I feel like an outcast

[anonymous]

:sl:

I have a problem sisters and brothers and I'm really confused.. and I could need some advice and support.. Please don't judge me.

I met a brother. He is a hafiz and has a lot of knowledge in Islam. He use to lead Taraweeh prayers in our masjid during Ramadan. I never looked at him nor talked to him as other girls used and tried to do during that time as they all thought he was good-looking and they were interested in him. He obviously liked the fact that I always use to lower my gaze, so he approched a friend of mine one day when I wasn't there, he asked her for my number and she gave it to him as he told her he was interested in getting married to me. The only reason she gave him the phone number was so he could contact me and I could give him the number of my wali or give his number to my wali.

He started to text me and he told my he liked me because I wasn't like those "girls". He said that he heard I had nice aklaq and deen and that he was looking for a wife. At this point I didn't wanted to text him, and I wanted to tell him not to text me and give him the number of my wali instead. But people (very close to me) said to me that it was okay for him to text me because it was not like we were meeting or being alone with each other. I still didn't thought this was okay but they somehow convinced me.

At the same time I thought to myself why would this guy who is hafiz and from what I have seen a practicing muslim text me if it wouldn't be permissible, even he insisted on that it was okay for us to do so as our purpose were marriage.

The texting went over to him calling me. And next time I know he use to phone me every night and we use to talk up to 3 hours. (All of this without anyone knowing, not even my wali, he told me not to tell anyone)This time I thought we use to discuss things that were revelant to marriage such as economic, children, household etc and I thought it was better then texting as he use to text me irrevelant stuff. But it still didn't feel right. People told me that this was how people got married, that you were allowed to call one another to get to know each other and that you can't just marry each other just like that.

He said the same thing when I said that I thought it felt wrong. He said; but then how am I suppose to get to know you? How are we suppose to get married? I told him to contact my wali but he said he wasn't perpared for it. Why? Cause he doesn't have a job nor does he have a house. I asked him how he then even thought about marrying me as I have right for him to fulfill such as economics. He then told me that this is just dunya and we will take what we get from Allah (SWT).. It didn't make sense to me but I didn't wanted to argue with him..

He called me one day while I was in the masjid and told me to come out. I asked him why? He said he wanted to take a look at me, I said no way and that it was out of question. He said we have to meet so we can look at each other, otherwise we can't proceed things. I told him I'll come out only for him to look and then I'll go in again as fast as possible. He agreed on it and I went outside, he looked at me and as I turned and were about to go in he said; :sl: and started to chat, we talked for 2-3 mins and then I went inside again.

I feelt horrible! In the masjid and all the way home it was all I could think about until this day! I knew what we did must have been wrong so I texted him that day and told him he couldn't call me anymore and text me, and that if he wanted to marry he had to contact my wali. He thought it was weird and that he had to have contact with me to be able to marry each other! And like every other time he says it's permissible for us to do these things, such as text, talk in phone and meet.


I'm confused sisters and brothers.. I hope you get me.. I think it's a cultural thing because people agree with him. They think it's okay to call each other and text each other and that you should meet just to take a look at each other and they say this is okay in Islam.. ButI don't know, it doesn't feel like that.. When I say that we should meet and discuss with my wali in presence he and the people laughs and say you can't do that and that's embarrasing..


Anyways I hope you understand.. my english is not the best as it's not my native language.. all the best..

Please give me advice and tell me if it's permissible all we have done or not, or if I even should marry him? And don't I have the right to marry someone who has a job and a house? He thinks it's weird..

:wa:

[rpwelton]

What do you mean "take a look"? You mean, you removed your hijab for him? That would not be allowed as you are not a mahram to him yet.

It's OK for prospective spouses to meet and chat, but a male guardian for the woman must be present throughout the conversation (and of course they should respect Islamic protocol during the conversation, such as sitting separate from one another).

[cat eyes]

lol sis i know loads of brothers who have memorized all the holy Qur'an and they have been seen standing and chating with girls(non muslims) flirting and messing with them by friends of mine and just coz he leads the prayer don't mean anything either. i don't know him but he sounds a bit odd. no you cannot meet alone its haraam, about the contacting i am not knowlegable enough to say that this is okay as far as i know hearing the girls voice is haraam and not encouraged.

[Cabdullahi]

''come outside so i can take a look at you''

at that stage you should have waited until an old scary man went outside of the masjid and then you should've textd him saying thats me good bye!

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[anonymous]

I did not take my hijaab for him!! He said to come outside so he could take a look at my face...

[nebula]

i cant believe this brother told you to come outside to take a look at you! :raging: what is this???????????????????????????????????????

sister my advice to you is that you should completely stop talking to this brother, if he aint got a house or money then why the hell is he contacting you if he aint ready for marriage? hes obviously messin wid ur mind, tell ur brothers to bang him out.

[nebula]

if he wants to look at your face then tell him to contact ur wali and arrange something if hes serious, SubhannAllah

[Cabdullahi]

i cant believe this brother told you to come outside to take a look at you! :raging: what is this???????????????????????????????????????

sister my advice to you is that you should completely stop talking to this brother, if he aint got a house or money then why the hell is he contacting you if he aint ready for marriage? hes obviously messin wid ur mind, tell ur brothers to bang him out.

This is not the world wrestling federation,i think the sister can kill the guy off without rolling up the sleaves and thats by ignoring him

[Hayaa]

:sl:

This reminds me of something I once read somewhere "Not every religious person is neccessarily a hafiz.. and not every hafiz is neccessarily religious"


It's unfortunate about the latter.. but true.

[Maimunah]

salaam.

from what i know is that if a brother wants to marry you, then he needs to speak to your wali n take it from there.

check this

"The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “Sin is that which wavers in your heart and which you do not like the people to find out about.” Narrated by Muslim (2553).

Secondly:

For a woman to speak to a man on the phone or otherwise, if it leads to her being tempted or being a source of temptation, it is haraam. That includes speaking of emotional matters such as love and affection, describing oneself, promising to meet and so on, because these are things that lead to immorality, and they are the steps that the shaytaan uses to trap women who are chaste and unaware. The wolf will carry on speaking softly, weaving dreams, making promises and swearing oaths until the woman falls prey to him. How often has honour been violated, how often have the sacred limits been transgressed, how many calamities have been caused, when the first step was a phone call?

Most of these wolves are liars and cheats who do not know the meaning of true love, and they have no intention of honourable marriage. They are only striving for depraved ends, and seeking to please the shaytaan. One of them stated that he does that sometimes for fun, sometimes for the love of power and temptation, and sometimes to feel proud that he entrapped So and so. And Allaah is the One Whose help we seek.

So beware, and save yourself. The most precious things that a woman possesses are her honour, her modesty and her chastity. This evil wolf will not be ashamed to mention his conquests to his friends, and he will say that he said such and such to her, and did such and such to her, until she is mentioned on the lips of the evildoers, and perhaps he may persuade her to meet him, or he will record her voice or take her picture, and use that a means to blackmail her and scare her, and try to get something even worse from her. May Allaah protect you and save you from all evil.

What we have said is not just mere words intended to scare you; rather it is a reference to dozens of stories that have actually happened in modern times, with the widespread availability of phones and chat rooms. They are sad and embarrassing stories that indicate the extent of the hard-heartedness of these playboys, and the weakness of women before their tricks. They clearly point to the greatness of the words of our Lord, may He be glorified and exalted (interpretation of the meaning):

“O you who believe! Follow not the footsteps of Shaytaan (Satan). And whosoever follows the footsteps of Shaytaan (Satan), then, verily, he commands Al‑Fahsha’ [i.e. to commit indecency (illegal sexual intercourse)], and Al‑Munkar [disbelief and polytheism (i.e. to do evil and wicked deeds; and to speak or to do what is forbidden in Islam)]. And had it not been for the Grace of Allaah and His Mercy on you, not one of you would ever have been pure from sins. But Allaah purifies (guides to Islam) whom He wills, and Allaah is All‑Hearer, All‑Knower”

[al-Noor 24:21]

Speaking on the phone may be one of the footsteps of the shaytaan, as may be a look, a smile or soft speech, which affects the one in whose heart is a disease, so he builds it into mountains of dreams and thoughts, which results in hopes, efforts and plots aimed at evil. Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

“be not soft in speech, lest he in whose heart is a disease (of hypocrisy, or evil desire for adultery) should be moved with desire, but speak in an honourable manner”

[al-Ahzaab 33:32]

We ask our sister – may Allaah protect her and keep her safe – is a phone conversation between a young man and a young woman free from soft speech, laughter and so on? How can it be otherwise, when they are speaking of marriage and hoping to meet? How can there not be any fitnah (temptation), how can there not be any attachment, how can there not be any hope in the sick heart?

If these plotters say that they want to get married, this is a false claim, because the way to get married is well known and is easily accessible;: islam qa


wasalaam

[anonymous]

:( Is it permissible to phone one another or text when you are interested in getting married withot him contacting your wali? Or even after he contacts your wali? Is the only way to get to know each other by having a wali in the presence? Is it wrong for him to just look at my face? Even though he did talked to me what if he didnt and just look at my face?

[anonymous]

Thank you sister maimunah jazakallah kheir! I dont know what I have gone myself into! I regret it so much, maybe if I tell him he will change his mind and we can do it right? :(

[Maimunah]

:( Is it permissible to phone one another or text when you are interested in getting married withot him contacting your wali? Or even after he contacts your wali? Is the only way to get to know each other by having a wali in the presence? Is it wrong for him to just look at my face? Even though he did talked to me what if he didnt and just look at my face?

:sl:
Note that it is permissible for a man to speak to a non-mahram woman, subject to important guidelines and conditions, the purpose of which is to prevent fitnah and sin. These conditions include :

1- That it is not possible to speak to her through one of her mahrams or through a woman who is his mahram.

2- That should be done without being alone with her (khulwah).

3- That should not go beyond permissible topics.

4- There should be no fitnah (temptation). If his desire is stirred by talking to her or if he starts to enjoy it, then it is haraam.

5- The woman should not speak in a soft manner,

6- The woman should be wearing full hijaab and be modest, or he should speak to her from behind a door. It is better if they speak on the phone, and even better if they communicate via letters or e-mail, for example.

7- That should not go beyond what is necessary.

If these conditions are met and there is no fear of fitnah, then it is o.k. And Allaah knows best.

Shaykh Saalih al-Fawzaan said, in his answer on the ruling about young men speaking to young women on the telephone: “It is not permissible for young men to speak to young women because of the fitnah involved, unless the girl is engaged to the man who is talking to her, and they talk only about matters pertaining to their engagement; but it is preferable and safer for him to speak to her guardian about that.” (al-Muntaqa min Fataawa al-Shaykh Saalih al-Fawzaan, 3/163, 164).

You have not proposed to this girl yet, so you have to be very careful and avoid exposing yourself to the causes of fitnah by taking all possible precautions to achieve your goal without approaching this girl.

The basis for this is two aayahs from the Book of Allaah:

1 – “O wives of the Prophet! You are not like any other women. If you keep your duty (to Allaah), then be not soft in speech, lest he in whose heart is a disease (of hypocrisy, or evil desire for adultery) should be moved with desire, but speak in an honourable manner”

[al-Ahzaab 33:32 – interpretation of the meaning]

2 – “And when you ask (his wives) for anything you want, ask them from behind a screen, that is purer for your hearts and for their hearts” [al-Ahzaab 33:53 – interpretation of the meaning]

Finally I would like to remind you that the Muslim’s standards when choosing a wife should be the standards encouraged by the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) when he said: “Choose the one who is religiously-committed, may your hands be rubbed with dust [i.e., may you prosper].” (Narrated by al-Bukhaari, 5090; Muslim, 1466).

And I warn you against everything that may lead you into doing haraam things or bring you close to that, such as being alone with her, going out with her, etc. I ask Allaah to make it easy for you to find a woman who will help you to obey Him.


Islam Q&A

[Danah]

To be honest.... The more I went in reading your post the more I got surprised and the wider I open my eyes to know that all of these things came out from a "hafiz"????

What the heck is this? I think the people around you were not the right ones to approach for offering advice! keep telling you its okay??

its okay to txt him, then call him, then meet him....what else sis? those all are the prior stages to the big haram thing!! Asteghfiruallah

txting him or call him mean that its only you and him who can talk without anybody know what are you talking about....which is another way what we called "forbidden khulwa" were you and him are alone and the Shaitan is the third one among you...remember the hadeeth about this thing sis.

Who on earth said that its okay to do such thing, how he can state such thing?

He keeps telling you that its okay, come to have a look on you, people marry this way. I wonder if it was his sister doing such thing with another brother, what he will do :?

Dont get fooled by all hafiz in the world. I know you trusted him since he is seemed to be a pious man, leading prayers, and knowing all Quran from cover to cover....but still, if you trust him you can't trust the Shaytan from whispering in that hafiz ear and keep telling him that its okay to talk to you.
Remember after all, that he is also a human who can be easily fooled by the Shaitan!
May Allah protect you sister, I advice you to cut all connections with him NOW, and tell him the final decision. IF he "really" interesting in you let him come to your wali instead of using the economy issue as an excuse to just waste the time in somthing HE himself know that he is no prepared for. Its like he is using you in this additional time until he become "ready" for marriage.
Feel free to PM me sis if you want inshaAllah

[anonymous]

Jazakallah khayr!!! Thank you so much sister!! May Allah reward you!

[cat eyes]

salaam.

from what i know is that if a brother wants to marry you, then he needs to speak to your wali n take it from there.

check this

"The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “Sin is that which wavers in your heart and which you do not like the people to find out about.” Narrated by Muslim (2553).

Secondly:

For a woman to speak to a man on the phone or otherwise, if it leads to her being tempted or being a source of temptation, it is haraam. That includes speaking of emotional matters such as love and affection, describing oneself, promising to meet and so on, because these are things that lead to immorality, and they are the steps that the shaytaan uses to trap women who are chaste and unaware. The wolf will carry on speaking softly, weaving dreams, making promises and swearing oaths until the woman falls prey to him. How often has honour been violated, how often have the sacred limits been transgressed, how many calamities have been caused, when the first step was a phone call?

Most of these wolves are liars and cheats who do not know the meaning of true love, and they have no intention of honourable marriage. They are only striving for depraved ends, and seeking to please the shaytaan. One of them stated that he does that sometimes for fun, sometimes for the love of power and temptation, and sometimes to feel proud that he entrapped So and so. And Allaah is the One Whose help we seek.

So beware, and save yourself. The most precious things that a woman possesses are her honour, her modesty and her chastity. This evil wolf will not be ashamed to mention his conquests to his friends, and he will say that he said such and such to her, and did such and such to her, until she is mentioned on the lips of the evildoers, and perhaps he may persuade her to meet him, or he will record her voice or take her picture, and use that a means to blackmail her and scare her, and try to get something even worse from her. May Allaah protect you and save you from all evil.

What we have said is not just mere words intended to scare you; rather it is a reference to dozens of stories that have actually happened in modern times, with the widespread availability of phones and chat rooms. They are sad and embarrassing stories that indicate the extent of the hard-heartedness of these playboys, and the weakness of women before their tricks. They clearly point to the greatness of the words of our Lord, may He be glorified and exalted (interpretation of the meaning):

“O you who believe! Follow not the footsteps of Shaytaan (Satan). And whosoever follows the footsteps of Shaytaan (Satan), then, verily, he commands Al‑Fahsha’ [i.e. to commit indecency (illegal sexual intercourse)], and Al‑Munkar [disbelief and polytheism (i.e. to do evil and wicked deeds; and to speak or to do what is forbidden in Islam)]. And had it not been for the Grace of Allaah and His Mercy on you, not one of you would ever have been pure from sins. But Allaah purifies (guides to Islam) whom He wills, and Allaah is All‑Hearer, All‑Knower”

[al-Noor 24:21]

Speaking on the phone may be one of the footsteps of the shaytaan, as may be a look, a smile or soft speech, which affects the one in whose heart is a disease, so he builds it into mountains of dreams and thoughts, which results in hopes, efforts and plots aimed at evil. Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

“be not soft in speech, lest he in whose heart is a disease (of hypocrisy, or evil desire for adultery) should be moved with desire, but speak in an honourable manner”

[al-Ahzaab 33:32]

We ask our sister – may Allaah protect her and keep her safe – is a phone conversation between a young man and a young woman free from soft speech, laughter and so on? How can it be otherwise, when they are speaking of marriage and hoping to meet? How can there not be any fitnah (temptation), how can there not be any attachment, how can there not be any hope in the sick heart?

If these plotters say that they want to get married, this is a false claim, because the way to get married is well known and is easily accessible;: islam qa


wasalaam

good post sis mashallaah. i pray every muslimah is protected from the evil wolfs out there Ameen

[anonymous]

Thank you all for the advice Inshallah I already kind of knew this I just felt that I was doing wrong by saying no to all of that because people around me, close family and he was telling me it was okay but alhamdulilah Im so happy you guys posted thank you so much. Inshallah I will not contact him anymore, if he is interested he will have to contact my wali!

Is it possible to delete thread now Inshallah??

[anonymous]

Please can this thread be deleted! :( Im really scared someone close to me founds out or even worse him..

[Cabdullahi]

dont worry i think we already know who you are psyche!......i'll contact a mod infact my favourite one