Greetings of peace
format_quote Originally Posted by
Burninglight
I thought many who memorized it were killed in a battle?
By this, I think your reffering to this narration? Yes, many of the Qur'a died, but where does it say the Qur'aan itself was lost? It mentions that they began to recollect.
Volume 6, Book 61, Number 509:
Narrated Zaid bin Thabit:
Abu Bakr As-Siddiq sent for me when the people! of Yamama had been killed (i.e., a number of the Prophet's Companions who fought against Musailama). (I went to him) and found 'Umar bin Al-Khattab sitting with him. Abu Bakr then said (to me), "Umar has come to me and said: "Casualties were heavy among the Qurra' of the! Qur'an (i.e. those who knew the Quran by heart) on the day of the Battle of Yalmama, and I am afraid that more heavy casualties may take place among the Qurra' on other battlefields, whereby a large part of the Qur'an may be lost. Therefore I suggest, you (Abu Bakr) order that the Qur'an be collected." I said to 'Umar, "How can you do something which Allah's Apostle did not do?" 'Umar said, "By Allah, that is a good project. "Umar kept on urging me to accept his proposal till Allah opened my chest for it and I began to realize the good in the idea which 'Umar had realized." Then Abu Bakr said (to me). 'You are a wise young man and we do not have any suspicion about you, and you used to write the Divine Inspiration for Allah's Apostle. So you should search for (the fragmentary scripts of) the Qur'an and collect it in one book)." By Allah If they had ordered me to shift one of the mountains, it would not have been heavier for me than this ordering me to collect the Qur'an. Then I said to Abu Bakr, "How will you do something which Allah's Apostle did not do?" Abu Bakr replied, "By Allah, it is a good project." Abu Bakr kept on urging me to accept his idea until Allah opened my chest for what He had opened the chests of Abu Bakr and 'Umar. So I started looking for the Qur'an and collecting it from (what was written on) palmed stalks, thin white stones and also from the men who knew it by heart, till I found the last Verse of Surat At-Tauba (Repentance) with Abi Khuzaima Al-Ansari, and I did not find it with anybody other than him. The Verse is:
'Verily there has come unto you an Apostle (Muhammad) from amongst yourselves. It grieves him that you should receive any injury or difficulty..(till the end of Surat-Baraa' (At-Tauba) (9.128-129) Then the complete manuscripts (copy) of the Qur'an remained with Abu Bakr till he died, then with 'Umar till the end of his life, and then with Hafsa, the daughter of 'Umar.
format_quote Originally Posted by
Burninglight
Besides, if they weren't, why didn't they see to it that the first documented Qurans were done right so they didn't need to be burned??
Why do they need to see to it, when nobody suggested the Qur'aan was not done right? The understanding was of the vowels and dialects, this was the only issue that could affect it, i.e the meaning would have changed not the Qur'aan itself. It was burnt so that the wrong meaning and understanding would stay the same as it was revealed.
format_quote Originally Posted by
Burninglight
From what I understand Muslims weren't happy to give up their older versions of the Quran. If the Hafiz recite it so prefectly, why was there a need to burn it? The Qurish dialect reason makes no sense to me.
They weren't happy because many of the memorisers were killed, and thinking it would have been lost, but it didn't because it states that they began to compile them and finally did so, the next narration after this states that due to the differences of dialect there were differences therefore they had to be burnt in case the wrong understanding derives thereof. You see there were arabs with different dialects, the meanings could have changed easily, this would mean that original meaning is not there or would have been lost.
format_quote Originally Posted by
Burninglight
People must have divided over the differences. Imo, different versions of the Qurans can cause a problem severe enough to warrant a burning.
Not necessarily, there was still the original version to compare them to in order to know which is the correct. i.e. Uthman (ra) asked for it from Hafsa (ra).
format_quote Originally Posted by
Burninglight
If there were no differences there would have been no need to burn and recompile it. People don't divide over a dialect, but it would make sense if they divided over the contents in the Quran.
There were arabs and non-arab muslims, but the arabs could understand the arabic better without the vowels the non-arabs could not, so therefore there was only the need to add the vowels. And nope they did not divide over the contents of the Qur'aan. The only issue they would divide over was the dialect while there was still the original in order to have it corrected, which it did. As you can see from the hadeeth's.
format_quote Originally Posted by
Burninglight
So why didn't the Hafiz get the first (burned) one right?
you don't get it do you. I'm sure that if you watch the videos and read over this thread, hopefully it will make sense.
format_quote Originally Posted by
Burninglight
Is it because Arabic was a new language? If so, why did they write what was supposed to only be said?
Nope, because it was what was revealed to the prophet (p) through the archangel Gabrael. Because it was believed to be the word's of God to mankind, because that was what was being revealed. He spoke unto his people what was revealed unto him.
format_quote Originally Posted by
Burninglight
Quran means recite not write. Maybe the problem was they wrote instead of said especially when there is no evidence of a divine mandate to write like there was for the Bible.
They wrote and they 'recited', however, another way if you look at it, the Qur'aan is the message for the whole of mankind to muslim and non-muslim, this is a great advantage for those who cannot hear but can read, so they can recite it. Though there is nothing wrong in it being written.
format_quote Originally Posted by
Burninglight
If that is the case, Uthman did no different. Where did he get the original information to compile the Quran?
From the wife of the prophet Hafsa (ra), you know about the killing and the burning, how did you manage to miss this part?
format_quote Originally Posted by
Burninglight
The answer according to you is from the memory of the Hafiz. So why didn't their memory work for the Qurans that had to be burned?
It was Hafsa (ra) (the wife of the prophet (p) whom Uthman (ra) borrowed the Qur'aan and ordered it be to copied from.
format_quote Originally Posted by
Burninglight
If their memory failed them there or some other factor happened to cause the Qurans to be burned, how do you know it didn't happen to the recompiled versions of the Quran by Uthman who was no prophet standarizing the word of Allah
Do you realise that all the Qur'aans weren't burnt except the ones that were differing from the original.
Also it was written down on whatever they could find, palm stalks, white stones, etc etc, these were written from the time of the prophet (p) and also men who had memorised it, and the companion Abu Bakr (ra) the first caliph had ordered it to be collected due to having many Qura'a being killed in the battle of Yamama. Also notice that he Abu Bakr (ra) had ordered Zaid Ibn Thabith to help compile the Qur'aan as he used to write down the revelation from the prophet (p).
The prophet (p) had done his duty, as it was written down and many had memorised it. Also the memorisers were not going to lose out on a single verse, you will find today that there are youth of today who've memorised the whole book without a single mistake, so imagine those who were the companions, the closest.