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h-n
07-10-2010, 01:20 AM
The problem lies with people not reading the Quran and remembering Allah and the Day of Judgement.

If you want to get married to another Muslim, then certainly remain strong, and get married. As no other Muslim should be preventing another Muslim from marrying another, that is unIslamic. Did not the companions of the Prophet Muhammad peace be upon him also get married to who they wanted? Yes people say talk about Guardian, but you can't blindly listen to him, when clearly the Guardian is not following Islam. For if he feared Allah, he would certainly not be opposing people wanting to get married. You test is paramount (your duty lies with yourself passing your own test ( to do what it takes to pass), not duty to other who frankly will not care about you on the Day of Judgement, you worshipping Allah and being his servant comes first. Marriages are accepted by Allah, even if your Guardian does not approve. As Allah is Merciful and Compassionate. I have provided reasons below.

Getting married to someone you don't like

If you get married to someone you don't like, you are the one who will be living with him, sleeping with him (so of course no one should tell you who to get married to). If you die, you potentially stay married to that person forever in the next world-so certainly you have to remain strong, and no matter the oppostion as I see it, your not only fighting what you want in this world but also what you want in the next world!

Even there was a case that I heard where a Mother forced her daughter to get married, she spat on the photo that she was shown of her future husband, and she was beaten up, now years down the line they have four children, and still together. The Mother is very pleased with this arrangement. Absolutely the end does NOT justify the means. This is on her bad record that she forced her daughter to get married.

Treat daughters like princesses, afterall even the women in Paradise aren't forced to get married!!

In Paradise

What about if your parents met the person that you wished to get married in this world. If you asked your parents if they would have had any objections if you married in Paradise the answer is No!! So it is your parents and others forgetting the life of the next world.

If your parents had more children, they would not be oppressing their children and saying they can't get married to who they want in Paradise, so why be constrained on Earth? When you are marrying another Muslim.

Of course if you both made it to Paradise, your parents will certainly not be complaining of your choice of husband/wife.

Sexual relationships

Your parents are being selfish. They already should be aware, of course about people's sexual desires (having already had a sexual relationship themselves), so they should not be preventing another from having sex without commiting a sin.

I am not impressed that parents ask for some to marry someone from another country and they have to wait to get a VISA, and wait to actually be with their husband/wife. To me its a joke.

Test

This is your life, its your test, if your ready to get married and you fear committing a sin, then be strong and go for getting married. Your parents cannot say that you have to wait for years to have a sexual relationship with someone and make your life a misery. You are responsible for how you are and what you do.

Allah is testing you and seeing what you can do. We respect parents, but that does not mean that we do everything they ask us to do. Then what is the point of having our own minds and bodies?? If you can't even say who you want to have sex with, then what they hell is the point of being an individual?

You don't want to just say on the Day of Judgement, that I did this, and this, and this and never anything else because that is what my parents wanted. As people wished they pushed on, and remained strong and steadfast and fought off any criticism.

Your parents are not going to care about it on the Day of Judgement. They are not going to complain that you got married to so and so. This is a joke, even a women approached the Prophet asking him to marry her, people did not say she had to go through a Wali. Even Prophets chose who to get married to.

Be strong as you don't have to go through anyone to become a Muslim, to be accepted by Allah. You shouldn't have to be forced to defend what you need and want to do in Islam that is right!! If they force you to, then be strong and push on to get married, You will regret not doing this in the next world and listening to society rubbish!! All your parents opposition will look stupid on the Day of Judgement.

To stand up strong as Men and Women, being mature and responsible and seeking marriages and not being forced to whine and act as children to your parents, to seek what is right and lawful!! Stand up strong, you will not regret doing this, what you will regret is not doing it!!!

Follow up from the "Society Evils" thread
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Rhubarb Tart
07-10-2010, 01:26 AM
Mashallah!!! I like what you have written!!! great advise!

But one thing though, most scholar if not all say that a muslim woman (a virgin in particular) has to have Wali (usually the father) permission. what do you have to say that?
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h-n
07-10-2010, 01:37 AM
Originally Posted by sweet106
Mashallah!!! I like what you have written!!! great advise!

But one thing though, most scholar if not all say that a muslim woman (a virgin in particular) has to have Wali (usually the father) permission. what do you have to say that?

1. The same the virgin's first duty is to herself passing her test. So she should recognise that her Guardian is breaking the rules of not allowing her to get married to another Muslims. She certainly does not need to listen to people who are not being religious, because if she listened to him, she is following something unIslamic.

2. If she cannot get approval to marry another Muslim, she can still get married as it was unIslamic to stop her, should she follow rules which are not Islamic? No. The marriage is still recognised by Allah, as he is Merciful and Compassionate.

3. So the fact is, is she listening to the Wali first or to Islamic rules? If the Wali was being Islamic he would never have refused, so if he refuses she can still get married and she is still following what is Islamic, and the marriage is valid!! The is no difference being don't bother thinking do that other Islamic thing, as I forbid it to you. You wouldn't listen to Satan telling you not to pray first before eating. How can someone forbid you something that is lawful? They cannot and you wouldn't be doing an Islamic thing by following them. Do not, and never listen to people first, listen to Islam first!!

To go through a Wali, was to protect the women, but there is nothing to say they have the right to make something unlawful which is lawful, they do not have the right to decline what clearly is the right for her to get married to another Muslim.

No Muslim who fears Allah and the Last Day would ever refuse. So don't listen to people who don't fear Allah and the Last Day, as you will be regretting it.
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Ummu Sufyaan
07-10-2010, 07:50 AM
:sl:
good thread.

i do disagree however with the way you have spoken about parents by using such terms as "Your parents are being selfish."

and this:
If you die, you potentially stay married to that person forever in the next world-so certainly you have to remain strong, and no matter the oppostion as I see it, your not only fighting what you want in this world but also what you want in the next world!
i want some strong solid evidences as to why you will stay married to your partner of this life, in the hereafter if you don't want them.


Treat daughters like princesses, afterall even the women in Paradise aren't forced to get married!!
ditto that. but not to the extreme, because then they become spoilt-like princesses.
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h-n
07-10-2010, 09:35 AM
Originally Posted by Ummu Sufyaan
:sl:
good thread.

i do disagree however with the way you have spoken about parents by using such terms as "Your parents are being selfish."

and this:

i want some strong solid evidences as to why you will stay married to your partner of this life, in the hereafter if you don't want them.



ditto that. but not to the extreme, because then they become spoilt-like princesses.
1. I wouldn't change a thing about what I said about parents, frankly they listen to society rather then Islam, they are being selfish and not looking out for the interests of who their children want to marry. Its absolutely disrespectful and has tough repercussions on the individuals involved etc. They are being selfish, they were young, they know that people want to get married etc.

I will never take it back. I already discussed this a bit more in "Society evils" threads. Of course they are selfish, they rather consider what they want rather what their children want, even some parents resorting to emotional blackmail, by telling their children that they are the source of their anguish etc. So they are happy to talk about how they feel, but dismiss how their children feel. Happy to push on and talk about what they want, but dismiss what their children want. So that by definition is being selfish, to not consider other people, but your own wants. I don't care for excuses about looking after the child's best interest, frankly you don't do anything to get your child to marry and potentially have sex with someone they don't want to be with, that is also abusive.

They want to be respected as parents, then they should act as parents, just as people who want to be treated with respect then respect others. I am not endorsing disrepect but honesty, and I am sure that if they are capable of forcing someone to get married then they are not "innocent", sure they can handle being told the truth, after all their daughters for example would have gone through a lot worse, ie by being raped.

Being a parent does not suddenly make you immune from any criticism.

So NEVER, I will take it back. For all those people who suffered, I will never back down from my stance.

2. Also I said potentially, because of course people who do get married with their parent's persuasion may end up liking their husband/wife.
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Ummu Sufyaan
07-10-2010, 10:17 AM
:sl:

1. I wouldn't change a thing about what I said about parents, frankly they listen to society rather then Islam, they are being selfish and not looking out for the interests of who their children want to marry. Its absolutely disrespectful and has tough repercussions on the individuals involved etc. They are being selfish, they were young, they know that people want to get married etc.
that's enough lady. you don't have to agree with what they do, but mind your tongue. are you looking out for their interests when you speak about them like this?

They want to be respected as parents, then they should act as parents, just as people who want to be treated with respect then respect others. I am not endorsing disrepect but honesty, and I am sure that if they are capable of forcing someone to get married then they are not "innocent", sure they can handle being told the truth, after all their daughters for example would have gone through a lot worse, ie by being raped.
and this is the ideal model of a child is it? its this reason exactly that they may disregard our opinions, because we disregard theirs.
i take it you would speak to your own parents like this?

Being a parent does not suddenly make you immune from any criticism.
when you become a parent, i look forward to your posts.
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h-n
07-10-2010, 10:39 AM
Originally Posted by Ummu Sufyaan
:sl:
that's enough lady. you don't have to agree with what they do, but mind your tongue. are you looking out for their interests when you speak about them like this?
and this is the ideal model of a child is it? its this reason exactly that they may disregard our opinions, because we disregard theirs.
i take it you would speak to your own parents like this?
when you become a parent, i look forward to your posts.
Don't have to agree with?? What do you mean mind my tongue? Have a been swearing?? They are being abusive and selfish, which cannot be denied.

This thread is for the children placed in difficult situations by the parents, of course I'm not thinking of the parent's interest in this thread.

Again, just because one is a parent, that does not meant that you can never have any critical comments. I am not advocating being rude, I am advocating people be strong and stand up for themselves.

I am strong, that does not make me rude, its about time we had some balance anyway, instead of it all being one sided. Why don't you tell that to the daughters who have been raped???

I am not going to be a parent in this world, I am no longer married and look forward to the next world. I will NEVER be making a life as people call it in this world.

If I was a parent, I wouldn't be abusive to my daughter and force her to get married.

Speak to my Mother honestly (father's already passed away), she does not have an issue with me and does not call me rude. Also there is still nothing wrong with what I said and how I said it.

Its is stupid that people sometimes resort to asking well you would not like it if you were the parent-what has that got to do with anything? Would you tell me not to be critical of an abuser, because I might become one??

There is no need to ask stupid questions about how to treat parents, and frankly people are already aware about treating others with kindness, even I don't go into talking about that, as I don't treat people like if they are stupid, hence my threads are the way they are. So instead of trying to talk down to me, when I am not immature, I would quit commenting on things which everyone already knows about!!!

I will NEVER take it back, I can safely repeat it all on the Day of Judgement, whilst the parents are embarrassed.

If they can force people to get married, then they can absolutely take criticism, and be told the truth, its not more then what their daughter is putting up with. Is she supposed to ask nicely instead of the fact that maybe she can't help screaming, being placed in an abusive situation??

Instead of derailing this thread you can create another one.

I will absolutely NEVER take anything back and will NEVER apologise, and to be told not to mention so and so, when this is what a forum is for, I am not here to be quiet about issues, but to talk about them. If you can't handle it there is no need to comment about it.
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Ummu Sufyaan
07-10-2010, 10:54 AM
Originally Posted by h-n
Don't have to agree with?? What do you mean mind my tongue? Have a been swearing?? They are being abusive and selfish.
you don't have to be swearing to be rude. being sarcastic can sometimes be rude...just giving an example.

This thread is for the children placed in difficult situations by the parents, of course I'm not thinking of the parent's interest in this thread.
why dont you encourage people to stand for their rights whilst at the same time being respectful to parents. you will get your point across better that way imo.

Again, just because one is a parent, that does not meant that you can never have any critical comments.
i don't recall stating otherwise. there is such thing to get your point across with out "shooting down" others.

I am not advocating being rude, I am advocating people be strong and stand up for themselves.
that is also important

I am strong, that does not make me rude, its about time we had some balance anyway, instead of it all being one sided. Why don't you tell that to the daughters who have been raped???
if you are at all suggesting that i advocate for women being raped, then it really is time you bite your tongue.

I am not going to be a parent in this world,
thats quite sad =)

I am no longer married and look forward to the next world. I will NEVER be making a life as people call it in this world.
all the best=)

If I was a parent, I wouldn't be abusive to my daughter and force her to get married.
good for you. that's the correct attitude to adopt.

Its is stupid that people sometimes resort to asking well you would not like it if you were the parent-what has that got to do with anything? Would you tell me not to be critical of an abuser, because I might become one??
everything. you know the sacrifices and the heart ache and physical pain of sacrificing your days and nights for your child and so having someone come to you, pointing their finger saying "i am critical of you" well im sure you would want to punch them.


If they can force people to get married, then they can absolutely take criticism, and be told the truth, its not more then what their daughter is putting up with.
see reply to second quote.

Instead of derailing this thread you can create another one.
i dont feel it necessary.


There is no need to ask stupid questions about how to treat parents, and frankly people are already aware.
you could have fooled me. asking questions about how to treat parents is far from stupid. and the comment you made about me is also far fetched.
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h-n
07-10-2010, 11:06 AM
Originally Posted by Ummu Sufyaan
you don't have to be swearing to be rude. being sarcastic can sometimes be rude...just giving an example.

why dont you encourage people to stand for their rights whilst at the same time being respectful to parents. you will get your point across better that way imo.
i don't recall stating otherwise. there is such thing to get your point across with out "shooting down" others.
that is also important
if you are at all suggesting that i advocate for women being raped, then it really is time you bite your tongue.
thats quite sad =)
all the best=)good for you. that's the correct attitude to adopt.
everything. ou know the sacrifices and the heart ache and physical pain of sacrificing your days and nights for your child and so having someone come to you, pointing their finger saying "i am critical of you" well im sure you would want to punch them.
see reply to second quote.
i dont feel it necessary.
you could have fooled me. asking questions about how to treat parents is far from stupid. and the comment you made about me is also far fetched.

I will not be changing how I write, and frankly its fine, it give what I am saying in a clear, direct to the point way.

You quickly mentioned about being a parent, so quickly your thinking of yourself or being a parent when clearly this thread is for the children. So I suggest you stop making it about parents, you are free to open a new thread about parents. Its is also selfish to quickly make what is a serious issue to something else. As you are drawing attention away from the people that need it to people who frankly already have it, and are misusing it, as stated you don't have a no critical free card as soon as you become a parent.

You get your reward from Allah, not to remind your children so that they are going to do whatever you ask of them. Its your idea of having children, that does not mean that your children cannot mention anything that you don't like. If your parenting is so successful then you wouldn't feel threatened by children talking about such and such.

The children are entrusted to people by Allah, they belong to him. So you have to respect your children as well as children respecting their parents too.

I am happy and content with were I am in life and happy to leave this world too. It is very easy, as anyone who sees this world as a prison would be able to tell you.
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Salahudeen
07-10-2010, 03:22 PM
Originally Posted by sweet106
Mashallah!!! I like what you have written!!! great advise!

But one thing though, most scholar if not all say that a muslim woman (a virgin in particular) has to have Wali (usually the father) permission. what do you have to say that?
The wali is not allowed to refuse without a valid reason, if the person is pious and has good character then he has to say yes and its upto the girl if she wants to get married to the person or not. Of course this is not how it is in todays world, wali's refuse simply because of race, cast, tribe, nationality and this is not right. If the man is pious and has a good character then he can't refuse without a valid reason. If only this was praticed in todays world :(

Also I'm pretty sure only virgins/girls who are getting married for the first time need their wali's permission. Women who are divorced don't.

Also as brother Zafran said, Hanafi scholars say the girl does not need a wali to get married even if she is a virgin/getting married for the first time. However I don't know which is the correct opinion out of the 4 madhabs. Allah hu alam.
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cat eyes
07-10-2010, 05:11 PM
id go with the hanafi opinon on it. its seems fair. but the four imams are also correct but there also only humans too.

Sister h-n good thread mashallah

lets say ''NO'' to forced marriages

and be free to live our own life according to the Qur'an and sunnah.
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Zafran
07-10-2010, 05:53 PM
Also as brother Zafran said, Hanafi scholars say the girl does not need a wali to get married even if she is a virgin/getting married for the first time. However I don't know which is the correct opinion out of the 4 madhabs. Allah hu alam.
salaam

all 4 are correct as all 4 have proofs for there positions.

peace
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syed_z
07-10-2010, 06:06 PM

A Reply for H-N


You quickly mentioned about being a parent, so quickly your thinking of yourself or being a parent when clearly this thread is for the children. So I suggest you stop making it about parents, you are free to open a new thread about parents.
As you are drawing attention away from the people that need it to people who frankly already have it, and are misusing it, as stated you don't have a no critical free card as soon as you become a parent.
Okay and your Religion shows as Muslim....interesting... and you have no respect what so ever on HOW to speak 1st of all in Islamic Board... 2nd.. you don't know any thing about Subject of Parents...

i have a Hadith that is for you... Muhammad (saw) said... "Actions without Knowledge is Misguidance..." ...and so i clearly CAN see the effect of this Hadith in your speech , in your Posts...

1st of all lets see what the Quran has to say about Parents ? shall we..


(31:14) Show Gratitude to me and to your Parents.

(6:151) Join not anything with Him and be good to your Parents.


(17:23-24) Your Lord has decreed that you worship none but Him and that you be KIND to your parents. Whether one or both of them attain old age in Your life, say not to them A Word of CONTEMPT, nor REPEL them, but address them in terms of Honor. And out of kindness, lower to them the wing of Humility, and say "My Lord! Bestow on them mercy even as they cherish me in my childhood."



Parent Love is part of Divine Love, as Allah (Swt) chose them as Means of you to be in this World.... also do you see H-N as to why Allah (swt) mentions obeying and listening to His commands always occurs together with obeying the commands of the Parents ? It can be clearly seen as to How much Importance Does Allah (swt) give parents !! And those like You who do not give respect, as is evident from this Thread... are completely Ignorant or Blind i should say!!


As is also evident from many other places in the Quran, that Parents are to be Obeyed, even though they are NON BELIEVERS! The only place where Quran say don't obey them is , if they try to make you associate Partners in Worship... only then! Otherwise you respect and love them and pray for them even if they are non-Muslims...



The children are entrusted to people by Allah, they belong to him. So you have to respect your children as well as children respecting their parents too.
The way you said about Children being Respected by Parents 1st sounds like Parents need Parenting by children... .. you are so not right! Parents give brith to children and parents take care of Children as Parenting is done by parents and CHildren need to learn from parents and they need to learn how to respect parents so that they are trained according to Islam on Moral Level..... i feel sorry for your mother..... i think you probably "teach" her more than she teaches you even though You are completely ignorant and egoistic in your attitude..... Be Humble... learn how to be humble.....


Be strong as you don't have to go through anyone to become a Muslim, to be accepted by Allah. You shouldn't have to be forced to defend what you need and want to do in Islam that is right!! If they force you to, then be strong and push on to get married, You will regret not doing this in the next world and listening to society rubbish!! All your parents opposition will look stupid on the Day of Judgement.

Don't have to agree with?? What do you mean mind my tongue? Have a been swearing?? They are being abusive and selfish, which cannot be denied.
Clearly Rejecting the Verses of Quran... clearly... 1st of All talking about Parents and using words like "stupid"... May Allah guide you, and i doubt you probably even know any thing about Islam....

(6:151)....be good to your Parents.


and you use words like Stupid.... clearly going against What Allah (swt) says...

(17:23) ...Say NOT to them a Word of Contempt, nor repel them, but address them interms of Honor ......


This thread is for the children placed in difficult situations by the parents, of course I'm not thinking of the parent's interest in this thread.

Again, just because one is a parent, that does not meant that you can never have any critical comments. I am not advocating being rude, I am advocating people be strong and stand up for themselves.

I am strong, that does not make me rude, its about time we had some balance anyway, instead of it all being one sided. Why don't you tell that to the daughters who have been raped???


(31:14)...show gratitude to Me and to your Parents...



When Allah (swt) chooses Parents as MOST important to be for Muslims, after Him, then How dare you make Parents as some one to be ignored COMPLETELY in making of a Child's Future ... who gave you the authority ? I see what you trying to do...

You are not strong you are weak... because whisperings of Devils are making you think you are "right" and everyones wrong...and this will not cause balance, rather imbalance for your own self and others....



There is no need to ask stupid questions about how to treat parents, and frankly people are already aware about treating others with kindness, even I don't go into talking about that, as I don't treat people like if they are stupid, hence my threads are the way they are. So instead of trying to talk down to me, when I am not immature, I would quit commenting on things which everyone already knows about!!!

I will NEVER take it back, I can safely repeat it all on the Day of Judgement, whilst the parents are embarrassed.
i have a Verse for you...

(7:200) And if it happens that a prompting from Satan should stir you up (to anger), seek refuge with Allah. He is All-Hearing, All-Knowing.



Your way of talking, posting, giving opinions on Religious Issues totally against what Quran teaches us .... that is NOT the way to address Issues on Islam... and i very well remember that you are the same Person who had typed that ebing Friendly with Disbelievers, is Haraam, even though Quran mentions NOT to be befriend those who are not hostile towards the Muslims.....now once again you argue like you know everything!



2. If she cannot get approval to marry another Muslim, she can still get married as it was unIslamic to stop her, should she follow rules which are not Islamic? No. The marriage is still recognised by Allah, as he is Merciful and Compassionate.

3. So the fact is, is she listening to the Wali first or to Islamic rules? If the Wali was being Islamic he would never have refused, so if he refuses she can still get married and she is still following what is Islamic, and the marriage is valid!! The is no difference being don't bother thinking do that other Islamic thing, as I forbid it to you. You wouldn't listen to Satan telling you not to pray first before eating. How can someone forbid you something that is lawful? They cannot and you wouldn't be doing an Islamic thing by following them. Do not, and never listen to people first, listen to Islam first!!

To go through a Wali, was to protect the women, but there is nothing to say they have the right to make something unlawful which is lawful, they do not have the right to decline what clearly is the right for her to get married to another Muslim.

To go through a Wali, was to protect the women
.......it was not a WAS, it still is... Islam teachings are still to be followed, and yes women need protection from Walis (Guardians) , don't make it sound like it is Outdated!

1st of all many girls are young and inexperienced and they might be choosing some one for themselves, which parents might know not to be a good person, who might be good person according to their understanding.... so should the parents not stop them... ? Should the parents not stop their children from Jumping off the roof, just because the child does not know what shes doing.... ... or if they stopped them , then would that also be "forcing" according to you.....

Not ONE statement from Quran and Sunnah have you given to back up your Misguided claims... not a single... you expect every one to believe whatever you post just because your Status says "sister in Islam"...



(2:216)....and you dislike it; it may be that you dislike a thing and the same is good for you, and you love a thing and the same is bad for you: Allah knows but you do not.



There is also an example like you gave one, that a girl married a boy with her parents choice, and was not happy at 1st... but later he treated her Like princess, and she thanked Allah (swt) for giving Her such Husband and prayed for Mercy for her Parents because they Acted like the Best Guardians (Walis) for her...and made for her the best decision regarding her future.... while she also realized that if she would have made her decision , that could have ended her with the wrong type of person....

Children are NOT fully mature and experienced while parents are, thats why Allah gives you to their care, sometimes kids might not like something, which is actually good for them...



To stand up strong as Men and Women, being mature and responsible and seeking marriages and not being forced to whine and act as children to your parents, to seek what is right and lawful!! Stand up strong, you will not regret doing this, what you will regret is not doing it!!!

My Message to all Brothers/sister who read this Post please do not follow what ever she says... because she hasn't produced any references for all her Beliefs regarding how to deal with parents, neither has she produced any Tradition (sunnah) as evidence in favor of her Subject... shes making it sound more rebellious rather than deal with a Situation in an Islamic Humble manner.... please read careful what i write about Family Ties...


(13:25) And those who Break the Covenant of Allah, after its ratification, and sever that which Allah has commanded to be joined (i.e they sever the bond of kinship and are not good to their parents, brothers,sisters), and work mischief in the land, on them is the curse, and for them is the unhappy home(i.e Hell)


A cursed person is deprived of the Mercy of Allah (swt). It is deprivation of the Mercy, which makes one live in an unhappy state in this World as well as the Hereafter. As i did mention all those Verses above , in which Allah has made it crystal clear, that without your parents being happy with you, you cannot gain Mercy of Allah and acceptance of Allah.Would we like to keep ourselves away from Mercy of Allah (Swt) ?!?


"There is no sin more deserving of having punishment, meted out by Allah to its perpetrator, in advance in this World along with what He stores up for him in the next world than oppression and severing family ties."
(Tirmizi)


Since we are all against Injustice , and Muhammad (saw) mentioned that severing family ties is equivalent of that, then we should also think before we raise our voice with our parents, before we argue and behave rudely with them, before we tell them what is right and what is wrong in a way as if we know every thing and they don't know any thing, and in the end we leave those ones who cared for us all their lives, suffered pain for us.... just for the sake of a New Guy we met ???


I am not saying forced marriage is right, but the thread and all info posted here talking about "Rights of Children" is clearly rebelling against God and ones Parents, just for the sake of satisfying oneself....


Message for H-N.....



(49:1)... do not advance before Allah and His Messenger, and fear Allah. Verily Allah is All-Hearing, All-Knowing


(49:2) Believers, do not raise your voices above the voice of the Prophet and when speaking to him do not speak aloud as you speak aloud to one another, lest all your deeds are reduced to nothing without your even realising it.




do not argue against what Allah (swt) and His Messenger (saw) has already taught and ordered us to do, if we try changing the teachings as ordained by Allah (swt) and Muhammad (Saw), it might reduce our deeds to NOTHING.....when Allah (Swt) has given Parents a Status that is NEXT to Him, would we like to change it for a principle of Islam, which is less important in the eyes of Allah (swt)....



sorry for the long Post, but we are An Ummah which Should Enjoin What is right and FORBID what is wrong...
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Insecured soul
07-10-2010, 06:34 PM
Originally Posted by syed_z
[B]

1st of all lets see what the Quran has to say about Parents ? shall we..


(31:14) Show Gratitude to me and to your Parents.

(6:151) Join not anything with Him and be good to your Parents.


(17:23-24) Your Lord has decreed that you worship none but Him and that you be KIND to your parents. Whether one or both of them attain old age in Your life, say not to them A Word of CONTEMPT, nor REPEL them, but address them in terms of Honor. And out of kindness, lower to them the wing of Humility, and say "My Lord! Bestow on them mercy even as they cherish me in my childhood."
well i guess i dont get it right?... does this mean u should obey parents even if they are acting out of sharia?

i understand well parents should be respected the most, however marriage is an important thing the girl should be willing and happy to get married to the guy if she isnt then what is the point?

do u know the divorce rate was way too high at the time of sahabah becoz they wouldnt date and wait to see if the person is compatible, they would rather marry and understand the person and divorce if they are not happy, they saw marriage as a relationship of two souls.

now if a women divorce's, would u marry her? if ur answer happens to be yes then know that there are thousands of muslim men wouldnt marry a divorce women
and i guess prophet pbuh said dont force women into marriage let them choose??

i guess the root cause of this people are not following sharia... if they would, such things will not happen

and allah knows the best
Reply

Cabdullahi
07-10-2010, 06:36 PM
sister h-n is not messing around....some good points and nice colour coding!
Reply

cat eyes
07-10-2010, 08:19 PM
Originally Posted by Abdullahii
sister h-n is not messing around....some good points and nice colour coding!
LOL i just knew u were going to say that, u make humor out of every thread u post on
Reply

h-n
07-10-2010, 08:40 PM
[QUOTE=syed_z;1346693]
A Reply for H-N QUOTE]


I have the upmost respect, because if I did not, I certainly would not have learnt what I know today, which is certainly better then ending up as parents who force their children to marry against their will.

My Mother accepts me the way I am.

At least my Mother does not have a complete bore as a daughter. I certainly am not going to waste time talking about things that people already know. Which is what your doing!!!!

I will NEVER back down from my stance, when a daughter gets raped, you want me to say what about their parents that they are good and clever? Instead of being evil and stupid??

If I am so wrong, then go ahead and refute everything that I have written. You have nothing, as you clearly avoided even talking about children being ill treated by their parents. If you ill treat your child, it goes on your bad record, it is not ignored by Allah, which is what you like to have done!!!

Taking out on me on this thread, because you were wrong on another. Has already mentioned that we are not treating non-Muslims in an ill way, but that does not mean that we are friends. Also people are rejecting Islam. So it is not for me to be friends with the sinners when they are rejecting what Prophet Noah peace be upon him’s message.

Go ahead and make friends with the lewd, homosexual people. AS already mentioned if you read the Quran, there is no way that Allah is teaching us that we are friends with non-Muslims, why even the angels don’t care about them. Get your facts right, instead of derailing this thread go and open another one to talk about this. Which I am absolutely right in what I have said. You have failed to recognise its not just about people who fight physically against us, then why bother complaining about the cartoons of the Prophet Muhammad peace be upon him. Many people today have already rejected Islam, as people have done aforetime. They are no different to people in the past.

Well the Wali WAS there to protect, clearly that is no longer present with people today,

Everything in the Earths and Heavens belongth to Allah!! Including children.

Rights of children, are you saying they don’t have any?? Again if they treat children badly it goes on their bad record, Allah records everything. Just because people did not want to look at the whole picture as it benefited those has that is the only way they got married, by these stupid parents.

It was the parents choice to have children, the child cannot give what the parent has provided, you get your reward from Allah. We have separate bodies and minds. Allah has allowed us to be different, and to have different personalities. Allah has NEVER said that we have to do everything our parents ask us to do. Even if we did, we cannot blame our parents on the Day of Judgement, when we have not made it to Paradise. Allah is testing us individually.

If a child cannot at least be capable of choosing to get married to, then frankly they shouldn’t be told to get married to so and so. As the parents are already treating them like if they are immature. You get married as adults, because your responsible and mature!!
If you can’t choose who to marry, and frankly who to have sex with, then what is the point of having any other decisions in your life?? That takes a huge chunk out of your life, and frankly you would be staying married for that person for years. So of course it should be the child’s decision.

Also just thinking of using anything, as you have nothing. The verse that you quoted from the Quran;-

(2:216)....and you dislike it; it may be that you dislike a thing and the same is good for you, and you love a thing and the same is bad for you: Allah knows but you do not.

is referring to people WHO have already are married!!!

Severing family ties?? Forcing someone to get married is about keeping them? When its likely that they have forced the child to get married to someone, and their parents may die and no longer in this world, and the child is stuck with the life that the parents have chosen for her!! Also what family ties on the Day of Judgement??? No one is going to help you, so your first duty is to pass your test, no matter what it takes.

I am forbidding what is evil and enjoining what is good!! Which you are not doing, no wonder these problems have not actually subsided, because of people like you!

The parents have forced their child to get married-that is not a good act, but an evil one. That is also damaging to children.

Go and say that on the Day of Judgement, I find that people who stick up for these parents are people who are happy to have them, as they arrange marriages with them, maybe that’s they only way for you to get married is persuade and force someone to get married, and you don’t want someone to go against it as you benefit out of it directly. +o(

I can repeat what I have said on the Day of Judgement, I look forward to your criticism on that Day. I have already explained myself, thank Allah that countries are collapsing and the Major signs of the Day of Judgement are upon us, so we don’t have to live in a boring society with people like you. If you can't handle what how I am talking then frankly your going to be shocked then these countries collapse.

Your not in a position to advise, as clearly you don’t think about the rights of children. Willing to oppress others and make excuses that they don’t know any better. +o(

I fear Allah and remember the Day of Judgement. What I have said is sound in Islam. You have not disputed with what I have actually mentioned about the parents in the next world not talking as they were in this world, they were looking at society rather then Islam.
Glad that I am not part of your family etc I rather die then be a bore like you, again you probably only stick up for these parents as it give you what you want and you benefit, probably because that is they only way for you to get married. +o(

Typically you have NOT refuted anything that I have said, you are using one point for a situation when I am talking about another situation. With some Muslims I have noticed that they think to say things that they know that people won't dispute ie respecting parents. That is why you see some Muslims quoting on such and such, and they are happy as they won't have any opposition. That is why you brought this up, as frankly you have nothing else to say. But again your NOT thinking, your not talking of the situation at hand. That does not address this situation. I am not telling anyone to ill treat their parents I am telling them to be strong, to pass their tests in this world.

Reply

h-n
07-10-2010, 08:47 PM
Originally Posted by Adib Shaikh
well i guess i dont get it right?... does this mean u should obey parents even if they are acting out of sharia?

i understand well parents should be respected the most, however marriage is an important thing the girl should be willing and happy to get married to the guy if she isnt then what is the point?

do u know the divorce rate was way too high at the time of sahabah becoz they wouldnt date and wait to see if the person is compatible, they would rather marry and understand the person and divorce if they are not happy, they saw marriage as a relationship of two souls.

now if a women divorce's, would u marry her? if ur answer happens to be yes then know that there are thousands of muslim men wouldnt marry a divorce women
and i guess prophet pbuh said dont force women into marriage let them choose??

i guess the root cause of this people are not following sharia... if they would, such things will not happen

and allah knows the best
A person's first duty is to themselves to pass their tests in this worldm which is the first duty of the virgin too before she even got married.

Your absolutely right the daughter has to be happy of who she gets married too, in the past they questioned how do you know if a virgins is consenting to having a relationship-and that is by her silence. Nowadays no matter the opposition from the virgin and the fact that there are plenty of cases were Virgins are being pushed to having sex with someone. So they are not treated very well.

So to listen to Islam first, not by people who are "society people". If you listen to someone who is dismissing the right of children, virgins etc, then you are not actually following Islam.

Your parents won't be able to help you on the Day of Judgement, people's souls are important, so don't place yourselves into something, that is traumatic, depressing this is your one in a lifetime opportunity to make it to Paradise. So be stong and remain firm.
Reply

h-n
07-10-2010, 08:48 PM
Originally Posted by cat eyes
id go with the hanafi opinon on it. its seems fair. but the four imams are also correct but there also only humans too.

Sister h-n good thread mashallah

lets say ''NO'' to forced marriages

and be free to live our own life according to the Qur'an and sunnah.
Thank-you, absolutely to say NO to forced marriages.
Reply

h-n
07-10-2010, 08:51 PM
Originally Posted by Abdullahii
sister h-n is not messing around....some good points and nice colour coding!
Thank-you for taking the time to read it, and happy that you understand that I am being to the point. Nice colour coding LOL, thanks :)
Reply

Rhubarb Tart
07-10-2010, 09:17 PM
Originally Posted by h-n
1. The same the virgin's first duty is to herself passing her test. So she should recognise that her Guardian is breaking the rules of not allowing her to get married to another Muslims. She certainly does not need to listen to people who are not being religious, because if she listened to him, she is following something unIslamic.

2. If she cannot get approval to marry another Muslim, she can still get married as it was unIslamic to stop her, should she follow rules which are not Islamic? No. The marriage is still recognised by Allah, as he is Merciful and Compassionate.

3. So the fact is, is she listening to the Wali first or to Islamic rules? If the Wali was being Islamic he would never have refused, so if he refuses she can still get married and she is still following what is Islamic, and the marriage is valid!! The is no difference being don't bother thinking do that other Islamic thing, as I forbid it to you. You wouldn't listen to Satan telling you not to pray first before eating. How can someone forbid you something that is lawful? They cannot and you wouldn't be doing an Islamic thing by following them. Do not, and never listen to people first, listen to Islam first!!

To go through a Wali, was to protect the women, but there is nothing to say they have the right to make something unlawful which is lawful, they do not have the right to decline what clearly is the right for her to get married to another Muslim.

No Muslim who fears Allah and the Last Day would ever refuse. So don't listen to people who don't fear Allah and the Last Day, as you will be regretting it.
All good saying this but if I was you, I would be careful on how to spread such message which if a girl follows can land her in danger (Violence from parents or even honour killing). One should seek support and advice from iman before going ahead, that iman can help to change the parent’s attitudes as he is trustworthy. This would lessen the danger if indeed her parents are like that.
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Al Mu'minaat
07-10-2010, 09:52 PM
Aslamalakaium wa rahmatuliah wa baraktu

Great Post Brother syed_z ..

Jazakhalah Khayr for the post.. alhamduliah very beneficial :)

May Allah shower his blessing on our parents, and Guide the Misguided Ones... who divert others from the right path..
Ameen:)
Reply

Rhubarb Tart
07-10-2010, 09:59 PM
Respect parents and no to force marriages. Why can we have both? Why do we have to choose one over the other?
Reply

Rhubarb Tart
07-10-2010, 10:18 PM
Hadith on forced marriage
The Prophet (pbuh) prohibited the practise of forced marriages as completely going against the purpose of marriage as set out in the Quran.

Abu Hurayrah, may Allaah be pleased with him, reported that the Prophet sallallaahu `alayhi wa sallam (may Allaah exalt his mention) said: "A non-virgin woman may not be married without her command, and a virgin may not be married without her permission; and enough permission for her is to remain silent (because of her natural shyness)." [Al-Bukhaari, Muslim & Others]

A woman said to the Prophet that her father married her to a relative of his in order to improve his own social standing. He did not ask her views on this marriage before he did it. The Prophet ruled the marriage to be dissolved immediately. The woman said: "Now, messenger of God, I approve of what my father has done. I only wanted that women should know that men have no say in their matrimonial affairs."

ONE day, a beautiful woman by the name of Jameela, daughter of Abi Ibn Salool, came to the assembly of Prophet Muhammad (Peace Be Upon Him) and said to Him: "O prophet of Allah, nothing can make my head and his (her husband's head) to be together in one place." Then she went on to describe how ugly and repulsive she found him to be in appearance. The Prophet asked her if her husband had given her anything as dower. Jameela informed him that he had given her an orchard of dates as her mehr. At this the Prophet asked her if she was ready and willing to return the orchard to him. She replied, "Yes, that and more!" At this he said, "Not more, not more." Then the Prophet sent for her husband, Sabit bin Qais, informed him of his wife's feelings and intention and conducted a divorce between them.

A companion of the Prophet, Mughira bin Shuba, reported that when he intended to marry a certain woman and to send the proposal of marriage to her, the Prophet asked him, "Have you seen her?" The man said "No". The Prophet advised him, "Take a look at her, as this would be more conducive to producing affection, love and pleasant harmony between the two of you". (Musnad Ahmed, Tirmizi, Nisai, Ibn Majah). So love and harmony between the spouses are essential ingredients of a successful marriage.

Once a young woman came to the Prophet and said that her father had married her off as a minor, and that she had obviously not been consulted. The Prophet said that she could leave her husband if she so wished. She replied, "I have no desire to leave him. I simply wanted to know my rights." This was the Prophet's way of honouring the female.

And of His signs is this: He created spouses for you from among yourselves that you might find comfort in them, and He put between you love and mercy. Surely there are signs in that for people who reflect. (Qur'an 30:21)

ay a father force his virgin daughter who attained puberty to marry? Two well-known opinions in this regard are reported from Ahmad:



That he may compel her. This is also the opinion of Maalik, ash-Shaafi`ee, and others.
That he may not. This is also the opinion of Aboo Haneefah and others, and is the correct one.

People have differed as tot he reason permitting the compulsion: whether it is virginity, the daughter being under-aged, or a combination of both. The closest opinion to the truth is her being under-aged, whereas no one can compel a grown-up virgin in marriage. Aboo Hurayrah, radhiallahu `anhu reported that the Prophet, sallallahu `alaihi wa sallam, said:



"A non-virgin woman may not be married without her command, and a virgin may not be married without her permission; and enough permission for her is to remain silent (because of her natural shyness)." [Al-Bukhaaree, Muslim, and others]



Thus the Prophet, sallallahu `alaihi wa sallam, prohibits forcing a virgin in marriage without her permission, whether it be her father or someone else. Furthermore, `Aa'ishah, radhiallahu `anhaa, said that she asked the Prophet, sallallahu `alaihi wa sallam, "In the case of a young girl whose parents marry her, should her permission be sought or not?" He replied, "Yes, she must give her permission." She then said, "But a virgin will be shy, O Allaah’s Messenger." He answered:



"Her silence is [considered as] her permission." [Al-Bukhaaree, Muslim, and others]



This applies to the father as well as others. Furthermore, Islaam does not give the father the right to use any of her wealth without her permission, how then could he be allowed to decide, without her permission, how her body (which is more important than her wealth) is to be used, specially when she disagrees to that and is mature to decide for herself?



Also, there is evidence and concensus in Islaam to restrict an underage person’s free control of his wealth or person. However, to make a virginity a reason for the restriction contradicts the Islaamic basis.



As for the difference between the non-virgin and virgin in the hadeeth of the Prophet, sallallahu `alaihi wa sallam, it is not a differentiation between compulsion and non-compulsion; the difference between the two cases is that (a) the former gives her instructions for the marriage whereas the latter gives permission, and that (b) the virgin’s silence counts as a permission. The reason for this is that a virgin would be shy to discuss the matter of marriage, so she is not proposed to directly; rather, her walee (guardian) is approached, he takes her permission, and then she gives him the permission not the command to marry her.



And as for a non-virgin, she would not have the shyness of virginity anymore; thus she can discuss the matter of her marriage, she can be proposed to, and she gives the command to her walee to perform the marriage, and he must obey her.



Thus the walee is command-executor in the case of the non-virgin, and is permission-seeker in the case of the virgin. This is what the Prophet's words indicate. As for compelling her to marry despite her loathing to do so, this would contradict the fundamentals and reason. Allaah ta`ala did not permit a walee to force her to sell or rent her property without her permission. Neither did He permit him to force her to eat or drink or wear that which she does not wish. How would He then oblige her to accompany and copulate with a person whose company she hates - at the time when Allaah ta`ala has sent between the two spouses love and mercy? If such company happens despite her hatred and repulsion, where is the love and mercy?
I got the info from this thread: http://www.islamicboard.com/advice-s...-marriage.html
Reply

h-n
07-10-2010, 10:55 PM
Originally Posted by sweet106
Respect parents and no to force marriages. Why can we have both? Why do we have to choose one over the other?
Just like to say that I never said that we shouldn't respect parents, I am concentrating on those children who are placed into difficult situations. They frankly need the attention, so I can't just change what is clearly aimed at them to talking about respecting parents.

The fact that people brought up respecting parents speaks volumes of their own insecurities. When I only said for children to be strong as this is they only time they have to save themselves from the fires of Hell.

Also thank-you for taking the time to post about forced marriages.
Reply

h-n
07-10-2010, 11:00 PM
Originally Posted by Al Mu'minaat
Aslamalakaium wa rahmatuliah wa baraktu

Great Post Brother syed_z ..

Jazakhalah Khayr for the post.. alhamduliah very beneficial :)

May Allah shower his blessing on our parents, and Guide the Misguided Ones... who divert others from the right path..
Ameen:)
You saying that I am misguiding people? Why don't you also ask Allah to help those children who have been placed in difficult situations too???

I find people who complain are just insecure about themselves, when I only mentioned children being strong, it is the only time they have to make it to Paradise, not live a miserable forced existance. It is a BAD THING to use others to make yourselves feel appreciated at the expense of your children being miserable. I am not disputing respecting parents.

You say that I am misguiding you, then PRAY to Allah, PRAY that our paths never cross when these countries collapse, till the time we have to walk to the Mahdi. PRAY, PRAY for this, as you are saying that I am misguiding you. When I only have mentioned the truth, which Syed_z has not refuted he is using other situations without addressing the situation at hand.
Reply

syed_z
07-11-2010, 06:44 AM
Originally Posted by Adib Shaikh
well i guess i dont get it right?... does this mean u should obey parents even if they are acting out of sharia?

i understand well parents should be respected the most, however marriage is an important thing the girl should be willing and happy to get married to the guy if she isnt then what is the point?

do u know the divorce rate was way too high at the time of sahabah becoz they wouldnt date and wait to see if the person is compatible, they would rather marry and understand the person and divorce if they are not happy, they saw marriage as a relationship of two souls.

now if a women divorce's, would u marry her? if ur answer happens to be yes then know that there are thousands of muslim men wouldnt marry a divorce women
and i guess prophet pbuh said dont force women into marriage let them choose??

i guess the root cause of this people are not following sharia... if they would, such things will not happen

and allah knows the best

Brother Hope you doing fine...


Yes brother you did not get me right... any Muslim Parents if trying to force their Children would not be following Shariah i agree......

.....but is this True that since the inception of Islam, for the past 1400 years of Islamic History, since all those years, among all parents with children or families, and every time, a Child was ALWAYS right and parents were ALWAYS wrong ? Hasn't there been times when Parents were also right and Children were also wrong ? Would you believe that Children's choice of Marriage ALWAYS ended up Perfect with 100% success rate ?..... seriously Bro, there are many instances where Parents have warned the child, because of the child's inexperience and because of parents own experience that they have been able to see that the guy might NOT be right for their daughter.... and yes there have been many instances when the Child was wrong and Parents saved their daughters from marrying wrong person and many instances when daughter realized her mistake of marrying a wrong guy by not listening to her parents who had more experience ...... so are you telling me that such will be against Shariah, if parents would stop their Child daughter from getting ruined....


thats why i gave an example which i have seen in my relatives and told H-N...


(2:216)....and you dislike it; it may be that you dislike a thing and the same is good for you, and you love a thing and the same is bad for you: Allah knows but you do not.



There is also an example like you gave one, that a girl married a boy with her parents choice, and was not happy at 1st... but later he treated her Like princess, and she thanked Allah (swt) for giving Her such Husband and prayed for Mercy for her Parents because they Acted like the Best Guardians (Walis) for her...and made for her the best decision regarding her future.... while she also realized that if she would have made her decision , that could have ended her with the wrong type of person....



do u know the divorce rate was way too high at the time of sahabah becoz they wouldnt date and wait to see if the person is compatible, they would rather marry and understand the person and divorce if they are not happy, they saw marriage as a relationship of two souls.
could you please tell me what was the Divorce rate was at the time ? brother there was no divorce rate..... Yes there were many instances that Marriages were broken but are you trying to say that rate was high as meaning most companions marriages did not end up right ? No thats not true... also the rate of Love marriages i.e Dating before Marriage, does it always end up right ?.... is there 100% succes rate in love marriages ? I have seen many statistics in which Love marriages are mostly unsuccessful... but does that mean there should NOT be love marriage ? Obviously you should like the person.... but that does NOT mean either that all Arrange marriages are NOT successful !! Its fruitless to argue over this... whether Arrange or Love, both ways can be success or unsuccess... :)

HOWEVER! There is NO Dating in Islam! Yes you need to know the person before you marry.... is there A Halaal way to do it ? Yes there is.... you can talk to the girl as long as she has a Mahram i.e her brother/father/mother etc with her... this is what scholars say because Muhammad (Saw) said "If a man and woman are alone, then the 3rd among them is a Satan"..... you can talk to her for how many hours, get to know her and then marry her if both of you think you can get along... simple! No Western Way of Dating!


now if a women divorce's, would u marry her? if ur answer happens to be yes then know that there are thousands of muslim men wouldnt marry a divorce women
and i guess prophet pbuh said dont force women into marriage let them choose??
There are also thousands who WOULD marry her.... and yes Many Sahabas did marry the widows ... im sure you agree with that! Muhammad (Saw) married A Widow.... so yes all men should, and Allah (Swt) says in the Quran about a Widow to not be forced.... and it clearly says...


(2:232) And when you divorce women and they have come to the end of their waiting term, hinder them not from marrying other men if they have agreed with each other in a fair manner.


The Divorced women are much experienced and know much about Marital life, as compared to a girl who has never been married....

Also we have to keep in mind, that unlike todays world, in Islamic Culture, which is still purely followed in many places of the World... men are the supporters of the House and women usually take care of the House as that is their Job... since Women do not go outside much and stay at homes unless otherwise.....young women need Guardians (walis) to help them in their Major Decision of their Lives, specially Marriages.... because it concerns their Future....

H-N is making it sound MORE like Parents influencing their Childs future is because they are JEALOUS and SELFISH! What Rubbish is that ? would people believe that Muslim Parents almost all of them, are jealous and selfish, even the worst parents Love their child, its God gifted Nature .... not that there cannot be ever.... but throughout her post, to stand up to parents is being shown as Standing up to a Tyrant Ruler!


All i am saying is... that Marriages cannot be forced on women, unmarried or divorced... period! but also Parents consultation is a must... they are your guardians, specially in case of young women... and since Allah (swt) gives them a degree which if we try giving them a lesser one, then we are going against Allah... mutual consultation brings peace, even the Companions did Mutual consultation before making their decisions... and this is case of those who gave birth and took care of you all your lives... and we forget them in regards to a major decision in your life ?

H-N if you notice only speaks of parents forcing and being selfish and jealous and children always being right, but she NEVER explains in an Islamic manner that we also need to keep Parents respect and love in our minds at all times...she only focuses on One while completely forgetting the most important aspect of a Muslims life, this is dangerous we are not one sided Muslim.... this is Un Islamic... this is to rebel... watch out!



What are colors good for ... when the Message aint even right...
Reply

syed_z
07-11-2010, 06:59 AM
Originally Posted by sweet106
Respect parents and no to force marriages. Why can we have both? Why do we have to choose one over the other?
exactly ... agreed... so the person starting this Thread only focuses on one Subject while completely keeping Parents out, whom Allah has given a very high degree respect...Focuses only on children while forgetting that Parents are the cause of you to be in this world... keeps using words like selfish, stupid, jealous about those who are Mercy from Allah ..... and so yes we should love parents and CONSULT regarding all our decisions and not be rebellious with them as they care for us more than any one....
Reply

h-n
07-11-2010, 08:12 AM
To everyone, Syed_z has mentioned the word "jealousy", as Allah is my witness that word has not come to my mind when writing this thread etc. Only when he has mentioned it, and he is accusing me fo accusing parents of being jealous. Which I have never done-were is it that I have used that word? Nowhere.

Frankly that speaks volumes. He is just probably using his own life experiences to be content with how things work because he is happy with them as it works for him;-

1. There are males who don't oppose forced marriages as it benefits them, they have someone to have sex with etc.

2. Of course they know that without their parents they would not have been able to get married, as they are probably idiots and its hard for them to find a wife without the parents. ;D

3. It is idiotic to me that a Male quotes other people's examples. For example if a someone came to me and said why don't you get married to me, because those other two got married and she was happy etc. I find it stupid, he wants me to get married to him, there is no need to talk about anyone else. I am not marrying you because other people have got married, they are not the ones who have got married to you and having sex with you. <_< Also Syed_z missing important points, a virgin does NOT want to have sex with someone she does not like. So what if your parents like him, your the one who is going to have sex with him. Its important to like the person that you have sex with, even the virgins in Paradise are happy with their husbands. They are being made to go through something uncomfortable.

4. As the Males don't dispute with anything as it works in their favour, this explains were the word jealousy he has brought in, as nowhere in thread post 1 has he actually refuted. He is jealous himself then, that he stands rather poorly compared to others who stand up for what they believe in. To stand up as Men and Women to be strong and push to fight for what is right and who you want to get married to. As there are people who kick themselves and wish they done what so and so had done in their life. If someone learnt to fly an aeroplane, someone wished they done the same, and they see themselves poor in comparison. :bump1:

5. Please note that I am no longer married ( but I am not going to be selfish and tell others to be losers), I am not teaching people to live a miserable existance as Syed_z is, where he has not actually addressing the issue of forced marriage. I want other people to do well, even I am happy for people to be better then me. :D Not to live the same that I have done. Even a single Muslim women at a community centre, said to me that the married people were being rather stuck up and not giving talking about marriage issues very well, and I wasn't. There are people who are jealous and want others to live the same as they do, and not do anything else.

6. If a person stands up as Men and Women, instead of being treated like children they will be happy with themselves. You cannot quote inexperience. As soon you would be entering a sexual relationship so stop treating people as if they are immature. They aren't using other people's experience in their own marriage they are having their own!! :D

7. There are Males that like to quote that a female got married and wasn't happy and then she was later on, that is because people like Syed_z are shallow, and insecure and rely on the females to turn out the same way as they read in stories. <_<

8. If you were an upstanding Man, then frankly women would be asking to get married to you, they would want to get married to you. So you don't need to use other people's examples as you are weak. People look at your credentials and what you stand for and achieve, not hiding behind your parents.

9. Syed_z has not proved that what I have said on post 1 is wrong, I am talking about marriages not being approved and forced marriages, he is talking about something totally different -respecting parents (which I did mention anyway in post 1 which is highlighted in blue-that we respect parents-he said what is the point of colours if it gives the wrong information!! When obviously it is correct). :D How can he be right when he is talking about something else not addressing the situation? He is not.

10. There is nothing wrong with this thread, parents already have so much support, who supports the child? When they are forced to get married?? He has shown he is selfish and inconsiderate. Why not give support to people who need it the most. <_< So showing that he wants people to be living a miserable life, never getting up and standing up for what is right, for being the best they can be!.

11. He talks about divorce, there are people that are not allowed to get one. Also no matter who has chosen it, the children have made the marriage work!! Not the parents. They are showing that they can make a marriage work with someone else too, not just the person that their parents had chosen for them.

12. Also as he could not simply oppose evil over the internet, how hard was it to forbid evil? When he is not even in battle etc. He could not do a simple thing, showing that he is useless to oppose evil in his existance. It has been rather poor!!! Obviously forgetting that there are those that are already in the next world wishing they had distanced themselves from evil, they allowed people to be beaten up, and they wished they had done more to forbid it!!

:popcorn:
Reply

Ummu Sufyaan
07-11-2010, 10:05 AM
:sl:
im going to ignore your last reply to me, as i dont see it getting anywhere but that wali issue that was bought up i would like to address.

im not sure exactly of the fiqhi details of it, but in the case where there is difference of opinion between the ulamaa about it, then this isn't what im arguing. i fully accept this and have no problems with thier differing over it (if this really is this case) however you haven't made it exactly clear what your stance in regards to the wali giving his daughter away....can you expand? do you disregard that the wali is needed in giving his daughters away? are you condoning women to turn their backs on their families by disregarding the opinion of their walis? are you saying that women should believe and trust every guy that speaks nicely to her and promises her a happy marriage IN ABSENCE of her wali/mahrams.
Reply

h-n
07-11-2010, 10:21 AM
Its strange, they treat me like if they are being rude,

1. I'm being direct and don't treat and think that people if they are stupid.
2. They say they talk nicely, but they treat and think that people are stupid.

I am talking about Muslim Men and Women being strong, responsible and mature. I have confidence that they would recognise other people's credentials.

Maybe you treating this like teenage boyfriend and girlfriend, were they rely on people saying they are attractive and want to be with them. Well move on from that LOL, I am talking about Muslim Men and women being responsible. If they and they do meet someone that they like, then by all means marry that person. You don't need the approval of your rejecting Wali, when marriage is already lawful for you. You don't need to beg someone to have what is rightfullly yours.

There is no need to waste time picking on anything for sake of argument. So quit posting anything. Go and create your own thread about the issue. As that is about choosing the right husband/wife, so no need to derail threads. This thread is about people rejecting the idea of them getting married, when it is unlawful for them to do so.
Reply

Ummu Sufyaan
07-11-2010, 10:49 AM
:sl:
people treat you nice becuase they realize that being direct (and it has been proven to them) that talking harshly doesn't work. unless you know what is in the hearts of people, then shut up.

from now on, i will talk to you how i really think/feel and lets see how far it will go.

lady, you seem to have a head the size of planet earth? does it have its own gravitation pull as well? now tell me, is that attitude going to work? no.

You don't need the approval of your rejecting Wali, when marriage is already lawful for you. You don't need to beg someone to have what is rightfullly yours.
the conditions for a marriage to be considered valid, is the acceptance of the wali.

Marriage is not permissible and is not valid except with a wali, according to the majority of scholars, because of the words of the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him): “There is no marriage without a wali.” Narrated by Abu Dawood (2085), al-Tirmidhi (1101) and Ibn Majaah (1881) from the hadeeth of Abu Moosa al-Ash’ari; classed as saheeh by al-Albaani in Saheeh al-Tirmidhi.

And he (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “There is no marriage except with a wali and two witnesses of good character.” Narrated by al-Bayhaqi from the hadeeth of ‘Imraan and ‘Aa’ishah; classed as saheeh by al-Albaani in Saheeh al-Jaami’ 7557.

And he (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “Any woman who gets married without the permission of her guardian, her marriage is invalid, her marriage is invalid, her marriage is invalid. But if the marriage is consummated then the mahr is hers because she has allowed him to be intimate with her. If they dispute, then the ruler is the guardian of the one who has no guardian.” Narrated by Ahmad (24417), Abu Dawood (2083) and al-Tirmidhi (1102); classed as saheeh by al-Albaani in Saheeh al-Jaami’ no. 2709.
http://islamqa.com/en/ref/95405/wali

there are several fatwa (and books) which state its importance. go rad anything basic regarding marriage and it will tell you the same thing.

There is no need to waste time picking on anything for sake of argument. So quit posting anything. Go and create your own thread about the issue.
no. i feel it is an important issue to raise. if men dont see that the girl doesn't care about what her family think, they (save a few who fear allah) will walk all over her, funnily enough yielding the same bloody results you are condemning in this thread- women's rights being abused.

men fear men -end of. you cant cant accept a guy to care about a sister if he sees that her family (namely her mahrams) dont care about her. no matter how smart and unemotional a girl is, she still remains the lone sheep and and any man with ill intent can easily "prey" on her :( a girl can be of strong personality, but a male will use sweet words to win her over. a girl can be weak and a male can use either abuse her/abuse her rights or brainwash her again will sweet words.

i recall some brothers here in the past advising sister to be careful. and this is from a brothers perspective...the both extremes of forced marriages and disregarding the wali IS NOT GOOD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

what you mention is almost just as worse as the opinions of some kaafirs have regarding women! we aren't doormats and Allah has honored us through Islam whether it be through the allowance of rejecting anyone we dont like or whether it is through making is necessary for a man to go to our fathers/wali's and practically BEG by ASKING his permission for us!!! a male wanting something going up to a fellow male to ask. what better honor is that, i dont freaking know. talk about an ego bruising!
Reply

h-n
07-11-2010, 11:04 AM
Originally Posted by Ummu Sufyaan
:sl:
people treat you nice becuase they realize that being direct (and it has been proven to them) that talking harshly doesn't work. unless you know what is in the hearts of people, then shut up.

from now on, i will talk to you how i really think/feel and lets see how far it will go.

lady, you seem to have a head the size of planet earth? does it have its own gravitation pull as well? now tell me, is that attitude going to work? no.


the conditions for a marriage to be considered valid, is the acceptance of the wali.



there are several fatwa (and books) which state its importance. go rad anything basic regarding marriage and it will tell you the same thing.


no. i feel it is an important issue to raise. if men dont see that the girl doesn't care about what her family think, they (save a few who fear allah) will walk all over her, funnily enough yielding the same bloody results you are condemning in this thread- women's rights being abused.

men fear men -end of. you cant cant accept a guy to care about a sister if he sees that her family (namely her mahrams) dont care about her. no matter how smart and unemotional a girl is, she still remains the lone sheep and and any man with ill intent can easily "prey" on her :( a girl can be of strong personality, but a male will use sweet words to win her over. a girl can be weak and a male can use either abuse her/abuse her rights or brainwash her again will sweet words.

i recall some brothers here in the past advising sister to be careful. and this is from a brothers perspective...the both extremes of forced marriages and disregarding the wali IS NOT GOOD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

what you mention is almost just as worse as the opinions of some kaafirs have regarding women! we aren't doormats and Allah has honored us through Islam whether it be through the allowance of rejecting anyone we dont like or whether it is through making is necessary for a man to go to our fathers/wali's and practically BEG by ASKING his permission for us!!! a male wanting something going up to a fellow male to ask. what better honor is that, i dont freaking know. talk about an ego bruising!
What ever the size of my head maybe, at least my brain works. :D Also its not about being nice, what is consistent is people derailing my threads. The threads are there for all to see that.

What is it that you don't understand about "derailing threads"? Typical some women's attitude is they like to win an argument and say anything.

Why are you talking about sweet talking all the time??? You appear to have a stupid teenage prespective on bringing up males being nice to people, I suggest you get upto date, that's embarrassing.+o(

If you have opened your eyes in this world, you would have realised that the west world is actually promoting what Muslim women look at, they look at how that Man treats his parents, his family, how is he with his job, etc. Not how he talks to the women!!!! Also of course we look at how he is Islamically too.

If you read my " Evil Society " thread, then you would realise that I certainly do not treat Muslim Men and Women as being immature etc. So at least I mentioned that this was a follow up from the Evil Society thread. So at least I linked this thread with the other one.

This thread is about Muslim Men and Women who have already made up their mind of who they want to marry!! Not questioning their decision. But to go over that no one can reject the marriage as its unlawful. So create your own thread. Stop derailing mine. This is ridiculous.
Reply

Ummu Sufyaan
07-11-2010, 11:11 AM
omg just omg *whacks head on table*

*ignores all your other misunderstood based jargon*

What is it that you don't understand about "derailing threads"? Typical some women's attitude is they like to win an argument and say anything.
what are you then? a robot? a man? an animal? not a very coming statement from someone who claims to have a brain.

This is ridiculous.
ugh! ya telling me!

im sorry lady, there is no-one embarrassing themselves more in this thread, other then your own self.
Reply

h-n
07-11-2010, 11:14 AM
Originally Posted by Ummu Sufyaan
omg just omg *whacks head on table*

*ignores all your other misunderstood based jargon*


what are you then? a robot? a man? an animal? not a very coming statement from someone who claims to have a brain.


ugh! ya telling me!

im sorry lady, there is no-one embarrassing themselves more in this thread, other then your own self.
I said "some women's attitude". You see that word SOME!!!!

I am happy with what I have written, say it on the Day of Judgement, that it was an embarrasment.
Reply

Ummu Sufyaan
07-11-2010, 11:16 AM
yh i do now. but apparently your big head refuses to understand anybody else point of view. have fun being stupid.

you lecture people about the aakhirah and you cant even acknowledge the walis involved in a marriage!
Reply

h-n
07-11-2010, 11:27 AM
Originally Posted by Ummu Sufyaan
yh i do now. but apparently your big head refuses to understand anybody else point of view. have fun being stupid.

you lecture people about the aakhirah and you cant even acknowledge the walis involved in a marriage!
Maybe Islamicboard should change their name to "I'm with stupid".

Typical saying anything, when you've got nothing to say about the issue at hand, about wali's rejecting marriage.

The Day of Judgement is important, and reflects what people should do.

Wali does not come first, remembering the Day of Judgement does!!!
Reply

Ummu Sufyaan
07-11-2010, 11:39 AM
Maybe Islamicboard should change their name to "I'm with stupid".
everyone would get confused with the same user-names. thats not very practical.

Typical saying anything, when you've got nothing to say about the issue at hand, about wali's rejecting marriage.
what choice have you given me? i figured its best to ignore everything since you seemed to have not sunken in.

The Day of Judgement is important, and reflects what people should do.
thank you you've hit the nail on the head.

Wali does not come first, remembering the Day of Judgement does!!!
exactly. so how do we prepare for this day, if we go around ignoring rulings Islam has stipulated. does that even sound consistent/normal to you?
Reply

Cabdullahi
07-11-2010, 12:22 PM
shizzle i need to get some popcorn! are sisters harsh to each other like this bomboclat!
Reply

syed_z
07-11-2010, 01:16 PM
1. There are males who don't oppose forced marriages as it benefits them, they have someone to have sex with etc.

2. Of course they know that without their parents they would not have been able to get married, as they are probably idiots and its hard for them to find a wife without the parents. ;D
Muhammad (saw) said "A Believer is either one who speaks good or keeps his/her mouth shut."

Also Syed_z missing important points, a virgin does NOT want to have sex with someone she does not like. So what if your parents like him, your the one who is going to have sex with him. Its important to like the person that you have sex with, even the virgins in Paradise are happy with their husbands. They are being made to go through something uncomfortable.
Marriage for you is nothing but Sexual Intercourse... there is also love and affection and emotions, its not only Physical Satisfaction that you marry for... May Allah guide you before you get married...



for you H-n ....


(75:14) Nay but man shall against himself be an eye witness, (15) even though he may veil himself in excuses...


Praise be to Allah (swt)... every one sees what your saying and what i have said and every one knows whose at fault... just by writing in Capital and fancy will not help you prove your point and will not help change the fact ... your talks are useless and you need to repent to God for whatever you have posted in many threads...

What ever you say comes from Your own Evil Self (Nafs) , it does NOT come from Allah (Swt) and His Messenger (saw)... just cause your status say "sister in Islam"... does not mean that Muslim Brothers/sisters will help or be on your side even if you were saying everything wrong.... we are supposed to say word of Truth even though it be against Ourselves...

Learn Islam, then come talk..
Reply

Al Mu'minaat
07-11-2010, 01:18 PM
You saying that I am misguiding people? Why don't you also ask Allah to help those children who have been placed in difficult situations too???


ermm i think your confused love, who said i was talking about you? - think twice and use your brain.. i thought you had one.. *wink*
not everything in the post is about you my dear.. get used to it.. i didnt mention your name..

and may i say.. you really dooo need to sort out your attitude out.. wallahi by allah.. i have never ever in my whole entire life seen a foul mouth person+o(. you are soo rude.. if you are going to talk to someone.. sort our your attitude.. and goo study the book Good Manners In Islam by Iman Bukhairi.. okay..
goo study some knowledge.. and then come back to this thread and talk..

I find people who complain are just insecure about themselves, when I only mentioned children being strong, it is the only time they have to make it to Paradise, not live a miserable forced existance. It is a BAD THING to use others to make yourselves feel appreciated at the expense of your children being miserable.

I am not disputing respecting parents.


congrulations;D !! alhamduliah your getting somewhere with your manners.. praise is to allah.,:)

you dont make sense love.. the part where you were talking about children.. where do you get your information from.. hmm i suspect with ignorance and without knowledge..

who said they have to live a miserable forced existence.. what you need to understnad is.. that okay these situations doo happen in life.. and instead of just complaining and being rude to people.. why dont you do somehting about it.. go set up a dawah project that supports your idea... and btw good luckkk with that..

this life is a test.. it is the prupose of our existence... off course we have to suffer some point in our lives...

let me just tell uu an ayah of the quran which explains it all..

[He] who created death and life to test you [as to] which of you is best in deed - and He is the Exalted in Might, the Forgiving -

exactly.. allah created us so that he can test us... and some people are tested with these situations.. and allah is training them to have Sabr- patience... with their parents and to place their trust in allah..

You say that I am misguiding you, then PRAY to Allah, PRAY that our paths never cross when these countries collapse, till the time we have to walk to the Mahdi. PRAY, PRAY for this, as you are saying that I am misguiding you. When I only have mentioned the truth, which Syed_z has not refuted he is using other situations without addressing the situation at hand.
if your have mentioned the truth.. quote an ayah of the quran.. or a hadith that backs up your point.... i dont see any evidence..

which Syed_z has not refuted he is using other situations without addressing the situation at hand.

okay and your point is..??
Reply

Al Mu'minaat
07-11-2010, 01:27 PM
ohh btw love.. i forgot something my dear sister... ;D

I think its time you shut your mouth.. and went to another forum we're people will appreciate your presence.. no one wants you hear, you and your iggnorance .. GET LOST..:raging:
all the best
Reply

noorseeker
07-11-2010, 02:57 PM
You shouldnt break a old family in order to make a new one,

I hate it when i see couples dying to marry each other, as if life depends on it .

If it dont work out, move on,
Reply

h-n
07-11-2010, 03:19 PM
Originally Posted by syed_z
Muhammad (saw) said "A Believer is either one who speaks good or keeps his/her mouth shut."

Marriage for you is nothing but Sexual Intercourse... there is also love and affection and emotions, its not only Physical Satisfaction that you marry for... May Allah guide you before you get married...



for you H-n ....


(75:14) Nay but man shall against himself be an eye witness, (15) even though he may veil himself in excuses...


Praise be to Allah (swt)... every one sees what your saying and what i have said and every one knows whose at fault... just by writing in Capital and fancy will not help you prove your point and will not help change the fact ... your talks are useless and you need to repent to God for whatever you have posted in many threads...

What ever you say comes from Your own Evil Self (Nafs) , it does NOT come from Allah (Swt) and His Messenger (saw)... just cause your status say "sister in Islam"... does not mean that Muslim Brothers/sisters will help or be on your side even if you were saying everything wrong.... we are supposed to say word of Truth even though it be against Ourselves...

Learn Islam, then come talk..
Again you have NOT refuted anything on post 1, you change the subject to something else. I am talking about forced marriages etc, and your talking about respecting parents. Of course people can see that you don't make any sense. Absolutely baseless! So its best for you to keep your mouth shut, when obviously your always avoiding the thread content!!

Also I am referring to sex as an example that you shouldn't be told who to have sex with.
Reply

h-n
07-11-2010, 03:26 PM
Originally Posted by Al Mu'minaat
You saying that I am misguiding people? Why don't you also ask Allah to help those children who have been placed in difficult situations too???


ermm i think your confused love, who said i was talking about you? - think twice and use your brain.. i thought you had one.. *wink*
not everything in the post is about you my dear.. get used to it.. i didnt mention your name..

and may i say.. you really dooo need to sort out your attitude out.. wallahi by allah.. i have never ever in my whole entire life seen a foul mouth person+o(. you are soo rude.. if you are going to talk to someone.. sort our your attitude.. and goo study the book Good Manners In Islam by Iman Bukhairi.. okay..
goo study some knowledge.. and then come back to this thread and talk..

I find people who complain are just insecure about themselves, when I only mentioned children being strong, it is the only time they have to make it to Paradise, not live a miserable forced existance. It is a BAD THING to use others to make yourselves feel appreciated at the expense of your children being miserable.

I am not disputing respecting parents.


congrulations;D !! alhamduliah your getting somewhere with your manners.. praise is to allah.,:)

you dont make sense love.. the part where you were talking about children.. where do you get your information from.. hmm i suspect with ignorance and without knowledge..

who said they have to live a miserable forced existence.. what you need to understnad is.. that okay these situations doo happen in life.. and instead of just complaining and being rude to people.. why dont you do somehting about it.. go set up a dawah project that supports your idea... and btw good luckkk with that..

this life is a test.. it is the prupose of our existence... off course we have to suffer some point in our lives...

let me just tell uu an ayah of the quran which explains it all..

[He] who created death and life to test you [as to] which of you is best in deed - and He is the Exalted in Might, the Forgiving -

exactly.. allah created us so that he can test us... and some people are tested with these situations.. and allah is training them to have Sabr- patience... with their parents and to place their trust in allah..

You say that I am misguiding you, then PRAY to Allah, PRAY that our paths never cross when these countries collapse, till the time we have to walk to the Mahdi. PRAY, PRAY for this, as you are saying that I am misguiding you. When I only have mentioned the truth, which Syed_z has not refuted he is using other situations without addressing the situation at hand.
if your have mentioned the truth.. quote an ayah of the quran.. or a hadith that backs up your point.... i dont see any evidence..

which Syed_z has not refuted he is using other situations without addressing the situation at hand.

okay and your point is..??
From your post you it would be obvious that you were saying that I was misguiding you. If you deny this, then repeat it on the Day of Judgement, as you are avoiding saying who you were referring to!!

The post 1 of this thread, is acceptable, and sound in Islam.

Manners??? I have not been rude, I am to the point and direct. What do you want me to do talk to you like if I am talking to a 5 year old??

Yes, we are here to be tested, but that does not mean that people forcibly place people in miserable situations!

The fact that you avoided mentioning on your first post here anything about children being forced into marriage, already speaks volumes, that you are an inconsiderate person!! <_<

If you can't handle what and how I am saying, then wait till the countries finish collapsing, what do you expect another Muslims to do? Hold your hand when the Dajjal is here???
Reply

h-n
07-11-2010, 03:43 PM
Originally Posted by Al Mu'minaat
ohh btw love.. i forgot something my dear sister... ;D

I think its time you shut your mouth.. and went to another forum we're people will appreciate your presence.. no one wants you hear, you and your iggnorance .. GET LOST..:raging:
all the best
Your already forgetting what I've actually mentioned ??? That;-

1. 100% that these countries are collapsing right now.

2. There won't be an Islamicboard soon. :lol: So getting rid of me, is the least of your problems.

3. The Major signs of the Day of Judgement is upon us.

4. I'm not asking to be appreciated LOL. I am here to provide information on what I know and understand about Islam to help people to be strong for the coming events, for when the Dajjal arrives. (So it is not my issue that people choose to derail, and waste time)

5. Also as Allah's is my witness, I see a definite link, the fact the people have problems with me are those that have been complacent about what is going on around them, that countries are ending right now (I am more then happy to take the blame, but I see it lying with how you are first, were people anyway have not actually mentioned about problems with post 1 of threads) . I am providing information directly and to the point so people can learn quickly. Which your already proving that you are not heeding what is going on, your asking to get rid of me, so you can continue in this forum as you want? How stupid is that when this is all finishing. As per my "Collapse of these countries" thread. :bump1:

6. My ignorance??? So your telling everyone that my threads are of ignorance they include;-

- Allah
- Murder
- Collapse of these countries
- Major signs of the Day of Judgement,
- Devils
- Non-Muslims and Islam
- Love, love say the Christians (but I say that they are liars)
- Why Prophet Jesus peace be upon him DOES NOt love the Christians
- No such things as Atheism
- To non-Muslims turning to Islam. etc.

7. I haven't come on a forum to be quiet. There would be no point of joining.

8. No one is forcing you to post in my threads.

9. Go ahead and create your own thread, its quite simple really, you just push a button on top of the screen.

10. I won't be joining another forum, when I finished here, which will be soon, as countries are finishing, as people will be busy watching the rest of the signs before the countries will be of no more.
Reply

h-n
07-11-2010, 03:49 PM
Originally Posted by Ummu Sufyaan
everyone would get confused with the same user-names. thats not very practical.


what choice have you given me? i figured its best to ignore everything since you seemed to have not sunken in.


thank you you've hit the nail on the head.


exactly. so how do we prepare for this day, if we go around ignoring rulings Islam has stipulated. does that even sound consistent/normal to you?

Why don't you read the Quran all over again, the Day of Judgement comes first, and then everything falls into place when you remember this Day, which is were people decide on the choices that they make, and not be lead by unIslamic things.

Also you mentioned that I am not reading things from your prespective-well that is stupid as I created this thread, so people should talk about post 1 of this thread, not about other issues.
Reply

Muslim Woman
07-11-2010, 05:00 PM
Salaam

Originally Posted by h-n
. Did not the companions of the Prophet Muhammad peace be upon him also get married to who they wanted?
they did not ask the parent of the women or got married without thier permission ? Now a days , Muslims are having girl/ boy friends and they get married without the consent and prensence of guardian and they call it love marriage . Surely these go against the teaching of Islam.

Parents must not object if a proposal comes from a religious person . Also , young people must be careful not to disobey parents in the name of freedom.
Reply

h-n
07-11-2010, 05:17 PM
Originally Posted by Muslim Woman
Salaam



they did not ask the parent of the women or got married without thier permission ? Now a days , Muslims are having girl/ boy friends and they get married without the consent and prensence of guardian and they call it love marriage . Surely these go against the teaching of Islam.

Parents must not object if a proposal comes from a religious person . Also , young people must be careful not to disobey parents in the name of freedom.
The fact is that no one forced the companions to get married to such and such.

I am not talking about how Muslim Men and Women meet, I'm not talking about immature people, this thread is a follow up from the "Evil Society" thread. I am talking about the Muslims being prevented from getting married unlawfully.

This thread is about the last point that you have mentioned, that parents etc should not object to getting married to another Muslim.
Reply

Rhubarb Tart
07-11-2010, 06:12 PM
Originally Posted by syed_z
exactly ... agreed... so the person starting this Thread only focuses on one Subject while completely keeping Parents out, whom Allah has given a very high degree respect...Focuses only on children while forgetting that Parents are the cause of you to be in this world... keeps using words like selfish, stupid, jealous about those who are Mercy from Allah ..... and so yes we should love parents and CONSULT regarding all our decisions and not be rebellious with them as they care for us more than any one....
To be fair though, you keep saying parents know what best for us, but some parents just follow tradition like marrying their daughter/son off to cousins. Yeah I agree we should consult our parents. I think the sister said she is talking to children who have parents that are rejecting marriage for no valid reasons and only would accept certain people or those who are force to marry someone they dont like.

I know a couple that waited five years to marry because both families rejected each other due to race, but the parents finally accepted five years later. Patience always seems to work. :)
Reply

Asiyah3
07-11-2010, 06:47 PM
Originally Posted by h-n
3. The Major signs of the Day of Judgement is upon us.
:sl:

What do you mean?
Reply

h-n
07-11-2010, 07:01 PM
Originally Posted by **muslimah**
:sl:

What do you mean?
The fact that the countries are finsihing right now, so then we enter into seeing the Major signs of the Day of Judgement by having the Mahdi for example.

Please see "Collapse of these countries" and "Major signs of the Day of judgement" threads, both in the general section.
Reply

Asiyah3
07-11-2010, 07:08 PM
Originally Posted by h-n
The fact that the countries are finsihing right now, so then we enter into seeing the Major signs of the Day of Judgement by having the Mahdi for example.

Please see "Collapse of these countries" and "Major signs of the Day of judgement" threads, both in the general section.
Are you saying that the Day of Judgement will arrive soon?
Reply

h-n
07-11-2010, 07:11 PM
Originally Posted by **muslimah**
Are you saying that the Day of Judgement will arrive soon?
Have you read the threads, that I referred you to???
Reply

Insecured soul
07-11-2010, 07:13 PM
Originally Posted by syed_z
Brother Hope you doing fine...


Yes brother you did not get me right... any Muslim Parents if trying to force their Children would not be following Shariah i agree......

.....but is this True that since the inception of Islam, for the past 1400 years of Islamic History, since all those years, among all parents with children or families, and every time, a Child was ALWAYS right and parents were ALWAYS wrong ? Hasn't there been times when Parents were also right and Children were also wrong ? Would you believe that Children's choice of Marriage ALWAYS ended up Perfect with 100% success rate ?..... seriously Bro, there are many instances where Parents have warned the child, because of the child's inexperience and because of parents own experience that they have been able to see that the guy might NOT be right for their daughter.... and yes there have been many instances when the Child was wrong and Parents saved their daughters from marrying wrong person and many instances when daughter realized her mistake of marrying a wrong guy by not listening to her parents who had more experience ...... so are you telling me that such will be against Shariah, if parents would stop their Child daughter from getting ruined....


thats why i gave an example which i have seen in my relatives and told H-N...
could you please tell me what was the Divorce rate was at the time ? brother there was no divorce rate..... Yes there were many instances that Marriages were broken but are you trying to say that rate was high as meaning most companions marriages did not end up right ? No thats not true... also the rate of Love marriages i.e Dating before Marriage, does it always end up right ?.... is there 100% succes rate in love marriages ? I have seen many statistics in which Love marriages are mostly unsuccessful... but does that mean there should NOT be love marriage ? Obviously you should like the person.... but that does NOT mean either that all Arrange marriages are NOT successful !! Its fruitless to argue over this... whether Arrange or Love, both ways can be success or unsuccess... :)

HOWEVER! There is NO Dating in Islam! Yes you need to know the person before you marry.... is there A Halaal way to do it ? Yes there is.... you can talk to the girl as long as she has a Mahram i.e her brother/father/mother etc with her... this is what scholars say because Muhammad (Saw) said "If a man and woman are alone, then the 3rd among them is a Satan"..... you can talk to her for how many hours, get to know her and then marry her if both of you think you can get along... simple! No Western Way of Dating!


There are also thousands who WOULD marry her.... and yes Many Sahabas did marry the widows ... im sure you agree with that! Muhammad (Saw) married A Widow.... so yes all men should, and Allah (Swt) says in the Quran about a Widow to not be forced.... and it clearly says...


(2:232) And when you divorce women and they have come to the end of their waiting term, hinder them not from marrying other men if they have agreed with each other in a fair manner.


The Divorced women are much experienced and know much about Marital life, as compared to a girl who has never been married....

Also we have to keep in mind, that unlike todays world, in Islamic Culture, which is still purely followed in many places of the World... men are the supporters of the House and women usually take care of the House as that is their Job... since Women do not go outside much and stay at homes unless otherwise.....young women need Guardians (walis) to help them in their Major Decision of their Lives, specially Marriages.... because it concerns their Future....

H-N is making it sound MORE like Parents influencing their Childs future is because they are JEALOUS and SELFISH! What Rubbish is that ? would people believe that Muslim Parents almost all of them, are jealous and selfish, even the worst parents Love their child, its God gifted Nature .... not that there cannot be ever.... but throughout her post, to stand up to parents is being shown as Standing up to a Tyrant Ruler!


All i am saying is... that Marriages cannot be forced on women, unmarried or divorced... period! but also Parents consultation is a must... they are your guardians, specially in case of young women... and since Allah (swt) gives them a degree which if we try giving them a lesser one, then we are going against Allah... mutual consultation brings peace, even the Companions did Mutual consultation before making their decisions... and this is case of those who gave birth and took care of you all your lives... and we forget them in regards to a major decision in your life ?

H-N if you notice only speaks of parents forcing and being selfish and jealous and children always being right, but she NEVER explains in an Islamic manner that we also need to keep Parents respect and love in our minds at all times...she only focuses on One while completely forgetting the most important aspect of a Muslims life, this is dangerous we are not one sided Muslim.... this is Un Islamic... this is to rebel... watch out!



What are colors good for ... when the Message aint even right...
Jazakallah brother im doing alrite

Brother u dont judge the health of the society by divorce rate, and yes indeed the divorce rate was high at the time of sahabah as compared to now, i would request u to go and verify this with an ulama, divorce is disliked but what do u do when u dont like ur wife/husband? would u live with her for the rest of ur lives, being miserable? offcourse not, sahabah would marry and divorce if they cant handly and also they wouldnt leave a sister stay unmarried so a divorcee would marry another man, i ask u again to go and check with an ulama coz i know u already have a lot of prejudices.

I never said love marriages are better than arranged? i dont support love marriages and all this dating crap.

offcourse parents may have been right in some cases when they have forced thier daughters into marriage but u dont assume that and force ur child, we dont control outcome of the affairs its allah azzawajal.

and if u take it in another way parents forcing thier child for thier better future................., do they know the future?

and why would parents not let thier daughter marry someone, on what reason would they refuse? almost all of them would refuse due job (lessness) or either he does not have his own house/car
these so called parents see only dunya.

a proper marriage is when u marry someone just for allah azzawajal and that ur partner should show u they way to jannah, whats the use of that partner who has house/car and has huge salary but doesnt pray and not is islamic? would he leave u to jannah or jahannum?

but i guess such type of marriages would be so rare in our ummah right now


u said there are thousands of muslim men who would marry a divorce women, well right now forget about divorce i know many women who are over 35 and were never married, there are many such cases in our muslim community all over the world, im sure u can come across some in ur country.

brother remember there are two extremes in everything islam shows us a a middle and best path, if u keep women only inside the house and tell her NOT NOT NOT to everything its not good niether she should be allowed to mix with men freely. there is a middle path, im sure i dont need to elaborate on that u can certaily understand what it is.

as far as the parents goes i would listen to them always and respect them

PLS someone show me how to multi quote :)

salaam alaikum
Reply

Asiyah3
07-11-2010, 07:18 PM
Originally Posted by h-n
Have you read the threads, that I referred you to???
I was expecting a simple yes or no. Yes, I read them now Al-hamdulillah. However, I didn't get a clear picture.. Will the Day of Judgement arrive soon?
Reply

h-n
07-11-2010, 07:24 PM
Originally Posted by **muslimah**
I was expecting a simple yes or no. Yes, I read them now Al-hamdulillah. However, I didn't get a clear picture.. Will the Day of Judgement arrive soon?
The Day of Judgement is upon us.

Also here is what is going on, your edging for a confrontation (this is why you posted anything on my threads to try and get it!!) :lol: If you deny this, then say as Allah is my witness that this is not true!!!!!!!!!

You wanted me to say something more specific rather then upon us, so you wanted me to make a mistake and then you wanted to be critical of me and tell me that no one knows when the Day of Judgement is going to happen except Allah-which everyone knows. <_<

The fact is that these countries are finishing, we know that they won't be around when Prophet Jesus peace be upon him arrives. The thread are actually very clear, re-read them again, also with the proper attentions!! :D
Reply

Asiyah3
07-11-2010, 08:12 PM
Originally Posted by h-n
The Day of Judgement is upon us.

Also here is what is going on, your edging for a confrontation (this is why you posted anything on my threads to try and get it!!) LOL. If you deny this, then say as Allah is my witness that this not true!!!!!!!!!

You wanted me to say something more specific rather then upon us, so you wanted me to make a mistake and then you wanted to be critical of me and tell me that no one knows when the Day of Judgement is going to happen except Allah-which everyone knows. <_<
*Ehem..* I am not against reminders, we should definitely prepare ourselves, think of the Aakhirah and take heed of the small signs of day of Judgement insha'Allah. Nevertheless, Allah alone knows when the Hour will be.

p.s. Didn't I tell you to stop using colours? <_<
Reply

h-n
07-11-2010, 08:17 PM
Originally Posted by **muslimah**
*Ehem..* I am not against reminders, we should definitely prepare ourselves, think of the Aakhirah and take heed of the small signs of day of Judgement insha'Allah. Nevertheless, Allah alone knows when the Hour will be.

p.s. Didn't I tell you to stop using colours? <_<
:popcorn:


Sister h-n
Reply

Muslim Woman
07-12-2010, 12:45 AM
Salaam

Originally Posted by h-n
The fact is that no one forced the companions to get married to such and such.
.
and another fact they did not have any secret relationship or did anything shameful . Now a days , young people are becoming shameless and they think it's their right to do so . They believe , parents must approve everything children are asking for including approval of the affairs they have.


.

This thread is about the last point that you have mentioned, that parents etc should not object to getting married to another Muslim.
your point is good but u presented it in a very negative way . Thus created the unnecessary debate . Sis ,pl. remember to show due respect to parents.

And We have enjoined on man to be dutiful and kind to his parents. His mother bears him with hardship. And she brings him forth with hardship, and the bearing of him, and the weaning of him is thirty months, till when he attains full strength and reaches forty years, he says: "My Lord! Grant me the power and ability that I may be grateful for Your Favour which You have bestowed upon me and upon my parents, and that I may do righteous good deeds, such as please You, and make my offspring good. Truly, I have turned to You in repentance, and truly, I am one of the Muslims (submitting to Your Will)." ( 46 : 15 )
Reply

Muslimeen
07-12-2010, 09:45 AM
Originally Posted by **muslimah**
*Ehem..* I am not against reminders, we should definitely prepare ourselves, think of the Aakhirah and take heed of the small signs of day of Judgement insha'Allah. Nevertheless, Allah alone knows when the Hour will be.

p.s. Didn't I tell you to stop using colours? <_<
True, I once heard qiyamah starts for a person as soon as he enters the grave. How prepared are we for this? it could happen to anyone at anytime.

Seems like someone is really getting under you skin, I hope you're not turning red or blue.:grumbling
You know what they say, if you can't beat them, join them.
If warnings don't work, resort to threats. :Evil:
Reply

Ummu Sufyaan
07-12-2010, 10:12 AM
:sl:
Originally Posted by h-n
Why don't you read the Quran all over again, the Day of Judgement comes first, and then everything falls into place when you remember this Day, which is were people decide on the choices that they make, and not be lead by unIslamic things.
1. the sunnah is also relevant. laa ilaha illah muhammad rasoolullah. ring a bell? if you are a Muslim and believe that this is the first pillar of islam then you have confirmed that the sunnah is also necessary and relevant.

2. i ask again, how is one supposed to prepare for the day of judgment if they dont uphold the Islamic rulings. you cant just "rock up" on the last day with zero in your account. this life is to prepare for that day...why should we expect to have a good aakhira if we dont even put in the effort to strive for it. and likewise why should we expect to have a good akhira if we dont worship Allah according to his prophet, sallahu alaeyhi wa sallam bought with.

if we truly believe in these 2 words and believe in the first pillar of islam...if we believe in the Prophet sallahau aleyhi wa sallam, then it wouldn't be hard to acknowledge his sunnah either.

3. wow, involving the wali is UnIslamic! woo hoo, lets announce this across the world it turns out that people have been practicing the wrong thing. [/end sarcasm]



im going to await your reply and if its anything of the same repetitive nature you keep dishing up, i'll say goodbye.
Reply

Muslimeen
07-12-2010, 11:00 AM
Originally Posted by Abdullahii
shizzle i need to get some popcorn! are sisters harsh to each other like this bomboclat!
They really get under each others skin don't they? Knives are out!! I'm getting outta here, before it turns really ugly.:hiding:

Enjoy the show, and the popcorn.:popcorn:
Reply

syed_z
07-12-2010, 01:05 PM
Salaam Brother... hope you and yours are doing fine .. the only reason i joined this conversation was to let the Person know that Parents are to be part of each and every one of their child's life matters, specially which involve major decisions.... and Parents cannot be kept outside or be told to stay way ....


about what you said... many parents marry their child for money and duniya, i agree there are parents... that do and if they do then they are responsible for their actions...




and if u take it in another way parents forcing thier child for thier better future................., do they know the future?
I know that parents have experience more than the child has, and that can make them see things which child may not.... in that case if they see future going to be not good for their daughter, then they have the right to tell them and help them... .. you may disagree, up to you bro ... :)




almost all of them would refuse due job (lessness) or either he does not have his own house/car
these so called parents see only dunya.

a proper marriage is when u marry someone just for allah azzawajal and that ur partner should show u they way to jannah, whats the use of that partner who has house/car and has huge salary but doesnt pray and not is islamic? would he leave u to jannah or jahannum?

but i guess such type of marriages would be so rare in our ummah right now
I think your from Pakistan, forgive if i am wrong.... i say so because i am from pakistan and that is Typical attitude of Pakistanis living abroad in UK, Canada, US, ...also in Pakistan its the Upper class specially, and upper and lower Middle class.... i see that such attitude mostly comes from Pakistani parents such as mentioned... However, its not always like that.... i know the World has become materialistic and keeps heading that way as we move ahead in to the future.... but there are many parents who stop their children because of good reasons as well or marry them not because of their own benefit but the benefit of their daughters....


brother remember there are two extremes in everything islam shows us a a middle and best path, if u keep women only inside the house and tell her NOT NOT NOT to everything its not good niether she should be allowed to mix with men freely. there is a middle path, im sure i dont need to elaborate on that u can certaily understand what it is.
i completely agree.. yes there is a middle path and may Allah guide our parents and us, as we are moving towards becoming parents.... inshA Allah we will adopt the Middle Path....


Now just to let you know... the purpose of me to reply to the Person (H-N) who posted the 1st few posts telling us how to deal with parents.... was COMPLETELY disrespectful, and it wasn't even Islamic! ... i was posting to reply to tell what Islam (Quran and Sunnah) says about the Parents issue... since parents come 1st, After Allah (swt)... we need to understand the Subject of parents and their Rights upon us... and only under the light of that understanding do we move forward in our lives and shape our lives, because if we do not draw the line between our Rights given by Islam and the Rights of Parents over us in Islam, then we could be making serious error by overriding some of their Rights in the name of our Own rights, which would be disobedience to Allah (swt)..... and i clearly saw that happening in this thread....hope you understand...

Muhammad (Saw) was once asked "what is the rights of parents over their children ?" to which Messenger of Allah (Saw) replied...

"They are Your Heaven and Hell." (Ibn Majah, Hadith 3652)











Reply

h-n
07-12-2010, 02:03 PM
Originally Posted by Ummu Sufyaan
:sl:
Originally Posted by Ummu Sufyaan
1. the sunnah is also relevant. laa ilaha illah muhammad rasoolullah. ring a bell? if you are a Muslim and believe that this is the first pillar of islam then you have confirmed that the sunnah is also necessary and relevant.

2. i ask again, how is one supposed to prepare for the day of judgment if they dont uphold the Islamic rulings. you cant just "rock up" on the last day with zero in your account. this life is to prepare for that day...why should we expect to have a good aakhira if we dont even put in the effort to strive for it. and likewise why should we expect to have a good akhira if we dont worship Allah according to his prophet, sallahu alaeyhi wa sallam bought with.

if we truly believe in these 2 words and believe in the first pillar of islam...if we believe in the Prophet sallahau aleyhi wa sallam, then it wouldn't be hard to acknowledge his sunnah either.

3. wow, involving the wali is UnIslamic! woo hoo, lets announce this across the world it turns out that people have been practicing the wrong thing. [/end sarcasm]



im going to await your reply and if its anything of the same repetitive nature you keep dishing up, i'll say goodbye.


Proving how stupid you really are,


1. When this thread involves marriages NOT being approved by their Guardians -therefore they already sought it!!! Who said then never did?????

2. Your the one who is clearly forgetting about the Day of Judgement in actually involving it in your life, that is why on post 1, I have mentioned that you should remember that people not approving marriage is unIslamic, and they can't stand by their decision in the next world. So you shouldn't run your life according to their opinions, because it isn't worth it Islamically!

3. You and others treat religion like its a ceremony, do this, do that, and use and and abuse it more, as you are using good things. We have to remember the Day of Judgement FIRST. You are looking at what good things you have to do first. But remembering the Day of Judgement FIRST, then dictates your decision making. THUS on post 1, I said IF your marriage is not approved, remain firm and strong as you know that you are right, because in the next world your parents won't be able to repeat themselves!!!

4. The fact that people like you have felt threatened so easily of children standing up for themselves speaks volumes!!!!!!!! As there are people who want others to do the same as them to make them life have meaning. For example if a Man with a computer system, that is no longer upto date, and people are using a new program, he has spent years living and doing that, he feels less valued.

5. You clearly don't think and incorporate the Day of Judgement as you should just remember it as a seperate time, and the fact that you have not thought about the absolute relevant points on post 1. Shows that you are acting as a wordly person, look this is what happened to the Jews they use religion to get married too etc!!! They don't think of the next world or death or even Hell now. They talk about how to be relgiously in this world, do all the right things, but they only care about the life of this world.


I would never follow someone who looks less towards the Day of Judgement then I do! Which includes you!!!
Reply

AhmadibnNasroon
07-12-2010, 02:09 PM
so how is everyone doing today

*sprays peaceful air freshener*
Reply

Muslimeen
07-12-2010, 02:35 PM
Come on ladies stop ridiculing each other. I hate it when they do that, what's with all this name calling??
Is this the example we want to set? You can be polite in disagreement too you know.
Reply

Salahudeen
07-12-2010, 02:39 PM
Originally Posted by Muslimeen
Come on ladies stop ridiculing each other. I hate it when they do that, what's with all this name calling??
Is this the example we want to set? You can be polite in disagreement too you know.
This is women akhi, they get very emotional trust me lol. Any dig they can get will do.
Reply

Sawdah
07-12-2010, 03:14 PM
:sl:

Guys, this is not how we should talk to each other. We should do it with the right intention and expect best for one another. It doesn't seem like I'm seeing that right now. Remember when we discuss, we're not trying to show the people that we have more knowledge, nor are we showing we are better, we do it so the message can go through. We start threads like this only for the sake of our brothers and sisters of Islam, so they may benefit from them. If someone disagrees, be not rude but show your position respectfully without offending the person and answer back in a polite manner. I'm not pointing fingers, but I'm just reminding everyone. I hate it when I see brothers and sisters call each other horrible words, it's not a beautiful sight at all. Where's the love for the sake of Allah?

I ask everyone to take the time to read this inshaAllah: link. It's the manners of dialogue in Islam.

And Allah azawajjal knows best.

:wa:
Reply

Asiyah3
07-12-2010, 05:26 PM
1. Parents shouldn't refuse a righteous man for the sake of race or nationality etc.

2. Forced marriages are forbidden in Islam.

3. Children should respect and be kind to their parents.

Just my two cents. Feel free to add to the list.

Originally Posted by Muslimeen
They really get under each others skin don't they? Knives are out!! I'm getting outta here, before it turns really ugly.:hiding:

Enjoy the show, and the popcorn.:popcorn:
Trust me, you don't want to know what happens in the Sisters section. :X
Reply

'Abd-al Latif
07-12-2010, 11:45 PM
:salamext:

Marriage is not a the goal of life. Our goal is Allah.

Here is some practical advice to everyone.

1) Righteousness is not inherited. If you think that somehow you will conquer the world with your spouse after marriage then you are living in a dream land. Reality will slap you in the face when you wake up and learn that your perception of marriage was seen through rose tinted glasses. If you can't have that inner drive to make Allah your ultimate goal, to make Him your only source of happiness and have that will to strive day and night for His pleasure, being certain that true happiness lies only in sincerity towards Him, then you have mislead yourself to think that your spouse will be able to make you see this! A righteous spouse, no matter how righteous, will never be able to pass on his righteousness unless it be that Allah guides you towards Him. True righteousness is sincerity in the heart towards Allah while insincerity is superficial worship; Islam is more then hijabs and beards.

O you who believe! let not your wealth, or your children, divert you from the remembrance of Allah; and whoever does that, these are the losers. [Muniqoon, 9]

Those who divert you from the remembrance of Allah could even be your own spouse. If you sincerely looked for a spouse for the sake of Allah then adjust your attitude in accordance to the pleasure of Allah while looking for a spouse. If you are facing obstacles by feeling an overwhelming sexual desire that you cannot control, you lose patience and hope, you curse and insult your parents and the Qadr (decree) of Allah that is meant for you (i.e. that it is not yet time for you to get married - yet), then check your iman because your sincerity to get married for the sake of Allah is questionable!

2) Patience to Iman/belief, is like head to the body. If you have the head is cut the body is dead. If you cannot get married, your dua's are not being answered, you face difficulty where ever you go and you feel like your life is at a dead end then know that the problem is not with Allah, the problem is with you.

Are you fulfilling Allah's write upon you? Are you praying your prayers on time? Are there any shortcomings in your prayer? Are you discontent with what Allah has decreed for you (i.e. you feel an urge for sexual satisfaction yet no one understands your sexual needs need fulfilment because your parents are delaying your marriage) and you show anger and discontentment because of this? Do you feel like Allah is punishing you?

One who thinks these thoughts or something similar to this is an ungrateful slave of Allah who has no understanding of iman.

The Prophet (saws) said, "If Allaah loves a people, He tries them, and whoever has patience will have patience, and whoever is anxious will be anxious." (Reported by Imaam Ahmad; Saheeh al-Jaami’, 1706).

Then there are among men such as say, "We believe in Allah"; but when they suffer affliction in (the cause of) Allah, they treat men's oppression as if it were the Wrath of Allah!... [29:09]

3) You as an individual should be striving to become a good Muslim and not be dependant on another (i.e. your spouse) to mould you into something good. A spouse at most can only fulfil your desires, not solve your problems. If you are unmarried and Allah wants to increase you in patience then what virtue is better than this!?

Nooh (a.s) was patient with his people for 950 years for rejecting the religion of Allah until finally Allah drowned the disbelievers off the face of the earth. And in return for Nooh (a.s)'s efforts, Allah made the whole world become populated with the offspring of Nooh.

Yusuf, the symbol of patience, was forced to live life away from his family and was separated by his own brothers. He grew up without his family, was called to fornication by the beautiful wife of al-azeez, framed to make it seem as though Yusuf was the one in the wrong, locked up in prison without a family or friend for years. Who could be more isolated and rejected than this? Who could be in more grief and loneliness then Yusuf? Yet he never showed signs of impatience. And, as gratitude from Allah for his righteousness, Yusuf was rewarded with a high position, status and lots of wealth. He was reunited with his family as a leader for the righteous and is a shining example for the people today as we recite his story in Qur'an. And in the hereafter he will be among those who will be under the shade of the throne of Allah, on a day where there will be no shade. And this is a reward for him and whomsoever follows in his footsteps.

Muhammad (saaws), Ibraheem (a.s), Moosa (a.s) reached the pinnacle of success in this world and the next with their patience and faith (in Allah).

Be patient with parents and do not rant on forums because this is not a solution to a problem.

:threadclo
Reply

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