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Samiun
04-19-2010, 03:19 PM
:sl:, I have been searching for this answer but yet I fail to find it due to certain contradictions...

Al-Khatib Al-Baghdadi quoted Abu Yusuf as saying, “I heard Abu Hanifah saying, ‘But for fear of Almighty Allah’s wrath that I had not made use of my knowledge, I would not have given fatwas at all to whoever asks me. The person who asks me gets the benefit of knowing the answer anyway, while I bear the responsibility (before Almighty Allah) if it has been wrong!’”
I have already started saying to both non-muslims and muslims that chess is really haram. But based on the narration above, I don't think I'm in a position to face Allah S.W.T. during YauQiyamah. You see, I collected all my sources from one source which is like a popular search engine to search for fatwas. The problem is that when I look up unto more things about whether chess is haram or not, I get confuse. Some say haram, some say it's makrooh and some say it's permissible with certain conditions.
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Alchemist
04-19-2010, 05:36 PM
Yeah.. scholars disagree on some matters.. like this one.. if some say haram, some say makrooh and some say permissible then you can choose what you feel is right and you won't be judged as far as I know..

wa allah hu a3lam..
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Missinglinks
04-19-2010, 06:00 PM
Ruling on playing chess
I wana ask if chess(the type played now a days)is allowed in islam or not?


Praise be to Allaah.
“When chess distracts us from what we are obliged to do both inwardly and outwardly, it is haraam according to the consensus of the scholars – such as when it distracts from an obligatory duty such as prayer or anything that is necessary in the interests of oneself or one’s family, or enjoining what is good and forbidding what is evil, or upholding ties of kinship or honouring one’s parents, or any obligations connected to positions of authority or leadership, etc. In this case it is haraam according to the consensus of the scholars. Similarly, if it involves anything that is haraam such as telling lies, swearing false oaths, cheating, wrongdoing or helping in wrongdoing, or other forbidden things, then it is haraam according to the consensus of the Muslims.” (Adapted from Majmoo’ al-Fataawa, 32/218, 240).
But if it does not distract us from our obligations or involve anything that is haraam, then there is a difference of scholarly opinion concerning the ruling. The majority of scholars (Abu Haneefah, Maalik, Ahmad and some of the companions of al-Shaafa’i) said that it is also haraam, basing that view on the evidence of the Book of Allaah and the opinions of the Sahaabah.
The evidence of the Qur’aan is the words (interpretation of the meaning):
“O you who believe! Intoxicants (all kinds of alcoholic drinks), and gambling, and Al-Ansaab [stone altars set up for sacrifices to idols etc], and Al-Azlaam (arrows for seeking luck or decision) are an abomination of Shaytaan’s (Satan’s) handiwork. So avoid (strictly all) that (abomination) in order that you may be successful.
Shaytaan (Satan) wants only to excite enmity and hatred between you with intoxicants (alcoholic drinks) and gambling, and hinder you from the remembrance of Allaah and from As-Salaah (the prayer). So, will you not then abstain?”
[al-Maa’idah 5:90-91]
Al-Qurtubi (may Allaah have mercy on him) said: “This aayah indicates that it is haraam to play dice or chess, whether that involves gambling or not, because when Allaah forbade alcohol He explained the reason for that, which is ‘Shaytaan (Satan) wants only to excite enmity and hatred between you with intoxicants (alcoholic drinks) and gambling, and hinder you from the remembrance of Allaah and from As-Salaah (the prayer).’ So every kind of game in which a little leads to a lot and stirs up enmity and hatred between those who are devoted to it and prevents them from remembering Allaah and praying, is like drinking alcohol, which implies that it must be haraam like alcohol.” (al-Jaami’ li Ahkaam al-Qur’aan, 6/291).
With regard to the views of the Sahaabah:
It was narrated that ‘Ali ibn Abi Taalib (may Allaah be pleased with him) passed by some people who were playing chess. He said, “What are these images, to which you are devoted? [cf. al-Anbiya’ 21:52]” Imaam Ahmad said: “The soundest comment on chess what that which was said by ‘Ali (may Allaah be pleased with him).”
‘Abd-Allaah ibn ‘Umar (may Allaah be pleased with him) was asked about chess and he said, “It is worse than dice.”
“Dice” refers to what is used nowadays for playing backgammon, which is played on a special table. It was narrated in the ahaadeeth that it is haraam.
Abu Dawood (4938) narrated from Abu Moosa al-Ash’ari that the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “Whoever plays dice has disobeyed Allaah and His Messenger.” (Classed as saheeh by al-Albaani in Saheeh Abi Dawood, 4129)
Muslim (2260) narrated that the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “Whoever plays dice is like one who has dipped his hand in the flesh and blood of a pig.” Al-Nawawi (may Allaah have mercy on him) said: “This hadeeth is quoted as evidence by al-Shaafa’i and the majority of scholars to prove that playing dice is haraam. The phrase ‘dipped his hand in the flesh and blood of a pig’ refers to eating it, and this simile is used to show that this is haraam because it is haraam to eat that.”
What some of the scholars have said about the prohibition of chess:
Ibn Qudaamah (may Allaah have mercy on him) said: “Chess is like dice in that it is forbidden.” (al-Mughni, 14/155),
Ibn al-Qayyim (may Allaah have mercy on him) said: “The evil consequences of chess are greater than the evil consequences of dice. Everything that points to the prohibition of dice points to the prohibition of chess even more so… This is the view of Maalik and his companions, of Abu Haneefah and his companions, of Ahmad and his companions, and the view of the majority of the Taabi’een… It is not known that any of the Sahaabah permitted it or played it. Allaah protected them from that. Everything that is attributed to any of them and says that he played it – such as Abu Hurayrah – is a fabrication and lie against the Sahaabah and is rejected by anyone who knows how the Sahaabah really were and by anyone who has sufficient knowledge to examine the reports critically. How could the best generation and the best of mankind after the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) permit playing something that prevents people from remembering Allaah and from praying, and is worse in this regard than alcohol when the player gets immersed in it, as we see in real life? How could the Lawgiver forbid dice but permit chess, which is many times worse?…” (al-Furoosiyah, 303, 305, 311).
Al-Dhahabi (may Allaah have mercy on him) said: “With regard to chess, most of the scholars say that it is haraam to play it, whether that is for money or not. If it is played for money then it is indisputably gambling. Even if it is not played for money it is still gambling and haraam, according to most of the scholars… al-Nawawi (may Allaah have mercy on him) was asked about playing chess, is it forbidden or permissible? He (may Allaah have mercy on him) replied that if it makes a person miss praying on time or he plays for money, then it is haraam, otherwise it is makrooh according to al-Shaafa’i and haraam according to others…” (al-Kabaa’ir, 89-90).
For more information see Tahreem al-Nard wa’l-Shatranj wa’l-Malaahi by al-Aajurri, ed. By Muhammad Sa’eed Idrees.
And Allaah knows best. We ask Allaah to help us to do that which He loves and which pleases Him, and to help us to obey Him.
May Allaah send blessings and peace upon our Prophet Muhammad.

Islam Q&A
Sheikh Muhammed Salih Al-Munajjid
source: http://www.islamqa.com/en/ref/14095
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aadil77
04-19-2010, 06:10 PM
The main emphasis on the permissablity on playing any game, whether sports etc is that they do not waste excessive time and do distract you from rememberence of Allah eg; you miss salaah
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Samiun
04-22-2010, 10:38 AM
Al-Qurtubi (may Allaah have mercy on him) said: “This aayah indicates that it is haraam to play dice or chess, whether that involves gambling or not, because when Allaah forbade alcohol He explained the reason for that, which is ‘Shaytaan (Satan) wants only to excite enmity and hatred between you with intoxicants (alcoholic drinks) and gambling, and hinder you from the remembrance of Allaah and from As-Salaah (the prayer).’ So every kind of game in which a little leads to a lot and stirs up enmity and hatred between those who are devoted to it and prevents them from remembering Allaah and praying, is like drinking alcohol, which implies that it must be haraam like alcohol.” (al-Jaami’ li Ahkaam al-Qur’aan, 6/291).
:sl:
Thanks for reminding me this Fatwa brother, but the problem with these type of book is that I can't rebuke others from playing chess due to the fact that I took a hadeeth from the "internet". My muslim brothers will just deny the fact that chess is indeed haram. Is there any solution to this problem?
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aadil77
04-22-2010, 10:45 AM
Originally Posted by Nabiel
:sl:
Thanks for reminding me this Fatwa brother, but the problem with these type of book is that I can't rebuke others from playing chess due to the fact that I took a hadeeth from the "internet". My muslim brothers will just deny the fact that chess is indeed haram. Is there any solution to this problem?
Bro in the same way you could use that fatwa to deem every single game and sport haraam, It not that clear cut that it is haraam, you need to make sure that games do not waste time excessively, stop you from the rememberence of Allah or stir up emity or hatred

Read this clearly again
So every kind of game in which a little leads to a lot and stirs up enmity and hatred between those who are devoted to it and prevents them from remembering Allaah and praying, is like drinking alcohol, which implies that it must be haraam like alcohol
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cat eyes
04-22-2010, 12:48 PM
i love playstation but i dont play it all the time :( is it really haraam?
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Cabdullahi
04-22-2010, 01:28 PM
Originally Posted by cat eyes
i love playstation but i dont play it all the time :( is it really haraam?
Come on! sister you dont play playstation
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cat eyes
04-22-2010, 02:03 PM
i love playstation:embarrass im very boyish when it comes to any type of game.

Im very boyish when it comes to alot of stuff actually especially movies.:hiding: i could make a list of.. this is why my sis strictly dont want go cinema with me cos i will pick some dumb action movie

I try to keep it hidden though :nervous: and pretend to like all girly stuff to fit in.

I think it was because of growing up with 3brothers :hiding: i dont really know :><:
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Missinglinks
04-22-2010, 03:33 PM
Originally Posted by Nabiel
:sl:
Thanks for reminding me this Fatwa brother, but the problem with these type of book is that I can't rebuke others from playing chess due to the fact that I took a hadeeth from the "internet". My muslim brothers will just deny the fact that chess is indeed haram. Is there any solution to this problem?
wa:sl:

yes there is, first of all, memorise the hadith and the sanad if you can. Or memorise the hadith and the reference.
Then act like a true worshipper, people tend to take information as a reliable source when:
- inshaAllah when your only aim is to please Allah and really sincerily advise people,,,
- always speak with daleel(proof, evidence), even if it is a small question.
- the person has a good reputation(no sinning, gives the best example of behaviour, is known among people that he studies islamic sciences and is well rooted herein, etc..)
- doesn't speak when he doesn't know or doubts. (people tend to not trust you if you err(faults) to much)
- is honest and gives more opinions of the real scholars and then clearifies wich one is the strongest and best to follow
- has memorised a lot, it's much more convincing when you give the proof without a book.
- oh almost forgot.. arabic arabic arabic!!!! and memorise a lot of quran, you wont be taken serieus by some if you haven't memorised at least 7-10 juz.
- and much more....

And finally Allah is the one who raises status not we, remember the prophet pbuh for 13 years he was not taken serieus except by a few.

if I say something good it's from Allah and the faults are mine.
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smile
04-22-2010, 03:41 PM
chess is boring anyway
i don't think its haram
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Darth Ultor
04-22-2010, 11:43 PM
How can chess be haraam? It's not gambling, it's strategic. Makes you think fast and logically. Algebra and certain forms of science came from the Muslim world. If it benefits the mind, then I don't think it's haraam.
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Rabi Mansur
04-23-2010, 01:52 AM
Originally Posted by Boaz
How can chess be haraam? It's not gambling, it's strategic. Makes you think fast and logically. Algebra and certain forms of science came from the Muslim world. If it benefits the mind, then I don't think it's haraam.
Chess is great exercise for the mind. I agree with Boaz, how can it be haram? There is no gambling, it develops the mind.

Sure if someone got so consumed by it that they neglected everything else, like some people do with computer games, I can see that being a problem. But chess is normally not like that. The people I know who are good at chess are deep thinkers. It is hard for me to see a problem with it like with games of chance and gambling.

:wa:
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Pure Purple
05-06-2011, 12:07 PM
playing Chess is prohibited in Islam?If yes , what's the reason?
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Innocent Soul
05-06-2011, 04:35 PM
Its better not to play chess. Visit these links you will get the answer.

http://www.islam-qa.com/en/ref/14095
http://www.islamicboard.com/showthread.php?t=134296342
http://www.islamweb.net/emainpage/in...twaId&Id=85615
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Pure Purple
05-07-2011, 06:32 AM
Jazakallah safiya
chess khelana band
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Pure Purple
05-07-2011, 06:39 AM
Originally Posted by aadil77
Bro in the same way you could use that fatwa to deem every single game and sport haraam, It not that clear cut that it is haraam, you need to make sure that games do not waste time excessively, stop you from the rememberence of Allah or stir up emity or hatred

Read this clearly again
If this is so...
In my opinion Cricket is most time consuming game
I think This is most correct answer
JAZAKALLAH
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Tyrion
05-07-2011, 07:15 AM
It's like most things in Islam... Just do it in moderation. It's only when something like this keeps you from your duties as a Muslim (like from Salah) that it becomes haram for you.

I think the bigger issue here is why you would want to know Islamic information in order to rebuke your friends:

Originally Posted by Nbeel
but the problem with these type of book is that I can't rebuke others from playing chess due to the fact that I took a hadeeth from the "internet". My muslim brothers will just deny the fact that chess is indeed haram. Is there any solution to this problem?
This stuff should be learned first and foremost to better yourself, not to use it as a weapon to belittle others... (ESPECIALLY not with issues where there are differences of opinion) Actually, this isn't the first time you've done this Nbeel... I remember a while ago you were asking questions about music because you wanted to know if you could rebuke people you knew then as well... You shouldn't be learning in order to call out others on what you perceive to be faults. It's really not a good quality...
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Woodrow
05-07-2011, 02:11 PM
Originally Posted by Tyrion
It's like most things in Islam... Just do it in moderation. It's only when something like this keeps you from your duties as a Muslim (like from Salah) that it becomes haram for you.

I think the bigger issue here is why you would want to know Islamic information in order to rebuke your friends:



This stuff should be learned first and foremost to better yourself, not to use it as a weapon to belittle others... (ESPECIALLY not with issues where there are differences of opinion) Actually, this isn't the first time you've done this Nbeel... I remember a while ago you were asking questions about music because you wanted to know if you could rebuke people you knew then as well... You shouldn't be learning in order to call out others on what you perceive to be faults. It's really not a good quality...
Or as so well said by Baba Ali:



While we should correct our Brothers and sisters when we see them doing wrong. We need not go out of our way to seek wrong doings. Especially when we do not know the correct answer our self. Now if someone is asking us if something is haram, If we know the answer tell them. If we do not know, encourage them to look up the answer. Self searching is more effective than doing the searching for the person.

Of course if we are seeking the answer for our own knowledge that is not only admirable it is obligatory. Always learn to better one's self not for the intent to use it as a means to rebuke others.
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Woodrow
05-07-2011, 02:20 PM
to add an additional thought. Chess was unknown to the Arabs until after the con guest of Persia. The game came from the Persians. It was further developed by the Muslim world during the Golden age of Islam and spread throughout the world by us Muslims. I have often wondered if the game in the Ahadith that is now translated as Chess is the same game? In either case if it should not be played to such a fervor it distracts us from our obligations. As for it being Halal, Mahkouf or Haram, I really do not know and am still seeking an answer. I personally enjoyed the game before I reverted, but since it may be haram I have not played it after reverting. I am still seeking a definite, proven ruling.
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Haya emaan
05-07-2011, 03:23 PM
i never knew that chess is probably haram
that means its better not to play it...
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al yunan
05-07-2011, 03:42 PM
Assalamu alaikum to all,

I think that brother missinglink made his point clear enough on the matter and so did tyrion about not using knowledge to show others up.
I would just like to add the only Fatwa on the matter I've ever heard of and that is from Imam Malik rahimullah who talks about Backgammon (Tauvli) which according to him is Makruh Tahrimi which if continued leads to shirk.
Using Qiyas one would derive to a similar conclusion about many past times in todays world.
The question is should one seek to clarify one's actions ? Or is it Was Was ?
There is a Hadith Qudsi which states "Allah S.W.T will not accept the words I did not know that in Qiyamat" (not ad verbum)
May Allah S.W.T protect us from acts which displease Him.
Masalam
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Chavundur
05-07-2011, 04:35 PM
I think chess should not be thought as a game only. I had read some books about its being halal if there is an ongoing Jihad. We went to school and learned a lot of unnecessary things, chess was more beneficial than most of them. Especially one of the most important lesson can be learned from chess is to become patient. I was short tempered and impatient to an extent. Playing chess was very beneficial in those days. I think after comprehending essence of that game or sport, spending too much time on it is useless. After some age, capabilities can not be advance either.
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Samiun
05-10-2011, 10:37 AM
Originally Posted by Tyrion
It's like most things in Islam... Just do it in moderation. It's only when something like this keeps you from your duties as a Muslim (like from Salah) that it becomes haram for you.

I think the bigger issue here is why you would want to know Islamic information in order to rebuke your friends:



This stuff should be learned first and foremost to better yourself, not to use it as a weapon to belittle others... (ESPECIALLY not with issues where there are differences of opinion) Actually, this isn't the first time you've done this Nbeel... I remember a while ago you were asking questions about music because you wanted to know if you could rebuke people you knew then as well... You shouldn't be learning in order to call out others on what you perceive to be faults. It's really not a good quality...
:sl:, actually I send you a message to seek for your advice and to debate about it so truth would be discovered, which I think would be pointless in the internet cause it's better to debate in real life. This thread is like one year old and I had stopped rebuking people for some time now. This includes birthdays, mother's day, music, and some part of Tasawwuf. This incident made me realize that I have to gain more knowledge in order to explain to other people about a haram/halal matter rather than forcing them to accept it against their will and Allah S.W.T. knows best.
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Skunkman
05-10-2011, 10:41 AM
Isn't it fine to play if u maintain to perform salah?. =) just for fun. its a brain game.
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Darth Ultor
05-10-2011, 03:25 PM
It seems like everything that doesn't have to do with God or Islam is either potentially haraam or questionable. I mean, seriously, there's fear of God and then there's paranoia. God is not a tyrant. Fear of God means that you have to be aware of your actions because God knows all your deeds, thoughts, and feelings and you will be held accountable if you do something wrong. It's doesn't mean to live in fear like at any moment you might die and be punished in the Hereafter. I think He wants you to enjoy life but within reason. Without sinning. I can understand alcohol and drugs being forbidden. I can even understand music (certain vulgar types). But chess? A game that makes you think? How is that a sin? God gave us brains so that we may use them. Nothing wrong with a game that teaches you to think logically. It's like saying math or science is haraam.
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Dagless
05-10-2011, 04:30 PM
Originally Posted by al yunan
I would just like to add the only Fatwa on the matter I've ever heard of and that is from Imam Malik rahimullah who talks about Backgammon (Tauvli) which according to him is Makruh Tahrimi which if continued leads to shirk.
How can it lead to shirk?
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aamirsaab
05-10-2011, 04:56 PM
Originally Posted by Boaz
...But chess? A game that makes you think? How is that a sin? God gave us brains so that we may use them. Nothing wrong with a game that teaches you to think logically. It's like saying math or science is haraam.
Mucho confusio in this thread.

Chess is fine.

The hadiths that speak of Chess being haram, are referring to a type of chess that involved the use of dice. The one we play (with the knights, bishops and Queens etc) is fine.

Just don't be a skiver and blame a missed prayer on a game of chess.

p.s; don't steal your opponent's chess pieces either!
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sabr*
05-14-2011, 06:27 PM
As-Salāmu `Alaykum (السلام عليكم):

May Allah punish those who attempt to change the laws of Allah!


Always the lukewarm who make excuses for implementing the laws of Allah!!

The puesdo intellectuals pick and choose that which they fervertly support. When it directly
confronts that which they engage they will defend. This hadith refers to chess and not backgammon. The
main point is not to waste time with anything that doesn't promote Allah's word being superior. They will
never provide evidence showing that chess can be played.

Attempting to attack any of the Sahih Sittah puts you on the otherside of practicing Muslims who adhere to the
Quran and Sunnah.

Chapter 2: IT IS PROHIBITED TO PLAY CHESS


Sahih Muslim Book 028, Number 5612:


Buraida reported on the authority of his father that Allah's Apostle (may peace be upon him) said:
He who played chess is like one who dyed his hand with the flesh and blood of swine.
__________________________________________________ ________

Al-An'am (The Cattle) 6:116
وَإِن تُطِعْ أَكْثَرَ مَن فِي الأَرْضِ يُضِلُّوكَ عَن سَبِيلِ اللّهِ إِن يَتَّبِعُونَ إِلاَّ الظَّنَّ وَإِنْ هُمْ إِلاَّ يَخْرُصُونَ (6:116)
Wain tutiAA akthara man fee alardi yudillooka AAan sabeeli Allahi in yattabiAAoona illa alththanna wain hum illa yakhrusoona

6:116 (Y. Ali) Wert thou to follow the common run of those on earth, they will lead thee away from the way of Allah. They follow nothing but conjecture: they do nothing but lie.
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جوري
05-14-2011, 06:34 PM
chess came about in Baghdad around 772 H so how can Allah's apostle have spoken about a game that was not yet invented? pls. look at the actual wording in Arabic you'll see that it is about backgammon and especially if involving gambling!

and Allah swt knows best

:w:
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sabr*
05-14-2011, 07:11 PM
Originally Posted by τhε ṿαlε'ṡ lïlÿ
chess came about in Baghdad around 772 H so how can Allah's apostle have spoken about a game that was not yet invented? pls. look at the actual wording in Arabic you'll see that it is about backgammon and especially if involving gambling!

and Allah swt knows best:w:
As-Salāmu `Alaykum (السلام عليكم):

Subhanallah! It is acknowledged that Chess was invented in India during the 6th century during the Gupta empire. The
rules of chess rules evolved during the 1200 before Nabi Muhammad (SAWS ) was born. The way the game is played today that
was changed around 1475. So the claim that chess wasn't created until after Nabi Muhammad is without any doubt an
error. Be careful of changing history to suit a passion especially when it involves the practice of Islam.
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جوري
05-14-2011, 08:33 PM
Originally Posted by sabr*
As-Salāmu `Alaykum (السلام عليكم): Subhanallah! It is acknowledged that Chess was invented in India during the 6th century during the Gupta empire. The rules of chess rules evolved during the 1200 before Nabi Muhammad (SAWS ) was born. The way the game is played today that was changed around 1475. So the claim that chess wasn't created until after Nabi Muhammad is without any doubt an error. Be careful of changing history to suit a passion especially when it involves the practice of Islam.
Wa A'alaykum Asalaam,

The chess played in India differs from that of Persia differs from that in Baghdad .. Check proper history books and not the internet on the matter. Furthermore, different imams have passed different opinions on the matter, some making it out right Haram, some decreeing it makrooh and some Halal so long as it doesn't waste time, involve gambling or interferes with ibadat so with such difference of opinion how can anyone here speak with absolution on a matter that had scholar divided?


:w:
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Dagless
05-14-2011, 09:03 PM
Does anyone know the actual reason chess is prohibited? (for those who believe it is prohibited even when no money is involved).


Originally Posted by sabr*
Attempting to attack any of the Sahih Sittah puts you on the otherside of practicing Muslims who adhere to the
Quran and Sunnah.

Chapter 2: IT IS PROHIBITED TO PLAY CHESS


Sahih Bukhari Book 028, Number 5612:


Buraida reported on the authority of his father that Allah's Apostle (may peace be upon him) said:
He who played chess is like one who dyed his hand with the flesh and blood of swine.
__________________________________________________ ________
Whichever site you got this from has referenced it incorrectly. It might be Sahih Muslim, but it's not Sahih Bukhari.
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Samiun
05-15-2011, 01:33 AM
:sl:, hmm yeah Dagless is right, it's actually from Abu Dawood who narrated it and it says 'backgammon' not 'chess'

Prophet (sallallah alihi wa sallam) said:
"Whoever plays backgammon it is as if he had coloured his hands with the flesh and blood of a pig. (Abu Dawud Vol. 2 Pg. 319)
However, Ali R.A. have stated “Chess is gambling of the Ajam people (non Arabs)” (no source :( )
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sabr*
05-15-2011, 02:05 AM
Originally Posted by τhε ṿαlε'ṡ lïlÿ

Wa A'alaykum Asalaam,

The chess played in India differs from that of Persia differs from that in Baghdad .. Check proper history books and not the internet on the matter. Furthermore, different imams have passed different opinions on the matter, some making it out right Haram, some decreeing it makrooh and some Halal so long as it doesn't waste time, involve gambling or interferes with ibadat so with such difference of opinion how can anyone here speak with absolution on a matter that had scholar divided?


:w:
As-Salāmu `Alaykum (السلام عليكم):


We rely upon a hardcopy of The World Almanac and Book of Facts 2011. We did research after you cited and the following
link for the experts who play chess confirmed what was posted.

http://math.uww.edu/~mcfarlat/177hist.htm

Any opinion that would go directly against what it plain we wouldn't acknowledge anyway.
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sabr*
05-15-2011, 02:14 AM
Originally Posted by Dagless
Does anyone know the actual reason chess is prohibited? (for those who believe it is prohibited even when no money is involved).
Originally Posted by Dagless




Whichever site you got this from has referenced it incorrectly. It might be Sahih Muslim, but it's not Sahih Bukhari.

As-Salāmu `Alaykum (السلام عليكم):

Akhi Dagless:

we thank you for the correction. We amended the citation. We understand that promoting the word of Allah as being
superior is the objective and not our own interests. We are again humbled and acknowledge all knowledge is with Allah.
________________________________________________

Surah Hashr 59:22-24
هُوَ اللَّهُ الَّذِي لَا إِلَهَ إِلَّا هُوَ عَالِمُ الْغَيْبِ وَالشَّهَادَةِ هُوَ الرَّحْمَنُ الرَّحِيمُ (59:22)
Huwa Allahu allathee la ilaha illa huwa AAalimu alghaybi waalshshahadati huwa alrrahmanu alrraheemu

59:22 (Y. Ali) Allah is He, than Whom there is no other god;- Who knows (all things) both secret and open; He, Most Gracious, Most Merciful.

هُوَ اللَّهُ الَّذِي لَا إِلَهَ إِلَّا هُوَ الْمَلِكُ الْقُدُّوسُ السَّلَامُ الْمُؤْمِنُ الْمُهَيْمِنُ الْعَزِيزُ الْجَبَّارُ الْمُتَكَبِّرُ سُبْحَانَ اللَّهِ عَمَّا يُشْرِكُونَ (59:23)
Huwa Allahu allathee la ilaha illa huwa almaliku alquddoosu alssalamu almuminu almuhayminu alAAazeezu aljabbaru almutakabbiru subhana Allahi AAamma yushrikoona

59:23 (Y. Ali) Allah is He, than Whom there is no other god;- the Sovereign, the Holy One, the Source of Peace (and Perfection), the Guardian of Faith, the Preserver of Safety, the Exalted in Might, the Irresistible, the Supreme: Glory to Allah. (High is He) above the partners they attribute to Him.

هُوَ اللَّهُ الْخَالِقُ الْبَارِئُ الْمُصَوِّرُ لَهُ الْأَسْمَاء الْحُسْنَى يُسَبِّحُ لَهُ مَا فِي السَّمَاوَاتِ وَالْأَرْضِ وَهُوَ الْعَزِيزُ الْحَكِيمُ (59:24)
Huwa Allahu alkhaliqu albario almusawwiru lahu alasmao alhusna yusabbihu lahu ma fee alssamawati waalardi wahuwa alAAazeezu alhakeemu

59:24 (Y. Ali) He is Allah, the Creator, the Evolver, the Bestower of Forms (or Colours). To Him belong the Most Beautiful Names: whatever is in the heavens and on earth, doth declare His Praises and Glory: and He is the Exalted in Might, the Wise.
Reply

جوري
05-15-2011, 02:17 AM
Originally Posted by sabr*

As-Salāmu `Alaykum (السلام عليكم):


We rely upon a hardcopy of The World Almanac and Book of Facts 2011. We did research after you cited and the following
link for the experts who play chess confirmed what was posted.

http://math.uww.edu/~mcfarlat/177hist.htm

Any opinion that would go directly against what it plain we wouldn't acknowledge anyway.
:sl:
the link you provided confirms what I stated repeatedly:

Many local variations in chess rules persist even today in isolated rural areas, for example in India.

and another:

The variation familiar to Europeans and Americans traveled through Iran..

which is exactly what I stated, what was played in India, differed from Persia, Differed from Iraq..

:w:
Reply

sabr*
05-15-2011, 02:25 AM
Originally Posted by τhε ṿαlε'ṡ lïlÿ

:sl:
the link you provided confirms what I stated repeatedly:

Many local variations in chess rules persist even today in isolated rural areas, for example in India.

and another:

The variation familiar to Europeans and Americans traveled through Iran..

which is exactly what I stated, what was played in India, differed from Persia, Differed from Iraq..

:w:
As-Salāmu `Alaykum (السلام عليكم):

Ukhti τhε ṿαlε'ṡ lïlÿ:

we must have missed something. Where is the Dalil (Evidence) that states it is permissible to play chess that abogates the Sahih Muslim hadith posted? Not someones opinion but Quran or Sahih hadith. We will wait patiently for it.
Reply

sabr*
05-15-2011, 02:34 AM
As-Salāmu `Alaykum (السلام عليكم):


Al-Ma'idah (The Table Spread) 5:47
وَلْيَحْكُمْ أَهْلُ الإِنجِيلِ بِمَا أَنزَلَ اللّهُ فِيهِ وَمَن لَّمْ يَحْكُم بِمَا أَنزَلَ اللّهُ فَأُوْلَـئِكَ هُمُ الْفَاسِقُونَ (5:47)
Walyahkum ahlu alinjeeli bima anzala Allahu feehi waman lam yahkum bima anzala Allahu faolaika humu alfasiqoona

5:47 (Y. Ali) Let the people of the Gospel judge by what Allah hath revealed therein. If any do fail to judge by (the light of) what Allah hath revealed, they are (no better than) those who rebel.
Reply

جوري
05-15-2011, 02:34 AM
Originally Posted by sabr*

As-Salāmu `Alaykum (السلام عليكم):

Ukhti τhε ṿαlε'ṡ lïlÿ:

we must have missed something. Where is the Dalil (Evidence) that states it is permissible to play chess that abogates the Sahih Muslim hadith posted? Not someones opinion but Quran or Sahih hadith. We will wait patiently for it.
:wa:

I don't have evidence that it is haram and I don't have evidence that it is halal for reasons afore mentioned..

:w:
Reply

Ramadhan
05-15-2011, 02:39 AM
Originally Posted by sabr*
As-Salāmu `Alaykum (السلام عليكم): Subhanallah! It is acknowledged that Chess was invented in India during the 6th century during the Gupta empire. The rules of chess rules evolved during the 1200 before Nabi Muhammad (SAWS ) was born. The way the game is played today that was changed around 1475. So the claim that chess wasn't created until after Nabi Muhammad is without any doubt an error. Be careful of changing history to suit a passion especially when it involves the practice of Islam.

:sl:

Brother, you need to lay off your frequent shu'udzon of your own brothers and sisters in Islam.

From the sources on the history of chess including the source you cited, it seems chess was taken up by the muslim world after the conquest of Persia (633-644) and introduced to europe after that, and it is highly unlikely that the Makkah-Madina people already played it during prophet Muhammad SAW.

The hadith that you cited from muslim seems to be an error in translation, and the one cited by Dagless is more accurate:
Prophet (sallallah alihi wa sallam) said:
"Whoever plays backgammon it is as if he had coloured his hands with the flesh and blood of a pig. (Abu Dawud Vol. 2 Pg. 319)

For your information, backgammon is the oldest board game (around 5,000 years) and already existed during ancient egypt and mesopotamia civilizations.
Important to notice: backgammon requires play of DICE and LUCK is very important factor in the outcomes, and gambling has been associated with backgammon as old as the game itself.
Reply

YusufNoor
05-15-2011, 02:46 AM
Originally Posted by Nbeel
:sl:, hmm yeah Dagless is right, it's actually from Abu Dawood who narrated it and it says 'backgammon' not 'chess'



However, Ali R.A. have stated “Chess is gambling of the Ajam people (non Arabs)” (no source :( )
just adding my 2 cents:

having been a fair to middling chess player for most of my life, i found a xiangqi computer in the early '90s, iirc. xiangqi is basically "chinese chess." i was extremely interested and learned how not only to play, but could beat the game on the lower levels and on the mid levels i worked out a few sacrifices [pc's sometimes play point count, leave a few higher ranking pieces exposed which the pc will take, while you maneuver for check mate.]

i brought the game to work the next. a Vietnamese pantry worker saw me playing and said, "you wanna play?" sure, why not? did he say ok? nope, "25 bucks" is what he said. i was kinda irked saying that i just learned to play yesterday. he said that if i didn't want to bet, then he wouldn't play. a Vietnamese dishwasher later agreed to play. i beat him, the pantry worker then refused to play me. later on, a friend of mine from Thailand returned. i asked him if he cared to play? "NO WAY, i don't have any money," was his reply.

in some cultures, xiangqi is learned like westerners learn checkers. BUT you play to gamble! to them, the game is chess. it is NOT the same as western chess. western chess is played as a game of intellect and skill.

western chess is a difficult game to master taking years of study. xiangqi, however is an awesome game of beauty and involving skill as well, but because there are fewer pawns, only 5, and a river in the middle of the board and the king and his ministers being restricted to the "castle", it is WAY different than [western] chess.

the games aren't the same. "chess" is "boring" unless you take the time to master "the 64 variations of the 64 openings" [an expression more than a truism]; xiangqi focuses on 5 or 6 openings. it's simpler, sweeter and much more fun.

i don't believe that they are they same, as well they AREN'T! one is, though much more fun, a game meant for gambling. the other is strictly a game.

i don't know if xiangqi existed at the time of Rasulullah, but "western" chess didn't. it might even be said to be the version of the game that was developed in Persia because there the game was modified by removing haram elements.

even the link says:

The variation familiar to Europeans and Americans traveled through Iran (Persia) to the main commercial centers of Italy and Spain by about 1000 AD.
Shogi, Japanese chess, is even different that "chess' and xiangqi. what game was the hadeeth talking about?

so maybe that's 3 cents...
Reply

Ramadhan
05-15-2011, 03:18 AM
Originally Posted by YusufNoor
what game was the hadeeth talking about?

It very likely refers to backgammon:

http://www.gammonvillage.com/backgam...?resourceid=38
Backgammon is said to be the oldest game in recorded history. Its origin stems from a version of this board game that was first played about 5,000 years ago in Ur of the Chaldees in Mesopotamia. In Greek, Mesopotamia means "between rivers". The Tigris and Euphrates rivers bordered this area situated just north of the Persian Gulf in present day Iraq and Kuwait. Between 2900-1800 BC, early civilizations of a very diverse people lived in these fertile valleys. Ur, also known as the home of the Biblical Abraham, was an important city of the Sumerian culture.
http://www.play65.com/BackgammonHistory.html
Backgammon history continued to evolve throughout the 20th century as the backgammon game underwent two stirring changes at the beginning of the 20th century and toward its end. First, the doubling cube was invented, apparently by socialite Grand Duke Dmitri of Russia, adding new elements of strategy and strengthening backgammon tie with gambling. And finally, for now, the expanding accessibility of fast internet introduced online backgammon servers, enabling real-time, multi-player backgammon games between opponents of opposite sides of the globe.
http://www.1on1backgammon.com/backgammon-history.html
The backgammon game actually became so popular that it had more than its share of problems with the English church. The inherent element of gambling probably was the main reason to this prosecution.
http://www.msoworld.com/mindzine/new.../history1.html
There is evidence that several thousand years later the Egyptian Pharaohs were enjoying another board game that may be an ancestor of backgammon. Boards dating from 1500 BC. were found in King Tutankhamen's tomb in the valley of the Nile, and even at Enkomi on Cyprus, then an Egyptian colony. One board contains Queen Hatshepsut's name, and with the board were found lion-headed pieces, the ancient symbols of royal power. Wall paintings in many Egyptian tombs portray people playing the game, suggesting that it was played by common people as well as by the aristocracy.
Reply

sabr*
05-15-2011, 03:30 AM
Originally Posted by naidamar


:sl:

Brother, you need to lay off your frequent shu'udzon of your own brothers and sisters in Islam.

From the sources on the history of chess including the source you cited, it seems chess was taken up by the muslim world after the conquest of Persia (633-644) and introduced to europe after that, and it is highly unlikely that the Makkah-Madina people already played it during prophet Muhammad SAW.

The hadith that you cited from muslim seems to be an error in translation, and the one cited by Dagless is more accurate:
Prophet (sallallah alihi wa sallam) said:
"Whoever plays backgammon it is as if he had coloured his hands with the flesh and blood of a pig. (Abu Dawud Vol. 2 Pg. 319)

For your information, backgammon is the oldest board game (around 5,000 years) and already existed during ancient egypt and mesopotamia civilizations.
Important to notice: backgammon requires play of DICE and LUCK is very important factor in the outcomes, and gambling has been associated with backgammon as old as the game itself.
As-Salāmu `Alaykum (السلام عليكم):

The insult of the indo word shu'udzon ( cynical, negative, doubtful) is misapplied. You use that label because we are
presenting Dalil (Evidence) that is opposing the normal tribal, cultural and clicks in the forum. We only desire to promote
Allah's word as superior. A blacklash is expected when we oppose the buddy system in the forum. A forum member who
we support in most views supports playing chess based upon personal feelings and not dalil but we don't allow that to
hinder our position of supporting what it correct. When time permits read the following ayat.


Al-Ma'idah (The Table Spread) 5:8
يَا أَيُّهَا الَّذِينَ آمَنُواْ كُونُواْ قَوَّامِينَ لِلّهِ شُهَدَاء بِالْقِسْطِ وَلاَ يَجْرِمَنَّكُمْ شَنَآنُ قَوْمٍ عَلَى أَلاَّ تَعْدِلُواْ اعْدِلُواْ هُوَ أَقْرَبُ لِلتَّقْوَى وَاتَّقُواْ اللّهَ إِنَّ اللّهَ خَبِيرٌ بِمَا تَعْمَلُونَ (5:8)
Ya ayyuha allatheena amanoo koonoo qawwameena lillahi shuhadaa bialqisti wala yajrimannakum shanaanu qawmin AAala alla taAAdiloo iAAdiloo huwa aqrabu lilttaqwa waittaqoo Allaha inna Allaha khabeerun bima taAAmaloona

5:8 (Y. Ali) O ye who believe! stand out firmly for Allah, as witnesses to fair dealing, and let not the hatred of others to you make you swerve to wrong and depart from justice. Be just: that is next to piety: and fear Allah. For Allah is well-acquainted with all that ye do.
Reply

al yunan
05-15-2011, 03:35 AM
Originally Posted by Dagless
How can it lead to shirk?
Assalamu Alaikum brother,

A lot of Fatwas don't make sense to us ordinary folk as we are not A'lim.
The thing about Fiqh one has to have an holistic knowledge of Islam to understand it.
This particular decision by the Imam proves how inept is Muslim's understanding of Shariah for it's strange how Makruh Tahrimi leads to shirk which is worse than the Kufr of Haram.
I too questioned this and was told that a single act of Haram would lead one to be Kafir until the sin was atoned for or wrong restored e.t.c.
Whereas Makruh Tahrimi is to a deliberate act that is done continuously and it's this factor of repetition that makes it Shirk.
A single mistake is not the same a repetitive one for it involves Thought,Decision and Act.
We would truly be lost today without those scholars of old may Allah S.W.T bless and forgive them all.
The problem with most of us today is that we accept the first favourable decision that comes our way without doing a thorough research.
Ignorance of law is no excuse in this world's law and it's also so in Divine law.

May Allah S.W.T protects us from Ghaflah.(ignorance, stupidity, unbothered)
Masalam

PS: Has anyone concidered the figure carvings of the chess pieces ?
Reply

جوري
05-15-2011, 03:55 AM
Originally Posted by sabr*

As-Salāmu `Alaykum (السلام عليكم):

The insult of the indo word shu'udzon ( cynical, negative, doubtful) is misapplied. You use that label because we are
presenting Dalil (Evidence) that is opposing the normal tribal, cultural and clicks in the forum. We only desire to promote
Allah's word as superior. A blacklash is expected when we oppose the buddy system in the forum. A forum member who
we support in most views supports playing chess based upon personal feelings and not dalil but we don't allow that to
hinder our position of supporting what it correct. When time permits read the following ayat.


Al-Ma'idah (The Table Spread) 5:8
يَا أَيُّهَا الَّذِينَ آمَنُواْ كُونُواْ قَوَّامِينَ لِلّهِ شُهَدَاء بِالْقِسْطِ وَلاَ يَجْرِمَنَّكُمْ شَنَآنُ قَوْمٍ عَلَى أَلاَّ تَعْدِلُواْ اعْدِلُواْ هُوَ أَقْرَبُ لِلتَّقْوَى وَاتَّقُواْ اللّهَ إِنَّ اللّهَ خَبِيرٌ بِمَا تَعْمَلُونَ (5:8)
Ya ayyuha allatheena amanoo koonoo qawwameena lillahi shuhadaa bialqisti wala yajrimannakum shanaanu qawmin AAala alla taAAdiloo iAAdiloo huwa aqrabu lilttaqwa waittaqoo Allaha inna Allaha khabeerun bima taAAmaloona

5:8 (Y. Ali) O ye who believe! stand out firmly for Allah, as witnesses to fair dealing, and let not the hatred of others to you make you swerve to wrong and depart from justice. Be just: that is next to piety: and fear Allah. For Allah is well-acquainted with all that ye do.
I don't know if this post is directed at me?
I have neither stated that I support or don't support the game of chess or that I am looking for others to buddy with me on a 'personal feeling' --Perhaps everyone including your person is exhibiting a personal feeling-- what do you think? The word for chess in Arabic is shatranj, Arabic is my mother tongue, I saw no hadith in Arabic with reference to such a word and the one you've used doesn't translate to chess in Arabic.. further the online fatwas that are available differ in opinion so we're all left to our own devices. Either we form an opinion that is rooted in knowledge or it is my fatwa can beat your fatwa.. I like to use my mind, since Islam goes with common sense not against it!

:w:
Reply

Ramadhan
05-15-2011, 04:07 AM
Originally Posted by sabr*
As-Salāmu `Alaykum (السلام عليكم): The insult of the indo word shu'udzon ( cynical, negative, doubtful) is misapplied. You use that label because we are presenting Dalil (Evidence) that is opposing the normal tribal, cultural and clicks in the forum. We only desire to promote Allah's word as superior. A blacklash is expected when we oppose the buddy system in the forum. A forum member who we support in most views supports playing chess based upon personal feelings and not dalil but we don't allow that to hinder our position of supporting what it correct. When time permits read the following ayat.


:wa:

Brother, I don't play chess at all and I don't support playing chess based upon personal feelings and against dalil.

But I'm very interested to know what exactly is referred to in the hadith.

This is extermely important one for us muslims as Rasulullah SAW said:

Narrated 'Ali: The Prophet said, "Do not tell a lie against me for whoever tells a lie against me (intentionally) then he will surely enter the Hell-fire."
References:
Sahih Bukhari, Volume 1, Book 3, #106, Book: Kitab al-Iilm (Knowledge)

Narrated 'Abdullah bin Az-Zubair: I said to my father, 'I do not hear from you any narration (Hadith) of Allah s Apostle as I hear (his narrations) from so and so?" Az-Zubair replied. l was always with him (the Prophet) and I heard him saying "Whoever tells a lie against me (intentionally) then (surely) let him occupy, his seat in Hell-fire.
References:
Sahih Bukhari, Volume 1, Book 3, #107, Book: Kitab al-Iilm (Knowledge)

Narrated Salama: I heard the Prophet saying, "Whoever (intentionally) ascribes to me what I have not said then (surely) let him occupy his seat in Hell-fire."
References:
Sahih Bukhari, Volume 1, Book 3, #109, Book: Kitab al-Iilm (Knowledge)

In the hadith shahih muslims that you presented, you translated it as "chess', however, in many other translations it is mentioned as backgammon:

788. Fadala ibn 'Ubayd was at a meeting when he heard that some people were playing backgammon. He got up in anger to forbid it in the strongest possible terms. Then he said, "The one who plays in order to live on his winnings is like a person who eats pig meat and does wudu' in blood." http://www.sunnipath.com/library/Hadith/H0003P0032.aspx

Abu Dawood (4938) narrated from Abu Moosa al-Ash’ari that the Messenger of Allaah (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “Whoever plays dice has disobeyed Allaah and His Messenger.” (Classed as saheeh by al-Albaani in Saheeh Abi Dawood, 4129)

Muslim (2260) narrated that the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “Whoever plays dice is like one who has dipped his hand in the flesh and blood of a pig.” Al-Nawawi (may Allaah have mercy on him) said: “This hadeeth is quoted as evidence by al-Shaafa’i and the majority of scholars to prove that playing dice is haraam. The phrase ‘dipped his hand in the flesh and blood of a pig’ refers to eating it, and this simile is used to show that this is haraam because it is haraam to eat that.
Reply

CosmicPathos
05-15-2011, 04:20 AM
oh wow, I did not know that rolling dice is haram? We play a game called Ludoo feverently in Pakistan. So its haram? :S
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ludo_%28board_game%29
Reply

al yunan
05-15-2011, 04:50 AM
Salam to all,

If all that has been presented so far was compared and summarised:
  • The evidence against backgammon is undeniable.
  • The evidence against chess by comparative Ahadith and Qiyas would point to a gray matter issue. The prophet s.a.w advised us to stay clear of gray issues until we have assurances on the matter.
  • The choice here becomes personal. To play or not play chess.
  • Should one decide to play it's best to refrain from saying to others that it is permissible.
  • Should one decide not to play then it would best also to refrain from telling others that it's Haram
  • The third and final option is to take the Prophet s.a.w's advice treat it a a gray issue and refrain from judging others until proof positive is obtained.
  • The solution would be to produce Ahadith in their original Arabic form with chess as the topic from any accepted to all source.
The main issue is to have Yakin Mutmaina one way or the other and to avoid the sin of making what is Haram into Halal and visa versa.
In a gray matter any decision that's not outright for something becomes undesirable and remains on the individual''s Aqidah to react to it.
A reminder that on judgement day we stand alone with our deeds

May Allah S.W.T grant us the way to his favour (Ridha Allah)
Masalam

PS: On a personal basis I quit all those board Games plus cards from evidence to time wasting and Gaflah over two decades ago my source "Mishkat al Masabih"
PS 2: Susnuzon is a dangerous sifa best reserved for extreme cases like for the enemies of Allah S.W.T, our beloved Prophet s.a.w and his Wasiat
Reply

Dagless
05-15-2011, 05:08 AM
Originally Posted by sabr*


As-Salāmu `Alaykum (السلام عليكم):

Akhi Dagless:

we thank you for the correction. We amended the citation. We understand that promoting the word of Allah as being
superior is the objective and not our own interests. We are again humbled and acknowledge all knowledge is with Allah.
________________________________________________
I agree that maybe it is better to avoid all forms of chess since we don't know the exact variation which was being referred to (if the word 'chess' is mentioned). You haven't, however, answered why you think it is haraam. I ask because there are a few similar games.

Originally Posted by naidamar
The hadith that you cited from muslim seems to be an error in translation, and the one cited by Dagless is more accurate:
It was Nbeel, not me.


Originally Posted by al yunan
Assalamu Alaikum brother,

A lot of Fatwas don't make sense to us ordinary folk as we are not A'lim.
The thing about Fiqh one has to have an holistic knowledge of Islam to understand it.
This particular decision by the Imam proves how inept is Muslim's understanding of Shariah for it's strange how Makruh Tahrimi leads to shirk which is worse than the Kufr of Haram.
I too questioned this and was told that a single act of Haram would lead one to be Kafir until the sin was atoned for or wrong restored e.t.c.
Whereas Makruh Tahrimi is to a deliberate act that is done continuously and it's this factor of repetition that makes it Shirk.
A single mistake is not the same a repetitive one for it involves Thought,Decision and Act.
We would truly be lost today without those scholars of old may Allah S.W.T bless and forgive them all.
The problem with most of us today is that we accept the first favourable decision that comes our way without doing a thorough research.
Ignorance of law is no excuse in this world's law and it's also so in Divine law.

May Allah S.W.T protects us from Ghaflah.(ignorance, stupidity, unbothered)
Masalam

PS: Has anyone concidered the figure carvings of the chess pieces ?
I would like more evidence on this if you have it. Whenever I hear the word shirk I take it to mean major shirk (ie. associating partners). A sin, whether done once or more is still a sin. I understand that it can lead to bigger sins and those can lead to shirk, but there is a difference between sin and shirk... otherwise I think most of us would be outside the fold of Islam.
Reply

al yunan
05-15-2011, 05:30 AM
Originally Posted by Dagless
I would like more evidence on this if you have it. Whenever I hear the word shirk I take it to mean major shirk (ie. associating partners). A sin, whether done once or more is still a sin. I understand that it can lead to bigger sins and those can lead to shirk, but there is a difference between sin and shirk... otherwise I think most of us would be outside the fold of Islam.
Assalamu Alaikum brother Dagless,

I suggest you take the matter up with some one who is versed on Imam Malik rahimullah Math'hab.
For me I lay my trust in the person who explained to me. As I mentioned it's strange and rightly so should you seek proof as I did.
The actual explanation is a lot lenghtier which also lead me to stop many other forms of time wasting.
I'm happy as a fellow Muslim that you take what might seem small matter to others seriously.
On the matter of Shirk, it's a broad subject with a lot of shocking realities and I strongly believe that all of us should strive to understant the principle well to avoid becoming it's victims and with out Was-Was.

Thanks for your reply and interest.
Masalam
Reply

Rhubarb Tart
05-15-2011, 06:43 AM
:sl:

I am still going to play chess. I don’t understand the reason Islam q and A gave. I am not fond of that site either. The same reason of wasting time can be applied to play station. And I dont waste time on chess.

:wa:
Reply

Anas Hasan
05-15-2011, 08:45 AM
بسم الله
I'm still not convinced that playing chess is haram, I mean ya there is a Hadeeth saying it's Haram but is the chess they were playing the same chess we play now.
You may say you don't have to be convinced in order to obey, and I know that the you don't have to know the wisdom in everything in islam, but I can say that until now I've never seen or heard anything in Islam Haram or Halal that didn't convince me.

Saying chess is Haram is going to open new other doors, like playing computer games, football, or any game, so the reason for Tahreem the chess must be known and clear.
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Muslim Woman
03-15-2012, 01:55 PM
:sl:


the hadith on chess are all authentic or some are weak ?
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