04:30 AM
Well, the good news is, there is an explanation! The bad news is, I don't remember it!

Sorry!
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alcurad
12-11-2008, 05:26 AM
Ibn Say'yad didn't physically expand, rather that's a term in arabic which denotes his anger at being accused of being the dajjal so much, something like when you say someone 'puffed up' with anger.
as for the story, either the prophet received revelation of there being some person known as dajjal but didn't receive more so he thought Ibn Say'yad was him, later receiving more revelation on the matter to clarify. or the story was fabricated or was changed during transmission. in the end we don't know for sure if it were even the prophet's own words in the ahadith or someone else's who was simply transmitting what he understood the hadith to mean.

as for Tamim Al dari's story, some say it was simply a dream he had not a true journey, and I atleast do agree with that, for how could a human being survive since the time of the prophet until now, that's over a thousand four hundred years..
the meanings contained within Tamim's story are perhaps symbolic and not to be taken too literally, in any case this narration is not a central part of Islam anyway, rather one has to do good and forbid and abhor evil wherever and whenever they be regardless of the dajjal or no.
as for Omar never making mistakes, the Muslims believe only the prophets of Allah are infallible, and that only at the actions/sayings that are part of their message from him. so in day to day human affairs they are susceptible to human error. no one be he Omar or any of the companions of the prophet has that status.
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themuffinman
12-11-2008, 06:11 AM
thanks for clarifying. oh i didnt mean omar never made mistakes, i meant the fact that he swore in front of the prophet that ibn sayyad was the dajjal and the prophet did not say anything
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alcurad
12-11-2008, 09:39 AM
maybe he had a strong 'hunch', and as I said before it might have been that the prophet didn't know specifically who the dajjal would be, then it was revealed to him later.
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alcurad
12-11-2008, 07:07 PM
http://axisoflogic.com/artman/publis...le_28940.shtml
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LockOn
12-12-2008, 08:48 PM
Don't worry...its a pretty confusing subject in itself. So you're not the only one. Imam Anwar Alwaki...covered this story about Ibn Sayaad in his hereafter series ( Which in itself is worth listening to) Maybe you'll find ur answer in that....or maybe someone will give you a worthy response.
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- Qatada -
12-13-2008, 08:33 AM
:salamext:


I've read that some 'ulama said that what 'Umar meant is that he [ibn sayyad] is one of the dajjals, i.e. an imposter who claims some form of prophecy. That doesn't necessarily mean he is the final dajjal who will come near the final hour.


this goes into more detail;

who was ibn sayyaad?

http://www.islam-qa.com/en/ref/8301
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