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Darth Ultor
12-19-2011, 12:48 PM
North Korean leader Kim Jong-il has died of a heart attack at the age of 69, state media have announced.

Millions of North Koreans were "engulfed in indescribable sadness", the KCNA state news agency said, as people wept openly in Pyongyang.
KNCA described one of his sons, Kim Jong-un, as the "great successor" whom North Koreans should unite behind.

Pyongyang's neighbours are on alert amid fears of instability in the poor and isolated nuclear-armed nation.
Continue reading the main story “Start Quote

This could be a turning point for North Korea”
William Hague UK Foreign Minister


Fears were compounded by unconfirmed reports from South Korean news agency Yonhap that the North had test-fired a missile off its eastern coast before the announcement of Kim Jong-il's death was made.
Unnamed government officials in Seoul were quoted as saying they did not believe the launch was linked to the announcement. The South Korean defence ministry has declined to comment.
Following news of Mr Kim's death, South Korea put its armed forces on high alert and said the country was on a crisis footing. Japan's government convened a special security meeting.
China - North Korea's closest ally and biggest trading partner - expressed shock at the news of his death and pledged to continue making "active contributions to peace and stability on the Korean peninsula and in this region".
Asian stock markets fell after the news was announced.
Crying aloud Mr Kim's death was announced in an emotional statement on national television.
Continue reading the main story Analysis

Lucy Williamson BBC News, Seoul
Kim Jong-il's death leaves a hole in the communist state that is difficult for outsiders to understand.
As only the country's second leader and the son of its founder, Kim Jong-il was more than just a national figurehead.
State propaganda elevated him to a demi-god, credited with superhuman powers of wisdom, leadership and military prowess.
Now that focus has moved to his younger son, Kim Jong-un. He has been publicly positioned as his father's successor for just over a year. But this is perhaps the toughest test of North Korea's stability.

The announcer, wearing black, struggled to keep back the tears as she said he had died of physical and mental over-work.
The KCNA later reported that he had died of a "severe myocardial infarction along with a heart attack" at 08:30 local time on Saturday (23:30 GMT Friday).
He had been on a train at the time, for one of his "field guidance" tours, KCNA said.
The state news agency said a funeral would be held in Pyongyang on 28 December and Kim Jong-un would head the funeral committee. A period of national mourning has been declared from 17 to 29 December.
Images from inside the secretive state showed people in the streets of Pyongyang weeping at the news of his death.
Ruling party members in one North Korean county were shown by state TV banging tables and crying out loud, the AFP news agency reports.
"I can't believe it," a party member named as Kang Tae-Ho was quoted as saying. "How can he go like this? What are we supposed to do?"
Another, Hong Sun-Ok, said: "He tried so hard to make our lives much better and he just left like this."
KCNA said people were "convulsing with pain and despair" at their loss, but would unite behind his successor Kim Jong-un.
Continue reading the main story North Korea



  • Population about 23 million
  • One million-strong army thought to be world's fifth largest
  • Manufacturing output mainly geared to military's demands
  • All aspects of daily life strictly controlled by government
  • Daily food shortages; acute power cuts and poor infrastructure




"All party members, military men and the public should faithfully follow the leadership of comrade Kim Jong-un and protect and further strengthen the unified front of the party, military and the public," the news agency said.
Little is known about Kim Jong-un. He was educated in Switzerland, is aged in his late 20s and is believed to be Kim Jong-il's third son - born to Mr Kim's reportedly favourite wife, the late Ko Yong-hui.
Kim Jong-un was unveiled as his father's likely successor just over a year ago. Many had expected to see this process further consolidated in 2012.
'Turning point' South Korea - which remains technically at war with the north - urged people to "go about their usual economic activities" on Monday, while putting the military on alert.
President Lee Myung-Bak spoke to US President Barack Obama by telephone and they "agreed to closely co-operate and monitor the situation together", a South Korean presidential spokesman said.
Reaction from Washington was muted, with the White House saying it was "closely monitoring" reports of the death.
The US remained "committed to stability on the Korean peninsula, and to the freedom and security of our allies", it said in a statement.
China said it was "distressed" to hear the news of his death. "We express our grief about this and extend our condolences to the people of North Korea," foreign ministry spokesman Ma Zhaoxu was quoted by Xinhua news agency as saying.
Continue reading the main story Analysis

Donald Gregg Former US ambassador to South Korea
Kim Jong-il's death should not have come as a complete surprise to anyone, given his tenuous health.
But it is safe to say that the North Koreans would have very much preferred that he lived one more year, so that in 2012, the 100th anniversary of the birth of Kim Il-sung, his father, Kim Jong-il would have been on hand to pay homage to "the Great Leader".
Now that lot will fall to Kim Jong-un, Kim Jong-il's youngest son who has been put forward as the natural and fully prepared successor to his father.



Analysts say that with the process of transition from father to son incomplete, Mr Kim's death could herald "very unstable times" in North Korea.
"We have to be very worried because whenever there is domestic instability North Korea likes to find an external situation to divert the attention away from that - including indulging in provocation," Professor Lee Jung-hoon, specialising in international relations at Yonsei University in Seoul, told the BBC.
Christopher Hill, former US representative to the six-party talks on North Korea's nuclear programme, said all parties needed to "keep cool heads".
Britain's Foreign Secretary William Hague said it could be a "turning point" for North Korea to engage more closely with the international community.
Kim Jong-il inherited the leadership of North Korea from his father Kim Il-sung.
Shortly after he came to power in 1994, a severe famine caused by ill-judged economic reforms and poor harvests left an estimated two million people dead.
His regime has been harshly criticised for human rights abuses and is internationally isolated because of its pursuit of nuclear weapons.
Under Mr Kim's leadership, funds have been channelled to the military and in 2006 North Korea conducted its first nuclear test. It followed that up with a second one three years later. Multinational talks aimed at disarming North Korea have been deadlocked for months.
He had reportedly been in poor health since suffering a stroke in August 2008.




I hope he's sent to the lowest part of Hell.
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Ramadhan
12-19-2011, 01:40 PM
I've just watched the news which showed the reaction of north koreans when they were hearing/watching the news of Kim Jong Il death.
I've never seen that many people cried that hard, I was mystified.
It's as if every single north korean just heard the news that their only child and their parents died at the same time.
The amount of brainwashing in North Korea must be beyond imagination.
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Insaanah
12-19-2011, 01:52 PM
Originally Posted by Ramadhan
The amount of brainwashing in North Korea must be beyond imagination.
Either that, or there is the possibility that we are brainwashed beyond imagination.

I don't know much about him, and am not commenting on him in particular, but remember our western media can paint a picture that readers/viewers/listeners won't think twice about and will take for granted as being 100% true.

Remember Iraq supposedly having weapons of mass destruction? Everyone believed it, yet it was fabricated justification for going to war. So imagine the scenario regarding states that are developing/have developed or have supposedly developed nuclear capabilities.

Anyhow Allah will be just to him, as He is the best of Judges.
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Dagless
12-19-2011, 02:27 PM
Originally Posted by Insaanah
Either that, or there is the possibility that we are brainwashed beyond imagination.
I thought that when I saw it too. Like they must really have loved him, but why if he is so oppressive? I also don't know much about him other than he doesn't like his people knowing too much about the reality of the world. I hope his son does some good.
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Ramadhan
12-19-2011, 03:20 PM
Not sure if any of this is true, but they will make you chuckle nevertheless:


The Incredible Kim Jong-il and his Amazing Achievements

Known to his people variously as The Supreme Leader, the Dear Leader, Our Father, the General, Lodestar of the 21st Century or Eternal President, Kim Jong-il has been credited with a mind-boggling series of achievements.

By Julian Ryall, Tokyo
2:45PM GMT 31 Jan 2011


* Even before his birth, the future leader of North Korea was triggering miracles. Official biographers say his birth in a cabin on the slopes of Baekdu Mountain in February 1942 was foretold by a swallow and heralded by a double rainbow. When he was born, a new star appeared in the night sky.
* The first time he picked up a golf club, in 1994, Kim reportedly shot a 38-under par round on North Korea's only golf course, including 11 holes-in-one. He then decided to retire from the sport for ever.
* Kim has the ability to alter the weather simply through the power of thought.
* The fledgling leader was a genius as an infant, with official North Korean biographies stating that he had learned to walk at just 3 weeks and was talking at 8 weeks.
* As a junior high school pupil in Pyongyang, he corrected and chastised his teachers for their incorrect interpretations of history.
* Kim wrote six full operas in two years, "all of which are better than any in the history of music," according to his official biography.
* He designed the Tower of the Juche Idea, a 170-metre tower in the east bank of the River Taedong in central Pyongyang that is topped by a glowing red flame.
* Kim's official biography also claims that he wrote 1,500 books during his time at Kim Sung Il University, from where he graduated in 1964.
* According to the Korea Central News Agency, Kim is an expert on all aspects of the film industry and "improved the scripts and guided the production" of the movie "Diary of a Girl Student." His favourite movies are reportedly "Friday the 13th," "Rambo" and anything starring Elizabeth Taylor.
* Kim reportedly employs a servant to inspect every grain of rice that is served to him. Any with the most minor of flaws is discarded.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worl...ievements.html
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Darth Ultor
12-19-2011, 04:29 PM
So is Kim Jong-il some kind of prophet? :D
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ardianto
12-19-2011, 04:53 PM
Kim Il-Sung : Son! tell our people, God does exist!
Kim Jong-Il : Too late! I am dead too!
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Crystal
12-19-2011, 05:16 PM
Yeah I saw that part where they all started crying - and their country is in mourning now for 10 days! We think that in a globalised world we are more aware of what happens in some country but North Korea is such a closed society - the people definitely don't know what the outside world is like and it seems they are very brainwashed. I also saw a video of the Koreans all surrounding a statue of King Jong Il and crying as if they were worshipping it - its just so crazy and so sad at the same time because they don't even know what they are doing is wrong
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Hamza Asadullah
12-19-2011, 05:36 PM
Anyone with Nucleur ambitions are made out to be "crazy madmen". But the only country in the world to have used nucleur weapons -US, are accepted to have a huge nucleur arsenal as are Israel. The fact is that the US fears any other country to have such weapons so they do everything in their power to isolate such a country like they have done with North Korea. But the truth is they fear North Korea and its capabilities and now that its leader has died this is their opportunity to continue their pressure and further isolation of that country.
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Hamza Asadullah
12-19-2011, 05:44 PM
Originally Posted by Crystal
Yeah I saw that part where they all started crying - and their country is in mourning now for 10 days! We think that in a globalised world we are more aware of what happens in some country but North Korea is such a closed society - the people definitely don't know what the outside world is like and it seems they are very brainwashed. I also saw a video of the Koreans all surrounding a statue of King Jong Il and crying as if they were worshipping it - its just so crazy and so sad at the same time because they don't even know what they are doing is wrong
When you open up a country for globalisation who are not allies of the US then you will have the same fate as many countries who have fallen victim to the US and its allies in the past 50 years or so. Some of the recent victims include Afghanistan, Iraq, Libya and now in Syria where they will use everything in their power to destabilize the country and destroy it until it is forced to bow to the west.

I think it is us who are brainwashed into believing what the media portrays about such countries but what North Korea have done is to protect themselves and their people against the evil of the US and its allies and that is what frustrates the US and why they have such little influence in North Korea.

As soon as a country who are not allies with the US open their country up tgen that is when they have opened themselves up to exploitation and destabilisation by tge US and its allies.
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IslamicRevival
12-19-2011, 07:31 PM
I dont know the ins and outs of how he run his country but i always considered him to be a good apple..out of a bad bunch. I applauded his stance against S Korea and its masters US, he stood up to the bullies and beat them.

The zionist controlled media hated him and they did their best to paint a picture of him being some sort of insane, wild leader. Its far from the truth
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serena77
12-19-2011, 07:52 PM
Salaams
the comment about him being so oppressive why would his people be so upset... my father was often so not a nice person... it was just who he was.... but when he passed I was still really upset. I think its the same thing but on a grander scale. He probably was taught to be revered no matter what. I read somewhere on msnbc earlier ( if true of course... it is western media) ... that all the people were classified into a huge list of categories depending on how loyal you were to the regieme ....
Serena
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Banu_Hashim
12-19-2011, 08:19 PM
The reaction to his death is ridiculous. Crying, wailing, banging of fists, making sujood... Surely they knew he was going to die. Why not put on this idiotic display of brainwashed emotions since the day he was born in anticipation of his death. Honestly- the guy cared more about developing an army then feeding his people. Maybe he stood against the US etc, Allah knows best but more worryingly, it seems to me he put himself up on a divine pedestal demanding worship, and he definitely got it today!

waAllahu 'Alam.
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Hamza Asadullah
12-19-2011, 08:31 PM
Honestly- the guy cared more about developing an army then feeding his people. Maybe he stood against the US etc, Allah knows best but more worryingly, it seems to me he put himself up on a divine pedestal demanding worship, and he definitely got it today!

waAllahu 'Alam.
How do you know this about him? Have you ever lived in North Korea? Have you ever spoken to any of the People? If not then how can you come up with such baseless conclusions? Dont tell me - The media. Thought so.
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Banu_Hashim
12-19-2011, 08:38 PM
Originally Posted by Hamza Asadullah
How do you know this about him? Have you ever lived in North Korea? Have you ever spoken to any of the People? If not then how can you come up with such baseless conclusions? Dont tell me - The media. Thought so.
Unfortunately, yes, all I have are media reports. I didn't have the luxury of flying to North Korea whenever I felt like it and having a private audience with Kim Jong-il. However, at the same time and for the same reason you just posted, no one knows whether he was a good leader, as a lot of people seem to think. These are also baseless conclusions. Which is why I said "wa Allahu 'Alam"; you seemed to miss that bit of my post.
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Hamza Asadullah
12-19-2011, 08:59 PM
Originally Posted by Banu_Hashim
Unfortunately, yes, all I have are media reports. I didn't have the luxury of flying to North Korea whenever I felt like it and having a private audience with Kim Jong-il. However, at the same time and for the same reason you just posted, no one knows whether he was a good leader, as a lot of people seem to think. These are also baseless conclusions. Which is why I said "wa Allahu 'Alam"; you seemed to miss that bit of my post.
None of us are saying he was a good leader because we dont know how good or bad he was but it is also unfair to say he was a bad person or leader just going by media reports alone.

Only his achievements and his people as a whole can judge him andlooking at the extent of the mourning over his death may give some indication as to how his people felt about him.

I think what good he has done is to close off his country from the outside world to prevent western intervention and meddling which they have a habit of doing since they have taken it upon themselves to be the world police.

Also I did notice your "Wallahu alum" but that was only after you made an uncalled for harsh judgement about him.

Let us let Allah be his judge.
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Banu_Hashim
12-19-2011, 09:07 PM
Originally Posted by Hamza Asadullah
Only his achievements and his people as a whole can judge him andlooking at the extent of the mourning over his death maybe some indication as to how his people felt about him. I think what good he has done is to close off his country from the outside world to prevent western intervention and meddling which they have a habit of doing since they have taken it upon themselves to be the world police.

Also I did notice your "Allahu wallum" but that was only after you made an uncalled for harsh judgement about him.

Let us let Allah be his judge.
Again, your perception of 'good' is just as invalid as my 'bad'. I agree my judgement was unsubstantiated and uncalled for- my apologies. I have no first hand evidence. But neither do you. He was not Muslim and no one knows what the impact of this alienation from the West actually was, on the ordinary people living there.

How do you know they wern't forced to act more distressed on camera and produced more tears?

I agree brother, let Allah be his judge.

:wa:
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Hamza Asadullah
12-19-2011, 09:16 PM
Originally Posted by Banu_Hashim
Again, your perception of 'good' is just as invalid as my 'bad'. I agree my judgement was unsubstantiated and uncalled for- my apologies. I have no first hand evidence. But neither do you. He was not Muslim and no one knows what the impact of this alienation from the West actually was, on the ordinary people living there.

How do you know they wern't forced to act more distressed on camera and produced more tears?

I agree brother, let Allah be his judge.

:wa:
Millions of people being forced to cry and wail? That is hardly a realistic statement to make.

And Allah knows best in all matters
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Banu_Hashim
12-19-2011, 09:20 PM
Originally Posted by Hamza Asadullah
Millions of people being forced to cry and wail? That is hardly a realistic statement to make.

And Allah knows best in all matters
No just the ones on camera. Millions? Did you go to North Korea and see the millions? Could it be that the sheer number was insinuated by crafty media work?

Indeed He (sub7aanahu wa ta3aala) does.
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Hamza Asadullah
12-19-2011, 09:31 PM
Originally Posted by Banu_Hashim
No just the ones on camera. Millions? Did you go to North Korea and see the millions? Could it be that the sheer number was insinuated by crafty media work?

Indeed He (sub7aanahu wa ta3aala) does.
One should never attack the character of a man that one does not know nor degrade a leader one has never been led by nor should one call the people brainwashed when one has never met, lived with nor spoken to such people.

Making such statements are clearly narrow minded and in itself come from being brainwashed by the media.
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Banu_Hashim
12-19-2011, 09:37 PM
Originally Posted by Hamza Asadullah
One should never attack the character of a man that one does not know nor degrade a leader one has never been led by nor should one call the people brainwashed when one has never met, lived with nor spoken to such people.

Making such statements are clearly narrow minded and in itself come from being brainwashed by the media.
Does anyone know George Bush on a personal level, and need to have been led by him to know his motives? I shan't reply again as clearly this is discussion is not beneficial or conducive to any positive outcome. I appreciate your comments and will take them on board. Barakallaahu feek. :wa:
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GuestFellow
12-19-2011, 10:31 PM
Salaam,

Good riddance. He's insane. Not all North Koreans support him. Some North Koreans managed to escape and flee to South Korea. There is a documentary on YouTube about North Korea. It is as though the citizens are expected to worship their leader and are taught to do so from a very young age. I would go bonkers living in that country.
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Ramadhan
12-19-2011, 11:16 PM
Originally Posted by Tragic Typos
I would go bonkers living in that country.
Probably not if you had been born there and lived your life. You wouldn't have any idea what life is like outside your country.
You even might have thought that North Korea was the only paradise on earth and that living in other countries were miserable.

I give you an example of much less scale:
I was born and lived all my younger life when Soeharto was the strongman president of Indonesia (he ruled Indonesia for 30 years) and I would never have had the wildest imagination that he and his family was going to get replaced with the sort of democracy that we have now so soon. I was so very proud of my country and thought living in Indonesia was the best anyone can do (until I went to study in Australia at 17 lol), which in many ways true don't get me wrong. But most of those kind of thinking we got from all kinds of indoctrinations, be it in school or through media which all were controlled by the government.
In fact, there was some sort of indoctrination and brain wash on a much less scale that Indonesians were led to believe that Soeharto was magically powerful that anyone would have been crushed if they would have dared to stand up to him.

Anyway, let this be lesson to future leaders who aspire to be modern day fir'auns: their power last very short time, and they will die.
And this proves that Al Qur'an always remain relevant.
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syed1
12-20-2011, 12:07 AM
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GuestFellow
12-20-2011, 05:51 PM
Originally Posted by Ramadhan

Probably not if you had been born there and lived your life. You wouldn't have any idea what life is like outside your country.
You even might have thought that North Korea was the only paradise on earth and that living in other countries were miserable.
Salaam,

I'm aware of that. What I meant is to visit North Korea and stay there. There have been a few people that visited North Korea, some were undercover journalists.

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Ghazalah
12-20-2011, 08:09 PM
Originally Posted by syed1
It wouldn't surprise me if they idolised his grave.
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IslamicRevival
12-20-2011, 08:36 PM
Originally Posted by syed1
Madness..but its no different to when Princess Diana or Micheal Jackson passed away.
Two great personalities in many peoples eyes and maybe the Korean people thought the same of their now deceased leader
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GuestFellow
12-21-2011, 05:14 PM
Some of them could just be acting and forced to cry. I highly doubt everyone was actually sad to see him gone.
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attica
12-21-2011, 07:31 PM
Because of Kim blocking outside influence in his country, it had a terrible famine in which between 900,000 and 3.5 million people out of a population of 22 million died. So up to almost 15% of the population.
I'd say that's pretty bad and enough reason to conclude that he wasn't a very good leader. Talking to a South Korean recently, he told me there is still is terrible famine up there. While this famine was going on, Kim used money that could have been used to help his people on developing nuclear weapons, in order to scare the West off intervening. The West would never intervene anyway, because they are scared of the Chinese reaction to such an invasion, so all he has done is punish his own people.
On the positive side, apparently his favourite movie is "Rambo: First Blood" which, while not being a masterpiece, is certainly superior to the Rambo sequels.
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marwen
12-21-2011, 08:05 PM
Originally Posted by Tragic Typos
Some of them could just be acting and forced to cry. I highly doubt everyone was actually sad to see him gone.
I agree. Honestly I can't believe that. People crying for a president ! whatever he was/
Besides it seems like a fabricated scene, reported by the national news agency of north korea (KCNA).
They seem mainly like a bunch of teens in uniforms (school students I guess) collected in that little place. More like a political message to be sent to enemies, than anything else.
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