PDA

View Full Version : Haters. Go away.



M..x
05-10-2010, 06:43 PM
A general comment to all you haters.
If Islam offends you so much, why are you on an Islamic forum? Clearly you have nothing to say which would benefit Muslims and have no intention of seeking knowledge on Islam so what are you doing here?
I find your comments offensive, disgusting and rude.
I don't get it? You have nothing valuable to contribute to a site which aims to promote ISLAMIC beliefs but you have the nerve to come here throwing all sorts of ridiculous comments.
Do you not have anything better to do? Or why not kill your time on another forum which won't be so offensive to your delicate little heart (!)
I have had enough of Islam haters like you, and if spreading hate towards Islam is what floats your boat, please go to a forum that does that.
Islam is a peaceful faith, so go take the hate somewhere else. Please.
Reply

Login/Register to hide ads. Scroll down for more posts
Life_Is_Short
05-10-2010, 06:52 PM
A reminder for us Muslims:

The Qur’an says in Surah Nahl, chapter 16 verse 125:
’Invite (all) to the way of thy Lord with wisdom and beautiful preaching; and argue with them in ways that are best and most gracious.’ [Al-Qur’an 16:125]

‘The true servants of the Most Merciful are those who behave gently and with humility on earth, and whenever the foolish quarrel with them, they reply with [words of] peace.’ (al-Furqan 25: 63)


As for the "haters", I think the mods can deal with them.
Reply

Dagless
05-10-2010, 06:52 PM
Reply

cat eyes
05-10-2010, 07:03 PM
just this forum being here we are already inviting people to islam Alhamdulilah whether the non muslims decide to join or not. sister life is short im not going to disagree with that anyway lol but maybe if these non muslims actually mentioned islam once for us to preach to lol but they just talk about stuff that have no relation to islam what so ever
Reply

Welcome, Guest!
Hey there! Looks like you're enjoying the discussion, but you're not signed up for an account.

When you create an account, you can participate in the discussions and share your thoughts. You also get notifications, here and via email, whenever new posts are made. And you can like posts and make new friends.
Sign Up
Life_Is_Short
05-10-2010, 07:15 PM
Originally Posted by cat eyes
just this forum being here we are already inviting people to islam Alhamdulilah whether the non muslims decide to join or not. sister life is short im not going to disagree with that anyway lol but maybe if these non muslims actually mentioned islam once for us to preach to lol but they just talk about stuff that have no relation to islam what so ever
The last i heard IB serves to promote Islam. People who talk trash about Islam regardless of whether they are muslims or non-muslims should straight away be banned.
Reply

shuraimfan4lyf
05-10-2010, 08:01 PM
Originally Posted by Dagless
LOL..haha thats funny...
Reply

atheistbynature
05-10-2010, 10:28 PM
I have actually never read a hateful comment against Islam on this website or heard anyone saying they are offended by it. Reasonable criticism is a good thing and should not be taken as offensive.

This is a discussion forum, not everyone is going to agree. I think while you're calling people names you should wounder who it is thats really spreading hate here.
Reply

جوري
05-10-2010, 10:33 PM
Originally Posted by atheistbynature
I have actually never read a hateful comment against Islam on this website or heard anyone saying they are offended by it. Reasonable criticism is a good thing and should not be taken as offensive.

This is a discussion forum, not everyone is going to agree. I think while you're calling people names you should wounder who it is thats really spreading hate here.

Whose measure is weighing in on this formula? -- should we judge by your assessments-- because you have a whopping two posts and that should really weigh in heavily on the credibility meter?.. atheists really are a funny bunch!
Glad to see you good for something-- puerile confrontations and the occasional comedic relief!

all the best
Reply

atheistbynature
05-10-2010, 10:47 PM
I'm glad i amused you, but my point still stands can you give me an example of this hateful language.

And the post was talking about 'haters' just because i'm an atheist doesn't mean i'm a hater, i dont [B]hate[B] anyone. The original post is I'm glad i amused you, but my point still stands can you give me an example of this hateful language.

And the post was talking about 'haters' just because i'm an atheist doesn't mean i'm a hater, i dont [B]hate[B] anyone. The original post is ridiculous given many threads are addressed given many threads are addressed directly to atheists with questions.
Reply

atheistbynature
05-10-2010, 10:50 PM
whoops! dont know what happened there.

I'm glad i amused you, but my point still stands can you give me an example of this hateful language.

And the post was talking about 'haters' just because i'm an atheist doesn't mean i'm a hater, i dont hate anyone. The original post is ridiculous given many threads are addressed given many threads are addressed directly to atheists with questions.
Reply

جوري
05-10-2010, 10:52 PM
Originally Posted by atheistbynature
I'm glad i amused you, but my point still stands can you give me an example of this hateful language.
Only mildly so.. How do you break things down to someone with linear thinking abilities-- furthermore whose only claim to fame are his objections to this thread?
And the post was talking about 'haters' just because i'm an atheist doesn't mean i'm a hater, i dont [B]hate[B] anyone. The original post is I'm glad i amused you, but my point still stands can you give me an example of this hateful language.
Who the hell are you? did the post concern you? obviously the members here were speaking of an ongoing dialogue on a particular thread.. don't insinuate yourself in the middle and then come tell us about how you feel all victimized by proxy.. and again see above reply!
And the post was talking about 'haters' just because i'm an atheist doesn't mean i'm a hater, i dont [B]hate[B] anyone. The original post is ridiculous given many threads are addressed given many threads are addressed directly to atheists with questions.
I don't understand this mindless drivel and other meaningless repetitive echolalia!

all the best
Reply

Junon
05-10-2010, 11:08 PM
Salaam

Well heres an contender

'
Dear DataPacRat,
Please, and I'm speaking for myself, pygo, trumble, skav, cz, kading and the rest of the atheist commuity here (really, they all sent me PMs telling me to tell you this), go find your own thiests. These are ours. Isn't there a nice Mormon or Sikh forum you can harrass? There's like 5,000 religions, why try to take our thiests into to the shadowy realm of logic and rational discourse?

Oh and welcome to the forum.

Yours Truly,
Gator
A revealing insight into the mentality of dawkinites on this board, preachy to say the least

Always curious as to why athiests feel the need to create a 'community' in an Islamic forum of all places, validation in their lives, who knows?

Anyway yes its inevitable, if beliefs systems incompatible it will lead to much disagreement, not much can be done. :hmm:

There are some more sympathetic non Muslims on this board (eg. Eric, Karina, Glo) its best just to concentrate on conversing with them.
Reply

Dagless
05-10-2010, 11:45 PM
Originally Posted by atheistbynature
whoops! dont know what happened there.

I'm glad i amused you, but my point still stands can you give me an example of this hateful language.

And the post was talking about 'haters' just because i'm an atheist doesn't mean i'm a hater, i dont hate anyone. The original post is ridiculous given many threads are addressed given many threads are addressed directly to atheists with questions.
This made me lol. You've been a member since April and have 4 posts. What makes you think you're qualified to judge a post as ridiculous? I have seen quite a few of the threads in question and most are deleted.

I agree with the OP in that there are a few atheists registered who I don't believe are here to ask questions, or learn, or build bridges, etc. I usually don't read their threads and just skip over their posts in threads which interest me. I think most members on here get a good feel for who is genuine and who is not after a while.

Originally Posted by Junon
There are some more sympathetic non Muslims on this board
I don't like the term 'sympathetic'; for me its just mutual respect. The attitude that you believe what you believe and I believe what I believe, but that doesn't mean you're a lesser human, or less intelligent. Either you are respectful of others or you're not. To be fair though most people around that age are pompous; I'm sure life will humble them later on.
Reply

جوري
05-10-2010, 11:46 PM
^^ loved both your posts (I am glad I wasn't the only one loling at our new guests comments).. and the whole sympathetic thing hmmmmm.. I can think of at least one person on that list who is anything but the proverbial wolf in sheep's clothing!

:w:
Reply

Darth Ultor
05-10-2010, 11:58 PM
Don't feed the trolls.
Reply

جوري
05-11-2010, 12:01 AM
Originally Posted by Boaz
Don't feed the trolls.
Boaz.. how did you become so wise.. and can you tell me more about Jacob's ladder in Jewish folklore?

if you convert you'll give us the best of both worlds.. have you heard of 'Israelyat'?
Reply

Darth Ultor
05-11-2010, 12:44 AM
I don't remember the story too well. What's the Israelyat?
Reply

جوري
05-11-2010, 12:51 AM
Originally Posted by Boaz
I don't remember the story too well. What's the Israelyat?
They are the stories that Jews gave the Muslims after they converted to Islam.. I have written about one here:
http://www.islamicboard.com/comparat...ml#post1320531

I like listening and learning of such stories.. if you have some you should share them.. stories of virtue ..

peace
Reply

shuraimfan4lyf
05-11-2010, 12:58 AM
:sl:

Our Imam told us that story in a khutba once..subhanAllah its just amazing..
Reply

Ummu Sufyaan
05-11-2010, 05:03 AM
Originally Posted by M..x
A general comment to all you haters.
If Islam offends you so much, why are you on an Islamic forum? Clearly you have nothing to say which would benefit Muslims and have no intention of seeking knowledge on Islam so what are you doing here?
I find your comments offensive, disgusting and rude.
I don't get it? You have nothing valuable to contribute to a site which aims to promote ISLAMIC beliefs but you have the nerve to come here throwing all sorts of ridiculous comments.
Do you not have anything better to do? Or why not kill your time on another forum which won't be so offensive to your delicate little heart (!)
I have had enough of Islam haters like you, and if spreading hate towards Islam is what floats your boat, please go to a forum that does that.
Islam is a peaceful faith, so go take the hate somewhere else. Please.
yeah, bugger off you bullies.
Reply

M..x
05-11-2010, 10:32 AM
I have actually never read a hateful comment against Islam on this website or heard anyone saying they are offended by it. Reasonable criticism is a good thing and should not be taken as offensive.
Given that you've been a member for such a short period of time, your hardly in a position to be saying that. And if you had come across some of the posts that I have and many of the members on this forum have (Which has led to the banning of some members who have done as I have described) you woudn't be saying that. =)

This is a discussion forum, not everyone is going to agree.
There's a difference between leading a constructive debate about an issue and it is something completely different hurling baseless silly comments which have no value and which will provoke an argument.

I think while you're calling people names you should wounder who it is thats really spreading hate here.
This was a general comment, and I don't recall my comments specifically applying to 'atheists' or 'Christians'. It was a GENERAL remark. I thought I made that clear.


The original post is ridiculous given many threads are addressed given many threads are addressed directly to atheists with questions.
Not really, its an issue of respect. I'd say the same if it was a case of Muslims acting in an inappropriate way.
What I do find 'ridiculous' though is, when I do have time to come on this and see hateful comments by people. I mean, like we haven't got enough hate towards Muslims as it is, and this is going on in an Islamic forum where non-Muslims have the audacity to come and post such filthy remarks. If you don't like the religion, go away. Simple as. =)
Reply

Skavau
05-11-2010, 02:37 PM
This thread was created (presumably, as the exact same post exists in the thread) directly in response to an example I gave to marwen, in ironically a civilised discussion about the nature of free-speech and the role (or lack of role) that censorship should play. Indeed it should also be noted that the thread me and marwen were conversing in happened to have been started by a Muslim - who seeked to gather support for those who would wish punishment upon those who insult Muhammed. Every single non-muslim poster in that thread has been posting defensively, in direct response to claims made by Muslims. Every single non-muslim poster in that thread, as well, has been posting in a mature and non hateful manner.

Do I deny that there have been offensive non-muslims that come to this forum with the objective to insult, mock, or propagate? No. I can identify them myself pretty quickly. They often also get removed fairly quickly. I also have never actually started a thread on here. I cannot recall Pygoscelis having ever began a thread on here. I cannot recall Hugo having began a thread on here. All of our posts tend to be defensive or inquisitive in nature and often direct responses to claims made by Muslims about atheism, or about humanism, or about secularism, or about something disagreeable. I have no problem with this and indeed it is precisely what I would expect of a Muslim-ran forum.
Reply

جوري
05-11-2010, 02:46 PM
Originally Posted by Skavau
. I cannot recall Pygoscelis having ever began a thread on here. I cannot recall Hugo having began a thread on here.
Maybe you should go into their profile and do a little research before you make another one of your inane observations? It is too late I think to save face now!

Nice to see though that there is honor amongst the 'humanists'.. Every day your practices and points of views become more degenerate and change to acquiesce to the changing tides .. one wonders how you develop loyalties at all.. Perhaps a loyalty to degeneracy then?

all the best
Reply

Ramadhan
05-11-2010, 03:47 PM
Originally Posted by Skavau
This thread was created (presumably, as the exact same post exists in the thread) directly in response to an example I gave to marwen, in ironically a civilised discussion about the nature of free-speech and the role (or lack of role) that censorship should play. Indeed it should also be noted that the thread me and marwen were conversing in happened to have been started by a Muslim - who seeked to gather support for those who would wish punishment upon those who insult Muhammed. Every single non-muslim poster in that thread has been posting defensively, in direct response to claims made by Muslims. Every single non-muslim poster in that thread, as well, has been posting in a mature and non hateful manner.

Do I deny that there have been offensive non-muslims that come to this forum with the objective to insult, mock, or propagate? No. I can identify them myself pretty quickly. They often also get removed fairly quickly. I also have never actually started a thread on here. I cannot recall Pygoscelis having ever began a thread on here. I cannot recall Hugo having began a thread on here. All of our posts tend to be defensive or inquisitive in nature and often direct responses to claims made by Muslims about atheism, or about humanism, or about secularism, or about something disagreeable. I have no problem with this and indeed it is precisely what I would expect of a Muslim-ran forum.
I apologize beforehand if this come across as being offensive, but I find the sentences in bold wildly funny.
Reply

جوري
05-11-2010, 04:47 PM
Originally Posted by naidamar
I apologize beforehand if this come across as being offensive, but I find the sentences in bold wildly funny.
funny guy posts in the other thread an alleged south-park toon against 'the holocaust' not even bothering to read the anti-defamation league praise for the patent Mel Gibson mockery.. it does take a certain wit to appreciate the caustic 'humor' in those cartoons and it is rather funny that the folks who feel they have 'superior intellect' to the rest can miss something that is slapping them in the face.. another side to hypocrisy perhaps.. or perhaps they like to cater to their own mentation that no one is going to bother investigate something their holiness put down!

:w:
Reply

Dagless
05-11-2010, 05:01 PM
Originally Posted by τhε ṿαlε'ṡ lïlÿ
Maybe you should go into their profile and do a little research before you make another one of your inane observations? It is too late I think to save face now!
I agree, someone with such intellect should have realised that a search button exists and facts are easily verified... might have been better to stick to nihilism.

"I cannot recall"; the best thing to say when you know you're not telling the entire truth. Either don't say the thing, or check it.

He also avoided answering Junon's comment where he was mentioned. I would have thought that was the most revealing thing which needed to be addressed. I would suggest complete denial or another "I cannot recall"... It usually works.
Reply

Skavau
05-11-2010, 05:12 PM
Originally Posted by Dagless
I agree, someone with such intellect should have realised that a search button exists and facts are easily verified... might have been better to stick to nihilism.
Perhaps Pygoscelis and Hugo have made threads. Whether they have or not was not the central point. The point was is that none of us are specifically offensive, rude or in anyway insulting in our mannerisms and spend more time defending our points than we do attacking other peoples worldviews.

He also avoided answering Junon's comment where he was mentioned. I would have thought that was the most revealing thing which needed to be addressed. I would suggest complete denial or another "I cannot recall"... It usually works.
What comment? Are you talking about this?

Originally Posted by Junon
Dear DataPacRat,
Please, and I'm speaking for myself, pygo, trumble, skav, cz, kading and the rest of the atheist commuity here (really, they all sent me PMs telling me to tell you this), go find your own thiests. These are ours. Isn't there a nice Mormon or Sikh forum you can harrass? There's like 5,000 religions, why try to take our thiests into to the shadowy realm of logic and rational discourse?
It was a joke. I've never sent blackpool an IM regarding that.
Reply

LauraS
05-11-2010, 05:17 PM
I agree there should be respect and it should be on both sides. I'm starting to get a little tired of being spoken to really snidely in answer to simple questions, such as on the Noah's Ark thread when I'm not even posting anything rude. I think I'm just going to avois certain members because I know there are people on here who are much more polite.
Reply

Ramadhan
05-11-2010, 05:44 PM
Originally Posted by LauraS
I agree there should be respect and it should be on both sides. I'm starting to get a little tired of being spoken to really snidely in answer to simple questions, such as on the Noah's Ark thread when I'm not even posting anything rude. I think I'm just going to avois certain members because I know there are people on here who are much more polite.
I haven't been on IB nearly as long as sis Lily, but even I could detect between people who ask genuine questions, and others who come to the discussions pretending asking questions but with snide agenda of their own.
For your information, there have been countless discussions which were very fruitful, beneficial to all and ran its good course because people involved were genuine in seeking answers or giving their contribution in good manner.
Reply

LauraS
05-11-2010, 05:55 PM
I have been asking genuine questions, I haven't come on here to insult people and don't have some sort of secret agenda. Like I said, it's only certain members.
Reply

Ramadhan
05-11-2010, 06:00 PM
Originally Posted by LauraS
I have been asking genuine questions, I haven't come on here to insult people and don't have some sort of secret agenda.
Many others, including me, might perceive you asking mad_scientist if he is really a muslim a not so genuine question.
Reply

جوري
05-11-2010, 06:09 PM
Originally Posted by Dagless
I agree, someone with such intellect should have realised that a search button exists and facts are easily verified... might have been better to stick to nihilism.

"I cannot recall"; the best thing to say when you know you're not telling the entire truth. Either don't say the thing, or check it.

He also avoided answering Junon's comment where he was mentioned. I would have thought that was the most revealing thing which needed to be addressed. I would suggest complete denial or another "I cannot recall"... It usually works.
Well as I always say-- if you are looking for sub-mediocre persuasions, perversions of truths and the usual comedic relief .. you can always look to one of their posts.. You know what strikes me is, if this is the level of fidelity (or lack thereof) with which they approach other areas of their lives.. I can't imagine as an employer hiring folks or seeking business from folks this provincial. They are either directly deceptive which in fact would be in concert with their code of ethics or believe that everyone else is beneath them intellectually, socially, morally etc. and just huckster their crap out because well who is going to question it?

:w:
Reply

Woodrow
05-11-2010, 06:30 PM
I just want to interject a thought at this point:


Keep in mind we are not a scholastic site. It is not within our ability to educate, teach, or give in Tasfir. we do not and will not claim to be Islamic teachers, Mufti, or scholars.

Our goal is very basic, very simple and not much more than kindergarten level. Our goal is simple, basic truth. to let us learn the truth about each other, smash stereotypical views and let non Muslims learn what a Muslim is, without being limited to the stereotype.

A secondary goal is for us to learn the truth about non-Muslims and not what our stereotypical view tells us they are. Perhaps we can live side by side without offending each other, if we learn how we sometimes unjustly offend each other.



With that in mind should we be trying to reach those who know and love us, or should we be trying to reach those who despise us and believe the lies?


In the mean time, we all can try to learn to debate, with facts - not hate. Legitimate debates should be educational, productive and enjoyable. If we do not have those, it is not a debate.
Reply

جوري
05-11-2010, 08:54 PM
Br. woodrow you may always interject with a little candor and a large sized tranquilizer gun
Reply

LauraS
05-11-2010, 09:11 PM
Originally Posted by naidamar
Many others, including me, might perceive you asking mad_scientist if he is really a muslim a not so genuine question.
I really meant no offence, I didn't phrase it as "really" a Muslim. It's just he claimed to have little knowledge of Islam so I was confused. That's the truth whether you believe it or not, I didn't realise it was him "not bragging" about his knowledge as apparently we do in the west
Reply

Ummu Sufyaan
05-12-2010, 01:29 AM
Originally Posted by LauraS
I have been asking genuine questions, I haven't come on here to insult people and don't have some sort of secret agenda. Like I said, it's only certain members.
maybe you should take into consideration that perhaps certain things maybe offensive to us, and thus should be reworded. not having a go at you personally, but I've seen one thread of yours, replied in it once, and unsubscribed becuase i know it would have just been going around in circles and possibly not tried being understood how its meant to be, but rather from a pre-formed/presumptuous opinion, it would have been viewed.

these threads that some people make just seem to be made with a certain (insincere) intend and thus are just going to breed argument without an aim. its as if you the truth and yet knowingly twist it around just to cause some controversy. these things have been repeated over and over and over and over and....(well you get the drift) again. if you want to ask, first search. if nothing makes sense, ask using some manners. holy moly, people learn good manners at the age of 5!

i mean seriously people for those who intend insult and harm, if you ask question, surely you have the consideration to ask them politely and not come here all guns blazin' expecting to be treated kindly. get real.
Reply

Woodrow
05-12-2010, 03:05 AM
Originally Posted by Ummu Sufyaan
maybe you should take into consideration that perhaps certain things maybe offensive to us, and thus should be reworded. not having a go at you personally, but I've seen one thread of yours, replied in it once, and unsubscribed becuase i know it would have just been going around in circles and possibly not tried being understood how its meant to be, but rather from a pre-formed/presumptuous opinion, it would have been viewed.

these threads that some people make just seem to be made with a certain (insincere) intend and thus are just going to breed argument without an aim. its as if you the truth and yet knowingly twist it around just to cause some controversy. these things have been repeated over and over and over and over and....(well you get the drift) again. if you want to ask, first search. if nothing makes sense, ask using some manners. holy moly, people learn good manners at the age of 5!

i mean seriously people for those who intend insult and harm, if you ask question, surely you have the consideration to ask them politely and not come here all guns blazin' expecting to be treated kindly. get real.
:sl:

I believe you may have touched on something that is the basis of many bad feelings. It is true many non-Muslims do say and do things we find to be extremely objectionable, argumentative, insulting and out right offensive. Yet, I doubt if the majority are aware of it and see us as just being overly emotional. Perhaps one of the best mutual services we can do is to point out specifically why something offends us and elicits anger. A little education and explanations can reduce many misunderstandings.

I find that very few people are actually bad and intend to offend, but a very large number of people are ignorant of what is offensive to people outside their own belief system. Education, explanations and by example just may go a long ways.

We do have people that come here with the intent of bashing us. They never last past the moment any mod or admin becomes aware of them. One good tool all members have is access to the report button. We actually do pay attention to reports. We do take action. The action may not be visible to everybody, but if an offense has been committed, the mods and the offender are aware of the action and what needs to be done. Use the report button, there is no advantage in any member taking matters in their own hands.
Reply

جوري
05-12-2010, 03:08 AM
Br. Woodrow we are under no-obligation to wait until someone has 200 infraction pts. for a permanent ban-- really I personally run on zero tolerance. If they can't respect the religion of this forum, then they need not be here, the web is littered with a gamut of anti-Islamic sites which share their sentiment in various grades.
I am so appalled truly instead of greeting potential converts and clarifying things for them we waste our time on these net gadflies and trolls.

To me that is absolutely unnecessary!

:w:
Reply

Woodrow
05-12-2010, 04:04 AM
Originally Posted by τhε ṿαlε'ṡ lïlÿ
Br. Woodrow we are under no-obligation to wait until someone has 200 infraction pts. for a permanent ban-- really I personally run on zero tolerance. If they can't respect the religion of this forum, then they need not be here, the web is littered with a gamut of anti-Islamic sites which share their sentiment in various grades.
I am so appalled truly instead of greeting potential converts and clarifying things for them we waste our time on these net gadflies and trolls.

To me that is absolutely unnecessary!

:w:
:sl: Ukhti,

Just my own opinion. I also despise the gadflies and trolls. I have no delusion that anything I say or do will change there opinion of Islam nor open their eye's to the Love of Allaah(swt). I actually have a very fast temper, I do anger easily, but my trial on earth has become one of self control and know that I have no control over how others act or behave, but I do have control over how I treat others and my burden in my later years is now one of patience and self control I can not guide as much as one person to Islam and I can not prove any non believer is wrong, but I can through my actions and words show that as a Muslim I act out of peace and seek fairness for all people, which is a very big change from my pre-reverting life. Islam led me to Peace and part of this Peace removed the hate and impatience I had in the past
Reply

LauraS
05-12-2010, 08:41 AM
Then can I set the record straight? I haven't come here with the intention of offending anybody I just wanted to discuss with Muslims the issues that are in the press at the moment, which are the wars in Afghanistan and Iraq and obviously the niqab. I've never said I support the wars I've been debating with myself the rights and wrongs. As for the niqab, I do respect that women wear it out of faith but I also agree with Supreme's post on the thread itself. We will obviously have different opinions on matters but don't think I want to cause trouble because of it. To my knowledge I've never posted anything in an outright rude manner, but if I do say something worded in the wrong sort of way, as Woodrow says, just tell me.
Reply

marwen
05-12-2010, 02:57 PM
I didn't want to post in this thread because I want to end this tension between the forum members. But I want just to add some words to Br. Woodrow's comment that I think it sums up the situation.

1) First, a message for muslim brothers and sisters : we need as muslims to be kind with all people. We especially need to avoid rude replies to the comments that we feel offending and just to reply calmly and show the truth in the most polite form. We really need to represent the right picture of our Prophet S.A.W and how he kindly deal with people offending him.

2) Second, a message for non-muslim brothers and sisters : I just want to let you know that muslims are your brothers in humanity. There is no difference between muslims and non muslims except the belief that is a personal opinion. Every human has the right to choose his belief he think is right. That's how muslims also think, and muslims are not trying to invade your belief or to force you to be muslim, but people who are interested in learning about Islam can get the knowledge they want here. You are welcome to present your ideas and your arguments free from insults or inapropriate comments, and we are happy to hear your point of view, but let's keep it at the level of discussion, and personal judgements are to be avoided.

3) For muslims and non-muslims (all the members) : as Br. Woodrow clarified above, if you feel that a post is being offensive for you, or for your beliefs, you can just report it to admins. And we have to avoid mutual hate and insults.
Reply

Ummu Sufyaan
05-13-2010, 02:23 AM
wa alaykum us-Salaam
Originally Posted by Woodrow
:sl:

I believe you may have touched on something that is the basis of many bad feelings. It is true many non-Muslims do say and do things we find to be extremely objectionable, argumentative, insulting and out right offensive. Yet, I doubt if the majority are aware of it and see us as just being overly emotional. Perhaps one of the best mutual services we can do is to point out specifically why something offends us and elicits anger. A little education and explanations can reduce many misunderstandings.

I find that very few people are actually bad and intend to offend, but a very large number of people are ignorant of what is offensive to people outside their own belief system. Education, explanations and by example just may go a long ways.

We do have people that come here with the intent of bashing us. They never last past the moment any mod or admin becomes aware of them. One good tool all members have is access to the report button. We actually do pay attention to reports. We do take action. The action may not be visible to everybody, but if an offense has been committed, the mods and the offender are aware of the action and what needs to be done. Use the report button, there is no advantage in any member taking matters in their own hands.
akhee when you know certain things are controversial and that know Muslims get insulted by it, but yet insist on bringing up the same old topic
when the thread gets so overally repetitive that the trouble makers just wont give up or change their veiws and ignore the information given to clarify the matter
when non-muslims insert into their posts cunning remarks aimed to insult Islam and Muslims then go off crying and try to pin the blame on others when stood up to

do all these sound like someone who is interested in learning. i have thought about what you mentioned but then i think this is no-qay the indication that someone is trying to ask and seek knowledge. ive seen non-muslims here who are interested in Islam, and they know how to ask and dont do so with an attitute.
when you go ask you neighbor for something, you knock on their door and ask politely not barge in and take whatever you need from their house without permission then get all angry when you haven't taken the steps to bother asking nicely.

i have taken into consideration that yes, they perhaps dont know any better, but then reread and consider what ive seen of their posts and it doesn't do it for me.
Reply

M..x
05-13-2010, 10:48 AM
Wow. I had not intended for this thread to get into a debate.
I accept that Muslim members on this forum SHOULD be respectful to other views, whether that be another Muslim or a Non-Muslim. However, having said that, it is equally a duty upon Non-Muslims NOT to come out with snide hurtful remarks and reply with the same level of respect.
As I said that, using supposed 'examples' and 'theories' on Islam are not going to benefit anyone, especially a forum which aims to promote Islamic views and they are instead going to create tension and rifts between members.
It is true to say then that if you have nothing of any value to post, just don't do it?
I didn't intend to attack any specific individual but this was actually a post from another thread that just escalated into an argument. I thought my comment was general and advice to all Non-Muslims who do come on the forum to do just as I have described. I think its a waste of time for them to be posting such remarks knowing that they are based on fallacies and misinterpretations of Islamic views, and a waste of time of Muslim Members who are inevitably going to get defensive and try to refute them. But if such comments weren't made in the first place, arguments like that wouldn't occur either.
Just thought I'd clarify myself.
Peace.
Reply

Woodrow
05-13-2010, 07:05 PM
Originally Posted by Ummu Sufyaan
wa alaykum us-Salaam


akhee when you know certain things are controversial and that know Muslims get insulted by it, but yet insist on bringing up the same old topic
when the thread gets so overally repetitive that the trouble makers just wont give up or change their veiws and ignore the information given to clarify the matter
when non-muslims insert into their posts cunning remarks aimed to insult Islam and Muslims then go off crying and try to pin the blame on others when stood up to

do all these sound like someone who is interested in learning. i have thought about what you mentioned but then i think this is no-qay the indication that someone is trying to ask and seek knowledge. ive seen non-muslims here who are interested in Islam, and they know how to ask and dont do so with an attitute.
when you go ask you neighbor for something, you knock on their door and ask politely not barge in and take whatever you need from their house without permission then get all angry when you haven't taken the steps to bother asking nicely.

i have taken into consideration that yes, they perhaps dont know any better, but then reread and consider what ive seen of their posts and it doesn't do it for me.
:sl:

Very good post and some important considerations.

All religious discussions among different faiths are extremely controversial. I really doubt if it is possible for any person to discuss what they believe without out having others see it as promotion of that belief.

We all need to keep in mind that when a member of any faith states what their beliefs or non-beliefs are. Those statements will offend some people of other faiths.

when we read the beliefs of a person who follows different beliefs we need to always be aware and mindful of several things:

1. We are going to be offended.

2. the person is expressing what they believe, not the intent to offend anybody.

3. The person is going to find our reply offensive.

4. Personal attacks of any person is not going to make the conversation less offensive.

The goal is mutual agreement to avoid out right deliberate attacks of others. To do this we all need to learn to address statements and not people. To base replies upon verifiable facts and not upon feelings, and to accept that no matter what we say or present will most likely not be ligical or believable to the other person.

It is a very difficult job to live in peace with others, yet the results are worth the effort, if we do learn to disagree without malice.
Reply

Skavau
05-13-2010, 07:59 PM
Originally Posted by Mx
Wow. I had not intended for this thread to get into a debate.
I accept that Muslim members on this forum SHOULD be respectful to other views, whether that be another Muslim or a Non-Muslim. However, having said that, it is equally a duty upon Non-Muslims NOT to come out with snide hurtful remarks and reply with the same level of respect.
As I said that, using supposed 'examples' and 'theories' on Islam are not going to benefit anyone, especially a forum which aims to promote Islamic views and they are instead going to create tension and rifts between members.
I'd like to say first that Woodrow has handled this situation with grace and is trying very well to bridge the gaps. These gaps with me however are artificial and I try to talk with everyone in the same manner.

I would like also say and repeat again that I never come out with any deliberate snide or hurtful remarks to anyone much less Islam. Indeed I know what prompted this thread and I won't repeat the issue there, but I am sure you aware now yourself that it was a misunderstanding of what I was trying to say in the context of a civil debate between me and marwen. It is unfortunate but when you debates on things such as free-speech, theistic morality and express a specific or perhaps controversial opinion on current events that people are going to be offended, and sometimes respond negatively.

I can't help that. And in the topic in question that prompted this thread, I would have imagined that any response by me or anyone else supporting the argument I was making would have prompted some sort of outrage from some of the more sensitive members on the forum. Perhaps the creation of a new sub-forum with a focus on issues like these would be in order. It does not fit into Comparative Religion, and they aren't Clarifications on Islam.
Reply

Junon
05-17-2010, 03:33 PM
Salaam

I don't like the term 'sympathetic'; for me its just mutual respect. The attitude that you believe what you believe and I believe what I believe, but that doesn't mean you're a lesser human, or less intelligent. Either you are respectful of others or you're not. To be fair though most people around that age are pompous; I'm sure life will humble them later on.
Well we can hope, but in all honesty it wont happen. I think with other religionists and perhaps agnositics progress can be made, despite our differences we are still aiming for the same goal no matter how much we'd disagree. With atheists (particularly the dawkinite type) its quite pointless.

Barney

I'm antitheist, sure. I'd rather people embrace reality and see theism as the biggest and greatest obstacle to peace between all peoples. This is no more of a pipedream than The world submitting to Bhuddism or Islam or Christianity.
Usual atheist drivel, not much different from the rhetoric Marxists would spout in the old Soviet Union for example

Religion is a fanatic and perverse reflection of the world
'religion has become the medium for spiritual enslavement of the masses'
"If atheism solved all human woe, then the Soviet Union would have been an empire of joy and dancing bunnies, instead of the land of corpses."
— John C. Wright
In fact it would be immense hypocrisy on their part to acnknowledge your position something akin to us accepting that Allah has partners and the like, so dont hold your breath. . . . .

If your interested in the history theres a book by Alister McGrath called the Twilight of Atheism, worth checking out.

To be fair though there are some athiests and secular people who are not impressed by the 'new atheism. For example Micheal Ruse (no believer in God) said 'The God Delusion makes me embarassed to be an atheist' and after Dawkins television series 'The root of all evil?' (Religion = evil etc etc) one of Alister McGraths atheist colleagues said 'Dont judge the rest of us by this pseudo-intellectual drivel.'

Plus you have people like Norman finkelstein (atheist) who campaigns for the Palestinain cause so we have to be careful about unfair labelling, all we have to do is sort out the wheat from the chaff.

I also agree with the whole young people and their egos, (anyone remember Kev the teenager? ;D) hopefully they will chill out as they get older.

and the whole sympathetic thing hmmmmm.. I can think of at least one person on that list who is anything but the proverbial wolf in sheep's clothing!
Yeah always something to watch for.
Reply

glo
05-17-2010, 07:25 PM
Originally Posted by Woodrow
:sl: Ukhti,

Just my own opinion. I also despise the gadflies and trolls. I have no delusion that anything I say or do will change there opinion of Islam nor open their eye's to the Love of Allaah(swt). I actually have a very fast temper, I do anger easily, but my trial on earth has become one of self control and know that I have no control over how others act or behave, but I do have control over how I treat others and my burden in my later years is now one of patience and self control I can not guide as much as one person to Islam and I can not prove any non believer is wrong, but I can through my actions and words show that as a Muslim I act out of peace and seek fairness for all people, which is a very big change from my pre-reverting life. Islam led me to Peace and part of this Peace removed the hate and impatience I had in the past
That's a wonderful example of what happens when we allow God to work in us and through us!
Thank you for sharing, Woodrow. :)
Reply

IslamicRevival
05-17-2010, 09:07 PM
Originally Posted by M..x
A general comment to all you haters.
If Islam offends you so much, why are you on an Islamic forum? Clearly you have nothing to say which would benefit Muslims and have no intention of seeking knowledge on Islam so what are you doing here?
I find your comments offensive, disgusting and rude.
I don't get it? You have nothing valuable to contribute to a site which aims to promote ISLAMIC beliefs but you have the nerve to come here throwing all sorts of ridiculous comments.
Do you not have anything better to do? Or why not kill your time on another forum which won't be so offensive to your delicate little heart (!)
I have had enough of Islam haters like you, and if spreading hate towards Islam is what floats your boat, please go to a forum that does that.
Islam is a peaceful faith, so go take the hate somewhere else. Please.
With an attitude such as this, we'll drive many people who are researching Islam and thinking of reverting away. Yes, many may dislike Islam but its our golden chance to show them what Islam is really about. Let them hate, maybe they will eventually open their heart and accept Islam?

Allah Azzawajal Knows Best
Reply

Hey there! Looks like you're enjoying the discussion, but you're not signed up for an account.

When you create an account, you can participate in the discussions and share your thoughts. You also get notifications, here and via email, whenever new posts are made. And you can like posts and make new friends.
Sign Up

IslamicBoard

Experience a richer experience on our mobile app!