/* */

PDA

View Full Version : Just read some things that are turning me away from Islam, need explanation



Marth
10-01-2009, 05:43 AM
Hi, i have recently been looking at Islam keeping an open mind but i have just read some things that don't make any sense to me and its really turning me off Islam.

I had heard that Islam is unfair to women which led me to read about it for myself, and I can understand that the stuff about hitting women being completely misinterpreted by many and other such misconceptions, but the one verse that bothers me is: i think either Surah 2:281 or 2:282 which says:

"And get two witnesses out of your own men. And if there are not two men
then a man and two women, such as you agree for witnesses, so that if one of them errs, the other can remind her"


I didn't fully understand the verse but it seems to imply that women aren't as smart as men and are more forgetful. :raging:
I looked into it more and this is what i found:

From Hadith from Sahih Al Bukhari, 301:1, (Source: Alim, Silver Spring Maryland, ISL Software Corp, 1986-2000)

Once Allah's Apostle said to a group of women. 'Give alms, as I have seen that the majority of the dwellers of Hell-fire were you (women).'...I have not seen anyone more deficient in intelligence and religion than you. A cautious sensible man could be led astray by some of you.' The women asked, 'O Allah´s Apostle! What is deficient in our intelligence and religion?' He said, 'Is not the evidence of two women equal to the witness of one man?' (Surah 2:282). They applied in the affirmative. He said, 'This is the deficiency in your intelligence.


I did some research on male vs female intelligence and i found that our IQ's are basically equal:
http://www.newsweek.com/id/101079

And that in every study conducted men are actually found to be MORE forgetful than women:
http://www.google.com.au/search?hl=e...an+men&spell=1
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,351621,00.html

In Muhammeds time women were suppressed and people generally believed that woman intelligence was inferior to men.
So i can understand Muhammed making this mistake.

Now surely Allah at this time would have know that women were smarter than perceived since he is God.

Since the Quran is the timeless word of Allah and not of Muhammed, why does Allah say that females are forgetful and inferior to male intelligence? When surely he would have known otherwise?

This is really bothering me and has turned me off Islam for now, if there's a reasonable explanation of this then i need to know.

Thank you in advance
Reply

Login/Register to hide ads. Scroll down for more posts
Muhaba
10-01-2009, 03:00 PM
ppl tend to forget when afraid & witnessing is a stressful thing. It can cause great fear because you may have to testify against someone so you may get afraid that the person might try taking revenge later on. That's why witness faces are usually shown blurred on TV in america. So it's possible for a person to forget while witnessing. When there are two women, both women will be more comfortible together than if there were only one woman. Even in psychology it is shown that ppl like to be around other ppl in similar circumstances, especially when the event is scary or mysterious. So it's a great mercy of Allah that women aren't required to witness alone but have another woman to turn to. Additionally women aren't left to witness alone. They will feel safer in the presence of a man who is physically stronger.

The verse doesn't show that women in general have lower intelligence because it doesn't state that if a woman forgets, the man will remind her. It says that the one (woman) will remind the other.

just my thoughts
Reply

Masuma
10-01-2009, 04:59 PM
:sl:
format_quote Originally Posted by Marth
Hi, i have recently been looking at Islam keeping an open mind but i have just read some things that don't make any sense to me and its really turning me off Islam.

I had heard that Islam is unfair to women which led me to read about it for myself, and I can understand that the stuff about hitting women being completely misinterpreted by many and other such misconceptions, but the one verse that bothers me is: i think either Surah 2:281 or 2:282 which says:

"And get two witnesses out of your own men. And if there are not two men
then a man and two women, such as you agree for witnesses, so that if one of them errs, the other can remind her"
Dear sis, you are not the first one to raise objections about this verse and hadith of my beloved Prophet (s.a.w). The other forums which I've joined simply keep repeating this verse no matter how many explanations we give.
First of all I want to tell you that my aim on this forum was to gather as much information about Islam as possible. I did not come here to do Dawah with the non-Muslims because I actully spend half of my day doing it on the other world's most pathetic forum. Still I feel it as my responsibility to help those who ask for help. I would simply love to help you if that makes you come near to Islam. Dear sis, know that I am not a scholar but the things which I know, I'll definitely share them with you. May Allah help you and make you able to see the truth in Islam!

First we will discuss the verse of your Lord and my Lord. Allah made the two women witnesses equal to one man's witness in financial cases.This is due to the reason that during the Prophet's (s.a.w) time, women were not that much indulged in the financial bussiness. They mostly used to remain at home and so were not like the working women of today. Males were mainly the people concerned with bussiness and earning livelihood. Therefore the women of that time didnot know much about bussiness and so it was for this reason that the witnesses of two women were equal to that of a man's. Women due to not that much involved in bussiness were liable to forget as they were not experienced in such fields.

And do you know sis that there are many cases in Islam in which only woman's witness is acceptable? For example giving bath to a woman who has died, only the women are consult in this matter. There are various such examples!

Even if we look at the world around us, we still find more men in bussiness and financial dealings than the women.

Sis, you should first understand this basic concept that women and men are equal but they are not identical! Women and men have responsibilities but in different areas of life. Lets take an example. There is an examination and two students give this exam. In the examination, there are a total of 10 questions (each carrying 10 marks). When the results come out, we find that both students, student A and student B, have got equal marks. But if we analyse their marks in particular questions, we find that in Q.1, student A scored 10 whereas student B scored 9. Then in Q.2, student A scored 9, whereas student B scored 10 and so on. Now in individual question analysis, one student scored more than the other but still at the end their marks were equal. This example now you can apply to our real life. Women and men are very different. Psychologically, biologically, physically etc. So the duties assigned to both sexes are not same. In one field of life, men excell whereas in another field of life, women excell. But still both are equal and no one is superior to another in social life.
Men are given the duty to earn livelihood for their family and so they excell in this field. Their brains work more when it comes to money and financial issues. Women have other duties and they are not expected mostly to earn money for their homes.

format_quote Originally Posted by Marth
I didn't fully understand the verse but it seems to imply that women aren't as smart as men and are more forgetful. :raging:
They may forget when it comes to financial dealings as women are generally not that much involved with money.

format_quote Originally Posted by Marth
I looked into it more and this is what i found:

From Hadith from Sahih Al Bukhari, 301:1, (Source: Alim, Silver Spring Maryland, ISL Software Corp, 1986-2000)

Once Allah's Apostle said to a group of women. 'Give alms, as I have seen that the majority of the dwellers of Hell-fire were you (women).'...I have not seen anyone more deficient in intelligence and religion than you. A cautious sensible man could be led astray by some of you.' The women asked, 'O Allah´s Apostle! What is deficient in our intelligence and religion?' He said, 'Is not the evidence of two women equal to the witness of one man?' (Surah 2:282). They applied in the affirmative. He said, 'This is the deficiency in your intelligence.

Reason that most of the dewellers of hell fire were women is not due to deficiency in their intelligence. Another similar hadith of the beloved Prophet explains it. The reason stated in that hadith was that women are generally ungratefull to their husbands. The poor fellow spends all his day working his head out and if he is unable to fulfill even a single small wish of his wife, she starts complaining that "I have never got anything good from you".
Deficiency in intelligence does not mean that women are stupid or foolish. The concept of "what intelligence really is" is very important. I asked my physic teacher about the intelligence of man and woman and he told me that some experiments were conducted on man and woman and the results were that woman had a higher reaction time compared to man. This experiment is in my "Pacific physics for A-level" book. Intelligence is not like you know every thing in your course book and earns A+ grade. Intelligence is how quick someone makes a decision etc. I myself have noticed many times that when a trouble befalls, woman usually gets scared earlier than man. This effects her quick decision making process. She gets worried whereas male remains calm and think it through.

I also once saw on National Geographic Channel a documentary in which they showed woman's and man's brain scans. They told that males have more brain volume and females have more brain surface area. Now I dunno what these results mean cuz I missed the last part of that show. But one thing is confirmed that this info proves that males and females have some differences in their brains.

format_quote Originally Posted by Marth
I did some research on male vs female intelligence and i found that our IQ's are basically equal:
http://www.newsweek.com/id/101079

And that in every study conducted men are actually found to be MORE forgetful than women:
http://www.google.com.au/search?hl=e...an+men&spell=1
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,351621,00.html
Sis, we cannot take these experiments as a 100% proof because you should know that hypothesis in science is not much of a gr8 deal. Theories can change but only the Laws of science are reliable. Therefore we'll have to wait till a "law" of science is formed.

format_quote Originally Posted by Marth
In Muhammeds time women were suppressed and people generally believed that woman intelligence was inferior to men.
So i can understand Muhammed making this mistake
Nope! You are wrong there. Prophets never made mistakes because everything Prophet said or did was in accordance with Allah's will. And saying that in Muhammad's (s.a.w) time women were percieved as inferior is also very wrong. It was before Prophet's time that women were regarded as inferior but Prophet (s.a.w) was a liberator for the women. If you are interrested to know more about this, then let me know.

Sis, I would like to give you a sincere advice that avoid going and believing on all the sites avilable on the internet. More than 60% of them are anti-Islamic and so would obviously never let you come to Islam. Some of the sites are so strong in falsehood that they managed to ruin some of the namesake muslims' Akhira by making them ex-Muslims! If you want to know about Islam, ask from Muslims who know it better than anybody else. Allah too says in Quran that if you don't know sth, ask it from a person who knows it.

I have tried very hard to explain you my reasoning. I'll inshAllah try to take more of your questions and help you with them. If you want to know anything else or didn't understand sth in this post, do let me know.

May Allah show you the right way. Ameen!

(I'll b looking forward to your reply):statisfie

Allahafiz!
Reply

Muslimlearner
10-01-2009, 08:11 PM
Ha-ha!
You know Marth:when somebody start to think about Islam,
the Devil gets really angry and attacks him with complicated thoughts like yours.:statisfie

So:women aways have been grater number then men.
Females are not less intelligent:if they were,why Allah SUT will order women to care and educate the kids?
For example:Prophet Muhammad SAUS learn so many things from his wife Khadeejah(r.a) about the business.

Regardless the number why more women will deserve Hell fire?
See around you:isn't the ladies who start to show their bodies to attract,did they flirt and separate husband from wife,break families?

When women fall in love -her intelligence often go way:she can even live her child to be with somebody!Isn't that true?!
Think about the matter in this way and you'll find more.Here is the explanation of the first hadeeth.

Accepting Islam is giving you the answers how to battle your desires,but yet to be happy;do not make mistakes wich can cost a lot .

Allah STU knows his creations and He SUT give them the guidance to succeed.
Note that women are created to be softer- hearted then man and follow they fillings and not take the right desigions somethimes:thats why Muslimas can't be judges in the courts.
Reply

Welcome, Guest!
Hey there! Looks like you're enjoying the discussion, but you're not signed up for an account.

When you create an account, you can participate in the discussions and share your thoughts. You also get notifications, here and via email, whenever new posts are made. And you can like posts and make new friends.
Sign Up
Khalisah
10-01-2009, 09:30 PM
:sl:
I am not answering with any islaimic proofs here...just my thoughts

However, as a general rule, and I am NOT implying that all women are like this, but women tend to have a habit of exaggerating, gettin carried away... Have you noticed that when you have a group of women/sisters we RARELY run out of topics/stories to talk about?! Whereas you stick a group of men in a room, and it's either silent or factual talk.
That's just my thought.. I am not saying that the bros' are boring :omg: ....or that sisters are gossipers :exhausted ... Aplogies if I've come across that way! :statisfie
Reply

'Abd-al Latif
10-01-2009, 11:29 PM
Why two women witnesses?


By Shamshad.M.Khan

With modifications and additions by Abû 'Iyâd


Source: http://www.sunnahonline.com/ilm/dawah/0030.htm





A question that repeatedly arises is that concerning the 'position of women in Islâm'. Muslim scholars have been able with great success - despite the onslaught of distortion and misrepresentation - to demonstrate the true position of Muslim women; especially of women's liberation in the advent of Islâm. The Islamic ruling on issues such as inheritance, the right to earn, the right to own property etc. have reinforced this position and have been prescribed by Allâh - the One True God - long before western nations even thought of such concepts!

The issue of two women witnesses in place of one man is the concern of the present treatise. As will become clear to the sincere and objective reader, the intellectual status of a Muslim woman is neither marred nor degraded by the commandment that if two Muslim male witnesses are not available then one Muslim male and two Muslim females should be invited to witness. Rather, this injunction is in perfect harmony with the nature and psychology of the woman as will become evident through quotations from psychologists, psychiatrists and medical research.

The passage of the Qur'ân (Baqarah 2:282) in which the above-mentioned requirement is made has usury, capital and debtor difficulties as its theme. Allâh grants guidelines in matters relating to monetary obligations. Then business transactions are dealt with. In this section, the requirement to commit all transactions into writing is stated most emphatically (Reduce them to writing...). The section after this describes the responsibility of the scribe, or in modern parlance, the person responsible for drawing up the agreement. The following section describes the responsibility and the obligation of the person incurring the liability. The section after this explains how if the party that is liable cannot effectively draw up the contract - out of being deficient or weak mentally, or being unable to dictate - then his or her guardian should help draw out the contract and choose two suitable witnesses to observe. It must be understood that this situation arises if it is not possible for the liable party to draw out the contract by him/herself. The condition to put things into writing is still supreme. The next section then explains that two men should be called to witness and if two men are not available (And if there are not two men...) then a man and two women. The legislation then continues and reminds most emphatically that one should not be complacent about putting ALL agreements into writing - no matter whether these agreements are major or minor as this is more JUST in the sight of Allâh and more reliable as evidence. The passage of the Qur'ân further explains that for practical reasons it may not always be possible to commit on-the-spot agreements into writing. In this case, it is also recommended that it be witnessed. The section which follows then lays down the guidelines which should be followed in the event that no witnesses are present.

The purpose in giving the above outline is to draw attention to the fact the question of women witnesses relates, in this instance, to commercial agreements and is not a statement on their status.

Let's look at the section under investigation in more detail. Allâh said:
And get two witnesses of your own men, and if there are not two men then a man and two women such as you choose for witnesses - so that if one of them errs, the other can remind her... [Baqarah 2:182]
A number of questions (as well as eyebrows!) are raised when this section of the passage is read. The questions often posed include:

Do women have weaker memories than men?
Why should two women be needed in the place of one man?
Are women inferior to men?

One must remember that Prophet Muhammad sallâllahu 'alayhi wa sallam was neither a physiologist, a psychiatrist and nor a surgeon. He was an illiterate and could neither read nor write. He passed on the revelation exactly as he received it. Allâh, the Creator, with His infinite wisdom gave the directives best suited to humankind. He is the Creator, therefore, He knows man better than a man himself.

In this scientific age we can explore the significance of this legislation. A great deal has been discovered since the early days of Islâm. And each day of advancement brings about a better understanding of the the last and final revelation from the Creator, Allâh to the creation, humankind. As women, we are aware of the cyclical psychological strains that a woman has to encounter every month. The symptoms during early pregnancy, ante-natal and post-natal depressions, the phenomenon of menopause, the physiological and psychological problems due to infertility and last but not least the psychological problems faced after miscarriage.

It is under these situations that women can experience extraordinary psychological strains giving rise to depression, lack of concentration, slow-mindedness and short term memory loss. Let us examine these episodes in a bit more detail and with medical references from the scientific world. PMT is an umbrella term for more than 140 different symptoms and there is a lot of evidence that it causes a lot of unhappiness in many women, and consequently, to their families.

Psychiatry in Practice, April 1983 issue states:
"Forty percent of women suffer from pre-menstrual syndrome in some form and one in if our women have their lives severely disrupted by it. Dr Jill Williams, general practitioner from Bury, gives guidelines on how to recognise patients at risk and suggests a suitable treatment." [Psychiatry in Practice, April 1993, p.14]
In the same issue, George Beaumont reporting on the workshop held at the Royal College of Obstetricians and Gynaecologists in London on pre-menstrual syndrome, says:
"Some authorities would argue that 80 percent of women have some degree of breast and abdominal discomfort which is pre-menstrual but that only about 10 percent complain to their doctors - and then only because of severe tenderness of the breasts and mental depression... Other authorities have suggested that pre-menstrual syndrome is a new problem, regular ovulation for 20 years or more being a phenomenon caused by 'civilisation', 'medical progress', and an altered concept of the role of women." [Psychiatry in Practice, April 1993, p.18]
In its examination of the occurrence of physical and psychological change during the period just prior to the onset of menstruation we read in Psychological Medicine:
"Many studies have reported an increased likelihood of various negative affects during the pre-menstrual period. In this affective category are many emotional designations including irritability, depression, tension, anxiety, sadness, insecurity, lethargy, loneliness, tearfulness, fatigue, restlessness and changes of mood. In the majority of studies, investigators have found it difficult to distinguish between various negative affects, and only a few have allowed themselves to be excessively concerned with the differences which might or might not exist between affective symptoms." [Psychological Medicine, Monograph Supplement 4, 1983, Cambridge University Press, p.6]
In the same article dealing with pre-menstrual behavioural changes we read:
"A significant relationship between the pre-menstrual phase of the cycle and a variety of specific and defined forms of behaviour has been reported in a number of studies. For the purpose of their review, these forms of behaviour have been grouped under the headings of aggressive behaviour, illness behaviour and accidents, performance on examination and other tests and sporting performance." [Psychological Medicine, Monograph Supplement 4, 1983, Cambridge University Press, p.7]
The lengthy review portrays how female behaviour is affected in these situations. In 'The Pre-menstrual Syndrome', C. Shreeves writes:
"Reduced powers of concentration and memory are familiar aspects of the pre-menstrual syndrome and can only be remedied by treating the underlying complaint."
This does not mean, of course, that women are mentally deficient absolutely. It just means that their mental faculties can become affected at certain times in the biological cycle. Shreeves also writes:
"As many as 80 percent of women are aware of some degree of pre-menstrual changes, 40 percent are substantially disturbed by them, and between 10 and 20 percent are seriously disabled as a result of the syndrome."
Furthermore, women face the problem of ante-natal and post-natal depression, both of which cause extreme cycles of depression in some cases. Again, these recurring symptoms naturally affect the mind, giving rise to drowsiness and dopey memory.

On the subject of pregnancy in Psychiatry in Practice, October-November 1986, we learn that:
"In an experiment 'Cox' found that 16 percent of a sample of 263 pregnant women were suffering from clinically significant psychiatric problems. Eight percent had a depressive neurosis and 1.9 percent had phobic neurosis. This study showed that the proportion of pregnant women with psychiatric problems was greater than that found in the control group but the difference only tended towards significance." [Psychiatry in Practice, October-November, 1986, p.6]
Regarding the symptoms during the post-natal cycle Dr. Ruth Sagovsky writes:
"The third category of puerperal psychiatric problems is post-natal depression. It is generally agreed that between10 to 15 percent of women become clinically depressed after childbirth. These mothers experience a variety of symptoms but anxiety, especially over the baby, irritability, and excessive fatigue are common. Appetite is usually decreased and often there are considerable sleep difficulties. The mothers lose interest in the things they enjoyed prior to the baby's birth, and find that their concentration is impaired. They often feel irrational guilt, and blame themselves for being 'bad' wives and mothers. Fifty percent of these women are not identified as having a depressive illness. Unfortunately, many of them do not understand what ails them and blame their husbands, their babies or themselves until the relationships are strained to an alarming degree." [Psychiatry in Practice, May, 1987, p.18]
" ... Making the diagnosis of post-natal depression is not always easy. Quite often the depression is beginning to become a serious problem around three months postpartum when frequent contact with the health visitor is diminishing. The mother may not present with depressed mood. If she comes to the health centre presenting the baby as the patient, the true nature of the problem can be missed. When the mother is continually anxious about the baby in spite of reassurance, then the primary health care worker needs to be aware of the possibility of depression. Sometimes these mothers present with marital difficulties, and it is easy to muddle cause and effect, viewing the accompanying low mood as part of the marital problem. Sometimes, only when the husband is seen as well does it become obvious that it is a post-natal depressive illness which has led to the deterioration in the marriage." [Psychiatry in Practice, May, 1987, p.18]*
Again there is a need to study the effects of the menopause about which very little is known even to this day. This phase in a woman's life can start at any time from the mid-thirties to the mid-fifties and can last for as long as 15 years.

Writing about the pre-menopausal years, C.B. Ballinger states:

"Several of the community surveys indicate a small but significant increase in psychiatric symptoms in women during the five years prior to the cessation of menstrual periods... The most obvious clinical feature of this transitional phase of menstrual function is the alteration in menstrual pattern, the menstrual cycle becoming shorter with age, and variability in cycle length become very prominent just prior to the cessation of menstruation. Menorrhagia is a common complaint at this time, and is associated with higher than normal levels of psychiatric disturbance." [Psychiatry in Practice, November, 1987, p.26]

On the phenomenon of menopause in an article in Newsweek International, May 25th 1992, Dr. Jennifer al-Knopf, Director of the Sex and Marital Therapy Programme of North-western University writes:
" ... Women never know what their body is doing to them ... some reporting debilitating symptoms from hot flashes to night sweat, sleeplessness, irritability, mood swings, short term memory loss, migraine, headaches, urinary inconsistence and weight gain. Most such problems can be traced to the drop-off in the female hormones oestrogen and progesterone, both of which govern the ovarian cycle. But every woman starts with a different level of hormones and loses them at different rates. The unpredictability is one of the most upsetting aspects. Women never know what their body is going to do to them ... "
Then there are the psychiatric aspects of infertility and miscarriage. On the subject of infertility, Dr. Ruth Sagovsky writes:
"Depression, anger and guilt are common reactions to bereavement. In infertility there is the added pain of there being nobody to grieve for. Families and friends may contribute to the feeling of isolation by passing insensitive comments. The gynaecologist and GPs have to try to help these couples against a backdrop of considerable distress." [Psychiatry in Practice, Winter, 1989, p.16]
On the subject of miscarriage the above article continues:
"Miscarriage is rarely mentioned when considering abortion. However, miscarriage can at times have profound psychological sequelae and it is important that those women affected receive the support they need. Approximately one-fifth of all pregnancies end in spontaneous abortion and the effects are poorly recognised. If however, the miscarriage occurs in the context of infertility, the emotional reaction may be severe. The level of grief will depend on the meaning of pregnancy to the couple." [Psychiatry in Practice, Winter, 1989, p.17]
Also, the fact that women are known to be more sensitive and emotional than men must not be overlooked. It is well known, for example, that under identical circumstances women suffer much greater anxiety than men. Numerous medical references on this aspect of female behaviour can be given but to quote as a specimen, we read in 'Sex Differences in Mental Health' that:
"Surveys have found different correlates of anxiety and neuroticism in the two sexes. Women and men do not become equally upset by the same things, and being upset does not have the same effect in men as in women. Ekehammer (1974; Ekehammer, Magnusson and Ricklander, 1974) using data from 116 sixteen-year-olds, did a factor analysis on self-reported anxiety. Of the eighteen different responses indicating anxiety (sweating palms, faster heart rate, and so on) females reported experiencing twelve of them significantly more often than males. Of the anxiety-producing situations studied, females reported experiencing significantly more anxiety than males reported in fourteen of them." [Katherine Blick Hoyenga and Kermit T. Hoyenga in Sex Differences in Mental Health, p.336]
It is in light of the above findings of psychologist, psychiatrists and researchers that the saying of Allâh, the Exalted:
And get two witnesses of your own men, and if there are not two men then a man and two women such as you choose for witnesses - SO THAT IF ONE OF THEM ERRS, THE OTHER CAN REMIND HER ... [Baqarah 2:182]
can be understood. One must also bear in mind that forgetfulness can be an asset. A woman has to be put up with children presenting all kinds of emotional problems and a woman is certainly known to be more resilient than man. The aim of presenting these research findings on a number of aspects related with the theme is to indicate that a woman by her biological constitution faces such problems. It does not however make her inferior to man but it does illustrate that she is different. Viewed in this way, it can only lead one to the conclusion that Allâh knows His creation the best and has prescribed precise laws in keeping with the nature of humankind.

Allâh, the Creator is - as always - All-Knowing.

* As has been mentioned above the Prophet Muhammad sallâllahu 'alayhi wa sallam was neither a psychologist nor a psychiatrist. Rather, he merely conveyed the truth that was revealed to him. It is in the context of this quotation and the one before it that the following saying of the Prophet Muhammad sallâllahu 'alayhi wa sallam can be understood: "Treat your women kindly. The woman has been created from a rib, and the most curved part of a rib is its upper region. If you try to straighten it you will break it, and if you leave it as it is, it will remain curved. So treat women kindly." And in another narration: "If you try to straighten her you will break her and breaking her means divorce." [Reported by al-Bukhârî and Muslim]. This is very important advice for the man - for him to have patience and not to try to 'reform' the behavioural pattern of the woman during these times i.e. 'to straighten her'. He will not be able to do that, as it is biological in origin. Instead, he should maintain and protect his relationship with her by showing kindness.
Reply

'Abd-al Latif
10-01-2009, 11:32 PM
Belittling Women with the Hadeeth: “Women are Deficient in Intellect and Deen.


Shaykh Abdul-Azeez ibn Baaz



We often hear the noble Hadeeth "Women are deficient in their intelligence and in their Deen” and some men use this Hadeeth as a form of belittlement towards the women. We desire from you O noble shaykh, clarification of the meaning of this Hadeeth?

The meaning of the Hadeeth of the Messenger of Allaah (sal-Allaahu 'alayhe wa sallam):

“I have never seen anyone with a deficiency of ‘Aql (intellect) and Deen (religion) who are more overpowering to men than one of you [women].”

So it was said:

“O Messenger of Allaah, what is the deficiency in her intelligence?”

He said:

“Isn’t the witness of two women equal to that of one man?”

So it was said:

“What is the deficiency in her Deen?”

So he said:

“Isn’t it the case that if she is menstruating she doesn’t pray or fast?”

So the Messenger (sal-Allaahu 'alayhe wa sallam) clarified that the deficiency of her intellect was from the angle of her weak memory and that her testimony is strengthened with the testimony of another woman. This is because of the preciseness of the witness (in Islaam) and because she could forget and make an addition or deletion to the testimony. Just as Allaah says:

{And bring forth two witnesses from your own men. If there are not two men (available) then a man and two women, such as you agree for witnesses, so that if one of them (two women) errs then the other can remind her…} [2282]

As for deficiency in her Deen, then it is because during her state of menstruation and post-partum bleeding, she abandons the Prayer and fasting, and she doesn’t make up the prayer. This is from the deficiency in her Deen. But this deficiency is not blameworthy upon her. Rather it is a deficiency, which happens as a result of that which Allaah had decreed for her and this was done in a manner of leniency and easiness towards her. For if she were to fast in a state of menstruation or in a state of postpartum bleeding it would harm her. So from the Mercy of Allaah (towards women) He has legislated for her to abandon the fast at the time when she is menstruating or in a state of Nifaas, and to make up the fast afterwards. As for the prayer, then without a doubt, the state of menstruation prevents her from purification. So from the mercy of Allaah, He legislated for her to abandon her prayer and likewise in the state of Nifaas.

He also legislated for her not to make it up, because in making up the (prayer) is difficulty, because the prayer is tremendous, and repetitious, five times throughout the night and day, and the days of menstruation can be plentiful, sometimes seven or eight days or more than that. And the Nifaas could reach 40 days. So from the mercy of Allaah upon her and from His Ihsaan (doing good) towards her is that He removed the prayer from her whether it be the initial prayer or the make-up. And this does not necessitate that her intelligence is deficient in everything! Nor that her Deen is deficient in everything! But indeed the Messenger (saw) clarified that the deficiency in her intelligence is from that which happens to her from the lack of precision in her memory and testimony, and that the deficiency in her Deen is from the fact that she leaves off the prayer and fasting at the time of her menses or in the state of Nifaas. Also this doesn’t necessitate that she is less than a man in everything! or the fact that the man is better in everything! Yes, generally the male gender is better than the gender of the females generally for many reasons. Just as Allaah the High and Sublime says:

{Men are the protectors and maintainers of women, because Allaah has made one of them to excel the other, and because they spend their wealth (to support them)…} [434]

But she can surpass him, sometimes, in many things. And by Allaah how many women surpass many men in their intelligence, Deen and precision! But verily that which is narrated on the Messenger (sal-Allaahu 'alayhe wa sallam) is that the women are surpassed by men, generally, in intelligence and in the religion only. There can proceed from her many righteous actions, in which, she can surpass the men and in her Taqwah of Allaah, Azza Wa Jall, and in her station in the hereafter. There could be some affairs that she places great importance on and is precise in them more so than the precision of a man. There are many issues, which she carefully considers, and is diligent in memorizing and precise in. She would become the foundation in Islaamic history and point of reference in many affairs and this is clear to those who ponder and reflect on the state of the women during the time of the Prophet (sal-Allaahu 'alayhe wa sallam) and after that. With this it should be understood that this deficiency should not prevent her from being treated equally in her narrations and in her testimony, if it is strengthened with the testimony of another woman.

And it doesn’t necessarily mean that it (this deficiency) should prevent her from having Taqwah of Allaah and the fact that she could be from the most virtuous slaves of Allaah if she is upright in her Deen, even if the fasting and prayer is not obligatory upon her at the time of menstruation and Nifaas rather this is a deficiency which is specific to the intellect and Deen just as the Messenger (sal-Allaahu 'alayhe wa sallam) clarified. It is not appropriate that a believer should accuse her of being deficient in everything and weak in every area of her Deen, and its clarification is pertinent and important so that the speech of the Messenger is understood in it’s proper context and in the best possible manner.



And Allaah knows best.
Reply

_ALI_
10-02-2009, 02:11 PM
Salam Marth
Hi, i have recently been looking at Islam keeping an open mind but i have just read some things that don't make any sense to me and its really turning me off Islam.

I had heard that Islam is unfair to women which led me to read about it for myself, and I can understand that the stuff about hitting women being completely misinterpreted by many and other such misconceptions, but the one verse that bothers me is: i think either Surah 2:281 or 2:282 which says:

"And get two witnesses out of your own men. And if there are not two men
then a man and two women, such as you agree for witnesses, so that if one of them errs, the other can remind her"

I didn't fully understand the verse but it seems to imply that women aren't as smart as men and are more forgetful.
You have to read the verse in context

002.282 يَا أَيُّهَا الَّذِينَ آمَنُوا إِذَا تَدَايَنْتُمْ بِدَيْنٍ إِلَى أَجَلٍ مُسَمًّى فَاكْتُبُوهُ وَلْيَكْتُبْ بَيْنَكُمْ كَاتِبٌ بِالْعَدْلِ وَلا يَأْبَ كَاتِبٌ أَنْ يَكْتُبَ كَمَا عَلَّمَهُ اللَّهُ فَلْيَكْتُبْ وَلْيُمْلِلِ الَّذِي عَلَيْهِ الْحَقُّ وَلْيَتَّقِ اللَّهَ رَبَّهُ وَلا يَبْخَسْ مِنْهُ شَيْئًا فَإِنْ كَانَ الَّذِي عَلَيْهِ الْحَقُّ سَفِيهًا أَوْ ضَعِيفًا أَوْ لا يَسْتَطِيعُ أَنْ يُمِلَّ هُوَ فَلْيُمْلِلْ وَلِيُّهُ بِالْعَدْلِ وَاسْتَشْهِدُوا شَهِيدَيْنِ مِنْ رِجَالِكُمْ فَإِنْ لَمْ يَكُونَا رَجُلَيْنِ فَرَجُلٌ وَامْرَأَتَانِ مِمَّنْ تَرْضَوْنَ مِنَ الشُّهَدَاءِ أَنْ تَضِلَّ إِحْدَاهُمَا فَتُذَكِّرَ إِحْدَاهُمَا الأخْرَى وَلا يَأْبَ الشُّهَدَاءُ إِذَا مَا دُعُوا وَلا تَسْأَمُوا أَنْ تَكْتُبُوهُ صَغِيرًا أَوْ كَبِيرًا إِلَى أَجَلِهِ ذَلِكُمْ أَقْسَطُ عِنْدَ اللَّهِ وَأَقْوَمُ لِلشَّهَادَةِ وَأَدْنَى أَلا تَرْتَابُوا إِلا أَنْ تَكُونَ تِجَارَةً حَاضِرَةً تُدِيرُونَهَا بَيْنَكُمْ فَلَيْسَ عَلَيْكُمْ جُنَاحٌ أَلا تَكْتُبُوهَا وَأَشْهِدُوا إِذَا تَبَايَعْتُمْ وَلا يُضَارَّ كَاتِبٌ وَلا شَهِيدٌ وَإِنْ تَفْعَلُوا فَإِنَّهُ فُسُوقٌ بِكُمْ وَاتَّقُوا اللَّهَ وَيُعَلِّمُكُمُ اللَّهُ وَاللَّهُ بِكُلِّ شَيْءٍ عَلِيمٌ
002.282 O ye who believe! When ye deal with each other, in transactions involving future obligations in a fixed period of time, reduce them to writing Let a scribe write down faithfully as between the parties: let not the scribe refuse to write: as Allah Has taught him, so let him write. Let him who incurs the liability dictate, but let him fear His Lord Allah, and not diminish aught of what he owes. If they party liable is mentally deficient, or weak, or unable Himself to dictate, Let his guardian dictate faithfully, and get two witnesses, out of your own men, and if there are not two men, then a man and two women, such as ye choose, for witnesses, so that if one of them errs, the other can remind her. The witnesses should not refuse when they are called on (For evidence). Disdain not to reduce to writing (your contract) for a future period, whether it be small or big: it is juster in the sight of Allah, More suitable as evidence, and more convenient to prevent doubts among yourselves but if it be a transaction which ye carry out on the spot among yourselves, there is no blame on you if ye reduce it not to writing. But take witness whenever ye make a commercial contract; and let neither scribe nor witness suffer harm. If ye do (such harm), it would be wickedness in you. So fear Allah; For it is Allah that teaches you. And Allah is well acquainted with all things.
Al-Qur'an, 002.282 (Al-Baqara [The Cow])
Text Copied from DivineIslam's Qur'an Viewer software v2.910
In this context, God is not talking about crime witnesses, He is only talking about witnesses of a financial deal. It is not tough to get two female witnesses for a financial deal so Allah has not given an impractical commandment. Also in Islam, men are expected to be bread winners of the family, not women. So they would have better knowledge regarding finance. Furthermore, in some cases, a female testimony invalidates a male testimony. In the Quran, Allah says that if a man is the sole witness of his wife committing adultery then he should testify 5 times. But that testimony cannot be considered if:

024.008 وَيَدْرَأُ عَنْهَا الْعَذَابَ أَنْ تَشْهَدَ أَرْبَعَ شَهَادَاتٍ بِاللَّهِ إِنَّهُ لَمِنَ الْكَاذِبِينَ
024.008 But it would avert the punishment from the wife, if she bears witness four times (with an oath) By Allah, that (her husband) is telling a lie;
024.009 وَالْخَامِسَةَ أَنَّ غَضَبَ اللَّهِ عَلَيْهَا إِنْ كَانَ مِنَ الصَّادِقِينَ
024.009 And the fifth (oath) should be that she solemnly invokes the wrath of Allah on herself if (her accuser) is telling the truth.
Al-Qur'an, 024.006-009 (An-Noor [The Light])
Text Copied from DivineIslam's Qur'an Viewer software v2.910
So by testifying 5 times, the wife gets no punishment and they divorce. Also in some other cases, one female witness is enough. If there is a marriage and a woman testifies that she breastfed both the groom and bride then the marriage becomes invalid based on that single testimony.
There are some scholars
As for men being smarter than women, we have early female scholars of Islam who have excelled in Islam. We have the example of Hazrat Aisha. She narrated more than 2000 sayings of the prophet, third only to Abdullah Bin Umar and Abu Hurairah (both are famous narrators of hadith). No Muslim scholar ever said that the hadith narrated by Hazrat Aisha are invalid because she is a woman.
In Muhammeds time women were suppressed and people generally believed that woman intelligence was inferior to men.
Before prophet Muhammad's time, women were suppressed. But because of him, status of women became equal (though not identical) to that of men.
http://www.ilovezakirnaik.com/womenrights/index.htm#
So i can understand Muhammed making this mistake.
In Islam, prophets don't err. But if they do make a tiny mistake they are immediately corrected by Allah.
Peace
Reply

Muslim Woman
10-03-2009, 04:00 AM
Salaam/ Peace

format_quote Originally Posted by Marth
...I had heard that Islam is unfair to women
.... if Islam is as oppressive to women as some journalists would have us believe, why aren't Muslim women running away in droves? What it is about Islam that attracts any followers outside its heartlands?


full article here

http://discover.islamway.com/articles.php?article_id=16
Reply

Argamemnon
10-03-2009, 08:23 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Haqeeka'
Regardless the number why more women will deserve Hell fire?
See around you:isn't the ladies who start to show their bodies to attract,did they flirt and separate husband from wife,break families?
Isn't the men who start wars and kill millions and millions of innocent human beings? Isn't the men who are producing and selling drugs? Etc..
Reply

Argamemnon
10-03-2009, 08:53 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Marth
From Hadith from Sahih Al Bukhari, 301:1, (Source: Alim, Silver Spring Maryland, ISL Software Corp, 1986-2000)

Once Allah's Apostle said to a group of women. 'Give alms, as I have seen that the majority of the dwellers of Hell-fire were you (women).'...I have not seen anyone more deficient in intelligence and religion than you. A cautious sensible man could be led astray by some of you.' The women asked, 'O Allah´s Apostle! What is deficient in our intelligence and religion?' He said, 'Is not the evidence of two women equal to the witness of one man?' (Surah 2:282). They applied in the affirmative. He said, 'This is the deficiency in your intelligence.
Salam,

I have recently read a long explanation of this hadith. I will summarize it briefly. The explanation did not satisfy me. The sheikh or imam says:

1) Women are more emotional and less rational than men, God created them this way.

2) Men are "warned" that women are different and can be "manipulative" and lead them astray.

3) Women will not be held accountable for being more emotional and less rational and "deficient in religion" (because they were created this way).

4) Women should be aware of their deficiencies and not "go astray".

My question is: if women were created differently, then why would they be held accountable? Why are women threatened with Hell fire, and accused of being deficient in religion, when this is beyond their control - since God created them this way?
Reply

Rasema
10-16-2009, 11:04 PM
Just open a Biology book:statisfie
Reply

layla is here
10-17-2009, 12:10 AM
I think abd al latif answered this question well. MashaAllah.
Reply

Masuma
10-17-2009, 03:12 PM
:bism: (In the name of Allah, the most Gracious and the most Merciful!)

:sl: (May peace be on you!)

Dear sis Marth,

I hope you find the above answers satisfactory. I just wanted to add a lil more information. You didn't actually understand the hadith of Prophet Muhammad (s.a.w) because you thought science contradicts the teachings of the hadith. That's why you mentioned the IQ tests and other searches. So I think it would be suitable to add some other scientific knowledge to this thread which doesn’t quite approve of the general IQ tests.

Also Marth, if you are confused about something or don't understand something, then ask as many questions as you can about it, do lots and lots of researches till no doubts remain in your mind regarding the authenticity of a particular subject.

I was reading my psychology book when I came across this definition of "what intelligence is?”

Intelligence:
An inferred characteristic of an individual, usually defined as the ability to profit from experience, acquire knowledge, think abstractly, or adapt to changes in the environment.

Did you notice something in the above definition? Well lets read it again with some words highlighted for understanding.

Intelligence:
Aninferred characteristic of an individual, usually defined as the ability to profit from experience, acquire knowledge, think abstractly, or adapt to changes in the environment.

So even the psychologists don't have an authentic, absolute and universal definition of intelligence. If you are interested in psychology and read some cases, you will find out how difficult it is to have a well defined and universal definition of something! If some people agree to one thing, the others with their authentic and logical reasoning will disapprove of it.

So even the science don't yet completely understand the human nature. :haha:SubhanAllah! Who says science has answers to everything? It is such an incomplete subject, a subject which many times turn over on itself.

Alfred Binet, who developed the first tests of intelligence, says this about intelligence:
He is against the idea and vigorously argues against it that intelligence is a fixed quantity that cannot be improved by further help.

Now I want you to read another extract from a different case study.

Brain:
The brain consists of three major layers which reflect our evolutionary development. At the top of the spinal cord is the brain stem which appears to control the basic life support functions of the body. When someone is declared as being “brain dead”, then it is this part of the brain that is showing no signs of activity. On top of the brain stem is a large structure known as the cerebral cortex which appears to control the cognitive functions like thought and memory and also action (movement).

In between the cortex and the brain stem is a collection of structures known as the limbic system whose function is much less clearly known. However, they are thought to have some effect on emotions as well as on some cognitive processes.

If limbic system is thought to have some effect on emotions etc and the system is not yet fully understood, then how can science provides you with absolute knowledge about women and their intelligence? I mean women are vessels of emotions and if limbic system is to some extent effecting emotions, then one needs to first get a proper knowledge of this system to understand some aspects of women’s personalities.

Why not a 100% reliable knowledge of the brain?
It has been possible to identify an area of the cortex that affects vision (the visual cortex) and an area that affects movement of the body (the motor cortex). There are, however, a number of problems with this naming of parts of the brain.
First, there are large areas of the brain whose function is relatively unknown.
Second, it is difficult to distinguish one area from another because some are no more than just a slight thickening of the tissue.

Now about IQ tests:
How it is that IQ testing has gained such respectability and prominence despite an inability to define the quality it is measuring?

Ring any bells? Look Marth, what if an IQ test is measuring a quality entirely different from “intelligence”? And crying out loud, we don’t even know absolutely what “intelligence” really is! The definition of “intelligence” is just a common definition but who knows how accurate or authentic it actually is?

(Just for fun!
Maybe you find this part confusing because this is how I usually think about things. If you don’t understand anything inside these brackets, simply ignore it.;D

1. If “intelligence” is not yet fully understood then maybe, just maybe the hadith of my beloved Prophet (s.a.w) was referring to some other quality still not understood by science?

2. Even if the intelligence referred to in the hadith was that “intelligence” commonly understood by people, then we are provided a 100% authentic knowledge about this quality that whatever the quality “intelligence” actually includes, women are deficient in it. So maybe a future Muslim scientist can discover what intelligence actually is as he or she is given a 100% reliable clue through Prophet’s hadith.

3. My head hurts so lets finish this thinking process here.:giggling:)

Reference: Introducing Psychological Research, Second Edition, by Philip Banyard and Andrew Grayson.

How accurate and reliable IQ tests can be?
Find answer here. http://www.2h.com/articles/iq-tests/...y-tell-us.html

There are some additions I want to do. IQ tests can be affected by the following factors.

  • Applicant’s biochemistry. (See! Male and female difference can come here)
  • Applicant’s level of anxiety while taking the test. (Women becoming more anxious and hyper in some situations.)
  • Emotions can also have a profound impact on IQ test scores (BINGO! Women are totally emotional and so emotions will play their role when I and you will be giving our IQ tests. :lol:)
Marth, this post was intended to show you that science is not the ultimate criteria to judge something. Science is so unreliable that many times it is just silent on some matter or fails to give accurate answers. You took science as a criterion to judge whether the hadith was authentic or not but what you were actually doing was taking the help of unreliable material to judge something reliable.

format_quote Originally Posted by Marth
I did some research on male vs female intelligence and i found that our IQ's are basically equal:
format_quote Originally Posted by Marth
http://www.newsweek.com/id/101079

And that in every study conducted men are actually found to be MORE forgetful than women:
http://www.google.com.au/search?hl=e...an+men&spell=1
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,351621,00.html
So the posts of my other brothers and sisters provide you an explanation about why Quran mentioned the case of wittnesses and the hadith of Prophet Muhammad (s.a.w) describing women's intelligence. This post tries to make you understand that the IQ tests you are taking as your criterion are not 100% accurate and authentic.

So this was the problem with it. Never side with theories of science unless you are 100% sure that the theories themselves are 100% correct. Or you can do something easier than this. Always side with the LAWS of science. The laws of science are 100% accurate and cannot be changed. Laws of science are the facts. So Marth, you cannot say that the hadith of the Prophet is wrong because there is no law of science yet proving that man and woman are equal in intelligence!

A miracle:
Do you know Marth that Quran, Muslim’s Holy Book describes many scientific things? It gave the scientific knowledge 1400 years ago which science is coming to know of today. Many of the scientific things mentioned in Quran have today proven to be 100% accurate by science. You will NEVER EVER find a law of science going against the many scientific teachings in Quran! Still there is a lot to discover. Quran describes many scientific things which science is unable to do research on because science has not yet advanced that much. Holy Quran is FAR SUPERIOR TO THE WHOLE SCIENTIFIC KNOWLEDGE today. And therefore our Muslim’s criterion to judge between right and wrong is Holy Quran! If something matches with Quran, we simply take it and if something contradicts Quran, we totally reject it.

May Allah show you the right way. Ameen!:statisfie

Allahafiz! :muslimah:
Reply

Masuma
10-17-2009, 03:28 PM
Asalamu alikum!

Happy2bMuslim can you please post your replies to marth again in this thread. I think they are lost.

Allahafiz!
Reply

maxoverton
11-08-2009, 06:09 AM
"Regardless the number why more women will deserve Hell fire?
See around you:isn't the ladies who start to show their bodies to attract,did they flirt and separate husband from wife,break families?"

Haqeeka, isn't it rather the MEN who should show some self-control? No matter what a woman shows, or her behaviour, if a man has his eyes fixed on God's Word and his own marriage, he will not err. So many men say, "It was her fault. She dressed in such a way as to tempt me." But they never look at their own fault... "I allowed lust into my heart." I think both genders must take responsibility. Just my thought...
Reply

Hamza Asadullah
11-08-2009, 10:50 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by maxoverton
"Regardless the number why more women will deserve Hell fire?
See around you:isn't the ladies who start to show their bodies to attract,did they flirt and separate husband from wife,break families?"

Haqeeka, isn't it rather the MEN who should show some self-control? No matter what a woman shows, or her behaviour, if a man has his eyes fixed on God's Word and his own marriage, he will not err. So many men say, "It was her fault. She dressed in such a way as to tempt me." But they never look at their own fault... "I allowed lust into my heart." I think both genders must take responsibility. Just my thought...
Thank you for your thoughts and you are correct in that both men and women have to control their desires and even Allah tells us this in the Qur'an:

“Tell the believing men to lower their gaze (from looking at forbidden things), and protect their private parts (from illegal sexual acts)” (An-Nur:30)

Men and women are equal but does'nt mean they are the same. Men have physical, mental and emotional differences. Men have superiority over women in certain aspects such as physical strength, while women have more superiority over men from a caring and nurturing perspective.

In the same manner, like our differences, we may have rewards that are different from one another, but that in no way suggest inequality. If you want to reward your son for something, perhaps you'll let him play a video game for example, whereas if you want to reward your daughter, perhaps you'll let her invite her friend over, or buy her something nice. Men and women have different needs and wants so obviously rewards would differ.

The nature of men - that is, their physical, physiological and psychological make-up is such that the level of lust, sexual arousal, and temptation for procreation which they feel during this worldly life, is higher than that felt by women. Men are more prone to visual stimuli and frequent temptations.

Even if they love their wife, and she is very beautiful, they still desire other attractive women physically. Simply put: men get aroused by a single, casual glance at a body-part or a small flash of skin. Men’s physical desires are different from women’s. So that is why women are obliged to cover themselves in front of men and are not to show their bodily definition and uncover themselves in front of anyone but their husband and mahram's(those legal for the women to have her hair uncovered infront of).

So what we should realise is that Men and women are created differently and have different natures.

Here is even scientific evidance to back this up:

Men give into sexual temptation easier than women, scientists say

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worl...tists-say.html

Men And Women Are Programmed Differently When It Comes To Temptation

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases...0715114145.htm

Men and women handle temptation differently

http://www.familylifeculturewatch.co...d-women-h.html

Whatever Allah wants for us is the best for us in everyway. Hijaab is freedom for women where she can keep her honour and respect and not degrade and lower herself like a lot of women do, but the media has always falsley portrayed Islam to imprison women when it has actually given them more freedom than any other faith or belief in the history of this world.

Why does one not ask those women who cover why they do so and not listen to the evil and deception of the media who have always had an agenda behind everything they do. Thank you for reading.
Reply

Ramadhan
11-09-2009, 02:56 AM
^ Allah SWT has commanded us (both sexes) to lower our gazes and to keep chastity of our private parts.
Allah SWT has also commanded the women to cover themselves in the manner that's explained in the Qur'an and Sunnah.
What's your point?
Reply

غزالی
11-11-2009, 07:25 PM
WOMEN IN ISLAM -

1- COMPLETE DETAIL,

2 -MISCONCEPTIONS ABOUT WOMEN IN ISLAM (A VERY SHORT BUT COMPREHENSIVE DETAIL)
Reply

Snowflake
11-28-2009, 05:03 AM
Marth: I didn't fully understand the verse but it seems to imply that women aren't as smart as men and are more forgetful.
Hi Marth,

The following conditions contribute to memory loss/impairment in women. But even in conditions which both genders can suffer from, it is women who fare worse. These are only a few examples, but enough to show that Islam being a complete way of life, really does take every aspect of human experiences into consideration.


30% of women are depressed. Men's figures were previously thought to be half that of women, but new estimates are higher. (Depression is known to affect memory).

http://www.upliftprogram.com/depression_stats.html#6

*****

About twice as many women as men experience depression. Hormones, work overload and sexual abuse are among the factors that may increase a woman's risk of depression.

http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/depression/MH00035

*****

^Among the more conspicuous of the casualties is memory. Scientists are probing the connection between depression and memory.

http://www.memorylossonline.com/summ...epression.html

*****

Most studies have found clear gender differences in the prevalence of depressive disorders. Typically, studies report that women have a prevalence rate for depression up to twice that of men (Bebbington, 1996; Nolen-Hoeksema, 1987). For example, Kessler et al. (1994) reported that women in the United States are about two-thirds more likely than men to be depressed, and a national psychiatric morbidity survey in Britain showed a similar greater risk of depression for women (Meltzer et al., 1995). Gender differences in depression appear to be at their greatest during reproductive years (Bebbington, 1996).

http://www.psychiatrictimes.com/disp...58326?verify=0

*****

Clinical and neuropsychological findings, EEG, and several blood and CSF parameters were investigated in 36 patients with Alzheimer's disease (AD) and 35 patients with senile dementia of Alzheimer type (SDAT). There were more women among senile patients and more familial cases among presenile patients. The average duration of the symptoms was longer in presenile patients (6.1 years) than in senile patients (3.9 years). This could be due to the lower resistance to the disease process in the senile group.

http://www3.interscience.wiley.com/j...TRY=1&SRETRY=0

*****

But menopausal women often complain of "brain freeze" or the inability to retrieve certain information when they need it. You may have noticed that you have trouble finding that word you want to use or that you can't remember the name of your new coworker. Slight memory loss is a normal sign of menopause, but there is no clear consensus as to what causes short term memory loss.

http://www.epigee.org/menopause/memory_loss.html

*****

Menopause symptoms due to estrogen deficits, include memory problems, trouble finding words, inability to pay attention, mood swings and irritability, in addition to the more well known symptoms.

http://www.nymemory.org/menmemandmoo.html

*****

Confusion: While most women will experience a depressed emotional state as part of the PMS symptoms, many other women will feel confused. This can bring on a deeper depressed and more insecure state of mind.
Forgetfulness: Often a woman with PMS will experience forgetfulness, more often than not short term memory loss. This can lead to a feeling of insecurity, consequently providing the impetus for a lack of self esteem.

http://www.pmsremedy.org/emotional-pms-symptoms.php


*****

Research suggests that between 50 and 80 per cent of pregnant women experience memory loss or 'baby brain', as it is sometimes known.

http://www.ivillage.co.uk/pregnancya...711962,00.html
Reply

Hey there! Looks like you're enjoying the discussion, but you're not signed up for an account.

When you create an account, you can participate in the discussions and share your thoughts. You also get notifications, here and via email, whenever new posts are made. And you can like posts and make new friends.
Sign Up

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 78
    Last Post: 05-20-2023, 08:11 PM
  2. Replies: 4
    Last Post: 02-08-2011, 07:21 AM
  3. Replies: 0
    Last Post: 07-09-2010, 10:39 PM
  4. Replies: 0
    Last Post: 11-04-2005, 06:40 AM
  5. Replies: 0
    Last Post: 04-30-2005, 07:35 PM
British Wholesales - Certified Wholesale Linen & Towels

IslamicBoard

Experience a richer experience on our mobile app!