Is it wrong to support troops?

[AnonymousPoster]

Hi all i have a friend who is a revert. she has been doing the adopt a soldier program for years in which you "adopt" a soldier based in various locations who rarely if ever receives mail from friends or family. she has been supporting two soldiers. they never talk about war or military stuff or religion (except for when she told them that she converted-which they both supported her) but talk about stuff in the u.s. like news about random things and just chit chat about life in general and their families. is it wrong for her to write to them?

[Mohamed M]

Personally i think its wrong to support troops, and i guess many people agree. i assume your friend is a muslim again? well think about it like this, those 2 soldiers whom she took care of, will kill innocent muslim brothers and sisters. which is more important, your religion and everyone who follows it or this programm and everything else in the world.

dont support anyone who harms muslims and who has no respect for our religion

[aurealnour]

The soldiers havent chosen to be where they are. But they are, what's wrong with showing another human that they care? Why does this bother you anyway?! I can understand the conflict you are probably feeling. I dont support the war, I never have. But they are there and like others in similar position belive what they are doing is for the greater good.

[AlbanianMuslim]

tough one...........

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[CosmicPathos]

such a fatalistic attitude does not exist in Islam. These revert soldiers can choose to leave the army. No ONE is FORCING them to work in a kaafir army. Its not for a Muslim to fight along with the kaafirs.

Allah guided these soldiers to Islam. Now its their duty to find out what Islam says about working in a kaafir army which mounts attacks on Muslims.

[AlbanianMuslim]

I thought it was far more difficult to get out of the army once youre in it, but who knows, maybe there is a way out for religious purposes..does anyone know?

[CosmicPathos]

I thought it was far more difficult to get out of the army once youre in it, but who knows, maybe there is a way out for religious purposes..does anyone know?

I do not think it should be difficult unless you signed up for a contract? These institutions do try to lure young people to join em by offering them free tuition for medical schools and colleges, very evil and in return, they will have to be army doctor for probably 5 years or whatever is in the contract.

[AlbanianMuslim]

Yea you may be right I had no idea. I was always under the impression that to get out was almost impossible unless you got hurt or did something "heroic"
Tough one.

[S<Chowdhury]

I do not think it should be difficult unless you signed up for a contract? These institutions do try to lure young people to join em by offering them free tuition for medical schools and colleges, very evil and in return, they will have to be army doctor for probably 5 years or whatever is in the contract.

There is a way out but its quite difficult, my friends father was in the army did a tour of Iraq and things, he wanted out after this. As soon as he lodged his notice of resignation, all his benefits he received stopped etc, his father was pressured from all angles to make him stay, thankfully his father just applied to be a guard at a RAF base. His father couldn't get a job outside of the army aswell he didn't have many qualification, and i think thats the sad story many infantry and lower rank soldiers don't have many qualifications the army is the only occupation with decent benefits. You could say he could retrain and get better qualification when you got 4 mouths to feed and trying to keep a roof of there heads it becomes quite difficult to leave the army.

[AlbanianMuslim]

Wow I figured as much. I remember when my brothers reached graduation, for each one of them we got constant phone calls for them to join. The recruiters were so persistent that my father lodged a complaint with the local recruiting station that took us off their lists.
I can imagine theyd be even worse if you go in and then you decide to get out.


P.s. chowdhury, i love your malcom x quote!

[S<Chowdhury]

Wow I figured as much. I remember when my brothers reached graduation, for each one of them we got constant phone calls for them to join. The recruiters were so persistent that my father lodged a complaint with the local recruiting station that took us off their lists.
I can imagine theyd be even worse if you go in and then you decide to get out.


P.s. chowdhury, i love your malcom x quote!

Thank you :)

Yeah I'm getting the same treatment now from the Army aswell, I'm gonna start Uni and i got a bombardment of leaflets and email to join the army instead, yeah right ;D. I have to admit when i was young (age 6) i thought the army was the best thing in the world, its rather attractive to kids especially with action figures like Action Man and this whole idea of guns and fighting to be just a bit of fun, and the comradeship. But my father was in the army and when he told me his experiences it gave a more bleak perspective of life in the army put me off at least.

[zakirs]

Is she is showing compassion/support to some soldiers who are in need then may be its ok.Again i am not sure of this

[سيف الله]

aurealnour

The soldiers havent chosen to be where they are. But they are, what's wrong with showing another human that they care? Why does this bother you anyway?! I can understand the conflict you are probably feeling. I dont support the war, I never have. But they are there and like others in similar position belive what they are doing is for the greater good.

Salaam

Some consider the phrase 'Support our troops' a meaningless phrase

Political analyst Noam Chomsky has criticized the slogan, saying,

"[...] the point of public relations slogans like "Support Our Troops" is that they don't mean anything [...] that's the whole point of good propaganda. You want to create a slogan that nobody is going to be against and I suppose everybody will be for, because nobody knows what it means, because it doesn't mean anything. But its crucial value is that it diverts your attention from a question that does mean something, do you support our policy? And that's the one you're not allowed to talk about."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Support_our_troops

He talks about it here for the first few minutes

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G7DdWmWUa_8

Myself personally, I dont give public backing to what British troops are doing in Iraq and Afghanistan and campaign for them to be withdrawn. No way do I buy into the rhetoric that there doing 'good'. However the troops are in a difficult position and its hard for them practically to disobey. Many of them privately say dont know what exactly they are fighting for and want to come home.

I've immense admiration for those who refuse to serve, that does take a lot of guts and they should be supported for their stand.

[Mohamed M]

''The soldiers havent chosen to be where they are. But they are, what's wrong with showing another human that they care?''

The soldies chose to go in the army fully aware about what ther are going to do. they have a choice, and they chose to join, no one forced them to.

[Woodrow]

The soldies chose to go in the army fully aware about what ther are going to do. they have a choice, and they chose to join, no one forced them to.

Young people are naive. Right now, since congress has not declared a state of war the president can only deploy 20% maximum of the US military to points outside US territories or areas of combat. At present he is deploying less then 10% so that means an ingoing soldier has a 1 out 10 chance of going to Afganistan or Iraq. Most youngsters look at it in the light they will be in the 90% that will never see Afghanistan or Iraq. Many of the young GIs enlist under the belief they will never be sent into combat and their primary role will be to protect the USA against invasion.

However, once a soldier has completed basic training, it is virtually impossible to get out of the service before completion of the enlistment agreement which is normally from 2 to 4 years depending on the branch of service.

The strongest incentive for young people to join the military is the current job market for people without a college degree or specialized training. Either of which can be gotten by enlisting in the military.

The next strongest incentive is some young people who have gotten arrested several times for minor offenses can often have their record wiped clean by serving in the military. An arrest record here can prevent a person from getting employment, housing loans, higher education, and even health care.

The only ones who know specifically they will be deployed to Afghanistan or Iraq are those who specifically request that as an assignment, and they are few. The Majority of GIs in those countries never expected they would be sent there, although they knew there was a possibility.

[cat eyes]

YES it is wrong and she should stop it immediately everybody knows even young kids know that they kill muslims... she should stop it at once and sincerely repent for it before Allah takes her soul and she will be held accounted for the lives that were lost

[S<Chowdhury]

YES it is wrong and she should stop it immediately everybody knows even young kids know that they kill muslims... she should stop it at once and sincerely repent for it before Allah takes her soul and she will be held accounted for the lives that were lost

Life in the army isn't all about killing innocent children, some of the army officers try to good out of the occupation in Iraq and Afghanistan, shouldn't generalise the whole army as baby murderers.

[Mohamed M]

Life in the army isn't all about killing innocent children, some of the army officers try to good out of the occupation in Iraq and Afghanistan, shouldn't generalise the whole army as baby murderers.

the iraq and afghanistan people dont need the soldiers help, sympathy or anything for that matter. People dont know what goes on in those countries, what you are basing your judgment is on what you see on t.v, the media fabricates the whole story making it seem like the soldiers are doing the locals a favour where as what the soldiers are doing is causeing more harm than good. Why are the soldiers still in those countries now?

[Woodrow]

the iraq and afghanistan people dont need the soldiers help, sympathy or anything for that matter. People dont know what goes on in those countries, what you are basing your judgment is on what you see on t.v, the media fabricates the whole story making it seem like the soldiers are doing the locals a favour where as what the soldiers are doing is causeing more harm than good. Why are the soldiers still in those countries now?

:sl:

Just my opinion. I believe the main reason is because there is an economic war between China and the USA. To keep China from getting the mechanical means to engage in a physical war with the USA, China needs oil. China has already signed some of the largest oil leases in history with Iran and Iraq. To get the oil to China, they will need to make pipelines and railroads through Afghanistan. The USA does not want China to have access to the oil. The easiest way is to either assist the aid of the Taliban to keep China out, like they did for 10 years with Russia. However, it looks like Afghanistan has also entered into a deal to sell mineral rights to China. So the next lowest cost method will be to keep American troops in Afghanistan keeping the country in turmoil and making it impossible for China to build the pipelines and railroads.

The next big lie to young Americans of military age will be to tell them we are in Afghanistan to protect Afghanistan from China.

[S<Chowdhury]

the iraq and afghanistan people dont need the soldiers help, sympathy or anything for that matter. People dont know what goes on in those countries, what you are basing your judgment is on what you see on t.v, the media fabricates the whole story making it seem like the soldiers are doing the locals a favour where as what the soldiers are doing is causeing more harm than good. Why are the soldiers still in those countries now?

Brother Okey i understand but my father colleagues that i know of and also i have a few friends who's father are also serving in the Iraq and Afghanistan front, so I'm not solely basing it on the media that would be silly of me. Obviously i can't speak of the war since I'm not on the front line, but neither are those who say that all soldiers are baby murderers unless they have witnessed it themselves but then we can't judge the majority on a few bad seeds. Anyway best of me not to continue with this discussion i guess we agree to disagree, because i get the feeling neither of us will change our perception of the war.

In terms of are solider doing good?....... The occupation itself is doing Afghanistan a favour as a whole, i cannot comment fully on the Taliban and its rule, there is array of mixed views some say they ruled perfectly whilst others said there rule is a dictatorship with the Taliban getting richer whilst the poor get poorer. From my reading though I am not complete and no its not all western books putting the Taliban under bad light..... i cannot distinguish fully whether there rule was one of good or bad, in a a years time i might be able to comment extensively inshallah. But from the stories I've heard from my father colleagues and my friends there seems to be a perception the Taliban rule was barbaric at times.

Anyway like i said we agree to disagree

[S<Chowdhury]

:sl:

Just my opinion. I believe the main reason is because there is an economic war between China and the USA. To keep China from getting the mechanical means to engage in a physical war with the USA, China needs oil. China has already signed some of the largest oil leases in history with Iran and Iraq. To get the oil to China, they will need to make pipelines and railroads through Afghanistan. The USA does not want China to have access to the oil. The easiest way is to either assist the aid of the Taliban to keep China out, like they did for 10 years with Russia. However, it looks like Afghanistan has also entered into a deal to sell mineral rights to China. So the next lowest cost method will be to keep American troops in Afghanistan keeping the country in turmoil and making it impossible for China to build the pipelines and railroads.

The next big lie to young Americans of military age will be to tell them we are in Afghanistan to protect Afghanistan from China.

I wouldn't rule it out

[aadil77]

In terms of are solider doing good?....... The occupation itself is doing Afghanistan a favour as a whole, i cannot comment fully on the Taliban and its rule, there is array of mixed views some say they ruled perfectly whilst others said there rule is a dictatorship with the Taliban getting richer whilst the poor get poorer. From my reading though I am not complete and no its not all western books putting the Taliban under bad light..... i cannot distinguish fully whether there rule was one of good or bad, in a a years time i might be able to comment extensively inshallah. But from the stories I've heard from my father colleagues and my friends there seems to be a perception the Taliban rule was barbaric at times.

Anyway like i said we agree to disagree

Bruv do you agree with the islamic view that anyone invading muslim lands with armed forces is to be fought?

Please tell me how they're doing afghanistan a favour overall, they're imposing there own rules on the people, democracy and the lot is not allowed in islam. With so many killed and so many lives ruined as a result of their invasion do you think its better overall?

[cat eyes]

Obviously i can't speak of the war since I'm not on the front line, but neither are those who say that all soldiers are baby murderers unless they have witnessed it themselves but then we can't judge the majority on a few bad seeds.

and how on earth do you know that this young girl (im assuming shes young) is not supporting a bad seed??? tell me is it worth it to even bother supporting these non muslim soldiers and not really knowing what there true intent is? its playing with fire now thats all it is! like putting a sword in a childs hand.

[S<Chowdhury]

Bruv do you agree with the islamic view that anyone invading muslim lands with armed forces is to be fought?

Please tell me how they're doing afghanistan a favour overall, they're imposing there own rules on the people, democracy and the lot is not allowed in islam. With so many killed and so many lives ruined as a result of their invasion do you think its better overall?

Okey we seem to be going off topic in terms of is the occupation in Afghanistan/Iraq right? and really if you want to discuss this i think you should create a different thread in another section but anyway if you really want to discuss it with me brother PM me yeah.

:sl: Brother

[S<Chowdhury]

and how on earth do you know that this young girl (im assuming shes young) is not supporting a bad seed??? tell me is it worth it to even bother supporting these non muslim soldiers and not really knowing what there true intent is? its playing with fire now thats all it is! like putting a sword in a childs hand.

Thats the thing we don't know sister, and how do you know these soldiers are baby murderer? well to a certain extent i agree its playing with fire, I've heard a few occasion where I been told by others who served in Iraq that one witnessed US soldiers with heavy metal music going around in there military vehicle on patrol and without going into how the situation arises but they end up shooting an innocent victim, so yeah i understand your view point, many solider seem to think its all a game.

Why shouldn't we support them, who are we to judge firstly? who knows what these soldiers have done or not done in the war, should we immediately assume they are bad?

[AnonymousPoster]

Not the OP

Sorry but the view that every soldier is inherently evil and out to kill all muslims women men and babies is borderline ignorance. I mean no insult by it but it is such.
I say this because my own cousin who joined the military to fight in Kosovo and Bosnia didnt finish he duty in time to not be deployed to Iraq. He was there for a 6 month tour of duty. As such, he came home and told us about how he and many of his fellow soldiers were frustrated with the war, did not believe in it and wanted out. They did not want to be a part of the killing that was going on nor any of the violence.


Now this isnt to generalize. Of course there are evil ignorant people in the army but assuming that they are ALL evil is wrong and ignorant.
For example: Do you like being put into the category of a terrorist who likes killing people who are not muslim, just because you are muslim?
Im assuming you would not like that at all and do not like the way many people view all muslims as terrorists. Now put yourself in the shoes of a soldier who is not an islamophobe, does not want to be in the war, but is deployed there nonetheless.

[AlbanianMuslim]

I dont know why that came out as anon but anyway.

Another point, we cannot be close minded about stuff. I absolutely hate the fact that the U.S. is any of these places. I wish they would get out. I pray for the people there, but we cannot seriously cannot generalize and call all soldiers in the army baby killers.
There are many soldiers in the U.S. army who are muslims. Look it up.

[IslamicRevival]

It depends on WHO you support.

I support Hamas for standing up and not allowing the Devilzionists from totally wiping Palestinians off the map

I support the Iraqi, Afghanistan, Pakistani and Yemeni Mujahideen who are under attack on a daily basis by the Kafir (Americans) and US agents (Saudis)

I will never ever support a kafir army as all they seem to do is ATTACK US. I do not believe it is right to join an army other then the army of the Muhahideen

[Ummu Sufyaan]

:sl:

Hi all i have a friend who is a revert. she has been doing the adopt a soldier program for years in which you "adopt" a soldier based in various locations who rarely if ever receives mail from friends or family. she has been supporting two soldiers. they never talk about war or military stuff or religion (except for when she told them that she converted-which they both supported her) but talk about stuff in the u.s. like news about random things and just chit chat about life in general and their families. is it wrong for her to write to them?

im not too sure, thh, i think its best to see an imam about this. i think its also important to note that she is a revert and so she still maybe ignorant about such rulings as well as nationalism, etc may still be in her mindset from the time she was a non-Muslim. so, be patient with her, but at the same time advise her and see a local imam.

[Blackpool]

Personally i think its wrong to support troops, and i guess many people agree. i assume your friend is a muslim again? well think about it like this, those 2 soldiers whom she took care of, will kill innocent muslim brothers and sisters. which is more important, your religion and everyone who follows it or this programm and everything else in the world.

dont support anyone who harms muslims and who has no respect for our religion

Most people DO support the troops. There are always innocent casualties in war but the Taliban have killed and still kill innocent people deliberately, so how is it that you all support the Taliban? :hmm:

Personally, I think tackling the extremists in Afghanistan has prevented the same from happening on our streets. I support our troops whether I'm with or against the war. Iraq I was against, Afghanistan I'm with.
Rather have it in Afghanistan than in Britain.

[Ummu Sufyaan]

Personally, I think tackling the extremists in Afghanistan has prevented the same from happening on our streets.

how so?

.......

[Grofica]

there is a saying

support the soldiers not the war.

there is nothing wrong with reaching out in a humain way to show someone caring... most of the people who are in the service dont care what they are TOLD to do. and they dont harm muslims...

dont believe all the uhmmm stuff you see on the news. and i have never seen a solider harm a muslim.

However, once a soldier has completed basic training, it is virtually impossible to get out of the service before completion of the enlistment agreement which is normally from 2 to 4 years depending on the branch of service.

that is not true there is an ENTIRE book on how to get out of the army its kept in every onpost library. it even tells you the criteria for getting out and if its honerable or not and what benifits you keep if you chapter out that way

The next strongest incentive is some young people who have gotten arrested several times for minor offenses can often have their record wiped clean by serving in the military.

that is a myth... serving in the military does not delete any record.

[Grofica]

YES it is wrong and she should stop it immediately everybody knows even young kids know that they kill muslims... she should stop it at once and sincerely repent for it before Allah takes her soul and she will be held accounted for the lives that were lost

I have been in iraq 5 years and never seen that happen.

[innocent]

I dont know if its right or wrong from the perspective that you are talking about but she is a female keeping in contact with non-mahram males(I'm assuming they are male soldiers) it's not right and I would say its haram to do that. Maybe she should try and find female soldiers to contact.

[cat eyes]

I have been in iraq 5 years and never seen that happen.

the point which im making here is that not whether you or me have seen anything. the point that is those soldiers are invading muslim land and the majority of those soldiers who they are fighting ALONG SIDE are terrorizing my brothers and sisters and i cannot believe how u or any other muslim could support this??? this is making my BLOOD BOIL

I wont discuss it any further.

[AlbanianMuslim]

Woah, you need to take a step back sister and actually open your eyes to what we ARE saying.
We are not supporting the troops being in muslim lands. Nor are supporting the fact that they often kill or terrorize. NO ONE is denying that soldiers do or do not do those things. There are the evil ones and there are the good ones.
We are only saying you cannot and should not group ALL the soldiers into one category: terrorists.
That is the SAME thing as the westerners grouping all of us muslims as: terrorists.
Just because the actions of some does not mean all are the same.
Tolerance sister, tolerance and understanding. You have to look at the whole picture, not just a small portion of it. We cannot be as close minded as the westerners who label all of us the same thing just because the actions of a few.

As for those who support the Taliban. I shake my head in shame at that. The Taliban treated the muslim people of Afghanistan terribly. It is my firm opinion that the taliban used the Kuran and the name of Islam for their own self gain and political aspirations. The atrocities committed by the taliban were sickening. I dont support the Taliban or the U.S. soldiers who have committed crimes. To me they are one in the same.

Who do i support? I support the muslims who are actually fighting for their land, like in Palestine. I support the muslims who are fighting to protect themselves and their families. I support the soldiers who do not want to be in this war and want to go home to their families and want no part in the bloodshed. I support the people who want peace. I understand why you hate, why you are angry and why your blood boils, but you take a step too far if you group them all in one category.
Thats all i have to say on the issue. I see that most of what i say and the others say fall on deaf ears. People who close their eyes and minds off to everything other than their own opinions are a lost cause.

[cat eyes]

Woah, you need to take a step back sister and actually open your eyes to what we ARE saying.
We are not supporting the troops being in muslim lands. Nor are supporting the fact that they often kill or terrorize. NO ONE is denying that soldiers do or do not do those things. There are the evil ones and there are the good ones.
We are only saying you cannot and should not group ALL the soldiers into one category: terrorists.
That is the SAME thing as the westerners grouping all of us muslims as: terrorists.
Just because the actions of some does not mean all are the same.
Tolerance sister, tolerance and understanding. You have to look at the whole picture, not just a small portion of it. We cannot be as close minded as the westerners who label all of us the same thing just because the actions of a few.

As for those who support the Taliban. I shake my head in shame at that. The Taliban treated the muslim people of Afghanistan terribly. It is my firm opinion that the taliban used the Kuran and the name of Islam for their own self gain and political aspirations. The atrocities committed by the taliban were sickening. I dont support the Taliban or the U.S. soldiers who have committed crimes. To me they are one in the same.

Who do i support? I support the muslims who are actually fighting for their land, like in Palestine. I support the muslims who are fighting to protect themselves and their families. I support the soldiers who do not want to be in this war and want to go home to their families and want no part in the bloodshed. I support the people who want peace. I understand why you hate, why you are angry and why your blood boils, but you take a step too far if you group them all in one category.
Thats all i have to say on the issue. I see that most of what i say and the others say fall on deaf ears. People who close their eyes and minds off to everything other than their own opinions are a lost cause.

lol taliban! every muslim country was fine before america stepped foot in it now they are wanting to put there big foots in pakistan and destroy it. pakistan was a beautiful peaceful land now look at the state of it. its all america america AMERICA why dont you open your eyes sister?

look i never said that all soldiers are the same either if you read my previous post i said that its the fact they are fighting along side the bad eggs.

and really she should ask imaam about this after all we are throwing fatwas at her.

[cat eyes]

Before US invasion of Afghanistan, Pakistan never saw a single case of suicide bombing in its soil in the history of Pakistan. After US invasion of Afghanistan, we are seeing suicide bombings in Pakistan almost everyday. US is responsible for all this bloodshed of innocent men, women, and children

[Muhammad]

:sl:

I think this thread is getting side-tracked and therefore it would be best to close. Regarding the original question - before even getting to the topic of 'supporting troops', the sister should be aware of the Islamic guidelines on the interaction between men and women. Some advice has been mentioned in this thread: http://www.islamicboard.com/manners-...uidelines.html

Perhaps you can encourage her to support orphans instead, or suffering individuals, as this can earn huge rewards:

Sahl bin Sa`d (may Allah be pleased with him) reported: The Messenger of Allah (Peace be upon him) said, "I will be like this in Jannah with the person who takes care of an orphan." The Messenger of Allah (PBUH) then raised his forefinger and the middle finger by way of illustration.

If you are looking for a fatwa, then it would be best to consult an Imam or scholar.

Thread closed.