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Darth Ultor
03-10-2010, 05:01 PM
I support it only in the worst of circumstances, like for terrorists, war criminals, and really horrible serial killers. If only to bring closure to the families of the victims. However, in most cases, I don't support it; death is too good for scum like some of these *******s who rape and murder women and children. The normal prison population would tear people like them to pieces.
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Alpha Dude
03-10-2010, 05:04 PM
I'm not sure what the Jewish concept of punishment is (do you believe in hell-fire?), but once they die (if they were unrepentant), they would be placed into hell. That would be far worse than any punishment humans can inflict.
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Asiyah3
03-10-2010, 05:32 PM
Originally Posted by Boaz
death is too good for scum like some of these *******s who rape and murder women and children. The normal prison population would tear people like them to pieces.
Some jails seem to be rather pleasant. I recently read an article that claimed the prisoners eat better food than students at school...

Edit: (^Just an example) I'm not saying we should give them bad food lol. But really at least in Europe jails resemble hotels.
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Darth Ultor
03-10-2010, 06:33 PM
Originally Posted by Alpha Dude
I'm not sure what the Jewish concept of punishment is (do you believe in hell-fire?), but once they die (if they were unrepentant), they would be placed into hell. That would be far worse than any punishment humans can inflict.
We do have a concept of Hell and I think it's similar to the Muslim concept. It's usually not permanent. Repentance from Hell is possible, but it is a much better investment to live a life doing good deeds and showing your devotion to God.

Capital punishment is prescribed in the scriptures for specific crimes. However, to get a guilty verdict was very difficult. At the time of the Temple, if a Jewish court executed more than two or three people in a span of seventy years, they were considered a bad court. I think the only capital crimes were premeditated murder, idolatry, adultery, and cursing the name of God. All of which required a warning to the defendant before hand and at least two witnesses to testify against the defendant in court.

My stance on capital punishment are not religiously motivated, but morally and politically.
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Uthman
03-10-2010, 06:46 PM
I believe in the Sharee'ah. The death penalty is part of the Sharee'ah. Therefore, I believe in the death penalty.
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Trumble
03-10-2010, 06:49 PM
I don't support the death penalty in any circumstances. Partly because, whatever fancy religious, moral or philosophical clothes you dress it in, capital punishment has far more to do with revenge than 'justice'. But mostly because, sooner or later, you are going to fry/hang/shoot somebody innocent. The ultimate punishment cannot be justified in an imperfect justice system and I'm aware of no justice system that is anything but.

Regarding the "worst of circumstances", the trouble is actually defining it. Terrorist or 'freedom fighter'? Cold calculating murderer or insane serial killer? We had much the same thing some years ago in the UK with people that the death penalty could be justified if guilt was "absolutely certain". Quite apart from the obvious point that unless guilt was 'beyond reasonable doubt' (and where is the line between that and absolutely certain - can you ever be absolutely certain?) there should never have been a conviction in the first place, one example that was used was when there was 'video evidence' of a crime. But in 2010, would anybody who has been to the movies in the last decade accept video evidence as certain proof of anything?
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sister herb
03-10-2010, 06:53 PM
As muslim, I believe to death penalty when judge use islamic shariah.
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Nokiacrazi
03-10-2010, 06:59 PM
In the correct circumstances of course.

You look at 'modern' and 'civilized' countries and you see women being raped daily. You see men being raped. You see boys being sodomised. What is this all about?

People seeing someone being raped in the streets of Paris and they think 'oh she's having fun'.

You catch a rapist and you prosecute him, and in two years they are released and they have raped someone else.

Therefore the death penalty is a just punishment in my eyes.
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Darth Ultor
03-10-2010, 07:07 PM
Under Shariah law, is there the presumption of innocence in the courts?
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islamirama
03-10-2010, 09:22 PM
Originally Posted by Boaz
Under Shariah law, is there the presumption of innocence in the courts?
Punishment is administered after evidence/proof has been established against the criminal. True shariah law is much more just for muslims and non-muslims alike than the democratic laws of the west where Muslims are guilty until proven innocent or just put away in prisons under false "suspicions" without trials for years.

visit here to read more on shariah:

http://www.islamawareness.net/Shariah

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cat eyes
03-10-2010, 10:58 PM
yeah the death penalty is the only answer really so they cant offend again.

so i agree with death penalty. i dont know what drives a person to rape or kill.

Is it just in there blood?
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-Fallen Angel-
03-10-2010, 11:05 PM
Originally Posted by cat eyes
yeah the death penalty is the only answer really so they cant offend again.

so i agree with death penalty. i dont know what drives a person to rape or kill.

Is it just in there blood?
It's different from person to person. Most criminals commit crimes because they get a "reward", like if you mug people you may get money, or if you rob houses you may get valuable items, similarly they may rape because they are getting a "reward" (sexual pleasure) and kill (because they enjoy it and dislike people), but that's just from what i understand, but anybody who does serious crimes like murder should be killed. It's only fair.
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cat eyes
03-10-2010, 11:08 PM
Originally Posted by UnhappyD:
It's different from person to person. Most criminals commit crimes because they get a "reward", like if you mug people you may get money, or if you rob houses you may get valuable items, similarly they may rape because they are getting a "reward" (sexual pleasure) and kill (because they enjoy it and dislike people), but that's just from what i understand, but anybody who does serious crimes like murder should be killed. It's only fair.
but thats what i dont get why do they rape when they can easily go to a club and get a woman with consent without having to force himself on her
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KittenLover
03-10-2010, 11:14 PM
Originally Posted by cat eyes
but thats what i dont get why do they rape when they can easily go to a club and get a woman with consent without having to force himself on her
there's more 2 it then that, it's psychological also, they want to make the other person feel pain and they want to be the aggressors/dominators they want to feel the power. I remember watching a programme on it once, sexual pleasure is not the only motivation.

alot of it stems from perverted fantasies that eventually go out of control. but sometimes it's purely for sexual gratification.
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cat eyes
03-11-2010, 12:51 PM
Originally Posted by KittenLover
there's more 2 it then that, it's psychological also, they want to make the other person feel pain and they want to be the aggressors/dominators they want to feel the power. I remember watching a programme on it once, sexual pleasure is not the only motivation.

alot of it stems from perverted fantasies that eventually go out of control. but sometimes it's purely for sexual gratification.
was watching a programme where they said the same thing also but i cant believe how much of a retard a person can be to do it in a city where there is a death penalty for crimes like this.

And what kinda life would you have in prison..he'd probably get raped and beaten himself :hmm:
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-Fallen Angel-
03-11-2010, 01:12 PM
Originally Posted by cat eyes
was watching a programme where they said the same thing also but i cant believe how much of a retard a person can be to do it in a city where there is a death penalty for crimes like this.

And what kinda life would you have in prison..he'd probably get raped and beaten himself :hmm:
Actully in prison pedophiles get beaten and raped, that's why they are put in a "special" section away from others. They deserve the death penalty, same goes for pedophiles, but human activists cry and whine about it.. :raging:
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aamirsaab
03-11-2010, 02:22 PM
:sl:
It's a sick world we live in where murderers and rapists are merely imprisoned for their crimes against society, but we shout hoo-rah when an enemy combatant falls in battle.
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S_87
03-12-2010, 11:27 AM
i believe in death penalty under shariah
i dont see such a penalty as escaping punishment-theres two ways to see it, one is that the real punishment will start and the other is that, their punishment in this world (death) will be means of purification for next. for example there ws a woman who commited zina in the time of Muhammed :arabic5: ....


'Abdullah b. Buraida reported on the authority of his father that Ma'iz b. Malik al-Aslami came to Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) and said: Allah's Messenger, I have wronged myself; I have committed adultery and I earnestly desire that you should purify me. He turned him away. On the following day, he (Ma'iz) again came to him and said: Allah's Messenger, I have committed adultery. Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) turned him away for the second time, and sent him to his people saying: Do you know if there is anything wrong with his mind. They denied of any such thing in him and said: We do not know him but as a wise good man among us, so far as we can judge. He (Ma'iz) came for the third time, and he (the Holy Prophet) sent him as he had done before. He asked about him and they informed him that there was nothing wrong with him or with his mind. When it was the fourth time, a ditch was dug for him and he (the Holy Prophet) pronounced judg- ment about him and he wis stoned. He (the narrator) said: There came to him (the Holy Prophet) a woman from Ghamid and said: Allah's Messenger, I have committed adultery, so purify me. He (the Holy Prophet) turned her away. On the following day she said: Allah's Messenger, Why do you turn me away? Perhaps, you turn me away as you turned away Ma'iz. By Allah, I have become pregnant. He said: Well, if you insist upon it, then go away until you give birth to (the child). When she was delivered she came with the child (wrapped) in a rag and said: Here is the child whom I have given birth to. He said: Go away and suckle him until you wean him. When she had weaned him, she came to him (the Holy Prophet) with the child who was holding a piece of bread in his hand. She said: Allah's Apostle, here is he as I have weaned him and he eats food. He (the Holy Prophet) entrusted the child to one of the Muslims and then pronounced punishment. And she was put in a ditch up to her chest and he commanded people and they stoned her. Khalid b Walid came forward with a stone which he flung at her head and there spurted blood on the face of Khalid and so he abused her. Allah's Apostle (may peace be upon him) heard his (Khalid's) curse that he had huried upon her. Thereupon he (the Holy Prophet) said: Khalid, be gentle. By Him in Whose Hand is my life, she has made such a repentance that even if a wrongful tax-collector were to repent, he would have been forgiven. Then giving command regarding her, he prayed over her and she was buried.

Sahih muslim
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Darth Ultor
03-12-2010, 08:41 PM
Also there raises the question in common capital murder cases. What if the court was wrong? There needs to be proof beyond a shadow of a doubt in capital cases.
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sister herb
03-12-2010, 09:08 PM
How Jews understand this matter?

For example Adolf Eichmann who was executed at 1962? What if he was innocent for those crimes he was accused?

^o)

What if court was wrong?
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Darth Ultor
03-12-2010, 10:08 PM
It's not the same as in a war crimes or crimes against humanity case. In the cases against the Nazis and the Japanese Empire you had files on top of files of incriminating evidence, plus testimony from the defendants and witnesses, and photograph and video evidence. I only wish that was the case with Milosevic a few years ago. He died before justice could be done. But in many murder cases, there is sometimes that off chance that they got the wrong guy. And what does my religion have anything to do with this?
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sister herb
03-12-2010, 11:08 PM
What about crimes against Palestinians? Can we say that those criminals whose have continue occupation in Palestine over 60 years are guilty of genocide, are war crimes will deserve death penalty? Like Shimon Peres? Like Ehud Olmert? Like Benyamin Netanyahu?

They all are similar war criminals like Adolf Eichmann. Not more, not less.

May Allah punish them at the Judgement day if courts in this world are too weak.
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Darth Ultor
03-13-2010, 12:33 AM
With all due respect, Cousin, I refuse to discuss the Israel issue unless the topic is focusing on that specifically.
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sister herb
03-13-2010, 09:24 AM
Originally Posted by Boaz
With all due respect, Cousin, I refuse to discuss the Israel issue unless the topic is focusing on that specifically.
Don´t insult me to call me as your cousin. I am not member of your family.

I will open new thread about zionist war criminals to here soon.
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S<Chowdhury
03-13-2010, 09:29 AM
Originally Posted by cat eyes
yeah the death penalty is the only answer really so they cant offend again.

so i agree with death penalty. i dont know what drives a person to rape or kill.
What happens if you put the wrong person under death penalty, and then a few years later you realise there is a mistake? that persons life is gone, his or her family is robbed of a life, what happens then?

DW I found the answer :)
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sister herb
03-13-2010, 09:56 AM
Originally Posted by S<Chowdhury
What happens if you put the wrong person under death penalty, and then a few years later you realise there is a mistake? that persons life is gone, his or her family is robbed of a life, what happens then?
islamirama already answered your question.

^o)
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Darth Ultor
03-13-2010, 12:25 PM
Originally Posted by sister harb
Don´t insult me to call me as your cousin. I am not member of your family.

I will open new thread about zionist war criminals to here soon.

I wasn't insulting you. I was referring to you as my cousin due to the fact the fact that you're a Muslim and I'm a Jew. You come Ishmael (pbuh) and we come from Itzhak (pbuh). Therefore, we are cousins.
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sister herb
03-13-2010, 01:01 PM
Originally Posted by Boaz
I wasn't insulting you. I was referring to you as my cousin due to the fact the fact that you're a Muslim and I'm a Jew. You come Ishmael (pbuh) and we come from Itzhak (pbuh). Therefore, we are cousins.
Ok I understand. You can comment about zionist terrorists.. oops war criminals in here if you like http://www.islamicboard.com/general/...criminals.html

Should they too get death penalty?
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Binyamine
03-13-2010, 01:46 PM
Originally Posted by Uthmān
I believe in the Sharee'ah. The death penalty is part of the Sharee'ah. Therefore, I believe in the death penalty.
Masha'Allah, a nice befitting reply:shade:
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Binyamine
03-13-2010, 01:52 PM
Originally Posted by sister harb
What about crimes against Palestinians? Can we say that those criminals whose have continue occupation in Palestine over 60 years are guilty of genocide, are war crimes will deserve death penalty? Like Shimon Peres? Like Ehud Olmert? Like Benyamin Netanyahu?

They all are similar war criminals like Adolf Eichmann. Not more, not less.

May Allah punish them at the Judgement day if courts in this world are too weak.
Peace Mercy And Blessing of Allah be upon all of us.

Good questions. But see the fate of Ariel Sharon, he is already paying some of his sins. All these ZIONIST will have to pay for their crimes insha'Allah.
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sister herb
03-13-2010, 02:05 PM
Originally Posted by Binyamine
Peace Mercy And Blessing of Allah be upon all of us.

Good questions. But see the fate of Ariel Sharon, he is already paying some of his sins. All these ZIONIST will have to pay for their crimes insha'Allah.
This zionist war criminal against humanity is not any more possible to charge at judge as he has been brain dead last years. He is still waiting his punishments at crave and at Judgement day.

May Allah gives to this murder what he deservers.
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Karina
03-13-2010, 02:20 PM
Originally Posted by Nokiacrazi
In the correct circumstances of course.

You look at 'modern' and 'civilized' countries and you see women being raped daily. You see men being raped. You see boys being sodomised. What is this all about?

People seeing someone being raped in the streets of Paris and they think 'oh she's having fun'.

You catch a rapist and you prosecute him, and in two years they are released and they have raped someone else.

Therefore the death penalty is a just punishment in my eyes.
Who's to say these types of things don't happen in 'non-modern' and 'non-civilized' societies (whatever they are - your words not mine).

Also - why would someone view a rape in Paris as being 'fun' for the victim?

A fitting punishment it may well be for many crimes, but the issue still stands that many innocent people are prosecuted for crimes they did not commit... You can let someone out of jail, but you can't bring an innocent person back to life.

See this example
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M.I.A.
03-13-2010, 11:06 PM
i believe in capital punishment.
those that are deserving of such cannot be deprived.
those that are innocent should long for death.
in all cases allah swt knows best.
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Woodrow
03-13-2010, 11:51 PM
I favor the death penalty, but I have never lived in any country, I feel the government is capable of enforcing it fairly or properly.
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aadil77
03-13-2010, 11:55 PM
The Govt pays billions to keep murderers and rapists in prison, much more economical to get rid of them
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M.A.S.H.
03-13-2010, 11:58 PM
Originally Posted by aadil77
The Govt pays billions to keep murderers and rapists in prison, much more economical to get rid of them
The death row is more expensive actually. Its cheaper to keep someone in prison for life than paying for all the lawyers and the appeals etc.
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aadil77
03-14-2010, 12:11 AM
Originally Posted by M.A.S.H.
The death row is more expensive actually. Its cheaper to keep someone in prison for life than paying for all the lawyers and the appeals etc.
forget deathrow thats just stupid, there should be an easier and simpler process to waste criminals more quickly
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Woodrow
03-14-2010, 12:13 AM
Originally Posted by M.A.S.H.
The death row is more expensive actually. Its cheaper to keep someone in prison for life than paying for all the lawyers and the appeals etc.
Unless you happen to live in Texas. When I lived in Texas. the death penalty meant the person was going to be executed, it took very fast action, if it was even possible, to get an appeal presented, before the execution took place.
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Ramadhan
03-14-2010, 03:49 AM
From the Islamic perspective, the death penalty is actually better for the criminal who deserve it, because then they will have paid for their crimes in the world rather in the hereafter where they might be put in jahannam where a second is worse than being put for a thousands death.

Allah SWT knows best.
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Darth Ultor
03-14-2010, 03:58 AM
I say put a limit on the appeal time. If there is proof beyond a shadow of a doubt, and the sentence was passed in court, give reasonable amount of time for an appeal, and if it is denied, shoot the murderer scum in the head. I don't like the lethal injection thing, it's too easy for them. I don't think it's fair that murderers can go so easily, but when someone is dying from a terrible cancer, they have to go painfully. I will make a topic about euthanasia very soon. Beheadings and hangings can go wrong, but a bullet is quick and instant when fired by a well trained gunman.
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Woodrow
03-14-2010, 04:24 AM
Originally Posted by cat eyes
but thats what i dont get why do they rape when they can easily go to a club and get a woman with consent without having to force himself on her
Rape has nothing to do with sex or sexual satisfaction. It is a power issue and is based on the rapist's desire to show they are more powerful than the victim or even the government. They want the death penalty and are encouraged to rape because of the death penalty. It is their desire to show they have no fear of death or the government and will do whatever they please to do, no matter who tries to stop them. The threat of the death penalty adds to their thrill and enjoyment. They do not intend to be caught and believe they are too smart to get caught. Sadly there is some truth as most rapists are never caught.
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theblackcloud
03-14-2010, 04:29 AM
Yes, I believe that the death penalty must be instituted. I believe in hard justice. Too many people get away with horrible things in today's world knowing that there won't be that bad of a consequence for their actions.
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Gator
03-14-2010, 04:47 AM
Voted no to death penalty. Don't believe the state should kill people they could detain indefinitely. Its too expensive, not a deterent and its immoral.
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theblackcloud
03-14-2010, 05:10 AM
Originally Posted by Gator
Voted no to death penalty. Don't believe the state should kill people they could detain indefinitely. Its too expensive, not a deterent and its immoral.
Well, what if someone wanted to publish your daughter's mutilated body in a porn magazine?

If I were the head of state, we would charge the owner of that magazine, and you could carry out the death penalty yourself. It disgusts me that people like that walk the face of the earth, and it scares me that they actually have a large consumer market to cater to.
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aadil77
03-14-2010, 01:11 PM
Originally Posted by Gator
Voted no to death penalty. Don't believe the state should kill people they could detain indefinitely. Its too expensive, not a deterent and its immoral.
How is it expensive to kill them?
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Ishaaq
03-14-2010, 01:17 PM
:sl:
It's only expensive to kill those sentenced to death row due to legal, court, appeal issues, etc.

Western law is extremely complex and the system is huge. Simple justice which the Religion of Al Islaam offers is much more efficient. Eye for an eye.
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Darth Ultor
03-14-2010, 02:42 PM
"Eye for an eye"? What about the due process of the law? One thing I do like is the fact that the family of the victim can pardon the criminal and the execution is canceled.
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Ishaaq
03-14-2010, 03:13 PM
Originally Posted by Boaz
"Eye for an eye"? What about the due process of the law?
Due process of law needs to be reasonable. The religion of Al Islaam neither advocates vigilante justice, but on the other hand, the Western version of law is extremely bureaucratic (for lack of better word).
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M.I.A.
03-14-2010, 05:30 PM
Originally Posted by Boaz
"Eye for an eye"
and its written (loosly paraphrased) that there losses will be comparable to yours. i guess that these laws are enforced by allah swt...you know its like you can only wronge your own soul in this place, if you are cought or not, if you are punished or not, allahs retribution is swift and his mercy infinate. just dont forget how many eyes youve taken and how many teeth you have left.

Originally Posted by Boaz
One thing I do like is the fact that the family of the victim can pardon the criminal and the execution is canceled.
its a perfect state.
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yahia12
03-16-2010, 05:47 PM
Yes, its good.
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