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Dawud_uk
01-15-2009, 03:26 PM
:sl:

mashallah, the ummah is getting united and at least talking about gaza but what about all the other suffering muslims?

why have we not marched on the ethiopian embassy for their actions in somalia, calling for a boycott of supermarkets selling ethiopian coffee and vegetables?

why do we not weep tears and make du'a for the people of afghanistan, and do all we can to stop the british and US military (within what is allowed by the covenant of security) and hold direct action in the west to stop the oppression there?

why do most muslims not even know where chechnya is on a map nevermind know there is a conflict there where the russian military has killed huge sections of the population for rising up and wanting shariah?

why is gaza such a cause for concern where as these other conflicts dont bring out anywhere near as much emotion and action from the muslims of the world?

:sl:
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Trumble
01-15-2009, 10:53 PM
Even you are being selective. On average, as many muslims as have been killed in Gaza in the last fortnight have been killed every fortnight in Darfur for the last five years. Yet nobody seems to care.
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IslamicRevival
01-15-2009, 10:56 PM
Because we all know this has been going on for over 60 years and the Arabs have done nothing to help their fellow people. All they've been doing is bowing down to the Americans. Shame on them

Palestine is a concentration camp
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Trumble
01-15-2009, 11:21 PM
So that's a reason to ignore a massacre of between 200,000 and 400,000 muslims that is still going on?!
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IslamicRevival
01-15-2009, 11:23 PM
Originally Posted by Trumble
So that's a reason to ignore a massacre of between 200,000 and 400,000 muslims that is still going on?!
I didnt say i was ignoring anyone...:rollseyes

Seems like you have a problem with us muslims judging by every single post you make is against us
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Trumble
01-15-2009, 11:40 PM
Originally Posted by Troubled Soul
I didnt say i was ignoring anyone...:rollseyes
OK. So what are your thoughts on Darfur?
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جوري
01-16-2009, 01:50 AM
Is this a thread on Darfur?
if you want to divert the attention -- I am sure it would be easy for you to start a thread of your chosen grievances!
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Eric H
01-16-2009, 01:58 AM
Greetings and peace be with you Dawud_uk;

About thirty thousand children die needlessly from grinding poverty and preventable disease each and every single day.

Should we be selective and say that we will only help the Christian children starving to death every day?

Or does justice demand that we help any child regardless of their religion, colour, or nationality? Why can’t Christians, Muslims, Hindus, Buddhists and atheists work together to end world poverty?

We can send men to the moon, we can build amazingly complex machines, mankind has a great intelligence. So why are we so stupid paying billions of dollars every year to fight people when that same money could help people end poverty, injustice and so put an end to wars,

In the spirit of praying for justice for all people, in the spirit of remembering that we are all created by the same God, regardless of our differences

Eric
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Woodrow
01-16-2009, 02:50 AM
Why do we only have tears for Gaza?

Not that we should lessen our tears for Gaza, we should know that for each tear we shed for Gaza we should also shed a river of tears for all other Muslims that are suffering.

After we count our tears we should look and see who else should we be shedding tears for.
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Yanal
01-16-2009, 02:55 AM
Its hard to do anything else but cry and fill our hearts with sorrow. All the else we can do is make dua and maybe donate a couple of items or a few dollars.
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Najm
01-16-2009, 04:18 AM
AsSalamOAlaikum WaRehmatuAllah WaBarkatuhu

We should cry for any of the suffereing of our Ummah. We should do all we can for our brothers and sisters. imsad

The answer to the question is...

Gaza needs our immediate attention. :cry:

"Watering the plant, is a very good deed, but not when your the house is on fire"

May Allah make use hold firm to our obligation. Ameen

FiAmaaniAllah
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Dawud_uk
01-16-2009, 05:53 AM
:sl:

to answer a few points,

yes, the poor and oppressed the world over deserve our support and help, including those in dafur (da meaning place, fur being one of the major tribes there).

dafur is a dirty nasty war, precisely because the sudanese government does not practice shariah which is why some of the groups there are fighting, for a more just equatable less arab nationalistic shariah based rule.

and gaza is in immediate need but so are the people who are going to freeze to death in afghanistan and pakistan this winter, so are those tortured, raped and murdered in chechnya.

all in immediate need, they are in immediate need in somalia and have been for decades, but where are the marches? where are the buckets being passed around for them?

:sl:
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Trumble
01-16-2009, 08:07 AM
Originally Posted by Argon Gossamer
Is this a thread on Darfur?
if you want to divert the attention -- I am sure it would be easy for you to start a thread of your chosen grievances!
Perhaps you should take the trouble to read the first post. It is a thread asking why so much less concern is shown about the violent death of muslims in other conflicts around the world than it is for those in Gaza. Clearly Darfur is such a conflict.
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Dawud_uk
01-16-2009, 08:24 AM
Originally Posted by Trumble
Perhaps you should take the trouble to read the first post. It is a thread asking why so much less concern is shown about the violent death of muslims in other conflicts around the world than it is for those in Gaza. Clearly Darfur is such a conflict.
i agree trumble,

you are correct but there were other conflicts i could have mentioned also, i was not saying these conflicts are alone in needing our attention, rather drawing attention to them as an example.
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KAding
01-16-2009, 09:36 AM
Originally Posted by Najm
We should cry for any of the suffereing of our Ummah. We should do all we can for our brothers and sisters. imsad
I don't know if you mean it this way, but statement like these, which are widespread here, sound very exclusive. As if only the suffering of fellow Muslims is worth crying for. Again, you might not mean it that way, but it certainly is the impression you get from this post, even from this thread overall.

I understand that as a human you have to set priorities and its impossible to shed tears for everyone, but at a rational level, surely we know that every stranger that is suffering deserves equal pity.
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IslamicRevival
01-16-2009, 09:49 AM
Originally Posted by KAding
I don't know if you mean it this way, but statement like these, which are widespread here, sound very exclusive. As if only the suffering of fellow Muslims is worth crying for. Again, you might not mean it that way, but it certainly is the impression you get from this post, even from this thread overall.

I understand that as a human you have to set priorities and its impossible to shed tears for everyone, but at a rational level, surely we know that every stranger that is suffering deserves equal pity.
Everyone apart from the terrorist Israelis.

Also, with all due respect... This is an Islamic Forum, of course we are going to feel pain for our own brothers and sisters

May Allah SWT ease the suffering of All muslims and guide the misguided. Ameen
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piXie
01-16-2009, 10:39 AM
:sl:

We've not forgotten our other brothers and sisters who are suffering. They are remembered in our du'aas along with Gaza, may Allaah help them all. :'(

n the practical steps we take to help Gaza, will also help them too. n tears are not enough. Our brothers and sisters who are suffering don't need our helpless tears .... they need us to pull our socks up n start acting ....! :bump:
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NobleMuslimUK
01-16-2009, 02:02 PM
Theres a lot of people collecting donations for the Gaza conflict, today in our mosque some guy announced for donations and I cud see people donating generously, it turns out that donation was for the mosque, to my shock the guy collecting for palestine was then stood outside asking for collection. i dont think the mosque committee shud have taken advantage of the situation like that but theres ignorant fools everywhere.
The other thing about the donations is I think a lot of people are exploiting the situation, as theres not much aid being let in so wheres all this money going to, i fear the worse into greedy and sly peoples pockets.
Allah knws best, if people are doing such things they are only making their akhira bad.
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NobleMuslimUK
01-16-2009, 02:04 PM
Ameen to all the duas for our suffering muslims brothers and sisters everywhere.
Reply

Angel12
01-16-2009, 03:13 PM
Originally Posted by Dawud_uk
:sl:

mashallah, the ummah is getting united and at least talking about gaza but what about all the other suffering muslims?

why have we not marched on the ethiopian embassy for their actions in somalia, calling for a boycott of supermarkets selling ethiopian coffee and vegetables?

why do we not weep tears and make du'a for the people of afghanistan, and do all we can to stop the british and US military (within what is allowed by the covenant of security) and hold direct action in the west to stop the oppression there?

why do most muslims not even know where chechnya is on a map nevermind know there is a conflict there where the russian military has killed huge sections of the population for rising up and wanting shariah?

why is gaza such a cause for concern where as these other conflicts dont bring out anywhere near as much emotion and action from the muslims of the world?

:sl:
Im sorry to say this but i personally believe its to do with insitutional racism and predjudices within the Islamic faith.
Arabs do tend to see themselves as more important and any genocide or large scale dying of African Muslims does not seem to garnish the same amount of publicity a Arab dying does.
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simplicity786
01-16-2009, 03:29 PM
i don't think its racism with in Islam, not all arabs think them self to be most important.. the situations throughout history haven't always been highlighted in the arab world this is a exception because people are standing up its not just about injustice its about the land its about history..
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Angel12
01-16-2009, 04:06 PM
Originally Posted by simplicity786
i don't think its racism with in Islam, not all arabs think them self to be most important.. the situations throughout history haven't always been highlighted in the arab world this is a exception because people are standing up its not just about injustice its about the land its about history..
As a African Muslim, i do tend to be looked down on by Arabs and Asians. As if Africans cannot be true Muslims.
Whatever the reason is, it is highly two faced and hypocritical to make a huge fuss about Palestinians but ignore what other Muslims are going through.
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Woodrow
01-16-2009, 04:36 PM
Originally Posted by Angel12
As a African Muslim, i do tend to be looked down on by Arabs and Asians. As if Africans cannot be true Muslims.
Whatever the reason is, it is highly two faced and hypocritical to make a huge fuss about Palestinians but ignore what other Muslims are going through.
Sadly, I have to agree with you. There is prejudice within the Ummah. I will not attribute it to Racism, as I see it more as nationalism. But, it is prejudice and it does need to be addressed and ended.

We are all Muslims and it makes no difference if our heritage is from Saudi, Palestine, Pakistan, Malaysia, Somalia, Nigeria, The UK, USA or Canada etc. We are one Ummah and need to extend our care to all of our Brothers and Sisters.
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KittyKat
01-16-2009, 04:41 PM
Salaams,

For me it is a matter of "I am but a small voice in this giant world." I feel so helpless to do anything of any substance to help those in need no matter of where they are in the world.

My heart does cry and yes I do shed tears, even before converting I've been shedding tears. What more can I do? I speak to those around me and I tell them of the tragedies of how I disagree and wish the world could live in peace and we could love our brothers and sisters but what good does this do?

I feel so helpless and small when it comes to matters such as this.
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Woodrow
01-16-2009, 04:47 PM
Originally Posted by KittyKat
Salaams,

For me it is a matter of "I am but a small voice in this giant world." I feel so helpless to do anything of any substance to help those in need no matter of where they are in the world.

My heart does cry and yes I do shed tears, even before converting I've been shedding tears. What more can I do? I speak to those around me and I tell them of the tragedies of how I disagree and wish the world could live in peace and we could love our brothers and sisters but what good does this do?

I feel so helpless and small when it comes to matters such as this.
:sl:

Just as each cell within our body is tiny and invisible. Combined all of the cells becom us. So it is we are each a tiny speck in the Ummah, but together we are a very big Ummah with a loud voice. But, we all need to work together and have a healthy strong Ummah.
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Angel12
01-16-2009, 04:58 PM
Originally Posted by Woodrow
Sadly, I have to agree with you. There is prejudice within the Ummah. I will not attribute it to Racism, as I see it more as nationalism. But, it is prejudice and it does need to be addressed and ended.

We are all Muslims and it makes no difference if our heritage is from Saudi, Palestine, Pakistan, Malaysia, Somalia, Nigeria, The UK, USA or Canada etc. We are one Ummah and need to extend our care to all of our Brothers and Sisters.
It does need to be addressed but i doubt anything will ever change.
Just because Islam came from within the ME does not mean anyone who is Arab is instantly better than other Muslims :raging:
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جوري
01-16-2009, 06:51 PM
Originally Posted by Trumble
Perhaps you should take the trouble to read the first post. It is a thread asking why so much less concern is shown about the violent death of muslims in other conflicts around the world than it is for those in Gaza. Clearly Darfur is such a conflict.
And I believe someone has already pointed out that the situation in some places is more pressing than others... to re-hash the analogy 'locusts in the field' isn't as pressing as when your house is on fire'
also notice, in my post, I made no mention of GAZA or Palestine, I clearly stated -- you may start a separate thread of your chosen grievance.
Reply

Trumble
01-16-2009, 07:14 PM
Originally Posted by Argon Gossamer
And I believe someone has already pointed out that the situation in some places is more pressing than others... to re-hash the analogy 'locusts in the field' isn't as pressing as when your house is on fire'
Perhaps you might choose a more relevant one. Actually both houses are on fire. Darfur is a much bigger house that has been burning a lot longer. However if the point you are struggling to make coherently is that, for the moment, the Gaza house is burning brighter, I look forward forward (with far more hope than anticipation) to a similar level of response regarding Darfur - which will still be burning - once the Gaza fire has been extinguished, or at least gotten under control, hopefully in as peaceful a fashion as possible.

I clearly stated -- you may start a separate thread of your chosen grievance.
That's very kind of you .. but regardless of any comprehension difficulties you may be experiencing my comments clearly belong in this thread, as acknowledged by the original poster, and here they will remain.
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جوري
01-16-2009, 07:21 PM
Originally Posted by Trumble
Perhaps you might choose a more relevant one. Actually both houses are on fire. Darfur is a much bigger house that has been burning a lot longer. However if the point you are struggling to make coherently is that, for the moment, the Gaza house is burning brighter, I look forward forward (with far more hope than anticipation) to a similar level of response regarding Darfur - which will still be burning - once the Gaza fire has been extinguished, or at least gotten under control, hopefully in as peaceful a fashion as possible.
relevance is a state of mind really?..
much bigger in your mind (Darfur)-- Much longer in my mind Gaza but still notice I didn't bring Gaza into the picture..
I think this paragraph I read yesterday summed it best!

Gaza's 9-11: When fighting back isn't an option
I am currently in Cambodia and took photos of some of the Killing Fields displays in Phnom Penh. They are a sad reminder of what horrors mankind is capable of committing and a powerful incentive for every man, woman and child in the world to work for peace -- starting right now!
When the World Trade Center was destroyed, Americans did everything they could to protect themselves.
When Spain's transit system was bombed, everyone throughout the world mourned.
When Britain's subways were attacked, the world stood back in shock and measures were taken.
Even Kosevo got protected. Even Somalia got aid from world organizations. Even Darfur was not begrudged the right to protect itself.
But after over 60 years of having endured attack after attack after attack after attack, Palestinians are still being scolded for trying to attempt to defend themselves and being told not to fight back.
Where's the justice in that?

as for your 'hopes' well.. they mean jack unless you are actively doing something than parting your Buddhist wisdom on a forum?
That's very kind of you .. but regardless of any comprehension difficulties you may be experiencing my comments clearly belong in this thread, as acknowledged by the original poster, and here they will remain.
It isn't comprehension difficulty really as much as say oh the bull **** meter going up when crossing some of your posts!
Let it remain as unction to your ego, if that is all you are able to part with, I wouldn't feel right depriving you of your two P!

cheers
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doorster
01-16-2009, 08:05 PM
do damaged cells make a faultless body?

wa salaam alaikum
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جوري
01-16-2009, 08:10 PM
Originally Posted by doorster
do damaged cells make a fault body?

wa salaam alaikum
I wouldn't be so annoyed by the 'morality squad's' drive by shooting with their BB gun if several criteria were met
1- They were actively practicing what they preach.. after all an opinion is worth its weight in goby
2- They didn't seek every opportunity to deflect away from current and ongoing calamities.
3- They weren't such staunch apologists for the guilty party, since everyone can see through the hypocrisy of that charade!

:w:
Reply

doorster
01-16-2009, 08:23 PM
Originally Posted by Argon Gossamer
Originally Posted by doorster
do damaged cells make a faultless body?

wa salaam alaikum
I wouldn't be so annoyed by the 'morality squad's' drive by shooting with their BB gun if several criteria were met
1- They were actively practicing what they preach.. after all an opinion is worth its weight in goby
2- They didn't seek every opportunity to deflect away from current and ongoing calamities.
3- They weren't such staunch apologists for the guilty party, since everyone can see through the hypocrisy of that charade!
:w:
hm... will need to do some consultation before replying
:w:
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Woodrow
01-16-2009, 08:37 PM
Originally Posted by doorster
do damaged cells make a faultless body?

wa salaam alaikum
The body is weakened by just one damaged cell. A damaged cell is the start of a disease. So it is with the Ummah, if any one of us is weak or faulted, the entire Ummah is sick to some degree, and worse, the sickness can spread to other members of the Ummah.

we do need to see all Muslims as being part of the Ummah and we need to keep all of our Brothers and Sisters healthy, be it in terms of physical well being or of increased Imaan.
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Yanal
01-16-2009, 10:25 PM
^ Perhaps you need to get the wording right "faultless" wouldn't be the right words, perhaps "disabled" or the phrase "needing special care".
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Al-Zaara
01-17-2009, 08:02 PM
Originally Posted by Eric H
Should we be selective and say that we will only help the Christian children starving to death every day?

Or does justice demand that we help any child regardless of their religion, colour, or nationality? Why can’t Christians, Muslims, Hindus, Buddhists and atheists work together to end world poverty?
Wish I knew..

We can send men to the moon, we can build amazingly complex machines, mankind has a great intelligence. So why are we so stupid paying billions of dollars every year to fight people when that same money could help people end poverty, injustice and so put an end to wars,
Exactly.

In the spirit of praying for justice for all people, in the spirit of remembering that we are all created by the same God, regardless of our differences
Beautiful. I pray so too!
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mayza
02-04-2009, 08:15 AM
I think we care because it's what we see on TV. I mean i was watching CNN yesterday about a girl called Moshe, if I'm not mistaken, and her Indian Nanny. Both his parents died at the Jewish center next to the hotel in the mumbai bombings. I mean, why weren't any of the indians killed had their stories told.

I'm like saying, if it doesn't deal with jewish people or the state of Israel, and this is only an assumption, that it wouldn't make it on the TV. This, in turn, produces public opinions on a subjects.

The media doesn't care about somalians, chechnyans, etc cause it doesn't relate to the Jewish people or the state of Israel.

Just my 2 cents.
Reply

justahumane
02-04-2009, 01:10 PM
Originally Posted by mayza
I think we care because it's what we see on TV. I mean i was watching CNN yesterday about a girl called Moshe, if I'm not mistaken, and her Indian Nanny. Both his parents died at the Jewish center next to the hotel in the mumbai bombings. I mean, why weren't any of the indians killed had their stories told.

I'm like saying, if it doesn't deal with jewish people or the state of Israel, and this is only an assumption, that it wouldn't make it on the TV. This, in turn, produces public opinions on a subjects.

The media doesn't care about somalians, chechnyans, etc cause it doesn't relate to the Jewish people or the state of Israel.

Just my 2 cents.
Well, Media is not alone to be blamed. After all they have to keep their shop in running mode. Thats why they are destined to show only well to do, rich, and cute kids only. Poor Moshe have all these qualities in him. Had they shown a black Somali or Darfurian kid playing with skull or carwling to fetch a piece of fungi-laced bread, ppls like myself cant stand to watch them and switch on to some other channel to watch likes of Moshe, in need to cry and show to the world how sensitive I m. Actually tear gland is black and poor resistant to be more precise.
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Muezzin
02-05-2009, 05:55 PM
Why do we only have tears for Gaza?
Because human beings' natural inclination is hypocricy, and we only really care about what we see, and what we see tends to be the flavour of the month, and we tend to be too lazy to seek out information about other calamities.

Compassion is fickle.
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The Palestinian
02-19-2009, 04:25 AM
Bro, let me tell you a truth
All you've saw is just "emotional" and temprory, believe me we are living in this war for 9years, but muslims did nothing but cry and send food.
And let me tell you, in Palestine everytime we dua'a in our prays we dua'a for Chechnye, Afghanistan...etc because we all in same "boat".
Bro, the biggest mistake is to think all we need is blankets and foods.
Occupation is disease, end it you'll be no longer suffering from borders and so on.
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jeff d
08-01-2009, 10:08 PM
Dear Dawud_UK:

As I have said many time, everyone deserves their freedom from opression. I think a lot of people focus on Gaza because it is in such a Holy area of the world, not really because Muslims in other places of the world are less important. Some do not know of the suffering in other places( or at least aren't familiar with the severity of it), such as Chechnya,Afghanistan,Here in the usa, and so many other places. I think many times media plays a big part in this, as they tend to point the way of current events. "care about these people, not these" type of attitude. Or the media many times neglects people in areas purposefully. This is very sad.
But, here's the good of it all.....you haven't forgotten....you feel for all your Muslim brothers and Sisters that are at the hands of tyranny. I feel for them too, as I'm sure many people of this forum do as well. I know that many times , governments like to hide this oppressive activity because they know it is wrong. I think more people cry for their forgotten Muslim Brothers and Sisters than you know. Always remember that eventually evil will be conquered, and all believers will have peace. Everyone's time will come as Allah sees fit. For now, we must pray that those suffeing fine a way to make it through. We must also pray that the oppressors have an awakening , a change of heart, and find a way to mend their wrong doing Rev. Jeff Dishong
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