Muslims and organ donation

[sharif1979]

I want all Brothers and Sisters to help me with a project looking at Muslim attitudes and opinions regarding organ donation. It is an anonymous survey and only takes 5 minutes of your time. I would be very grateful if you can take 5 minutes to click the link below for my survey:

http://www.surveymonkey.com/s.aspx?s...783xBj4g_3d_3d

Please encourage as many people as you can to complete this short survey, including all the members of your family. This work is very important so please help me.

Thank you.

[Muslim Woman]

:sl:

Ok I answered but it took 7/8 minutes not 5 :hmm:

[sharif1979]

That means you were very thoughtful with your answers - for which I am very grateful!

If you can encourage lots of people to complete it I will be eternally grateful!

:statisfie

[- IqRa -]

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[sharif1979]

Thank you. I hope you can encourage people to complete the survey - the link can be emailed to anyone.

The results of this survey will be analyzed and hopefully published in a medical journal. It should provide details on what individual concerns are so I need thousands of responses to get a good overview before taking things further.

Thanks for the support!

[Muslim Woman]

:sl:

If you can encourage lots of people to complete it I will be eternally grateful!

:statisfie

woww eternally grateful ? Don't want to miss this though not sure what exactly it is :p


I submitted your post in 2 forums . InshaAllah u will get responses .

http://theislampath.com/smf/index.ph...c=5406.new#new

http://myislamweb.com/forum/index.ph...=18671.new#new

[GuestFellow]

Completed the survey.

[sharif1979]

Ok so maybe 'eternally' grateful was a bit of a stretch... But I'm grateful nether the less! And thank you for forwarding those posts on.

[Caller الداعي]

salam
i think what should be understood here is that a muslim must follow the quran and hadith according to how it was interpreted by the pious predecessors. a muslim cannot make an islamic decision based on his own knowledge thats why muslims are ordered to seek knowledge and find answers for their problems from the scholars in islam! whether that may be the imam or even group of scholars etc.
so donation of organs is no exception, a muslim is required to seek the islamic ruling on it whether it involves loved ones or not and basing it on feelings and what anyone might say has nothing to do with it.
sorry its just the questionnaire sounds like what u get asked at the airport by the police!

[sharif1979]

I hope the questionnaire is bit friendlier than the airport security ones!

What you say is very true. There are in fact numerous Sharia rulings on the topic of organ donation from various countries, groups and scholars. The majority are in favour, some are equivocal and leave it to individual and some are slightly more negative. There was a recent study canvassing opinion amongst Imams in Turkey and they expressed a variety of different opinions on the topic.

Unfortunately this has just clouded the topic and therefore there appears to be no unanimous consensus. Everyone has a different opinion, interpretation, ruling on the issue. Hence why I am trying to canvass the largest number of responses possible to show the disparity and explore this further.

I hope you will encourage others to fill in the survey - I welcome all opinions and views and they are ALL needed.

Thank you!

[Muslim Woman]

:sl:

...There are in fact numerous Sharia rulings on the topic of organ donation from various countries, groups and scholars.

I heard lecture of Dr Zakir . He said something like that : if it's to save on'e life and donar's life is not in danger , then it is allowed . But it must not be done just to earn money.

I think , after death , we must at least donate eyes ( cornea ) . My father filled up a form about it . But last year , when he died , the 2 witnesses ( me and mom ) totally forgot about it - May Allah forgive us . May be we could remember if anyone would have asked if he signed any such form ever .

In Islam , to humaliate anyone , it's forbidden to cut off parts of dead bodies . But to save life , why we can't donate organs ? We need to do a lot of publicity about it . In my country , thousands and thousands kids are becoming blind just because of malnutrition . Also thousands people die each year . If we can collect cornea from the dead and give a new life to those blind kids , how it's possible that Allah will be angry with us ?

And Allah knows Best .

[kwolney01]

Survey completed.

Has anyone read anything on organ donation in Islam. I'm an organ donor and would like to find out some information on this topic.

[أبو سليمان عمر]

I want all Brothers and Sisters to help me with a project looking at Muslim attitudes and opinions regarding organ donation. It is an anonymous survey and only takes 5 minutes of your time. I would be very grateful if you can take 5 minutes to click the link below for my survey:

http://www.surveymonkey.com/s.aspx?s...783xBj4g_3d_3d

Please encourage as many people as you can to complete this short survey, including all the members of your family. This work is very important so please help me.

Thank you.

akhi i started doing the survey but when we get to the 3rd page it is just a yes no not sure answer and i can chose one or the other for example
the question about is organ donation compatible with Islam? I dont think it is ok unless dire necessity or emergency and if and only if it wont hurt the donor as for when he is dead to take the organ and save it to me doesnt seem right the body that has been given to a person is a trust it is for me or any person to do what we want with it and some other question that are not as simple as yes or no so ill wait for u to reply to this message before finishing inshalllah

[جوري]

fascinating survey..
your health system differs quite a bit in ethics or so I assume than in the U.S
I wonder how it would affect someone sitting for the plab or USMLE..

porcine heart valves are currently used as transplants for folks with valvular insufficiency.. but they have to be taken out every ten years.. there is also an alternative but they cause mechanical injury...( I think that should have been included in your survey, since you did mention organ donations from pigs in general.

in the end it should always be about patient autonomy and choice no?

I am aware that since there is a shortage in Europe that they harvest organs upon death unless the patient had a prior advance health care directive stating otherwise (is that correct?).. I don't agree with that at all..

all the best

:w:

[glo]

I am aware that since there is a shortage in Europe that they harvest organs upon death unless the patient had a prior advance health care directive stating otherwise (is that correct?).. I don't agree with that at all..

all the best

:w:

Interesting.

I found this article on the UK Patient Association site.
(It is from 2007, and I will have to check whether the UK has since adopted the 'opt-out' approach, which they seem to have in other European countries.)

The problem is clearly a shortage in donors (or in people who have bothered to declare their willingness to donate).
How do they ensure that they have enough donors in the US?

Presumed Consent for Organ Donation

The UK operates an opt-in system for organ donation where people have to make their wishes known by registering their details on the NHS Organ Donation Register, carrying a donor card or telling their family. If a person dies the register is check for their details and regardless of whether they have registered or not their relatives are asked for their agreement before organs are removed.


However the need for donated organs far exceeds the supply and whilst many people are positive towards the idea of donating their organs, only a relatively small number have actively registered to do so.


In his July 2007 Chief Medical Officer’s annual report Sir Liam Donaldson recommended the UK changed to a system of presumed consent in an attempt to increase the number of available organs for donation. The opt-out system would mean health professionals would be able to assume everyone had consented to donating their organs unless they had specifically registered their desire not to become an organ donor.


If UK organ donation moved to an opt-out system there would be safeguards to make sure that anyone who did not wish to donate organs could easily make their wishes know. Any relatives who feel particularly strongly about donating organs would also have their views respected in “special circumstances”.


The opt-out system is used in many other European countries however there are concerns that it can cause major distress for relatives who can feel that they have not been consulted. It is also worth remembering that due to the timescale involved in making decisions it will not always be possible to contact a next of kin in time. In these situations there will need to be strict guidelines to ensure the wishes of the deceased person and their family are followed.



The View from The Patients Association

The Patients Association is aware of the critical shortage of organs available for transplant and the devastating effect this shortage has on those awaiting transplant surgery. We are also concerned about the increasing number of desperate patients traveling abroad for transplants, often to developing countries with less rigorous regulations and ethics.


The UK must look at ways of increasing the number of people on the NHS Organ Donation Register and The Patients Association acknowledges the most obvious and rapid way of doing this is to operate an opt-out system. We agree with Sir Liam that action should be taken and appreciate that it can be challenging for clinicians not to know exactly what their patient would have wanted to happen following their death. We also understand that the number of people carrying organ donor cards is not representative of those who would be willing to donate an organ.


However it is vital to remember that the decision to register as an organ donor is an intensely private one and needs careful consideration and consultation with family members. People need to be encouraged to make a choice regarding organ donation but those with a strong desire not to donate should still have the right to easily make this know. In this way we are not satisfied that the opt-out system works for everyone. In an emergency situation the right to opt-out may not be sufficient if organs are transplanted before a family can alert the clinical team to the fact that a patient did not wish to be a donor.


The Patients Association believes that the key to increasing organ donors is to raise public awareness and access to the register rather than imposing an opt-out system. A public campaign would highlight the shortage of donors and allow people to register a personal choice in an easily accessible forum.

An opt-out system places a hugely private decision in the hands of the Government. We believe with increased awareness those who choose to make this “gift” will also choose to make it known.

http://www.patients-association.org....Organ-Donation

[sharif1979]

Thank you all for doing the survey. As detailed as I would have liked to have made the survey, I had to balance it against having it short enough so people don't lose patience and give up. So I was quite strict that it cannot take longer than 5 minutes, hence some responses are simple 'yes, no' answers. This also helps with the statistical analysis after - the aim is not simply to show the overall snapshot but to explore further (eg. do people > 40 have different views to < 40, do those with children favour donating to a loved one more than those without etc...). Masha Allah there is currently over 90% completion rate and hopefully it will continue.

The health system in the UK is similar to the US with regard to organ donation (opt in system). Some countries in Europe, like Spain, have the presumed consent opt out system. The British Government recently set up a task force to look into a similar system in the UK but decided against it due to resistance, a lot of it from the religious groups in th UK but also the general public.

I'm pushing on for over 10,000 responses - please help by forwarding this link to all and sit down elder members of your family and help fill in the survey for them.

Thank you!

[glo]

The health system in the UK is similar to the US with regard to organ donation (opt in system). Some countries in Europe, like Spain, have the presumed consent opt out system. The British Government recently set up a task force to look into a similar system in the UK but decided against it due to resistance, a lot of it from the religious groups in th UK but also the general public.

Your information saves me from looking it up myself where the UK stands on organ donation. Thank you! :)

Out of interest, which religious groups expressed most concers about the opt-out system, and why? Do you know?

Do you work in/for the health system yourself?

[جوري]

Interesting.

How do they ensure that they have enough donors in the US?

They don't, as a result many people die on waiting lists, however, they have lessened the stringency of the criteria for who can donate.. as such a person with prior disease can't be exempt unless in extreme circumstances and there is a system set even for a case of liver transplant, can have an organ donated from someone who also has liver disease in a less advanced stage. Someone with an MELD score of 25 can receive a donation from someone with MELD score of 10 (as an example)... my friend's father died waiting for a bad liver, however, folks like that drunkard guy from I dream of Geanie got two fresh liver transplants from young fresh newly dead teenagers.. obviously, I have very strong reservation on the process!

[sharif1979]

I think the religious groups collectively had objections to a system of presumed consent. They also questioned whether it would increase the number of donations. I think Spain and Sweden have the presumed consent system: although Spain has the highest donation rates in the world (3x the UK), Sweden actually does less than the UK so presumed consent alone is not the answer.

I'm a specialist trainee in Renal and Transplant medicine - hence the interest! I work in a very multicultural city with a large Indo-Asian Muslim population. In the UK, Indo-Asians (predominantly Muslim) form around 8% of the general population, nearly 25% of our dialysis population but organ donation rates are minimal. So Indo-Asian Muslims often die on dialysis before a transplant due to a lack of suitably matched kidneys (blood group B very common amongst Indo-Asians compared to Caucasians).

[glo]

^
It's a tricky moral dilemma (as so much in medicine is)
Is it morally better to take organs from deceased who may not have specifically agreed to the donation, or to let people die for lack of organs?
(I don't know the answer, I am just musing)

What is a MELD score?
And why did the guy from 'I dream if Geanie' (I am guessing that's a TV programme?) get a liver before your friend's father?

I guess there will always be case of rich people being able to buy their organs somewhere by some means ... :hmm:

[Rabi'ya]

:sl:

wow...i started a topic on this many moons ago. lol. There are two very strong opinions regarding this issue.

But as far as I know you can opt-out in the UK now. the only problem is that there is not ONE central register, and even if they do check the main register it may not have been updated in time or sometimes they are in such a rush that the doctors do not check thoroughly enough. forexample a change of name or two people who have similar names etc.

[sharif1979]

It is still an opt in system in the UK, either in life or after death (if family consent). You can opt out i life with an advanced directive or something like that. The possibility of an opt out system though exists if organ donation rates don't increase (I think the Government said within 5 years).

[جوري]

MELD measures bilirubin, INR and creatinine (for kidney function which is associated with liver disease) called hepatorenal syndrome.

recognize this guy?

it is Larry Hagman.. my guess is he can afford it, so it doesn't really matter how he spent his life or that he drank himself into liver failure, while my friend's father was a poor guy who worked at the printer and took various odd jobs on the side such as delivering people's foods for pennies and contracted hepatitis B from an unhygienic clinic couldn't afford either the transplant or to merely show up for crappy treatment~!

[Rabi'ya]

It is still an opt in system in the UK, either in life or after death (if family consent). You can opt out i life with an advanced directive or something like that. The possibility of an opt out system though exists if organ donation rates don't increase (I think the Government said within 5 years).

having said that.....I am sure that I read somewhere that they can still use your organs if someone else gives consent like NOK. so unless we specifically have it written that we DO NOT want to give organs then the doctors can still use them anyway.

[sharif1979]

That is true - if you have never expressed any wishes in your life then your next of kin can decide for you after death. So you would have to express your wishes either way in life in word or writing.

Unfortunately the opposite is also true. Your next of kin can overrule your expressed desire to donate organs after your death when they have to give consent. Although a new law (Human Tissue Act) passed a few years ago means doctors can now overrule the next of kin (if deceased has donor card or signed register) I don't think ANY doctor would get into the situation of arguing with the relatives - so the new law is good on paper but not in practice.

[جوري]

I think the religious groups collectively had objections to a system of presumed consent. .

& For Good reason, as it undermines patient's autonomy. 'presumed consent' should be true to its original purpose, such as you show up semi-comatosed and the doctors assume that if you were conscious to let them know of your wishes, you'd want treatment, not that you wish to part with your organs!

I have no reservations donating an organ to a family member or a pious Muslim, whether I am alive or dead, but I'd be seriously angry, if they harvested organs without my consent to give to someone who spent their life abusing their body and made enough money to afford a transplant. I don't know if socialized medicine extends itself to organ donations in the U.S but it costs hundreds of thousands of dollars here in the U.S with no prediction as to whether the patient will reject it, or that s/he won't succumb to opportunistic infections from the immuno-suppressive agents..

seems almost frivolous at times to think about it really. And perhaps I have my own biases and judgments and rightfully so when it comes to ones own body!

:w:

[Rabi'ya]

Ahhhh, jazakAllah kheir. that makes a bit more sense. But still seems a little silly. It needs sorting out. They need some kind of central register or some other kind of way of making sure what they do is right :)

[جوري]

That is true - if you have never expressed any wishes in your life then your next of kin can decide for you after death. So you would have to express your wishes either way in life in word or writing.

Unfortunately the opposite is also true. Your next of kin can overrule your expressed desire to donate organs after your death when they have to give consent. Although a new law (Human Tissue Act) passed a few years ago means doctors can now overrule the next of kin (if deceased has donor card or signed register) I don't think ANY doctor would get into the situation of arguing with the relatives - so the new law is good on paper but not in practice.

Doctors can override it, it is true, but it is hardly done, imagine their public scrutiny when the news paper headline reads, Doctor harvests organ against family's wishes.. the law often kowtows to public opinion, since most people are superficially educated on such particulars of both medicine and the law!

:w:

[sharif1979]

Over 200 views of this thread but don't think everyone has been clicking on the survey. Please please please - it takes 5 minutes, faster than making a cup of tea! In fact I take a bit longer making tea because I leave the tea bag in for a good few minutes to make it strong! :statisfie

http://www.surveymonkey.com/s.aspx?s...783xBj4g_3d_3d

[glo]

I would vote, Sharif, except you are looking specifically for Muslim opinions and attitudes - so I can't really help you much ...

[sharif1979]

Thanks. Although organ donation rates need to be improved across the board they are exceptionally low amongst Muslims in particular hence the survey specifically aimed at Muslims.

You could forward the survey link to everyone eligible - that would help me immensely. And also encourage all to complete it! :statisfie

Anybody reading this thread, please don't leave without clicking on the survey. 5 minutes of your time only!!

http://www.surveymonkey.com/s.aspx?s...783xBj4g_3d_3d

[glo]

What other approaches are you trying to screen the opinions of Muslims?
How else are you advertising this survey?

[sharif1979]

Anything I can think of! The weblink has been emailed to friends and family, with all encouraged to forward on. The weblink is being posted in forums such as this. Printed questionnaires are going to be left in mosques, waiting rooms in surgeries, community centres etc... A local Member of Parliament has distributed to local community leaders. If anybody can think of anything else please feel free to distribute the weblink wherever you think it will make an impact or mention it to me.

The easiest method is for people to click the weblink - there are thousands of people on this forum. I could have 10,000 responses in 10 minutes if all took the 5 minutes to fill it in! Patience is a virtue though - I'm sure I'll make it.

http://www.surveymonkey.com/s.aspx?s...783xBj4g_3d_3d

[glo]

Do you have a deadline for your survey?

[aamirsaab]

:sl:
I have filled out the survey. Hope the answers help. I'm actually in agreement with those who are for organ donation but ONLY if the donar gives consent (I don't subscribe to the notion of presuming on that scale!). I was fortunate to read up on this subject a few weeks back so had obtained some very usefull info.

[sharif1979]

No particular deadline. Was hoping to have 10,000 responses by end of the year and aim to analyze and present findings early next year. The real work will start then!

Also am planning to liase with Department of Health and community leaders so am keen to get the numbers for the survey - looks more legitimate if thousands of Muslims have been canvassed.

Please encourage all to fill it in. Thank you.

http://www.surveymonkey.com/s.aspx?s...783xBj4g_3d_3d

[sharif1979]

Responses are trickling in but not pouring in - come on people!! I have faith in you all!

http://www.surveymonkey.com/s.aspx?s...783xBj4g_3d_3d

[Rabi'ya]

:sl:

ive just emailed the local ISOC so hoping they will email it out to the members inshAllah

hope u get a good response :)

[sharif1979]

Wow - that's fantastic, thanks a lot! Here's hoping people take the time to fill it in. I'm sure I'll get to 10,000 Insha' Allah.

Really appreciate it - thank you.

http://www.surveymonkey.com/s.aspx?s...783xBj4g_3d_3d

[ieshia]

I'm an organ donor mashALLAH.

[sharif1979]

Numbers are improving - I hope everybody is spreading the word!

Rabi'ya - I'm not able to reply to your message as I have under 50 posts apparently! I could email you the info if you like.

Thank you all.

http://www.surveymonkey.com/s.aspx?s...783xBj4g_3d_3d

[sharif1979]

For anybody new reading this post please take 5 minutes to complete the organ donation survey by clicking the link below. Your views are important and I need as many responses as possible. Please get all in the family to fill in and forward the link wherever you can to generate lots of responses.

http://www.surveymonkey.com/s.aspx?s...783xBj4g_3d_3d

Thank you all.

[glo]

How many responses have you had so far, sharif?

[Danah]

Completed the survey
Interesting topic!

[sharif1979]

Hi - thanks to everyone for filling in the survey. In the last few weeks since I've had survey running I've got just over 400 responses. Pleased but still pushing to get more.

Realistically if I could get about 2000 responses then I would be happy - that's a good number to analyze to take the work forward. Maybe 10,000 is pushing it which is a shame. The results so far are very interesting with regards to peoples views but the more responses I get the more legitimate the results.

If anybody can post the web link anywhere or encourage others to fill in that would be wonderful. There may a debate on this issue on the Islam Channel here in the UK out of interest to people.

Thanks for the interest - please help me try and push the numbers up!!

[sharif1979]

Just to remind people to please take 5 minutes to complete the survey. Thanks.

http://www.surveymonkey.com/s.aspx?s...783xBj4g_3d_3d

[sharif1979]

Thank you to everybody who has taken 5 minutes to complete my anonymous survey. I am SIXTY short of reaching my target number - PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE help me complete this project so that I can begin to analyse the results.

Just click the weblink and complete the survey if you haven't already done so:

http://www.surveymonkey.com/s.aspx?s...783xBj4g_3d_3d

Thank you!

[sharif1979]

Sorry - the link above is broken. Here is proper link.

http://www.surveymonkey.com/s.aspx?s...783xBj4g_3d_3d

[Dagless]

Done. You're only 59 short now.

[S.A.SH]

Completed...

[Fטлку]

Done! :D....