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Uthman
10-16-2009, 08:48 PM
'Most powerful Muslim woman in Britain' to appear alongside Nick Griffin, Jack Straw and Chris Huhne.

The Conservative party has confirmed that Tory peer Sayeeda Warsi will take part as a panellist on next week's controversial edition of BBC1's Question Time, which will feature British National Party leader Nick Griffin.

A spokesman for the Conservative party confirmed that they were expecting Baroness Warsi to take part.

Anglo-American playwright and critic Bonnie Greer is also expected to appear, alongside justice secretary Jack Straw and the Liberal Democrat home affairs spokesman, Chris Huhne.

Baroness Warsi, the shadow minister for community cohesion and a former lawyer, became the first Muslim woman to sit on the front bench of a British political party in 2007, aged 36. Earlier this year she was named the most powerful Muslim woman by a panel led by Trevor Phillips, the chairman of the Equality and Human Rights Commission.

A BBC spokesman refused to confirm its lineup ahead of next Thursday's edition of the political debate show, which will be recorded at the BBC's Television Centre.

Anti-fascist campaigners are planning a protest against Griffin's appearance outside the corporation's headquarters in west London.

Source
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Alpha Dude
10-16-2009, 08:53 PM
Wiki has this to say about Sayeeda:
Other comments made by Baroness Warsi have also provoked anger amongst gay-rights and anti-fascist campaigners, when she went on record saying "People who back the BNP, criticised for its racist and homophobic agenda, may even have a point. They have some very legitimate views." [10] On 15 October 2009 it was announced Warsi is scheduled to appear on the Question Time edition of 22 October; another panelist is Nick Griffin, leader of the British National Party.[11]
Should be interesting.
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InToTheRain
10-16-2009, 09:05 PM
The lies:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/8308582.stm

:ooh: what a coincidence. Guess they can't really grill him about the "fact" that he and his ilk are racist thugs :hmm:
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The_Prince
10-17-2009, 12:41 AM
does anyone have the specific details of the time, and channel for this show.
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nocturnal
10-17-2009, 01:02 AM
It's an explosive line-up of panellists, thats for sure. Straw won't back down from taking aim at anyone he feels deserves a dressing down, Griffin will obviously prate on about the urgent need for white racial exclusivity, and Warsi is going to be the very epitome of everything he hates; a woman, a non-white, who happens to be a fully-fledged legislator and front-bench member of an incoming government. This one is going to be off the hinges!
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Trumble
10-17-2009, 01:04 AM
format_quote Originally Posted by Z.AL-Rashid
The lies:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/8308582.stm

:ooh: what a coincidence. Guess they can't really grill him about the "fact" that he and his ilk are racist thugs :hmm:
What "lies"? The story is entirely factual.

I suspect you are missing the whole point. The BNP constitution, which excluded non-whites from joining, was rightly ruled illegal. The BNP, therefore, have no alternative but to amend that constitution to remain within the political process. Which, of course, they can happily do in the full knowledge that - precisely because they are racist thugs - no non-whites in their right mind would want to join anyway. In other words the whole thing has been a complete waste of time for everybody except the lawyers who pocketed the taxpayer's cash. Nobody is suggesting the BNP's views have changed in any way, including the BNP.

I certainly have no problems with Griffin appearing on the programme. The more idiotic a set of views are, the more harm the advocate of such views will do to themselves trying to peddle them on national TV.
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Blackpool
10-17-2009, 07:19 AM
I will definately be watching this without a doubt. I used to be a BNP supporter myself until I worked and mingled with Asians, however I do know people who are openly BNP supporters yet they're the nicest guys you can meet who will hold the door open for anyone.
Bring this show on!
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Uthman
10-17-2009, 09:39 AM
format_quote Originally Posted by The_Prince
does anyone have the specific details of the time, and channel for this show.
BBC One, Thursday, 10:35PM
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Uthman
10-17-2009, 01:11 PM
Interesting piece: The BNP on Question Time is the wrong party on the wrong programme

It's the old debate really about whether it's best to deny them publicity for their views or whether it's best to allow them publicity so that they can expose themselves for the racist thugs they really are.
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mahfuja
10-17-2009, 01:44 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Uthmān
Interesting piece: The BNP on Question Time is the wrong party on the wrong programme

It's the old debate really about whether it's best to deny them publicity for their views or whether it's best to allow them publicity so that they can expose themselves for the racist thugs they really are.
^ I agree with the latter! i think its showtime for the BNP and people can see what their veiws really are! Insha'Allah many eyes will be unveiled after this programme.
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InToTheRain
10-17-2009, 02:23 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Trumble
The BNP, therefore, have no alternative but to amend that constitution to remain within the political process.
The constitution should reflect the views and core principles of the party and BNP has no intention of changing this hence IT'S ALL A LIE! :raging: **** what's written on paper, the party clearly should not be allowed to exist legally as it never will change their core principles according to their own statements. What a farce.
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czgibson
10-17-2009, 08:54 PM
Greetings,

I'm looking forward to this very much, partly because I'm not entirely sure what to expect. It could end up providing us all with some classic TV moments, or it might be a fuss over nothing. The panel may give Griffin a disappointingly easy ride, or it could consist of just an hour of invective. I expect Dimbleby will find it hard to resist chiming in with one of his often masterly interventions. How many questions are they expecting to get through, when the obvious distraction of having a racist being invited to offer his opinions is there?

The big question, though, is obviously how this will affect the BNP's fortunes. I can't see it doing them much good in the long run, but you never know. Lunatic fringes do have a habit of flaring up from time to time.

Peace
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GuestFellow
10-17-2009, 09:24 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Uthmān
BBC One, Thursday, 10:35PM
Salaam.

Good I got a day off then. I'm looking forward to this. ;)
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aamirsaab
10-17-2009, 09:30 PM
I hope Griffin gets owned.
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InToTheRain
10-17-2009, 09:32 PM
I have a friend who regulars the BNP website when he is bored... it's always given him a good laugh...
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Blackpool
10-17-2009, 09:36 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Z.AL-Rashid
I have a friend who regulars the BNP website when he is bored... it's always given him a good laugh...
If your friend is white British then careful... it may suck him/her in. The BNP policies on that website are excellent and could/has sucked many people into the party. Just a warning.
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InToTheRain
10-17-2009, 09:38 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Blackpool
If your friend is white British then careful... it may suck him/her in. The BNP policies on that website are excellent and could/has sucked many people into the party. Just a warning.

LOL thanks man I needed that :D

He isn't white but he is cauc-asian :D
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Blackpool
10-17-2009, 10:44 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Z.AL-Rashid
LOL thanks man I needed that :D

He isn't white but he is cauc-asian :D
Thanks for what? What do you find to be funny?

Asian... no worries.
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mahi
10-17-2009, 10:53 PM
I look forward to watching it, but I don't look forward to it at all.

Why? Because that man Nick Griffin and many BNP members are good at what they do. They take something that would normally be auto looked down on and they twist it to present it differently and make it look like a solid point. And when the majority of your viewers are members that the BNP are targetting, so much of what Nick Griffin will probably hit with them.

I hope that he does get showed for what he is, but I have seen videos of him and he's not an easy target. He won't go there and leave his policies to be screwed at. Everything his party is, he has some explanation for it, and they sound reasonable. Obviously if you go beyond what he's saying, they're all horse poo.

Give this man a massive audience, and he will hit a lot of the audience. He won't be blantantly racist, he'll be subtle. And he'll use concepts like "We need to protect the needs of the majority of this country as more and more of white people fall into poverty" He'll quote unemployment figures. He'll quote things like crime figures in favour of white population. This is all as opposed to going outright and saying only the white people should be cared for. And he'll say it a much better and believable way.

You give him an audience and you'll be left with many people thinking that he does make some sense and that their best interests would be looked after by the BNP.
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Uthman
10-20-2009, 05:00 PM
Twenty questions for the BNP
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mahfuja
10-20-2009, 06:44 PM
^ these questions are spot on! I would love to see how Griffin answers them! I'm looking forward to Thursdays show and insha'Allah he'll make himself look like a complete doughnut!
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czgibson
10-20-2009, 07:17 PM
Greetings,
format_quote Originally Posted by Uthmān
Nice find, Uthman. :)

I hope they give him a good grilling!

Peace
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Muezzin
10-20-2009, 07:36 PM
I hope Jeremy Paxman is in the audience and nobody but he is allowed to ask questions. This would be what is known as 'cracking telly'.
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Uthman
10-21-2009, 10:20 AM
I'm not as optimistic as the rest of you. Like it or not, the British public have widespread concerns about immigration which the economic crisis has only seved to amplify. The BNP can be good at 'talking the talk'. They can tap into these concerns and make themselves sound reasonable, even if it involves outright lying about their policies.

I'm also concerned that, if and when it comes to a discussion about Islam, Nick Griffin might raise some issues about Islam's teachings which Baroness Warsi is unable to answer directly. He's raised that old Taqiyya myth on a radio show before. You know, that teaching which Islam-hater's love to misrepresent.
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nocturnal
10-22-2009, 02:30 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Uthmān
I'm not as optimistic as the rest of you. Like it or not, the British public have widespread concerns about immigration which the economic crisis has only seved to amplify. The BNP can be good at 'talking the talk'. They can tap into these concerns and make themselves sound reasonable, even if it involves outright lying about their policies.

I'm also concerned that, if and when it comes to a discussion about Islam, Nick Griffin might raise some issues about Islam's teachings which Baroness Warsi is unable to answer directly. He's raised that old Taqiyya myth on a radio show before. You know, that teaching which Islam-hater's love to misrepresent.
I see your point, but even though there is widespread dissatisfaction with the current economic crisis and the manner in which it is being handled by the government, i don't think most people with even an elementary grasp of history will vote in a cluster of fascist thugs to govern this country. Granted, they did receive 900,000 votes that propelled them to the European Parliament, and that startled me too, but i still don't see the BNP given its bigoted agenda, having the kind of agenda that it does, resonating with the vast majority of the public.

The time for acrimony over whether it was right or wrong to haul him on to the Question Time rostrum is over, it's now up to Jack Straw, Bonnie Greer and the rest to deliver a firm rebuttal to Griffin's abhorrent views.
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Uthman
10-22-2009, 06:01 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by nocturnal
The time for acrimony over whether it was right or wrong to haul him on to the Question Time rostrum is over, it's now up to Jack Straw, Bonnie Greer and the rest to deliver a firm rebuttal to Griffin's abhorrent views.
Agreed. They should expect to hear his infamous argument that Black people are allowed to have a Black Police Officer's Association and that isn't seen as racist. Clearly the BNP are not racist then(!)
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Uthman
10-22-2009, 08:00 PM
This whole event sure has had a lot of media coverage. I'll have to record it on Sky+ and watch it tomorrow. I've got lots of uni work to do tonight.
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The_Prince
10-22-2009, 10:02 PM
this lady is a JOKE, nick griff just said Islam says raped women should be stoned to death! and she didnt even bother saying no, rather she goes into a tirade against him, what a stupid stupid lady.

she could have said WHERE DOES IT SAY THAT, AND THATS FALSE, NO SUCH LAW EXISTS. but once again we have dumb asses representing us, its either an anjem choudry, or a stupid moderate like her who doesnt seem to know anything about the religion.
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GuestFellow
10-22-2009, 10:43 PM
^ Ah..I guess it didn't go too well? =/

I do wish we had better people to represent us but we should not care what others think of us since it is based on lies and utter crap.
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aamirsaab
10-23-2009, 08:24 AM
:sl:
He got owned.

format_quote Originally Posted by The Prince
this lady is a JOKE, nick griff just said Islam says raped women should be stoned to death! and she didnt even bother saying no, rather she goes into a tirade against him, what a stupid stupid lady.

she could have said WHERE DOES IT SAY THAT, AND THATS FALSE, NO SUCH LAW EXISTS. but once again we have dumb asses representing us, its either an anjem choudry, or a stupid moderate like her who doesnt seem to know anything about the religion.
Nah she was playing her cards right; keep the focus on BNP and expose his ass, religion can be dealt with later. Though, someone should have said: ''pardon me nick griffin, but you are aware that a female muslim is sitting on the panel amongst you and has obtained a much higher and respected position than you!''

p.s; everything he said about Islam was a lie too; he couldn't even get the bank thing right (which btw, was less to do about usury and more to do with risk) - and THAT was supposed to be a compliment.
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Ar-RaYYan
10-23-2009, 09:44 AM
Im sure the BNP are not thinking of accepting any inivitation for Question Time for a while.
Two new things i learn about Mr Griffin in this debate is 1) he is an awful liar! I mean how can you be misquoted in a video?^o) 2) he cant stop giggling! why does that silly man keep laughing and smilling when the things they were talking about was hardly amusing!
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The_Prince
10-23-2009, 02:24 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by aamirsaab
:sl:
He got owned.


Nah she was playing her cards right; keep the focus on BNP and expose his ass, religion can be dealt with later. Though, someone should have said: ''pardon me nick griffin, but you are aware that a female muslim is sitting on the panel amongst you and has obtained a much higher and respected position than you!''

p.s; everything he said about Islam was a lie too; he couldn't even get the bank thing right (which btw, was less to do about usury and more to do with risk) - and THAT was supposed to be a compliment.
she did bring ONE good point up when she said she doesnt know if hes a friend or foe of Islam, right after he bashed Islam he goes on talking about some of its good qualities, and how he supports Muslim countries to remain strong in Islam and how he didnt support the wars against them!
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Muezzin
10-23-2009, 05:34 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by The_Prince
she did bring ONE good point up when she said she doesnt know if hes a friend or foe of Islam, right after he bashed Islam he goes on talking about some of its good qualities, and how he supports Muslim countries to remain strong in Islam and how he didnt support the wars against them!
He's trying to get the Muslim vote. I'm dead serious.
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M..x
10-23-2009, 05:45 PM
Tha man is a jowke. His life is a jowke. As is his disgusting party. He did not know what he was talking about, and when he got done over, he'd just sit laughing like a muppet. He really is a confused man with really bent values. Buh I'm so happy he got exposed and in tha correct manner. I really think tha BNP party is doneshow. So I guess Griffin can go hibernate in a cave or something, away from eryone... InshAllah..

Warsi deserves browny points thas fo' sure. Although agreed abouh her displaying a lack of Islamic knowledge. If she's representing tha Muslims, she should be able to put forward tha correct Islamic view rather than just keep quiet. Nevertheless, I really admire her manner and speech.

A job well done... Agreed much?
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GuestFellow
10-23-2009, 06:07 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Muezzin
He's trying to get the Muslim vote. I'm dead serious.
Wow...he's desperate. O_o
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czgibson
10-25-2009, 01:36 PM
Greetings,

I watched this for the first time last night on iPlayer as I was busy when it went out on Thursday night.

We all got to see Griffin being the deceptive miscreant he is very clearly. His vague politician's answers were often quite cunning, but I can't see too many people falling for his way of thinking as a result of the programme. So his KKK friend was non-violent? OK then! His dad fought in the RAF against the Nazis? He must be appalled at the way his son has turned out. On the whole, though, the panel didn't really let him talk for long enough to completely d.amn himself out of his own mouth.

I thought Bonnie Greer's humorous and patronising tone worked well, offering him history books to read and so on. I've also never seen Dimbleby making himself the centre of attention so often - he gave Griffin more of a grilling than the rest of the panel put together. I'd also give three cheers to the audience member who suggested a whip-round to buy Griffin a ticket out of the country. Jack Straw did badly most of the time - lots of uninvited attacks that made him seem more like a bully than someone willing to answer the questions put to him. One point where he did score was when he brought up his position as Justice Minister, giving Griffin permission to address the topic of Holocaust denial without fear of punishment.

There were a few uncomfortable moments, though, when the heat came off Griffin and he was asked for his opinion just as if he was a regular panellist. We don't want his appearance on programmes like this to begin to seem normal.

On another point, I was very surprised to hear Sayeeda Warsi standing up for gay rights - I thought she was a Muslim?

Peace
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GuestFellow
10-25-2009, 03:07 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by czgibson
Greetings,

On another point, I was very surprised to hear Sayeeda Warsi standing up for gay rights - I thought she was a Muslim?

Peace
Greetings,

Some Muslims that I've met do stand up for gay rights and say whatever they do in their private life is non of our business. Not all Muslims share same values. However they do still regard homosexuality as a sin.
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nocturnal
10-25-2009, 03:26 PM
Good point goodfellow, but also, Warsi is a front-bench member of a party that is now poised to form the next government. At a time when all of them are being watched carefully, their policies scrutinised, their indiscretions in the past dredged up in the media and especially after 12 years out of government, they'd have rebuked her if she did anything that would even marginally affect their claim to form the next government.

Later on after that show, she appeared on BBC News along side Chris Hughne, the Lib Dem panellist who appeared on the show along side her. What was a simple question about how to neutralise the BNP's purported electoral gains, rapidly degenerated into an rancorous segment of political mud-slinging.
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czgibson
10-25-2009, 03:27 PM
Greetings,
format_quote Originally Posted by Guestfellow
Greetings,

Some Muslims that I've met do stand up for gay rights and say whatever they do in their private life is non of our business. Not all Muslims share same values. However they do still regard homosexuality as a sin.
How can you stand up for something you believe is a sin?

Peace
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GuestFellow
10-25-2009, 03:30 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by czgibson
Greetings,


How can you stand up for something you believe is a sin?

Peace
Well maybe that is not the correct term to use. They don't support it or go against it. They ignore it.

I didn't worded well in my previous post.
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Uthman
10-25-2009, 05:02 PM
Greetings czgibson,

I completely agree with your assessment of this week's Question Time. :)

format_quote Originally Posted by czgibson
On another point, I was very surprised to hear Sayeeda Warsi standing up for gay rights - I thought she was a Muslim?
Well she has also attacked polygamy in the past. Plus, it's not like she wears the Hijaab or anything so she clearly doesn't tend to subscribe to orthodox Islamic teachings. Kudos to her for her defence of Islam on the show though.

Regards
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nocturnal
10-25-2009, 05:10 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by Uthmān
Greetings czgibson,

I completely agree with your assessment of this week's Question Time. :)

Well she has also attacked polygamy in the past. Plus, it's not like she wears the Hijaab or anything so she clearly doesn't tend to subscribe to orthodox Islamic teachings. Kudos to her for her defence of Islam on the show though.

Regards
I can't help but think she really is just being put out there as a bit of a token by the Tories. And i don't think she's stupid enough not to know that; so all i can deduce from it is that she's positioning herself within the party rank and file, and putting herself out there in the media, possibly in the hunt for a bigger portfolio. I don't think she's going to be very satisfied with her current lot for too long.
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GuestFellow
10-25-2009, 05:21 PM
format_quote Originally Posted by nocturnal
I can't help but think she really is just being put out there as a bit of a token by the Tories. And i don't think she's stupid enough not to know that; so all i can deduce from it is that she's positioning herself within the party rank and file, and putting herself out there in the media, possibly in the hunt for a bigger portfolio. I don't think she's going to be very satisfied with her current lot for too long.
Asslamu Aliakum.

This is why I believe Muslims in a non-Muslim country should try to avoid getting into politics. Our views will eventually clash.
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nocturnal
10-26-2009, 01:37 AM
format_quote Originally Posted by Guestfellow
Asslamu Aliakum.

This is why I believe Muslims in a non-Muslim country should try to avoid getting into politics. Our views will eventually clash.
Good point, but i think the problem with a total boycott on political participation, especially in a country as diverse as the UK is that you invariably have gaping voids in terms of the formulation of policies to promote community cohesion. So if there's a conspicuous absence of any Muslim, Jewish, Buddhist, etc representation, you risk having the government press ahead unilaterally conceiving policies without adequate consultation with people from ethnic minorities in whose names, certain pieces of legislation are purported to be enacted.

Also, many Muslims, just like people from any other faith are ambitious too. I guess the problem arises, especially in politics, when you have to, or appear to have to, compromise on certain inviolable tenets and principles of your belief. Baroness Warsi had that foisted on her with respect to homosexuality.
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