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Clover
05-25-2009, 02:24 AM
Hello, I am a ex-Christian, now I am a Taoist, I am here to learn about Islam. I do not come to debate religion, I come to learn. Debating gets no one nowhere, if you ask me.
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Yanal
05-25-2009, 03:51 AM
Welcome to the forum,that is great that you are interested to learn and not debate causing inflamming with members.

May I reccomend you to visit the following sections so you can full your brain capacity with the knowledge you need.
•Discover Islam
•New muslims
•And Comparative religion to confirm or erase doubts.

If you need help let me know and I will drop you a PM inshAllah.
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roohani.doctor
05-25-2009, 03:54 AM
Welcome!

You will learns loads here! :)

GOD BLESS
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Clover
05-25-2009, 03:55 AM
I have some questions, to anyone able to answer:

1. When can I put things in a Signature?
2. Will I ever be allowed to put a Avatar from my PC onto my Avatar Choice?
3. When do I become a Member instead of a Limited Member?

Thanks to Answers, if any come this way.
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Yanal
05-25-2009, 03:58 AM
1 and 3 are after 50 posts,avatar I do not know,maybe choose a custom one and check.
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Clover
05-25-2009, 04:01 AM
Originally Posted by Alpha Jr
1 and 3 are after 50 posts,avatar I do not know,maybe choose a custom one and check.
Thank you for the info.
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ژاله
05-25-2009, 05:54 AM
Welcome clover,hope u have a beneficial stay here!:)
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alcurad
05-25-2009, 06:05 AM
welcome clover :)
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Zarmina
05-25-2009, 06:16 AM
Welcome aboard.
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glo
05-25-2009, 07:24 AM
Welcome to LI, Clover. :welcome:

I gather the word in the 'Way of Life section' is spelled wrong. It says 'Toaist'. Perhaps that can be corrected ...
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Zico
05-25-2009, 08:15 AM
Originally Posted by Clover
Hello, I am a ex-Christian, now I am a Taoist, I am here to learn about Islam. I do not come to debate religion, I come to learn. Debating gets no one nowhere, if you ask me.
Why hello there to you too :D Hope you enjoy your stay here at LI as much as I do.
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aadil77
05-25-2009, 08:21 AM
Welcome
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Strzelecki
05-25-2009, 10:08 AM
Hello Clover.

What is Taoism? :)

In a nutshell.
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crayon
05-25-2009, 12:28 PM
Welcome Clover! It's nice to have a Taoist here, hope you can learn a bit about Islam, and perhaps teach us a bit about Taoism as well inshaAllah (God willing)! :)
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- Qatada -
05-25-2009, 02:55 PM
Hey Clover. :)


here's a good site as an intro for islam;

http://islamreligion.com


it might answer alot of the questions which you might have from the beginning.
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Clover
05-25-2009, 09:41 PM
Originally Posted by crayon
Welcome Clover! It's nice to have a Taoist here, hope you can learn a bit about Islam, and perhaps teach us a bit about Taoism as well inshaAllah (God willing)! :)
hehe, I am a student of Taoism, not a teacher, but students can converse among themselves to teach each other. The basics can be found in the Tao Te Ching, but if you have any questions, pm me, and I will do my best to help you.

Originally Posted by Sayf Udeen
Hello Clover.

What is Taoism? :)

In a nutshell.
hehe, funny question, in the beginning of the Tao Te Ching, it tells us straight forward "The Tao that can be spoken is not the eternal Tao" basically, I can tell you all I know about Taoism, and it never be all of it, no matter how much I tell you. Here is somewhat of my knowledge of it:

Tao is everything, and is nothing. It is the void, and it is the non-void. Tao is a car, Tao is the gas, Tao is the driver, Tao is the fan. In Tao, just like many other eastern philosophies, has Chi (Zen, Soul Power, Inner Strength) that can be channeled, and grown, through martial arts, meditation, and other forms.

If you want to know anymore, pm me, I'll do my best.

Originally Posted by glo
Welcome to LI, Clover. :welcome:

I gather the word in the 'Way of Life section' is spelled wrong. It says 'Toaist'. Perhaps that can be corrected ...
I have always spelled it like that, I do many things incorrectly due to repitition. I think, if we really wanted to get technical, it could be called Daoist, and the pronunciation of it has so many different ways. I was talking to a friend of mine who is Chinese, and he pronounced it, "Taoooism" with it sounding a lot like Towism, which I liked the prounciation better then my normal "taoism" lol.

Sorry for my mistake, thank you for pointing it out, I make that mistake sometimes.
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crayon
05-25-2009, 09:47 PM
I've read the Tao of Pooh, but I'm not sure how accurate a representation of Taoism that gives.. It was a while ago so I don't recall much, but I do remember it being interesting.
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Clover
05-25-2009, 09:59 PM
Originally Posted by crayon
I've read the Tao of Pooh, but I'm not sure how accurate a representation of Taoism that gives.. It was a while ago so I don't recall much, but I do remember it being interesting.
I have heard its a great book, and their are others, I believe their is one on Piglet, I hope I can read it soon.
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Bint-Al-Islam
05-25-2009, 11:27 PM
Hello there
Welcome to LI... May u benefit from this site.. Hope u learn a lot in here :)
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Abdul Fattah
06-14-2009, 02:14 PM
Hi, welcome to the forum
I respect your wish not to debate, but rather simply to seek knowledge, and consider it an honourable motive. I have some questions for you, and while they might seem as if attempting to instigating a debate, please consider them as merely seeking knowledge, and not seeking debate.

1) According to Tao Te Ching:
To conduct one's life according to the Tao,
is to conduct one's life without regrets;
to realize that potential within oneself
which is of benefit to all.
Regarding the part about no regrets, it seems you can interpret that in two (perhaps even more) ways. Either as a don't feel bad about what you've done, or don't do anything which you'll end up feeling bad for. The second part of the sentence, benefit for all, suggest the second interpretation is most probable. Is my deduction correct?

2) You wrote in your personal profile that you are considering enlisting in the US army. Can I deduce from that that you truly believe enlisting in the US army would "benefit all" including Iraqi and Afghan people which you might get send to? I mean the presence and actions of the US in those places has been so far highly controversial. I'm just curious how you see those things. Also from Tao Te Ching:
When leading by the way of the Tao,
abominate the use of force,
for it causes resistance, and loss of strength,
showing the Tao has not been followed well.
Achieve results but not through violence,
for it is against the natural way,
and damages both others' and one's own true self.
The harvest is destroyed in the wake of a great war,
and weeds grow in the fields in the wake of the army.
And:
Weapons of war are instruments of fear,
and are not favoured by the wise,
who use them only when there is no choice,
for peace and stillness are dear to their hearts,
and victory causes them no rejoicing.

3)again according to Tao Te Ching
Nature acts without intent,
so cannot be described
as acting with benevolence,
nor malevolence to any thing.
In this respect, the Tao is just the same,
though in reality it should be said
that nature follows the rule of Tao.
Therefore, even when he seems to act
in manner kind or benevolent,
the sage is not acting with such intent,
for in conscious matters such as these,
he is amoral and indifferent.
So we should act spontaneous on our nature while disregarding our sense of morality? How can you reach "that potential within oneself which is of benefit to all" like that? Isn't in our nature both the potential for evil as for good? Don't we need morality to choose which potential to follow, which part of our nature to indulge to?

4)Again from Tao Te Ching:
Through sight, the colours may be seen,
but too much colour blinds us.
Apprehending the tones of sound,
too much sound might make us deaf,
and too much flavour deadens taste.
When hunting for sport, and chasing for pleasure,
the mind easily becomes perplexed.
He who collects treasures for himself
more easily becomes anxious.
The wise person fulfills his needs,
rather than sensory temptations.
How can we tell the difference of our needs and our sensory temptations if we ignore our sense of morality?
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Clover
06-15-2009, 04:40 PM
Originally Posted by Abdul Fattah
Hi, welcome to the forum
I respect your wish not to debate, but rather simply to seek knowledge, and consider it an honourable motive. I have some questions for you, and while they might seem as if attempting to instigating a debate, please consider them as merely seeking knowledge, and not seeking debate.

1) According to Tao Te Ching:
To conduct one's life according to the Tao,
is to conduct one's life without regrets;
to realize that potential within oneself
which is of benefit to all.
Regarding the part about no regrets, it seems you can interpret that in two (perhaps even more) ways. Either as a don't feel bad about what you've done, or don't do anything which you'll end up feeling bad for. The second part of the sentence, benefit for all, suggest the second interpretation is most probable. Is my deduction correct?

2) You wrote in your personal profile that you are considering enlisting in the US army. Can I deduce from that that you truly believe enlisting in the US army would "benefit all" including Iraqi and Afghan people which you might get send to? I mean the presence and actions of the US in those places has been so far highly controversial. I'm just curious how you see those things. Also from Tao Te Ching:
When leading by the way of the Tao,
abominate the use of force,
for it causes resistance, and loss of strength,
showing the Tao has not been followed well.
Achieve results but not through violence,
for it is against the natural way,
and damages both others' and one's own true self.
The harvest is destroyed in the wake of a great war,
and weeds grow in the fields in the wake of the army.
And:
Weapons of war are instruments of fear,
and are not favoured by the wise,
who use them only when there is no choice,
for peace and stillness are dear to their hearts,
and victory causes them no rejoicing.

3)again according to Tao Te Ching
Nature acts without intent,
so cannot be described
as acting with benevolence,
nor malevolence to any thing.
In this respect, the Tao is just the same,
though in reality it should be said
that nature follows the rule of Tao.
Therefore, even when he seems to act
in manner kind or benevolent,
the sage is not acting with such intent,
for in conscious matters such as these,
he is amoral and indifferent.
So we should act spontaneous on our nature while disregarding our sense of morality? How can you reach "that potential within oneself which is of benefit to all" like that? Isn't in our nature both the potential for evil as for good? Don't we need morality to choose which potential to follow, which part of our nature to indulge to?

4)Again from Tao Te Ching:
Through sight, the colours may be seen,
but too much colour blinds us.
Apprehending the tones of sound,
too much sound might make us deaf,
and too much flavour deadens taste.
When hunting for sport, and chasing for pleasure,
the mind easily becomes perplexed.
He who collects treasures for himself
more easily becomes anxious.
The wise person fulfills his needs,
rather than sensory temptations.
How can we tell the difference of our needs and our sensory temptations if we ignore our sense of morality?
I will answer these, but I will not respond to a challenge of faith, if one is enacted in this.

1. Taoism is based on opinoin. It is my opinoin that Tao is real, and that it exists. It is not your's, I'd think, since you believen a god named Allah. Both of the 2 options are the same thing. In the end, living your life ot the fullest you wish, is what I'd say it's saying.

2. I am joining up. When you join the Army, your considering the fact that they will only send you when violence is neccessary. That is part of the Army, when you join, they don't tell you they will send you cause they feel like it, they will send you when it's needed.

3. Tao is not a diety, Tao is Tao. It cannot be explained fully, but part of Tao is natural laws. I believe what this part of the TTC is saying is, we cannot break the laws of naturality, hence, we cannot break Tao, cause everything and nothing is Tao.

4. Morality is a human term. We can live with it, no matter what, if we wish, but it's not always a good idea. In the TTC, as you've quoted, it's un-natural (Un-Tao) to break a river's current, yet we do this with dams, all the time, that is Un-Tao, and morality is the reason people do it, to feed others with the energy from it. I do not know how you got no morality out of this, but I guess you can. If your wanting to seriously debate the TTC then I advise you go to the Teahouse, they are much more seasoned then I am, and one of them wrote a version of the TTC, that I use.
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Abdul Fattah
06-15-2009, 04:45 PM
Hi,
Like I said, although the composition of the questions might make it seem as if instigating debate, I really just wanted to hear your opinions views. So thanks for your replies. ^_^
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muslimah4life
06-20-2009, 07:25 PM
welcome to li
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