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- IqRa -
06-19-2009, 11:28 AM
Putting off stuff for me would be:

- A fully grown beard
- Doesn't pray 5 times a day
- There has to be SOME attraction...even if it is a tiny bit (you're going to see the person's face everyday when u wake up for God's sake, u dont wanna see something u dont even like a little bit!)
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convert
06-19-2009, 12:16 PM
She must like her men to be fasiqeen.
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- IqRa -
06-19-2009, 12:47 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Alpha Dude
^ You'd be put off by a full grown beard? :><:
Yup. That's just me. Only close shaven beards, not the ones that are 2/3 fists long, lol.

What? Don't look at me like that. Everyone is entitled to their own choice.
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- IqRa -
06-19-2009, 12:48 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by convert
She must like her men to be fasiqeen.
Excuse me? What does fasiqeen mean?

And how many men do you see out there without beards, that are practising? Loads. So there. :-\
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convert
06-19-2009, 12:51 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by T.I.A
Excuse me? What does fasiqeen mean?

And how many men do you see out there without beards, that are practising? Loads. So there. :-\
Being as you are in Egypt and the brothers there have to deal with Firawn and the beard police, I won't be quite as harsh. However, brothers need to have a beard.

What you said would be equivalent to me saying: I want a sister who doesn't wear hijab/dress modestly.

fasiq = one who sins openly
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- IqRa -
06-19-2009, 12:54 PM
Well if a girl dresses modestly without hijab, i would see no reason to reject her proposal.
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convert
06-19-2009, 12:59 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by T.I.A
Well if a girl dresses modestly without hijab, i would see no reason to reject her proposal.
This is where we differ then; the only thing I would say to a sister without hijab in this situation is to advise her (in a non-harsh fashion, making sure I bring proof) to wear hijab.

She may have good character but to do such a thing is to openly violate commands of Allah. Now, if she were to wear hijab then speak with me again, I would reconsider. I am not going to force her to wear hijab or anything though.
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Banu_Hashim
06-19-2009, 02:09 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by T.I.A
Yup. That's just me. Only close shaven beards, not the ones that are 2/3 fists long, lol.

What? Don't look at me like that. Everyone is entitled to their own choice.
2/3 fists!? Who has a beard 2-3 fists long. 1 fist is the max it should be (depends how big your fist is :D)... That's the sunnah. To keep it nice and tidy, not to let it grow endlessly ...
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- IqRa -
06-19-2009, 02:31 PM
I even find 1 a bit :-\ Close shaven is good.
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Banu_Hashim
06-19-2009, 02:33 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by T.I.A
I even find 1 a bit :-\ Close shaven is good.
ok, that's your personal preference. But the prophet did say to the male Muslim community grow your beards and trim your moustaches.
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Sunni Ninja
06-19-2009, 02:38 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by T.I.A
Excuse me? What does fasiqeen mean?

And how many men do you see out there without beards, that are practising? Loads. So there. :-\
it depends on what u see as practicing.. because if a brother doesn't have a beard he isnt acting upon the sunnah unless he is really young and has health issues with hair growth.. but then again he will be reading his namaaz which will be seen as practising..
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convert
06-19-2009, 02:43 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Banu_Hashim
2/3 fists!? Who has a beard 2-3 fists long. 1 fist is the max it should be (depends how big your fist is :D)... That's the sunnah. To keep it nice and tidy, not to let it grow endlessly ...
Actually, no. The sunnah is to let it grow. It only came about after the prophet (saw) died that the beard was trimmed to a fist. The prophet's (saw) beard covered his upper chest.
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- IqRa -
06-19-2009, 02:43 PM
Sunni Ninja

A lot of Muslims girls don't wear niqab - thats Sunnah - so are you saying that girls who only wear hijab should be considered? SubhanAllah. Anyway I'm not getting into an argument - its your own personal choice.
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AntiKarateKid
06-19-2009, 02:44 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by convert
Being as you are in Egypt and the brothers there have to deal with Firawn and the beard police, I won't be quite as harsh. However, brothers need to have a beard.

What you said would be equivalent to me saying: I want a sister who doesn't wear hijab/dress modestly.

fasiq = one who sins openly
Are you kidding me. Way to blow something out of proportion. The Prophet did advise us to get beards but there is no age requirement. A man can grow a beard after marriage.

I plan on doing it after I get married and am more Islamically mature. Otherwise, its weird to see an immature guy with a beard. Its...not right.
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S_87
06-19-2009, 02:46 PM
both the niqab and beard according to one opinion is considered waajib....
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S_87
06-19-2009, 02:47 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by AntiKarateKid
Are you kidding me. Way to blow something out of proportion. The Prophet did advise us to get beards but there is no age requirement. A man can grow a beard after marriage.

I plan on doing it after I get married and am more Islamically mature. Otherwise, its weird to see an immature guy with a beard. Its...not right.
ok not hoping to make this a beard thread but ive heard the whole 'after i marry or become mature i will.....' who guaranteed youd get there? i mean if you dont want to fine, but dont put off the excuse that after youre married youd do it...because then its like youre just saying you know its something you have to do but...
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- IqRa -
06-19-2009, 02:48 PM
^ See that's what I don't believe. Sunnah and waajib are completely different things.

Hijab = Waajib
Niqaab = Sunnah

Covering Awrah (Male) = Waajib
Beard = Sunnah

Anyway, lets not go off topic.

Allah and His Messenger Know best.
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Sunni Ninja
06-19-2009, 02:49 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by T.I.A
Sunni Ninja

A lot of Muslims girls don't wear niqab - thats Sunnah - so are you saying that girls who only wear hijab should be considered? SubhanAllah. Anyway I'm not getting into an argument - its your own personal choice.
nah im not saying it shudnt be considered im just saying different people have different veiws on what they think is "practising.."
if one doesnt have a beard.. and doesnt wish to have a beard is something to think about before marriage i think.. others wudnt see it as important..
but if they dont have a beard but after marriage or later on in life they wud wish to then that will be different too...because they wil be acting upon the sunnah which i think is important..
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AntiKarateKid
06-19-2009, 02:49 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by amani
ok not hoping to make this a beard thread but ive heard the whole 'after i marry or become mature i will.....' who guaranteed youd get there?
I think I have more important Islamic things to worry about than my beard. I'll work on praying on time and learning more Surah's first before I feel comfortable taking on a more Islamic image.

But you are right in one way though. I don't know.

Besides... my mother is against it right now, apparently it makes me look too old LOL.
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AntiKarateKid
06-19-2009, 02:54 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Sunni Ninja
nah im not saying it shudnt be considered im just saying different people have different veiws on what they think is "practising.."
if one doesnt have a beard.. and doesnt wish to have a beard is something to think about before marriage i think.. others wudnt see it as important..
but if they dont have a beard but after marriage or later on in life they wud wish to then that will be different too...because they wil be acting upon the sunnah which i think is important..
If they are mindful of their prayers and have good manners then I doubt that a person should reject them because of...their beard?? Yes it is sunnah, but they are doing what is obligatory very well.

THAT should be our standard of practicing. Using a miswaak is sunna... do you do it? There are hundreds of things that are sunna. Perhaps I do one thing that is sunna that you don't..... Should I consider you non-practicing?
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- IqRa -
06-19-2009, 02:56 PM
Anywayyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy

Getting back to the topic lol
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convert
06-19-2009, 02:59 PM
When you say "sunnah" do you mean like how the 5 salawat are sunnah?

Also, I started growing my beard (and wearing kufi pretty much 24/7) because:

- its sunnah/wajib/fard
- as a white guy, how will people identiy me as a muslim if I don't?

If you don't want a brother that practices Islam fully then say so but don't make it out like there is debate over this issue. Yes I do know brothers (even scholars) who don't have full beards due to their lack of being able to grow one and I am not talking about them; I am talking about brothers with the ability to do so but they don't.

However, like I said, shaving doesn't mean you're not a muslim.

p.s. for those that neglect this issue, keep in mind that under the Ottoman caliphate, the testimony of a muslim brother who shaved was not accepted in court as they were considered fasiqs
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Sunni Ninja
06-19-2009, 03:03 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by AntiKarateKid
If they are mindful of their prayers and have good manners then I doubt that a person should reject them because of...their beard?? Yes it is sunnah, but they are doing what is obligatory very well.

THAT should be our standard of practicing. Using a miswaak is sunna... do you do it? There are hundreds of things that are sunna. Perhaps I do one thing that is sunna that you don't..... Should I consider you non-practicing?
im not saying that.. some people would see reading namaaz and doing just the fard as practising when others will see the fard and doing the sunnah as practising.. everyone has different views on what they see as practising..
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Ibn Abi Ahmed
06-19-2009, 04:11 PM
:sl:

'Sunnah' actually differs in meaning according to which type of scholar is using it or which context it's being used. For example, if scholars of theology use the word 'sunnah', they mean the Aqeedah of ahl al-Sunnah, whereas if the scholars of Usool use it they mean something else, and where scholars of Jurisprudence use it, they mean something else, and if I remember correctly, the earlier scholars of Fiqh used to use 'sunnah' along the same lines as Wajib, and Makrooh used to be used as another word for Haram, so arguing over terminology doesn't make a difference until it's sorted what exactly one intends by using the term.

That being said, the bare minimum for a male is to have hair on his face and cheeks, something that shows that he isn't a woman. To keep it longer is obviously better and preferred and it is well known that the Prophet (saw) had a thick long beard.

And as a reminder, lets not turn this into an issue that causes rifts within ourselves, as the obligation of unity is greater than the obligation of a beard.

That said, to correct some views expressed in this thread, the beard is not merely a 'sunnah' that one may leave or keep at one's own will, rather the early Imaams all considered this to be mandatory.

Shaikh Ahmad an-Nafarawi al-Maliki said in the commentary of Imam Abu Zaid’s Risala,
To shave the beard is without doubt haram according to all Imams”, it is also mentioned in ‘Tamhid’ which is a commentary of the Muwatta’ of Imam Malik that to shave the beard is haram and among males the only ones to resort to this (practice) are the hermaphrodites. (From the book “at-Tamhid”)
Applying the last line above is obviously erroneous in the context of today (i.e. not everyone that shaves is a hermaphrodite, there are multiple reasons why people choose to shave their beards), but I only wanted to show the importance the early Muslims placed upon the beard. Allaah knows best.

:w:
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nebula
06-19-2009, 04:15 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by T.I.A
^ See that's what I don't believe. Sunnah and waajib are completely different things.

Hijab = Waajib
Niqaab = Sunnah

Covering Awrah (Male) = Waajib
Beard = Sunnah

Anyway, lets not go off topic.

Allah and His Messenger Know best.
Sister, you are speaking without daleel, the Beard is Wajib, its wajib to let it grow, theres no such THING in hadeeth where the prophet Muhammad pbuh said keep it fist length thats made up and i really dont like it when people say that.

Beard=Wajib
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Ibn Abi Ahmed
06-19-2009, 04:19 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by nebula
Sister, you are speaking without daleel, the Beard is Wajib, its wajib to let it grow, theres no such THING in hadeeth where the prophet Muhammad pbuh said keep it fist length thats made up and i really dont like it when people say that.

Beard=Wajib
Trimming the beard to fist length has a basis akhi, and it comes from the notable Companions (radi allaahu anhum) who we know would never go do something if it was made Haraam by Allaah or His Messenger (saw):

From Marwaan bin Saalim al-Muqaffa’ who said, “I saw ibn Umar grasp his beard and cut off that which had exceeded a fistful.” Reported by Abu Dawood and others with a hasan chain.

From Naafi’ that Abdullah ibn Umar used to finish fasting in Ramadan and he intended to make hajj, then he would not take off any of his hair or beard until he had made hajj. And in another narration that when Abdullah bin Umar used to cut his hair after hajj or umrah he would also take from his beard and moustache. Reported by Maalik in al-Muwataa.

And al-Khalaal reports in “at-Tarajul” (p.11) with a saheeh chain from Mujaahid who said, “I saw ibn Umar grasp his beard on the day of Nahr then he said the cupper, “Take off what is below a fistful.” Al-Baajee said in “Sharh al-Muwattaa”, “meaning that he used to trim form it along with cutting his hair, and Maalik (rahimahullaah) recommended that since trimming it is in a way that does not alter the natural disposition of the creation in terms of beauty…”

Can we get back on topic please?
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MSN
06-19-2009, 04:41 PM
Isn't the topic about beard??That's pretty much stated!!
What's wrong with having a short beard?
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Rebel
06-21-2009, 08:50 AM
Otherwise, its weird to see an immature guy with a beard. Its...not right.
Exactly :X

What is this topic about, anyways :><:?
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Tony
06-21-2009, 09:15 AM
mine is growing as we speak, I am white and along with brother convert I want people to know I am muslim
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Ali_008
06-21-2009, 09:21 AM
:sl:

Prophet Muhammad (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) asked us males to keep a beard in order to differentiate from the mushrikeen:X. Yeah considering today's world, a beard has become a symbol of danger (terrorism, jihad:raging:) and a Muslim invites all sorts of dangers by keeping one but especially keeping it today will give us more reward. The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allah be upon him) said "At times of digression, whoever follows my sunnah will get a reward of 100 martyrs.:thumbs_up" So the beard is an expression of love for the Prophet.

I know everyone have their own preferences but I like to keep a beard though its just a "goatie":D:giggling:

Lets not impose anything on the sisters and beautify ourselves with our beaards :happy::shade::coolious::p
For some sisters, a close shave is a big turn-off
:beard::beard::beard::beard::beard::beard::beard:
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Muhammad
06-21-2009, 11:38 AM
:sl:

And on that note, I believe we can close this thread. We must always remember to put our personal preferences aside and give the Qur'an and the Sunnah the utmost importance.

It is not fitting for a Believer, man or woman, when a matter has been decided by Allah and His Messenger to have any option about their decision: if any one disobeys Allah and His Messenger, he is indeed on a clearly wrong Path. [Ahzab: 36]
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