Why is nudity considered worse than violence/curses in movies and games?

[AntiKarateKid]

I was wondering this before. I stopped watching movies and shows that had gratuitous sexual references or jokes but then I still play videogames with gore/violence and cursing in it?

It seems like I mind cursing more than I do gore and violence and hate nudity above all but writing this now it seems... backwards?

All are bad I know but for some reason I'm having trouble seeing violence on par with nudity.

So guys what are your views?

[Cabdullahi]

brother .....all affect the heart....being exposed to and actively seeking out nudity through books and video's causes greater damage but swearing and violence also causes damage

[Charzhino]

Yea, I'm not too sure either. When I was younger, my mum would let me watch movies with intense gore, violence and bad language, but when it came to even a prolonged kiss scene, she would change the channel or tell me to look away. Kind of funny now that I think about it.

[Keltoi]

I suppose over time people have become numb to exploding limbs and the f bomb. Nudity is probably the last thing "we" will eventually become numb to. It probably isn't that far off.

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[aamirsaab]

:sl:
I think it's because violence and cursing occurs more frequently than nudity. So there is an element of normality and desensitization; the more frequent an act is the more likely it is to be accepted.

Case in point is adultery; it's not uncommon in today's society for both men and women to be flurtatious or promiscuous (ex-girlfriends, ex-boyfriends and such). In fact, some would argue it's a social norm to actually have those!

Yet, things like child molestation are still considered a horrible act (which is a good thing - I certainly do not wish to see the day where child molestation becomes any less of a crime than it is today. In my book, child molesterers should get really harsh punishments ALWAYS...freakin sickos)

I'm not sure which is worse for a human psychologically speaking though, Violence or nudity? I would probably say nudity since it's connected with insecurity (usually a bad thing), whereas violence is connected with domination (usually a good thing).

[Peterwf]

Nudity leads to a "consuming passion", it leads to seeking new and more perverse forms of titillation and thereby ever deeper into sin, and more difficult to escape.

Similarly, viewing violent material is also a "consuming passion" and leads to the desire for the next thrill. It can lead to a person becoming angry in their relationships and thence onto violence.

Both are evil, very dangerous and extremely difficult to escape once trapped.
So I have to agree with the OP that it does seem strange that by comparison violence is tolerated.

[aadil77]

I was wondering this before. I stopped watching movies and shows that had gratuitous sexual references or jokes but then I still play videogames with gore/violence and cursing in it?

It seems like I mind cursing more than I do gore and violence and hate nudity above all but writing this now it seems... backwards?

All are bad I know but for some reason I'm having trouble seeing violence on par with nudity.

So guys what are your views?

well one is haraam and the other isn't, yh swearing is a sin but it is nowhere near as bad as the other and does not nearly lead to the amount of haraam the other can cause

[جوري]

I don't know if nudity leads to passion.. but that is my point of view as a female I think it dulls the senses and turns people into animals and denies them something very basic and beautiful to which every human is entitled which is their God given dignity. Nudity fosters contempt for women objectifies and depersonalizes them.. I think it is very sad.. and whereas most women who chose to butter their bread this way for one reason or another are viewed in multitudes of ways from sex objects to w hores, I really can't help but feel very sorry for them.. that is someone's mom or sister, or niece or aunt that perverts are gawking at to satisfy instant base desires that are stripped of emotion, compassion or love...

I'd take violence over nudity for reasons above.. at least violence for the most part has good and evil defined and a sense of justice somehow attached to it.

[alcurad]

^second
most of us can't get too violent as it were, you can't exactly go around shooting people as happens in video games for example. on the other hand 'nudity' as an umbrella encompassing all that is lewd etc could be acted upon, or has a larger chance of being acted out, this is in my view why it is not acceptable as violence is.
any fantasies-the 'normal' ones atleast- in that realm could/should be easily satisfied by getting married etc, not so for violence/gore, so it's more tolerated as a lesser evil,,

[Trollomore]

Not sure I can agree with the above post.
Guns are indeed hard to get hold of, especially in countries that don't have guns in Walmart on sale :)
However, I'm sure we'll all aware that blunt instruments, blades, anything pokey can do just as much damage albeit you wouldn't be able to kill as many as quicky if you started running around a mall with a knife as you would with a firearm.

I just can't see how violence is a lesser form of barbarity then nudity is.

[Azy]

I think the answer to this is simply social conditioning, as aamirsaab said, what people consider social norms. Presumably you all live in societies where everyone keeps covered up and the sexes generally separated.

There are parts of the world where people won't put on a pair of pants their whole life and it has no bearing on their dignity and no sexual connotations, it is simply how they have always lived.

How on earth you can think that beating someone to a bloody pulp is preferable to being nude is beyond me.

[alcurad]

Azy, the discussion is concerning games & movies, all it takes is a few clicks-in a game that is-not that I'm for that,,

[miss red]

I think that violence in movies got bad effect, but violence in reale life is most effective so if your in violence community u will be as it mostly. If the movies and games are your community meaning you deal so much with thim that's where thy have effect on you. You also choose what to watch and what to play, ok don't laugh:popcorn: i watch cartoon movies they have almost any violence and some of thim are good, And go to cinema to watch it too.

slam

[Azy]

Azy, the discussion is concerning games & movies, all it takes is a few clicks-in a game that is-not that I'm for that,,

I know, what I'm saying is that it's essentially all about your perception of normality whether it's in a game, movie or real life.

It's interesting that for AKK there seems to be no distinction between "gratuitous sexual references" and "nudity".

[miss red]

And i think worior movies are positive.

[Grace Seeker]

I don't know if nudity leads to passion.. but that is my point of view as a female I think it dulls the senses and turns people into animals and denies them something very basic and beautiful to which every human is entitled which is their God given dignity. Nudity fosters contempt for women objectifies and depersonalizes them..

I agree. And I also suspect that viewing violence has a similar desensitizing effect on people causing us to view others once again as objects of our own wrath rather than to be valued as human beings who, like ourselves, are equally part of God's amazing creation.

And I think language is a tool that can leverage us into being willing to accept violence as normative and reasonable, especially if our language is filled with violent imagery or behaviors. Really who would want someone to actually literally complete the acts that we often say with our most obscene langauge?

[czgibson]

Greetings,

Two of the best sentences I've seen today:

It seems like I mind cursing more than I do gore and violence and hate nudity above all but writing this now it seems... backwards?

There are parts of the world where people won't put on a pair of pants their whole life and it has no bearing on their dignity and no sexual connotations, it is simply how they have always lived.

It's more common by far to see violence in a film than it is to see nudity, and prolonged nudity will get a film a higher certificate than prolonged violence. It's always seemed upside-down to me.

If you're religious: is it better to look at God's creation or to look at the destruction of it?

Peace

[جوري]

'Presumably you all live in societies where everyone keeps covered up and the sexes generally separated.'
lol.. when sitting for the United states medical licensing exam specifically the CSA. you can fail the test if you do poorly in one of three components and one of them is patient communication. Yes people have indeed failed for not offering the patient appropriate cover or exposing an area of the body not being examined. I think human diginity is a universal language, except for those who for personal reasons are far removed from it.
Look it up under medical ethics CSA!

[جوري]

I agree. And I also suspect that viewing violence has a similar desensitizing effect on people causing us to view others once again as objects of our own wrath rather than to be valued as human beings who, like ourselves, are equally part of God's amazing creation.

And I think language is a tool that can leverage us into being willing to accept violence as normative and reasonable, especially if our language is filled with violent imagery or behaviors. Really who would want someone to actually literally complete the acts that we often say with our most obscene langauge?

It does indeed depend on the content of how violence is used, to me it is a western problem really, I don't see that level of violence in foreign films, or students going postal on their classmates and teachers else where in the world as in the U.S... were it up to me I'd do away with both, but if I had to choose the lesser of two evils it would be nudity..

it is remarkable to me but yesterday I was thinking if I had just one wish for this world, what would it be, and world peace wasn't as pressing or realistic as doing away with pornography!

cheers

[جوري]

Greetings
If you're religious: is it better to look at God's creation or to look at the destruction of it?

Peace

You can look and admire God's creation in the private tender moments that he made lawful.. pornography in any form even if swept under artistry is an exploitation of the subject!

[Whatsthepoint]

Nudity is mostly harmless, on the other hand, violence in movies seems to cause a fair deal of trouble - not one, but two shootin sprees in one day.

[جوري]

Harm doesn't have to be physical and palpable to be well.. harmful!...
But given the atheist tendency for materialism I am not surprised at that, (yes I am aware you are an Agnostic) it is a generalization given the consensus

[Azy]

It does indeed depend on the content of how violence is used, to me it is a western problem really, I don't see that level of violence in foreign films

Never watched any chinese films?

or students going postal on their classmates and teachers else where in the world as in the U.S...

I suppose we don't notice it as much because it isn't news to anyone that Somalis or Sudanese are shooting each other on a daily basis.

[czgibson]

Greetings,

You can look and admire God's creation in the private tender moments that he made lawful.. pornography in any form even if swept under artistry is an exploitation of the subject!

I'm talking about nudity, not necessarily pornography.

Peace

[Whatsthepoint]

Greetings,


I'm talking about nudity, not necessarily pornography.

Peace

I guess her definition of porn spans wider than yours.

[Grace Seeker]

Nudity is mostly harmless, on the other hand, violence in movies seems to cause a fair deal of trouble - not one, but two shootin sprees in one day.

Nudity may be mostly harmless, but pornography isn't. (Yes, I contend that there is a difference between the two.) And many who have been caught in the grips of pornoagraphy have said that it led them deeper and deeper into more and more degradation of people and, for more than just a few, into violence.

... my interviews with pornography users and sex offenders, and various other researchers' work, have led me to conclude that pornography can: (1) be an important factor in shaping a male-dominant view of sexuality; (2) be used to initiate victims and break down their resistance to unwanted sexual activity; (3) contribute to a user's difficulty in separating sexual fantasy and reality; and (4) provide a training manual for abusers (Dines & Jensen, 2004).

from Pornography and Sexual Violence

I was under oath when asked whether, in my opinion, pornography is a cause of violence against women.

I hate that question, because pornography is violence against women: the women used in pornography. Not only is there a precise symmetry of values and behaviors in pornography and in acts of forced sex and battery, but in a sex-polarized society men also learn about women and sex from pornography. The message is conveyed to men that women enjoy being abused. Increasingly, research is proving that sex and violence--and the perception that females take pleasure in being abused, which is the heart of pornography--teach men both ambition and strategy.

But beyond the empirical research, there is the evidence of testimony: women coming forth, at least in the safety of feminist circles, to testify to the role that pornography played in their own experiences of sexual abuse. One nineteen-year-old woman testified at the Hartford trial that her father consistently used pornographic material as he raped and tortured her over a period of years. She also told of a network of her father's friends, including doctors and lawyers, who abused her and other children. One of these doctors treated the children to avoid being exposed.

Stories such as these are not merely bizarre and sensational; they are beginning to appear in feminist literature with increasing frequency. To dismiss them is to dismiss the lives of the victims.

source: LETTERS FROM A WAR ZONE: THE NEW TERRORISM -- Pornography's Part in
Sexual Violence

And if you want even more chilling testimony, albeit antecdotal, then read the following: What we learned from Ted Bundy.

[czgibson]

Greetings,

I guess her definition of porn spans wider than yours.

Perhaps that's true. The way I look at it, nudity doesn't always cause sexual thoughts, whereas with pornography the intention is that it does.

I must have missed this one:

it is remarkable to me but yesterday I was thinking if I had just one wish for this world, what would it be, and world peace wasn't as pressing or realistic as doing away with pornography!

What an absolute shocker of a statement to make.

Peace

[Grace Seeker]

What an absolute shocker of a statement to make.

Peace

Yes, but I can see where it is coming from. For instance, just take a look at the Iraq war. As much as the US was hated around the world for going into Iraq without cause. The issues that seemed to galvanize the most negative opinions were the photos coming out of Abu Ghraib or stories of US soldiers rapiing Iraqi women. Such things were relatively few, but even one is understandably viewed as too many. On top of that, these things often led to other acts of violence, either as revenge or as a cover-up. Terrible as Dafur is, the story of soldiers being ordered to rape 12 & 13 year old girls is generating more international action than years of murders and starvation. There is something about the human psyche which seems to universally says that among all crimes, these sorts of crimes are the worst. And yet, all societies are guilty of them, western or eastern it makes no difference, from the Japanese "rape of Nanking" to the US "rape of Iraq".

And where do these acts originate? But in the perverted fantasies stimulated and condoned by pornography.

[Whatsthepoint]

And where do these acts originate? But in the perverted fantasies stimulated and condoned by pornography.

Could be quite the opposite.
There was been rape long before mass pornography.

[czgibson]

Greetings Grace Seeker,

In all of the situations you mention, violence is the major problem, not nudity.

Peace

[Amadeus85]

I dont know whats worse for a young mind, porn or violence. All I can say is that in a world of 6 billion people, with hundred thousands of psychopats, movies such as Dexter, Californication or Saw are gonna create at least one murderer.

[جوري]

Never watched any chinese films?

I am not bothered by Jet lee as I am by Larry Flynt!

I suppose we don't notice it as much because it isn't news to anyone that Somalis or Sudanese are shooting each other on a daily basis.

I rather think it is because your economy is soon to be matching that of third world countries as well pretty soon their despots!

[جوري]

Greetings,


I'm talking about nudity, not necessarily pornography.

Peace

I don't see much difference between Correggio's Jupiter and Io or a center fold by Hefner.. if there is a human model involved.. So yes I suppose I subscribe to a different confidence interval than yours!

[جوري]

Greetings,

What an absolute shocker of a statement to make.

Peace

Glad you haven't lost your sense of wonder.. it is good to hang on to a measure of the 'Auguries of Innocence'

[Amadeus85]

Nudity is mostly harmless, on the other hand, violence in movies seems to cause a fair deal of trouble - not one, but two shootin sprees in one day.

Thanks to internet the young generation that is just growing up is one of the first who had such easy contact to all kind of twisted pornography. So we will unfortunately just see the effects of this in next years.
Sex and violence sells, unfortunately I must say that the american movies and tv film series such as Beverly Hills 90210, Sex in The City or Ally McBeal caused greatly more for the moral and sexual revolution in my country than the efforts of all liberal politicians and parties.

[Azy]

I rather think it is because your economy is soon to be matching that of third world countries as well pretty soon their despots!

I rather think that has little to do with this topic.
The western media does not have a monopoly on violence, it's been a popular pastime with humans for quite a while.

And if you want even more chilling testimony, albeit antecdotal, then read the following: What we learned from Ted Bundy.

Ted Bundy may have been looking at a lot of porn but some reports state he was diagnosed with 3 different personality disorders, which left him with a will to dominate others without remorse.

Probably not the best example of what pornography might do to your average man (or woman) on the street.

[جوري]

I rather think that has little to do with this topic.
The western media does not have a monopoly on violence, it's been a popular pastime with humans for quite a while.

Western Media engenders the vast majority of base material produced and mass marketed to the world...It is actually one of those areas that they have pioneered as well re-writing history using that same medium.
would love to sit here all night and have a tit for tat with you compadre but I really do have better things to do.. like watching a gory horror flick on chiller

cheerio :shade:

[Yanal]

Nudity is haram as a stranger looks at a stranger women which creates fitnah, and violence isn't haaram and your playing not controlling an army to kill a random person right?

[Trollomore]

I think that violence in movies got bad effect, but violence in reale life is most effective so if your in violence community u will be as it mostly. If the movies and games are your community meaning you deal so much with thim that's where thy have effect on you. You also choose what to watch and what to play, ok don't laugh:popcorn: i watch cartoon movies they have almost any violence and some of thim are good, And go to cinema to watch it too.

slam

Just to understand your meaning, have you formed the opinion that if as you say a community watches violent with/without nudity in films and plays them in video games are subject to practise such acts in real life even if subconsciously?

[Yanal]

^ Actually yes,in another thread I also posted this real story. A game tester for need for speed tested the game for approximately 10 hours a day ,one day after testing he was on his way home when he started to drive 170 km/h without noticing until after.
Doctor Y

[Trollomore]

Yes, but I can see where it is coming from. For instance, just take a look at the Iraq war. As much as the US was hated around the world for going into Iraq without cause. The issues that seemed to galvanize the most negative opinions were the photos coming out of Abu Ghraib or stories of US soldiers rapiing Iraqi women. Such things were relatively few, but even one is understandably viewed as too many. On top of that, these things often led to other acts of violence, either as revenge or as a cover-up. Terrible as Dafur is, the story of soldiers being ordered to rape 12 & 13 year old girls is generating more international action than years of murders and starvation. There is something about the human psyche which seems to universally says that among all crimes, these sorts of crimes are the worst. And yet, all societies are guilty of them, western or eastern it makes no difference, from the Japanese "rape of Nanking" to the US "rape of Iraq".

And where do these acts originate? But in the perverted fantasies stimulated and condoned by pornography.

People are not stupid, they do not need to be told what to watch and what to not watch.
Anyone who would deem it as acceptable to rape someone in real life has a mental illness.

Vikings raped women and I doubt porn made them do it.

Please read this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_rape

Also, I see that you're a Christian, and just like any religious person I'm sure you love your scripture (at least the parts they pick, the rest (as we know) discard it with the line "it was ok at the time" or any such).
So here's some for you now, just for you to mull over:

[QUOTE]"They must be dividing the spoil they took: there must be a damsel or two for each man…" Judges 5:30 and "For I [God] will gather all the nations against Jerusalem to battle, and the city shall be taken and the houses looted and the women raped;..." Zechariah 14:2

[alcurad]

People are not stupid, they do not need to be told what to watch and what to not watch.
Anyone who would deem it as acceptable to rape someone in real life has a mental illness.

mostly agree, it really depends on the person at that,,

[Keltoi]

I think the real issue is children. Adults can choose whether they wish to be exposed to pornography or not. But the changing nature of our culture has all but pushed sexuality onto our children at a very young age. I'm not talking sex education either. The music and movies our children are exposed to make it very difficult for a parent to shelter their children from it.

[Muezzin]

I was wondering this before. I stopped watching movies and shows that had gratuitous sexual references or jokes but then I still play videogames with gore/violence and cursing in it?

It seems like I mind cursing more than I do gore and violence and hate nudity above all but writing this now it seems... backwards?

All are bad I know but for some reason I'm having trouble seeing violence on par with nudity.

So guys what are your views?

My view is human beings are inherently messed up and destructive, and this is further evidence supporting that view. We'd rather expose our kids to images of the destruction of human life than the creation of it. Ideally, we'd expose them to neither, of course.

Heck, forget kids, think about grown-ups - would you be more embarassed being caught watching an ultra-violent action movie or some ultra-rude nudie flick? Not many in polite society would even want to watch an ultra-rude nudie flick to begin with. That's good. But how come we're so quick to go and watch Arnie blow the hell out of something? Yeah, it's fun, but why do we as audience members find this sort of violence fun to watch?

On a more basic level, it's pretty revealing that conflict is the core of drama, and tragedy the core of comedy.

Ah well. That's enough misanthropy for one day.

[alcurad]

My view is human beings are inherently messed up and destructive, and this is further evidence supporting that view. We'd rather expose our kids to images of the destruction of human life than the creation of it. Ideally, we'd expose them to neither, of course.

but muezzin, the example doesn't support the proposition, that happens nowadays, not throughout all time.

anyway, perhaps the values of patriarchal society are that way, too much sexualized nudity and you have a weaker population less capable of enacting violence, justified or not is another issue.
although as it were, nudity in our modern societies has lowered the status of women significantly, women are usually used for their looks regardless of where, it is an effective means of advertising, but it has worsened the situation, in my view most western societies don't have much objection not to mention awareness of that.
my main point in my first post was that nowadays especially nudity and what it entails are easy to maintain, violence is not.

[Muezzin]

but muezzin, the example doesn't support the proposition, that happens nowadays, not throughout all time.

Er... It pretty much has happened throughout time. What's happened is, we've found more ways and better technology to exploit it.

Humans have lust and bloodlust. They just choose to indulge the latter publically. Roman gladiators? The general sort of 'glory of battle' mentality throughout most civilisations? Capital punishment as community entertainment? Modern blood sports? Boxing?

The more usual sort of lust has been and will be indulged privately forever.

Same goes for conflict being the basis of drama and tragedy the basis of comedy. These are all very primal things.

anyway, perhaps the values of patriarchal society are that way, too much sexualized nudity and you have a weaker population less capable of enacting violence, justified or not is another issue.

I don't know. Bloodlust and normal lust are two equally destructive extremes. It's just weird that we tend to think the former is somehow less embarassing than the latter.

although as it were, nudity in our modern societies has lowered the status of women significantly, women are usually used for their looks regardless of where, it is an effective means of advertising, but it has worsened the situation, in my view most western societies don't have much objection not to mention awareness of that.

Oh, I agree about what you say about the objectification of women and everything. That sort of behaviour is not right. I just find it weird that people tend not to find ritualised violence wrong. Heck, I enjoy watching action movies and the like (I'm a male born in the 80's, I didn't have much of a choice :p) - I'm just curious as to where exactly this sort of destructive machismo in a lot of people comes from, and why we tolerate, or even celebrate, it.

[Grace Seeker]

What an absolute shocker of a statement to make.

Peace

Yes, but I can see where it is coming from. For instance....
And where do these acts originate? But in the perverted fantasies stimulated and condoned by pornography.

Could be quite the opposite.
There was been rape long before mass pornography.

Did you read the articles? Yes, there was rape before mass pornography. But one of the key words here is your modifier, "mass".

Greetings Grace Seeker,

In all of the situations you mention, violence is the major problem, not nudity.

Peace

Yes, I clearly said that there was a difference between nudity and pornography much eariler in the discussion.

[Grace Seeker]

Ted Bundy may have been looking at a lot of porn but some reports state he was diagnosed with 3 different personality disorders, which left him with a will to dominate others without remorse.

Probably not the best example of what pornography might do to your average man (or woman) on the street.

Granted that Bundy was more than your average sicko, but he also was more than your average mass murderer. What Bundy's life points out is that these things begin long before we see the effects. There was a time when Bundy appeared and behaved normal. If one goes into prisons (and I have worked in them) one finds three things: alcohol, drugs, and pornography. These things are shared factors among 75-80% of any given prison population. (At least in the USA, which is all I know.) Now, I don't mean that these are things they are accessing and sharing in prison (though that is true too), but I mean that they were involved in these things at one level or another before they committed the criminal acts for which they were ultimately sent to prison.

[BlackMamba]

In the Quran Allah tells men and women to lower their gaze (Surah Noor ayah 30-31). If a movie has nudity then it is real nudity like its real women without clothes. So it would be haram to look at.
But violence in movies is fake, its not real. The blood coming out is like ketchup or something. So while it might not be good to watch violence, its not as bad as nudity.

[Azy]

Granted that Bundy was more than your average sicko, but he also was more than your average mass murderer. What Bundy's life points out is that these things begin long before we see the effects. There was a time when Bundy appeared and behaved normal.

Bundy 'behaved normal' most of the time, of course he did, that is part and parcel of his disorder and how he managed to evade capture for so long. You could probably meet up with him 5 minutes after he'd strangled a woman and had sex with her corpse and not notice anything unusual about his demeanour. Bundy expressed that he didn't understand social relationships in his early teens and it's suspected he killed his first victim when he was 14.

Slightly twisted upbringing too. :)

If one goes into prisons (and I have worked in them) one finds three things: alcohol, drugs, and pornography. These things are shared factors among 75-80% of any given prison population. (At least in the USA, which is all I know.) Now, I don't mean that these are things they are accessing and sharing in prison (though that is true too), but I mean that they were involved in these things at one level or another before they committed the criminal acts for which they were ultimately sent to prison.

90+% ate bread and drove a car, it doesn't necessarily mean there is causation.

"empirical research designed to clarify the question has found no evidence to date that exposure to explicit sexual materials plays a significant role in the causation of delinquent or criminal behaviour among youth or adults."
- United States Commission on Obscenity and Pornography

"The aggregate data on rape and other violent or sexual offences from four countries where pornography, including aggressive varieties, has become widely and easily available during the period we have dealt with would seem to exclude, beyond any reasonable doubt, that this availability has had any detrimental effects in the form of increased sexual violence. ... As far as the other forms of sexual violence are concerned, the remarkable fact is that they decreased - the more so, the more serious the offence." - Kutchinsky, 1991

"the vast majority of people can view the kind of so-called pornography I've been talking about and not be moved this way. Why?" - Ted Bundy

[Woodrow]

I suppose over time people have become numb to exploding limbs and the f bomb. Nudity is probably the last thing "we" will eventually become numb to. It probably isn't that far off.

True, that is basically Festinger's inoculation theory of personality development.

We adapt to what we are frequently exposed to and it eventually becomes the acceptable norm from our view.

This is the big danger of exposure to nudity, it becomes acceptable and harmless to us. We are accustomed to seeing people daily, it is a very small step going from seeing dressed people to seeing nudity etc. Nudity and inappropriate sexual behavior are already close to being seen as acceptable to each of us, as a result very little exposure is needed in photographs, movies, games etc. for us to accept it as normal and becoming ingrained as acceptable part of our personality.

[Chuck]

Bundy 'behaved normal' most of the time, of course he did, that is part and parcel of his disorder and how he managed to evade capture for so long. You could probably meet up with him 5 minutes after he'd strangled a woman and had sex with her corpse and not notice anything unusual about his demeanour. Bundy expressed that he didn't understand social relationships in his early teens and it's suspected he killed his first victim when he was 14.

Slightly twisted upbringing too. :)
90+% ate bread and drove a car, it doesn't necessarily mean there is causation.

"empirical research designed to clarify the question has found no evidence to date that exposure to explicit sexual materials plays a significant role in the causation of delinquent or criminal behaviour among youth or adults."
- United States Commission on Obscenity and Pornography

"The aggregate data on rape and other violent or sexual offences from four countries where pornography, including aggressive varieties, has become widely and easily available during the period we have dealt with would seem to exclude, beyond any reasonable doubt, that this availability has had any detrimental effects in the form of increased sexual violence. ... As far as the other forms of sexual violence are concerned, the remarkable fact is that they decreased - the more so, the more serious the offence." - Kutchinsky, 1991

"the vast majority of people can view the kind of so-called pornography I've been talking about and not be moved this way. Why?" - Ted Bundy

well here is bundy's own words:

In the Dobson interview before his execution, Bundy said that violent pornography played a major role in his sex crimes. According to Bundy, as a young boy he found "outside the home again, in the local grocery store, in a local drug store, the soft core pornography that people called soft core...And from time to time we would come across pornographic books of a harder nature...."[109] Bundy said, "It happened in stages, gradually. My experience with pornography generally, but with pornography that deals on a violent level with sexuality, is once you become addicted to it — and I look at this as a kind of addiction like other kinds of addiction — I would keep looking for more potent, more explicit, more graphic kinds of material. Until you reach a point where the pornography only goes so far, you reach that jumping off point where you begin to wonder if maybe actually doing it would give that which is beyond just reading it or looking at it."[109]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ted_Bundy#Pathology

[Azy]

I think there might be a problem with applying the behaviour of a sociopath/psychopath to the (relatively) normal people around you.

[Woodrow]

I think there might be a problem with applying the behaviour of a sociopath/psychopath to the (relatively) normal people around you.

Unless you see a connection between sociopathic behavior and environment. (Psychopathology is an illness, not related much to environment) However, sociopath behavior can be taught to "normal" people. ie: The guards at Auschwitz, Radical group exposure KKK, Skinheads etc.

The same factors occur from over exposure to violence, nudity etc. A person's acceptance of either becomes more liberal with more exposure. Changing the person's personality to accepting that which the "norm" does not accept, in other words sociopathic behavior or acceptance of such.

[Azy]

Unless you see a connection between sociopathic behavior and environment. (Psychopathology is an illness, not related much to environment) However, sociopath behavior can be taught to "normal" people. ie: The guards at Auschwitz, Radical group exposure KKK, Skinheads etc. The same factors occur from over exposure to violence, nudity etc. A person's acceptance of either becomes more liberal with more exposure. Changing the person's personality to accepting that which the "norm" does not accept, in other words sociopathic behavior or acceptance of such.

A true sociopath is not simply someone who behaves differently from the norm but is very different psychologically speaking. They generally have some abnormal brain development and suffered an uncaring or abusive upbringing, and as a result do not feel emotion in the same way others do, if at all.

[Woodrow]

A true sociopath is not simply someone who behaves differently from the norm but is very different psychologically speaking. They generally have some abnormal brain development and suffered an uncaring or abusive upbringing, and as a result do not feel emotion in the same way others do, if at all.

That is more of a description of an amoral personality disorder. while it is true sociopath behavior is an indicator of an amoral personality a sociopath is not necessarily amoral.

[Azy]

That is more of a description of an amoral personality disorder. while it is true sociopath behavior is an indicator of an amoral personality a sociopath is not necessarily amoral.

I think some degree of empathy is required for a person to be moral and a lack of empathy is essentially one of the hallmarks of a sociopath.