Questions about Islam

[nihil est]

Here's my first one. Prior to the final revelation gifted to Muhammad, how did the previous generations of Muslims (for example, those in the time of Abraham) worship? Is it the same way that Muslims worship now, with the same positions and prostrations and words?

[_ALI_]

Salam nihil est

Here's my first one. Prior to the final revelation gifted to Muhammad, how did the previous generations of Muslims (for example, those in the time of Abraham) worship? Is it the same way that Muslims worship now, with the same positions and prostrations and words?

Quran/hadith do not clearly tell us how the Muslims before prophet Muhammad prayed. That is because it is not relevant for us. Allah will not ask me how people before the prophet prayed, but He will ask me whether I prayed or not. But certain verses of the Quran tells us that the method of praying for those previous Muslims was somewhat similar.

002.125 وَإِذْ جَعَلْنَا الْبَيْتَ مَثَابَةً لِلنَّاسِ وَأَمْنًا وَاتَّخِذُوا مِنْ مَقَامِ إِبْرَاهِيمَ مُصَلًّى وَعَهِدْنَا إِلَى إِبْرَاهِيمَ وَإِسْمَاعِيلَ أَنْ طَهِّرَا بَيْتِيَ لِلطَّائِفِينَ وَالْعَاكِفِينَ وَالرُّكَّعِ السُّجُودِ
002.125 Remember We made the House a place of assembly for men and a place of safety; and take ye the station of Abraham as a place of prayer; and We covenanted with Abraham and Isma'il, that they should sanctify My House for those who compass it round, or use it as a retreat, or bow, or prostrate themselves (therein in prayer).
Al-Qur'an, 002.125 (Al-Baqara [The Cow])
Text Copied from DivineIslam's Qur'an Viewer software v2.910
003.043 يَا مَرْيَمُ اقْنُتِي لِرَبِّكِ وَاسْجُدِي وَارْكَعِي مَعَ الرَّاكِعِينَ
003.043 "O Mary! worship Thy Lord devoutly: Prostrate thyself, and bow down (in prayer) with those who bow down."
Al-Qur'an, 003.043 (Aal-E-Imran [The Family of Imran])
Text Copied from DivineIslam's Qur'an Viewer software v2.910

019.058 أُولَئِكَ الَّذِينَ أَنْعَمَ اللَّهُ عَلَيْهِمْ مِنَ النَّبِيِّينَ مِنْ ذُرِّيَّةِ آدَمَ وَمِمَّنْ حَمَلْنَا مَعَ نُوحٍ وَمِنْ ذُرِّيَّةِ إِبْرَاهِيمَ وَإِسْرَائِيلَ وَمِمَّنْ هَدَيْنَا وَاجْتَبَيْنَا إِذَا تُتْلَى عَلَيْهِمْ آيَاتُ الرَّحْمَنِ خَرُّوا سُجَّدًا وَبُكِيًّا
019.058 Those were some of the prophets on whom Allah did bestow His Grace,- of the posterity of Adam, and of those who We carried (in the Ark) with Noah, and of the posterity of Abraham and Israel of those whom We guided and chose. Whenever the Signs of (Allah) Most Gracious were rehearsed to them, they would fall down in prostrate adoration and in tears.

Al-Qur'an, 019.058 (Maryam [Mary])

Text Copied from DivineIslam's Qur'an Viewer software v2.910
So as for positions and prostrations, that was a bit similar. But their recitations and our recitations cannot be identical since we recite Quran during our prayers and Muslims before the prophet did not have Quran.
Peace

[nihil est]

Salam nihil est

Quran/hadith do not clearly tell us how the Muslims before prophet Muhammad prayed. That is because it is not relevant for us. Allah will not ask me how people before the prophet prayed, but He will ask me whether I prayed or not. But certain verses of the Quran tells us that the method of praying for those previous Muslims was somewhat similar.

002.125 وَإِذْ جَعَلْنَا الْبَيْتَ مَثَابَةً لِلنَّاسِ وَأَمْنًا وَاتَّخِذُوا مِنْ مَقَامِ إِبْرَاهِيمَ مُصَلًّى وَعَهِدْنَا إِلَى إِبْرَاهِيمَ وَإِسْمَاعِيلَ أَنْ طَهِّرَا بَيْتِيَ لِلطَّائِفِينَ وَالْعَاكِفِينَ وَالرُّكَّعِ السُّجُودِ
002.125 Remember We made the House a place of assembly for men and a place of safety; and take ye the station of Abraham as a place of prayer; and We covenanted with Abraham and Isma'il, that they should sanctify My House for those who compass it round, or use it as a retreat, or bow, or prostrate themselves (therein in prayer).
Al-Qur'an, 002.125 (Al-Baqara [The Cow])
Text Copied from DivineIslam's Qur'an Viewer software v2.910
003.043 يَا مَرْيَمُ اقْنُتِي لِرَبِّكِ وَاسْجُدِي وَارْكَعِي مَعَ الرَّاكِعِينَ
003.043 "O Mary! worship Thy Lord devoutly: Prostrate thyself, and bow down (in prayer) with those who bow down."
Al-Qur'an, 003.043 (Aal-E-Imran [The Family of Imran])
Text Copied from DivineIslam's Qur'an Viewer software v2.910

019.058 أُولَئِكَ الَّذِينَ أَنْعَمَ اللَّهُ عَلَيْهِمْ مِنَ النَّبِيِّينَ مِنْ ذُرِّيَّةِ آدَمَ وَمِمَّنْ حَمَلْنَا مَعَ نُوحٍ وَمِنْ ذُرِّيَّةِ إِبْرَاهِيمَ وَإِسْرَائِيلَ وَمِمَّنْ هَدَيْنَا وَاجْتَبَيْنَا إِذَا تُتْلَى عَلَيْهِمْ آيَاتُ الرَّحْمَنِ خَرُّوا سُجَّدًا وَبُكِيًّا
019.058 Those were some of the prophets on whom Allah did bestow His Grace,- of the posterity of Adam, and of those who We carried (in the Ark) with Noah, and of the posterity of Abraham and Israel of those whom We guided and chose. Whenever the Signs of (Allah) Most Gracious were rehearsed to them, they would fall down in prostrate adoration and in tears.

Al-Qur'an, 019.058 (Maryam [Mary])

Text Copied from DivineIslam's Qur'an Viewer software v2.910
So as for positions and prostrations, that was a bit similar. But their recitations and our recitations cannot be identical since we recite Quran during our prayers and Muslims before the prophet did not have Quran.
Peace

Ah, thanks for the great reply _ALI_. I've got another one.

I've heard how previous generations of believers had the Tawrat or the Injil. I assume their Islam entailed different things, different practices. For example the Sunna of the Prophet didn't exist yet, since of course he wasn't alive. Does that mean Islam has changed through the years?

[zakirs]

Does that mean Islam has changed through the years?

The concept of Islam has always been the same , One god and the messenger is a prophet of god.Just how god wanted people to live and pray might have changed slightly or might not have changed.Since the information is not there may be we should not speculate upon it.

:)

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[nihil est]

Why is Muhammad the last prophet? Is his message 'better' than the other messengers?

[Uthman]

Why is Muhammad the last prophet? Is his message 'better' than the other messengers?

All the prophets essentially came with the same message - there is only one creator and he should be worshipped.

Whereas the previous messengers were sent for their own specific nations, Muhammad (peace be upon him) was sent with the final message for the whole of mankind.

[_ALI_]

Salam Nihil est

I've heard how previous generations of believers had the Tawrat or the Injil. I assume their Islam entailed different things, different practices. For example the Sunna of the Prophet didn't exist yet, since of course he wasn't alive. Does that mean Islam has changed through the years?

The basic principles of Islam were always there. Oneness of God, concept of prophethood and divine books, belief in existance of angels, day of judgement etc. Before prophet Muhammad, Muslims even prayed and fasted.

002.183 يَا أَيُّهَا الَّذِينَ آمَنُوا كُتِبَ عَلَيْكُمُ الصِّيَامُ كَمَا كُتِبَ عَلَى الَّذِينَ مِنْ قَبْلِكُمْ لَعَلَّكُمْ تَتَّقُونَ
002.183 O ye who believe! Fasting is prescribed to you as it was prescribed to those before you, that ye may (learn) self-restraint,-
Al-Qur'an, 002.183 (Al-Baqara [The Cow])
Text Copied from DivineIslam's Qur'an Viewer software v2.910
The Sunnah of prophet Muhammad wasn't there to guide these Muslims but they were guided by the Sunnah of their own prophets. So the fundamentals of Islam remained the same. However, the Islam today is not identical to the Islam at that time. We don't know how many times a day they prayed, when did they fast etc. So a few details have been changed. We can only speculate that the a few details have been different because the circumstances of the era are different. A few examples of these differences are given in the following hadith

Bukhari Vol. 1 Book 7 hadith 331
The Prophet, peace be upon him, said, "I have been given five things which were not given to any amongst the Prophets before me. These are:

1. Allah made me victorious by awe [by His frightening of my enemies] for a distance of one month's journey.

2. The earth has been made for me [and for my followers] a "masjid" [Arabic: a place for prostration] and a means of purification. Therefore, my followers can pray wherever the time of a prayer is due.

3. The booty has been made halal [lawful] for me [and was not made so for anyone else].

4. Every Prophet used to be sent to his nation exclusively but I have been sent to all mankind.

5. I have been given the right of intercession [on the Day of Resurrection].

Why is Muhammad the last prophet?

Prophet Muhammad is the last prophet simply because we don't need more prophets. You see, Allah appoints prophets to guide mankind to the right path. Now prophet Muhammad has been given complete guidance as the Quran says
This day have I perfected your religion for you, completed My favour upon you, and have chosen for you Islam as your religion. But if any is forced by hunger, with no inclination to transgression, Allah is indeed Oft-forgiving, Most Merciful.

Al-Qur'an, 005.003 (Al-Maeda [The Table, The Table Spread])

Text Copied from DivineIslam's Qur'an Viewer software v2.910
Hence we don't need more guidance and we don't require more prophets. Thus prophet Muhammad is the last prophet.

Is his message 'better' than the other messengers?

On the whole, his message is same as that of other messengers. However, as the hadith I quoted above says, prophet Muhammad's message is for the whole of humanity until the day of judgement but the message of other prophets was only for their people and for that time. Also, the previous books brought by other messengers were corrupted by their people. They added/subtracted a few things. But the message of prophet Muhammad i.e Quran has been guarded by Allah against corruption

015.009 إِنَّا نَحْنُ نَزَّلْنَا الذِّكْرَ وَإِنَّا لَهُ لَحَافِظُونَ
015.009 We have, without doubt, sent down the Message; and We will assuredly guard it (from corruption).

Al-Qur'an, 015.009 (Al-Hijr [Al-Hijr, Stoneland, Rocky City])

Text Copied from DivineIslam's Qur'an Viewer software v2.910
The biggest proof of Quran being uncorrupted is that there is only one Quran Muslims have. Same cannot be said about Torah or the Gospel.
Peace

[nihil est]

Ah, that clarifies things much more.

I can understand how the 'Speech of Allah' is one of His attributes, like how being merciful is one of his attributes, but I don't understand how the Qur'an that I have now is one of his attributes. Muslims tell me that the Qur'an is uncreated, and has existed eternally. Why would the verses on how to treat orphans kindly be necessary before orphans existed?

[zakirs]

Ah, that clarifies things much more.

I can understand how the 'Speech of Allah' is one of His attributes, like how being merciful is one of his attributes, but I don't understand how the Qur'an that I have now is one of his attributes. Muslims tell me that the Qur'an is uncreated, and has existed eternally. Why would the verses on how to treat orphans kindly be necessary before orphans existed?

Quran hasnt been here for ever.It was revealed to Prophet muhammed (pbh) over a period of time with the help of Angel Gabriel a.s . Sahabis of our prophet noted the quran down when prophet told them what God has revealed to him.

Quran is collection of revelations by God.His messages to the entire humanity given through our beloved prophet.God also promised in quran that he would save quran from human interference (i.e editing of Quran by humans) .Hence the Quran we have now is the same one which existed during the times of Prophet pbuh.

[_ALI_]

I can understand how the 'Speech of Allah' is one of His attributes, like how being merciful is one of his attributes, but I don't understand how the Qur'an that I have now is one of his attributes.

Quran has been attributed to God but I'm not sure what you mean when you say that Quran,like mercy, has been attributed to God. If you say that speech of Allah is his attribute then Quran is a speech of Allah. The Quran you have now is a written collection of divine orations. Hence Quran is His attribute. But the fact is, God will not ask us on the day of Judgement: tell me, is Quran regular attribute of Mine or is it some special attribute of Mine, like mercy?:). He will ask me whether I read, understood, obeyed Quran or not? So the question: "what sort of attribute is Quran?" is not really relevant.

Muslims tell me that the Qur'an is uncreated, and has existed eternally.

Ask those Muslims where is it written that Quran is uncreated? I cannot find any verse of the Quran or a saying of prophet Muhammad so I don't know whether Quran is created or uncreated. The closest thing I can find is
085.021 بَلْ هُوَ قُرْآنٌ مَجِيدٌ
085.021 Nay, this is a Glorious Qur'an,
085.022 فِي لَوْحٍ مَحْفُوظٍ
085.022 (Inscribed) in a Tablet Preserved!
Al-Qur'an, 085.021-022 (Al-Burooj [The Zodiacal Signs, The Constellations])
Text Copied from DivineIslam's Qur'an Viewer software v2.910
This verse tells us that Quran is in Loh-e-Mahfuz i.e preserved Tablet of God. But it does not say that Quran is uncreated. May be another Muslim more knowledgeable who is reading this thread can tell us. But again, Allah will not ask me whether Quran is timeless or not, instead He'll ask me whether I followed it or not.

Why would the verses on how to treat orphans kindly be necessary before orphans existed?

When/why did God inscribe Quranic verses in the Tablet, only He knows that. Allah has not told us the “when” and ”why” of every thing He did. He just told us what we required (e.g how to get to heaven etc) and no additional knowledge. But we can only speculate that inscribing Quran well before it could be applied stresses the importance of Quran. Quran is not like any other book. It has been specially inscribed by God long ago in the sacred Tablet.
Hope I helped
Peace

[Uthman]

Indeed the orthodox understanding - that of the Ahl-as-Sunnah - is that the Qur'an is uncreated. This is because the Qur'an is the Kalaam (speech) of Allah and the Kalaam of Allah is uncreated. This was the understanding of the Salaf - from whom the narrations on this issue have far has exceeded the level of mutawaatir.