the people of knowledge say that a person can never win a debate against an ignorant, lacking knowledge, person. it is even worse when we got ignorant + morally bankrupt
format_quote Originally Posted by
cat eyes
:sl:
I Fully agree with the marriage they should get married it dose not make sense to throw the father in jail because this girl will need support etc.
And control your anger brother islamic life we don't want to be giving threats to non muslims of slapping sense in to there heads:)
:wa:
sister, few things to keep in mind insha'Allah. Our anger love, kindness, hatred is for Allah. By slap, I did not many physically, I meant few common sense, academic slaps. Many of these morally bankrupt ignorant kuffaar, who are not fair and balanced and argue for sake of arguing, deserve more than just few slaps. Even ta'zeer punishment is not enough to give them what they deserve for their crimes against Allah and rest of humanity.
format_quote Originally Posted by
titus
You truly believe that? You think if an 8 year old consents to sex that it should allowed?
if she meets the conditions which I gave in me previous post then why not? however, generally speaking, in our age does 8 years old meet those conditions, the answer is no. Thus, your question is completely irrelevant - you can run around with it but it serves no purpose. Secondly, by which standards she should not be allowed to get married? Let me guess, your age based standards. Did you know that in our time even many 16 and 18 years old are not ready for marriage but how come you allow them, specifically speaking your laws?
format_quote Originally Posted by
titus
I need to be slapped a few times? Why are there so many rude people on this forum?
it is hardly my fault if you cannot understand the language in the context. It was never meant physical. Secondly, humiliating you by exposing your blunders and flawed reasoning with harsh language is not rude.
format_quote Originally Posted by
titus
Everyone should have the right to voice their opinion. Tell me, do you think gay men should be allowed to marry each other? If not, then who gave you the right to butt into other people's private affairs and speak on behalf of people who don't agree with you?
you really do not read, do you? It saddens me that you cannot differentiate between different concepts and what people are trying to say. First, my argument was divided in two parts: 1) saying they should not get married and 2) saying they should not be allowed to get married. Your whole argument is based upon the 2) point and it is tied to morality and inciting whether a law should be implemented or not. No one is saying that you cannot voice your opinion; however, you can run around and tell others to live life according your standards or say they should be doing this - this is nothing but arrogance.
I am sorry, your argument against me does not work because we never say gays should not get married, we are simply relaying what the Creator, the Lord has told and legislated for us. Our morality is not based upon flawed human intellect, reasoning, corrupt principles and standards. It is based upon the principles and standards of the Creator. You have a problem with this, take up your beef with Him.
format_quote Originally Posted by
titus
I don't believe anyone should slap you, though, for believing differently than I do.
already explained above
format_quote Originally Posted by
titus
Do you think a little girl can truly comprehend the immensity of marriage and what it will mean for her? Do you think an 11 year old truly has any idea what kind of man will make the best husband for her?
straw man! I never spoke of any age so stop attacking me and putting words in my mouth. I brought up four conditions and no sane person would say that if those conditions are met then a person is incapable of handling the marriage, except those who have dead hearts and no common sense.
Secondly, who are you calling little, immature, incapable of deciding for herself? Do you think 14, 16, 18 years old can truly comprehend the immensity of marriage? That is why, in the history of mankind, the age haven never been the main deciding factor to decide when a person is ready for marriage. This never happened in the history of mankind until the last century.
format_quote Originally Posted by
titus
Please don't tell me that most 11 year olds have this capacity. They don't.
never did, never implied, never used age argument - another straw man. Note the emphasized word, according to you, there are some exceptions; thus, we say to you so often that do not base your moral (in this issue upon age) and extreme views because there are always some exceptions to general rule.
format_quote Originally Posted by
titus
Then you tell me what you define as "mentally able", "physically able", and "financially able". Who decides if an 11 year old is mentally able to get married? Who decides if someone is physically able? What, according to you, should be the criteria?
first, do not bring up the age again because your own countries do not agree with each other on this and you want us to follow them. According to one country, it is fine and perfect but according to another country it is crime and girl is a victim and the guy is a pedophile, thrown into jail.
1 - mentally ready - able to comprehend the responsibilities of marriage and mentally ready to carry them out. Able to consent to marriage and comprehend the purpose of marriage
2 - physically ready - able to carry out marriage obligations: looking after husband, generally no fear of harm being caused while physical intimacy with husband and giving birth.
3 - financially ready - the husband understands the financial burden and can feed and look after his family
as far who decides when someone is physically ready, then that is based upon what is commonly known: from person's physical growth and body. Even much older women like in 25+ have difficulties with child birth and physical intimacy; so the argument of age does not work here. In Islam we have the general rule, a husband cannot have intercourse with his wife if it causes her harm (physical and psychological) and vice versa - whether he/she is 11 years old or 40 years old. This is completely different than your laws based upon age.
format_quote Originally Posted by
titus
Exactly how was I attacking you? The people in this article are not even Muslims.
I was not talking about people in the article. I was referring to the Muslims in this thread who were arguing against you.