Hijab or no hijab?

[Italianguy]

As most of you may know by now, I italianguy have ben pretty much surounded by Muslims lately......:D

One thing I have noticed is that most all Muslim women I come in contact with say wearing a Hijab is a must.......we are always, ....or i should say Zainab and my wife are always looking for some (Hijabs) for Zainab, believe t or not we found some at "Coach":hmm: ....who would of thought?

Back to my question, I see a lot of Muslim women, not wearing a Hijab. I also see a lot of Muslim women wearing..ummmmmm....form fitting clothing...very, form fitting clothing:hmm:. Some will wear a Hijab while wearing form fitting clothing....does that cancel out the form fitting clothing issue?

I am just kind of confused:p, I thought the women of Islam were supposed to be wearing modest clothing, losely fitting so as not to draw attention to their...ummmm....figures?

Some of the Muslim women that i have met have been dressed really provocativley......Zainab doesn't comment very nicely on that:raging:

And just to make it clear, %90 of the Muslims i have met have been from other countries with strict cultural veiws on this. The other %10 are usually reverts who are probably new and don't know?

This question is not intended in any way to be an insult or arguement:D......i was just wondering this for a while and thought I would ask......You all know me better than that now, I would never intend to offend anyone:D

If this question is out of line....just tell me, I will delete it immediately!

God be with you all! And may Allah bless all of you.

[GuestFellow]

A Muslim women is supposed to cover her hair and wear loose clothing. Pretty much pointless covering your hair and then wearing extra tight jeans. You might as well wear a belly top. So you have to cover your entire body.

EDIT: sorry I missed out some words <_<

[Italianguy]

A Muslim women is supposed to cover her hair and wear loose clothing. Pretty much pointless covering your hair and then wearing extra tight jeans. You might a well a belly top. So you have to cover your entire body.

Thank you. Am I the only one who notices this? We were at the mall a couple of hours ago........Like thats a suprise:hmm:

And at a Kiosk sat a Muslim woman wearing very very form fitting clothing BUT she was wearing a Hijab.....I'm an old-school Christian and if my daughter was wearing that......she wouldn't EVER leave the house:heated:

Even my wife wears clothing which totally covers her, like a sari or salwar kamee:D......besides her face....and feet you can't even tell shes brown;D...well, i guess the sari gives it away:hmm:

Keep in mind where I live it's business and shopping around here not much elseimsad

[GuestFellow]

I don't really notice girls wearing tight clothes, I try to lower my gaze.

Keep in mind some Muslim men are not following the dress code either. They are getting hairstyles that are haraam (copying kuffars), piercing their ears, shaving their beard off, wearing tight clothes and some wear silk or gold.

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[Donia]

As most of you may know by now, I italianguy have ben pretty much surounded by Muslims lately......:D

One thing I have noticed is that most all Muslim women I come in contact with say wearing a Hijab is a must.......we are always, ....or i should say Zainab and my wife are always looking for some (Hijabs) for Zainab, believe t or not we found some at "Coach":hmm: ....who would of thought?

Back to my question, I see a lot of Muslim women, not wearing a Hijab. I also see a lot of Muslim women wearing..ummmmmm....form fitting clothing...very, form fitting clothing:hmm:. Some will wear a Hijab while wearing form fitting clothing....does that cancel out the form fitting clothing issue?

I am just kind of confused:p, I thought the women of Islam were supposed to be wearing modest clothing, losely fitting so as not to draw attention to their...ummmm....figures?

Some of the Muslim women that i have met have been dressed really provocativley......Zainab doesn't comment very nicely on that:raging:

And just to make it clear, %90 of the Muslims i have met have been from other countries with strict cultural veiws on this. The other %10 are usually reverts who are probably new and don't know?

This question is not intended in any way to be an insult or arguement:D......i was just wondering this for a while and thought I would ask......You all know me better than that now, I would never intend to offend anyone:D

If this question is out of line....just tell me, I will delete it immediately!

God be with you all! And may Allah bless all of you.

Wearing form fitting clothing and then putting a scarf on your head does somewhat defeat the purpose of wearing "hijab". Hijab is supposed to be loose fitting clothing that covers everything except a woman's face and hands from my understanding.
However, who knows what these sisters are going through.. maybe they are in the process of trying to wear hijab properly and are just going slow with it until they get used to it.
Some women I have known will start by wearing long pants/skirts and long sleeves and then just build their way up.
We all have our struggles.. May Allah guide us all on the right path. Ameen.

[Italianguy]

I don't really notice girls wearing tight clothes, I try to lower my gaze.

Keep in mind some Muslim men are not following the dress code either. They are getting hairstyles that are haraam (copying kuffars), piercing their ears, shaving their beard off, wearing tight clothes and some wear silk or gold.

Sorry brother, I don't stare ....i lower my gaze tooimsad...you nust be married as well;D just kidding

I hate silk! I have never had any though, btw why is silk haram?......Uggggg these young kids even BOYS wearing ultra tight jeans WTH!:hmm:

[GuestFellow]

Sorry brother, I don't stare ....i lower my gaze tooimsad...you nust be married as well;D just kidding

I hate silk! I have never had any though, btw why is silk haram?......Uggggg these young kids even BOYS wearing ultra tight jeans WTH!:hmm:

I'm 18 :skeleton: I'm too immature to get married, mess around too much.

No I never assumed you stared at girls.

Why are men not allowed to wear silk?

[Italianguy]

Wearing form fitting clothing and then putting a scarf on your head does somewhat defeat the purpose of wearing "hijab". Hijab is supposed to be loose fitting clothing that covers everything except a woman's face and hands from my understanding.
However, who knows what these sisters are going through.. maybe they are in the process of trying to wear hijab properly and are just going slow with it until they get used to it.
Some women I have known will start by wearing long pants/skirts and long sleeves and then just build their way up.
We all have our struggles.. May Allah guide us all on the right path. Ameen.

Thanks for the reply sister:D

I have asked Zainab and she said some do it to attract attention for business and to attract other Muslim men...not that she condoned it.

Why dress that way for men? What kind of men are they going to attract? It's like my friends saying "lets go to a bar and find women" I'm like ,why? If you go to a bar think of the type of women that are there. Is that what you want to bring home to mom and pop (or Umma and Uppa)?

I kind of like it, (modest clothing)It makes a man have to KNOW the woman for her intelligence and self worth..not just beauty.

My wife is very very modest, but believe it or not there are men that still try to hit on her....me:raging: They think it's "exotic" ......until i walk up;D

[Sawdah]

A Muslim women is supposed to cover her hair and wear loose clothing. Pretty much pointless covering your hair and then wearing extra tight jeans. You might a well a belly top. So you have to cover your entire body.

Yup. Some muslim women these days wear the hijab along with some skinny jeans or some other fitting clothing.
Other muslim women don't wear the hijab because they believe that you don't have to and that you just need to wear it in prayer. (not right)

[Italianguy]

I'm 18 :skeleton: I'm too immature to get married, mess around too much.

No I never assumed you stared at girls.

Why are men not allowed to wear silk?

your to young to marry? ...dude my great grandparents were arranged in marriage at 16 or 17....and met at the alter! mY grandparents were arranged in marriage at 17 and 18.......better hurry up your getting old;D

I'm just messing with you:D

It's ok i didn't take offense (the staring thing):D

[Donia]

Thanks for the reply sister:D

I have asked Zainab and she said some do it to attract attention for business and to attract other Muslim men...not that she condoned it.

Why dress that way for men? What kind of men are they going to attract? It's like my friends saying "lets go to a bar and find women" I'm like ,why? If you go to a bar think of the type of women that are there. Is that what you want to bring home to mom and pop (or Umma and Uppa)?

I kind of like it, (modest clothing)It makes a man have to KNOW the woman for her intelligence and self worth..not just beauty.

My wife is very very modest, but believe it or not there are men that still try to hit on her....me:raging: They think it's "exotic" ......until i walk up;D

If the reason for wearing tight clothing is to attract a man, well then you kind of get what you ask for.
Alhumdulillah when wearing hijab, it is hoped to attract a man that would be attracted to modesty and for who the woman truly is inside and not her looks. Just like what you were saying.

LOL about the last part. Some people just have no sense.

[Italianguy]

If the reason for wearing tight clothing is to attract a man, well then you kind of get what you ask for.
Alhumdulillah when wearing hijab, it is hoped to attract a man that would be attracted to modesty and for who the woman truly is inside and not her looks. Just like what you were saying.

LOL about the last part. Some people just have no sense.

I know right!...all these men think she's Freda Pinto or something?.....well...she's darker;D....but they think she's soooo pretty:raging:....She can't tell anyway, she thinks they are just being nice:hmm: but there have been a couple of instances when she was affraid and had to yell for me!:cry:

I have had to get....physical with some of these dudesimsad. But NO MAN:raging: gets to close to my wife....and her friends.....as long as their women....men are on their own:p

On a more funny note.....we were in a store one time and a family thought she was lost:hmm:.....after walking with them for 5 minutes to the info desk, they asked what her parents names where........she gave them to them!;D The store paged the names....i heard it and said to myself "Thats my inlaws names"(there Indian...it's not hard to tell) so i go over there and shes just smiling away:D waving at me?........so i asked what was going on? and the store manager asked if I was her Gardian????.......I was like what?...i am her husband!! they looked at me in disgust+o(.....they thought she was a lost child!!hahahahahahaha;D;D

They thought she was.....hahahahahaha i can't stop!;D;D, a little girl! She's 24 but she looks like she's 13 only 5'2'' and very very small;D

And then.....THEY DIDN"T believe me:p they thought i was lying! It took me 30 minutes to convince them not to call the police!!

and the worst part......she had no clue what was going on;D:p....she thought the family needed help finding the help desk!;D

Just smilling and waving:D, smilling and waving:D

Indianssss!!!

[CosmicPathos]

Some women wear provocative clothing and a hijab. There are different types of hijabs. One is called a "mickey mouse Hijab." Brothers were so annoyed to see such muslimahs on campus that they jokingly came up with that name. It is a funny name. I know I will get flamed but hey, as someone said life should have some fun, this is how we guys have fun.

One can be a Muslim by proclamation of kalmah. But it does not mean they have submitted to Allah and hence such people wear unislamic clothing thinking they are still Muslims. They still might be. But they are not Mumins yet. At least with such mindset.

A Muslim Muminah is supposed to not only cover her hair but also her face. There is a huge debate on hijab vs niqab even among scholars. I do not see how wearing a hijab helps in attaining modesty. More guys are attracted to women's face rather than their hair. I did not know guys have fetish for hair. No point of hiding hair while leaving that attractive face open for display. Allhamdulillah all the women in my house do niqab. May ALLAH increase their piety more.

[GuestFellow]

your to young to marry? ...dude my great grandparents were arranged in marriage at 16 or 17....and met at the alter! mY grandparents were arranged in marriage at 17 and 18.......better hurry up your getting old;D

I'm just messing with you:D

It's ok i didn't take offense (the staring thing):D

I mean I mess around too much...my parents did consider getting me married though, probably 2 years later. :skeleton:

Oh just wanted to add, what anyone wears does not reflect their character. Some Muslims follow the dress code but do not behave like Muslims unfortunately.

[Italianguy]

On a more funny note.....we were in a store one time and a family thought she was lost.....after walking with them for 5 minutes to the info desk, they asked what her parents names where........she gave them to them:hmm:! The store paged the names....i heard it and said to myself "Thats my inlaws names"(there Indian...it's not hard to tell) so i go over there and shes just smiling away:D waving at me?........so i asked what was going on? and the store manager asked if I was her Gardian????.......I was like what?...i am her husband!! they looked at me in disgust+o(.....they thought she was a lost child!!hahahahahahaha;D

They thought she was.....hahahahahaha i can't stop!, a little girl!

She's 24 but she looks like she's 13 only 5'2'' and very very small;D

And then.....THEY DIDN"T believe me they thought i was lying! It took me 30 minutes to convince them not to call the police!!:phew

and the worst part......she had no clue what was going on:hmm:....she thought the family needed help finding the help desk!;D

Just smilling and waving:D, smilling and waving:D

Indianssss!!!
__________________
I guess i do have to say.....it was nice of that family to take the time to care:D

[Italianguy]

Some women wear provocative clothing and a hijab. There are different types of hijabs. One is called a "mickey mouse Hijab." Brothers were so annoyed to see such muslimahs on campus that they jokingly came up with that name. It is a funny name. I know I will get flamed but hey, as someone said life should have some fun, this is how we guys have fun.

One can be a Muslim by proclamation of kalmah. But it does not mean they have submitted to Allah and hence such people wear unislamic clothing thinking they are still Muslims. They still might be. But they are not Mumins yet. At least with such mindset.

A Muslim Muminah is supposed to not only cover her hair but also her face. There is a huge debate on hijab vs niqab even among scholars. I do not see how wearing a hijab helps in attaining modesty. More guys are attracted to women's face rather than their hair. I did not know guys have fetish for hair. No point of hiding hair while leaving that attractive face open for display. Allhamdulillah all the women in my house do niqab. May ALLAH increase their piety more.

Thanks brother!

[Italianguy]

Some women wear provocative clothing and a hijab. There are different types of hijabs. One is called a "mickey mouse Hijab." Brothers were so annoyed to see such muslimahs on campus that they jokingly came up with that name. It is a funny name. I know I will get flamed but hey, as someone said life should have some fun, this is how we guys have fun.

One can be a Muslim by proclamation of kalmah. But it does not mean they have submitted to Allah and hence such people wear unislamic clothing thinking they are still Muslims. They still might be. But they are not Mumins yet. At least with such mindset.

A Muslim Muminah is supposed to not only cover her hair but also her face. There is a huge debate on hijab vs niqab even among scholars. I do not see how wearing a hijab helps in attaining modesty. More guys are attracted to women's face rather than their hair. I did not know guys have fetish for hair. No point of hiding hair while leaving that attractive face open for display. Allhamdulillah all the women in my house do niqab. May ALLAH increase their piety more.

Omg, Brother, a moment of silence...........Is that poem you have about what i think it is?.........I AM SO SORRY!:cry:

[Hamza Asadullah]

As most of you may know by now, I italianguy have ben pretty much surounded by Muslims lately......:D

One thing I have noticed is that most all Muslim women I come in contact with say wearing a Hijab is a must.......we are always, ....or i should say Zainab and my wife are always looking for some (Hijabs) for Zainab, believe t or not we found some at "Coach":hmm: ....who would of thought?

Back to my question, I see a lot of Muslim women, not wearing a Hijab. I also see a lot of Muslim women wearing..ummmmmm....form fitting clothing...very, form fitting clothing:hmm:. Some will wear a Hijab while wearing form fitting clothing....does that cancel out the form fitting clothing issue?

I am just kind of confused:p, I thought the women of Islam were supposed to be wearing modest clothing, losely fitting so as not to draw attention to their...ummmm....figures?

Some of the Muslim women that i have met have been dressed really provocativley......Zainab doesn't comment very nicely on that:raging:

And just to make it clear, %90 of the Muslims i have met have been from other countries with strict cultural veiws on this. The other %10 are usually reverts who are probably new and don't know?

This question is not intended in any way to be an insult or arguement:D......i was just wondering this for a while and thought I would ask......You all know me better than that now, I would never intend to offend anyone:D

If this question is out of line....just tell me, I will delete it immediately!

God be with you all! And may Allah bless all of you.

You are actually quite correct in your observations. Heres a short article i pasted in another forum which i think is very relevant to this thread:

Asalaamu Alaikum Wr Wb, my sisters the very purpose of wearing hijaab is to conceal oneself and not to attract unwanted attention upon oneself. But nowadays many of our sisters are making a mockery of hijaab and wearing beaded and such fashionable hijaabs like red and pink and in all the different colours of the rainbow.

Why are sisters wearing hijaabs that really stand out and look attractive and appealing to the eye? They are clearly attracting unwanted attention from men. Is that the purpose of hijaab?

Allah subhaanahu wa ta aala says in in His Book:

...and not to reveal their adornments except to their husbands, their fathers, their husband's fathers, their sons, their husband's sons, their brothers or their brother's sons, or their sister's sons, or their (Muslim) women (i.e. their sisters in Islaam), or the (female) slaves whom their right hands possess, or old male servants who lack vigour, or small children who have no sense of the shame of sex. And let them not stamp their feet so as to reveal what they hide of their adornment. And all of you beg Allaah to forgive you all, O believers, that you may be successful. Suratun-Nur 31


Behavorial psychologists state that a women who wear red and pink colours are clearly wanting to attract attention upon themself and are wanting to really make a statemen and stand out. Again is this the purpose of hijaab?

On top of that one will see many girls not wearing the hijaab properly. They tuck the hijaab over their ears and reveal their whole neck and wear it in such a fashionable way like a bandana.

They also beautify themselves further by applying lots of make up looking all 'dolled up'. This can be seen everywhere nowadays and is a very sad state of affairs as it goes against the very principles of hijaab which is not to look extra attractive and attract unwanted attention and gazes upon oneself.

The purpose of hijaab is to be inconspicuous not to stand out glowing with make up and various kinds of fashion accessories. Those girls who act like this get more attention from guys than girls who don't wear hijaab at all!

Even scholars have stated that it is not permissable for a girl who wears hijaab to get all 'dolled up' by wearing lots of make up and accesories that further beautify her and make her stand out which clearly attract unwanted attention and gazes from others.

One will also see many girls who wear hijaab wearing the highest of heels which make so much noise when they walk clearly attracting so much attention upon themselves.

Many a time one will see groups of 'hijaabis' walking around the shopping mall or on the high street or university behaving and acting so much more louder than other girls who don't wear hijaab at all. Should one not care how loud one is and attract unwanted attention from guys?

Allah says:

"Be not soft in speech, lest he in whose heart is a disease (of hypocrisy, or evil desire for adultery, etc.) should be moved with desire" (Sura Al-Azzab Ayat #32)

Also many a time one will see girls with hijaab wearing knee length leather boots, tight combats and jeans aswell as full sleeveless tight and low cut tops. Is this to attract more attention upon themselves? Why would they dress like this when they are wearing a hijaab on their heads? How could they mock and disgrace themselves and the hijaab like that? In actual fact they are mocking the command of Allah upon them. The command of Allah is to conceal ones beauty but why wear hijaab to attract extra attention upon oneself?

The worst of all is when a girl with hijaab is seen publically holding hands and making out with a boy. Many a time have i and many others seen this. These girls have no shame at all and don't even try to hide it. They are an absolute disgrace to the hijaab, to their families and to themselves. They are also the ones who always get hurt and used and then complain about it afterwards. Why go through the torture of getting hurt and scarred from a haraam relationship? These relationships never work and what impression are girls who wear hijaab and have open haraam relationships making to others?

These girls are tarnishing the respect that girls who wear hijaab properly deserve because guys are starting to get the impression that girls who wear hijaab are the same as girls who don't. To be honest nowadays girsl who wear hijaab are acting and dressing worse than girls who don't wear hijaab at all. To these girls hijaab is nothing but a fashion accessory and a means of attracting more men.

Hijaab is inner and outer modesty not just a cloth on ones head or a fashion accessory like how many girls nowadays treat the hijaab. Do these girls think it is an excuse to dress and act how they want?

Women are precious jewels and the beauty of those precious jewels should only be admired and appreciated by her marriage partner not anyone else.

A women can beautify herself as much as she likes in front of her husband but why beautify yourself for the whole world to admire and lust over? Do you think you will not return to Allah and answer for your actions?

Please sisters seriously look at your intentions in your hearts and ask yourselves why dress and act like this? Is this what hijaab is really about? Or is hijaab so much more deep and meaningful than that.

Ask yourselves are you doing justice to the hijaab your wearing on your head? What do you think Allah is thinking of you right now looking at the way your dress and act whilst you have a hijaab on your head?

Remember we can go at any second and if we were to go in this state then what will we answer to Allah? How will we justify our behaviour?

So my sisters whatever has happened in the past has happened now. Let us move on and repent to Allah that he forgives us and let us have a new beginning. Never again wear tight or innappropriate clothes when going out. Only wear the most minimal of makeup if any when you go out so as to not attract unwanted attention and finally wear a dark coloured hijaab that does'nt stand out and the jilbaab which is far superiour that any type of loose clothing which may hug on the hips and curves.

These are the women that have true beauty for they are the most beautiful in the eyes of Allah and the women are make a mockery of hijaab are the most beautiful to shaythan!

May Allah save our brothers and sisters from all the evil that surrounds us and from our inner desires and the whisper of shaythan and may Allah help us to let carry out his commandments properly and let us not let shaythan have a say in how we carry out our commandments. Ameen

I have pasted some very useful and beneficial links especially for our sisters:

Advice from a sister on hijaab

http://www.sunniforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=39547


The Role of Women in Islamic Society-Very good article by revert sister

http://www.sunniforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=39901


Hijaab and the Freedom of Women

http://www.sunniforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=39857


Very Inspiring Experiences Of Recently Converted Woman

http://www.sunniforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=40169


WOMEN IN ISLAM

http://www.sunniforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=41377


The Best Role Models for All Muslim Women

http://www.sunniforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=41302


Please remember me in your dua's and ask me ANYTHING you want and i will try my best to always help you as your brother in Islam. Allah Hafiz

[CosmicPathos]

Omg, Brother, a moment of silence...........Is that poem you have about what i think it is?.........I AM SO SORRY!:cry:

The poem in my signature? No, that is related to my personal and social experiences with life. When people's hands are tied and they are thrown in ice cold rivers and streams in Swat (Pakistan) and they drown helplessly, I do not think life offers any colors to enjoy. Then when I hug my mothers feet while she talks about some daily things she did and I listen to her and then think one day she will die or I will die before her, I do not see any colors in life anymore. Then when I look at my dad and see how he works for maintaining and providing us and then I think one day it will be all gone ... then I dont see any colors in life. Sorry, off topic.

[syilla]

salams...

do you know what? i think you should try asking in the nicest way why they are wearing that way when they are suppose to be a muslimah. lets see if they really understand the purpose of hijab.

actually you can find lots of them in malaysia :/. and some people says they wear hijabs just to show that they are goody to shoes but actually they are the opposites. but we shouldn't be judging them because we don't really knows whats in their hearts.

it shows that the muslims are not giving the right message whats islam is really all about.

['Abdul Rahmaan]

Could it be called Islamic Hijaab if only the faces were uncovered? Yes, IMO.

[CosmicPathos]

Could it be called Islamic Hijaab if only the faces were uncovered? Yes, IMO.

beautiful. May Allah give ajar to these sisters for following the sahaabiyaat and the mothers of believers.

[Hamza Asadullah]

beautiful. May Allah give ajar to these sisters for following the sahaabiyaat and the mothers of believers.

Ameen. Those who mock our sisters that wear niqaab are out of the fold of Islam and are hypocrites. How can anyone mock what the Sahaabiyaat and the mothers of believers wore? These people have until their souls have reached their throats to ask for forgiveness and change their ways!

May Allah give all of our sisters to follow the example of the sahaabiyaat and the mothers of believers! Ameen

[Supreme]

I personally have nothing against the Hijab, so long as it's the personal choice of the female who's wearing it to wear it. As far as I see it, it's just another head covering such the one used by nuns or the one popular with African women. As long as it isn't enforced by a controlling husband or father.

[Alpha Dude]

your to young to marry? ...dude my great grandparents were arranged in marriage at 16 or 17....and met at the alter!

Really? I had no idea there was such an arranged marriage culture among Italians. Is it common? :ooh:

[Italianguy]

The poem in my signature? No, that is related to my personal and social experiences with life. When people's hands are tied and they are thrown in ice cold rivers and streams in Swat (Pakistan) and they drown helplessly, I do not think life offers any colors to enjoy. Then when I hug my mothers feet while she talks about some daily things she did and I listen to her and then think one day she will die or I will die before her, I do not see any colors in life anymore. Then when I look at my dad and see how he works for maintaining and providing us and then I think one day it will be all gone ... then I dont see any colors in life. Sorry, off topic.

Can you explain a litte more? Interesting

[Italianguy]

Really? I had no idea there was such an arranged marriage culture among Italians. Is it common? :ooh:

Ummmmmm..... Not much anymore, it is outside of the big cities. My family still does it....we don't say much about it, people think it's weird in the USA. :( and they think it's oppressive towards women

[Supreme]

Ummmmmm..... Not much anymore, it is outside of the big cities. My family still does it....we don't say much about it, people think it's weird in the USA. :( and they think it's oppressive towards women

What a load of rubbish, it's oppressive to both the man and the woman in the marriage.

[cat eyes]

sure what bout the men?? i also see loads of muslim guys not dressing modest just the other day i saw a muslim guy at the mosque and his muscles were bulging out of his PINK t-shirt! yes it was pink would u believe that :raging: i mean not that i was looking or anything but it was a bit hard not to notice as i was walking out :exhausted

[Alpha Dude]

I know Italians are big on family etc, but I didn't realise they were so close to Islamic or even indian culture. No wonder you married a desi. :D

It's not really oppressive toward women though, men of course would be in the same situation.

[Fטлку]

sure what bout the men?? i also see loads of muslim guys not dressing modest just the other day i saw a muslim guy at the mosque and his muscles were bulging out of his PINK t-shirt! yes it was pink would u believe that :raging: i mean not that i was looking or anything but it was a bit hard not to notice as i was walking out :exhausted

LOL! Have you ever seen a guy with glitter in his hair? :giggling:

[Italianguy]

What a load of rubbish, it's oppressive to both the man and the woman in the marriage.

No it's not! How would you know? Did yours fail? All my family members arranged marriage were %100 successful:D

May I ask? do you even know what an Arranged marriage is?

[Italianguy]

I know Italians are big on family etc, but I didn't realise they were so close to Islamic or even indian culture. No wonder you married a desi. :D

It's not really oppressive toward women though, men of course would be in the same situation.

I know, i told him it wasn't oppressive either?:hmm: He is the reason we don't talk about it much! They all think the men are some kind of caveman that beats the woman over the head with a club and drags her to his cave:hmm:;D.

And yes i married a desi girl.lol;D Yeah, her mother was really suprised to see how close our cultures are too:D

[Asiyah3]

What a load of rubbish, it's oppressive to both the man and the woman in the marriage.

Oh really ?! :raging: So then it is less oppressive for guys to spend the night with the woman (I'd rather not use more impolite description of their deeds, even though I can) and then throw her away and get a new sock?

An COUNTLESS cases come into my mind! So then that ways better?

Come on, how often does those kinda relationships end so that the guy just sends a stupid textmessage to the girl "sorry, it's over" "we're too different" etc. after having the five mins of enjoyment <_<


EDIT: What an arrogant statement!

[GuestFellow]

What a load of rubbish, it's oppressive to both the man and the woman in the marriage.

Do you even know how arrange marriages work?

[Italianguy]

Oh really ?! :raging: So then it is less oppressive for guys to spend the night with the woman (I'd rather not use more impolite description of their deeds, even though I can) and then throw her away and get a new sock?

An COUNTLESS cases come into my mind! So then that ways better?

Come on, how often does those kinda relationships end so that the guy just sends a stupid textmessage to the girl "sorry, it's over" "we're too different" etc. after having the five mins of enjoyment <_<

Thank you sister!

[Asiyah3]

No it's not! How would you know? Did yours fail? All my family members arranged marriage were %100 successful:D

May I ask? do you even know what an Arranged marriage is?

true, I agree 100%. Good question.
All my family's arranged marriage were also 100% successful,

Indeed, it is alots more successful comparing to Supremes' "50-dates"-marriage

[Italianguy]

Do you even know how arrange marriages work?

NO he doesn't, or he wouldn't have said that. I have seen a poll that said 9 out of 10 arranged marriages are successful, where 3 out of 10 of the so called "normal way" are successful........3 out of 10! ....It's probably less nowimsad

[sister herb]

__________________
I guess i do have to say.....it was nice of that family to take the time to care:D

Sure. They were kindly and caring people when they (of they mind found lonely missing child...). Hopely they will make same again... but not with same "missing child".

;D

[Italianguy]

true, I agree 100%. Good question
All my family's arranged marriage were also 100% successful,

Indeed, it is alots more successful comparing to Supremes' "50-dates"-marriage

What? he went on 50 dates before marriage?:hmm:

I met my wife for 5 minutes once.....then asked her dad if we could have a lunch...ummmm..... meeting:p Her parents came.....Then a family sit down....then married:D

It took a realistic time of about ............1 day(thats time together) before we were married.

Its probably different for others.

[Italianguy]

Sure. They were kindly and caring people when they (of they mind found lonely missing child...). Hopely they will make same again... but not with same "missing child".

;D

LOL, I hope not. I hope next time my wife realises whats going on;D

[Supreme]

No it's not! How would you know? Did yours fail? All my family members arranged marriage were %100 successful:D

May I ask? do you even know what an Arranged marriage is?

It's were the parents (or somebody else apart from the couple in question) arrange a marriage that isn't their own.

Oh really ?! So then it is less oppressive for guys to spend the night with the woman (I'd rather not use more impolite description of their deeds, even though I can) and then throw her away and get a new sock?

An COUNTLESS cases come into my mind! So then that ways better?

Come on, how often does those kinda relationships end so that the guy just sends a stupid textmessage to the girl "sorry, it's over" "we're too different" etc. after having the five mins of enjoyment

I never even implied such a thing. I just said that arranged marriages are oppressive, and also illegal.

Indeed, it is alots more successful comparing to Supremes' "50-dates"-marriage

Not if the couple in question don't love each other. If you have 5 dates or 500 hundred dates with different people, I'm sure if you find the one you love in the end it's worth it and successful.

[sister herb]

LOL, I hope not. I hope next time my wife realises whats going on;D

I wrote as:

but not with same "missing child"

;D

[Alpha Dude]

I just said that arranged marriages are oppressive, and also illegal.

I think you have arranged marriages confused with forced ones.

[CosmicPathos]

Can you explain a litte more? Interesting

i will pm you soon.

[Supreme]

I think you have arranged marriages confused with forced ones.

No, I'm pretty sure I've got arranged marriages right:

Amongst the arguments against arranged marriage, the most prominent are:

Arranged marriage is as good or as bad as the people arranging it. A forced mismatch, based on the values important to the arranger may not be as important to the parties involved.[citation needed]
Coercion to marry is commonly considered a violation of fundamental human rights in most Western societies. In the United Kingdom, legislation was passed in 2007 to effectively outlaw the practice in England, Wales and Northern Ireland. This is primarily because of its usurpation of a choice that, in most Western thought, belongs solely to the individuals involved; people can "find themselves stuck in marriages with persons decidedly not of their own choosing... whom they may find personally repulsive."[11]
A further condemnation of the practice of arranging marriage for economic reasons comes from Edlund and Lagerlöf (2004) who argued that a love marriage is more effective for the promotion of accumulation of wealth and societal growth.[12]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arranged_marriage#Against

[Italianguy]

i will pm you soon.

Thanks:D brother

[Alpha Dude]

Supreme, in Islam, nobody can force somebody to get married. The choice is (or always should be) up to the individuals. If two people have been arranged to get married, they both have the option to refuse the partner that has been brought forth.

[Italianguy]

Ohhhh my friend, let me explain an arranged marriage in my family or culture, it may differ from others, so I only speak for myself.

An arranged marriage is a beautiful thing. It is where 2 families have decided based upon multiple reasons such as; Faith, age, education, stature, status in society (in some cases) and looks (rarely) among other reasons.

A couple usualy gets to meet with each other maybe once or twice, just to talk! Not for a test run. In my families cases, they met at the alter(on the day of marriage)

You will learn to love each other through time. Both parties have already been educated on their respective roles in the household I.E.; Husband provides and is head of household and woman provides for a nourishes the children as well as other things. There is a mutual respect! Respect is a big part.

If you are brought up knowing this, it is not a big deal:hmm:

I was born here in America, and i know it is frowned upon, but believe it or not it is getting popular again, slowely.

It's not just a Muslim or Christian, or Hindu thing....It's a proper thing.

Just going out and "testing the waters" for man or woman is against everything a Christian should do,(as well as a Muslim, I think?? Someone correct me).

We shouldn't just go out and date:heated:

My friend....you trully find a great respect and love for a person when you have to learn everythng about them new.

I am against forced marriage, it is totally different......but there was someone in my family involved in a forced marriageimsad 22 years ago......they are still happily married:D

Arranged marriage is a journey, that you and your partner will take together, it strengthens a bond between the 2 of you that can never be broken. It creates a love only seen by few.

My great grandparents where inseperable, I never saw them apart....In fact when they got to the US through Ellis island, my grandfather was detained for a week....My grandmother (at that time 16 years old) slept outside! In the dirt...in the cold and rain:cry: drinking water that fell off the roof when it rained...for a weekimsad she NEVER left his side ......EVER. They loved eachother so much:D they were always together.

Have you ever seen the movie "The Namesake"? It's about an Indian couple and shows their arranged marriage.

Arranged marriages are usually %99 sucessfull!

I do understand how you see it though. Many don't know the beauty in arranged marriage. It's because everone has become so liberal and against everything out off THEIR norm.

God be with you friend.

[Supreme]

Supreme, in Islam, nobody can force somebody to get married. The choice is (or always should be) up to the individuals. If two people have been arranged to get married, they both have the option to refuse the partner that has been brought forth.

I'm against arranged marriages irregardless of them being Islamic or otherwise.

It's not just a Muslim or Christian, or Hindu thing....It's a proper thing.

No its not, it's a method of parent to control their offspring against the offspring's will. Now I've no doubt the offspring themselves can benefit, and the parents are doing it for the best interests of their children, but that still does not make it right.

Just going out and "testing the waters" for man or woman is against everything a Christian should do,(as well as a Muslim, I think?? Someone correct me).

Any verse in the Bible to prove this?

Arranged marriage is a journey, that you and your partner will take together, it strengthens a bond between the 2 of you that can never be broken. It creates a love only seen by few.

Maybe, but it's the choice of the individual, because it is the individual that is the one who is going to be most affected. It's the same with buying a house, if I was going to spend millions of pounds on a house I was going to live in for the rest of my life, I would at least go out and choose it myself.

Arranged marriages are usually %99 sucessfull!

Just because something is successful, it does not make it right.

I do understand how you see it though. Many don't know the beauty in arranged marriage. It's because everone has become so liberal and against everything out off THEIR norm

And that's just it- you're conservative, I'm liberal. We're never going to agree on some things, and this is just one of those things.

[greenshirt]

the hijab is required for all muslimahs, and they should not wear tight clothing with it, nor should they wear standout clothing (like florescent color hijabs, etc.) the reason for wearing hijab is because of modesty, and so if someone is wearing a hijab and then wearing tight jeans and a revealing shirt, this is unacceptable and not within the dress code boundaries of the religion!

concerning forced(arranged) marriages, this is also unacceptable. a person has a right to decide if they want to get married or not. though it is practiced in many cultures, and usually with good intentions, it is still ultimately up to a person, and only them, whether or not they want to get married to another person. this is even narrated in the hadiths. http://www.islam-qa.com/en/ref/4602/forced%20marriage

[جوري]

what is
Eharmony.com
chemistry.com
match.com

etc etc?

are they not arranging people together sans the actual insight of third parties who know them, since people are seldom honest on their profile?..

I am not a fan of arranged marriages but couldn't help pass the opportunity to point out yet another flaw in western hypocrisy!

They do the exact same thing to a lesser degree that rejects all safety measures and have the audacity to point out how others are doing it wrong..

yeah good luck with your sites and bar hopping.. I am sure it is the classy way to go about it!

for centuries people have been perfectly happy being brought together by a third party, substituting that for internet arrangements, perhaps makes it a bit more sterile but a thorn by any other name!

[Italianguy]

Supreme, in Islam, nobody can force somebody to get married. The choice is (or always should be) up to the individuals. If two people have been arranged to get married, they both have the option to refuse the partner that has been brought forth.

Thanks DUDE, i forgot to put that. They do have the option to refuse.

[Italianguy]

what is
Eharmony.com
chemistry.com
match.com

etc etc?

are they not arranging people together sans the actual insight of third parties who know them, since people are seldom honest on their profile?..

I am not a fan of arranged marriages but couldn't help pass the opportunity to point out yet another flaw in western hypocrisy!

They do the exact same thing to a lesser degree that rejects all safety measures and have the audacity to point out how others are doing it wrong..

yeah good luck with your sites and bar hopping.. I am sure it is the classy way to go about it!

I know, those sites are horible+o(

They match upon nothing true.

I heard they rarely work anyway:hmm:

[جوري]

Al-Khansaa’ bint Khidaam complained to the Prophet that her father wanted her to marry someone she didn’t want, saying “I do not wish to accept what my father has arranged.” The Prophet said, “Then this marriage is invalid, go and marry whomever you wish.” Al-Khansaa’ said, “I have actually accepted what my father has arranged, but I wanted women to know that fathers have no right in their daughter’s matters” (i.e. they have no right to force a marriage on them). (Fath Al-Barî Ibn Hajr, Sunan Ibn Mâjah)

[Supreme]

I know, those sites are horible+o(

They match upon nothing true.

I heard they rarely work anyway:hmm:

Tell me about it. The TV adverts (sorry, commericials) make me cringe.

[Italianguy]

I'm against arranged marriages irregardless of them being Islamic or otherwise.


No its not, it's a method of parent to control their offspring against the offspring's will. Now I've no doubt the offspring themselves can benefit, and the parents are doing it for the best interests of their children, but that still does not make it right.



Any verse in the Bible to prove this?



Maybe, but it's the choice of the individual, because it is the individual that is the one who is going to be most affected. It's the same with buying a house, if I was going to spend millions of pounds on a house I was going to live in for the rest of my life, I would at least go out and choose it myself.

Just because something is successful, it does not make it right.



And that's just it- you're conservative, I'm liberal. We're never going to agree on some things, and this is just one of those things.

My friend, i am not trying to enforce my opinion on you. Everybody has the right to their own opinion, i respect that:D

God bless.

I will find the verse you are seeking.

[Italianguy]

Tell me about it. The TV adverts (sorry, commericials) make me cringe.

HEY, WE agreed on something;D

God bless.

[Italianguy]

Al-Khansaa’ bint Khidaam complained to the Prophet that her father wanted her to marry someone she didn’t want, saying “I do not wish to accept what my father has arranged.” The Prophet said, “Then this marriage is invalid, go and marry whomever you wish.” Al-Khansaa’ said, “I have actually accepted what my father has arranged, but I wanted women to know that fathers have no right in their daughter’s matters” (i.e. they have no right to force a marriage on them). (Fath Al-Barî Ibn Hajr, Sunan Ibn Mâjah)

An aranged marriage or "assited marriage" is different than forced.

I don't like forced marriage eitherimsad

[GuestFellow]

I'm against arranged marriages irregardless of them being Islamic or otherwise.

No its not, it's a method of parent to control their offspring against the offspring's will. Now I've no doubt the offspring themselves can benefit, and the parents are doing it for the best interests of their children, but that still does not make it right.



Any verse in the Bible to prove this?



Maybe, but it's the choice of the individual, because it is the individual that is the one who is going to be most affected. It's the same with buying a house, if I was going to spend millions of pounds on a house I was going to live in for the rest of my life, I would at least go out and choose it myself.

Just because something is successful, it does not make it right.



And that's just it- you're conservative, I'm liberal. We're never going to agree on some things, and this is just one of those things.

Why is it not right?

[Italianguy]

Why is it not right?

right! And i also do not see in the Bible that it says ok to date either.

we can't just look for whats wrong, we need to look for whats right.

[Alpha Dude]

Supreme, think about it this way: You have a (guy) friend and your sister has (girl) friend. They both are looking to get married soon to somebody reliable, trust worthy etc. You and your sister think they both would make an awesome couple so arrange a meeting between them. They both hold the belief that any sort of 'dating' before marriage is prohibited so they get married asap because they think they are compatible based on what they have seen of each other and what their well-wishers have told them.

Nothing forced about it. Now just assume it is the family of the people looking to get married that suggest the potentials to each other. Same principle.

[Italianguy]

I guess I should make it clear....My marriage was not arranged....well....semi arranged.

Keep in mind I am Italian and my wife is Indian, any Indian will tell you....thats not typical, and probably would never happen in India?

[جوري]

An aranged marriage or "assited marriage" is different than forced.

I don't like forced marriage eitherimsad

The fellow seems to suggest that Muslim marriages are 'forced' as an exist strategy to why the west practices the same principles to a far more deranged degree!

all the best!

[Italianguy]

The fellow seems to suggest that Muslim marriages are 'forced' as an exist strategy to why the west practices the same principles to a far more deranged degree!

all the best!

Yeah i noticed, i was just trying to clerify it for him....i don't think it workedimsad

But....to each his own, right?

God be with you sister:D

[Italianguy]

The fellow seems to suggest that Muslim marriages are 'forced' as an exist strategy to why the west practices the same principles to a far more deranged degree!

all the best!

Are you talking about me or Supreme?

[جوري]

Sub............................................... ...........................................

[Italianguy]

Sub............................................... ...........................................

??? What is that?

[tango92]

i think gossamer thinks were on the same intellectual level as her, haha

[Asiyah3]

i never even implied such a thing. I just said that arranged marriages are oppressive, and also illegal.

well you can find many people's laws which aren't made the way they are for the people's interest. I respect your view (though i don't find it rational nor reasonable.)

not if the couple in question don't love each other. If you have 5 dates or 500 hundred dates with different people, i'm sure if you find the one you love in the end it's worth it and successful.

yes, as you said "if" they don't love each other (though that's not the case (/in most cases) and "if" the person in the end finds happiness. I'll just say that in the marriages (arranged) i've seen, the couple's love each other strongly and are happily married. Then again since i live in europe, i see alot of depressed people which i conclude are so because of loneliness. Plus, if i go randomly into a class, and ask the student's how many student's parent's have been divorced, i believe that about half of them would answer positively.

^ ..............

[Ğħαrєєвαħ]

Thank you. Am I the only one who notices this? We were at the mall a couple of hours ago........Like thats a suprise:hmm:

And at a Kiosk sat a Muslim woman wearing very very form fitting clothing BUT she was wearing a Hijab.....I'm an old-school Christian and if my daughter was wearing that......she wouldn't EVER leave the house:heated:

Even my wife wears clothing which totally covers her, like a sari or salwar kamee:D......besides her face....and feet you can't even tell shes brown;D...well, i guess the sari gives it away:hmm:

Keep in mind where I live it's business and shopping around here not much elseimsad

Aslamu alaaykum .. The Women who wear tight jeans, may not be practising their faith as it should be done, and some may be unaware of this issue ie.to dress modestly!
These people need to be advised seriously , as it is a serious matter!:statisfie
wa alaaykum Salaam..

[Italianguy]

Aslamu alaaykum .. The Women who wear tight jeans, may not be practising their faith as it should be done, and some may be unaware of this issue ie.to dress modestly!
These people need to be advised seriously , as it is a serious matter!:statisfie
wa alaaykum Salaam..

True, but it's not my place to tell them, thats up to you sisters in Islam:D

[Ğħαrєєвαħ]

:statisfie

True, but it's not my place to tell them, thats up to you sisters in Islam:D

Yes true, all i can do from i am right now, is make Du`a for them, That Allaahs shows them the true path, Ameen

[Ğħαrєєвαħ]

Note: There are young Christian Girls who cover un-modestly, so therefore thats your Job :) :P

[Italianguy]

Note: There are young Christian Girls who cover un-modestly, so therefore thats your Job :) :P

Yup! you are correct about that one.

[Ğħαrєєвαħ]

Yeah no hard feelings, just saying whats what aye :P...Indeed we must all do our part in whatever way that is good for us! :)

[Italianguy]

Yeah no hard feelings, just saying whats what aye :P...Indeed we must all do our part in whatever way that is good for us! :)

Ameeeeeeeeen!

[جوري]

i think gossamer thinks were on the same intellectual level as her, haha

I just substituted the P for a B really to tickle myself.. No intellect involved whatsoever just a basic vindication.. :D

:w:

[Asiyah3]

I'm against arranged marriages irregardless of them being Islamic or otherwise.




No its not, it's a method of parent to control their offspring against the offspring's will. Now I've no doubt the offspring themselves can benefit, and the parents are doing it for the best interests of their children, but that still does not make it right.


Any verse in the Bible to prove this?



Maybe, but it's the choice of the individual, because it is the individual that is the one who is going to be most affected. It's the same with buying a house, if I was going to spend millions of pounds on a house I was going to live in for the rest of my life, I would at least go out and choose it myself.


Just because something is successful, it does not make it right.



And that's just it- you're conservative, I'm liberal. We're never going to agree on some things, and this is just one of those things.

You are talking about forced marriages, mister. All of us are against forced marriages (it's wrong). Really, I don't think you know what arranged marriages are :hmm:

[Italianguy]

I just substituted the P for a B really to tickle myself.. No intellect involved whatsoever just a basic vindication.. :D

:w:

Haha, i knew it, i was just wondering? I thought thats what you did thats why i didn't ask anymore.lol

[Supreme]

Supreme, think about it this way: You have a (guy) friend and your sister has (girl) friend. They both are looking to get married soon to somebody reliable, trust worthy etc. You and your sister think they both would make an awesome couple so arrange a meeting between them. They both hold the belief that any sort of 'dating' before marriage is prohibited so they get married asap because they think they are compatible based on what they have seen of each other and what their well-wishers have told them.

Nothing forced about it. Now just assume it is the family of the people looking to get married that suggest the potentials to each other. Same principle.

I would personally be freaked out if one of my mates did that to me. But then they don't know what sort of women I like or anything.

Aslamu alaaykum .. The Women who wear tight jeans, may not be practising their faith as it should be done, and some may be unaware of this issue ie.to dress modestly!
These people need to be advised seriously , as it is a serious matter!

Even though I respect Islam's views on modesty, I hardly think tight jeans are the epitome of the problem. What about short skirts and no knickers? Or tops that practically reveal all of a woman's breasts? Tight jeans seem a rather mild form of immodesty when compared to other clothes.

You are talking about forced marriages, mister. All of us are against forced marriages (it's wrong). Really, I don't think you know what arranged marriages are

Yes, I do understand forced marriages. But also understand that, even though people aren't forced into these things, they should still be able to search for a partner of their own free will.

[Cabdullahi]

Even though I respect Islam's views on modesty, I hardly think tight jeans are the epitome of the problem. What about short skirts and no knickers? Or tops that practically reveal all of a woman's breasts? Tight jeans seem a rather mild form of immodesty when compared to other clothes.

this guy obviously hasn't met the booty and the jeans that gives it the shape

[جوري]

I hate jeans, I think they flatter no one.. they are so bourgeois!

:w:

[Italianguy]

I hate jeans, I think they flatter no one.. they are so bourgeois!

:w:

True, I preffer Italian cashmere and or Egyptian cotton with the highest thread count:D

Jeans are for mowing the lawn in.

[جوري]

^^ I agree wholeheartedly.. but I also like all natural material.. I just don't know why it costs so much?

:w:

[Italianguy]

^^ I agree wholeheartedly.. but I also like all natural material.. I just don't know why it costs so much?

:w:

LOL, anyway they can charge more:hmm: All they do is say "Made in Italy" and jack up the price %90 or if its Egyptian cotton it's double that cost....:hmm:

[Getoffmyback]

Tight jeans , high heels , tight shirt , a full makeup . But Veiled hair. Shows good deeds and good intentions . They are really innocent inside and shy. they are not aliens when you talk to them. Just trying to look good . I'm with the temptations of looking good its not a sin. The idea is that you will only see them walking down the streets shopping some more:) . And its not enough to get an impression by that. and you never see them acting anomaly like dancing in a night club . So they do have respect inside.

[tango92]

^^jeez quit with the graphic description already.

[love_mawada]

heh heh gr8 dtory bro!!

[love_mawada]

sorry-story ;)