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DigitalStorm82
08-25-2009, 09:56 PM
Asalaamz,

I hope everyone is enjoying their Ramadan... May Allah make it easy and rewarding for everyone.

So, on to the topic... I need to know explicit reasons why Islam prohibits women from having multiple husbands.

I've read many things about the woman being barren and stuff, but the man can also be impudent and in that case... she has to divorce him where as the Man can just get another wife. So, if someone can give me a list of reason only applicable to a woman as to why women cannot have more than one husband that would be greatly appreciated.

This is for discussion with non-muslims.

Thanks,
W'salaamz
Reply

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cat eyes
08-25-2009, 11:20 PM
Originally Posted by Alpha Dude
Wa alaykum salam,

If both men and women were allowed multiple partners, then it would lead to a big chain of married people. Let me elaborate:
1 man marries 4 women. Each of those 4 women is married to 3 other guys. Each of those other guys is married to 3 other women. And so on.. it could be an infinite chain. :hmm: So clearly, if it has to be allowed, it has to be limited to one sex being given that opportunity only.

And why should it be men and not women that are allowed? I guess the simplest explanation might be that we can't know who the father of any child is, if a woman is in a polygamous marriage.
you know i wanted to ask that question also because the man has every right to marry another woman if his first wife cannot have kids or she is disabled but yet if the womans husband is tha one who cannot produce or is disabled then whats the woman mean't to do? also what would be the need for the child to know who his dad is after all wouldn't he be calling them all his guardians? sure a the child can also get confused who his mum is if there was more the one woman in the house and they would be also loving the child like there own:hmm: like this has confused me a bit.. and i would also like some clears and proper evidence that a woman cannot marry more then one husband. i have not come across it in the hadiths yet or is it written in holy QURAN on some surah i missed?:hmm:
Reply

noorseeker
08-25-2009, 11:24 PM
Polygamy has been there since the dawn of time

Every nation, every civilisation has practiced it in their own way,

Its not like islam suddenly came along, and invented it, islam came to regulate it
Reply

جوري
08-25-2009, 11:32 PM
There is a biological reason for this but I don't want to get into it 7 mins and 08 seconds before iftar..

:w:
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cat eyes
08-25-2009, 11:39 PM
i would like polygamy to be both ways.. finding out who the father is can be easily solved these days so wouldn't that make it halal in these times
Reply

noorseeker
08-25-2009, 11:44 PM
Originally Posted by cat eyes
i would like polygamy to be both ways.. finding out who the father is can be easily solved these days so wouldn't that make it halal in these times


Can you give me a reason as to why you want more than one husband

I await skyes answer
Reply

zakirs
08-25-2009, 11:45 PM
Woah so many people thinking about multiple spouses :O .. Is marriage so crazy ? :P
Reply

Danah
08-25-2009, 11:52 PM
If that was applicable we get the endless big chain of married that brother Alpha talked about, we even might end up having the brother marry his sister without either one of them knowing

the reason behind that is biological, emotional and social
Reply

al Amaanah
08-25-2009, 11:55 PM
:salamext:

Question:

Why are women not allowed to have 3 or 4 husbands but men can have 3 or 4 wives?

Answer:

Praise be to Allaah.

This is connected primarily to faith in Allaah. All religions are agreed that it is not permissible for a woman to have intercourse with anyone except her husband. Among these religions are those which are undoubtedly of heavenly origin, such as Islam and the original versions of Judaism and Christianity. Belief in Allaah dictates submission to His rulings and laws, for Allaah is All-Wise and All-Knowing, He knows what is in the best interests of mankind. So we may understand the wisdom behind the ruling of sharee’ah, or we may not be able to grasp it.

With regard to the permissibility of multiple spouses for men and its prohibition for women, there are several issues which are obvious to every intelligent person. Allaah has made woman like a vessel, but man is not like that. If a woman becomes pregnant (when she has had intercourse with a number of men at one time), the father can never be known. People’s lines of descent and lineage will be mixed up, families will be destroyed and children will be lost. Women will be burdened with so many children that they will be unable to bring them up and spend on their maintenance. Maybe women would find themselves forced to sterilize themselves, which would lead to the extinction of the human race. Moreover it is medically proven now that one of the major causes of the serious diseases which have become widespread, such as AIDS etc., is women having intercourse with more than one man, and the mixing of seminal fluids in the woman’s womb causes these lethal diseases. Hence Allaah has prescribed a waiting period (‘iddah) for a woman who has been divorced or whose husband has died, until enough time has passed for her womb and passages to be cleansed of any traces of her former husband, and the monthly period also has a role to play in this matter. Perhaps these brief pointers will dispense with the need for a lengthy discussion. If the purpose of the question is research for a university or other assignment, he may refer to the books which have been written on the topic of plural marriage (polygyny) and the wisdom behind it. And Allaah is the Source of strength.

Shaykh Sa’d al-Humayd

IslamQA

:w:
Reply

Muhaba
08-26-2009, 12:12 AM
why not take a survey asking how many women would want more than one husband?
Reply

nebula
08-26-2009, 12:17 AM
theres no point on having a survey... this matter is clear. alhumdulilah. Women can only have 1 husband.
Reply

Danah
08-26-2009, 12:22 AM
Originally Posted by nebula
theres no point on having a survey... this matter is clear. alhumdulilah. Women can only have 1 husband.
True!

If a woman cant stand living with a husband who keep asking for many things to be done, can she stand living with another clone of that man and be able to cope between them?
give it another though guys :hmm:, look at it from different angles !!
Reply

Muhaba
08-26-2009, 12:38 AM
Originally Posted by DigitalStorm82
Asalaamz,
When you ask such questions, you are questioning Allah's Justice and Wisdom. Not a good thing imo.


Originally Posted by cat eyes
and i would also like some clears and proper evidence that a woman cannot marry more then one husband. i have not come across it in the hadiths yet or is it written in holy QURAN on some surah i missed?:hmm:
Also (forbidden are) women already married, except those (captives and slaves) whom your right hands possess. Thus has Allah ordained for you. All others are lawful, provided you seek (them in marriage) with Mahr... Surah 4 Al-Nisa, verse 24
Reply

Muhaba
08-26-2009, 12:44 AM
Originally Posted by nebula
theres no point on having a survey... this matter is clear. alhumdulilah. Women can only have 1 husband.
I don't think you understood my point. If you take a survey, you will see most women want just one husband. This is because it is in a woman's nature to want only one husband at a time. Islam is the religion according to a person's nature & not against it. Asking why Allah didn't allow women to have more than one husband equates with questioning His justice but what Allah did is according to our nature.
Reply

cat eyes
08-26-2009, 01:26 AM
Originally Posted by al Amaanah
:salamext:

Question:

Why are women not allowed to have 3 or 4 husbands but men can have 3 or 4 wives?

Answer:

Praise be to Allaah.

This is connected primarily to faith in Allaah. All religions are agreed that it is not permissible for a woman to have intercourse with anyone except her husband. Among these religions are those which are undoubtedly of heavenly origin, such as Islam and the original versions of Judaism and Christianity. Belief in Allaah dictates submission to His rulings and laws, for Allaah is All-Wise and All-Knowing, He knows what is in the best interests of mankind. So we may understand the wisdom behind the ruling of sharee’ah, or we may not be able to grasp it.

With regard to the permissibility of multiple spouses for men and its prohibition for women, there are several issues which are obvious to every intelligent person. Allaah has made woman like a vessel, but man is not like that. If a woman becomes pregnant (when she has had intercourse with a number of men at one time), the father can never be known. People’s lines of descent and lineage will be mixed up, families will be destroyed and children will be lost. Women will be burdened with so many children that they will be unable to bring them up and spend on their maintenance. Maybe women would find themselves forced to sterilize themselves, which would lead to the extinction of the human race. Moreover it is medically proven now that one of the major causes of the serious diseases which have become widespread, such as AIDS etc., is women having intercourse with more than one man, and the mixing of seminal fluids in the woman’s womb causes these lethal diseases. Hence Allaah has prescribed a waiting period (‘iddah) for a woman who has been divorced or whose husband has died, until enough time has passed for her womb and passages to be cleansed of any traces of her former husband, and the monthly period also has a role to play in this matter. Perhaps these brief pointers will dispense with the need for a lengthy discussion. If the purpose of the question is research for a university or other assignment, he may refer to the books which have been written on the topic of plural marriage (polygyny) and the wisdom behind it. And Allaah is the Source of strength.

Shaykh Sa’d al-Humayd

IslamQA

:w:
but where in the hadiths is it written, where in the only qur'an is it written. is there anything even written from the early scholars? like i just want clear and understandable evidence thats as we all know times are changing Allah knows, its easy to find out who the father is these days with the technolegy we have today! look a scholar has many different types of views on everything concerning shariah law.. you will find loads of scholars will says different things about a certain law which might not be right and he is just making from his own head what he think is right.

like a man, a woman has needs now if her husband becomes disabled and can't fufil her sexual needs, what is she mean't do? she loves him and don't want to leave him but she is not happy and she wants another husband which will make up for the rest of her needs. and i am dead sure that there is women like that in the world..

i am just saying in some cases it should be allowed!

about the mingling of different sexes sure obviously the man has to take permission from his first wife to get married to another woman so therefore it can be controled!
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al Amaanah
08-26-2009, 01:35 AM
:salamext:

Allah has perfected this deen. why should something be allowed now because time has changed?

:w:
Reply

cat eyes
08-26-2009, 03:38 AM
i believe things should be made halal in some cases. we are all humans no matter if we are man or woman.. it bothers me when a woman comes to a scholar and asks for his advice on sensitive issue's such as this and he tells her divorce your brain dead husband and marry another man to have your kids how would that be islamicly right?when she loves her first husband dearly and wants to take care of him, wants to give him affection but yet she is longing for children. and like mabe a man might have other problems in the bed area.

i have never been the type to shy away from things like this and i have always been open like some women don't talk about this because they are to afraid men will call them horrible names i won't mention what they might say but i am speaking as a woman and a HUMAN with needs. i hate the way some men believe and talk as if we have no needs, like they are basically calling us something else other then human. yes its true brothers women do think about having more than one husband for many a reason but at the same time she fears Allah and want to do everything right to not hurt anybody with divorce as divorce is hated by Allah swt. a human can love more then one person. if yous believe aids will spread by a woman sleeping with more then one man sure it would be the very same thing for a man to sleep with loads of women aids spreads also in this case if you don't get checked come on!!
Reply

ummsara1108
08-26-2009, 03:53 AM
Originally Posted by DigitalStorm82
Asalaamz,

I hope everyone is enjoying their Ramadan... May Allah make it easy and rewarding for everyone.

So, on to the topic... I need to know explicit reasons why Islam prohibits women from having multiple husbands.

I've read many things about the woman being barren and stuff, but the man can also be impudent and in that case... she has to divorce him where as the Man can just get another wife. So, if someone can give me a list of reason only applicable to a woman as to why women cannot have more than one husband that would be greatly appreciated.

This is for discussion with non-muslims.

Thanks,
W'salaamz
Salam, From my understanding, if a man has sexual relations with one or more women and they all get pregnant, who's the father? He is of course, BUT if a woman has one or more husbands and she gets pregnant, who's the father? One of them surely would be, therefore introducing the DNA concept of proof. Hope this helps.
Reply

ummsara1108
08-26-2009, 04:01 AM
Also another thing came to mind, It was allowed back when there were many more wars and many more widows and orphans, this is when it became ok for a man to take on more than one wife, however as stated in the Quran, if you can equally treat all of your wives the same then marry more than one but seeing you can not only take one. Off hand I can't remember the Surah location, but if someone else knows where the Surah is located please state it here.
Reply

ummsara1108
08-26-2009, 04:09 AM
i've read the other posts and Of course there are other ways of finding out who the father is, but in most countries there are noway to find out, thats just asking for more trouble and issues. Besides why would any woman or man want more than one? Sheesh do we all not have enough to worry about these days....lol
Reply

Muslim Woman
08-26-2009, 04:10 AM
:wa:

Originally Posted by DigitalStorm82
Asalaamz,

... why women cannot have more than one husband
Main reason is God Almighty did not allow it in His holy book .

Human explanantions could be like this : if a man has say 1000 wives , it's not a problem to find out who is daddy , who is mommy .

If wife has multiple husbands , then her baby and all husbands need to go through DNA test . It's not honourable for any man or baby to find out the identity.

when wife is pregnant , it's husband's responsiblity to take care of her and spend money for her . If all 4 husbands claim that it's not my child and others are responsible , then who will take care of her and the baby ? During the long 9 months , she will stay with which husband ?

May be , it's not good for a woman / pregnant woman to have multiple panters ; it could be harmful for their and babies health etc etc .

The most important matter is God did not allow it , that's all :statisfie
We must not challenge our Creator but must say , we hear and we obey .
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AntiKarateKid
08-26-2009, 04:20 AM
Ok go ahead and have 4 husbands.

When each of them want 1,2,3 or more kids....

Have fun being in labor for the rest of your life!

Have you ever thought that one "freedom" might diminish your other freedoms? Women complain that men view them as just "baby machines" when they themselves are asking for things which will actually turn them into one. Not to mention the fact that men are more possessive and aggressive over their mate.

Ding! Ahmad wants two boys and a girl!

Now Malik wants three boys

After your done, Ibrahim wants a few daughters

And last but not least, Abdullah wants 5 for himself!

Start choosing who goes first but choose carefully! Your husbands aren't going to like waiting years just to get a turn... it might turn ugly!
Reply

IslamicRevival
08-26-2009, 04:36 AM
Originally Posted by cat eyes
i would like polygamy to be both ways.. finding out who the father is can be easily solved these days so wouldn't that make it halal in these times
Salaam. Its not for us to decide what we like. Humans like a lot of things but we have to abstain from what is prohibited. Whatever is haraam it is haram Whatever is Halal is halal. Allah SWT knows best
Reply

DigitalStorm82
08-26-2009, 04:36 AM
Thanks for the responses...

I usually engage in religious dialogs with non-muslims and I get some interesting questions. Most of them I can easily answer, but this one got me thinking because everything can be refuted.

Majority of the people said that you wont know who the father is... but with DNA it is possible.

And for cateyez... Sis, there is an easy answer for your question as well... Artificial Insemination. A couple can choose to do this A.I. instead of marrying another woman.

But, I was asked this question by a jewish lady and I gave her some common answers, but they aren't strong enough points because the same can be said for the female wanting multiple husbands.

I had a long discussion with some of my family members regarding this issue, and I'll list few things that we talked about...

1. Mixing of seminal fluids in the woman (roughly 12 hours to - 3 days) may cause/harbor diseases.
2. Head of house hold... Which husband would be in charge?
3. Population of women is higher than men in some parts of the world but lower in others. (not a good argument)
4. DNA testing is not a practical solution on a global scale to determine the father of the baby.
5. Psychological factors - undetermined/undecided at the moment.
6. Being pregnant with a child of one husband - unable to perform her duties as a wife to other husbands - Debatable...


I know some responses were that it is asking questions about Allahs knowledge and wisdom. But, we need to be able to answer questions in defense of our religion which is why I made a post... not to cause fitnah. Although, I do fear that it may have already done some damage. Which is one of the reasons why I'm posting some of the answers that I came up with our small family discussion.

But, please feel free to give me more suggestions.

Thanks,
W'salaamz
Reply

Santoku
08-26-2009, 09:46 AM
Originally Posted by al Amaanah
:salamext:

Question:

Why are women not allowed to have 3 or 4 husbands but men can have 3 or 4 wives?

. Moreover it is medically proven now that one of the major causes of the serious diseases which have become widespread, such as AIDS etc., is women having intercourse with more than one man, and the mixing of seminal fluids in the woman’s womb causes these lethal diseases.
IslamQA

:w:
Medically proven by whom? This is a statement of ignoranceand as a result casts doubt on the rest of the words.
Reply

Muhaba
08-26-2009, 10:03 AM
Originally Posted by DigitalStorm82
Thanks for the responses...

Thanks,
W'salaamz
oh that's why you were asking. I thought you yourself were wondering why women couldn't have more than one husband.

one other reason may be that women only need one to get pregnant, but men can make more than one pregnant. Allowing men to marry more than one increases children because one man will be able to father lots of children & since there are more than women than men, all women will be able to get married and have children.

If you look at some animals, like bees and i think ants, one female (queen) mates with many males to fertilize lots of eggs. So in those animals, it's acceptable for the female to mate with lots of males.
Reply

Santoku
08-26-2009, 10:15 AM
Originally Posted by muhaba
oh that's why you were asking. I thought you yourself were wondering why women couldn't have more than one husband.

one other reason may be that women only need one to get pregnant, but men can make more than one pregnant. Allowing men to marry more than one increases children because one man will be able to father lots of children & since there are more than women than men, all women will be able to get married and have children.
It also leads to a society which is unstable - since the ratio of male births to female births is around even for every man that has four wives, three men have to go without. So they will be forced to go outside the social group to find a wife. Perhaps that is the reason why christian and jewish wives are allowed, gives the young men something to go after, aand after they have exhaisted all the women in the area then they will have to invade somewhere else, but what happens when all the lands are occupied?
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Malaikah
08-26-2009, 10:30 AM
Santuko, I have to question that reasoning... you are forgetting that women have choice, and although it must vary significantly depending on the culture, I imagine most women would much rather marry a single man rather marry a man who is already married.

It would also be interesting to see what proportion of men would actually have four wives, and again this depends on the culture. Having four wives would be pretty expensive, not many men would be able to look after such big families.
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Santoku
08-26-2009, 10:51 AM
Originally Posted by Malaikah
Santuko, I have to question that reasoning... you are forgetting that women have choice, and although it must vary significantly depending on the culture, I imagine most women would much rather marry a single man rather marry a man who is already married.

It would also be interesting to see what proportion of men would actually have four wives, and again this depends on the culture. Having four wives would be pretty expensive, not many men would be able to look after such big families.
Did you not see the program on the Iranian famer who had 4 wives - he was not rich, Channel 4 I think it was.
I imagine the society would be much like the one the mormon fundies have in Texas? The big boys at the top get multiple wives the kids at the bottom get nowt and if the say anything they are excluded (thrown out).
As for approval the social pressures put on the girls would probably be quite severe. If they were given a choice - we have seen many cases in muslim societies where a girl is married off as a junior wife to an older man and she is definitely unwilling. See those legal cases in the gulf we had earlier this year and for every girl who has he courage to stand up and say "I want a divorce, I was married against my will" how many do not get the chance or lack the courage?
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Malaikah
08-26-2009, 11:02 AM
Originally Posted by Santoku
Did you not see the program on the Iranian famer who had 4 wives - he was not rich, Channel 4 I think it was.
I imagine the society would be much like the one the mormon fundies have in Texas? The big boys at the top get multiple wives the kids at the bottom get nowt and if the say anything they are excluded (thrown out).
No, it is 100% different. In the FLDS, no one has the right to choose who they wish to marry and only their so called prophet can arrange a married after being 'inspired' by God. Of course its all fake and all that happens is the influential men in the community go to the prophet and tell him who they want to marry and the girls have no right to refuse because according to their beliefs this was mandated by God. The only reason they get so many wives, especially young wives, is because they are forced.

Forced married is a sin in Islam and is NOT allowed. Both men and women have the right to choose who they want to marry and no one can force them into it.

As for approval the social pressures put on the girls would probably be quite severe. If they were given a choice - we have seen many cases in muslim societies where a girl is married off as a junior wife to an older man and she is definitely unwilling. See those legal cases in the gulf we had earlier this year and for every girl who has he courage to stand up and say "I want a divorce, I was married against my will" how many do not get the chance or lack the courage?
I know many, many Muslim couples and I have only ever met one couple who was forced to marry each other (both the husband and wife were forced). The fact remains that forcing someone into marriage is a crime, and if the girls or their family or friends don't speak up about it the you can't expect the government or state to help them.

I know of a non-Muslim woman who was forced into married in a Western country... it isn't exclusive to Muslims. Forced marriages happen with or without polygamy and is a separate issue.
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Muhaba
08-26-2009, 12:11 PM
Originally Posted by Malaikah
...It would also be interesting to see what proportion of men would actually have four wives, and again this depends on the culture. Having four wives would be pretty expensive, not many men would be able to look after such big families.
Most men, I think, don't even want more than one wife. While living in UAE I noticed that men who remarry usually neglect the first wife altogether and live only with the second wife (unless they have lots of Taqwa and wear Allah, in which case they give equal rights to both wives). So I think it's more like a man in the West remarrying. The other wife is still married to them, but they don't have any relations with them.

So I think polygamy would be a burden on most men and they'd be happier with just one wife at a time.
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Woodrow
08-26-2009, 12:37 PM
:sl:

The overall and determining answer is because that is what Allaah(swt) has prescribed.

Now to find reasons (Although we should not need any)

1. Men are permitted 4 wives, not required to have 4 wives. This ruling actually eliminated polygamy to a large extent. This is a means to reduce if not eliminate mistreatment of women

2. The rulings for taking more than one wife, if properly followed, serve to protect women as men are obligated to protect them. A woman is not obligated to provide for or protect a man from danger.

3. Any or all of what have been mentioned earlier in this thread.

3.
Reply

cat eyes
08-26-2009, 04:06 PM
Originally Posted by Santoku
Medically proven by whom? This is a statement of ignoranceand as a result casts doubt on the rest of the words.
exactly! medically proven by whom? all of you's are all making statements with no prove or evidence.

if you see in my first posts, i did also ask for you to give me the surah verse where its stated its haraam for a woman to have more then one husband thats all.. and i also asked for hadith evidence..

because i could not find myself.. what is the actual real laws of the shariah anyway? because i find alot of there laws are corrupted and made up by ignorant leaders and you will not find much of there laws stated in the hadiths either.
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Nσσя'υℓ Jαииαн
08-26-2009, 04:12 PM
Meh imagine having more than one hubby to satisfy( not trying to sound gross). Err lets just say they're sex drive is ermm really high as compared to a woman. Could you handle that. Cooking for 2 let alone 4? Cleaning up after all of them. Women complain about their husbands, you want more? Seriously? How could anyone want that? Alhamdulillah but I'd only like to deal with ONE.

Allah knows best what is good for us, people seem to forget that...

You ask, is it written anywhere where they can't. Did Allah state a woman could?? It goes both ways.

Some people are really odd..
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Woodrow
08-26-2009, 04:19 PM
Originally Posted by cat eyes
exactly! medically proven by whom? all of you's are all making statements with no prove or evidence.

if you see in my first posts, i did also ask for you to give me the surah verse where its stated its haraam for a woman to have more then one husband thats all.. and i also asked for hadith evidence..

because i could not find myself.. what is the actual real laws of the shariah anyway? because i find alot of there laws are corrupted and made up by ignorant leaders and you will not find much of there laws stated in the hadiths either.
I doubt if there are any hadith that specifically forbid a woman from having more then one Husband. However, it is forbidden for a man to marry a woman who has a husband. In the Qur'an read Surat 4 (Al_Nisa) Ayyat 25 and forbidden to you are married women.

Therefore there is no need for a specific ruling that prohibits a woman from having more than one Husband. If she is married, A Muslim man is forbidden to marry her. So how can she have more than one Husband if Muslim men are forbidden to marry her while she is married.
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cat eyes
08-26-2009, 04:20 PM
Originally Posted by Light of Heaven
Meh imagine having more than one hubby to satisfy( not trying to sound gross). Err lets just say they're sex drive is ermm really high as compared to a woman. Could you handle that. Cooking for 2 let alone 4? Cleaning up after all of them. Women complain about their husbands, you want more? Seriously? How could anyone want that? Alhamdulillah but I'd only like to deal with ONE.

Allah knows best what is good for us, people seem to forget that...

You ask, is it written anywhere where they can't. Did Allah state a woman could?? It goes both ways.

Some people are really odd..
a woman also has a high sex drive also and no it dosen't really go both ways
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MSalman
08-26-2009, 04:41 PM
Originally Posted by DigitalStorm82
Majority of the people said that you wont know who the father is... but with DNA it is possible.
is the DNA possibility universal? Meaning,
1 - Did we have this tool in the past?
2 - Do we have any evidence that humanity will never lose this tool?
3 - Do every one has access to this tool even in our period of time? Can we prove that everyone can utilize this tool given any period of time?
Conclusion, Islam is not time or people limited. All these people who claim to be rational, the kuffaar, yet bring up this argument really need to check their common sense.

Originally Posted by DigitalStorm82
I know some responses were that it is asking questions about Allahs knowledge and wisdom. But, we need to be able to answer questions in defense of our religion which is why I made a post... not to cause fitnah
akhee, may Allah preserve you, there is a proper way of da'wah. We need to understand the difference between their way and our way. As long as the difference lies, they will never be able to understand Islamic rulings and you will be just running in circles...PERIOD. How can you convince a person about Islamic rulings if he does not even believe in Allah or Islam? How can he understand Islamic rulings when he hardly knows anything about principles used to derive rulings? So, first learn the proper methodology of da'wah and how do we answer their contentions, insha'Allah. This is a good place to start

When the text tells us the wisdom/reasoning behind a ruling, we tell them When the text is silent, then we also tell them that. Sometime, we can come up with some answers but sometime we cannot because we do not know the actual reasons and wisdom behind a certain ruling. The more we try to come up, with answers, ourselves, the more we will be cornered and appeared as justifying Islam.

Allah knows best
Reply

cat eyes
08-26-2009, 04:41 PM
Originally Posted by Woodrow
I doubt if there are any hadith that specifically forbid a woman from having more then one Husband. However, it is forbidden for a man to marry a woman who has a husband. In the Qur'an read Surat 4 (Al_Nisa) Ayyat 25 and forbidden to you are married women.

Therefore there is no need for a specific ruling that prohibits a woman from having more than one Husband. If she is married, A Muslim man is forbidden to marry her. So how can she have more than one Husband if Muslim men are forbidden to marry her while she is married.
i would like a more clear clarification on it because this verse could mean another thing totally different from what we are actually discussing.. any man would be forbidden to a woman anyway even if she is not married because that would be zina.

can i also just say that the holy qur'an is the only book which says marry only one woman..

so please anybody who says a brother can have loads of women and its not disgusting then think again.. some brothers and sisters seem to think its not a big thing here but it is!
Reply

Nσσя'υℓ Jαииαн
08-26-2009, 04:45 PM
It does go both ways. It's known guys have more than women.

I ask you sis, did Allah(swt) claim a woman can marry? Just as much as u think he didn't? And you didnt address the other bits of my post.

Tell me honestly, do you want four husbands?

so please anybody who says a brother can have loads of women and its not disgusting then think again
Are you for REAL? Allah(swt) says this in the Qur'aan that they are allowed. Are you saying what Allah allowed is disgusting?
Reply

MSalman
08-26-2009, 05:06 PM
Originally Posted by cat eyes
i would like a more clear clarification on it because this verse could mean another thing totally different from what we are actually discussing..
sister, may Allah preserve you, the ayah is very clear.

Originally Posted by cat eyes
any man would be forbidden to a woman anyway even if she is not married because that would be zina.
:), allhamdulillah, you just refuted yourself. If any man is not allowed to interact with any stranger woman (married or not married), then why would Allah specifically mention the married ones? This is an evidence in and of itself that this mentioning has a special meaning. The ayah is talking about women which a man is not allowed to MARRY. If a man cannot marry a married woman then it means she can have ONLY ONE husband. Let us look at the ayaat in the context:
And marry not women whom your fathers married, except what has already passed; indeed it was shameful and most hateful, and an evil way.

Forbidden to you (for marriage) are: your mothers, your daughters, your sisters, your father's sisters, your mother's sisters, your brother's daughters, your sister's daughters, your foster mother who gave you suck, your foster milk suckling sisters, your wives' mothers, your step daughters under your guardianship, born of your wives to whom you have gone in - but there is no sin on you if you have not gone in them (to marry their daughters), - the wives of your sons who (spring) from your own loins, and two sisters in wedlock at the same time, except for what has already passed; verily, Allah is Oft Forgiving, Most Merciful.

Also (forbidden are) women already married, except those (slaves) whom your right hands possess. Thus has Allah ordained for you. All others are lawful, provided you seek (them in marriage) with Mahr (bridal - money given by the husband to his wife at the time of marriage) from your property, desiring chastity, not committing illegal sexual intercourse, so with those of whom you have enjoyed sexual relations, give them their Mahr as prescribed; but if after a Mahr is prescribed, you agree mutually (to give more), there is no sin on you. Surely, Allah is Ever All Knowing, All Wise

[Surah an-Nisa (4): 22-24 - interpretation of the meaning]
I hope this is clear now, insha'Allah

Originally Posted by cat eyes
can i also just say that the holy qur'an is the only book which says marry only one woman..
you mean he can marry only one if he fears that he cannot give them their rights?

and Allah knows best
Reply

Woodrow
08-26-2009, 06:08 PM
Originally Posted by cat eyes
i would like a more clear clarification on it because this verse could mean another thing totally different from what we are actually discussing.. any man would be forbidden to a woman anyway even if she is not married because that would be zina.
Al-Nissa 23-26 are quite clear in that they are speaking of whom a man may marry and may not marry. I can not find another meaning for the words" And forbidden to you are married women except such as your right hand possesses. (Ma Malakat Aimanukum) ie Female non-Muslim married prisoners of war who accept Islam and become Muslim and their husbands don't.
And allowed to you are those beyond that, that you seek them by means of your property, marrying them properly and not committing fornication. When taken in context with what is being told in Ayyats 23-26
Reply

MSalman
08-26-2009, 07:19 PM
Originally Posted by Woodrow
Female non-Muslim married prisoners of war who accept Islam and become Muslim and their husbands don't.
as-salamu 'alayka

brother, may Allah preserve you, what you have said is not entirely correct. I do not want to go off-topic but felt that I needed to correct you. She does not have to be a Muslim and Allahu A'lam
Reply

Woodrow
08-26-2009, 07:27 PM
Originally Posted by islamiclife
as-salamu 'alayka

brother, may Allah preserve you, what you have said is not entirely correct. I do not want to go off-topic but felt that I needed to correct you. She does not have to be a Muslim and Allahu A'lam
Jazakallah Khayran for catching my error. I stand corrected the woman does not need to be a Muslim. I should have stated my example was not all inclusive and there are other conditions under which it would apply.
Reply

Rebel
08-26-2009, 07:28 PM
Four husbands... LOL :X Good luck.
Reply

cat eyes
08-26-2009, 08:15 PM
Originally Posted by Light of Heaven
It does go both ways. It's known guys have more than women.

I ask you sis, did Allah(swt) claim a woman can marry? Just as much as u think he didn't? And you didnt address the other bits of my post.

Tell me honestly, do you want four husbands?



Are you for REAL? Allah(swt) says this in the Qur'aan that they are allowed. Are you saying what Allah allowed is disgusting?
just goes to show how little people know.. remember the holy Qur'an was revealed 1400years ago. sister in those days it was allowed to marry more then one,Allah was talking about in those times because there was so many slaves etc ask any scholar that it was allowed then also to make the muslim community stronger, the more wives a man had, the more children and the generation of muslims will be strong now these days the younger brothers are trying to bring that law back again only for sex thats all.. not because they want to free a slave lol so it is disgusting in this sense believe me
Reply

cat eyes
08-26-2009, 08:19 PM
and no i don't want more then 4husbands lol :D they would be all fighting over me anyway haha
Reply

Nσσя'υℓ Jαииαн
08-26-2009, 09:19 PM
Originally Posted by cat eyes
just goes to show how little people know.. remember the holy Qur'an was revealed 1400years ago. sister in those days it was allowed to marry more then one,Allah was talking about in those times because there was so many slaves etc ask any scholar that it was allowed then also to make the muslim community stronger, the more wives a man had, the more children and the generation of muslims will be strong now these days the younger brothers are trying to bring that law back again only for sex thats all.. not because they want to free a slave lol so it is disgusting in this sense believe me
Sis you can't say it for all the brothers. That's wrong and unfair.

What Allah(swt) says always remains and doesn't change. Marrying another woman because she's been widowed and support her etc still applies even today. That and many other reasons. You're forgetting that Islam is for all times and that includes the Qur'aan. You can't accept one part of it and reject the other. You take all or none.
Reply

cat eyes
08-26-2009, 10:10 PM
Originally Posted by Light of Heaven
Sis you can't say it for all the brothers. That's wrong and unfair.

What Allah(swt) says always remains and doesn't change. Marrying another woman because she's been widowed and support her etc still applies even today. That and many other reasons. You're forgetting that Islam is for all times and that includes the Qur'aan. You can't accept one part of it and reject the other. You take all or none.
ya i suppose sister but the majority of scholars today object to it today for many a reason
Reply

rpwelton
08-26-2009, 10:35 PM
sister cat eyes, you need to be very careful when talking about the Qur'an. You must believe in the Qur'an in its entirety, and not reject a portion or say a portion was only for a certain time, when this is not the case. If you feel you have adequate evidence to say so, then bring for some scholarly proofs please.

Personally I would never want a second wife, but I can't say that it isn't allowed because Allah makes the provision that men can have up to 4. It's not my business to have an opinion on this matter, because Allah is the Most Knowledgeable and what He decrees is what is best for us.
Reply

Woodrow
08-26-2009, 10:40 PM
Originally Posted by cat eyes
ya i suppose sister but the majority of scholars today object to it today for many a reason
I do not know if it is the majority, but I agree many do. Not because they see it as outdated but because very few men if any could meet the requirements for an additional wife in today's world.
Reply

Snowflake
08-26-2009, 10:50 PM
cateyes: but where in the hadiths is it written, where in the only qur'an is it written. is there anything even written from the early scholars? like i just want clear and understandable evidence thats as we all know times are changing Allah knows, its easy to find out who the father is these days with the technolegy we have today! look a scholar has many different types of views on everything concerning shariah law.. you will find loads of scholars will says different things about a certain law which might not be right and he is just making from his own head what he think is right.

like a man, a woman has needs now if her husband becomes disabled and can't fufil her sexual needs, what is she mean't do? she loves him and don't want to leave him but she is not happy and she wants another husband which will make up for the rest of her needs. and i am dead sure that there is women like that in the world..

i am just saying in some cases it should be allowed!

about the mingling of different sexes sure obviously the man has to take permission from his first wife to get married to another woman so therefore it can be controled!




i believe things should be made halal in some cases. we are all humans no matter if we are man or woman.. it bothers me when a woman comes to a scholar and asks for his advice on sensitive issue's such as this and he tells her divorce your brain dead husband and marry another man to have your kids how would that be islamicly right?when she loves her first husband dearly and wants to take care of him, wants to give him affection but yet she is longing for children. and like mabe a man might have other problems in the bed area.

i have never been the type to shy away from things like this and i have always been open like some women don't talk about this because they are to afraid men will call them horrible names i won't mention what they might say but i am speaking as a woman and a HUMAN with needs. i hate the way some men believe and talk as if we have no needs, like they are basically calling us something else other then human. yes its true brothers women do think about having more than one husband for many a reason but at the same time she fears Allah and want to do everything right to not hurt anybody with divorce as divorce is hated by Allah swt. a human can love more then one person. if yous believe aids will spread by a woman sleeping with more then one man sure it would be the very same thing for a man to sleep with loads of women aids spreads also in this case if you don't get checked come on!!



Originally Posted by cat eyes
i would like polygamy to be both ways.. finding out who the father is can be easily solved these days so wouldn't that make it halal in these times



exactly! medically proven by whom? all of you's are all making statements with no prove or evidence.

if you see in my first posts, i did also ask for you to give me the surah verse where its stated its haraam for a woman to have more then one husband thats all.. and i also asked for hadith evidence..

because i could not find myself.. what is the actual real laws of the shariah anyway? because i find alot of there laws are corrupted and made up by ignorant leaders and you will not find much of there laws stated in the hadiths either.

a woman also has a high sex drive also and no it dosen't really go both ways


i would like a more clear clarification on it because this verse could mean another thing totally different from what we are actually discussing.. any man would be forbidden to a woman anyway even if she is not married because that would be zina.

can i also just say that the holy qur'an is the only book which says marry only one woman..

so please anybody who says a brother can have loads of women and its not disgusting then think again.. some brothers and sisters seem to think its not a big thing here but it is!
like a man, a woman has needs now if her husband becomes disabled and can't fufil her sexual needs, what is she mean't do? she loves him and don't want to leave him but she is not happy and she wants another husband which will make up for the rest of her needs. and i am dead sure that there is women like that in the world..
^^^First to this... There are also paedophiles and rapists in the world. Do we allow them to do what they will because they have needs?


May Allah keep you rightly guided. Ameen. It seems you have been visited by the shaytaan sister. imsad


OK well for the sake of the argument,let's say you have multiple husbands and all live seperately. But in Islam, a man has the right to fulfil his desires when he needs. How can you give him those rights when you are with another? Shariah states that a woman cannot refuse her husband without a legitimate reason. Nowhere in the Qur'an and Sunnah, will you find, the wife being with another husband a legitimate excuse. The absence of this being a legal excuse proves there is no allowance for a muslim woman to have more than one husband.





How would you or any woman with more than one husband be able to be with all the children when you want, the children or husband want? If you have two children by two husband a year apart, who would care for the child you're not with. Given how much children need their mothers at an early age, not to mention laters, the whole supportive dynamic between family members would be corrupted. Your view that polygamy should be allowed for women would be nothing but a recipe for disaster on a personal level and to the muslim society.





Another thing. The Quran states that men are the maintainers of women because they provide for them from their wealth.
Allah SWT says in the Quran:
'Men are in charge of women by (right of) what (qualities) Allah has given one over the other.So good women are obedient, guarding in secret that which Allah hath guarded.....' Quran: an-Nisa:34








This verse shows that a woman is expected to be obedient to her husband. A woman cannot obey two husbands at once as to do that she will have to disobey the other and incur sin on herself and violate one's rights. Islam helps us to avoid matters which lead us to sin and to harm other and clearly polygamy for woman does the opposite to what is liked/permitted. Again this proves that a woman can only marry one man at one time. Two Kings cannot rule a country at the same time. And I don't think you need me to tell you why.


A wife is also responsible for guarding the husband's honour (herself and his name) and property in his absence. How will she keep her honour and his name clean, if she is leaving his home to have sexual relations with another man?







Allah subhanwa ta'ala also tells men to force his wife to give up what is prohibited.

"And enjoin prayer (which keeps one away from sins) upon your family (and people) be steadfast therein.." Quran: Taha: 132)

Again this verse shows that a husband is the head of the house. Two men cannot be head of house at the same time. Furthermore, a woman cannot leave the house without her husband's permission. How then can a wife leave him against his will to go to another man's house? If polygamy was allowed for women then this right refusing her permission to go out would deny the other husband his rights. Islam gives every person his/her due rights. Hence this proves polygamy for women is not from Islam.






The obedience to the husband even supercedes the parents rights to be obeyed. To illustrate..

It is narrated that, the paternal aunt of Husayn, came to the Prophet (saw) and he asked her: "Do you have a husband?" When she replied in the affirmative, he (saw) said to her, "See your status with him (i.e. whether you try to satisfy him or not), for he is your Paradise and your fire (i.e. your entering Paradise or Hell-fire can be dependant on the way you treat him."




How many times will you have to disappoint one husband to please another?


Also, Allah says in the Quran to men with more than one wife, "...And live with them in kindness...." (Quran An-Nisa :19)

and

"...So do not incline completely (toward one) and leave another hanging.." (Quran An-Nisa: 129)


In Surah An Nisa it is clearly stated to men how they should treat their wives if they have more than one. Since men are a degree above women, why are there no verses telling women to be equal and good, if not better to their husbands?






Also looking at it from another perspective.. if a woman has more than one husband, she possibly cannot live with them at the same time and hence cannot fulfil their needs. So each husband getting half (if that) of what he wants in a marriage has the right to find another wife. That's fair right? But that wife also has another husband and can't give him enough time either. So he finds another wife....... and another if need be. But wait, didn't you say it's disgusting if a man has more than one wife? So how does your system of polygamy for women work? Double standards? POlygamy for women might appeal to you personally, but it will never benefit you or anyone else or especially the muslim society but it will destroy it.



Finally, you should know that the Prophet (saw) brought the Complete and Final message to mankind, and any disagreement to that on your part suggests you think you know better than Allah and His Rasul about how we should live our lives. Your argument that nowhere in the Quran and sunnah is it prohibited for a woman to marry more than one man is silly to say the least. I could say the Quran doesn't explicitly prohibit you from eating a number of disgusting things so why don't you eat them? See how silly it seems when the same logic is returned.



There is no ayah, hadith, or any account in islamic history relating to a muslim woman being allowed more than one husband at one time and to change what you want would mean changing a large part of Islamic teachings and creating new ones. Na udhu billah! :heated:


I pray Allah protects you from disobedience to Him and His Rasul. Ameen.
Reply

cat eyes
08-26-2009, 10:56 PM
Originally Posted by rpwelton
sister cat eyes, you need to be very careful when talking about the Qur'an. You must believe in the Qur'an in its entirety, and not reject a portion or say a portion was only for a certain time, when this is not the case. If you feel you have adequate evidence to say so, then bring for some scholarly proofs please.

Personally I would never want a second wife, but I can't say that it isn't allowed because Allah makes the provision that men can have up to 4. It's not my business to have an opinion on this matter, because Allah is the Most Knowledgeable and what He decrees is what is best for us.
i did not say i believe in half of holy Qur'an and disbelieve in the other half, Allah should take my soul now if i said such a thing.. but Allah said marry only one and most respected scholars say marry only one.. getting married to 2or 3 or 4wives, is it a little thing? no its not! its a major test and you have to fufil the proper requirments because thats why most scholars tell modern muslims not to do it because on jugdement day if you did not do justice between them so one of those wives will testify against you that he was not doing enough for me.. he was only selfish. so Allah will say did i not tell you marry only one wife!! i am not taking that option away from any brother! in this century, men are different and women are different thats all thats clear to see. these days you are playing with fire taking on more then one wife
Reply

rpwelton
08-26-2009, 10:58 PM
I apologize then, I guess I misunderstood your point. I thought you were implying that a man cannot have more than one wife and that the portion of the Qur'an allowing more than 1 has been made null in our modern times. My mistake.
Reply

cat eyes
08-26-2009, 11:08 PM
Originally Posted by Scents of Jannah
^^^First to this... There are also paedophiles and rapists in the world. Do we allow them to do what they will because they have needs?


May Allah keep you rightly guided. Ameen. It seems you have been visited by the shaytaan sister. imsad


OK well for the sake of the argument,let's say you have multiple husbands and all live seperately. But in Islam, a man has the right to fulfil his desires when he needs. How can you give him those rights when you are with another? Shariah states that a woman cannot refuse her husband without a legitimate reason. Nowhere in the Qur'an and Sunnah, will you find, the wife being with another husband a legitimate excuse. The absence of this being a legal excuse proves there is no allowance for a muslim woman to have more than one husband.





How would you or any woman with more than one husband be able to be with all the children when you want, the children or husband want? If you have two children by two husband a year apart, who would care for the child you're not with. Given how much children need their mothers at an early age, not to mention laters, the whole supportive dynamic between family members would be corrupted. Your view that polygamy should be allowed for women would be nothing but a recipe for disaster on a personal level and to the muslim society.





Another thing. The Quran states that men are the maintainers of women because they provide for them from their wealth.
Allah SWT says in the Quran:
'Men are in charge of women by (right of) what (qualities) Allah has given one over the other.So good women are obedient, guarding in secret that which Allah hath guarded.....' Quran: an-Nisa:34








This verse shows that a woman is expected to be obedient to her husband. A woman cannot obey two husbands at once as to do that she will have to disobey the other and incur sin on herself and violate one's rights. Islam helps us to avoid matters which lead us to sin and to harm other and clearly polygamy for woman does the opposite to what is disliked/prohibited. Again this proves that a woman can only marry one man at one time. Two Kings cannot rule a country at the same time. And I don't think you need me to tell you why.


A wife is also responsible for guarding the husband's honour (herself and his name) and property in his absence. How will she keep her honour and his name clean, if she is leaving his home to have sexual relations with another man?







Allah subhanwa ta'ala also tells men to force his wife to give up what is prohibited.

"And enjoin prayer (which keeps one away from sins) upon your family (and people) be steadfast therein.." Quran: Taha: 132)

Again this verse shows that a husband is the head of the house. Two men cannot be head of house at the same time. Furthermore, a woman cannot leave the house without her husband's permission. How then can a wife leave him against his will to go to another man's house? If polygamy was allowed for women then this right refusing her permission to go out would deny the other husband his rights. Islam gives every person his/her due rights. Hence this proves polygamy for women is not from Islam.






The obedience to the husband even supercedes the parents rights to be obeyed. To illustrate..

It is narrated that, the paternal aunt of Husayn, came to the Prophet (saw) and he asked her: "Do you have a husband?" When she replied in the affirmative, he (saw) said to her, "See your status with him (i.e. whether you try to satisfy him or not), for he is your Paradise and your fire (i.e. your entering Paradise or Hell-fire can be dependant on the way you treat him."




How many times will you have to disappoint one husband to please another?


Also, Allah says in the Quran to men with more than one wife, "...And live with them in kindness...." (Quran An-Nisa :19)

and

"...So do not incline completely (toward one) and leave another hanging.." (Quran An-Nisa: 129)


In Surah An Nisa it is clearly stated to men how they should treat their wives if they have more than one. Since men are a degree above women, why are there no verses telling women to be equal and good, if not better to their husbands?






Also looking at it from another perspective.. if a woman has more than one husband, she possibly cannot live with them at the same time and hence cannot fulfil their needs. So each husband getting half (if that) of what he wants in a marriage has the right to find another wife. That's fair right? But that wife also has another husband and can't give him enough time either. So he finds another wife....... and another if need be. But wait, didn't you say it's disgusting if a man has more than one wife? So how does your system of polygamy for women work? Double standards? POlygamy for women might appeal to you personally, but it will never benefit you or anyone else or especially the muslim society but it will destroy it.



Finally, you should know that the Prophet (saw) brought the Complete and Final message to mankind, and any disagreement to that on your part suggests you think you know better than Allah and His Rasul about how we should live our lives. Your argument that nowhere in the Quran and sunnah is it prohibited for a woman to marry more than one man is silly to say the least. I could say the Quran doesn't explicitly prohibit you from eating a number of disgusting things so why don't you eat them? See how silly it seems when the same logic is returned.



There is no ayah, hadith, or any account in islamic history relating to a muslim woman being allowed more than one husband at one time and to change what you want would mean changing a large part of Islamic teachings and creating new ones. Na udhu billah! :heated:


I pray Allah protects you from disobedience to Him and His Rasul. Ameen.
i just needed hadiths and surah verses because i could not find it anywhere! my views were merely innocent suggestions and not from shaytaan! Allah is all merciful to his servants sister for having any type of a view and he understands in hard times of a persons life they will think such things. i did not need a long lecture thanks...
this world is tough and i know well enough Allah will satisfy everyone in jannah so i am really not bothered about this world. i simply wanted prove to help me with my deen and understanding islam in a bigger view because i know my knowledge is not great. Allah knows so i don't need a long lecture.
Reply

Snowflake
08-26-2009, 11:37 PM
Originally Posted by cat eyes
i just needed hadiths and surah verses because i could not find it anywhere! my views were merely innocent suggestions and not from shaytaan! Allah is all merciful to his servants sister for having any type of a view and he understands in hard times of a persons life they will think such things. i did not need a long lecture thanks...
this world is tough and i know well enough Allah will satisfy everyone in jannah so i am really not bothered about this world. i simply wanted prove to help me with my deen and understanding islam in a bigger view because i know my knowledge is not great. Allah knows so i don't need a long lecture.


i believe things should be made halal in some cases.
-------
i would like polygamy to be both ways.. finding out who the father is can be easily solved these days so wouldn't that make it halal in these times

---------
what is the actual real laws of the shariah anyway? because i find alot of there laws are corrupted and made up by ignorant leaders and you will not find much of there laws stated in the hadiths either.
---------
a woman also has a high sex drive also and no it dosen't really go both ways
-------------
i believe things should be made halal in some cases. we are all humans no matter if we are man or woman..
------------
so please anybody who says a brother can have loads of women and its not disgusting then think again.. some brothers and sisters seem to think its not a big thing here but it is!

LOL, the gall! You were very clear in your views about wanting polygamy to be halal for women and even said it's disgusting when men have loads of women. So, honestly, to me (or others) that didn't sound like someone inquiring about evidence. If you were, and my post was of no benefit to you, then please forgive me for wasting my time.
Reply

cat eyes
08-27-2009, 12:00 AM
Originally Posted by Scents of Jannah
LOL, the gall! You were very clear in your views about wanting polygamy to be halal for women and even said it's disgusting when men have loads of women. So, honestly, to me (or others) that didn't sound like someone inquiring about evidence. If you were, and my post was of no benefit to you, then please forgive me for wasting my time.
you seem to be very quick to judge others.. keep your kufir comments in your pocket and don't bring them on this forum

like how much is it you really know yourself because i found your post of no use and you had nothing to support your views
Reply

Woodrow
08-27-2009, 12:36 AM
:sl:

Just a gentle reminder to any to whom it applies.

One of the admins is a grouchy old man who gets very upset when debates become fights and personal comments about any member's character appear.. When the old grouchy admin sees too much personal fighting, threads vanish into the never-never land of cyberspace and are never seen again.
Reply

Nσσя'υℓ Jαииαн
08-27-2009, 12:37 AM
Originally Posted by Woodrow
:sl:

Just a gentle reminder to any to whom it applies.

One of the admins is a grouchy old man who gets very upset when debates become fights and personal comments about any member's character appear.. When the old grouchy admin sees too much personal fighting, threads vanish into the never-never land of cyberspace and are never seen again.
:D Agreed
Reply

cat eyes
08-27-2009, 01:04 AM
Originally Posted by Woodrow
:sl:

Just a gentle reminder to any to whom it applies.

One of the admins is a grouchy old man who gets very upset when debates become fights and personal comments about any member's character appear.. When the old grouchy admin sees too much personal fighting, threads vanish into the never-never land of cyberspace and are never seen again.
Im sorry but her postz were virging on making out i am a
Kufir and i dont believe on holy qur'an...by quoting my posts. I am not a fool. Jst becoz human has a desire that somethngz should b halal in some cases so it dosent mean now they will act on them aftr they have gotton proper knowledge they fear Allah! Thankz 4 responding to me in a correct manner...may ALLAH REWARD YOU
Reply

Nσσя'υℓ Jαииαн
08-27-2009, 01:12 AM
:sl:

To be quite fair sister, she didn't and she wasn't. She basically said what I have been and everyone else :)

Anyways it is the month of Rahma so let's keep it as such InshaAllah. I speak to myself before anyone else :)

:w:
Reply

alcurad
08-27-2009, 01:23 AM
sexual needs can be fulfilled through many means, a partner is not required for all of them, in extreme cases the scholars have allowed masturbation and so on, thus the example sister cat eyes gave is resolved to an extent. otherwise a divorce is one valid solution. see life is coldly indifferent to human needs, only the practical solution prevails in the end however it might hurt/shock.

we have ideals, then we have reality, there's not so much overlap as to not require giving up ideals at times of necessity. for example even killing another is allowed if done for self-defense.

My main point though is, a healthy relationship between a man and a woman is the best medicine for all such needs, for those who require more, it shouldn't be too hard to hold themselves back, self-control is the main reason we're not like the rest of the animal kingdom. a sexual encounter lasts for no more than a little while, the consequences might be life changing.
then we should be careful of indulging and giving in to our primal desires to the point where society/religion are not important.

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in the margin:
women having multiple partners under law is problematic for society, there's an alternative, it's classed as adultery in Islam, although in the future that might not be so clearly the case. in today's society adultery is more acceptable, strangely even some 'scholars' allow a form of it, look at the shiite mut'a, or it's recently spreading-watered down-sunni version called misyar. both can be seen as 'prostitution', although there's only two people involved.

to note, research has shown that it's not that women are satisfied with just one man, while men are lustful and require man women; rather women prefer the best males, and those are in short supply, men simply seek to propagate their genes, hence they're not so selective.
thus, with more technological/medical advancements,cultural revolutions and more aggressive forms of feminism/women's rights; many women will call for the 'privilege' of multiple partners/promiscuity.
this is as anyone can see a dangerous trend, it should be stopped, first through more awareness of it I might add.
http://theoccidentalquarterly.com/ar...linTOQV6N2.pdf
Reply

IslamicRevival
08-27-2009, 01:42 AM
Originally Posted by alcurad
sexual needs can be fulfilled through many means, a partner is not required for all of them, in extreme cases the scholars have allowed masturbation and so on, thus the example sister cat eyes gave is resolved to an extent. otherwise a divorce is one valid solution. see life is coldly indifferent to human needs, only the practical solution prevails in the end however it might hurt/shock.

we have ideals, then we have reality, there's not so much overlap as to not require giving up ideals at times of necessity. for example even killing another is allowed if done for self-defense.

My main point though is, a healthy relationship between a man and a woman is the best medicine for all such needs, for those who require more, it shouldn't be too hard to hold themselves back, self-control is the main reason we're not like the rest of the animal kingdom. a sexual encounter lasts for no more than a little while, the consequences might be life changing.
then we should be careful of indulging and giving in to our primal desires to the point where society/religion are not important.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
in the margin:
women having multiple partners under law is problematic for society, there's an alternative, it's classed as adultery in Islam, although in the future that might not be so clearly the case. in today's society adultery is more acceptable, strangely even some 'scholars' allow a form of it, look at the shiite mut'a, or it's recently spreading-watered down-sunni version called misyar. both can be seen as 'prostitution', although there's only two people involved.

to note, research has shown that it's not that women are satisfied with just one man, while men are lustful and require man women; rather women prefer the best males, and those are in short supply, men simply seek to propagate their genes, hence they're not so selective.
thus, with more technological/medical advancements,cultural revolutions and more aggressive forms of feminism/women's rights; many women will call for the 'privilege' of multiple partners/promiscuity.
this is as anyone can see a dangerous trend, it should be stopped, first through more awareness of it I might add.
http://theoccidentalquarterly.com/ar...linTOQV6N2.pdf
First Ive Heard Of This. Masturbation Is Not allowed under Any Circumstances.

Whatever is forbidden is forbidden. No exceptions. Allah SWT knows best
Reply

AntiKarateKid
08-27-2009, 01:55 AM
I'd like to take this opportunity to thank the TC for completely ignoring my post, failing to answer it, and continuing this ridiculous discussion. :statisfie
Reply

Snowflake
08-27-2009, 03:38 AM
Originally Posted by cat eyes
you seem to be very quick to judge others.. keep your kufir comments in your pocket and don't bring them on this forum

like how much is it you really know yourself because i found your post of no use and you had nothing to support your views
Originally Posted by cat eyes
Im sorry but her postz were virging on making out i am a
Kufir and i dont believe on holy qur'an...by quoting my posts. I am not a fool. Jst becoz human has a desire that somethngz should b halal in some cases so it dosent mean now they will act on them aftr they have gotton proper knowledge they fear Allah! Thankz 4 responding to me in a correct manner...may ALLAH REWARD YOU
If I want, I can give as good as I get, so that you won't even find the words to reply again, and I had started to too.. but I had come online as I had been feeling bad worrying I'd hurt your feelings and it kept bothering me. I can read what you've said about me above and let the shaytaan get the better of me. But I'm gonna bite my lip fi sabilillah and I hope you do the same. I swear by Allah, I am asking you to forgive me as I can't bear to think I've displeased Allah by hurting your feelings. I forgive you too and may Allah forgive us both. Ameen

Peace :)


Edit: Oh and my apologies to Br. Woodrow also.
Reply

DigitalStorm82
08-27-2009, 04:21 AM
Asalaam,

Sister (Scents of Jannah) your post was one of the most constructive and helpful post in this thread.

I thank you and everyone who participated, I believe I have a good understanding or enough arguments to make my case in defense of Islam... or better understand the wisdom behind not allowing multiple husbands.

If everyone has come to an understanding of this subject. I'd like to request that this thread be locked or closed to avoid any further fitnah.

Or, possibly delete all the posts and create one big concise post with answers. Delete the rest. Whatever the moderators decide.

Jazak'llah khair
W'Salaam
Reply

Snowflake
08-27-2009, 04:24 AM
JazakAllahu khayr brother : (

all good is from Allah
Reply

Woodrow
08-27-2009, 04:44 AM
:sl:

This is a good time to close this thread. Jazakallajhu Khayran to all who contributed.
Reply

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