=Kashnowe;1373680]interesting stuff here. definitly food for thought. i think that by saying the father has no rights to the child its not so much a punishment but it tells the man he can fornicate and not be he held responsible...as is the case i'm speaking of. the father doesn't care about the child. he prefers to think the child doesn't exist. he is not being punished. he is free to do whatever he wants and the enitre burden, emotionally and financially, fall on the mother. its quite clear the mother and child are the ones suffering.
Punishing those who violate God's commands isn't an automatic right of human beings. This is only permissible when the criteria set for the punishment are met. Where punishment can't be carried out, we leave the judgement in Allah's hands. Allah has prescribed severe punishment for fornicators in this life and the hereafter, in the Holy Quran. However if one repents then Allah may forgive him if he wills.
"And those who invoke not any other god along with Allah, nor kill such life as Allah has forbidden, except for just cause, nor commit illegal sexual intercourse (zina) and whoever does this shall receive the punishment. The torment will be doubled to him on the Day of Resurrection, and he will abide therein in disgrace; except those who repent and believe and do righteous deeds, for those Allah will change their sins into good deeds, and Allah is Oft Forgiving, Most Merciful." (al-Furqaan #25, ayat #68-70)
"And come not near to unlawful sexual intercourse. Verily, it is a faahishah (a great sin) and an evil way." (Sura Al-Israa # 17 ayah # 32)
I understand that the Bible also forbids Christians of illegal sexual intercourse. Exodus 20:14 "You shall not commit adultery." According to the Bible adultery is punishable by death. We can safely say no such punishment is going to be executed amongst present day Christians. However, in regards to the rights of illegitimate children in Christianity, the Bible says:
“No ******* shall enter into the assembly of the Lord; even to the tenth generation none of his descendants shall enter the assembly of the Lord.” (B* Deuteronomy 23:2).
The Bible is clearly denying children born out of wedlock the same rights as legitimate children. In fact in (Sirach 23:22-25 NRSV) that such children will be punished as will their mother.
Your friend's frustration is understandable given the societal influence of man made laws. But if she were to consider the Christian judgement of her own actions, she may realize that she isn't in the position to be demanding any emotional and financial help from the father of her child at all.
Lastly on this perspective, I assure you Islam has the perfect solutions for all man's ill. Muslim's must follow the laws of the land they live in. This means that your friend can demand child maintenance from him, as long as he is a subject of that country.
Muslim parents of the father do nothing but degrade the mother and call her a *****. why do they not consider their son a *****? why does he escape ridicule and shunning? they all want nothing to do with the child. this is hardly a portrayal of love or peace or civility. it is pure hate
Muslims parents have every right to hate the actions of a Christian fornicator, but they should not call her names while ignoring their son's mistake. Islam deems both people equally guilty, and has prescribed the same punishment for the man and woman.
in my opinion a better punishment would be to make the man pay financially to help support the child, and if he was to marry and have his own children afterwards then he would still have to support his illegitimate child until adulthood. first come first served. seems just and fair to me. because who is to say that the man would not get married andcheat on his wife and father another illegitimate child? he was not punished the first time so why would the second be any different? he would not have to pay a penny to the child or the mother. the punishment would be real if every paycheck the man earned, a bit had to be taken for his illegitimate child, and it would remind him every day of what he has done, and hopefully it would drive him to pray for forgiveness every day and maybe bring him closer to God.
then his family and friends any everyone in town would know that you must pay every day and every minute for your actions.
this man doesn't care that his son can't inherit from him. he just wants to keep all of his money so he can buy $300 sunglasses and fancy cars. to him the child is dirt. i believe that attitude is a learned one, from the society in which he was raised, a Muslim society that does not value the needs of the innocent children, moreso it is concerned with wealth.
the greatest thing this child deserves to inherit from his father is love. anything else is quite irrelevant.
anyhow, i'm not trying to cause an argument. i was just wondering what you all believe.
I think Allah the All-Knowing, Wise and Just knows better which punishment prescribed is suited to which crime. I strongly believe that if anyone feels that Islam is unfair, then they only have to look at their own beliefs and compare the punishments that their religion has prescribed for them. I am sure your friend will be glad she is not living under Christian laws.
i would also like to add that i'm assuming the father would not have fornicated with the mother if he was actually living in morocco. i bet the pressure from family and community and not to mention the law would be a huge deterrent. but he came here to america where evil and temptation are rampant. but also, if a man of faith was surrounded by temptation it should have no effect on him if he truly believe what he said he did. so i'm thinking the man who fathered this child was not of a strong faith at all in the first place to allow himself to do such things. we do of course have free will. a religious man would say no to a room full of naked women if he was truly a man of faith
He may still have fornicated. We don't know that. But it'd easier for men to commit adultery where women are willing participants. Of course the man is not of strong faith. I'm wondering what the level of his faith is at all. A true God fearing muslim would rather be stabbed in the head with a piece of iron than commit sexual intercourse with a woman who isn't his wife.
I don't think it's appropriate for your friend to bring the man's faith into it, especially as her actions as a Christian are equally questionable and neither can be dealt with religious laws. I think your friend should pursue the matter through legal means, and leave it at that. My sincere piece of advice to both you ladies is to learn about Islam with an open heart and mind, and hopefully come to understand and accept it as the Truth. may Allah guide you both. Ameen.