confusion need help

[cat eyes]

:sl:
Well basically its about something serious which has come to my knowledge from another muslim

I have been taking part in taleem readings quite often and i was told that the books that they are reading from has weak fake and fabricated hadiths and stories in it. can this be true? i have watched vids and lectures and they have said yes it is true and we should only read from bukhari since its the most authentic

i have also taken part in the womans jamaat also where they had invited muslims around even reverts and they read from these books but never the bukhari hadiths they never read from bukhari hadiths i dont know why this is when they are the most authentic

i will now stop going to these places because
the prophet (saw) said who ever makes a lie concerning me his home will be hell

Now that the truth has come to me Alhamdulilah

your opinions will be most greatful :wa:

['Abd-al Latif]

:salamext:

Is it the Taleem ul-Haq book?

[Salahudeen]

Do you have names of the books they are using? You are right sahih bukhari is the most authentic book of hadith. It could be true, my friend was in same situation.

does the group your with call themselves tabliki jamaat?

[Life_Is_Short]

:wa:
If the books aren't referenced i suggest you don't use them. Each hadith should be referenced something like this:
" [1] Narrated by Al-Bukhaari (1/348) and the four via 'Abdullah ibn Buraydah, from Imraan".

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[AabiruSabeel]

:sl:

If the books you are referring to is called as Fazail A'mal, which is compiled by Maulana Zakariyyah Al-Kandhlawi, then there is nothing wrong with reading those books. Those are authentic books on the virtues of deeds and widely accepted among Muslims all over the world.
If you check the bibliography of Fazail A'mal, there are 84 classical works of scholars listed there. All the Ahadith mentioned therein are referenced to the classical scholars of Hadith.

Shaikh/Maulana Zakariyyah (RH) was considered as Shaikhul Hadeeth of his time. His major works on Ahadith such as Awjazul Masalik (18 volumes, Arabic commentary and explanation of Muwatta Imam Malik) are widely accepted by all the scholars of the world. His other classical works include Arabic commentary of Bukhari called Laami'ud Diraari (10 volumes), Abwaab wat Taraajim A'laa sahih Bukhari, Kawkabud Durri A'laa Sunani Tirmidhi.

Some people try to spread false information about the Shaikh and the book Fazail A'mal by disrespecting the Shaikh and falsely attributing lies to him. They try to take a few sentences out of context and label them shirk, kufr and bid'ah. May Allah guide them and us all. They should know that disrespecting the scholars will only deprive them of knowledge and it may lead them to kufr. Allah SubHanahu wa Ta'ala announces war against those who hold enmity against His friends. Man 'aada li waliyyan faqad aazantuhu bil Harb.

Please go through these links if you want further clarification:
http://www.sunniforum.com/forum/show...849#post368849

http://www.sunniforum.com/forum/show...ses#post396812

[cat eyes]

Do you have names of the books they are using? You are right sahih bukhari is the most authentic book of hadith. It could be true, my friend was in same situation.

does the group your with call themselves tabliki jamaat?

yes it sounds something like that :( but im not quite sure since i did not look in to the name before going with them.

[cat eyes]

:salamext:

Is it the Taleem ul-Haq book?

brother they read from 3 or 4books and i think thats one of them not quite sure

[cat eyes]

:wa:
If the books aren't referenced i suggest you don't use them. Each hadith should be referenced something like this:
" [1] Narrated by Al-Bukhaari (1/348) and the four via 'Abdullah ibn Buraydah, from Imraan".

yes i notice some of the hadiths are not even referenced cos i never hear the sister saying the reference of the hadith

[cat eyes]

:sl:

If the books you are referring to is called as Fazail A'mal, which is compiled by Maulana Zakariyyah Al-Kandhlawi, then there is nothing wrong with reading those books. Those are authentic books on the virtues of deeds and widely accepted among Muslims all over the world.
If you check the bibliography of Fazail A'mal, there are 84 classical works of scholars listed there. All the Ahadith mentioned therein are referenced to the classical scholars of Hadith.

Shaikh/Maulana Zakariyyah (RH) was a considered as Shaikhul Hadeeth of his time. His major works on Ahadith such as Awjazul Masalik (18 volumes, commentary and explanation of Muwatta Imam Malik) are widely accepted by all the scholars of the world and even taught in a few institutes. His other classical works include commentary of Bukhari called Laami'ud Diraari (10 volumes), Abwaab wat Taraajim A'laa sahih Bukhari, Kawkabud Durri A'laa Sunani Tirmidhi.

Some people try to spread false information about the Shaikh and the book Fazail A'mal by disrespecting the Shaikh and falsely attributing lies to him. They try to take a few sentences out of context and label them shirk, kufr and bid'ah. May Allah guide them and us all. They should know that disrespecting the scholars will only deprive them of knowledge and it may lead them to kufr. Allah SubHanahu wa Ta'ala announces war against those who hold enmity against His friends. Man 'aada li waliyyan faqad aazantuhu bil Harb.

Please go through these links if you want further clarification:
http://www.sunniforum.com/forum/show...849#post368849

http://www.sunniforum.com/forum/show...ses#post396812

jazakAllah brother that is the main book that they mostly read from but some scholars which i have watched said that we should follow bukhari since its the most authentic. i want to know why they are saying all this stuff about fazail e amaal ? and why to they object to reading bukhari hadeeths for?

['Abd Al-Maajid]

*EDITED*If someone gives you references from Quran or Hadeeth follow it otherwise discard it.

[tigerkhan]

:sl:
blv i got much sad bcz of above reply by brother abdul majid....i read this thread and i was thinking to say something on this issue but then i think if i say something then may be there will a new disscussion taken place about the work of dawa, that whether they are going right or wrong.....and i dont want that we (atleast i) bcm a dudge, to pass or fail tableegh ppl....bcz today this is shotcoming of all us that we never think of ourself but we can easily comment on other, we never think by our words maybe some 1 can get hurts....
so plz bro and sis DONT COMMENT ON THIS THREAD AND STOP IT HERE....bcz maybe some of our muslims bro and sis got hurts , if we contining discussion on this topic.....
i was just sending a PM to Cat Eyes to not to share such things on open forum, but now what i was afraid, that has been done by bro A.Majid....
so plz its my request not to post any commnet on this thread.

about the issue, its v.clear if someone following quan and sunna, he is always right, if some one is not following......the day dudgement is there to make all clear.
sorry for my words if some1 got hurt of them
JZK
:wa:

['Abd Al-Maajid]

:sl:
blv i got much sad bcz of above reply by brother abdul majid....i read this thread and i was thinking to say something on this issue but then i think if i say something then may be there will a new disscussion taken place about the work of dawa, that whether they are going right or wrong.....and i dont want that we (atleast i) bcm a dudge, to pass or fail tableegh ppl....bcz today this is shotcoming of all us that we never think of ourself but we can easily comment on other, we never think by our words maybe some 1 can get hurts....
so plz bro and sis DONT COMMENT ON THIS THREAD AND STOP IT HERE....bcz maybe some of our muslims bro and sis got hurts , if we contining discussion on this topic.....
i was just sending a PM to Cat Eyes to not to share such things on open forum, but now what i was afraid, that has been done by bro A.Majid....
so plz its my request not to post any commnet on this thread.

about the issue, its v.clear if someone following quan and sunna, he is always right, if some one is not following......the day dudgement is there to make all clear.
sorry for my words if some1 got hurt of them
JZK
:wa:

Sorry brother...I shouldn't had made that comment...I meant no offense...imsadimsad.

[cat eyes]

:sl:
blv i got much sad bcz of above reply by brother abdul majid....i read this thread and i was thinking to say something on this issue but then i think if i say soething then may be there will a new disscussion taken place about the work of dawa, that whther they are going right or wrong.....and i dont want that we (atleast i) bcm a dudge, to pass of fail tableegh ppl....bcz today this is shotcoming of all us that we never think of ourself but we can easily comment on other, we never think by our maybe some 1 can get hurts....
so plz bro and sis DONT COMMENT ON THIS AND STOP IT HERE....bcz maybe some of our muslims bro and sis got hurts , if we contining discussion on this topic.....
i was just sending a PM to Cat Eyes to not to share such things on open forum, but now what i was afraid, that has been done by bro A.Majid....
so plz its my request not to post any commnet on this thread.

about the issue, its v.clear if someone following quan and sunna, he is always right, if some one is not following......the day dudgement is there to make all clear.
sorry for my words if some1 got hurt of them
JZK
:wa:

i just want to clear my confusion because i fear Allah swt :hmm: on judgment day Allah should not ask me why you were sitting with people while they were reading out false information about the prophet (saw) if im hurting anybody by doing that then im sorry but i want to clear my doubts. i am a revert i dont know much about anything so i have to be extra careful thats why i always come here for help

[islamirama]

i just want to clear my confusion because i fear Allah swt :hmm: on judgment day Allah should not ask me why you were sitting with people while they were reading out false information about the prophet (saw) if im hurting anybody by doing that then im sorry but i want to clear my doubts. i am a revert i dont know much about anything so i have to be extra careful thats why i always come here for help

I wouldn't read anything or trust anything others say unless its from the Quran, Sunnah and authentic hadith. Also, its good to listen to respected reputable scholars, sometimes some of them slip too and if they do abandon them and stick other that stick to the Quran and Sunnah.

You can visit here to read Sahih Bukhari, Sahih Muslim, Sunan Abudawud, Malik's Muwatta and downloaded to your pc

http://www.searchtruth.com/

[cat eyes]

i will stick to bukhari hadiths now because of the constant difference in opinion which have fueled my doubts and insecurities. i will be no longer going on the jamaat and taleems. i have big sahih al bukhari in my home which will read everyday now since ive been going to the taleems i have not opened one page of it astagfulliallah because i felt that there was no need

[UmmSqueakster]

Assalamu Alaikum,

Imam Bukhari (ra) was an incredibly knowledgeable man BUT he didn't include every sound hadith in his collection. There are other hadith collections that contain thousands of sound ahadith. To limit ourselves only to bukhari would be to limit our religion.

So long as the book comes from a trusted scholar, inshaAllah we should trust their judgment regarding the hadith they relate (unless of course, we're fluent in arabic and have spent decades of our lives dedicated to the study of hadith. Then by all means, please do disagree with scholars of hadith).

Please see this answer related to ahadith in the book you're studying:

http://www.beautifulislam.net/hadith...hadiths_p.html

[Hamza Asadullah]

:sl:
Well basically its about something serious which has come to my knowledge from another muslim

I have been taking part in taleem readings quite often and i was told that the books that they are reading from has weak fake and fabricated hadiths and stories in it. can this be true? i have watched vids and lectures and they have said yes it is true and we should only read from bukhari since its the most authentic

i have also taken part in the womans jamaat also where they had invited muslims around even reverts and they read from these books but never the bukhari hadiths they never read from bukhari hadiths i dont know why this is when they are the most authentic

i will now stop going to these places because
the prophet (saw) said who ever makes a lie concerning me his home will be hell

Now that the truth has come to me Alhamdulilah

your opinions will be most greatful :wa:

:sl: according to correct understanding of Islam and the view of the consensus of scholars weak hadith can be used to promote good morals and enjoin good and forbid evil but they are not used in fundamentals of the deen and in Sharia'.

Bare in mind that "weak" does not mean "fabricated". There is a whole world of difference between the two.

So do not worry or have concern for you should act upon these virtuous acts. Bukhari has also used weak hadith in 'al-Adab al- mufrad'. So for the purpose of good morals and enjoining good and forbidding evil it is allowed and those virtuous deeds should be acted upon inshallah.

and Allah knows best in all matters

[cat eyes]

im going by bukhari for the main reason scholars have said its the most authentic after the holy Quran. how could going by possibly weak hadiths be of any good to humanity? if a person knows something is weak they should keep away from it.

[AabiruSabeel]

:sl:

jazakAllah brother that is the main book that they mostly read from but some scholars which i have watched said that we should follow bukhari since its the most authentic. i want to know why they are saying all this stuff about fazail e amaal ? and why to they object to reading bukhari hadeeths for?

There is a great difference between Sahih Bukhari and Fazail A'mal.
Sahih Bukhari is a collection of Hadith. Fazail A'mal is not a collection of Hadith, rather it is a book of fazail, virtues of good deeds. It contains verses from the Qur'an, Ahadith as well as saying of scholars and pious people of the past.
The purpose of Sahih Bukhari is to collect all the Sahih Ahadith at one place. Whereas the purpose of Fazail A'mal is to encourage a person to become a practising Muslim by narrating to him the rewards that he will earn on performing a good deed and by relating the punishment he will face on leaving that good deed.
Ahadith from Sahih Bukhari can be used to derive masa'il rulings. But not everyone is capable of doing that. So we have to rely on the fuqaha experts in the field of jurisprudence. Fazail A'mal cannot be used to derive any Islamic ruling. It is just used to encourage a Muslim to practise his Religion.

If a person reads Sahih Bukhari on his own, and he thinks he can follow the Ahadith from it, then it is most likely that he will go astray. Because you will see Ahadith apparently contradicting each other in Sahih Bukhari. You will even find Ahadith that were abrogated by other Ahadith. There are also Ahadith which were specific actions of the Prophet :saws1: and they cannot be considered as Sunnah. So reading Sahih Bukhari without scholarly supervision can be dangerous for one's Iman and A'mal.
Whereas Fazail A'mal can be read by anyone since we do not derive any rulings from it. It is just used for encouragement to be more practising.

Those who read Fazail A'mal, they do not discourage you from reading Sahih Bukhari. Rather they tell you to read it under the supervision of a scholar. You will not find more Huffaz, 'Ulama and Mufti anywhere else except in the families of those who read Fazail A'mal and spend time in the Path of Allah for the sake of His Deen. This is a fact which no one can deny. Because of this work of Deen, more and more people are coming closer to Allah and discarding their sinful life.

I know the people who speak against Fazail A'mal on youtube. Not everyone who grows a beard and wears a ghutrah/shimagh becomes a scholar.

Mu'adh ibne-Anas Juhani Radhiyallahu 'anhu narrates that Rasulullah Sallallahu 'alaihi wasallam said: If anyone guards a believer's honour from a hypocrite, then Allah will appoint an angel who will guard his flesh from the Hell-Fire on the Day of Resurrection. If anyone accuses a Muslim by saying something to defame him, then Allah will restrain him on the bridge over Hell until he is cleansed from what he said. (Abu Dawood)

If you trust youtube (which you shouldn't actually), then please view the videos posted in response to their objections too before forming a biased opinion on the book Fazail A'mal.


Please go through the links I had posted in my earlier post if you still have any doubts regarding it.

i will stick to bukhari hadiths now because of the constant difference in opinion which have fueled my doubts and insecurities. i will be no longer going on the jamaat and taleems. i have big sahih al bukhari in my home which will read everyday now since ive been going to the taleems i have not opened one page of it astagfulliallah because i felt that there was no need

It's important to read Sahih Bukhari under the supervision of a scholar because of the reasons mentioned above.

You can still attend the Ta'leem and consult knowledgeable sisters on the issue. Or better still, try to consult an 'Alim behind hijab.

yes i notice some of the hadiths are not even referenced cos i never hear the sister saying the reference of the hadith

The references are usually written at the bottom of the page or with the Arabic text of the Hadith. A layman should not be concerned with the references as long as the book is compiled by a trustworthy scholar. Therefore these references are not included with the translation. Anyone who is capable enough of analysing the references will obviously know Arabic, so he can check them in the Arabic text or in the foot notes.

Shaikh Muhammad Zakariyyah Kandhlawi was a trustworthy scholar. As mentioned in my earlier post, his works are widely accepted among all the scholars of the world. He lived his last days in Madinah Munawwarah and passed away on 1st Sha'ban 1402 AH. He is now resting in Jannatul Baqi', near the Ahlul Bayt. Even Shaikh Huzaify, Imam and Khateeb of Masjidun-Nabawi said about him that he was his personal friend and a great 'Alim (click to read first hand account).

[UmmSqueakster]

im going by bukhari for the main reason scholars have said its the most authentic after the holy Quran. how could going by possibly weak hadiths be of any good to humanity? if a person knows something is weak they should keep away from it.

It's no problem if you want to study Bukhari (ok, there are issues, just be aware we cannot draw our religion from reading a single hadith), but please do be aware that it isn't the most authentic after the Qur'an. Sahih ahadith are the source of our religion after the Qur'an, and they can be found in many collections by hadith masters (including, but not limited to Bukhari, Muslim, Musnad Ahmad, Abu Dawud, al-Tirmidhi, Al-Muwatta of Malik, Ibn Majah, and al-Nasa'i, among others).

[CosmicPathos]

I was against tableeghi jamaat due to their teachings but my recent experiences with them have forced me to change my opinion regarding them. they are the people who truly serve in path of Allah, unlike some scholars for dollars who have given us nothing but bitterness, takfeer, loss and depression.

[Salahudeen]

The Training Manual of the Jamaat Tableegh

Originally known as Tableeghi Nisaab, ‘Fazaail-e-Aamaal’ literally means the virtues (Fazaail) of actions of worship (Aamaal). It consists of a series of booklets written by Moulana Zakariyah Kandhalvi on the instructions of Moulana Ilyas (the founder of Jamaat Tableegh) as mentioned by Moulana Zakariyah himself in his autobiography ‘Aap Beeti.’
Fazaail-e-Aamaal consists of nine booklets, namely - Hikayaat Sahabah, Fazaail-e-Dhikr, Fazaail-e-Namaaz, Fazaail-e-Tableegh, Fazaail-e-Qur’aan, Fazaail-e-Darood, Fazaail-e-Ramadaan, Fazaail-e-Sadaqat and Fazaail-e-Hajj. These series were compiled in two volumes and entitled, ‘Tableeghi Nisaab.’ They were intended to be the fundamental training guide for the cadre of the Jamaat Tableegh. Later on, it was re-named, ‘Fazaail-e-Aamaal.’ This book originally in Urdu, has been translated to many different languages. But it has never been translated into the Arabic language as a whole.[1]

now all you need to do is research into Jamaat Tableegh and Deobandi's.

[tigerkhan]

i just want to clear my confusion because i fear Allah swt :hmm: on judgment day Allah should not ask me why you were sitting with people while they were reading out false information about the prophet (saw) if im hurting anybody by doing that then im sorry but i want to clear my doubts. i am a revert i dont know much about anything so i have to be extra careful thats why i always come here for help

:sl:
sorry i dont know u are a revert....mashallah from ur posts u seems to be big "ALLAMA"....and mashallah its v.good u have good neyah to learn and fear of Allah SWT.... but SIS actually this issue is very up from our levels...many Ulama has write details books on clarification of these issue. so one can see them if interersted....
i think to some extent things are cleared to u by other replys by BRos, obviously they has much knowledge and i laso learn much from there posts...so u do take parts in tahleem halqas and circles...Fazaila Ammal is not a fiqa book, but it cantain many hadidths from Bukhari, muslim, abo dawood etc and that are about fazails of ammal,,,,bcz to try muslim to know the actual value of ammals so that they bcm practicing,,,bcz today we know importance of money, car, banglow but not of Salat, zikar, taqva. we strive for hours daily for wordly thiings but we missed salat, zikr etc.....so its a try to make all muslim practicing islam 100%...
i hope u got it....plz be clear also bukhari and fazail ammal is not opposite to each other as ppl say we follow bukhari but not fazail ammal...i think its just a misconception....its seems by saying this that fazail ammal cantain some thing which is opposite to bukhari...however maximum part of fazail ammal is taken from bukhari....like when some AALIM write book about masail salat, he may take all hadiths about salat froom bukhari, muslim, tirmizi etc...so it doesnt mean we should not follow that book, but we follow bukhari....same is case of fazail aamal as its cantains fazail of ammals from all hadiths books.....

my english is bit weak,,,,,so sorry for it....may Allah SWT helps us to find the things for our life, which are most acceptable to Him.
JZK
:wa:

[cat eyes]

i just want to say thanks everyone for your help and taking time to post there is no doubt about it though my imaan did reach a mountain top when i had started going for jamaat i have also contacted a mufti about it and im waiting on reply jazakallah everyone

['Abd Al-Maajid]

^ Hope you get to know the truth...:)

[cat eyes]

i dont wish to respond to pms that have your own opinions im sorry if im ignorant i have respect for the people who write these books and i do not wish to critisizee but wish to understand and learn thats all.

[cat eyes]

:sl:
There is a great difference between Sahih Bukhari and Fazail A'mal.
Sahih Bukhari is a collection of Hadith. Fazail A'mal is not a collection of Hadith, rather it is a book of fazail, virtues of good deeds. It contains verses from the Qur'an, Ahadith as well as saying of scholars and pious people of the past.
The purpose of Sahih Bukhari is to collect all the Sahih Ahadith at one place. Whereas the purpose of Fazail A'mal is to encourage a person to become a practising Muslim by narrating to him the rewards that he will earn on performing a good deed and by relating the punishment he will face on leaving that good deed.
Ahadith from Sahih Bukhari can be used to derive masa'il rulings. But not everyone is capable of doing that. So we have to rely on the fuqaha experts in the field of jurisprudence. Fazail A'mal cannot be used to derive any Islamic ruling. It is just used to encourage a Muslim to practise his Religion.

If a person reads Sahih Bukhari on his own, and he thinks he can follow the Ahadith from it, then it is most likely that he will go astray. Because you will see Ahadith apparently contradicting each other in Sahih Bukhari. You will even find Ahadith that were abrogated by other Ahadith. There are also Ahadith which were specific actions of the Prophet :saws1: and they cannot be considered as Sunnah. So reading Sahih Bukhari without scholarly supervision can be dangerous for one's Iman and A'mal.
Whereas Fazail A'mal can be read by anyone since we do not derive any rulings from it. It is just used for encouragement to be more practising.

Those who read Fazail A'mal, they do not discourage you from reading Sahih Bukhari. Rather they tell you to read it under the supervision of a scholar. You will not find more Huffaz, 'Ulama and Mufti anywhere else except in the families of those who read Fazail A'mal and spend time in the Path of Allah for the sake of His Deen. This is a fact which no one can deny. Because of this work of Deen, more and more people are coming closer to Allah and discarding their sinful life.

I know the people who speak against Fazail A'mal on youtube. Not everyone who grows a beard and wears a ghutrah/shimagh becomes a scholar.

Mu'adh ibne-Anas Juhani Radhiyallahu 'anhu narrates that Rasulullah Sallallahu 'alaihi wasallam said: If anyone guards a believer's honour from a hypocrite, then Allah will appoint an angel who will guard his flesh from the Hell-Fire on the Day of Resurrection. If anyone accuses a Muslim by saying something to defame him, then Allah will restrain him on the bridge over Hell until he is cleansed from what he said. (Abu Dawood)

If you trust youtube (which you shouldn't actually), then please view the videos posted in response to their objections too before forming a biased opinion on the book Fazail A'mal.


Please go through the links I had posted in my earlier post if you still have any doubts regarding it.

It's important to read Sahih Bukhari under the supervision of a scholar because of the reasons mentioned above.

You can still attend the Ta'leem and consult knowledgeable sisters on the issue. Or better still, try to consult an 'Alim behind hijab.
The references are usually written at the bottom of the page or with the Arabic text of the Hadith. A layman should not be concerned with the references as long as the book is compiled by a trustworthy scholar. Therefore these references are not included with the translation. Anyone who is capable enough of analysing the references will obviously know Arabic, so he can check them in the Arabic text or in the foot notes.

Shaikh Muhammad Zakariyyah Kandhlawi was a trustworthy scholar. As mentioned in my earlier post, his works are widely accepted among all the scholars of the world. He lived his last days in Madinah Munawwarah and passed away on 1st Sha'ban 1402 AH. He is now resting in Jannatul Baqi', near the Ahlul Bayt. Even Shaikh Huzaify, Imam and Khateeb of Masjidun-Nabawi said about him that he was his personal friend and a great 'Alim (click to read first hand account).

a brother gave me a website to contact a mufti ahke and theres positive fatwas on there also :)

[AabiruSabeel]

:sl:

O ye who believe! If a wicked person comes to you with any news, ascertain the truth, lest ye harm people unwittingly, and afterwards become full of repentance for what ye have done. [49:6]

Whenever someone makes a claim on something, it is important to analyse the arguments from both the sides before forming our opinion on the issue. If someone has watched the videos that attribute lies to the book, then he should also watch the response to those videos before forming his own opinion on it.

Since this matter is now clarified to the OP, I hope it's now safe to close this thread.