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Blackpool
09-13-2009, 09:48 PM
How did the "protest" at Trafalgar Square go on today?

POLICE chiefs up and down the country were last night warned to brace them- selves for a winter of race riots.

http://www.express.co.uk/posts/view/...o-grip-the-UK-
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The_Prince
09-14-2009, 01:08 PM
salam, i recorded these guys on my camera, i was right beside them when everything seemed to happen! :

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tqMHDBdB3Wk&feature=sub

i have another recording where i went and stood infront of all of them, and recorded their ugly lady leader, the one who is often shown in newspapers shouting and everything, i got her on camera lol and she kept trying to hide and even complained to the police.

it was very nice having eye to eye contact with these thugs and they could tell how bad i despise them, some of them even looked nervous because i was telling themyour going to be famous and then getting on my phone, lol, i loved the looks on their nervous faces, bunch of mutts.
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kashmirshazad
09-14-2009, 02:49 PM
Im sure the Express is a lantern of shining truth, and honesty.
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kashmirshazad
09-14-2009, 02:54 PM
I actually went to the protest in Birmingham, I think it was end of JUly and we gave them a good beating them.
Inshallah Allah swt will give us faith and imaan to destroy there evil operation and let peace reign again.
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Cabdullahi
09-14-2009, 03:10 PM
nice vid za3ter boy!....after browsing through other vids i find myself watching ''was muhammed a prophet of god
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kashmirshazad
09-14-2009, 03:14 PM
Youtube is probably not the best place to watch an Islamic advice series however.
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IslamicRevival
09-14-2009, 03:36 PM
The English defence league are part of the racist BNP party. Unfortunately I think we'll be seeing a lot more of these thugs around our areas

If these thugs were protesting and chanting anti jew slogans they would be locked up for being anti semetic.. It seems like Islamaphobia is the in thing these days and you can incite hatred without any punishment

Such a sad state of affairs
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Tony
09-14-2009, 06:00 PM
lol, so funny brother. I was expecting to see some big hard psycho looking men, but what do we get, some skinny mommy boy turds who think being hard means swaggering around behind the safety of the old bill. Excellent video brother
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Blackpool
09-14-2009, 09:17 PM
The English Defence League's tactics are not to go and beat some muslims, to outnumber them and walk all over them. They know that they are a small group. The group's tactic is to INCITE violence to create widespread anger and hatred against muslims. This group will grow! I've said this time and time again. I promise you I am not bull****ting. I think any person with a decent sized brain knows this.

The question is why are you all falling straight into the EDL's trap? This group is just going to grab more and more people as the anger increases.

IT IS A TRAP AND YOU ARE FALLING FOR IT!
So cut the bragging about the violence and do what is right. It is the EDL that is winning.
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Blackpool
09-14-2009, 09:24 PM
Mr Denham said: “The English Defence League is not very big but have among them people who know exactly what they are doing.

“If you look at their demonstrations they’ve organised, it is clear that it’s a tactic designed to provoke and to get a
response and hopefully create violence.”
This basically backs up on what I am saying. It is a trap that muslims are falling into.
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Tony
09-14-2009, 09:33 PM
Originally Posted by Blackpool
The English Defence League's tactics are not to go and beat some muslims, to outnumber them and walk all over them. They know that they are a small group. The group's tactic is to INCITE violence to create widespread anger and hatred against muslims. This group will grow! I've said this time and time again. I promise you I am not bull****ting. I think any person with a decent sized brain knows this.

The question is why are you all falling straight into the EDL's trap? This group is just going to grab more and more people as the anger increases.

IT IS A TRAP AND YOU ARE FALLING FOR IT!
So cut the bragging about the violence and do what is right. It is the EDL that is winning.

I get what ur saying blackpool, but the point is the Muslims are doing what is asked of them by Allah, we dont have a choice mate. The thing is with EDL growing is that they will only incite righteous responses with these tactics, we believe we win as long as we defend Islam, thats whatever the consequences in this life. The EDL will only win if they force/scare Muslims into non-action, it will never happen. I pray for peace but it is not forthcoming
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The_Prince
09-14-2009, 09:42 PM
Originally Posted by Blackpool
The English Defence League's tactics are not to go and beat some muslims, to outnumber them and walk all over them. They know that they are a small group. The group's tactic is to INCITE violence to create widespread anger and hatred against muslims. This group will grow! I've said this time and time again. I promise you I am not bull****ting. I think any person with a decent sized brain knows this.

The question is why are you all falling straight into the EDL's trap? This group is just going to grab more and more people as the anger increases.

IT IS A TRAP AND YOU ARE FALLING FOR IT!
So cut the bragging about the violence and do what is right. It is the EDL that is winning.
there was no violence or arrests this time.
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Blackpool
09-14-2009, 10:34 PM
Originally Posted by Tony
I get what ur saying blackpool, but the point is the Muslims are doing what is asked of them by Allah, we dont have a choice mate. The thing is with EDL growing is that they will only incite righteous responses with these tactics, we believe we win as long as we defend Islam, thats whatever the consequences in this life. The EDL will only win if they force/scare Muslims into non-action, it will never happen. I pray for peace but it is not forthcoming
Tony, you seem to be a reasonably intelligent guy. Tell me, do you believe violence will defeat the EDL, the SIOE and other anti-Muslim groups who incite violence in their demos? If the answer to this question is no then what makes muslims think that GOD will feel that this is the right response. Of course God will ask for the hatred and incitement from the EDL and SIOE groups to be challenged. But violence doesn't work, it does the opposite. It helps these groups expand and grow. It increases public anger and hatred. This is the mission of these groups and I'd feel really stupid if I were to do with any counter-prrotesters fighting them.

There is only one way to defeat these groups and that is to win the hearts of the people. This can be done through many things. One effective way is by getting a few Asian counter-demonstrators to carry a huge Union jack with words such as "We do not hate Britain." Send a message to the people of Great Britain wearing England shirts.

To me this would be an effective way of tackling Islamophobia and as God would want it, it is the most peaceful way of doing so. Violence does NOTHING. You will not win with violence. The EDL will win everytime regardless of numbers.

Originally Posted by The_Prince
there was no violence or arrests this time.
I'm referring to all of the demonstrations, however there's a bit of bragging on this forum. What angers me the most after reading the messages on the youtube videos I see Asians using it as a "Asians vs Whites" riots. There were white counter-protesters!
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kashmirshazad
09-15-2009, 08:07 AM
Yes, in fact in Birmingham in July there were more white counter protesters than there were youth of asian background.
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S_87
09-15-2009, 02:09 PM
Originally Posted by Blackpool
The English Defence League's tactics are not to go and beat some muslims, to outnumber them and walk all over them. They know that they are a small group. The group's tactic is to INCITE violence to create widespread anger and hatred against muslims. This group will grow! I've said this time and time again. I promise you I am not bull****ting. I think any person with a decent sized brain knows this.
exaactly. this is exactly how hate groups in the past got support to be powerful enough to start their slaughtering.
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arturo
09-17-2009, 12:35 AM
Hi, this is a difficult post and I would like to say that I come to you in peace and that I sincerely wish you well. It is not my intention to disrespect your beliefs, only to talk.

I'll be completely honest from the word go, I am a member of the EDL and the reason I am posting is because I feel that you are all misinformed about who we are and our intentions.

I and the EDL are not racist, we are not right wing and we DO NOT in any way support the BNP or any other racist group and we are not in any way against ordinary Muslims, in fact we respect those of you who work hard to make a better life for your selves and your families.

If you were to come to our website you would see clearly stated that we will ban and delete posts and opinions that are racist and against ordinary Muslims. We welcome all to join us, regardless of skin colour or religion.

We are only against the extremist who would bomb and kill. we are frighten for our wives, mothers,children, no one surely wants to wake up one morning to find their loved ones have been blown to pieces, we don't bring our kids up to be killed because they were on the wrong bus, tube, train or plane, do we?

Our demonstrations, which were supposed to be peaceful are being hijacked by the likes of the BNP and the so called UAF, WHY, because they are violent thugs looking for a fight, they want the violence, they want division and I and the EDL LOATH SUCH PEOPLE and it breaks my heart to see our cause hijacked.

Nick Griffin is a racist thug and his plan is to get sympathy and votes by making Muslims look as if they are. The sympathy vote, don't fall into his trap.

All of these groups, BNP, white power, combat 18 etc are all trying to hijack our cause, which is a fight against extremism we want peace and harmony, there are many many good and decent Muslims who work in our NHS as doctors, nurses and other caring roles, who are councillors, MPs,school teachers, the list is endless and I and the EDL appreciate this and respect this too.

When the group who abused the home coming solders demonstrated I became angry, why because these poor sods, sent to war by a corrupt government to support another corrupt government for the so called war on terror didn't deserve this, they have no choice, no voice.
It should be Blair, Brown and Bush who should have been demonstrated against, they are the war criminals, not the poor squaddies on the front line dying for no good reason.Some of these solders are of course Muslim.

I would point out to you that extreme Islam is some thing that has no place here, please try and imagine if the liquid bombers had succeeded, the heartbreak, the grief, the devastation as people woke up to the death of all their dreams and hopes.

Now I come to my finale point, you, not us, must drive out the extremist, you must tell them there is no place here for them, we the ordinary folk and I include Muslims in this, dont want a war or violence, we just want peace and harmony, we can't control what the war criminals Blair, Brown and Bush do, but, on the streets of England we don't need to listen to their lies. Let the likes of Griffin and the UAF fight, they are violent thugs with there own agenda. we the EDL wish no harm to innocent Muslims.

Please, come to our website, you will see for your selves that most of are against racism.We state clearly that it is not our intention to target innocent Muslims.

My kindest regard,
Arturo.
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جوري
09-17-2009, 01:20 AM
let's crucify the new guy :D

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Ramadhan
09-17-2009, 07:48 AM
Originally Posted by arturo
Now I come to my finale point, you, not us, must drive out the extremist, you must tell them there is no place here for them, we the ordinary folk and I include Muslims in this, dont want a war or violence, we just want peace and harmony, we can't control what the war criminals Blair, Brown and Bush do, but, on the streets of England we don't need to listen to their lies. Let the likes of Griffin and the UAF fight, they are violent thugs with there own agenda. we the EDL wish no harm to innocent Muslims.

I thought in democratic countries the citizens control their government?
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arturo
09-17-2009, 09:15 AM
Naidamar, when was the last time you had any control over this government, when did they last listen to the people, the millions who marched against the war in Iraq.

Do they care that millions of people in this country have lost their jobs and homes, while the bankers walk away with millions.

Do they care that our troops are coming home in coffins, fighting a war in Afganistan, that no one wants.

They,Blair and Brown have stolen our democracy and made themselves rich, democracy, excuse me while I go and laugh,what a joke.
arturo.
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GuestFellow
09-17-2009, 12:37 PM
Originally Posted by kashmirshazad
I actually went to the protest in Birmingham, I think it was end of JUly and we gave them a good beating them.
Inshallah Allah swt will give us faith and imaan to destroy there evil operation and let peace reign again.
I have to disagree. :/

Things are only going to get worse if we take the law into our own hands. We should not resort to violence to get our point across.

Just ignore them.
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S_87
09-17-2009, 12:47 PM
Originally Posted by arturo
Naidamar, when was the last time you had any control over this government, when did they last listen to the people, the millions who marched against the war in Iraq.

Do they care that millions of people in this country have lost their jobs and homes, while the bankers walk away with millions.

Do they care that our troops are coming home in coffins, fighting a war in Afganistan, that no one wants.

They,Blair and Brown have stolen our democracy and made themselves rich, democracy, excuse me while I go and laugh,what a joke.
arturo.
i understand what ur saying and for what youve said mostly agree but consider this. the only time the UK was attacked by muslims and actually faced a serious threat was after in joined the so called war on terror and went on a slaughter spree to muslims in other countries. as a non muslim can you atleast understand how this breeds extremism?
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Blackpool
09-17-2009, 02:01 PM
Originally Posted by amani
i understand what ur saying and for what youve said mostly agree but consider this. the only time the UK was attacked by muslims and actually faced a serious threat was after in joined the so called war on terror and went on a slaughter spree to muslims in other countries. as a non muslim can you atleast understand how this breeds extremism?
What has this got to do with ordinary British citizens? The majority of the population in Britain opposed any invasion of Iraq and Afghanistan. Ok, we voted for this party but war was never on their manifesto. Everything were based on LIES.

I'll give you an idea of how democracy works in Britain. Labour PROMISED us a referendum on the EU Treaty. Hundreds of thousands of petitions were sent to 10 Downing Street, the vast majority of people polled in favour of a referendum. What did Gordon Brown do? He ignored the country, broke his party's promise to the people and went to sign the EU Treaty. He handed power to Brussels. This slimey government in no way represents the British public.

So, are the killing of innocent people justified? I support the EDL's cause.
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The_Prince
09-17-2009, 02:05 PM
Originally Posted by Blackpool
What has this got to do with ordinary British citizens? The majority of the population in Britain opposed any invasion of Iraq and Afghanistan. Ok, we voted for this party but war was never on their manifesto. Everything were based on LIES.

I'll give you an idea of how democracy works in Britain. Labour PROMISED us a referendum on the EU Treaty. Hundreds of thousands of petitions were sent to 10 Downing Street, the vast majority of people polled in favour of a referendum. What did Gordon Brown do? He ignored the country, broke his party's promise to the people and went to sign the EU Treaty. He handed power to Brussels. This slimey government in no way represents the British public.

So, are the killing of innocent people justified? I support the EDL's cause.
just as you support the EDL'S cause we support the cause of Muslims who fight and rise against your tyranny, as well as the cause of Muslims who wish to have a right to their religion in the west.
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S_87
09-17-2009, 02:58 PM
Originally Posted by Blackpool
What has this got to do with ordinary British citizens? The majority of the population in Britain opposed any invasion of Iraq and Afghanistan. Ok, we voted for this party but war was never on their manifesto. Everything were based on LIES.
ask those iraqi and afghani citizens what they did to deserve having their ENTIRE country blitzed and what they think of the british government for doing it. when you get that answer, ask yourself what did they do wrong? of course the ordinary british citizen is not to be blamed without a doubt...its the governments problem. but its politics, just like the afghan and iraqi citizens-they didnt know what hit them when bombs were raining down on them. what did they do do deserve it?

I'll give you an idea of how democracy works in Britain. Labour PROMISED us a referendum on the EU Treaty. Hundreds of thousands of petitions were sent to 10 Downing Street, the vast majority of people polled in favour of a referendum. What did Gordon Brown do? He ignored the country, broke his party's promise to the people and went to sign the EU Treaty. He handed power to Brussels. This slimey government in no way represents the British public.
yeh its sucks and i in NO way condone terrorist acts. BUT britain IS a democratic country is it not? whether its an idiot that doesnt listen to his people after being voted in or not, he was elected

So, are the killing of innocent people justified? I support the EDL's cause.
no its not justified and whether they are muslim or not doesnt matter..wrong is wrong
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GuestFellow
09-17-2009, 03:02 PM
Originally Posted by Blackpool
What has this got to do with ordinary British citizens? The majority of the population in Britain opposed any invasion of Iraq and Afghanistan. Ok, we voted for this party but war was never on their manifesto. Everything were based on LIES.

I'll give you an idea of how democracy works in Britain. Labour PROMISED us a referendum on the EU Treaty. Hundreds of thousands of petitions were sent to 10 Downing Street, the vast majority of people polled in favour of a referendum. What did Gordon Brown do? He ignored the country, broke his party's promise to the people and went to sign the EU Treaty. He handed power to Brussels. This slimey government in no way represents the British public.

So, are the killing of innocent people justified? I support the EDL's cause.
No sister amani simply stated how extremism breeds and stated direct the source of the problem.

Of course I agree with you. The public are innocent and anger should not be directed towards them.

It works both way. To fight against those who encourage extremists and to deal with the direct source of the problem. Otherwise conflicts will never resolve and will continue to take place in the future but in a different shape and form.

EDL may fight against extremists but their methods are failing. Maybe they should try different tactics such as talking instead of demonstrations.
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Cabdullahi
09-17-2009, 03:22 PM
the EDL are worried about the excessive muslim influence when we compare it with the western world and its input in the muslim lands it would truly be diddley-squat

the EDL member said he fears for his wife,daughters and so on but the thing is they can watch eastenders ,shop at newlook and beautif y their nails whilst women in afghanistan and iraq watch their children being raped by the so called democratic soldiers .

On top of that these far right groups say 'muslims are doing this and that but it is silly

There is a sudden spike of hatred against muslims from all quarters and history tells us that media outlets were big players against then the number one enemy ''communism'' which strangely enough the muslims played apart to nullify

now that communism is gone the obstacle still there is islam and it is slowing your zionists and secularists plan to push for the sought after 'Novus Ordo Seclorum'
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arturo
09-17-2009, 05:22 PM
Yes I do understand why the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan generate great anger among Muslims and I think it does the same to many others too and we are helpless to be able to do anything about it. But I don't think being violent to each other is any answer,It'l Just be a violent circle.

Will the next lot be any different, my feeling is no, so what happens next, more of the same.

Some times people only see what the media tells, so, for example they don't talk about the hard working Muslim families, they just see the violence and it scares them and extremists use the fear against us all. They twist things, just like they have with the EDL and the big problem now is that the thugs will see us as one them, and speaking for my self I am most certainly not, I'm a believer in a compassionate society, where all the different groups work together to produce a better place to live.

You're right there is this feeling going round that is anti Islam, fed by the media and the politicians.
But they'd be stuffed if we all stood together.
arturo
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S_87
09-17-2009, 05:25 PM
Originally Posted by arturo
Yes I do understand why the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan generate great anger among Muslims and I think it does the same to many others too and we are helpless to be able to do anything about it. But I don't think being violent to each other is any answer,It'l Just be a violent circle.

Will the next lot be any different, my feeling is no, so what happens next, more of the same.

Some times people only see what the media tells, so, for example they don't talk about the hard working Muslim families, they just see the violence and it scares them and extremists use the fear against us all. They twist things, just like they have with the EDL and the big problem now is that the thugs will see us as one them, and speaking for my self I am most certainly not, I'm a believer in a compassionate society, where all the different groups work together to produce a better place to live.

You're right there is this feeling going round that is anti Islam, fed by the media and the politicians.
But they'd be stuffed if we all stood together.
arturo
in that case the way to reach out against extremism is not through demos in the name of EDL
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Cabdullahi
09-17-2009, 05:46 PM
Originally Posted by arturo
Yes I do understand why the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan generate great anger among Muslims and I think it does the same to many others too and we are helpless to be able to do anything about it. But I don't think being violent to each other is any answer,It'l Just be a violent circle.

Will the next lot be any different, my feeling is no, so what happens next, more of the same.

Some times people only see what the media tells, so, for example they don't talk about the hard working Muslim families, they just see the violence and it scares them and extremists use the fear against us all. They twist things, just like they have with the EDL and the big problem now is that the thugs will see us as one them, and speaking for my self I am most certainly not, ...............
so do you have a solution to combat extremism on both sides because smelly pub goers holding placards saying 'ban mosques' is a bit diabolical
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arturo
09-17-2009, 06:34 PM
I don't think that banning mosqes is the answer to any thing and as I don't frequent pubs, it's some thing I don't know about, I may have the odd glass of wine at home, but I stopped going to them when they became loud and full of drunken Idiots.

I think the mosqe thing became an issue when the media and that Muslim chap who has written a book about them being one of the places where youngsters were turned into extremists.

My own opinion is I have nothing at against any place of worship, be it, a mosqe, church or synagog.

I really don't know the way forward, I or EDL can't stop the wars. Only parliament can do that.

Can I ask what your opinion of Anjem Choudary is? Im not asking for anyone to be disloyal or to run him down. Just is he well thought of?
arturo
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Uthman
09-17-2009, 07:12 PM
Greetings arturo,
Originally Posted by arturo
Can I ask what your opinion of Anjem Choudary is? Im not asking for anyone to be disloyal or to run him down. Just is he well thought of?
To be honest, most Muslims aren't even aware that he exists.
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arturo
09-17-2009, 07:50 PM
Thanks Uthman, funny enough I go back to the EDL website and am confronted by headlines in the Sun, where he said that Muslims will out breed us, take over and instal sharia law.
I'm, frankly bewildered, what does he hope to gain by statements like this, stir things up, with the Sun aiding and abetting,I'm not that good at maths, but it would mean the Muslim women would have to produce 40 or 50 million babies by 2050 and it would mean a population of about 90 odd million.It's a silly thing to say.

What is scary is that people are already inflamed by it and it's created more tension and more ammunition for the likes of Griffin and the other right wingers.

He said this in the Lea Bridge road Mosque.
arturo
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GuestFellow
09-17-2009, 08:06 PM
Originally Posted by arturo

Can I ask what your opinion of Anjem Choudary is? Im not asking for anyone to be disloyal or to run him down. Just is he well thought of?
arturo
Ah he should be imprisoned. Many Muslim don't agree what he has to say...then again not many know what he exists.

Originally Posted by Uthmān
Greetings arturo, To be honest, most Muslims aren't even aware that he exists.
I just found out about him when I joined this forum lol.
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arturo
09-17-2009, 09:55 PM
Thanks Guestfellow and I must say I feel better about the possibilties of a debate.
arturo
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The_Prince
09-17-2009, 10:43 PM
Originally Posted by arturo
Thanks Uthman, funny enough I go back to the EDL website and am confronted by headlines in the Sun, where he said that Muslims will out breed us, take over and instal sharia law.
I'm, frankly bewildered, what does he hope to gain by statements like this, stir things up, with the Sun aiding and abetting,I'm not that good at maths, but it would mean the Muslim women would have to produce 40 or 50 million babies by 2050 and it would mean a population of about 90 odd million.It's a silly thing to say.

What is scary is that people are already inflamed by it and it's created more tension and more ammunition for the likes of Griffin and the other right wingers.

He said this in the Lea Bridge road Mosque.
arturo
well sometimes you might have to conclude (and im starting to believe this) that he works for the government! this guy has said some of the craziest stuff u can hear, including the condoning of murder, and advocating of violence, yet he is still FREE and allowed to do as he pleases, and on top of that many of his close associates are on government pay. either the government is hiring this guy to create social tension and division for their own future purposes, or he is an informant working with them, which allows him to stay such wack things and remain free.
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S_87
09-18-2009, 11:15 AM
Originally Posted by arturo
I think the mosqe thing became an issue when the media and that Muslim chap who has written a book about them being one of the places where youngsters were turned into extremists.
this MIGHT have been credible if the media didnt use the tablighi jamat name as they have. every muslim knows that tablighi jamat masjids dont get involved in politics at ALL and TJ is like christian missionary. thats what they do..go around preaching islam. no politics NOTHING.
so when the media starts talking about sinister TJ mosques i for one find it hilarious because if they are going to label, atleast use the right ones.


Can I ask what your opinion of Anjem Choudary is? Im not asking for anyone to be disloyal or to run him down. Just is he well thought of?
arturo
i think he calls the media before they have their conferences where they slate. honestly the media loves him and he loves the media...not a fan of him at all.
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S_87
09-18-2009, 11:17 AM
Originally Posted by arturo
,I'm not that good at maths, but it would mean the Muslim women would have to produce 40 or 50 million babies by 2050 and it would mean a population of about 90 odd million.It's a silly thing to say.


arturo
plus those irresponsible teenage pregnancies soooooo have to stop :p
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Cabdullahi
09-18-2009, 11:28 AM
Originally Posted by amani
plus those irresponsible teenage pregnancies soooooo have to stop :p
that wont stop so long as shows like big brother and skins are aired
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arturo
09-19-2009, 12:00 AM
An Invitation to the English Defence League

Indeed, Allah (SWT), the One true God, sent the Final Messenger Muhammad (SAW) and the Qur'an as a guidance for all mankind, providing detailed rules on how to regulate the affairs of society. These divine rules are collectively known as the Shari'ah, and are capable of solving all of the ills of society that mankind currently faces.

For the past four months, Islam4UK have successfully launched Islamic Roadshow's up and down the United Kingdom, providing the British community with a unique opportunity to experience the exquisite beauty of the Shari'ah. The latest roadshow, in Woolwich south London, which took place on Saturday 29th August 2009, was particularly fruitful, and effectively demonstrated why the Shari'ah is needed to aid burgeoning problems such as poverty, racism and general corruption.


In light of this, we have recently seen the emergence of a new organisation called, ‘The English Defence League'. On their website http://www.englishdefenceleague.org/index.html they describe themselves as an organisation that,

"...has been formed by English people who are tired of our government letting terrorists preach murder on our streets. It is not an act of fascism to oppose terrorists and the Shari'ah."

As misinformed as they may be about Islam, recent events have also shown that they are being poorly represented in the public arena by various media outlets; incorrect comparisons have been drawn between its members and those from among the British National Party, who are known for their particularly racist views and consequently, we felt it necessary to clarify the reality of the English Defence League to help elucidate the correct method in dealing with a party, which essentially are against those individuals who wish to implement the Shari'ah of Allah (SWT) here in Britain.

One such organisation, which has played a large role in distorting the reality of the English Defence League, is the Unite Against Fascism party. The UAF (Unite Against Fascism) party, who in an attempt to gain popular support among the British community, have taken it upon themselves to hijack protests led by members of the English Defence League to further their own socialist led policies, in a typical ‘underdog' themed campaign.

As a result of this clear distortion, which they are fully aware of, we call upon the UAF to cease such baseless demonstrations regarding an organisation that clearly has nothing to do with them; we also call upon those so-called Muslim members of UAF, to hastily review their positions before it is too late, as it is clear that such membership is in direct opposition to the Deen of al-Islam.

As far as the English Defence League is concerned, indeed we are aware of your demonstrations against our aspirations to transform Britain into an Islamic State, and we would like to invite you to a constructive debate to discuss the reality of British law and its suitability to govern the masses.

We would also like to clarify many of the misconceptions you have about the Shari'ah, which unfortunately, as you yourselves have experienced (at the hands of UAF), has been heavily distorted by the media and other deceitful organisations.

Verily, we believe that it is only Almighty God who should be followed, worshipped and obeyed, and we challenge you to prove otherwise.
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arturo
09-19-2009, 12:15 AM
I have in fact emailed them and I'll see what they say, altho I have to say that while I've got no problem with Muslims using this on a civil leval. Where the law of the land is concerned it must be one law for all.
I know that many are totaly against the Idea and see it as a first step to an Islamic state.
artur
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S_87
09-21-2009, 06:32 PM
Originally Posted by arturo
I know that many are totaly against the Idea and see it as a first step to an Islamic state.
artur
TBH if it is Gods will that the UK becomes and islamic state no power on earth can stop that. But consider this for a second. the middle eastern countries are full of muslims. are they islamic states?(ok besides s.arabia-egypt,lebanon,syria,dubai and even morocco,pakistan,libya,algeria etc) does that not tell you something?
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Apathy
09-21-2009, 06:43 PM
you should ingore these toons if no one bats an eye lid they will go unoticed most of the right winged papers printed these hateful protests as English protesters fleeing from Asian mobs... which gets them more sympathy and more supporters publicity etc.

If you do protests do it peacefully with proper manners insh'Allah :nervous:
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Foxhole
09-21-2009, 06:57 PM
Originally Posted by arturo
An Invitation to the English Defence League

As far as the English Defence League is concerned, indeed we are aware of your demonstrations against our aspirations to transform Britain into an Islamic State, and we would like to invite you to a constructive debate to discuss the reality of British law and its suitability to govern the masses.
If anyone says this about the US I will consider it an outright declaration of war, and will treat those who pursue this goal as enemies of the state.

The UK has to disestablish the Anglican Church and write a constitution that stipulates permanent secular governance. Just end the discussion now.
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جوري
09-21-2009, 08:49 PM
^^^ hilarious

what you want to be:



and what you actually are:


cut down on the bean dip tough guy!
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Tony
09-21-2009, 08:51 PM
^^^lol. If there was an olympic trophy for button pushing, no-one would be able to touch you sister lol. (btw, my thread is not passed yet:hiding:)
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GuestFellow
09-21-2009, 08:58 PM
Originally Posted by Foxhole
If anyone says this about the US I will consider it an outright declaration of war, and will treat those who pursue this goal as enemies of the state.
O_o

Okay...
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czgibson
09-21-2009, 09:09 PM
Greetings,
Originally Posted by Foxhole
If anyone says this about the US I will consider it an outright declaration of war, and will treat those who pursue this goal as enemies of the state.
That is totally over the top.

Do you actually think there's a chance of it happening?

The UK has to disestablish the Anglican Church and write a constitution that stipulates permanent secular governance. Just end the discussion now.
True - the sooner religion gets out of politics the better.

Peace
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جوري
09-21-2009, 09:16 PM
Originally Posted by Tony
^^^lol. If there was an olympic trophy for button pushing, no-one would be able to touch you sister lol. (btw, my thread is not passed yet:hiding:)
I've low tolerance for drumbeaters.. especially when they are on this forum as guests!

:w:
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Apathy
09-21-2009, 09:37 PM
Originally Posted by Foxhole
If anyone says this about the US I will consider it an outright declaration of war, and will treat those who pursue this goal as enemies of the state.

The UK has to disestablish the Anglican Church and write a constitution that stipulates permanent secular governance. Just end the discussion now.
Oh wow, declaring war on ideologies i wonder were you get that from ;D.

Though an Islamic American state without interest ruling your society does sound a lot better than what you have :statisfie also may help cut down the murder/drugs/suicides :shade:
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GuestFellow
09-21-2009, 10:12 PM
Originally Posted by Apathy
Oh wow, declaring war on ideologies i wonder were you get that from ;D.

Though an Islamic American state without interest ruling your society does sound a lot better than what you have :statisfie also may help cut down the murder/drugs/suicides :shade:
A lot of people are obsessed over celebrities...as though they worship them.
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arturo
09-22-2009, 12:03 AM
Originally Posted by Gossamer skye
^^^ hilarious

what you want to be:



and what you actually are:


cut down on the bean dip tough guy!
Sorry, I'm not tough at all, I'm 66 and a grandfather to 6 grandchildren, but I stand for what I feel is right and do you realy believe that 7/7 and all that destruction was right. I cannot believe that you, a fellow citizen, believes or wants this. What if there is another such event, maybe even worse. Do you believe that this will make life better for you. I truly, bare you no ill will at all.
arturo.
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جوري
09-22-2009, 12:12 AM
Originally Posted by arturo
Sorry, I'm not tough at all, I'm 66 and a grandfather to 6 grandchildren, but I stand for what I feel is right and do you realy believe that 7/7 and all that destruction was right. I cannot believe that you, a fellow citizen, believes or wants this. What if there is another such event, maybe even worse. Do you believe that this will make life better for you. I truly, bare you no ill will at all.
arturo.

That post wasn't directed at you, I have actually addressed you in a separate thread, perhaps if you'd actually read it, you'd have learned that I am not a fellow citizen, neither do I subscribe to doctored up conspiracy theories by bush and his poodle blair and cronies ... thus your words (wise as they are) I fear are falling on deaf ears.

all the best
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Cabdullahi
09-22-2009, 12:50 AM
Originally Posted by arturo
Sorry, I'm not tough at all, I'm 66 and a grandfather to 6 grandchildren, .... Do you believe that this will make life better for you. I truly, bare you no ill will at all.
arturo.
nobody wants that but for the elite to create order they need choas when everything thing is choatic and ''fear'' is the common feeling felt by the masses , ideologies , racial concepts , interests , culture , different countries and different views will be all meshed together a globilization will take place this allows the power to shift to those who control the economy and the government officials are nothing but public counsellors to keep you quiet helping you to feel fear and at the same time promising to actively sort out the threat of terrorism

a government that doesn't even allow an official inquiry to the 7/7 bombings why don't they not tell us what happened if they're truthful to conclude you are more likely to die from an allergic reaction than a terrorist attack and that is the truth
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arturo
09-22-2009, 01:00 AM
Originally Posted by The_Prince
well sometimes you might have to conclude (and im starting to believe this) that he works for the government! this guy has said some of the craziest stuff u can hear, including the condoning of murder, and advocating of violence, yet he is still FREE and allowed to do as he pleases, and on top of that many of his close associates are on government pay. either the government is hiring this guy to create social tension and division for their own future purposes, or he is an informant working with them, which allows him to stay such wacky things and remain free.
You and me both prince, you know I live in London,in an inner city part and my road is like the united nations,next door is a hindu family, been to two of their weddings, opposite me is a turkish muslim guy,always ready for a chat and the whole street is like that, on bonfire night they all come round and we let off a few fireworks, we keep an eye out for each others houses, we've had a street party, with all manner of wonderful foods. We borrow tools from each other.My youngest daughter babysits for them. a few times, when I've been locked out after forgetting my key, I can knock on any door and I'm always welcome, the turkish guy with coffee so strong I can't sleep for a week.
This is how it should be in all England and if people make an effort, then that's how it could be.

Communities don't just appear out of thin air, you have to work at it,sometimes hard.

By the same token, if some thing is wrong you have to make a stand,if you don't, wrong wins.
What more can I say, the people who want to fill hearts and minds in our community with the kind of hatred that makes them want to die and take innocent people with them are wrong, kick them out or we get hell on earth.
Kind regards,
arturo.
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arturo
09-22-2009, 01:05 AM
Originally Posted by Gossamer skye
That post wasn't directed at you, I have actually addressed you in a separate thread, perhaps if you'd actually read it, you'd have learned that I am not a fellow citizen, neither do I subscribe to doctored up conspiracy theories by bush and his poodle blair and cronies ... thus your words (wise as they are) I fear are falling on deaf ears.

all the best
I am sorry for that and I apologise.
arturo.
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arturo
09-22-2009, 01:31 AM
Originally Posted by Abdullah Ii
nobody wants that but for the elite to create order they need chaos when everything thing is chaotic and ''fear'' is the common feeling felt by the masses , ideologies , racial concepts , interests , culture , different countries and different views will be all meshed together a globalization will take place this allows the power to shift to those who control the economy and the government officials are nothing but public counsellors to keep you quiet helping you to feel fear and at the same time promising to actively sort out the threat of terrorism

a government that doesn't even allow an official inquiry to the 7/7 bombings why don't they not tell us what happened if they're truthful to conclude you are more likely to die from an allergic reaction than a terrorist attack and that is the truth
There is some truth in what you say and I agree that there should be a public inquiry into any disaster, whatever the nature.
I have seen the conspiracy video several times and there are some inconsisties, that worry me.
But I did go to Finsbury park a couple of times when the chap with the one hand and he was encouraging people to do ghastly things and there are a number of these people doing this and for example the bomber Reid and the recent liquid bombers, there are some others too and the perception is of great danger.

Perhaps you right, that there is some sort of government conspirocy, perhaps the preachers of hate are paid to say what they do, but we can still kick them out.

None of this could happen if we all stood together.Drive out the muslim extremist, drive out the nazi BNP, with unity, none could stand in our path.
arturo
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kawaiigardiner
09-22-2009, 01:34 AM
It doesn't help when there are grade A morons like Anjem Choudary open their mouth and there is no protest in opposition to what Anjem Choudary says.

Btw, Islam is blamed when in reality it is nothing less than an attack on non-white people in the UK by those band of right wing thugs. The social problems that exist in the 'Muslim community' in the UK have nothing to do with Islam and everything to do with the underlying culture.

With that being said, it doesn't help when immigrants come to the UK and no matter British they become they're never accepted as equals. I guess the benefit of being in Australia, New Zealand, Canada and the United States - our countries were founded on a melting pot immigration policy.
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Cabdullahi
09-22-2009, 02:03 AM
and dont forget an accomplice of Abu Hamza was an mi5 agent also i feel he was too the stuff he says is so scripted these agents are used to paint a picture of what type of person to fear in our minds , we were being readied for the ultimate thing 'one part of the choas' before 7/7 and 9/11 arnold and steven seagal were fighting islamists on the big screens when there was no imminent threat what so ever from the muslims,
The western world were still fresh off the destruction of communism but islam was in line next and here we are on an islamic forum trying to comfort a concerned pre-conditioned 66 year old , hopefully through dialogue we can denature the pre-set notion set by the media
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kawaiigardiner
09-22-2009, 02:17 AM
Originally Posted by Abdullahii
and dont forget an accomplice of Abu Hamza was an mi5 agent also i feel he was too the stuff he says is so scripted these agents are used to paint a picture of what type of person to fear in our minds , we were being readied for the ultimate thing 'one part of the choas' before 7/7 and 9/11 arnold and steven seagal were fighting islamists on the big screens when there was no imminent threat what so ever from the muslims,
The western world were still fresh off the destruction of communism but islam was in line next and here we are on an islamic forum trying to comfort a concerned pre-conditioned 66 year old , hopefully through dialogue we can denature the pre-set notion set by the media
I don't believe in conspiracy theories; Abu Hamza and Anjem Choudary are both idiots and if there was no Christianity, no Judaism, no Islam - those two would probably be anarchists, communists, socialists or fascists. They're radical and they push their agendas because they're weak individuals who look at romantically at the past with rose tinted glasses and dream that maybe they can resurrect it in the 21st century. Those two are in the same ball park as Meir Kahane who dreamed he could restore biblical Israel and for it to be ruled by strict Jewish Law.

The world is pluralistic, the state secular and the laws are based on individual rights, private property and other ideas out of the enlightenment. If they, Abu Hamza and Anjem Choudary, wish to live in third world squaller and being ruled by a theocracy stuck in the 7th Century then by all means go and live in Saudi Arabia or some other place.

BTW, notice that those who are most critical of Western values know the least about Western philosophy, the enlightenment, liberal democracy.
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جوري
09-22-2009, 02:33 AM
Originally Posted by kawaiigardiner
stuck in the 7th Century then by all means go and live in Saudi Arabia or some other place.

BTW, notice that those who are most critical of Western values know the least about Western philosophy, the enlightenment, liberal democracy.
hmmm.. considering 'Saudi Arabia' is a middle eighteenth century establishments, I reckon you know as much about its history, values, enlightenment etc, as your 'critical of the west' counterparts?

Does accusing others of faults you deem endemic to their regions somehow exempt you from it?

That was rhetorical btw, I am not looking for you to unfold your undoubtedly inscrutable wisdom!

all the best
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kawaiigardiner
09-22-2009, 02:47 AM
Originally Posted by Gossamer skye
hmmm.. considering 'Saudi Arabia' is a middle eighteenth century establishments, I reckon you know as much about its history, values, enlightenment etc, as your 'critical of the west' counterparts?
So you're saying that those people living in Saudi Arabia only suddenly appeared in the 18th century?

Does accusing others of faults you deem endemic to their regions somehow exempt you from it?

That was rhetorical btw, I am not looking for you to unfold your undoubtedly inscrutable wisdom!

all the best
So when I critique the best you can come back with it a childish reply akin to putting your fingers in your ears going "lalalal I can't hear you". The West has its faults, a very, very long list of faults but the value of individual rights, personal freedom and individual responsibility are hardly virtues contradictory to Islam.
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Tony
09-22-2009, 06:04 AM
^^^^noislily sucks in breath and heads for work with a kind of "whoa I know whats coming" smile.:D
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GreyKode
09-22-2009, 07:15 AM
Originally Posted by kawaiigardiner
I don't believe in conspiracy theories; Abu Hamza and Anjem Choudary are both idiots and if there was no Christianity, no Judaism, no Islam - those two would probably be anarchists, communists, socialists or fascists. They're radical and they push their agendas because they're weak individuals who look at romantically at the past with rose tinted glasses and dream that maybe they can resurrect it in the 21st century. Those two are in the same ball park as Meir Kahane who dreamed he could restore biblical Israel and for it to be ruled by strict Jewish Law.

The world is pluralistic, the state secular and the laws are based on individual rights, private property and other ideas out of the enlightenment. If they, Abu Hamza and Anjem Choudary, wish to live in third world squaller and being ruled by a theocracy stuck in the 7th Century then by all means go and live in Saudi Arabia or some other place.

BTW, notice that those who are most critical of Western values know the least about Western philosophy, the enlightenment, liberal democracy.
Everybody loves to take a cheap shot at saudi arabia, well to some people 7th century saudi arabia is much better than the w-h-o-r-e garbage countries of europe.
Just some other point of view.
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جوري
09-22-2009, 08:40 AM
Originally Posted by kawaiigardiner
So you're saying that those people living in Saudi Arabia only suddenly appeared in the 18th century?
You should simply do some reading before jabbering like a lunatic, and especially when accusing others of not doing the same what do you think? Don't answer me with a question, you are the one who spoke of 7th century 'Saudi Arabia', I am asking you, was there such a thing as Saudi Arabia in the 7th century? just so we can deduce a lucid clause from your guggle!



So when I critique the best you can come back with it a childish reply akin to putting your fingers in your ears going "lalalal I can't hear you". The West has its faults, a very, very long list of faults but the value of individual rights, personal freedom and individual responsibility are hardly virtues contradictory to Islam.
I think that is a deep perceptive insight to your own psyche, in fact, you haven't done any critique, you have generalized and lacking in your reasoning is even basic history of the region. Should I honestly take that with other than a grain of salt?
As for 'very very very very long list of things' well that is delightful young man, until you can put your thoughts into some cohesive legible literary 'critique' can it and it will be dismissed with the rest of your psycho-babble!

all the best of course!
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AvarAllahNoor
09-22-2009, 09:56 AM
Originally Posted by Blackpool
How did the "protest" at Trafalgar Square go on today?

POLICE chiefs up and down the country were last night warned to brace them- selves for a winter of race riots.

http://www.express.co.uk/posts/view/...o-grip-the-UK-
I think they are backed by the BNP (Even though they deny they are anything to do with each other) They go about inciting racial hatred (again they refute they are racist, but are against Islamification of Britain) - This way, Muslims, Sikhs, Blacks, Hindus (and many Whites, whom I've seen in the UAF rallies) will be provoked and result in violence, which It has. Then this will then allow the rest of the county to see how violent the Muslims are. The target is Islam as we well know. And protesting outside a Mosque, well that should not be allowed, unless it's the infamous one where Abu Hamza 'Hook' used to hold his daily demonic rantings.
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Cabdullahi
09-22-2009, 10:06 AM
^ choas is needed to create order, to be precise 'Novus Ordo Seclorum'
muslims fighting right wing groups , blacks against whites , teenagers against adults , women against men all will fight choaticly until they will yearn for a change and then a world order will be presented to them and because of the situation and certain circumstances it will be latched upon by the masses
people like kawaigardiner will be among the frontrunners to sign up because an angry man is a weak man
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AvarAllahNoor
09-22-2009, 10:11 AM
Originally Posted by Abdullahii
^ choas is needed to create order, to be precise 'Novus Ordo Seclorum'
muslims fighting right wing groups , blacks against whites , teenagers against adults , women against men all will fight choaticly until they will yearn for a change and then a world order will be presented to them and because of the situation and certain circumstances it will be latched upon by the masses
Indeed. But it's ironic to see for what many fought for during the two World Wars, is these days shrugged off.

Then again, It takes me to a verse as Shri Sheikh Farid Ji saying, ''I stand up high, and look around, and see that it's not just me in anguish, the WHOLE world is''
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arturo
09-23-2009, 11:26 PM
The EDL have never targeted mosques, Harrow was nothing whatsoever to do with us and WE WILL NOT be targeting mosques in the future. If you listen to UAF AND respect party lies then you will give them what they want. we have nothing at all against muslims or their places of worship.In fact they are none of our business.
We want the bombers out.

The Harrow mosque has passed all the required planning permissions and is a legitimate building and the idiots involved in those so called protests should shut up and go home and get a life.

If you are foolish enough to believe the lies of the socialists and the media, that's not my fault, lie after lie drips from their lips.

We have no connection to the scum in the BNP and we had banners saying so, members of my family were killed by nazi scum and it's a terrible insult to say that I support them.

Ignore the Harrow "protesters" walk away from them, show them contempt by not rising to their bait.Show the UAF that you are not interested or taken in by their lies.

WE have one cause and one cause only, we don't want the bombers and the sharia law.

Can you not understand, the media and others want you to be violent, they want you to riot, they profit by a good story, it sells newspapers. Give them what they desire.

Even the islam4uk are telling you that we EDL are not against you, that you should not listen to UAF lies. What does that tell you.

In the months to come, you will see the truth, we are right to want the bombers stopped and nothing will stop us.

Consider this, if I am a racist,if I'm some sort of right wing thug, why then have I come here and tried to talk to you.
arthur.
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Blackpool
09-23-2009, 11:54 PM
The EDL are releasing a video on Friday to send a message out that they are against muslim EXTREMISTS. They will be going on to explain that BNP supporters have infiltrated their demos and that they are not welcome. They burn the swastika flag and behind them show a banner bearing the words "BLACK and WHITE UNITE." They consist of both black people and white people and have invited moderate muslims to join their group against extremism.

The video will be posted on Friday. The EDL are getting alot of stick from members of the stormfront forum.
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The_Prince
09-23-2009, 11:59 PM
Originally Posted by Blackpool
The EDL are releasing a video on Friday to send a message out that they are against muslim EXTREMISTS. They will be going on to explain that BNP supporters have infiltrated their demos and that they are not welcome. They burn the swastika flag and behind them show a banner bearing the words "BLACK and WHITE UNITE." They consist of both black people and white people and have invited moderate muslims to join their group against extremism.

The video will be posted on Friday. The EDL are getting alot of stick from members of the stormfront forum.
black and white unite, what about asians? :-), right now black ppl arent on the right wing hit list, its switched to asians.
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The_Prince
09-24-2009, 12:05 AM
here is a forum topic from the EDL's website, dont be fooled by these guys:

1) Islamism is monolithic, static and unresponsive to change. It is based on the Koran, a hate-filled rant written by a psychopathic pedophile which claims to be the 'Eternal Word of God'.

If you are a Islamist you must accept the Koran without question, as the unchangeable and unchallengeable word of God. If you do not accept ALL of the koran (including the passages that incite murder, maiming and rape) then you are an apostate and other Islamists have a duty to kill you. Islamism is monolithic, petrified and fossilized, and can never separate itself or progress from this barbaric 7th century text. Modernization (Bid'ah) is strictly forbidden "Every innovation is a misguidance and every misguidance goes to Hell fire."


2) Islamism does not have values in common with other cultures, is not affected by them and does not influence them in any positive way. Islamism is totally different from any other religion. There is no Golden Rule. There is no 'Thou Shalt not Kill', no requirement for truth. In fact killing (Jihad) and lying (Taqiyya) to further the expansion of Islamism are regarded as virtues.

Those aspects of the cult which appear to imitate Judeo-Christianity are in fact a thin veneer covering vicious and evil barbarism. The pivot of Islamist existence is an implacable hatred of the non-believer, which is taught from infancy. All the rest of the 'religion' revolves around this divinely decreed requirement to kill, maim, rape, subjugate, plunder and humiliate the infidel. Jews and Christians are pigs and apes. Islamism has produced nothing of use or interest to other cultures for the last 500 years. Islamism is a theocratic, pre-rational phase of social development which Europe left behind in the sixteenth century.


3) Islamist culture continues to be in all respects inferior to the West. It produces no artistic or scientific output of any significance. Islamist society is barbaric, irrational, primitive, tribal and sexist. Stonings, honor killings, use of women as possessions, institutionalised pedophilia, polygamy and illiteracy abound.


4) Islamism is violent, and aggressive to its very core. The Koran advocates terrorism and Allah rewards those who kill infidels. Islamism is engaged in a 1400 year old 'clash of civilisations' where all other cultures are regarded as 'Jahiliya' to be destroyed, censored and suppressed. The world is divided into Dar al-Harb and Dar-al-Islam. Dar al-Islam has bloody borders and is permanently at war with Dar al-Harb. This war does not just apply to the West. Anarchic failed states such Pakistan and Afghanistan were once peaceful and prosperous Buddhist countries, but all traces of their Buddhist history have been eliminated. Pacifism is no protection against Islamist predation.


5) Islamism is a political ideology as well as being an irrationalist cult, and is used for political advantage, often by cynical rulers who live as playboys in the fleshpots of Dar al-Harb. Although utterly irrational and obscurantist, Islamism survives because it provides the justification for a medieval power structure where the priests are at the top, the Islamist male in the middle, and women and kaffirs at the bottom.


6) Islamists are continually criticising the West - moaning, whingeing, whining and complaining, even when they have chosen to come and live here. The are perpetually pleading for special treatment with alternating temper tantrums and threats of riots and terrorism interspersed with sulky infantile displays of victim status. They especially resent westerners applying modern standards of analysis to their protected 'victim culture'.


7) Uniquely among immigrants, Islamists refuse to fit in with the host society. Instead they expect the hosts to fit in with them. This causes real problems in employability as the employer can expect far greater numbers of lawsuits alleging discrimination etc from Islamist employees than from less 'victimised' groups.

Islamists also are a major security risk in sensitive occupations such as police, armed forces, airports etc. Their first loyalty is to the Ummah, not to their country (whose institutions and culture they hate).


8) Wariness about Islamists is natural and normal. These people really do want to kill us, plunder our property and rape and subjugate our children. The Koran tells them to do it and their role-model Mohammed set an example of divinely justified criminality which every Islamist endeavors to follow.

http://s1.zetaboards.com/EDL_The_Forum/topic/2316650/1/
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Blackpool
09-24-2009, 12:06 AM
Originally Posted by The_Prince
black and white unite, what about asians? :-), right now black ppl arent on the right wing hit list, its switched to asians.
I've not seen the video. I've only read the article in the daily star. I know, however, that the EDL are welcoming muslims into their group which goes to show that it is not a group set up to attack muslims. It is, as they claim, a group that are against extremists/extremism. It is a good platform for muslims to send out their message as the EDL seem to be getting alot of media coverage.
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Blackpool
09-24-2009, 12:09 AM
Originally Posted by The_Prince
here is a forum topic from the EDL's website, dont be fooled by these guys:
If you read the disclaimer above it....

Please note, any views posted on this board, and its contents are not necessarily the views of the English Defence League. The EDL will not tolerate any racist or Islamaphobic behaviour on this forum. We are against Islamic Extremists and all that they stand for, but do not want innocent Muslims being victimised or abused.
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The_Prince
09-24-2009, 12:19 AM
Originally Posted by Blackpool
I've not seen the video. I've only read the article in the daily star. I know, however, that the EDL are welcoming muslims into their group which goes to show that it is not a group set up to attack muslims. It is, as they claim, a group that are against extremists/extremism. It is a good platform for muslims to send out their message as the EDL seem to be getting alot of media coverage.
and what is an extremist Muslim according to the EDL? lol, they welcome Muslims, LOL, ok, so Muslims will go beside EDL members who are chanting Allah is a pedo, and Muhammad is a pedo you c*nt! and also running around saying paki *******s. lol okayyyyyyyyyy.

back to the topic of who is an extremist Muslim, well if a Muslim want sharia law, that makes him an extremist, well, guess what, most Muslims in the UK want sharia law in civil matters for Muslims, just like the Jews have their own religous court, Muslims want their Sharia one too, and i agree with that as thats fair and Jews have it, so that would make me an extremist, and that just goes to show the EDL's double standards.

what else, most Muslims believe Muslim women have a right to wear the niqab if they so choose to, well for most EDL members that would be extremist too, lol. what else, most Muslims believe in jihad, well again that makes us extremist.

so when u say ur looking for a Muslim, your looking for one sell out Muslim who is only Muslim by name but doesnt even believe in any of its real teachings.
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The_Prince
09-24-2009, 12:21 AM
ah yes if you also happen to support hezbollah and such resistence groups against Israel, that makes you an extremist too, so count all Muslims as extremists again, lol.

make no mistake ppl, the EDL are at war with Islam and the Muslims.
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The_Prince
09-24-2009, 12:29 AM
lol i just read the EDL's article in the daily star, lol what a load of RUBBISH, so ppl of ALL races are supporting the EDL, right, so where are they? why is that at the last protests all i saw was white protesters, and why is it that at other protests edl members were shouting at paki *******s?

seems i will have to make a video soon to expose the EDL propaganda.
Reply

Blackpool
09-24-2009, 12:34 AM
You don't seem to be getting the point. The EDL demonstrations were infiltrated by BNP and other far right-wing supporters. The EDL have made a video which will be released on Friday stating that the BNP, far right wing protesters are not welcome at the EDL demos and will therefore be kicked out of the EDL.

Extremists are those who justify terrorism, terrorist attacks, incite hatred amongst muslims and call for the death of non-muslims. It's not hard to understand this. Abu Hamza, Omar Bakri, Abdulla Ahmed Ali etc
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Blackpool
09-24-2009, 12:36 AM
Originally Posted by The_Prince
lol i just read the EDL's article in the daily star, lol what a load of RUBBISH, so ppl of ALL races are supporting the EDL, right, so where are they? why is that at the last protests all i saw was white protesters, and why is it that at other protests edl members were shouting at paki *******s?

seems i will have to make a video soon to expose the EDL propaganda.

I've seen pictures of some black members of this group knocking about...

The group has attracted ANTI-MUSLIMS who do not share the views of the EDL.
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The_Prince
09-24-2009, 12:38 AM
Originally Posted by Blackpool
I've seen pictures of some black members of this group knocking about...

The group has attracted ANTI-MUSLIMS who do not share the views of the EDL.
the only protest where i saw some black ppl with the EDL was at the first one, after that they never showed up again because they found out who the EDL really are, heck they were probaly even lied to in joining that protest.

compare that to the anti-EDL protests where you have whites, blacks, and asians. heck even at the last pro palestine march you had jewish rabbis!!!!!!!!
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The_Prince
09-24-2009, 12:44 AM
Originally Posted by Blackpool
You don't seem to be getting the point. The EDL demonstrations were infiltrated by BNP and other far right-wing supporters. The EDL have made a video which will be released on Friday stating that the BNP, far right wing protesters are not welcome at the EDL demos and will therefore be kicked out of the EDL.

Extremists are those who justify terrorism, terrorist attacks, incite hatred amongst muslims and call for the death of non-muslims. It's not hard to understand this. Abu Hamza, Omar Bakri, Abdulla Ahmed Ali etc
lol the EDL are the best thing to have happend to such extremists, now they will say look, these ppl are protesting against you the Muslims everywhere, and have made protests outside your mosques!

if you think the EDL are doing a good thing in combatting extremism im afraid your quite wrong, the only thing that will come out of this is more violence, and more millitancy.
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Blackpool
09-24-2009, 12:47 AM
Originally Posted by The_Prince
the only protest where i saw some black ppl with the EDL was at the first one, after that they never showed up again because they found out who the EDL really are, heck they were probaly even lied to in joining that protest.

compare that to the anti-EDL protests where you have whites, blacks, and asians. heck even at the last pro palestine march you had jewish rabbis!!!!!!!!

If you read the Daily Star you would have noticed that it also mentioned that one black guy featured in this video that is due to be released on Friday...

From reports, it was the Anti-EDL protesters that started the violence!

Originally Posted by The_Prince
lol the EDL are the best thing to have happend to such extremists, now they will say look, these ppl are protesting against you the Muslims everywhere, and have made protests outside your mosques!

if you think the EDL are doing a good thing in combatting extremism im afraid your quite wrong, the only thing that will come out of this is more violence, and more millitancy.

The EDL never protested outside any mosques. I think the EDL group is a fantastic idea if what they state is true. I feel muslims need to get up off their backsides and use them to send out their message to extremists.
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The_Prince
09-24-2009, 12:52 AM
the EDL protested outside the harrow mosque, they keep saying it wasnt them, yet one of the skin heads shouted EDL EDL EDL.

and they will be protesting outside a future mosque in wales, :). so indeedio they have and are going to.

yes, Muslims need to get off their backsides and confront the EDL at all places, just like they did in Harrow.
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The_Prince
09-24-2009, 12:57 AM
Muslims need to start making Muslim Defence Leagues, not just in England, but all over Europe, and i think it will happen soon, many are talking of making such groups, so the EDL isnt all bad, its waking Muslims up.
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arturo
09-24-2009, 01:20 AM
You have to understand that EDL are under attack from many different groups and they come onto the forum with their messages of hate and we try at first to reason with them and then we delete them so that their posts come under the heading of deleted user.
Some one was on today, re the Harrow mosque and you can see that I and others said clearly we did not want to be involved, we are not stupid you know, the media would have a field day, far right target mosques, muslims riot to defend it, just what purpose, other causing grief would that serve.
In my view, you muslims are fully entitled to your holy places and that is enshrine in the law of the land and I support the law of the land and no one has the right to disrespect that, end of.

The BNP are, without doubt, racist, so they use Islam as an excuse to propagate racism against asians.

The EDL, on the other hand are not racist, we are a single purpose group who want to get rid of extremists who want to kill, we for obvious reasons don't like that that much and we also realise that your average muslim doesn't either. why else would we be saying to you join us.

The racist BNP doesn't, it says, clearly only anglo saxons, it's quite funny really, if it wasn't tragic, where exactly are these anglo saxons, do they still exist?

If you are born here then logically you are English, you are born into England and England influences you without you even being aware of it, a friend of mine who's mum comes from Pakistan, comes out to my place in Italy and the Italians would say to him,Inflasie, without him saying a single word. Now how do you explain that?

My point is that if you are born in England you are, English, does not matter where your parents came from. My view is that, if there fore you are English, you are my countryman and when our Englishness is threatened, stand with me, does that sound unreasonable.

I issue this simple challenge to you, one of you, come onto our forum, announce you are muslim and would like to join us and I believe that you will be welcome by most and if you are not, I will leave the EDL. I also promise that I will give any short thrift should they be impolite.
arturo.
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arturo
09-24-2009, 01:44 AM
[QUOTE=The_Prince;1223639]and what is an extremist Muslim according to the EDL? lol, they welcome Muslims, LOL, ok, so Muslims will go beside EDL members who are chanting Allah is a pedo, and Muhammad is a pedo you c*nt! and also running around saying paki *******s. lol okayyyyyyyyyy.

back to the topic of who is an extremist Muslim, well if a Muslim want sharia law, that makes him an extremist, well, guess what, most Muslims in the UK want sharia law in civil matters for Muslims, just like the Jews have their own religious court, Muslims want their Sharia one too, and i agree with that as that's fair and Jews have it, so that would make me an extremist, and that just goes to show the EDL's double standards.

what else, most Muslims believe Muslim women have a right to wear the niqab if they so choose to, well for most EDL members that would be extremist too, lol. what else, most Muslims believe in jihad, well again that makes us extremist.

Prince, an extremist is one who wants to cause murder,they don't care who is killed.An extremist is one who wants to impose sharia law on me. simple really.

If muslims want those parts of sharia that don't go against the law of the land and it applies to muslims only, do I give a flying fig, no I don't but the law of the land must apply to all, if you have a dispute in the way of a civil matter, if you then then decide you both want to sort it out via your own way fine. If you want to, for example,force a women to marry some one she does not want to, then English law must be applied.If you don't like a law, lobby to get it changed.
arturo.
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arturo
09-24-2009, 01:58 AM
:hiding:
Originally Posted by The_Prince
the EDL protested outside the harrow mosque, they keep saying it wasnt them, yet one of the skin heads shouted EDL EDL EDL.

and they will be protesting outside a future mosque in wales, :). so indeedio they have and are going to.

yes, Muslims need to get off their backsides and confront the EDL at all places, just like they did in Harrow.
So you can't see that they are just trying to wind you up mate, think about other demos, like the anti globalisation, hijacked by anarchists, Just because a few idiots chant some slogans, some of these people come to demos just to have a fight, cause as much grief as they can. SO because some pratt calls you a name, I'm to take the blame.So if some muslim want to blow me up, I can blame you then.
arturo
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جوري
09-24-2009, 02:08 AM
Originally Posted by arturo
, for example,force a women to marry some one she does not want to, then English law must be applied.If you don't like a law, lobby to get it changed.
arturo.

You have a fine upstanding understanding of sharia law as evidenced from above.. Do you wonder why folks see all this as smoke and mirror? Shouldn't you be in the least bit educated of what sharia law is before speaking of which law is better? And actually I'll venture to say unless you are educated in either schools i.e British or Islamic law, which I highly doubt, you are not qualified to judge which of the two is better or worst!

Also, prince gave you an excellent example, if the law doesn't affect you personally as is the case with the Jews, I don't see why you are so crossed? You have some utopic vision of an England cohered by some ridiculous notion of solidarity, well not only does everyone not see eye to eye with you, your whole vision of what is 'good and peaceful' is rather subjective, the most any of you could offer for centuries long atrocities is either a blase dismissal of not bearing the sins of your forefathers, or shuffling the blame around to NATO or whatever other scape goat you depend on to bail you for unspeakable 'indiscretions' That which you choose omit and can't conceive as to why others don't see eye to eye with you has undoubtedly influenced their persuasions.

I am not British, but nothing would give me greater pleasure than to see your colonial little settler island be divided amongst all the nations of which it wreaked and continues to wreak havoc!

all the best
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arturo
09-24-2009, 04:05 AM
Originally Posted by Gossamer skye
You have a fine upstanding understanding of sharia law as evidenced from above.. Do you wonder why folks see all this as smoke and mirror? Shouldn't you be in the least bit educated of what sharia law is before speaking of which law is better? And actually I'll venture to say unless you are educated in either schools i.e British or Islamic law, which I highly doubt, you are not qualified to judge which of the two is better or worst!

Also, prince gave you an excellent example, if the law doesn't affect you personally as is the case with the Jews, I don't see why you are so crossed? You have some utopic vision of an England cohered by some ridiculous notion of solidarity, well not only does everyone not see eye to eye with you, your whole vision of what is 'good and peaceful' is rather subjective, the most any of you could offer for centuries long atrocities is either a blase dismissal of not bearing the sins of your forefathers, or shuffling the blame around to NATO or whatever other scape goat you depend on to bail you for unspeakable 'indiscretions' That which you choose omit and can't conceive as to why others don't see eye to eye with you has undoubtedly influenced their persuasions.

I am not British, but nothing would give me greater pleasure than to see your colonial little settler island be divided amongst all the nations of which it wreaked and continues to wreak havoc!

all the best

I have very little influence on world events and if we realy want exchange views on bad deeds centuries old, we could look at the muslims invasion of Persia or Spain and so on and go round and about who is blame for this that and the other. But rather a useless debate really.

I'm more concerned with the here and now in England so I'll wish you goodnight.
arturo
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جوري
09-24-2009, 04:17 AM
Originally Posted by arturo
I have very little influence on world events and if we realy want exchange views on bad deeds centuries old, we could look at the muslims invasion of Persia or Spain and so on and go round and about who is blame for this that and the other. But rather a useless debate really.

I'm more concerned with the here and now in England so I'll wish you goodnight.
arturo
The Muslim invasion of Persia or spain, left them a beacon to the world. Spain was the shinning star of all of Europe amidst what would have been otherwise a desolate state of the dark ages as history speaks of its neighbors.
And that right there should be a small clue as to what works better sharia law, or the law that made potatoes the devil food and women akin to animals (as in having no souls)

you are right, I have no interest in going that route with you, I am merely pointing out where you are misinformed if not down right delusional (about your expectations)

all the best!
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Ramadhan
09-24-2009, 04:50 AM
Is EDL such an irony?
they claim they are against extremism, but they can't even rid of BNP?
Or more plausible, their claim is just smoke and mirror.
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Blackpool
09-24-2009, 09:56 AM
Originally Posted by naidamar
Is EDL such an irony?
they claim they are against extremism, but they can't even rid of BNP?
Or more plausible, their claim is just smoke and mirror.
Is this post meant to be stupid? ^o)
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arturo
09-24-2009, 07:28 PM
To put it simply, we are English patriots,unfairly labeled, if you don't believe that, nothing I can do.We are not left or right and open to all to join and we do have muslims,hindus and buddhists among our supporters so far.

As for getting rid of the BNP, yesterday we burned the nazi flag, that should send them a you're not welcome message.

I came on here to reassure you that we are not against moderate muslims.
arturo
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Amadeus85
09-24-2009, 08:32 PM
Originally Posted by arturo
To put it simply, we are English patriots,unfairly labeled, if you don't believe that, nothing I can do.We are not left or right and open to all to join and we do have muslims,hindus and buddhists among our supporters so far.

As for getting rid of the BNP, yesterday we burned the nazi flag, that should send them a you're not welcome message.

I came on here to reassure you that we are not against moderate muslims.
arturo
Hello Arturo,

My question is, what is opinion of EDL about secular state and christianity. Are there any supporters of true theocracy in England? Because it is the only way imho to save countries like Yours from slow and steady dying. On the other hand, secular state will give more and more political power in England in the hands of jews, muslims, hindus and other minorities.
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The_Prince
09-24-2009, 09:58 PM
Originally Posted by Amadeus85
Hello Arturo,

My question is, what is opinion of EDL about secular state and christianity. Are there any supporters of true theocracy in England? Because it is the only way imho to save countries like Yours from slow and steady dying. On the other hand, secular state will give more and more political power in England in the hands of jews, muslims, hindus and other minorities.
it was theocracies that took england into the dark ages.
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جوري
09-24-2009, 10:18 PM
Originally Posted by The_Prince
it was theocracies that took england into the dark ages.
Perhaps they are nostalgic for the dark ages..can't shed their bestial roots.. so why put on a false front under the guise of progress?

:w:
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arturo
09-24-2009, 11:20 PM
Originally Posted by Amadeus85
Hello Arturo,

My question is, what is opinion of EDL about secular state and christianity. Are there any supporters of true theocracy in England? Because it is the only way imho to save countries like Yours from slow and steady dying. On the other hand, secular state will give more and more political power in England in the hands of jews, muslims, hindus and other minorities.
EDL are not polical in the sense of wanting to obtain power, like for example labour or tories, we are a pressure group that wants only to draw attention to the threat of extreme Islam. Members cover all political groupings and religions.

My own view is that all citizens have equal value.All religions have the right to practice their faith equally but should be separate from the state.
The state should be a democratic one.

There should also be a common set of values to which all within the state should try to hold. A unity.

I think England has lost it's way. For example, who are our hero's,half naked tarts who fill our tv screens and newspapers.So called pop stars who preach violence in there songs.Many of them selfish self serving drug addicts.

We have corrupt politicians who serve only them selves and are prepared to send our solders to die for no good reason, despite millions of protesting, not in our name, they add insult to injury by sending them ill equipped to even fight effectively. They spent more time debating fox hunting than they did the war in Iraq.
Good night,
arturo.
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Amadeus85
09-25-2009, 03:34 PM
[QUOTE=arturo;1224025].

My own view is that all citizens have equal value.All religions have the right to practice their faith equally but should be separate from the state.
The state should be a democratic one.
So Your struggles will be meaningless and won't change anything, but I wish You good luck, as its always better to do something than nothing.

I think England has lost it's way. For example, who are our hero's,half naked tarts who fill our tv screens and newspapers.So called pop stars who preach violence in there songs.Many of them selfish self serving drug addicts.

We have corrupt politicians who serve only them selves and are prepared to send our solders to die for no good reason, despite millions of protesting, not in our name, they add insult to injury by sending them ill equipped to even fight effectively. They spent more time debating fox hunting than they did the war in Iraq.

arturo.
Very true. I have some sentiment to England until 50's and 60's, although that I'm fan of latin culture and catholic world. But Your attempts, based on acceptance of liberalism and democracy wont bring back the old England, it could only save nowadays England, but that will be very hard too.
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Tony
09-25-2009, 06:54 PM
I have been following thread and think that i need to come to Arturos defense, I understand what is being said, and I have to admit that at times us white heterosexual English males seem to have less rights than anyone and are unable to voice opinions for fear of accusations of bigotry. Yes there are problems within British society that enables right wing fascists to hijack any cause and pervert it for their own ends, but, surely there is a rightfor British people to be conscerned and to voice conscern about losing our national identity without being chastised. When a voice is drowned out before it is listened to it is surely the same bullying technique adopted by people who hate without ever trying to understand diversity.
I am not sure what the EDL are hoping for by inviting muslims to burn flags alongside them etc, but I strongly feel that the slightly misguided EDL are in fact a genuine voice for those of us who would like to ensure our heritage and way of life.In the tollerant system of Islam there is room for this and we should be working together in order that all our needs and aspirations are met amicably.
We dont need to crush people or beleifs just because were different and cramped together.
PEACE OUT BROTHERS
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The_Prince
09-25-2009, 07:14 PM
I think the Muslims should join the EDL forum, it will be good to have chats there and refute alot of their propaganda, I have signed up, it's no good to just stay silent and ignore them, you may even attract some of them to Islam.
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Tony
09-25-2009, 07:19 PM
^^^your right brother I will go and check it out later tonight
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The_Prince
09-25-2009, 07:19 PM
Originally Posted by Tony
I have been following thread and think that i need to come to Arturos defense, I understand what is being said, and I have to admit that at times us white heterosexual English males seem to have less rights than anyone and are unable to voice opinions for fear of accusations of bigotry. Yes there are problems within British society that enables right wing fascists to hijack any cause and pervert it for their own ends, but, surely there is a rightfor British people to be conscerned and to voice conscern about losing our national identity without being chastised. When a voice is drowned out before it is listened to it is surely the same bullying technique adopted by people who hate without ever trying to understand diversity.
I am not sure what the EDL are hoping for by inviting muslims to burn flags alongside them etc, but I strongly feel that the slightly misguided EDL are in fact a genuine voice for those of us who would like to ensure our heritage and way of life.In the tollerant system of Islam there is room for this and we should be working together in order that all our needs and aspirations are met amicably.
We dont need to crush people or beleifs just because were different and cramped together.
PEACE OUT BROTHERS
I personally would like to know what is happening to white ppl and their culture, are whites being banned from pubs, nightclubs, having their singing and dancing, and many other things that are now associated with white culture etc.

lol what huge culture and identity change has happened, are english ppl being forced to wear turbans, burqas, hijabs, jewish caps, long robes, or chinsea type clothing? etc etc
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The_Prince
09-25-2009, 07:22 PM
English culture is changing for the worst, but not because of Islam or Muslims, infact if anyone studies, they will find that traditional british values and culture is very similar to Islamic values and traditions, it is this new modern day secular version that is changing the identity of England.
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The_Prince
09-25-2009, 07:23 PM
traditional british values:

-respect for women
-chasity
-hard justice
-well behaved society
-respect for the elder
-close familly

all of the above is traditional english values which is getting lost, and all of the above is in common with Islam.
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Tony
09-26-2009, 08:06 AM
Originally Posted by The_Prince
traditional british values:

-respect for women
-chasity
-hard justice
-well behaved society
-respect for the elder
-close familly

all of the above is traditional english values which is getting lost, and all of the above is in common with Islam.


You know brother I have come to notice that you are attacking all people whatever their veiws are, yes English identity is disappearing, you need to understand that Britain has a right to beleive or not beleive in Islam. You need to respect the people of England more brother, this is not an Islamic country and as such the people who were here before the arrival of muslims feel somewhat threatened by Islam. Do not misunderstand me, I am a proud and ardent muslim, butthe mass influx of differing cultures and peoples are impacting on the English way of life whether you like to hear this or not. You are my brother, and as such I feel you need to stop attacking people for the sake of it, I, and others are perfectly within their rights to voice conscern over what feels like a loss of identity, my post previously was a genuine and thought out response, I did not expect a brother whos roots are from another country to chastise me for exercising my freedom of expression. So while I understand what your saying brother, please give credit where its due and accept that their are veiws other than your own, peace
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The_Prince
09-26-2009, 02:08 PM
Originally Posted by Tony
You know brother I have come to notice that you are attacking all people whatever their veiws are, yes English identity is disappearing, you need to understand that Britain has a right to beleive or not beleive in Islam. You need to respect the people of England more brother, this is not an Islamic country and as such the people who were here before the arrival of muslims feel somewhat threatened by Islam. Do not misunderstand me, I am a proud and ardent muslim, butthe mass influx of differing cultures and peoples are impacting on the English way of life whether you like to hear this or not. You are my brother, and as such I feel you need to stop attacking people for the sake of it, I, and others are perfectly within their rights to voice conscern over what feels like a loss of identity, my post previously was a genuine and thought out response, I did not expect a brother whos roots are from another country to chastise me for exercising my freedom of expression. So while I understand what your saying brother, please give credit where its due and accept that their are veiws other than your own, peace
and i have the right to call nonsense when i see nonsense, and the right to speak out when i see immigrants getting the blame for problems that arent actually theirs, the english ppl need to get their act together and stop blaming others. is it because of immigrants that 9 out of 10 english will be obease by 2050? is it because of immigrants that england has a huge teen pregnancy and abortion problem? is it because of immigrants that england has a huge youth and social alcohol problem which is leading to the decay of its health as a whole according to doctors? is it because of immigrants that england found itself in an econamic mess that cost alot of english ppl their job??? the list goes on and on, if english ppl are losing their identity its because of their own backward ways that they have fallen into, and im sorry if u dont like that, but im not gonna sit here and just let u blame outsiders for problems that are obviously not due to them, get over it.
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The_Prince
09-26-2009, 02:11 PM
and btw, i apply this standard to ALL people, not just to the english, it makes me sick when i hear citizens of a country always blaming foreign ppl living in their country for their problems, i dont just attack english ppl for it, but many others as well, so im not just picking on england, i call nonsense wherever i see it, immigrants have always been the conveniant scape goats, just like the Jews in the Nazi era, and the ones in russia who are constantly getting attacked by neo nazi skin heads, this is nothing new.
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Amadeus85
09-26-2009, 02:15 PM
Originally Posted by The_Prince
English culture is changing for the worst, but not because of Islam or Muslims, infact if anyone studies, they will find that traditional british values and culture is very similar to Islamic values and traditions, it is this new modern day secular version that is changing the identity of England.
I wonder what's the reason. Capitalism? Feminism? Consumptionism? Secularism of the society? Xenophobia? Hedonism? Are young Israelis or Arabs different from us much? I think that yes and no. I dont know honestly. But I wish that we were more like modern Israelis and Arabs, more vital, religious, active, concerned. Does this process touch only Brittons? Of course not, it touches europeans from Lizbon to Warsaw.
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Tony
09-26-2009, 04:42 PM
Originally Posted by The_Prince
and i have the right to call nonsense when i see nonsense, and the right to speak out when i see immigrants getting the blame for problems that arent actually theirs, the english ppl need to get their act together and stop blaming others. is it because of immigrants that 9 out of 10 english will be obease by 2050? is it because of immigrants that england has a huge teen pregnancy and abortion problem? is it because of immigrants that england has a huge youth and social alcohol problem which is leading to the decay of its health as a whole according to doctors? is it because of immigrants that england found itself in an econamic mess that cost alot of english ppl their job??? the list goes on and on, if english ppl are losing their identity its because of their own backward ways that they have fallen into, and im sorry if u dont like that, but im not gonna sit here and just let u blame outsiders for problems that are obviously not due to them, get over it.


Brother chill out, Im not blaming any foreign people for the lack of identity English people feel, its our government that have lead us to this, what you see as nonsense is actuelly very real to the vast majority. Look theres nothing wrong with fire in the belly or a militant attitude to opposing beliefs, but bro, make sure you are right in what you are saying first. Englands backward ways, as you put it are still Englands ways, what right have you to criticise England for its choices, if Allah wanted it changed then it would be, but until that time Englanders have the right to either choose Islam or to be headonistic beer swillers, they were already this b4 the intro of Islam.
And yes, I can connect the influx of 20,000,000 people or so with the rise in crime, the suffering moral standards, what I can also do is point out that there are equal parts white English, Asian, black, eastern block etc etc to blame for it.
I get you brother, and I admire your steadfstness but I see it from both angles and whether you agree or not, English people have the right to be conscerned with what is fundamentally a change in the dynamics of the country they have every right to love and want to preserve. Im on your side bro but we need to give and take, I hate the skin head, bnp fascists as much as anyone, but the average Englishman/woman should be allowed to speak up for what they want in their own country without being blasted for it.
Peace and respect bro, I hope you take what I am saying in the spirit of how its meant, I am Muslim but I am English also and I love our way of life, when you look at English morals they are good strong morals, their are many factors attributing to the downfall we are experiencing, but the English traditions and way of life we have defended for so long is not part of it
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The_Prince
09-26-2009, 07:39 PM
Originally Posted by Amadeus85
I wonder what's the reason. Capitalism? Feminism? Consumptionism? Secularism of the society? Xenophobia? Hedonism? Are young Israelis or Arabs different from us much? I think that yes and no. I dont know honestly. But I wish that we were more like modern Israelis and Arabs, more vital, religious, active, concerned. Does this process touch only Brittons? Of course not, it touches europeans from Lizbon to Warsaw.
atheist humanist secularism.
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The_Prince
09-26-2009, 07:48 PM
Originally Posted by Tony
Brother chill out, Im not blaming any foreign people for the lack of identity English people feel, its our government that have lead us to this, what you see as nonsense is actuelly very real to the vast majority. Look theres nothing wrong with fire in the belly or a militant attitude to opposing beliefs, but bro, make sure you are right in what you are saying first. Englands backward ways, as you put it are still Englands ways, what right have you to criticise England for its choices, if Allah wanted it changed then it would be, but until that time Englanders have the right to either choose Islam or to be headonistic beer swillers, they were already this b4 the intro of Islam.
And yes, I can connect the influx of 20,000,000 people or so with the rise in crime, the suffering moral standards, what I can also do is point out that there are equal parts white English, Asian, black, eastern block etc etc to blame for it.
I get you brother, and I admire your steadfstness but I see it from both angles and whether you agree or not, English people have the right to be conscerned with what is fundamentally a change in the dynamics of the country they have every right to love and want to preserve. Im on your side bro but we need to give and take, I hate the skin head, bnp fascists as much as anyone, but the average Englishman/woman should be allowed to speak up for what they want in their own country without being blasted for it.
Peace and respect bro, I hope you take what I am saying in the spirit of how its meant, I am Muslim but I am English also and I love our way of life, when you look at English morals they are good strong morals, their are many factors attributing to the downfall we are experiencing, but the English traditions and way of life we have defended for so long is not part of it
btw, just to make myself more clear, this isnt uniquely english, the arabs are just as bad, and have fallen into the same mess.

i have no problem with english ppl wanting to fix their country up, but my problem is when they pin point that problem on outsiders, and assume that the way to fix the problem is by blaming the immigrants and thinking that once immigrants are out etc then the problem will be solved and everything will be good.

and you mention english morals, i agree, traditional english morals are very in line with Islamic ones, im not sitting here saying english morals are backwards, this modern era of secularism from many atheists is whats gotten england into this social decay that their experiancing. and not just England, but most countries around the world including Muslim ones.

humanist atheist secularism needs to be rejected or reformed. i mean in england there are adverts on the radio that say: want to be cool, wear a condemn!!!!!!!! this is all thanks to these secular atheists who promote such things.
Reply

arturo
09-26-2009, 08:53 PM
Prince, of course muslims are not directly to blame for what you may call a loss of identity,but there has been a huge influx of many different cultures and some have remained very seperate, with a great lack of communcation and understanding.
There is a great deal of ignorence and also a lack of common purpose.
Much of this has been brought about by politicians. They have created a divided nation.
Quite honestly I don't know the answer.
arturo.
Reply

arturo
09-26-2009, 09:30 PM
I've talked to some members of the EDL and they would like to have a discussion with some of you and I've been asked to invite you to our forum.

It's been suggested that there should be some rules for the discussion.

No personal attacks
No bad language
Stay on topic, which would be on how to find a way forward re extremists.

If those taking part would like to add to the rules, please do so.
Thanks, arturo.
Reply

The_Prince
09-27-2009, 03:24 AM
aturo, remember how you said the harrow mosque incident was wrong, and you guys dont intend to protest infront of mosques etc, well here are your fellow members supporting harrow mosque protest part 2!

http://s1.zetaboards.com/EDL_The_Forum/topic/2310909/2/

:-), now what do you say? the SIOE are planning to protest outside harrow mosque again, and your fellow EDL members are backing it, and are wanting to join, they just want 'official' confirmation, but that doesnt matter, what does matter is that we know that there are EDL members who support it, and support such things. :) tut tut, so much for the EDL members not thinking its ok to protest outside mosques.

lol whats more funny is that the harrow mosque is a very liberal mosque, and isnt even that orthodox, talk about stupidity and turning the wrong type of Muslims to go against you.
Reply

Tony
09-27-2009, 09:37 AM
So I just entered EDL forum into google and got directed to stormfront forum !!!!!!!!! Is this the site EDL want to discuss with muslims on ? The first thing I noticed were the rules ststing that the forum would tolerate no rascist language etc etc, the second thing I noticed was the rascist landuage, the third was the anti Asian photos, stories and rhetoric.
I advise any muslim who has been considering engaging in any discussion with these vile animals to reconsider, they are not worth the effort of registering into there squalid, rascist and frankly unintelligent arena.:raging:
Reply

arturo
09-27-2009, 01:16 PM
There are plenty of members on there shouting them down, plenty on their trying to hijack our forum and the movement.They post wind up posts and if you can't see that, what can I say.
The BNP have now said we are a Zionist plot. Now every one hates us, amazing.

Think about this, why would we invite for a you discussion, we need to prove that the wind up,far right etc are wrong, they can't hijack us.
But, fair enough, I see your points.
arturo
Reply

arturo
09-27-2009, 03:31 PM
So stormfront have managed to use google to direct people to their site. I'll put up a direct link, there are people who don't want us to talk, some of them do post on EDL but there are plenty who do want a discussion and some have suggested somewhere neutral, so maybe that's one way round it.

When I first came on here there were people who were suggesting violence, that didn't make me run away, it made me want to put my point of view in a reasonable way. To argue my case.

There are hotheads who want EDL to be involved in the Harrow mosque protest and EDL said no, it's a stupid thing to do.It would lead to violence. We are peaceful.
arturo.
Reply

Tony
09-27-2009, 07:37 PM
ok fair enough, I never heard of stormfront b4. Can u provide a direct link please Arturo
Reply

arturo
09-27-2009, 08:01 PM
The British National Party has declared the English Defence League a proscribed organisation and it will be a disciplinary offence for any party member to be involved with that group.

Making the announcement today in a special organiser s bulletin circulated within the party, national organiser Eddy Butler said that although the proscription had been ordered a while ago, it was being made public today because the controlled media continues to lie about the BNP and the EDL.

Time and time again the lying media has linked the BNP with the EDL s activities, said Mr Butler.

Most recently the media and the BBC Eastern regional service, in particular, lost no time in blaming the BNP when Muslim rioters attacked police in Luton.

The BBC coverage of that event specifically said that the BNP had planned to march through Luton, and this was why the Muslims had rioted, he said.

This is, of course, an utter lie. The BNP does not march in the streets but rather campaigns in an ordinary democratic fashion in elections, door-to-door canvassing and leafleting, Mr Butler continued.

It is completely malicious and unwarranted to blame the supposed activities of organisations such as the EDL on the BNP, when there is no common ground between the two groups at all.

The EDL has, in fact, gone out of its way to distance itself from the BNP, while the party has no interest in the sort of confrontation in which the EDL seems to seek.

In his official statement, Mr Butler said the proscription of the EDL meant that it will be a disciplinary offence for British National Party members to associate or participate in any event or activity organised by the English Defence League or hold membership of the English Defence League.

The reasons for this proscription are that the English Defence League, through its activities, brings nationalist and patriotic politics into disrepute. If the English Defence League is not instigated by and its activities are not encouraged by the state (which it quite possibly is), then the track record of this organisation shows that it is run by people who will only bring discredit and probable arrest for anyone who attends its events.

The British National Party does not wish to be associated with the English Defence League in any way whatsoever. Mr Butler s circular ended with a request for any party official who becomes aware of any member who breaks this rule to report such incidents to elections@bnp.org.uk.
Reply

arturo
09-27-2009, 08:03 PM
Hi Tony, I'd never heard of them until yesterday, trying to research them, I'll get back to you soon.
arturo.
Reply

The_Prince
09-28-2009, 02:27 AM
Arturo im sorry but its becomming quite obvious that voices as yours are starting to get drowned out by many other extreme right wing EDL members. I've just visited the forum and saw another moderate EDL member being talked down to, and being warned against, and being labelled as a leftist or some Musim Taqqiya tactician!

i mean there are now threads after threads to bash Islam (not fairly critique it, but bash and attack and use the same common tactic of oh Islam is evil, and makes Muslims evil bla bla)

and more threads appearing to bash Muslims as well, for instance one about Muslims not getting car insurance when the article cited doesnt even say such a thing, and state that its mostly whites not getting it!

how can you honestly expect any Muslim to sit there as a member and be part of it when you have threads demonizing their religion, calling for boycotts of Muslim nations and business', and making bigoted labels to them which are blatantly false.
Reply

arturo
09-28-2009, 07:51 PM
Thanks for making the effort Prince, I think it's a bit of a battle against the right wing and those of us who don't believe that all muslims are bad ect ect.

I need to keep working at it and I will and only time will tell who will win the argument, EDL wasn't set up for the extremist and eventually it will take a direction, hopefully it'l be the voices of reason.

I'm going to back off from here now and perhaps come back in a month or so, let you how it's going, you're right, I couldn't invite you and other moderates considering what's being said.
cheers mate.
arturo
Reply

The_Prince
09-28-2009, 09:15 PM
Originally Posted by arturo
Thanks for making the effort Prince, I think it's a bit of a battle against the right wing and those of us who don't believe that all muslims are bad ect ect.

I need to keep working at it and I will and only time will tell who will win the argument, EDL wasn't set up for the extremist and eventually it will take a direction, hopefully it'l be the voices of reason.

I'm going to back off from here now and perhaps come back in a month or so, let you how it's going, you're right, I couldn't invite you and other moderates considering what's being said.
cheers mate.
arturo
i dont think you should leave this forum, its good to have a voice like yours over here as well, it still helps out.
Reply

Amadeus85
09-28-2009, 10:53 PM
I see that english nationalists are badly organized, in eastern Europe it looks better.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-_9Dh...eature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IdRSc...eature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X2x7NkezUuU
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