Do the tax loopholes prove that the Democrats/Republicans are different sides of the

[truthseeker63]

Do the tax loopholes prove that the Democrats/Republicans are different sides of the same coin the Democrats claim to support a Progressive Income Tax I think Americans should understand that the two party system does not work Democrats claim to be for the Poor but the Democrats in my view are a Rich man's political party just like the Republicans are both parties are pro War and support the American Empire and American Imperialism Im sure that the United Kingdom has the same two party system that the United States has ?

[Trumble]

Hmmm... where to start on that one!

I hope one of our American contributors can comment on the Democrats and Republicans as, from Britain, our perception may not be accurate. For what it's worth, mine would be that there is a distinct shift in emphasis between the parties, but it that it is nowhere near as distinct as can be found in other countries, mainly because the majority of US voters don't want it that way. I actually think that system works pretty well on one level, in that in a great many cases Americans seem to vote for a particular candidate, and their positions on certain issues, rather than just because of their party. The nature of those parties, and the areas of their support has also changed significantly over time. Of course, both would deny being "pro War and support the American Empire and American Imperialism". Oddly enough, despite perceptions elsewhere in the world, none of things - even if true - are exactly vote winners.

As to British politics, it's currently effectively a three-party system in England, although there are nationalist parties in Wales and Scotland that are in the mix as well. Northern Ireland is really totally different, and far too complicated to explain here. Those parties are the Conservatives (who would be the closest to the Republicans) who currently form a coalition government with the Liberal Democrats who were traditionally a 'centre' party before moving to the left and now, seemingly back again. The third main party is Labour, who formed the last (Tony Blair, Gordon Brown) government. Labour was traditionally an out-and-out socialist party (although always democratic rather than revolutionary), although they have moved gradually more and more towards the centre and are probably now the closest equivalent to the US Democrats. The parallels are not that exact, though; as many British Conservative politicians would make happy Democrats as happy Republicans for example. Probably the main difference is that the social conservative element has nothing like the clout it seems to in the US.

[Woodrow]

It is a bit of a misunderstanding that here in America we have a 2 party system. It is actually multi-party. However, historically it has been dominated by 2 or 3 parties. Not always the same ones. It is probably impossible to find a complete listing of all parties that have been in existence or even of the current parties. Some past parties that no longer seem to be in existence:

Some of these parties did get to be quite dominate and very powerful. The Bull-Moose Party of 1912 is significant as it was the party President Theodore Roosevelt first ran for President under.

Federalist Party (c. 1789 – c. 1820)
Anti-Federalist Party (c. 1789 – c. 1792)
Democratic-Republican Party (1792 – c. 1824)
Toleration Party (1816 – c. 1827)
Anti-Masonic Party (1826–1838)
National Republican Party (1829–1833)
Nullifier Party (1830–1839)
Whig Party (1833–1856)
Liberty Party (1840–1848)
Law and Order Party of Rhode Island (1840s)
Free Soil Party (1848–1855)
Anti-Nebraska Party (1854)
American Republican Party (1843–1854)
American Party (a.k.a. "Know-Nothings") (c. 1854 – 1858)
Opposition Party (1854–1858)
Constitutional Union Party (1860)
National Union Party, (1864–1868)
Readjuster Party (1870–1885)
People's Party of Utah (1870–1891)
Liberal Party (Utah) (1870–1893)
Liberal Republican Party (1872)
Greenback Party (1874–1884)
Anti-Monopoly Party (1884)
People's Party (a.k.a. "Populists") (1887–1908)
Silver Party (1892–1902)
National Democratic Party ("Gold Democrats") (1896–1900)
Silver Republican Party (1896–1900)
Social Democratic Party (1898–1901)
Home Rule Party of Hawaii (1900–1912)
Socialist Party of America (1901–1972)
Independence Party (a.k.a. "Independence League") (1906–1914)
Progressive Party 1912 (a.k.a. "Bull Moose Party") (1912–1914)
National Woman's Party (1913–1930)
Non-Partisan League (1915–1956)
Farmer-Labor Party (1918–1944)
Proletarian Party of America (1920–1971)
Progressive Party 1924 (1924)
Communist League of America (1928–1934)
American Workers Party (1933–1934)
Workers Party of the United States (1934–1938)
Union Party (1936)
American Labor Party (1936–1956)
America First Party (1944) (1944–1996)
States' Rights Democratic Party (a.k.a. "Dixiecrats") (1948)
Progressive Party 1948 (1948–1955)
Vegetarian Party (1948–1964)
Constitution Party (1950s) (1952–1968?)
American Nazi Party (1959–1967)
Puerto Rican Socialist Party (1959–1993)
Mississippi Freedom Democratic Party (1964)
Black Panther Party (1966–1970s)
Youth International Party (a.k.a. "Yippies") (1967)
Communist Workers Party (1969–1985)
People's Party (1971–1976)
U.S. Labor Party (1975–1979)
Concerned Citizens Party (1975–1992)
Citizens Party (1979–1984)
New Alliance Party (1979–1992)
Populist Party of 1980s–1990s (1984–1994)
Looking Back Party (1984–1996)
Grassroots Party (1986–2004)
Independent Party of Utah (1988–1996)
Greens/Green Party USA (1991–2005)
New Party (1992–1998)
Natural Law Party (1992–2004)
Veterans Party (2003–2008)
Christian Freedom Party (2004)
Personal Choice Party (2004-2006?)

These seem to be the most powerful parties in existence at this time:

While these parties seldom have any visible impact on the Federal Government they often are very powerful at the local levels and often do shape the policies of the dominate parties.

Political Party↓ Founded in↓

America First Party 2002

American 3rd Party 1990

American Nazi Party 1959

American Party 1969

American Populist Party 2009

American Reform Party 1997

American Third Position Party 2010

America's Independent Party 2008

Boston Tea Party 2006

Citizens Party 2004

Constitution Party 1992

Communist Party of the United States of America 1919

Christian Liberty Party 1996

Democratic Party 1828

Florida Whig Party 2006

Freedom Road Socialist Organization (freedomroad.org faction) 1985

Freedom Road Socialist Organization (frso.org faction) 1985

Freedom Socialist Party 1966

Green Party of the United States 2001

Independent American Party 1998

Independence Party of America 2007

Jefferson Republican Party 2006

Labor Party 1996

Libertarian National Socialist Green Party 1997

Libertarian Party 1971

Moderate Party 2005

Modern Whig Party 2008

National Socialist Movement 1974

New Union Party 1974

Objectivist Party 2008

Party for Socialism and Liberation 2004

Peace and Freedom Party 1967

Populist Party of America 2002

Progressive Labor Party 1961
*
Prohibition Party 1869

Raza Unida Party 1970

Reform Party of the United States of America 1995

Republican Party 1854

Revolutionary Communist Party, USA 1975

Socialist Action 1983

Socialist Alternative 1986

Socialist Equality Party 1966

Socialist Labor Party of America 1876

Socialist Party USA 1973

Socialist Workers Party 1938

U.S. Marxist–Leninist Organization 1981

United States Marijuana Party 2002

United States Pirate Party 2006

Unity Party of America 2004

Workers Party 2003

Workers World Party 1959

Working Families Party 1998

World Socialist Party of the United States 1916

As the Republicans and Democrats become more similar to each other, we will mostly probably see one or more of the smallerparties gain more members and pose a very strong alternative to the republicans and Democrats. In the 1920s and 1930s the communist Party and the various Socialist parties came very close to being the dominate parties. While the Big 2 parties get the most attention, these smaller parties do have a large impact at times and are always in the background waiting to grab control.

A Brief History of the parties the Presidents have belonged to does show a bit of how American Politics does shift:

Democratic (14)
James Buchanan
Jimmy Carter
Grover Cleveland
Bill Clinton
Andrew Jackson
Andrew Johnson
Lyndon B Johnson
John F Kennedy
Franklin Pierce
James Polk
Franklin D Roosevelt
Harry S Truman
Martin Van Buren
Woodrow Wilson


Federalist (2)
George Washington (Note i)
John Adams


Democratic Republican (4)
John Quincy Adams
Thomas Jefferson
James Madison
James Monroe


Republican (17)
Chester A Arthur
George Bush
Calvin Coolidge
Dwight D Eisenhower
Gerald R Ford
James A Garfield
Ulysses S Grant
Warren Harding
Benjamin Harrison
Rutherford B Hayes
Herbert Hoover
Abraham Lincoln
William McKinley
Richard M Nixon
Ronald Reagan
Theodore Roosevelt
William H Taft

Whig (4)
Millard Fillmore
William Henry Harrison
Zachary Taylor
John Tyler (Note ii)
(Note i): Washington abhorred the idea of political parties and in fact, did not belong to one but it is clear his beliefs were Federalist.
(Note ii): Tyler ran for VP as a Whig but after becomig President (due to sudden death of W. Harrison) he tried to please everyone and the Whigs soon expelled him.

The whole point of this long post: As the Republicans and Democrats become more alike, the more powerful any or all of the opposition parties will become. I am certain that within what remains of my lifetime we will see more of these parties getting elected more often to posts in the congress and senate and to an even larger number on the individual state levels. These is somewhat of a Checks and balance for keeping any one party from becoming overly dominate for more than one or 2 terms.

[truthseeker63]

This is true we have many parties.

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[Sethi]

Although I agree that the Democratic and Republican parties are not all that different, at one point in time I thought they were both just as bad, and didn't see much point supporting either party. I used to be an independent. Then after Clinton left office and we had George W Bush as a president, I realized just how far things can go under the wrong president. I did not support the invasions of Afghanistan or Iraq. So I became a democrat again, and supported the election of Obama.

I think both parties end up stearing towards the "middle of the road" and what they think will get them elected, and get them campaign donations, which is why they seem similar. Both parties are interested in maintaining American dominance and keeping the status quo. However, I do think that Obama is much better then Bush and the neo-cons.

Some may say that Obama has continued Bush's war policies, and may point to the new Libya war as an example as to why he is no different. I think that the circumstances are different (limited involvement, no invasion, did not get involved without a UN mandate, and without support from the Arab Union.) I hope that he hurries up and gets us out of Iraq and Afghanistan, but am still hopefull that he is moving in that direction. I think we will be out of Iraq soon, and don't see us landing troops in Libya.

The Tea Party, although I do not agree with most of what they say, does create an opportunity for a split in the Republican party, which may allow for more liberals to support parties other then the Democratic party, without feeling that they are wasting their vote. I am hopefull that we will see a shift in the current two party system soon, indeed, we may be seeing it now.