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cat eyes
03-07-2010, 07:49 PM
:sl:

just want to know whether its haraam or halal and what is the guidelines if the aunty is only a couple of years older then her nephew.

should they be alone together? would the nephew be classed has her mahram?

I Once heard that a uncle married his niece

Should she wear the niqaab when coming in front of her nephew

JAZAKAllah brother and sisters
:wa:
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KittenLover
03-07-2010, 07:53 PM
The nephew is classed as a mehram due to the following verse

"Forbidden to you (for marriage) are: your mothers, your daughters, your sisters, your fathers sisters, your mothers sisters, your brothers daughters, your sisters daughters, your foster mother who gave you suck, your foster milk suckling sisters, your wives mothers, your step daughters under your guardianship, born of your wives to whom you have gone in - but there is no sin on you if you have not gone in them (to marry their daughters), - the wives of your sons who (spring) from your own loins, and two sisters in wedlock at the same time, except for what has already passed; verily, Allah is OftForgiving, Most Merciful" Surah nisa verse 23

The above verse tells us that it is never allowe for a nephew to marry his aunty so therefore he becomes her mehram. Since he is her merham all the rules that apply to non mehram do not apply to him so for example he can accompany her to hajj.
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cat eyes
03-07-2010, 07:55 PM
yeah i am aware of that verse but i want to know whether they should be alone together if she is forbidden for him
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KittenLover
03-07-2010, 07:57 PM
Originally Posted by cat eyes
yeah i am aware of that verse but i want to know whether they should be alone together if she is forbidden for him
I have the answer for you from a scholar :)

what people can a muslimah take her hijab off from?


Praise be to Allaah.

It is permissible for a woman to take off her hijaab in front of her mahrams.

A woman’s mahram is a person whom she is never permitted to marry because of their close blood relationship (such as her father, grandfather, great-grandfather, etc., and her son, grandson, great-grandson, etc., her paternal and maternal uncles, her brother, brother’s son and sister’s son), or because because of radaa’ah or breastfeeding (such as the brother and husband of the woman who breastfed her), or because they are related by marriage (such as the mother’s husband, the husband’s father, grandfather, etc., and the husband’s son, grandson, etc.). More details on this subject are given below:

Mahrams by ties of blood

These are the ones mentioned in Soorat al-Noor, where Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

“… and not to reveal their adornment except to their husbands, or their fathers, or their husband’s fathers, or their sons, or their husband’s sons, or their brothers or their brother’s sons, or their sister’s sons…” [al-Noor 24:31].

The mufassireen said: the woman’s male mahrams by ties of blood, as stated clearly in this aayah or inferred by it are as follows:

1- the woman’s forefathers, no matter how far back the line of ascent goes through her father and her mother, such as her father’s forefathers and her mother’s forefathers. As for her husband’s forefathers, they are her mahrams by marriage, as we shall see below.

2- her sons, which includes her children’s children, no matter how the line of descent goes and whether they are descended from males or females, such as her sons’ sons and her daughters’ sons. As for her “husband’s sons” mentioned in the aayah, these are the husband’s sons from other wives, and these are her mahrams by marriage, not by blood, as we shall see below.

3- her brothers, whether they are her brothers through both the mother and father, or through the father only or the mother only.

4- the children of her siblings, whether they are descended through the males or females, such as the sons of her sister’s daughters.

5- paternal uncles and maternal uncles. They are mahrams by blood even though they are not mentioned in the aayah, because they are like parents and are regarded by people as having the same status as parents, and a paternal uncle may be called a father. Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

“Or were you witnesses when death approached Ya‘qoob (Jacob)? When he said unto his sons, “What will you worship after me?” They said, “We shall worship your Ilaah (God — Allaah) the Ilaah (God) of your fathers, Ibraaheem (Abraham), Ismaa’eel (Ishmael), Ishaaq (Isaac)…” [al-Baqarah 2:133]. Ismaa’eel was the paternal uncle of the sons of Ya’qoob.

(Tafseer al-Raazi, 23/206; Tafseer al-Qurtubi, 12/232, 233; Tafseer al-Aaloosi, 18/143; Fath al-Bayaan fi Maqaasid al-Qur’aan by Siddeeq Hasan Khaan, 6/352)

Mahrams by radaa’ah (breastfeeding)

A woman may have mahrams through radaa’ah. It says in Tafseer al-Aloosi:

“The relationship of mahram which permits a woman to show her adornments may be through radaa’ah as well as through blood ties, so it is permissible for a woman to show her adornments to those who are her fathers or sons through radaa’ah.” (Tafseer al-Aaloosi. 18/143) The relationship of mahram by radaa’ah is like the relationship of mahram by blood – it means that marriage is forever forbidden by virtue of that relationship of mahram. This was the view stated by Imaam al-Jassaas when he commented on this aayah. He said (may Allaah have mercy on him): “When Allaah mentioned the fathers and that their marriage to these women is forbidden forever, this indicates that the same prohibition applies in other relationships of mahram, such as the mother of the woman and those who are mahrams by radaa’ah, etc.” (Ahkaam al-Qur’aan by al-Jassaas, 3/317).

The same things are made haraam by radaa’ah as by ties of blood.

It also says in the Sunnah: “The same things are made haraam by radaa’ah as by ties of blood.” This means that the people who are mahram to a woman because of blood ties are also mahram because of radaa’ah. It was reported in Saheeh Muslim that ‘Aa’ishah Umm al-Mu’mineen (may Allaah be pleased with her) said that Aflah the brother of Abu Qu’ays came and asked permission to see her. He was her uncle through radaa’ah. This was after hijaab had been revealed, so she refused to give him permission. When the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) came, she told him about what she had done and he told her to give him permission. (Saheeh al-Bukhaari bi Sharh al-‘Asqallaani, 9/150). This hadeeth was also narrated by Imaam Muslim, where the wording is: from ‘Urwah from ‘Aa’ishah, who told him that her uncle by radaa’ah, who was called Aflah, asked permission to see her and she did not let him. She told the Messenger (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) and he said to her, “Do not observe hijaab in front of him, because the same relationships of mahram are created by radaa’ah as by blood ties.” (Saheeh Muslim bi Sharh al-Nawawi, 10/22)

A woman’s mahrams through radaa’ah are the same as her mahrams through blood ties

In accordance with the Qur’aan and Sunnah, the fuqahaa’ have stated that a woman’s mahrams through radaa’ah are the same as her mahrams through blood ties. It is permissible for her to display her adornments before her mahrams by radaa’ah just as it is permissible for her to display her adornments before her mahrams by blood ties. It is permissible for her mahrams by radaa’ah to see whatever of her body it is permissible for her mahrams by blood ties to see.

Mahrams by marriage

A woman’s mahrams by marriage are those whom it is forever forbidden to marry, such as the father’s wife, the son’s wife or the wife’s mother. (Sharh al-Muntahaa, 3/7).

The mahram by marriage of the father’s wife is his son from another wife, for the wife of the son it is his father, and for the mother of the wife it is the husband. Allaah says in Soorat al-Noor (interpretation of the meaning):

“… and not to reveal their adornment except to their husbands, or their fathers, or their husband’s fathers, or their sons, or their husband’s sons…” [al-Noor 24:31]. Their husband’s fathers and their husband’s sons are mahrams of the woman by marriage. Allaah mentioned them along with their (the women’s own) fathers and sons, and made them all the same in the sense that women may display their adornments in front of them. (Al-Mughni, 6/555)


Islam Q&A
Sheikh Muhammed Salih Al-Munajjid
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cat eyes
03-07-2010, 08:02 PM
I Didnt find the answer to my question in there. sorry.

want to know should they be alone together if the age gap is not that much PLEASE

maybe some one else can help me?
Reply

KittenLover
03-07-2010, 08:04 PM
Originally Posted by cat eyes
:sl:

just want to know whether its haraam or halal and what is the guidelines if the aunty is only a couple of years older then her nephew.

should they be alone together? would the nephew be classed has her mahram?

I Once heard that a uncle married his niece

Should she wear the niqaab when coming in front of her nephew

JAZAKAllah brother and sisters
:wa:
if a uncle married his brothers daughter then it's a haraam marriage :hmm:
Reply

KittenLover
03-07-2010, 08:05 PM
Originally Posted by cat eyes
I Didnt find the answer to my question in there. sorry.

want to know should they be alone together if the age gap is not that much PLEASE

maybe some one else can help me?
well since he is her mehram, all the rulings of mehram apply to him such as being able to see her without hijaab and so on.

inlcuded in that is not requiring a third person present.
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cat eyes
03-07-2010, 08:10 PM
Originally Posted by KittenLover
well since he is her mehram, all the rulings of mehram apply to him such as being able to see her without hijaab and so on.

inlcuded in that is not requiring a third person present.
i need fatwa evidence for that whether a third person should be there or not.

The shayytan comes in between a woman and a man whom are alone so surely those two people would also come into that catagory or what

im confused.
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KittenLover
03-07-2010, 08:13 PM
Originally Posted by cat eyes
i need fatwa evidence for that whether a third person should be there or not.

The shayytan comes in between a woman and a man whom are alone so surely those two people would also come into that catagory or what

im confused.
well he is allowed to travel with her to hajj and I'm sure there would be plenty of times he will be alone with her while they are travelling together. read the below question/answer.


Can she travel without a mahram to visit her parents?
I am in XXX since 3 years and have not been to Pakistan since then.I have two kids and my parents have not met them. They really miss my kids a lot.My husband is a doctor too and he can't get a leaf from his job.I want to know that in this condition can I travel without a mehram? It is just for the sake of making my parents happy.


Praise be to Allaah.

It is not permissible for a woman to travel without a mahram, whether she is travelling to do an act of worship such as Hajj or visiting her parents in order to honour them and be kind to them, or travelling for permissible purposes such as going on vacation etc. The evidence for that is as follows:

1 – The general meaning of the words of the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him): “No woman should travel unless she has a mahram with her, and no man should enter upon her unless her mahram is present.” A man stood up and said: “O Messenger of Allaah, my wife has gone out for Hajj, and I want to go out with such and such an army.” He said: “Go and do Hajj with your wife.” Narrated by al-Bukhaari, 1862.

Muslim (1339) narrated from Abu Hurayrah that the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “It is not permissible for a woman who believes in Allaah and the Last Day to travel one day’s distance without a mahram.” There are many ahaadeeth which forbid a woman to travel without a mahram; they are general in meaning and apply to all kinds of travel.

2 – It is well known that travel involves exhaustion and difficulty. Because of her weakness, a woman needs someone to help her and look after her. Things may happen to her that make her panic and act out of character if there is no mahram present. This is well known nowadays when there are so many car accidents and other kinds of transportation accidents. Moreover, travelling alone exposes her to temptation, especially since there is so much corruption. Men who do not fear Allaah may sit neat her, and haraam actions may become attractive to her. Similarly if she is travelling alone in her car, she is exposed to other kinds of danger, if the car breaks down or if evil people conspire against her, and so on. It is perfectly wise that she should be accompanied by a mahram when travelling, because the purpose behind the mahram’s presence is to protect her and look after her, especially if something bad happens. Travel exposes her to such things regardless of how long it takes.

Al-Nawawi (may Allaah have mercy on him) said: The point is that whatever is known as travelling, women are forbidden to travel without a husband or a mahram.

The Standing Committee was asked whether it is permissible for a woman to travel to Hajj without a mahram. They replied as follows: It is not permissible for a woman to travel for Hajj or for any other purpose without a mahram.

Fataawa al-Lajnah al-Daa’imah, 11/97

Thus it should be clear that Islam is the foremost system when it comes to protecting women and taking care of them, and respecting and honoring them, and regarding them as precious jewels that must be guarded against evil.
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KittenLover
03-07-2010, 08:19 PM
Originally Posted by cat eyes
i need fatwa evidence for that whether a third person should be there or not.

The shayytan comes in between a woman and a man whom are alone so surely those two people would also come into that catagory or what

im confused.
I have found your answer from the scholar :)






A woman’s maternal uncle is a mahram and it is permissible for him to be alone with her
What is the ruling on a wife’s maternal uncle visiting her when she is alone during the time her husband is working? This situation has come up more than once.


Praise be to Allaah.

The maternal uncle is a mahram for all the daughters and granddaughters of his sisters, because Allaah says in Soorat al-Nisa’, defining women who are forbidden in marriage:

“Forbidden to you (for marriage) are: your mothers, your daughters, your sisters, your father’s sisters, your mother’s sisters, your brother’s daughters, your sister’s daughters”

[al-Nisa’ 4:23]

So there is nothing wrong with his visiting his sister’s daughter and being alone with her or travelling with her, so long as there are no reasons for suspicion, such as if he is an evildoer and cannot be trusted with his sister’s daughter. If there are any grounds for suspicion, then he is not allowed to be alone with or visit her when her husband is not present.

See also question no. 21953.

Some of the salaf – such as ‘Ikrimah and al-Sha’bi – were of the view that even though it is not permissible for a paternal uncle or a maternal uncle to marry their sister’s daughter or brother’s daughter, it is nevertheless not permissible for her to show her adornment in front of them, and she must observe hijab with them. They quoted two things as evidence for that:

1 – The maternal uncle and paternal uncle are not mentioned in the verse of Soorat al-Ahzaab which says that it is permissible for a woman to show her adornment in front of her mahrams. Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):

“It is no sin on them (the Prophet’s wives, if they appear unveiled) before their fathers, or their sons, or their brothers, or their brother’s sons, or the sons of their sisters, or their own (believing) women, or their (female) slaves. And (O ladies), fear (keep your duty to) Allaah. Verily, Allaah is Ever All‑Witness over everything”

[al-Ahzaab 33:55]

Here Allaah does not mention the paternal uncle or maternal uncle.

2 – They said: and because a maternal uncle or paternal uncle may describe the woman to his sons.

But the majority of scholars are of the view that the maternal uncle and paternal uncle are among the mahrams in front of whom it is permissible for a woman to show her adornment. In response to the comment that the maternal uncle and paternal uncle are not mentioned in the verse, they said:

They are not mentioned because their status is like that of the parents, hence Allaah calls the paternal uncle a father, in the verse in which He says (interpretation of the meaning):

“Or were you witnesses when death approached Ya’qoob (Jacob)? When he said unto his sons, ‘What will you worship after me?’ They said, ‘We shall worship your Ilaah (God — Allaah) the Ilaah (God) of your fathers, Ibraaheem (Abraham), Ismaa’eel (Ishmael), Ishaaq (Isaac), One Ilaah (God), and to Him we submit (in Islam)’”

[al-Baqarah 2:13]

Ismaa’eel was the paternal uncle of Ya’qoob (peace be upon them both)

2 – They are not mentioned because it is sufficient to mention the brother’s son and sister’s son, so it is more appropriate that this ruling should apply to the paternal uncle and maternal uncle.

Al-Sa’di (may Allaah have mercy on him) said (p. 788):

“It is no sin on them” means if they do not observe hijab in front of them. No mention is made here of paternal uncles and maternal uncles because if women do not have to observe hijab in front of those whose paternal and maternal aunts they are, the sons of their brothers and sisters, even though they (these women) are of a higher status than them, then it is more likely that they do not have to observe hijab in front of their paternal and maternal uncles. End quote.

With regard to the reason given, that the maternal uncle or paternal uncle may describe the woman to their sons, the majority of scholars responded to this by noting that this is a weak argument, because if this is accepted, it would imply that it is not permissible for a woman to uncover her adornment in front of any woman, because she may describe her to her sons!

One thing which indicates that the view of the majority – that it is permissible for a woman to show her adornment to her paternal and maternal uncles, and that it is permissible for them to enter upon her and be alone with her – is correct is the report narrated by al-Bukhaari (4796) and Muslim (1445) from ‘Aa’ishah (may Allaah be pleased with her), who said: Aflah, the brother of Abu’l-Qu’aysh, asked for permission to enter upon me after the (verse of) hijab had been revealed, and I said, I will not let him in until I ask the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) for permission, because his brother Abu’l-Qu’ays is not the one who breastfed me, rather the wife of Abu’l-Qu’ays breastfed me. The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) entered upon me and I said to him: “O Messenger of Allaah, Aflah, the brother of Abu’l-Qu’aysh, asked for permission to enter upon me, but I refused to let him in until I asked your permission. The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “What kept you from letting him in? He is your paternal uncle!” I said, “O Messenger of Allaah, the man is not the one who breastfed me, rather the wife of Abu’l-Qu’ays breastfed me.” He said: “Let him in, for he is your paternal uncle, may your right hand be rubbed with dust.” So if a paternal uncle through breastfeeding is allowed to enter upon a woman and be alone with her, then it is more appropriate that a paternal uncle through blood ties be allowed to do so, and the same applies to the maternal uncle.
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cat eyes
03-07-2010, 08:20 PM
and what about in her home alone or bedroom for that matter? dose it mean he can be alone with her there. im not getting the answers that i want here so some one please find this out for me.

:(
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KittenLover
03-07-2010, 08:21 PM
Originally Posted by cat eyes
and what about in her home alone or bedroom for that matter? dose it mean he can be alone with her there. im not getting the answers that i want here so some one please find this out for me.

:(
A woman’s maternal uncle is a mahram and it is permissible for him to be alone with her
What is the ruling on a wife’s maternal uncle visiting her when she is alone during the time her husband is working? This situation has come up more than once.


Praise be to Allaah.

The maternal uncle is a mahram for all the daughters and granddaughters of his sisters, because Allaah says in Soorat al-Nisa’, defining women who are forbidden in marriage:

“Forbidden to you (for marriage) are: your mothers, your daughters, your sisters, your father’s sisters, your mother’s sisters, your brother’s daughters, your sister’s daughters”

[al-Nisa’ 4:23]

So there is nothing wrong with his visiting his sister’s daughter and being alone with her or travelling with her, so long as there are no reasons for suspicion, such as if he is an evildoer and cannot be trusted with his sister’s daughter. If there are any grounds for suspicion, then he is not allowed to be alone with or visit her when her husband is not present.
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cat eyes
03-07-2010, 08:29 PM
what if he thinks shes beautiful and stuff like this... come on it cant be allowed the age gap is not that much in difference

Why am i hearing from other scholars they should not be alone!!!

how can u know a person has evil intention anyway? so shouldnt it be avoided
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KittenLover
03-07-2010, 08:36 PM
Originally Posted by cat eyes
what if he thinks shes beautiful and stuff like this... come on it cant be allowed the age gap is not that much in difference

Why am i hearing from other scholars they should not be alone!!!

how can u know a person has evil intention anyway? so shouldnt it be avoided
It's like thinking your mother is beautifull or dad is beautifull it just doesn't happen in the lustful way you're thinking.

these things are from the fitrah and only get transgressed when there is a sickness in the heart and corruption in the heart.

what scholars are you hearing this from and what is their proof for saying this?

how can u know a person has evil intention anyway? so shouldnt it be avoided
Allah has made it halal so we can't make something haraam which allah has made halal.

he has said it's forbidden to marry them for all your life so therefore they become your mehram just like your father is a mehram, just like your brother is a mehram.

It's exactly the same, what if your brother has an evil intention in anyway?

what if your father has an evil intention in anyway?

are you going to cut them relations also? :hmm:

hmm
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-Elle-
03-07-2010, 08:40 PM
Originally Posted by KittenLover
The nephew is classed as a mehram due to the following verse

"Forbidden to you (for marriage) are: your mothers, your daughters, your sisters, your fathers sisters, your mothers sisters, your brothers daughters, your sisters daughters, your foster mother who gave you suck, your foster milk suckling sisters, your wives mothers, your step daughters under your guardianship, born of your wives to whom you have gone in - but there is no sin on you if you have not gone in them (to marry their daughters), - the wives of your sons who (spring) from your own loins, and two sisters in wedlock at the same time, except for what has already passed; verily, Allah is OftForgiving, Most Merciful" Surah nisa verse 23

The above verse tells us that it is never allowe for a nephew to marry his aunty so therefore he becomes her mehram. Since he is her merham all the rules that apply to non mehram do not apply to him so for example he can accompany her to hajj.

wow sister, Jazak'Allah kheir for your numerous responses which were all very, very helpful.


To the O.P


I believe she has provided enough information to answer your question,but nevertheless,

Put simply;


A woman or man cannot marry their uncle/aunt. it is Haraam.

From what I know,An aunt is allowed to be around her nephew, even if there is a year age difference; age difference doesn't matter, it is the fact that their are related that makes it halal for her to be around him. She can never be with him, and he can never be with her, so why should age difference matter here?

Nevertheless, if there is a risk of something happening, they should know that their relationship would be haram, and if they fear not being strong enough, then in my opinion, they should be kept apart.

I don't understand how they would want to be with each other though, if they know that it is forbidden in Islam. Allahu 3alam.

best of luck.
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cat eyes
03-07-2010, 08:40 PM
some women even cover themselves in front of there brothers... why not?? incest happens dosen it
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Nσσя'υℓ Jαииαн
03-07-2010, 08:44 PM
Sis. Allah has said they are your mahram.

As for the idea with incest, yes it does exist. You do have cases where the father crosses the limits, that doesnt mean she's gunna cover her hair or face in front of him?

You should still maintain a level of decency even with your mahrams, but that doesn't mean you go and wear a hijab in front of them? Islam isnt meant to be difficult. Imagine wearing it with your family everyday and you have to wear it outside anyway. Why make it so hard?
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KittenLover
03-07-2010, 08:47 PM
Originally Posted by cat eyes
some women even cover themselves in front of there brothers... why not?? incest happens dosen it
in that case you might aswell cut off relations with ur fathers/brothers out of fear of incest.

do you see my point? incest is a sin/transgression, and the people who do such a sin will be held to account for it.

But Allah hasn't made it haraam for you to mix with your father or brother out of worry they may commit incest and the same goes for your uncle.

becuase men don't find such woman attractive unless there is a corruption in the heart and pervertedness.
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piXie
03-07-2010, 08:49 PM
Originally Posted by cat eyes
what if he thinks shes beautiful and stuff like this... come on it cant be allowed the age gap is not that much in difference

Why am i hearing from other scholars they should not be alone!!!

how can u know a person has evil intention anyway? so shouldnt it be avoided
:salamext:

If there is fear of fitna, then it is not allowed for them to be alone.

One is a general ruling e.g. They are allowed to be alone because he is her mahram (forbidden for marriage forever)

The other is a specific ruling e.g. In this specific situation, they are not allowed to be alone, even though he is her mahram, because there is fear of fitna.

Further explained in ruling below (see highlighted part)

What is the ruling on a wife’s maternal uncle visiting her when she is alone during the time her husband is working? This situation has come up more than once.

Praise be to Allaah.

The maternal uncle is a mahram for all the daughters and granddaughters of his sisters, because Allaah says in Soorat al-Nisa’, defining women who are forbidden in marriage:

“Forbidden to you (for marriage) are: your mothers, your daughters, your sisters, your father’s sisters, your mother’s sisters, your brother’s daughters, your sister’s daughters”

[al-Nisa’ 4:23]

So there is nothing wrong with his visiting his sister’s daughter and being alone with her or travelling with her, so long as there are no reasons for suspicion, such as if he is an evildoer and cannot be trusted with his sister’s daughter. If there are any grounds for suspicion, then he is not allowed to be alone with or visit her when her husband is not present.
can read the rest here

I hope that helped
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cat eyes
03-07-2010, 08:53 PM
Originally Posted by houda~
wow sister, Jazak'Allah kheir for your numerous responses which were all very, very helpful.


To the O.P


I believe she has provided enough information to answer your question,but nevertheless,

Put simply;


A woman or man cannot marry their uncle/aunt. it is Haraam.

From what I know,An aunt is allowed to be around her nephew, even if there is a year age difference; age difference doesn't matter, it is the fact that their are related that makes it halal for her to be around him. She can never be with him, and he can never be with her, so why should age difference matter here?

Nevertheless, if there is a risk of something happening, they should know that their relationship would be haram, and if they fear not being strong enough, then in my opinion, they should be kept apart.

I don't understand how they would want to be with each other though, if they know that it is forbidden in Islam. Allahu 3alam.

best of luck.
jazaKAllah sister but my point is that what if the guy has an attraction towards his niece or nephew towards his aunty.

All im getting is a one sided answer when i asked for the other answer to this.

Its not so difficult is it but u are the first who said to best that they should be kept apart if they fear something might happen and your the only one who gave me an answer that actually makes more sense.

i raised the question because i once heard in a lecture that if they are of the same age nearly it should be avoided for them to be alone or she should wear niqaab.
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Nσσя'υℓ Jαииαн
03-07-2010, 08:57 PM
^^so did sis pixie.
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cat eyes
03-07-2010, 09:00 PM
Originally Posted by Light of Heaven
Sis. Allah has said they are your mahram.

As for the idea with incest, yes it does exist. You do have cases where the father crosses the limits, that doesnt mean she's gunna cover her hair or face in front of him?

You should still maintain a level of decency even with your mahrams, but that doesn't mean you go and wear a hijab in front of them? Islam isnt meant to be difficult. Imagine wearing it with your family everyday and you have to wear it outside anyway. Why make it so hard?
Of course not, your not always going to cover but some women do because they fear Allah that much so what wrong in that.

better to be safe then sorry as the saying goes.

I dont myself but i see the sense in doing so...

Originally Posted by KittenLover
in that case you might aswell cut off relations with ur fathers/brothers out of fear of incest.

do you see my point? incest is a sin/transgression, and the people who do such a sin will be held to account for it.

But Allah hasn't made it haraam for you to mix with your father or brother out of worry they may commit incest and the same goes for your uncle.

becuase men don't find such woman attractive unless there is a corruption in the heart and pervertedness.
What have i been saying in my replies all along? what if there IS A CORRUPTION in the heart of that person

Allah would not expect us to sit alone with them would he and put ourselves in danger just because something is made halal dose not mean you can take advantage of it
:wa:
Reply

cat eyes
03-07-2010, 09:01 PM
Originally Posted by piXie
:salamext:

If there is fear of fitna, then it is not allowed for them to be alone.

One is a general ruling e.g. They are allowed to be alone because he is her mahram (forbidden for marriage forever)

The other is a specific ruling e.g. In this specific situation, they are not allowed to be alone, even though he is her mahram, because there is fear of fitna.

Further explained in ruling below (see highlighted part)



can read the rest here

I hope that helped
jazakAllah sister :)

Your reply was most helpful
Reply

KittenLover
03-07-2010, 09:09 PM
Originally Posted by cat eyes
Of course not, your not always going to cover but some women do because they fear Allah that much so what wrong in that.

better to be safe then sorry as the saying goes.

I dont myself but i see the sense in doing so...



What have i been saying in my replies all along? what if there IS A CORRUPTION in the heart of that person

Allah would not expect us to sit alone with them would he and put ourselves in danger just because something is made halal dose not mean you can take advantage of it
:wa:
LOL then if there is a fear something happening you use your common sense and do not mix with each other.

but to say it's not allowed for a person to mix with his aunty and he isn't her mehram isn't correct. because we've clearly established that he is allowed to mix with her unless he is known to be an evil man or she is known to be an evil woman.

He is her mehram just like her father and brother so he's allowed to mix with her just as her father and brother would and no 1 is allowed to tell him otherwise.

Unless 1 of them is known to be an evil person then it's not allowed.


so you understand now sis that he holds the position of mehram, just like a brother and father, hold the position of mehram? :hmm:
Reply

noorseeker
03-07-2010, 11:56 PM
Sister i know what you mean, i was meaning to ask the question

your saying they are in the same age group, and one of them might get feelings for the other because due to the age gap or lack of.

sister kittenlover did post the right information, you are allowed to mix,
but personally think there should be limited mixing or not become buddies.

it depends if either of them have a sickness in the heart.

i have a niece a couple years older and younger than me, but end of the day they are my sisters kids, i am their uncle no matter what,

we are not close because they grew up back home, they are here now, so theres limited chit chat.

just becareful is al i say
Reply

S_87
03-08-2010, 11:09 AM
maybe youre hearing that because if they are not married and the age dif then it isnt appropriate for them to be alone-like you said in a bedroom. just like scholars advise that if a mother in law/father in law is close in age to son/daughter in law, although they are still mahram caution has to be taken because things DO happen.
so yes caution should be taken especially if he may like her
Reply

Agiibs
03-30-2010, 12:18 PM
Is this pernissable ? The aunty is an aunty through marriage. She is the nephews mothers; brothers wife.
Reply

innocent
03-30-2010, 02:22 PM
Originally Posted by Agiibs
Is this pernissable ? The aunty is an aunty through marriage. She is the nephews mothers; brothers wife.
No she is not a mehram so she cannot be alone with him.
Reply

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