things I like about Islam

[ATHEISTofPEACE]

I think of the three monotheism I like Islam the best. Here are some of the reasons why. Please not this is not about all religions just the three.

Mankind's decent from Eden is not just Eves/womans fault.

Original Sin does not exist. This is appealing. Humans are not born with sin
disgust me. Also the Christians contradict them selves. We have original sin because of Adam and Eve but most Christians think this story did not really happen. Well a large amount of them anyways and Jesus died to free us from our imaginary created original sin. Makes no sense. Ohh and if the creator is perfect and he created us we should be perfect. Original sin is a creator not being perfect. So Islam avoids these contradictions.

Jesus. He is God. He is Gods avatar. He is Gods Son. He is Gods sons avatar? Come on.

The Trinity-It makes less sense then one good or many gods.

Mohamed(PBUH) There is no doubt that he existed. We know for a fact that he did.

Devil- is not an angel rebelling against God, for God giving man free will. How does one rebel against God with out free will/

devil/hell- if the devil is a fallen angel against God why does he do gods work and run hell? why would he make hell bad? Really just silly.


Muslims at least try to make scientific arguments.


peace
mick

[Woodrow]

I believe that as you learn more you will find more things that make Islam the logical choice for a theist. Our emphasis on personal responsibility for our actions is one thing that has always impressed me, even in my non-Muslim days. we do not expect a scapegoat to take the blunt of the punishment for our own Faux pas. we do the crime, we pay the time. we don't don't look for somebody to come bail us out.

[ATHEISTofPEACE]

I would not say it is the most logical or appealining religion bu,t it is for the three monotheisms.

[Woodrow]

I would not say it is the most logical or appealining religion but it is for the thre monotheisms.

I might be a touch biased. I love everything about Islam. Although if I had not found monotheism to be true, I would have been very attracted to the Native Religion of the Cherokee.

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[ATHEISTofPEACE]

I might be a touch biased. I love everything about Islam. Although if I had not found monotheism to be true, I would have been very attracted to the Native Religion of the Cherokee.

For me i would be a Daoist Shaman before anything else. Comparing Islam to non monotheism religious should be a different thread.
I was hoping other non Muslims could join me in saying what we like about Islam and Muslims and the Muslim members could comment off of that.

What do ya think?

Anyways every week Campus Crusaders for Christ meet up. I am almost there offical atheist member. I was thinking I could go one time and argue that Islam is more right then Christianity. It would be easyer then saying you are just wrong lol. What do you guys think?

[جوري]

^^ I say you are probably setting yourself up to be crucified.. honestly I can't remember how many times I was cornered by Christians during my undergrad, then they become relentless in their pursuits... It isn't worth your time if (religion) is a mere hobby for you, I wouldn't turn it into a major...

[ATHEISTofPEACE]

^^ I say you are probably setting yourself up to be crucified.. honestly I can't remember how many times I was cornered by Christians during my undergrad, then they become relentless in their pursuits... It isn't worth your time if (religion) is a mere hobby for you, I wouldn't turn it into a major...

My Bold. Why not? Its funny you say that. I think about it all the time. I would love to be a theology major and so many students and teachers think I would excel there. Why do you think I should not?


My Red hahaha. That was perfect. These are the ultra liberal Christians. Last time I had to deal with being told how cute I was. (maybe thats why I want to go back) For real. I am not worried about being swarmed or over whelmed. I mean come on they know I post and mod an Islamic forum. Some even know I just joined here. (The following is a joke) I mean they know I can debate with the big, bad, and scary Fundy extremist Muslims. They gotta be afraid of me right? (Joke) Not something I am worried about.

My Blue Religion is more then a hobby to me. It is the subject I am most passionately interested in. It is more then a mere hobby. It is the hobby.

[Woodrow]

My Bold. Why not? Its funny you say that. I think about it all the time. I would love to be a theology major and so many students and teachers think I would excel there. Why do you think I should not?


My Red hahaha. That was perfect. These are the ultra liberal Christians. Last time I had to deal with being told how cute I was. (maybe thats why I want to go back) For real. I am not worried about being swarmed or over whelmed. I mean come on they know I post and mod an Islamic forum. Some even know I just joined here. (The following is a joke) I mean they know I can debate with the big, bad, and scary Fundy extremist Muslims. They gotta be afraid of me right? (Joke) Not something I am worried about.

My Blue Religion is more then a hobby to me. It is the subject I am most passionately interested in. It is more then a mere hobby. It is the hobby.

I do not question your ability to debate. I have seen some of your debates on other forums and agree you have well honed skills. but, perhaps it would be best of taking a position you truly believe in and debate from that approach. I think that would be more constructive to yourself on a personal level.

[ATHEISTofPEACE]

I do not question your ability to debate. I have seen some of your debates on other forums and agree you have well honed skills. but, perhaps it would be best of taking a position you truly believe in and debate from that approach. I think that would be more constructive to yourself on a personal level.

Ahh but it is always fun to play devils advocate, erh, Gods advocate. It would be a good way to learn, teach them about Muslims and Islam, and besides I really can't win a debate from atheism.

Well you have seen the invoke the FSM arguments right? They alwasy fail to show theist this is what you sound like to me. If I were to say Islam is more true then Christianity they could not just scuff it off because Islam is real. Also I do think it is more logicaly. This does not mean I think Islam is logical just that Christianity is that much more absurd in its claims. So I would be arguing something I agree with. And they get to learn. Sounds like you really think it is a bad idea then?

Well how should I go to the next meeting ? What do you all think?

@Woodrow Can you split this thread from where we start talking about CCC. But make a copy of the first post I mention CCC and leave one in hear and make a new thread from that post and on call Campus Crusaders For Christ. Wait do you think we are really derailed?

[Woodrow]

Ahh but it is always fun to play devils advocate, erh, Gods advocate. It would be a good way to learn, teach them about Muslims and Islam, and besides I really can't win a debate from atheism.

Well you have seen the invoke the FSM arguments right? They alwasy fail to show theist this is what you sound like to me. If I were to say Islam is more true then Christianity they could not just scuff it off because Islam is real. Also I do think it is more logicaly. This does not mean I think Islam is logical just that Christianity is that much more absurd in its claims. So I would be arguing something I agree with. And they get to learn. Sounds like you really think it is a bad idea then?

Well how should I go to the next meeting ? What do you all think?

@Woodrow Can you split this thread from where we start talking about CCC. But make a copy of the first post I mention CCC and leave one in hear and make a new thread from that post and on call Campus Crusaders For Christ. Wait do you think we are really derailed?

No we are not derailed. Just an extension to show why you like Islam. You do have a good point in saying it makes more sense than Christianity and perhaps you do know enough to present a view as to how it makes more sense. Possibly limit the debate to one particular facet, rather then debating all aspects.

I think you have a fair grasp on how we do not have the trinitarian views of most Christian denomination. Perhaps a debate on the trinity from an Islamic view versus the Christian view.

Now to keep this on the original topic, do you feel that the Islamic totally monotheistic view of God(swt) makes more sense then the Trinitarian belief?

[ATHEISTofPEACE]

Now to keep this on the original topic, do you feel that the Islamic totally monotheistic view of God(swt) makes more sense then the Trinitarian belief?

Yes. But Polytheism and monotheism are at the moment equal. I also find the Hindu version of many gods=God better then the Trinity. In Hinduism its like polytheism thats really monotheism In Christianity its like monotheism that is really polytheism. Allah is more logical then the trinity.

Not this only because I am speaking comparitivly.

[coddles76]

Anyways every week Campus Crusaders for Christ meet up. I am almost there offical atheist member. I was thinking I could go one time and argue that Islam is more right then Christianity. It would be easyer then saying you are just wrong lol. What do you guys think?

How's about you become muslim first and then try to spread the word. I think that is a better proposition.

[coddles76]

Islam is appealing to me due to the fact it makes the most sense and has more than enough evidence to support its ideology. I for one will not and never grasp the logic of the trinity and really don't understand how others could. There more people try to make me understand there illogical it sounds so I guess its best for the christian not to try to explain it as it only makes the concept sound more silly. They should just concentrate on other aspects of christianity instead of trying to promote the father, son and the holy spirit are 1 in 3 and 3 in 1, they are not 3 but 1. Just typing it then got my head spinning

[ATHEISTofPEACE]

How's about you become muslim first and then try to spread the word. I think that is a better proposition.

See, you missed my point. *looks for the best wording*

[ATHEISTofPEACE]

There more people try to make me understand there illogical it sounds so I guess its best for the christian not to try to explain it as it only makes the concept sound more silly.

Wow. Can I use that? That works for so much for me as an atheist. Note that it includes things about Islam.

[coddles76]

Wow. Can I use that? That works for so much for me as an atheist. Note that it includes things about Islam.

Yes you can use it as much as you like but I don't think you'll have much success in quoting it against islam because you'll find that islam has a LOGICAL answer for everything.

[coddles76]

See, you missed my point. *looks for the best wording*

No I didn't miss the point, it was just my attempt and hoping that maybe you could join the Ummah of Islam and spread the word while being a muslim instead of an atheist :D

[ATHEISTofPEACE]

Yes you can use it as much as you like but I don't think you'll have much success in quoting it against islam because you'll find that islam has a LOGICAL answer for everything.

Yes they you all seem to do. I just disagree with most of it. There is one thing in Islam I find completly illogical, and that is that Allah needs no cause. That and if Allah needs no cause then why can the univers not have alwasy existed.

[north_malaysian]

i wonder why ther are no CCC peeps here... invite them

[coddles76]

Yes they you all seem to do. I just disagree with most of it. There is one thing in Islam I find completly illogical, and that is that Allah needs no cause. That and if Allah needs no cause then why can the univers not have alwasy existed.

Allah SWT is the creator. He would not need to be known as the creator without creation just like a painter is not a painter without paintings. Allah is the creator and always creates and we are one of those creations.

[ATHEISTofPEACE]

i wonder why ther are no CCC peeps here... invite them

I have been working on brining them to TMZ. I think a few will come to TMZ

[ATHEISTofPEACE]

Allah SWT is the creator. He would not need to be known as the creator without creation just like a painter is not a painter without paintings. Allah is the creator and always creates and we are one of those creations.

I get that part its the "fact" that he always existed with no cause that bugs me. Its even worse when a Muslim follows up by saying it is illogical of me to suggest that the universe has alwasy existed. But this is a topic for a diffrent thread. This is about what I like.

[coddles76]

I get that part its the "fact" that he always existed with no cause that bugs me. Its even worse when a Muslim follows up by saying it is illogical of me to suggest that the universe has alwasy existed. But this is a topic for a diffrent thread. This is about what I like.

I thought that's enough of a cause.
Anyway Well I will add that to my like list. I like the fact that Allah SWT is the creator and has created a beautiful creation better than any painter and his paintings.

[ATHEISTofPEACE]

There is at least some leeway with using condoms in Islam but no in Catholicism I like that.

[coddles76]

Hows about in islam you can be a women and devote your whole self to Allah SWT and then still marry and have kids while if your a nun devoting yourself then you can no longer get married or have kids. I think thats something I like about islam and atleast women don't miss out on alot of the good things in life, Cause I couldn't imagine my life now without my Son in it.

[ATHEISTofPEACE]

Hows about in islam you can be a women and devote your whole self to Allah SWT and then still marry and have kids while if your a nun devoting yourself then you can no longer get married or have kids. I think thats something I like about islam and atleast women don't miss out on alot of the good things in life, Cause I couldn't imagine my life now without my Son in it.

I like that too. That was a great one. Thank you :D

[ATHEISTofPEACE]

Islam has not stolen any pagan holidays. I like that.

[burdenofbeing]

There is one thing in islam, which I think is amazing, and understated.
Islam is the people's religion. People decide for themselves, people raise their voices against even the caliph, question even the prophet.

If it was a manufactured, or heavily distorted religion, it would be really silly to make a religion like this to rule the masses.

[ATHEISTofPEACE]

There is one thing in islam, which I think is amazing, and understated.
Islam is the people's religion. People decide for themselves, people raise their voices against even the caliph, question even the prophet.

If it was a manufactured, or heavily distorted religion, it would be really silly to make a religion like this to rule the masses.

Could you explain this please.

[Eric H]

Greetings and peace be with you ATHEISTofPEACE;

I was hoping other non Muslims could join me in saying what we like about Islam

I like the way Muslims pray five times a day, their sincere faith and trust in God, and how their bring their families up, I like many of the Muslims on this forum. We are all created by the same God.

Anyways every week Campus Crusaders for Christ meet up. I am almost there offical atheist member. I was thinking I could go one time and argue that Islam is more right then Christianity. It would be easyer then saying you are just wrong lol. What do you guys think?

Mick I am confused, how do you go about interfaith relations if your joy is in debating and almost taking sides?

In the spirit of praying for greater interfaith friendship and peace on Earth,

Eric

[YusufNoor]

Greetings and peace be with you ATHEISTofPEACE;

I like the way Muslims pray five times a day, their sincere faith and trust in God, and how their bring their families up, I like many of the Muslims on this forum. We are all created by the same God.

Mick I am confused, how do you go about interfaith relations if your joy is in debating and almost taking sides?

In the spirit of praying for greater interfaith friendship and peace on Earth,

Eric

:sl:

Peace Eric,

I like the way Muslims pray five times a day

this is actually a misconception, we don't pray 5 times a day, we perform Salat 5 times a day. we pray ALL DAY LONG!

the Arabic at the time of the Prophet, Salla Allahu Alayhe wa Salaam, is on a different/higher level than English. Salat IS translated as prayer, but only to give it a description that others understand. what we call du'a [supplication to Allah, Subhannahu Wa Ta' Aala] IS prayer! there are du'as is Salat, but Salat is formal worship done in a specific manner.

we make du'a when we: wake up, go to the bathroom, exit the bathroom, bfore we eat, after we eat, when we wash or make wuduu, when we finsh making wuduu, when we leave the house, when we enter the house, when we start a journey, when we finish a journey, when we greet each other, etc. we seek Allah, Subhannahu Wa Ta' Aala's Protection and Blessings through out the entire day.

Mufti Ismail Menk describes it a bit here:
http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...26761126106509

i urge you to watch it and, In Sha'a Allah, you will understand what i mean. and of course, i urge our Atheist companion to watch as well.

:w:

[~Taalibah~]

Alhamdulillah, I like everything about Islam.
Its the perfect system for mankind.

[ATHEISTofPEACE]

@ Eric I am working hard on your question to show you where we are not seeing eye to eye. For now I will just say that what you assumed with your question is not so. I mean when I do "host" interfaith talks I will not debate nor take sides. When I go to CCC means I am not doing interfaith talks it is me and a bunch of Christians.

Would you like me to make a thread "what I like about Christianity" Cause there are somethings I like about it more. These things are more emotional appeal.


@YusufNoor I am aware of that. =D I will watch the vido as soo as I can

@sabeeha Of course you do. What do you think about the things me and Eric have said we liked? Do you like anything about Islam more then something else?

[Nσσя'υℓ Jαииαн]

I love my status as a Muslim woman in Islam :) Islam has risen the status of the Muslim woman in such a manner, I have yet to see given to other women.

[nebula]

wow athiest you were born on the same day as me.

[Cern]

How's about you become muslim first and then try to spread the word. I think that is a better proposition.

Sometimes being the 3rd party allows one to remain more rational. I am not saying a Christian or Muslim isn't rational but one who follows a faith tends to be more biased towards what they believe in. One issue you can run into (and this can be a biggie) as a 3rd party is that you might represent a religion falsely since you don't fully believe in it, follow it, or over time correctly learn it.

[ATHEISTofPEACE]

Sometimes being the 3rd party allows one to remain more rational. I am not saying a Christian or Muslim isn't rational but one who follows a faith tends to be more biased towards what they believe in. One issue you can run into (and this can be a biggie) as a 3rd party is that you might represent a religion falsely since you don't fully believe in it, follow it, or over time correctly learn it.

Both halves of what you said are true.

[Tornado]

I think of the three monotheism...

IMO, of those three monotheism, I'd prefer Judaism because (ASAIK) there's no hell as described in the other two.

What do you think of Judaism ATHEISTofPEACE?

[ATHEISTofPEACE]

I would put it as number two on the list.

[Follower]

What do I like about Islam?

The Muslims - the people. I enjoy talking religion. Their discussions always make my own faith and understanding of Christianity grow much stronger. They ask great questions.

Actually some would say that a pagan experience was adopted by Islam. Mohammad did the very same thing some of the later church fathers did by getting rid of the idols and inserting a different meaning into the pagan event.

If I wasn't Christian I would be Jewish.

[ATHEISTofPEACE]

He converted the temple but he did not still a holiday.?

[glo]

I like the simplicity of Islam.

Many Muslims I have met lead very simple lifestyles and place little emphasis on material wealth.
I also love the hospitality of Muslims - that's something I am really trying to get better at!

[coddles76]

Sometimes being the 3rd party allows one to remain more rational. I am not saying a Christian or Muslim isn't rational but one who follows a faith tends to be more biased towards what they believe in. One issue you can run into (and this can be a biggie) as a 3rd party is that you might represent a religion falsely since you don't fully believe in it, follow it, or over time correctly learn it.

Yes, I agree. Well Said cern. I guess both sides has its negatives and positives. I was just hoping that my comments might persuade Atheistofpeace to accept islam, Even though the ultimate decision of that reversion lies in Allah SWT, but you never know, it might tickle something in his heart and mind ;):D

[Follower]

glo said- I like the simplicity of Islam.

I am surprised you say that? Maybe I am just a renegade but to me they have to follow way too many rituals, pray at a specific time, say certain prayers at certain times, face a certain way when praying. Go on pilgramage. They must wash correctly before prayers and at times have to rewash. To actually read the words of Allah they must learn Arabic. They can't even touch certain animals, not eat others. I have heard Muslims can't eat Jello is that right? Their women have to make sure their hair is covered and they can not make eye contact with men. After child-birth the mother must not pray or fast, touch the Kuran or enter a mosque for forty days?

glo - I could go on but maybe it it the fact that everything is lined out for what you have to do that makes it seem so simple?

Many Muslims I have met lead very simple lifestyles and place little emphasis on material wealth.

Many Christians have very unmaterialistic lives- especially the poor ones LOL! No really look at the Mennonites and Amish. I would love to visit an Amish farm for a weekend.

Yes this is very true-
I also love the hospitality of Muslims - that's something I am really trying to get better at!

[جوري]

Always better to dance like possessed cultists in church to the organ than to preform proper prayer I agree indeed. Given that is exactly how Jesus did it!

Not fasting or praying during menses is for the woman's benefit, if you actually understand a thing about physiology..

also I thought your women had to be covered up too, you should read Ezekiel and Corinthians ey?
(1 Corinthians 11:3-12)

The head of every man is Christ, and the head of the woman is man, and the head of Christ is God. Every man who prays or prophesies with his head covered dishonors his head. And every woman who prays or prophesies with her head uncovered dishonors her head—it is just as though her head were shaved. If a woman does not cover her head, she should have her hair cut off; and if it is a disgrace for a woman to have her hair cut or shaved off, she should cover her head. A man ought not to cover his head,[a] since he is the image and glory of God; but the woman is the glory of man. For man did not come from woman, but woman from man; neither was man created for woman, but woman for man. For this reason, and because of the angels the woman ought to have a sign of authority on her head.

plus these others I immensely enjoy, especially when you play comparison games

Genesis 3:16 Unto the woman he said, I will greatly multiply thy sorrow and thy conception; in sorrow thou shalt bring forth children; and thy desire shall be to thy husband, and he shall rule over thee.
Is.3:12 As for my people, children are their oppressors, and women rule over them.
1 Cor.11:3 "But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God."
1 Cor.14:34-36 "Let your women keep silence in the churches: for it is not permitted unto them to speak; but they are commanded to be under obedience as also saith the law. And if they will learn any thing, let them ask their husbands at home: for it is a shame for women to speak in the church."
Eph.5:22-24 "Wives, submit yourselves unto your own husbands, as unto the Lord. For the husband is the head of the wife, even as Christ is the head of the church: and he is the saviour of the body. Therefore as the church is subject unto Christ, so let the wives be to their own husbands in every thing."
Col.3:18 "Wives, submit yourselves unto your own husbands, as it is fit in the Lord."
1 Tim.2:11-15 "Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection. But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence. For Adam was first formed, then Eve. And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression. Notwithstanding she shall be saved in childbearing
1 Pet.3:1 "Likewise, ye wives, be in subjection to your own husbands."


or are you a hypocrite?

[coddles76]

glo said- I like the simplicity of Islam.

I am surprised you say that? Maybe I am just a renegade but to me they have to follow way too many rituals, pray at a specific time, say certain prayers at certain times, face a certain way when praying. Go on pilgramage. They must wash correctly before prayers and at times have to rewash. To actually read the words of Allah they must learn Arabic. They can't even touch certain animals, not eat others. I have heard Muslims can't eat Jello is that right? Their women have to make sure their hair is covered and they can not make eye contact with men. After child-birth the mother must not pray or fast, touch the Kuran or enter a mosque for forty days?

glo - I could go on but maybe it it the fact that everything is lined out for what you have to do that makes it seem so simple?

Many Muslims I have met lead very simple lifestyles and place little emphasis on material wealth.

Many Christians have very unmaterialistic lives- especially the poor ones LOL! No really look at the Mennonites and Amish. I would love to visit an Amish farm for a weekend.

Yes this is very true-
I also love the hospitality of Muslims - that's something I am really trying to get better at!

Oh thats right we muslims do too much worship to please our creator, I forgot that Christ already died for our sins and has already saved us so we no longer have a duty to do much but to believe in that. I guess thats the simplicity your after.

[Cern]

Yes, I agree. Well Said cern. I guess both sides has its negatives and positives. I was just hoping that my comments might persuade Atheistofpeace to accept islam, Even though the ultimate decision of that reversion lies in Allah SWT, but you never know, it might tickle something in his heart and mind ;):D

Even I have been contemplating Islam as a religion but I am still hesitant. As I have researched several religions I am presented with the good, the bad and the misconceptions of each. Unfortunately Islam seems to have more misconceptions to Westerns and I think most is caused by the media portraying Islam as radical and extremist terrorists which only represents a small portion of the 1 billion Muslims worldwide. I will admit that there are some portions of Islam I have issues with but I still am researching and trying to find the truth behind the cloak of fog.

[ATHEISTofPEACE]

Ahhh please no flaming eachother.

[coddles76]

Even I have been contemplating Islam as a religion but I am still hesitant. As I have researched several religions I am presented with the good, the bad and the misconceptions of each. Unfortunately Islam seems to have more misconceptions to Westerns and I think most is caused by the media portraying Islam as radical and extremist terrorists which only represents a small portion of the 1 billion Muslims worldwide. I will admit that there are some portions of Islam I have issues with but I still am researching and trying to find the truth behind the cloak of fog.

Alhumdulillah, Praise be to Allah SWT.
If your sincere in your search for the truth Allah SWT will guide you there. We live in a global society run by misconceptions and a media campaign determined to break the law of Allah SWT but Allah SWT will perfect his deen even though the evil one's detest it. Seek knowledge, learn, gather information and inshAllah Allah SWT will provide answers to all your queries. Islam is the most logical way of life and will have a logical answer for all your questions if you ask and research in the right areas.
I pray that you seek what you are searching for.

[Woodrow]

Even I have been contemplating Islam as a religion but I am still hesitant. As I have researched several religions I am presented with the good, the bad and the misconceptions of each. Unfortunately Islam seems to have more misconceptions to Westerns and I think most is caused by the media portraying Islam as radical and extremist terrorists which only represents a small portion of the 1 billion Muslims worldwide. I will admit that there are some portions of Islam I have issues with but I still am researching and trying to find the truth behind the cloak of fog.

NO PERSON HAS THE POWER OR THE RIGHT TO MAKE YOU ACCEPT ISLAM.

This is a choice only you can make. All that can be expected is that you investigate every aspect fully and base any choice you make upon your own findings.

Search, ask questions, read all sides and follow what you find to be true.

[burdenofbeing]

NO PERSON HAS THE POWER OR THE RIGHT TO MAKE YOU ACCEPT ISLAM.

This is a choice only you can make. All that can be expected is that you investigate every aspect fully and base any choice you make upon your own findings.

Search, ask questions, read all sides and follow what you find to be true.

you know, that's one of the things I can't really understand. What if I've searched with all my might in humility, and I didn't reach the destination islam? would I be still worse than an ignorant person born into a muslim family, and followed islam like following customs?

[Woodrow]

you know, that's one of the things I can't really understand. What if I've searched with all my might in humility, and I didn't reach the destination islam? would I be still worse than an ignorant person born into a muslim family, and followed islam like following customs?

:sl:

I was not raised Muslim and did not accept Islam until at what would be considered an elderly age, My view and opinion will probably differ from that of a younger person who lived an Islamic life since birth.

But, in my opinion I believe it all depends on your intention. do you sincerly want to please Allaah(swt) and simply are not certain as to how or is your intent to please family and friends? Answer that honestly and you should see the answer to your question.

[coddles76]

you know, that's one of the things I can't really understand. What if I've searched with all my might in humility, and I didn't reach the destination islam? would I be still worse than an ignorant person born into a muslim family, and followed islam like following customs?

Allah SWT knows the secrets of the heart, You cannot hide anything from Allah SWT. There are two things in questions here, Patience and sincerity. If these things are incorporated within your mighty search with the ulitmate goal of reaching the pleasure of Allah SWT then there is NO WAY Allah SWT will let you down and he will lead you to what you seek. Allah SWT knows whats in your heart remember and if your sincere and patient enough your destination will be reached. There are no tricks here you cannot decieve the almighty by saying "I've tried my hardest to reach my goal" But deep down inside your goals are elsewhere.

[burdenofbeing]

so, if I haven't reached islam, it must mean that I wasn't honest or searching hard enough? I mean, there are many here in turkey, who treat islam as it's just tradition. or say that they are muslims, but do not know anything about it. there are people who commit zina frequently, but take ghusl afterwards to "be clean" they get to cleanse their sins (at worst) in hell and then enjoy an eternal heaven, while a person on search for his existantial truth spends an eternity in hell?

Now, I know, if there were something like "if you search hard enough you and be a good fella, and still fail to become a muslim, you will go to heaven" people would exploit it immensely. but.. I don't know.

I don't care much about what my family and friends think of me. I'm not dependant on others very much. However I look, I'm alone in this life, and the life itself is finite. Compared with an eternity of any of the possibilities, this life is non-existant. Of this, I have no doubt. I mean, I'm a born muslim, and I'm looking all over the place to beat my doubts, I don't tell myself to take it easy, I don't take comfort in ignorance and such... This much should be obvious.

Anyway, my question was hypothetical and not really about me. :P

[Woodrow]

so, if I haven't reached islam, it must mean that I wasn't honest or searching hard enough? I mean, there are many here in turkey, who treat islam as it's just tradition. or say that they are muslims, but do not know anything about it. there are people who commit zina frequently, but take ghusl afterwards to "be clean" they get to cleanse their sins (at worst) in hell and then enjoy an eternal heaven, while a person on search for his existantial truth spends an eternity in hell?

Now, I know, if there were something like "if you search hard enough you and be a good fella, and still fail to become a muslim, you will go to heaven" people would exploit it immensely. but.. I don't know.

I don't care much about what my family and friends think of me. I'm not dependant on others very much. However I look, I'm alone in this life, and the life itself is finite. Compared with an eternity of any of the possibilities, this life is non-existant. Of this, I have no doubt. I mean, I'm a born muslim, and I'm looking all over the place to beat my doubts, I don't tell myself to take it easy, I don't take comfort in ignorance and such... This much should be obvious.

Anyway, my question was hypothetical and not really about me. :P

I realized after I posted my reply was directed as if it were towards you. I did understand you meant it to be hypothetical, my reply was worded wrong.

Now getting back to the question. Keep in mind not one of us knows who will go to Jannah. Fortunately, not one of us has the power to make that judgment. But, we do know that all people will be judged with fairness and mercy.

We do have the responsibility to guide people to Islam, in the best of our ability, but who is and who is not accepting of Islam is not within our control. We can not make an undeserving person go to Jannah and we can not srop a deserving person from going to JANNAH AND WE DO NOT KNOW WHO WILL BE DESERVING.

[burdenofbeing]

I know. Not even the prophet had that ability. I know that this is in the core of islamic belief. Only Allah can give hidayah (sic?). But if so, does it mean that every person that tries hard to look and understand life, and his place in it, will he eventually be given opportunities to reach islam?

Jannah is nice of course, I don't belittle it. But haq ul yaqeen is the greatest thing I can think of. I sincerely hope eventually I can be there.

[Hafswa]

I like the simplicity of Islam.

Many Muslims I have met lead very simple lifestyles and place little emphasis on material wealth.
I also love the hospitality of Muslims - that's something I am really trying to get better at!

Very true. Many preachers deviate from teaching and preach on prosperity and how to live a better life by getting this and that. Islam has demonstrated an acceptance of what Allah blesses you with.

To add on to this, I admire their dedication to pleasing Allah with simple things like saying Insha'allah or Bismillah because it is true, our seeing tomorrow is not given nor is the course our life takes either.

[Eric H]

Greetings and peace be with you ATHEISTofPEACE;

Eric I am working hard on your question to show you where we are not seeing eye to eye. For now I will just say that what you assumed with your question is not so. I mean when I do "host" interfaith talks I will not debate nor take sides.

The interfaith stance seems a tricky path to follow, I guess it is to seek justice for all people, the poor, widows, orphans, and the oppressed. Thirty thousand children die from grinding poverty and preventable disease every single day, children of every faith and no faith, all created by the same God. In many ways the interfaith stance becomes more powerful when you stand up for justice for people who are different from yourself.

When I go to CCC means I am not doing interfaith talks it is me and a bunch of Christians.

Fundamentalists of any faith appear narrow minded, and it might still be the place to talk about interfaith relations, rather than debating who is better than who.

Would you like me to make a thread "what I like about Christianity" Cause there are somethings I like about it more. These things are more emotional appeal.

I will leave that to you, however I would be more interested to hear about your thoughts on interfaith relations and any ideas for bringing us all together.

One more thing I like about Muslims is the way they fast and abstain.

In the spirit of praying for greater interfaith relations and peace on Earth

Eric

[~Raynn~]

The strong sense of community... :)

[Follower]

coddles said - Oh thats right we muslims do too much worship to please our creator, I forgot that Christ already died for our sins and has already saved us so we no longer have a duty to do much but to believe in that.

You have forgotten the part of the Holy Bible that says:

James 2
26As the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without deeds is dead.

Why do Muslims think you worship GOD more then the Christians? Why do you think your way is the only GOD pleasing way?

The Christian can dance, sing, play an instrument and do art to praise GOD. Everyday all day is in constant communion with GOD for many Christians. We can pray and praise silently. And yes some of us fast. No one around us needs to know, so very often no one knows!

We each have different gifts- all these can and are used to praise GOD.

[Nσσя'υℓ Jαииαн]

An honest question, what does that verse have to do with whether Christians dance and sing for praising God?

Don't answer it here cuz this thread was for another purpose.

[ATHEISTofPEACE]

I was talking to two of my atheist freinds at school. They agreed with what I said and felt that the Muslims they know were peacful people and that they hate the way the media portrays Islam and Muslims.