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TrueStranger
04-06-2012, 05:57 AM
What is going on in the UK? It hasn't been a month since three Muslims men admitted to raping or sexually assaulting a 15 year old.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-leeds-17477561

And now, eleven men, (one being as old as 59) are on trial for engaging underage girls in sexual activities.

Eleven men are on trial at Liverpool Crown Court charged with conspiring to engage children in sexual activity. The first of the defendants took to the witness box yesterday to deny the charges, which he dismissed as “lies” and “rubbish”. He also accused one girl of being a racist who believed “whites were a superior race”.

The 59-year-old man, who cannot be named for legal reasons, admitted having a prolonged sexual relationship with one girl, who is alleged to have conspired with the men to exploit other young girls. But he said he believed she was 18 and was a prostitute.

When asked about the alleged victims in the case the man said: '’They were clever girls. They had a business empire which extended to Leeds, Nelson, Bradford. If they went on to Sugar’s programme they would probably win The Apprentice. They did very well.’’

The defendant shocked the court when he was asked a question about how one of the victims could describe his naked body. He stood up and took off his light blue sweat shirt to reveal his naked torso.

“She would have seen this,” he said, referring to his hairy body and back, which he claims she did not tell the police about.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/ukne...ung-girls.html
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Cabdullahi
04-06-2012, 11:15 AM
Is it me or do you only post about rape and sexual abuse?

These guys didn't do what they did because they were muslim...they did it because they are criminal....the media wants you to think otherwise!


What is going on in the UK? It hasn't been a month since three Muslims men admitted to raping or sexually assaulting a 15 year old.
You know why? because a story about white men raping white girls is not that explosive (which does happen btw we just dont hear about it)...no person would care if they saw it on the news as much as they would care when the attention grabbing title includes the word 'muslim' ......

This so called 'muslim' drinks alcohol, never prays..is probably between Islam and agnosticism. why the need to include the persons religion?...what does it have to do with anything?

What these men did is beyond disgusting, but the double standards by the media, because of them peddling ' muslim ' stories more often than other similar stories by non muslims, which is more prevalent.... is disgusting.


Muslim girl gang kicked Rhea Page head yelling kill white slag
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...lag-FREED.html

'Muslim' girl gang......why the need to include the word 'muslim'........1.none of them look muslim, 2. they were out in the early hours in the morning, and 3. they had been drinking alcohol.

They dont know anything about islam...they've adopted a western lifestyle...so why 'muslim' gang?

If you keep reading muslim-bashing newspapers and online articles...then they will cast doubts into your mind about islam

Only reading gloom and doom articles makes you gloomy and that's a fact!
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Jedi_Mindset
04-06-2012, 12:51 PM
Originally Posted by Cbdullahii
Is it me or do you only post about rape and sexual abuse?

The guys didn't do what they did because they were muslim...they did it because they are criminal....the media wants you to think otherwise!




You know why? because a story about white men raping white girls is not that explosive (which does happen btw we just dont hear about it)...no person would care if they saw it on the news as much as they would care when the attention grabbing title includes the word 'muslim' ......

This so called 'muslim' drinks alcohol, never prays..is probably between Islam and agnosticism. why the need to include the persons religion?...what does it have to do with anything?

What these men did is beyond disgusting, but the double standards by the media, because of them peddling ' muslim ' stories more often than other similar stories by non muslims.... is disgusting.



http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...lag-FREED.html

'Muslim' girl gang......why the need to include muslim........1.none of them look muslim 2. they were out in the early hours in the morning 3. they had been drinking alcohol.

They dont know anything about islam...they've adopted a western lifestyle...so why 'muslim' gang?

If you keep reading muslim-bashing newspapers and online articles...then they will cast doubts into your mind about islam

Only reading gloom and doom articles make you gloomy and that's a fact!
I wanted to reply until i saw your post, a very clear and good post bro Masha'Allah so true.

Its very horrible that this happens but this article show indirectly that they are in war with islam, the media, books, psychical war (USA invasion of libya, afghanistan, somalia, iraq), freedom of speech, lets name them all. you don't want to know what this article is doing to someone's mind when he/she reads it, especially a non-muslim and anti-muslims.

Soon you will be walking on the street when some people scream at you: ''terrorist'', muzzie, bombmaker, pedophile, cult follower blabla. infact this happens already, when someone has the money, go out of the west, they want to kill us, because islam is the only thing that stands in their way.

Times will come when we need to sharpen our swords or to buy and own a land or finding a cave.

:sl:
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aamirsaab
04-06-2012, 02:15 PM
The article makes no mention of the fact that they were muslims or followers of the Islamic faith.

But it is indeed an absolutely disgusting act that has taken place. I hope they all go to jail.

And get raped.
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Jedi_Mindset
04-06-2012, 02:38 PM
Originally Posted by aamirsaab
The article makes no mention of the fact that they were muslims or followers of the Islamic faith.

But it is indeed an absolutely disgusting act that has taken place. I hope they all go to jail.

And get raped.
Mentioned in this article or not, it doesn't play out the fact that everything what a ''muslim'' does is blamed on islam. This is one of the reasons i don't read kufaar sources anymore, there are many other reasons too.
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aamirsaab
04-06-2012, 04:54 PM
Originally Posted by Jedi_Mindset
Mentioned in this article or not, it doesn't play out the fact that everything what a ''muslim'' does is blamed on islam. This is one of the reasons i don't read kufaar sources anymore, there are many other reasons too.
That's fine and dandy and I'm pretty sure everyone is in agreement, but it's actually a different issue altogether and there was no need to bring it up on this particular occasion, since it didn't actually happen in this particular occasion (which is why I posted what I did to help clarify matters, so we can now hopefully get to discussing the article)

:)
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TrueStranger
04-06-2012, 05:51 PM
Originally Posted by Cbdullahii
Is it me or do you only post about rape and sexual abuse?
And?

I initially wanted to reply to your question seriously, but it’s completely insignificant and misleading. So, my answer to you will be “And?”


These guys didn't do what they did because they were muslim...they did it because they are criminal....the media wants you to think otherwise!

You know why? because a story about white men raping white girls is not that explosive (which does happen btw we just dont hear about it)...no person would care if they saw it on the news as much as they would care when the attention grabbing title includes the word 'muslim' ......

This so called 'muslim' drinks alcohol, never prays..is probably between Islam and agnosticism. why the need to include the persons religion?...what does it have to do with anything?

What these men did is beyond disgusting, but the double standards by the media, because of them peddling ' muslim ' stories more often than other similar stories by non muslims, which is more prevalent.... is disgusting.



http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...lag-FREED.html

'Muslim' girl gang......why the need to include the word 'muslim'........1.none of them look muslim, 2. they were out in the early hours in the morning, and 3. they had been drinking alcohol.

They dont know anything about islam...they've adopted a western lifestyle...so why 'muslim' gang?

If you keep reading muslim-bashing newspapers and online articles...then they will cast doubts into your mind about islam

Only reading gloom and doom articles makes you gloomy and that's a fact!
This matter is not about “Muslim bashing”, but rather a group of Muslims who are accused of partaking in a hideous crime. You could see in both of the articles I have posted, and your latest article that these Muslims are behaving in a manner that is un-Islamic and uncultured. The magnitude of the issue becomes more disturbing when we have groups, and not individuals committing crimes that disturb the social cohesion and representation of society. Individuals such as yourself and Jedi are more concerned about the reporting method of the crime and not the enormity of these crimes. They are Muslims, that is a fact, whether their behavior is associated with Islam or the Muslim community depends on how harshly and openly we (Muslims) condemn them. Their behavior is not limited to or restricted to what you refer to as the “western way of life”. Such behaviors also occur in Muslim countries and it’s because of the “let’s keep everything bad Muslims do quiet” mentality that fosters certain behaviors to remain an open secret in most Muslim societies.

Besides sharing the same faith with them, I do not associate myself with any of the Muslims involved in these crimes. I can criticize their behavior without ever doubting Islam. Are you suggesting that we ignore the crimes Muslims commit because such “articles will cast doubts in our minds about Islam”? Condemning such behavior is not equivalent to portraying Islam negatively, but rather remaining silent and avoiding critical disapproval of such behavior(s) could be viewed as acceptance to say the least.

What you refer to as gloom and doom articles are part of every day life, and purposely ignoring them is a sign of indifference towards humanity. That is a Fact!

Salaam Aliakum
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GuestFellow
04-06-2012, 05:53 PM
Originally Posted by Cbdullahii
Is it me or do you only post about rape and sexual abuse?
Salaam,

Selective distortion?

These guys didn't do what they did because they were muslim...they did it because they are criminal....the media wants you to think otherwise!
Both of the articles did not mention anything about Muslims. Your the one that brought Islam and Muslims into this discussion.

These men are suspects, so let's just wait and see what happens.
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TrueStranger
04-06-2012, 05:58 PM
Originally Posted by Jedi_Mindset
Mentioned in this article or not, it doesn't play out the fact that everything what a ''muslim'' does is blamed on islam. This is one of the reasons i don't read kufaar sources anymore, there are many other reasons too.
When a good portion of Muslims ignore the crimes being committed by fellow Muslims, then of course the Western media will take advantage of it and address the problem to further their dehumanization of Muslims. Do you think people would associate Muslim criminals with Islam, if political, religious, and social leaders from Muslim communities worked towards finding solutions to social and legal issues that exist within Muslim communities?


It's our constant hesitation and silence that provides them with the upper-grounds.
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aadil77
04-06-2012, 07:21 PM
This is a dirty old deed found in parts of the pakistani community, its only recently police have cracked down hard on it which is why we're getting loads of these cases in a short space of time - they avoided it before fearing racial tensions.
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Jedi_Mindset
04-06-2012, 08:39 PM
Originally Posted by TrueStranger
When a good portion of Muslims ignore the crimes being committed by fellow Muslims, then of course the Western media will take advantage of it and address the problem to further their dehumanization of Muslims. Do you think people would associate Muslim criminals with Islam, if political, religious, and social leaders from Muslim communities worked towards finding solutions to social and legal issues that exist within Muslim communities?


It's our constant hesitation and silence that provides them with the upper-grounds.
I agree, its also our own fault that many people think bad about muslims, that many muslims also are falling in the fitnah of shaytaan and dajjal. Its our job to give dawah also to the bad muslims so their imaan will raise again Insha'Allah.
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GuestFellow
04-06-2012, 09:15 PM
Salaam,

Let's make one thing clear. These men have been charged. They have not been found guilty of any offence. Therefore, they are innocent.
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purple
04-06-2012, 09:25 PM
^^Two of them admitted rape charges.
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GuestFellow
04-06-2012, 09:30 PM
^ Oh sorry, my bad lol.
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TrueStranger
04-06-2012, 09:33 PM
Originally Posted by Jedi_Mindset
I agree, its also our own fault that many people think bad about muslims, that many muslims also are falling in the fitnah of shaytaan and dajjal. Its our job to give dawah also to the bad muslims so their imaan will raise again Insha'Allah.
Salaam Aliakum, I did not forgot how Western media portrays Muslims in this age. In most cases negativity is the theme of the news ( most news is like that), but I would rather hear criticism coming from sincere Muslim leaders, then from the Western media which might dilute the issue with other sociopolitical matters.
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Cabdullahi
04-07-2012, 12:32 PM
And?

I initially wanted to reply to your question seriously, but it’s completely insignificant and misleading. So, my answer to you will be “And?”
Well, it would be nice, for a change , to make a thread regarding good things that good Muslim men do. The opposite to domestic violence and rape, that perhaps might be of benefit to the brothers insha'Allah, maybe i should do that.
This matter is not about “Muslim bashing”, but rather a group of Muslims who are accused of partaking in a hideous crime. You could see in both of the articles I have posted, and your latest article that these Muslims are behaving in a manner that is un-Islamic and uncultured. The magnitude of the issue becomes more disturbing when we have groups, and not individuals committing crimes that disturb the social cohesion and representation of society
Agree
Individuals such as yourself and Jedi are more concerned about the reporting method of the crime and not the enormity of these crimes.
I disagree because i did talk about the enormity of the crimes these men committed, maybe you missed that part Allahu'Alam, but here it is again :

''What these men did is beyond disgusting,''


They are Muslims, that is a fact, whether their behavior is associated with Islam or the Muslim community depends on how harshly and openly we (Muslims) condemn them. Their behavior is not limited to or restricted to what you refer to as the “western way of life”.
Regarding the specific aforementioned cases, if Muslim men drank Alcohol provided alcohol, smoked weed and sold weed and Muslim women partied like the Muslim girl gang...what way of life is that?

If one does not live by Islam, I'm afraid ones' behavior is restricted to ''those who make their Desires their LORD'' [25:43] and let me tell you...Some Muslims can take their desires as their lord, it just means they do not know anything about Islam, they're just Muslim by name.

Taking desires as lord is the epitome of the western way of living.

Such behaviors also occur in Muslim countries and it’s because of the “let’s keep everything bad Muslims do quiet” mentality that fosters certain behaviors to remain an open secret in most Muslim societies.
Its not always about ''lets keep everything bad muslims do quiet'' What system do they use in these 'muslim countries' ?, for example you posted ''Row over Afghan wife-starving law''

What kind of law is that? we can clearly see that its not always about sins people commit secretly that people try to sweep under the carpet but the system in use, itself, is fundamentally flawed.

It encourages abuse and let's people get away with crimes that they shouldn't have.

We are ruled by other than Allahs law, our leaders are despots, our people follow culture more than Islam and so on and that is the root cause of our problems.

Besides sharing the same faith with them, I do not associate myself with any of the Muslims involved in these crimes. I can criticize their behavior without ever doubting Islam.
Masha'Allah

Are you suggesting that we ignore the crimes Muslims commit because such “articles will cast doubts in our minds about Islam”?
That's a categoric no, There is nothing wrong with reading about crimes Muslims commit, its good to know of how the muslim ummah is shaping up and what needs to be done to rectify issues within our society, but what I'm suggesting is to not read sensationalist articles that mix truth with falsehood and blow things out of proportion, that's all I'm saying.

I was just a tad concerned because i saw a couple of threads you made about wife abuse and rape and then i saw the ''Wifehood and Motherhood are Not the Only Ways to Paradise'' thread and thought to myself maybe doubt is creeping in.

Maybe i over-analysed things Allahu'Alam.
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purple
04-07-2012, 01:27 PM
Edit....
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Snowflake
04-07-2012, 03:47 PM
I don't understand what those muslims girls did was wrong - according to those who want muslims to adopt the western way of life. That's exactly what these girls did, didn't they? Go out, get drunk, then get excused for a crime cuz alcohol was to blame.

If you're a good muslim, you're a terrorist. If you're a bad muslim, then Islam gets the blame. Bloody idiots.
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White Rose
04-07-2012, 05:00 PM
One thing that angers me is that these bad Muslims bring down Islam and its beauty with them. I get so angry at these people:mad:
Now if you look at christians. You won't be reading news about "Christians" committing crimes but when a so called muslim does, they put the the word Muslim in the headlines.. I mean what is this....
Even if one Christian does something wrong, the media is gonna say, "Oh this person had mental disorder blah blah..." but when a Muslim does something wrong, they portray the entire Muslims as ignorant and as oppressed ones.
Media as its finest.
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TrueStranger
04-07-2012, 07:03 PM
Originally Posted by Cbdullahii
Well, it would be nice, for a change , to make a thread regarding good things that good Muslim men do. The opposite to domestic violence and rape, that perhaps might be of benefit to the brothers insha'Allah, maybe i should do that.
You need to stop taking matters that are associated with criminality personally. If you do not rape women or abuse them, then I do not seen the reason as to why you have an issue with someone who is trying to highlight the plight of some Muslims sisters. I agree, be the change you want to see.

Regarding the specific aforementioned cases, if Muslim men drank Alcohol provided alcohol, smoked weed and sold weed and Muslim women partied like the Muslim girl gang...what way of life is that?

If one does not live by Islam, I'm afraid ones' behavior is restricted to ''those who make their Desires their LORD'' [25:43] and let me tell you...Some Muslims can take their desires as their lord, it just means they do not know anything about Islam, they're just Muslim by name.

Taking desires as lord is the epitome of the western way of living.
Don't you see the irony, you, yourself refer to them as "Muslim men" and "Muslim women". No one is talking about Islam here, but rather an issue with the Muslim community. Whether they are Muslim by name or by principle we can not ignore the fact that they come from within our communities. No one is associating these men and women with Islam other than you.


Its not always about ''lets keep everything bad muslims do quiet'' What system do they use in these 'muslim countries' ?, for example you posted ''Row over Afghan wife-starving law''

What kind of law is that? we can clearly see that its not always about sins people commit secretly that people try to sweep under the carpet but the system in use, itself, is fundamentally flawed.

It encourages abuse and let's people get away with crimes that they shouldn't have.
Ha, you're really taking matters personally. But anyways, brother, it's a law that a particular Muslim nation has came up with. Remember I didn't say an "Islamic Nation". Besides, an open secret is not about sins people commit secretly, but one that is committed out in the open and people remain silent about it.

We are ruled by other than Allahs law, our leaders are despots, our people follow culture more than Islam and so on and that is the root cause of our problems.
I agree.


That's a categoric no, There is nothing wrong with reading about crimes Muslims commit, its good to know of how the muslim ummah is shaping up and what needs to be done to rectify issues within our society, but what I'm suggesting is to not read sensationalist articles that mix truth with falsehood and blow things out of proportion, that's all I'm saying.
You might have derived that perception from the articles, but I haven't.

I was just a tad concerned because i saw a couple of threads you made about wife abuse and rape and then i saw the ''Wifehood and Motherhood are Not the Only Ways to Paradise'' thread and thought to myself maybe doubt is creeping in.

Maybe i over-analysed things Allahu'Alam.
LOL! :D;D;D;D;D;D;D;D. Please, carry on and let your thoughts creep away.

Salaam Alaikum
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Snowflake
04-08-2012, 01:39 PM
If you want to corrupt a society, there's no better way to do it than have a legal system - that is unjust. I read so many cases where the punishment doesn't for the crime. Nor do cosy prisons with all the conveniences of outside life bar freedom punish people or act as deterrents. People have no fear of reoffending and ending up in prison again while hard-working tax-paying citizens support their sorry lives. There are even people who will offend to get into prison because they get 'looked after.' The gov. knows everything, so this is what they must really want. A corrupt society that keeps the cogs of their secret agendas (zionism) turning.

For ethnic minority repeat offenders & first time serious offenders, british born or not - immediate deportation. Imagine the threat of deportation, or temporary loss of citizenship (depending on severity of the crime)?

For british english and ethnic minority first time offenders - name and shame - boots camps - community service - loss of benefits - and prisons with reform programs minus the luxuries currently available to prisoners


Harsher sentences serve both as punishment and deterrents. Saudi Arabia is proof of that.
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