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جوري
04-17-2012, 12:48 PM
?????????????????????
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asiya45
04-17-2012, 12:54 PM
I dont know! I wish I did! Nothing seems to be normal in my life! :hmm:
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peace_maker
04-17-2012, 12:54 PM
What do you mean? :?
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جوري
04-17-2012, 12:56 PM
It is an open ended question for folks to define the baseline of normalcy without fixed limits or restrictions ...
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GodIsAll
04-17-2012, 12:57 PM
"Normal" is the equivalent of "boring".
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جوري
04-17-2012, 12:58 PM
what's boring then?
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peace_maker
04-17-2012, 12:59 PM
I think "normal" is average??
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asiya45
04-17-2012, 01:01 PM
If I knew what normal was, only then I would be able to understand abnormality!
We all have flaws, are we still normal?
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جوري
04-17-2012, 01:03 PM
I don't know what's the baseline?
Is it reaching certain milestones by a particular period of time? and if so what should those milestones be?
Is abnormal the exception to the rule or has it become the norm? How do we get things back to the norm if the exception has become the standard?
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GodIsAll
04-17-2012, 01:03 PM
Hold on, BlueBell! If you're going to tickle my brain with philosophical questions this early in the day, let me get another cup of coffee...

I'll be back:sl:
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asiya45
04-17-2012, 01:04 PM
Originally Posted by لميس
what's boring then?
Accroding to me boring means to not have anything to do!
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جوري
04-17-2012, 01:07 PM
Originally Posted by asiya45
Accroding to me boring means to not have anything to do!
Then that can't be normal if by mere definition normal is the standard.. we can't all have nothing to do as the standard?
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asiya45
04-17-2012, 01:07 PM
Originally Posted by asiya45
Accroding to me boring means to not have anything to do!
But then we always have something to do! :heated:
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جوري
04-17-2012, 01:14 PM
Originally Posted by asiya45
But then we always have something to do! :heated:
:haha: yes so true sis... I think we're in the period of' thoumma' and it is difficult because it is a winding road and seems limitless.. and to me seems very not normal to see every household with an affliction and no interjection of good in any form just to balance things or to give one the strength to bare with it...

Volume 9, Book 88, Number 182:
Narrated Usama bin Zaid:
Once the Prophet stood over one of the high buildings of Medina and then said (to the people), "Do you see what I see?" They said, "No." He said, "I see afflictions falling among your houses as rain drops fall."
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asiya45
04-17-2012, 01:33 PM
Originally Posted by لميس
:haha: yes so true sis... I think we're in the period of' thoumma' and it is difficult because it is a winding road and seems limitless.. and to me seems very not normal to see every household with an affliction and no interjection of good in any form just to balance things or to give one the strength to bare with it...

Volume 9, Book 88, Number 182:
Narrated Usama bin Zaid:
Once the Prophet stood over one of the high buildings of Medina and then said (to the people), "Do you see what I see?" They said, "No." He said, "I see afflictions falling among your houses as rain drops fall."
Sister what is "Thoumma?"

Things in my life seem so abnormal.....
My husband and I visit India often... life in India is so different than the life in Canada but at the same time my life before marriage was so much different than my life now.
I had never visited a country out side of North America to even feel that abnormality untill 4 years ago. When I was in elementary I knew that I wasn't normal because I was a muslim and was forbidden to do things other kids did... Later on in my life I understood why my parents stopped me. I just dont bother trying to fit somewhere now that I have understood Islam.
And accepted myself as abnormal!!

It all just seems like a mind game!! :heated:
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Endymion
04-17-2012, 01:39 PM
My siblings call me abnormal :hmm: I dunno the definition of normal but if you ask me whats abnormal,then,thats me :skeleton:
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asiya45
04-17-2012, 01:40 PM
^ me too :skeleton:
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جوري
04-17-2012, 01:41 PM
Originally Posted by asiya45
Sister what is "Thoumma?"
It means 'then'
“Rasul Allah (sal Allahu alaihi wa sallam) said: ‘Prophethood will last among you for as long as Allah wills, then Allah will take it away. Then it will be (followed by) a Khilafah Rashida (rightly guided) on the pattern of the Prophethood. It will remain for as long as Allah wills, then Allah will take it away. Afterwards there will be a hereditary leadership which will remain for as long as Allah wills, then He will lift it if He wishes. Afterwards, there will be biting oppression, and it will last for as long as Allah wishes, then He will lift it if He wishes. Then there will be a Khilafah Rashida according to the ways of the Prophethood.’ Then he kept silent.” [Musnad Imam Ahmad]

So we're in that period now and I don't know how long it will last.. but surely every Muslim household is afflicted with something so sharp and decisive that it would split one that way or the other so that as the hadith states:

Abu Hurairah said, The Prophet said, Woe to the Arabs from the great evil which is nearly approaching them: it will be like patches of dark night. A man will wake up as a believer, and be a kafir (unbeliever) by nightfall. People will sell their religion for a small amount of worldly goods. The one who clings to his religion on that day will be as one who is grasping an ember - or thorns. (Ahmad.) .. I am talking of the caliber of Tariq Mehanna being imprisoned for thinking thoughts America dislikes.. that sort of gravity of abnormal .. unless that's normal.. I don't know
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asiya45
04-17-2012, 01:51 PM
^Thank you, Sister BlueBell!!

A person can be ABNORMAL in many ways....but when a person becomes NORMAL...they become the target!!

So are we to be NORMAL or PRETEND to be ABNORMAL in a so call ABNORMAL society?
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جوري
04-17-2012, 02:01 PM
I don't know that we can pretend really.. we're simply passive recipients of what comes.. it is fate and it is unfortunately not a good time for Muslims:

Volume 9, Book 88, Number 188:
Narrated Az-Zubair bin 'Adi:
We went to Anas bin Malik and complained about the wrong we were suffering at the hand of Al-Hajjaj. Anas bin Malik said, "Be patient till you meet your Lord, for no time will come upon you but the time following it will be worse than it. I heard that from the Prophet."

I am not feeling optimistic unfortunately since every generation is going to experience a worse time than that which preceded..
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Ramadan90
04-17-2012, 02:12 PM
I think we need to first distinguish between definition of normal in normative(morality, reason, measured behaviour) and statisical sense(avarage or median of a data etc). Interesting question, I will get back to this thread with some thoughts if I have time.
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asiya45
04-17-2012, 02:12 PM
:hmm: I dont even have kids yet but I pray for them everyday!! When thinking about what will happen in the future, gives my goosebumps!!imsad
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Jedi_Mindset
04-17-2012, 02:34 PM
Its normal for human being to have faith in Allah, and submit to HIS will(This is the reason why Allah(SWT) created us) even though our desires will prevent it (if we don't struggle). Although when u are a pious believer and especally living in the west, u won't have a good image and you will be labeled as extremist. Imaan these days...is like walking on hot coal.

Times where someone wakes up as a believer and sleeps as a kafir. Or the opposite. Like our nabi(Saw) predicted. Though times, but we're in the end times, it can only become more worse until Mahdi(As) and prophet Isa(As) arrive.
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Scimitar
04-17-2012, 02:47 PM
I'd settle for normal, but aspire to the "exceptional".

Normal is what you are used to, the mean by which society tolerates social activities which may be deemed offensive by other neighbouring societies - making the same practice that is normal in one locality, an abnormal practice in another... for example:

It is normal for Muslims to go to offer salah at masjids in East London, but not outside number 10 Downing Street, it is not normal. That's one version of it... thing is, you can go ape working out definitions of normal ... even while writing this, I thought of about 3 more.

Now to go all geekynerdo on you, dictionary definitions LOOOOL:
normal


[nawr-muhl]  
Example Sentences Origin
nor·mal

   [nawr-muhl] Show IPA

adjective1.conforming to the standard or the common type; usual; notabnormal; regular; natural.

2.serving to establish a standard.

3.Psychology .a.approximately average in any psychological trait, asintelligence, personality, or emotional adjustment.

b.free from any mental disorder; sane.



4.Biology, Medicine/Medical .a.free from any infection or other form of disease ormalformation, or from experimental therapy ormanipulation.

b.of natural occurrence.



5.Mathematics .a.being at right angles, as a line; perpendicular.

b.of the nature of or pertaining to a mathematical normal.

c.(of an orthogonal system of real functions) defined sothat the integral of the square of the absolute value ofany function is 1.

d.(of a topological space) having the property thatcorresponding to every pair of disjoint closed sets aretwo disjoint open sets, each containing one of theclosed sets.

e.(of a subgroup) having the property that the sameset of elements results when all the elements of thesubgroup are operated on consistently on the left andconsistently on the right by any element of the group;invariant.



EXPAND






noun
7.the average or mean: Production may fall below normal.

8.the standard or type.

9.Mathematics .a.a perpendicular line or plane, especially oneperpendicular to a tangent line of a curve, or a tangentplane of a surface, at the point of contact.

b.the portion of this perpendicular line included betweenits point of contact with the curve and the x- axis.





00:

Origin:





1520–30; < Latin normālis made according to a carpenter'ssquare, equivalent to norm ( a ) ( see norm) + -ālis -al1

Related formsnor·mal·i·ty, nor·mal·ness, noun
an·ti·nor·mal, adjective
an·ti·nor·mal·ness, noun
an·ti·nor·mal·i·ty, noun
half-nor·mal, adjective
EXPAND











Example Sentences

  • Weather is so variable that it's hard to call any situation normal.

  • Monsoons are normal, but the duration and intensity was bizarre.

  • It is normal for a cow to eat her young when she senses that they aresickly.
  • Scimi




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Ramadan90
04-17-2012, 03:19 PM
Or you could take the easy way out... LOL! ^^

I looked forward to discuss from a philosophical perspective.:'(
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جوري
04-17-2012, 03:35 PM
by no means am I looking for the dictionary definition. A philosophical one is welcome and it is open ended..
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Scimitar
04-17-2012, 03:38 PM
Originally Posted by Allah&lt;3
I think we need to first distinguish between definition of normal in normative(morality, reason, measured behaviour) and statisical sense(avarage or median of a data etc). Interesting question, I will get back to this thread with some thoughts if I have time.
Originally Posted by Allah&lt;3
Or you could take the easy way out... LOL! ^^

I looked forward to discuss from a philosophical perspective.
If you got time to read, you got time to write :D

Philosophically eh? Loving it... Ok, I'll start then, kick this off so to speak.

1) Measuring what is normal from a moral perspective: I argue that the roots of all morality is ground in religious doctrine. But I also argue that religious morality is not the rule today, but the exception... so here you can see a contrast. Anyone differ?

2) measured behaviour... this one is a catch 22 argument. Measuring behaviour according to what standards? A clinic which houses mentally disturbed patients will see the passing public point and say "bunch of freaks"... but inside the clinic, it's just another day, right? Again, a contrast. But one with a different attachment. Anyone differ?

3) What is normal according to statistical data?, Analytical information that gets chosen to determine the average of something, does not reflect if it is normal. An example: My blood sugar is high, it is abnormally high - the readings all come back saying that blood pressure is off the charts... not normal, right? But it is for me... It's how i am, right?

These philosophical debates are actually the easier way out, and lead to a lot of confusion.

You can stick the three greatest philosophers, arguers of logic in the same room: Socrates, Plato and Aristotle and guess what? They'd disagree on fundamental points where there POV differs from eachother. Infact, I believe that the three would be at eachothers throats... a classic exa,mple of where philosophy fails at the highest level. So where do we go from there?

The answer is - back to faith. So back to this again: " I argue that the roots of all morality is ground in religious doctrine"

Scimi

EDIT: I think the better question would be "what is your reality, and what is normal in your reality".
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White Rose
04-17-2012, 03:50 PM
Good question.
If I was the only person living in this world, everything I would do would seem normal to me.
Line starts to get drawn when there is a clash of opinions.
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جوري
04-17-2012, 03:57 PM
How does one overcome the perceived abnormality then to become normal? For instance if the law of the land is freedom of speech and you use that right freely under that law to express yourself and receive a sentence of 17.5 years, or elicit a drone attack or or or..
or let's say the state decides that in order for you to achieve a certain position you need to pass the state requirement and when you do they shut the door on your face for similar reasons let's say you're too Muslim or too passive or whatever they concoct.
Do you think that everyone that uses the principals defined by the state to achieve the 'norm' and then denied it is abnormal?.. how then would you reconcile that? Just fight to the death? redefine the norm? stage a coup? succumb?
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Scimitar
04-17-2012, 04:02 PM
I think the best answer to that is "Find a diffferent reality, one that reflects your choice of what is normal - better."

This is why Hijra is an option for us. Infact, the time is close now, where practicing Islam in the west will be vilified... ground work is already laid out (above post houses two small examples). Hijaab bans, bearded men seen as suspect, anti-Islam propaganda... sadly, this is normailty here in the west, and the trend suggests that Muslims are definitely on the back foot. Worse, the trend also suggests that this onslaught of anti-Islam propaganda is only gonna make life for Muslims in the west, more difficult. And if given enough time to get used to that - it will become normal...

We should check that "back foot stance", stop, turn around and refuse to "play" their "game"...

...Like I said, hijra.

Unfortunately, there are not many options for that either. Sad and interesting times we are living in.

Scimi
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جوري
04-17-2012, 04:06 PM
Originally Posted by Scimitar
...Like I said, hijra.

Unfortunately, there are not many options for that either.
No there are not!.. and unfortunately unless you go there as a stowaway forget your entire education etc. there's virtually a zero chance of that occurring...
These are difficult times we live in....

Worst yet, they'd gladly give your a$$ up, have them drone you or whatever other means if it meant some despot remains on his seat.

:w:
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Haya emaan
04-17-2012, 04:10 PM
Originally Posted by لميس
What is normal?
for me every thing is normal if it goes on the track i have 'expected', and when something 'unexpected' happens is 'abnormal' until i accept it and become used to of it..
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جوري
04-17-2012, 04:12 PM
Originally Posted by muslima haya
for me every thing is normal if it goes on the track i have 'expected', and when something 'unexpected' happens is 'abnormal' until i accept it and become used to of it..
Yes, I think I have a problem with the accepting portion.. I don't even know how that reconciles with being a Muslim?.. I have a difficult time understanding the concept of fate vs. free will.
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sister herb
04-17-2012, 04:15 PM
Originally Posted by GodIsAll
"Normal" is the equivalent of "boring".
"Normal" means that you think everything what is normal is boring?

:giggling:
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asiya45
04-17-2012, 05:17 PM
We are all normal and abnormal in some way or another! :hmm:

What's normal in the west is not normal in India or the Middle East,
but then whatever that is normal in India is not normal in the Middle East,
and what is normal in the Middle East is not normal in India or anywhere else in the world.
:heated: WILL WE EVER BE NORMAL anywhere in the world? We have to try to fit somewhere :?...:hmm:
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sister herb
04-17-2012, 05:45 PM
Maybe being normal is overvalued any ways.
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asiya45
04-17-2012, 05:54 PM
^true...I still dont get it...
if Normal is to submit to Allah then I am normal as muslim but abnormal to the non-muslims...
if normal is to eat with your hands then I am normal in my house but not in the public
:heated:



Does being PREFECTLY NORMAL exist?? :?
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Endymion
04-17-2012, 05:55 PM
If acting like a true Muslim is normal and people who want to move you according to their wish are abnormal then the whole society is abnormal.Just keep a pocket size editable version of Islam and everything is "normal".
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asiya45
04-17-2012, 05:59 PM
Thats a good idea ^ :)
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Insanely.Krazii
04-17-2012, 06:16 PM
The word "normal" holds different meanings depending on where it is being used. In the US it's "normal" to see a girl walking outside in shorts and a shirt. That sight is abnormal (and pretty close to impossible) lets say in Saudi Arabia. Now, in Saudi it's "normal" to see a fully veiled woman whereas it's abnormal in the US. And it could go on like the traditional Somalian clothes are abnormal to any other place than Somalia and also their culture... language... etc...

Does being perfectly normal exist? I don't know lol.
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cOsMiCiNtUiTiOn
04-17-2012, 06:34 PM
I've come to learn that "normal" is wrong. Usually whatever seems abnormal is what is Islamically correct. Of course, I live in the U.S. so I guess what im trying to say is that normal is what society makes it, so where you are in the world may change the definition of normal.

- cOsMiC
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~Zaria~
04-17-2012, 07:10 PM
Assalamu-alaikum,

Great topic ukthi!

I think theres two specific scenarios to discuss when we consider the term 'normal':

1. In medical terms:

We have defined 'normal' values for almost every bodily function -
Simply, by looking at the general population - we are saying ~95% of values fall within a certain range, and anything outside of this, is regarded as 'abnormal'.

As our knowledge expands, these limits expand or reduce - and so, very often - what was considered to be 'normal' a few decades ago, may be 'redefined'.
e.g what is 'normal' blood pressure, 'normal' blood gluose range, 'normal' cholesterol, etc etc.

With regards to the above - we should all be happy to within the 'normal' ranges : )


2. In general terms:

In every other aspect of life - 'normal' is generally what we 'Expect' to occur in a given situation.
The person who leaves home without any clothes, or the one who suddenly starts singing in the middle of a bayaan - is considered to be 'abnormal', because this is not what our conditioning allows us to expect.
We EXPECT to see people dressed - because this is what we have been taught and indoctrinated (from both a societal and religious point of view) to accept as normal behaviour.

To the man living on a remote island, whose culture does not require clothing - this is what is normal to him.


Between these two ranges of 'normal' and 'abnormal' - there are varying degrees of what we consider to be 'acceptable' or 'tolerable'.
This is influenced by our faith, family values, personality, etc.


We should realise:

Life is not meant to be lived by trying to fall within the 'norm'.
Because, the reality is that, what is considered as 'normal' today - has the finger-prints of shaytaan all over it.

He wants you to believe that the world as it is, is 'normal'......and it is YOU who is weird and following an unnecessarily restricted, abnormal way of life.
He will send his 'followers'/ 'helpers' in this dunya to tell you - 'what is wrong with you? why are you all covered up in the middle of summer?......Are you mad?'

In this case - you mostly do NOT want to fall within the 'normal range'.

Do not listen to the world, my brothers and sisters.
Listen to Allah and His messenger (sallahu alaihi wasalam).......you may not be considered 'normal', but do you care for the opinions of man, or the favour of your Creator?


:wa:
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TrueStranger
04-17-2012, 07:14 PM
I guess normality depends on how one perceive him/herself and the world around them. We could easily accept multiple versions of normality, as long as it doesn't contradict our values, beliefs, and point of view.
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ژاله
04-17-2012, 08:01 PM
I think of normal in stastical terms. So, its like average in my view.
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جوري
04-17-2012, 08:16 PM
Does normal or abnormal hold a moral value in your opinion?

for instance:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/anna-d...6pLid%3D152605

Now the title was initially catchy because she said ''I just wanted to be normal' which implies to me that her chosen life style isn't//
and in the same breath and I quote ''your opinion of my sexuality isn't required or desired''...
which leave me with the question of why advertise? is advertising in this case normal? how about advertising without the desire to elicit a response? because to me when you advertise you're selling something.. some sort of reaction is meant to be elicited in the process..

Does normalcy always have a moral value or just in certain cases?
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tango92
04-17-2012, 08:32 PM
normal is being human. anything a human being does/ can do is normal

however a miracle is not normal
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Muezzin
04-17-2012, 08:38 PM
Normally, people don't have time to philsophically define normality.
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~Zaria~
04-17-2012, 08:48 PM
^ Lol

The fact that we are even on this forum.....makes one wonder how any of us has so much time : )
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Scimitar
04-17-2012, 08:49 PM
Originally Posted by Muezzin
Normally, people don't have time to philsophically define normality.
^ which is why the dictionary definition was ok in my opinion. :D

Scimi
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~Zaria~
04-17-2012, 08:52 PM
I dont think this is normal - to be talking about what normal is.....to complete strangers.......over a screen.......: P
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جوري
04-17-2012, 09:16 PM
Originally Posted by ~Zaria~
I dont think this is normal - to be talking about what normal is.....to complete strangers.......over a screen.......: P
Oh so you know about my AB status? wink wink
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CosmicPathos
04-17-2012, 09:23 PM
nothing is normal. All our perceptions of normal and abnormal are dependent on how we grew up, what genes we inherited, what proteins we expressed, what neural connections our brain built depending on the household environment and society we grew in. Nothing is normal. But usually people, because they dont want to remain outcasts, define normal as what most ppl do, and try to fit in. Some dont, like myself. But even I find myself following the herd mentality and trying to "fit in" at many occassions, at least when in professional settings.

Making connections, smiling, talking to others etc is usually considered normal and "healthy." Doing opposite of that is considered "abnormal" and anti-social. But it just the perception of others, dependent on what genes they go, how their brain works.

But then Islam also "abnormalizes" certain things such as sins. I guess humans would commit collective massive suicides, kamikaze style, just out of depression from existential angst for existing purposelessly if there was no sense of normality, or no sense of purpose. So God has through whatever means (evolution/creation etc) created our brains such that we look at patterns, create "artificial" purposes for ourselves such as looking good, having kids, making lots of money, earning respect etc that most of us get lost in these things so much that we forget the seeming "puposelessness" of existence, which from Islamic perspective is to just worship God.

There is a reason why some of the most "intellectual" people have been abnormal, misanthropes, nihilists and every other thing that you can think of. They did not believe in God, they were able to shun artificial purpose of life that our brain makes for us such as getting married or what not, but the gap created was so huge in their lives that these ppl created a purpose for themselves, which was to become their own gods. And that is manifested in various forms, as I mentioned above, misanthropy, misogyny, misandry, nihilis, amoralism etc.
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جوري
04-17-2012, 09:26 PM
The more scientifically advanced and depth reached the more occult and bizarre.. The best scientists have always been occultists...
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CosmicPathos
04-17-2012, 09:36 PM
Originally Posted by لميس
The more scientifically advanced and depth reached the more occult and bizarre.. The best scientists have always been occultists...
the more "knowledegable" one becomes, him becoming his own god becomes very likely, and from that stem many many issues. I think I am one such individual in progress. Not bragging that I am knowledgeable, but I've seen the harmful effects on myself.

There is a reason why villagers and illiterate people are some of the most content people in general. I've met many in my travels, typical rickshaw drivers, horse riders, shopkeepers, farmers ... they had something which I never had. And that was genuine contentment with whatever was written in their lot.
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جوري
04-17-2012, 09:46 PM
Originally Posted by CosmicPathos
I've met many in my travels, typical rickshaw drivers, horse riders, shopkeepers, farmers ... they had something which I never had. And that was genuine contentment with whatever was written in their lot.
There's actually something to be learned from the story of Barsisa


People of knowledge are more steadfast that those who merely spend their day in worship.. Knowledge cements your will and gives understanding...
Also Allah swt created us in ranks and gave us the ability to compete for good..
Al-Mutaffifin (Those Who Deal in Fraud) [83:26] [RECITE]
[top] [next match]
Khitamuhu miskun wafee thalika falyatanafasi almutanafisoona
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CosmicPathos
04-17-2012, 09:55 PM
yup, religious education. not secular scientific education.
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جوري
04-17-2012, 10:06 PM
Originally Posted by CosmicPathos
yup, religious education. not secular scientific education.
In fact all education should lead to Allah.. Does the Quran not discuss mathematics, and the cosmos and embryology and inheritance and economics and medicine and even poetry though not in a good light at first... come on!
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GuestFellow
04-17-2012, 10:07 PM
Normal means to conform to a standard, but this changes as times go by. What is considered normal 50 years ago may be considered bizarre today.
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Salahudeen
04-17-2012, 10:15 PM
Originally Posted by Tragic Typos
Normal means to conform to a standard, but this changes as times go by. What is considered normal 50 years ago may be considered bizarre today.
And vice versa, what was considered bizarre 50 years ago may be normal today, i.e same gender relationships. Another question could be, what determines our outlook on what normal is? is it the law that we live under that determines what we consider normal and appropriate in society.
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CosmicPathos
04-17-2012, 10:18 PM
Originally Posted by لميس

In fact all education should lead to Allah.. Does the Quran not discuss mathematics, and the cosmos and embryology and inheritance and economics and medicine and even poetry though not in a good light at first... come on!
Only those can indulge in it who are capable of it in terms of health, mental capabilities. it is not for everyone, and it certainly is not a criteria to get into jannah. it is like any other worldly activity.

maybe its my personal experience of hopelessness from medicine. and western medicine only replaces one problem with another in most cases, except some acute conditions or some surgical procedures where we can 100% cure the patient with minimal problems.
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Abz2000
04-17-2012, 11:13 PM
according to a Kafir:
wot the government tells u is normal, doesn't matter how crooked and treacherous they are - or if they came in through ballot fraud or banker and media help.
and then when they tell u it's not normal the next day, u get repulsed at the idea of wot was normal yesterday.
or if they tell you something they consider a crime,sexual perversion and mental illness (like sodomy) is all of a sudden ok, you call everyone who opposes the act bigoted the next day.


according to a Muslim:
wot God tells u is normal - since He's the one who made it all and tells you how it works.

you go to the manufacturer and ask them how it works - not to the thief who stole it.
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جوري
04-17-2012, 11:36 PM
Originally Posted by CosmicPathos
Only those can indulge in it who are capable of it in terms of health, mental capabilities. it is not for everyone, and it certainly is not a criteria to get into jannah. it is like any other worldly activity.
It is precisely why I said Allah swt created us in ranks and gave the impetus to compete for what we desire. & I have posted a hadith or two before about addressing people to their level of expertise and intellect without being condescending. A Bedouin who knows not much but has a loving heart is told the way to paradise is to simply fulfill the five pillars. For someone else it is merely memorizing and teaching the Quran.. Ali RA was a brilliant mathematician and a philosopher.. obviously not everyone is on the same level and paradise stratified to reflect that.
You experience with western style medicine is probably better than many of us have had it.. and I'd be joyous at the opportunity to learn believe me when I tell you there are many qualified people who don't make the cut with every step of the way, even at the finish line..

:w:
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IslamicRevival
04-17-2012, 11:58 PM
Living the way the best of creation, our Nabi Peace be upon him lived and following his, Peace be upon him ways, is by definition `Normal`, living any other way should be considered abnormal.
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Abz2000
04-18-2012, 12:06 AM
i found out wot abnormal is, phew took me a while, maybe u can deduce wots normal by subtracting everything in it from your lives and trying to be normal eh?

according to numerous law enforcement advisories, training manuals, seminars and other literature,
the federal government defines political activism, flying American flags, wearing Levi jeans, being nice, looking “normal” and going scuba diving all as signs of domestic terror.

The following is a list of behaviors, actions or interests that the federal government, via centralized threat fusion centers that collate such information, considers to be potential signs of terrorism under the MIAC Report.


- Displaying bumper stickers and other paraphernalia associated with the Constitutional, Campaign for Liberty, and Libertarian parties
- Supporting Congressman Ron Paul
- Supporting former presidential candidate Chuck Baldwin
- Supporting former Congressman Bob Barr
- Opposing the implementation of a North American Union
- Owning gold bullion
- Displaying historical U.S. flags
- Opposing abortion
- Talking about the documentary Zeitgeist
According to an earlier document issued by the Joint Terrorism Task Force (page 1 – page 2), the following behaviors, actions or interests are also signs of terrorism.
- Being interested in animal rights
- Being a “lone individual”
- Making numerous references to the U.S. Constitution
- Defending the U.S. Constitution
- Claiming driving is a right, not a privilege
- Refusing to identify yourself to an authority figure
- Attempting to monitor the actions of police
- Being bald
Under the terms of a A Texas Department of Public Safety Criminal Law Enforcement pamphlet, the following behaviors, actions or interests are also signs of terrorism.
- Being a “nice guy”
- Wearing Levi jeans
- Communicating predominantly by cell phone, email or text message
- Looking “normal” in appearance
- Renting a car
- Staying in a hotel or apartment
- Renting a storage facility
- Using cash to make large purchases
- Using pre-paid cellphones or hand-held radios
- Owning large amounts of medicines, alcohol, or baby formula
- Gaining support for a cause by holding meetings, public rallies, or demonstrations
- Gaining support for a cause by using websites, posters, leaflets, or underground press publications
- Possessing a photo-copy of your drivers license, passport, social security card or birth certificate
- Possessing or purchasing GPS technology
- Walking, biking or driving near “potential targets”
- Taking photographs of “potential targets,” including bridges, power plants or government buildings
Under the terms of a Virginia training manual used to help state employees recognize terrorists, the following behaviors, actions or interests are also signs of terrorism.
- Being a property-rights activist
- Trying to influence government or social policy
- Undermining confidence in the government
- Using a sketch pad, camera, map, binoculars or scuba equipment


as long as u don't do any of the above, you can consider yourself normal and have nothing at all to worry about.
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TrueStranger
04-18-2012, 12:30 AM
Abnormal: Normal viewed from the wrong angle. ;D
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MustafaMc
04-18-2012, 12:16 PM
I agree that 'normal' mostly means average or typical of the majority of people. If you are in the Mississippi Delta, then it is normal to be an African-American, but if you are a scientist at the USDA experiment station it is normal to be a Caucasian-American with a PhD. If you lived in Mecca right after Prophet Muhammad's (sal Allahu alayhi wa salaam) initial revelation, it would have been normal to be a polytheistic idolator, but if you lived in Medina just before his death, it would be normal to be a Muslim praying 5 times a day.

Being normal is a good thing if the majority of the populace are living according to Islamic principals. It is best to be abnormal if the bulk of society you live in is immoral or holds falsehood as Truth.

I have always been abnormal in many ways. I am the only Muslim in my entire family and the only one with a PhD. I remember back in 5th grade we had an art project to make a butterfly. We were given the materials and an example to follow which everyone else did with various abilities. I had a completely different idea that did not turn out as pretty as the 'normal' ones, but at least I did it my way.
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peace_maker
04-18-2012, 12:39 PM
After going through all of that, I think "normal" doesn't exist at all. It's merely an illusion created by human beings. :hmm:
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جوري
04-18-2012, 03:49 PM
Originally Posted by peace_maker
After going through all of that, I think "normal" doesn't exist at all. It's merely an illusion created by human beings. :hmm:
Of course that's very true and the only conclusion really is that 'Normal' follows an undulating baseline by which everything is measured as a reference point. & it is all born of our imagination. Everything even math is born of our imagination. Some of those values become constants and some are ever changing.
It is disturbing however when the values seem to change to exclude just one group of people.

:w:
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GuestFellow
04-18-2012, 03:53 PM
Originally Posted by Salahudeen
And vice versa, what was considered bizarre 50 years ago may be normal today, i.e same gender relationships. Another question could be, what determines our outlook on what normal is? is it the law that we live under that determines what we consider normal and appropriate in society.
Salaam,

There are several factors that determine what is considered to be the norm of a particular society. These are changes in the law, technological advancements, medical advancements, environmental changes, sociological changes, changes within the entertainment industry (sports, fashion, music, movies, media) and so on.
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Fiona
04-19-2012, 01:43 AM
I think normal is being you without trying to pretend to be something else. Normal to me means going by the law, being sane, sensible and using common sense.
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asiya45
04-19-2012, 02:16 AM
Originally Posted by peace_maker
After going through all of that, I think "normal" doesn't exist at all. It's merely an illusion created by human beings. :hmm:
I agree with you!!!:statisfie
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ardianto
04-19-2012, 06:07 AM
Assalamualaikum.

Someone is normal or abnormal depend on the view of people who see this person.

When I was kid I was a boy who always got special attention from teachers and school psychologist because I was considered as "different". An example, I didn't have interest to school lesson, but I had big interest to other knowledge that not taught in elementary school. Then they encouraged my parent to bring me to a psychologist. That's not a pleasant experience for a boy.

In the first year in the first secondary school, teachers called my parent to come and asked them why I was different. That beacuse I did school assignment different than other students. The assignment was write story with theme "vacation in ....". Other students wrote vacation in beach, in mountain, etc. But I wrote a story I got holiday to planet Pluto. I made my own rocket to go there. I knew it's different, but I just wanted to write what was in my mind.

Then I really became brat boy and kicked out from the school. That's why I spent 4 years in secondary school from normally 3 years. But teachers in the second secondary school could appreciate what I wrote. They did not say I was abnormal, even they said, actually I was smart.

In the first week in high school I got writing assignment too, an essay. I chose theme "effect of colors for human". I wrote, green color can make human eyes fresh, but also can make human afraid. In example, green forest in the nature would makes our eyes become fresh if we see it. But green color in army base will makes us afraid to make trouble in that place. White color remind us to purity, but white color could scare us. If we see white shadow floated in the air over the graveyard in the middle of the night, we would be so scared.

And I got surprise! the teacher took my paper, then brought and read it in all class. There were 11 classes. Immediately, I became popular. :statisfie

Until I graduated from high school, there's no teacher who said I was abnormal. Even all students and teacher like my writing. They always laughed when I read my stories or essays. Some of them told me they were impressed because I could 'expand' the theme. Might be this was one factor that made a girl in the class so impressed and later gave me two kids.

Yes, someone is normal or abnormal, depend on the view of people who see him.

And, brothers, sisters. What do you think about me? Am I normal or abnormal?

:)
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جوري
04-19-2012, 01:17 PM
Originally Posted by ardianto
And, brothers, sisters. What do you think about me? Am I normal or abnormal?
Well you know what they say.. if you gotta ask ..:p
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MustafaMc
04-20-2012, 12:39 AM
I don't need to ask because I KNOW I am abnormal, but don't tell anybody because I think I have them all fooled into thinking I am normal.:shade:
Reply

Muezzin
04-21-2012, 07:09 PM
Originally Posted by ardianto
Assalamualaikum.

Someone is normal or abnormal depend on the view of people who see this person.

When I was kid I was a boy who always got special attention from teachers and school psychologist because I was considered as "different". An example, I didn't have interest to school lesson, but I had big interest to other knowledge that not taught in elementary school. Then they encouraged my parent to bring me to a psychologist. That's not a pleasant experience for a boy.

In the first year in the first secondary school, teachers called my parent to come and asked them why I was different. That beacuse I did school assignment different than other students. The assignment was write story with theme "vacation in ....". Other students wrote vacation in beach, in mountain, etc. But I wrote a story I got holiday to planet Pluto. I made my own rocket to go there. I knew it's different, but I just wanted to write what was in my mind.

Then I really became brat boy and kicked out from the school. That's why I spent 4 years in secondary school from normally 3 years. But teachers in the second secondary school could appreciate what I wrote. They did not say I was abnormal, even they said, actually I was smart.

In the first week in high school I got writing assignment too, an essay. I chose theme "effect of colors for human". I wrote, green color can make human eyes fresh, but also can make human afraid. In example, green forest in the nature would makes our eyes become fresh if we see it. But green color in army base will makes us afraid to make trouble in that place. White color remind us to purity, but white color could scare us. If we see white shadow floated in the air over the graveyard in the middle of the night, we would be so scared.

And I got surprise! the teacher took my paper, then brought and read it in all class. There were 11 classes. Immediately, I became popular. :statisfie

Until I graduated from high school, there's no teacher who said I was abnormal. Even all students and teacher like my writing. They always laughed when I read my stories or essays. Some of them told me they were impressed because I could 'expand' the theme. Might be this was one factor that made a girl in the class so impressed and later gave me two kids.

Yes, someone is normal or abnormal, depend on the view of people who see him.

And, brothers, sisters. What do you think about me? Am I normal or abnormal?

:)
You're freakin' awesome.
Reply

Futuwwa
04-22-2012, 09:31 AM
Normal: Within two standard deviations from the average
Abnormal: Farther than two standard deviations from the average

[/thread] :p
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ardianto
04-22-2012, 11:52 AM
"I bought this product in normal price"
"Traffic situation is still normal until now"
"Normal capacity of this ship is 200 passenger"
"Normal, if you want to get holiday after worked hard"

These are just few of many example where "normal" can be used in sentences.

So, what is "normal"?. "Normal" is a flexible word that can be interpreted in various meaning, depend on context.
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Periwinkle18
04-22-2012, 12:26 PM
i dun know nths normal rite now for me i've got a stupid headache :( n i can't sleep...
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crimsontide06
04-22-2012, 03:16 PM
There is no such thing as normal. Normal can have any definition depending on the society, country, or town you live in. Normal for one country may be alien to another. Everyone is unique in their own way. Be yourself instead of trying to be what society wants you to be.
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Abdul-Raouf
04-22-2012, 04:58 PM
...Normal is when your troubles increase and when your search for a peaceful environment increases...

If not.. you are abnormal or you can expect a surprising big disaster.
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Al-bint
04-23-2012, 07:29 AM
that which is not abnormal I guess ^o)


:p
Wasalaam
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tango92
04-23-2012, 08:15 AM
Originally Posted by Al-bint
that which is not abnormal I guess ^o)


:p
Wasalaam
or not not not abnormal
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Futuwwa
04-23-2012, 07:37 PM
Bleh for quadruple negation :heated:
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Al-Mufarridun
04-26-2012, 09:28 AM
:sl: all

In Essence, There is 1 Normality, 1 Haqiqah - It's the Fitrah

Every single atom in existence is in its Normal state, except those who operate out of 'free will' and thus deviated from their Normality(Fitrah).

To the ones who using their 'free will' realize and actualize their Fitrah - They are Normal, as long as they are aligned to their original fitrah.
Those on the other hand who by their own 'free will' neglect their fitrah and actualize their fitnah - they are Abnormal, as long as they continue to oppose the Universal Fitrah. From their perspective, there are as many shades of Normal as there are atoms in their collective selves.


Narrated Abu-Huraira: Allah's Apostle said,
"No child is born except on the fitra and then his parents make him Jewish, Christian or Magian (Zoroastrian)*,
as an animal produces a perfect young animal: do you see any part of its body amputated?" -
(Sahih al-Bukhari, Volume 2, Book 23, Number 441)

*Notice the Prophet(pbuh) didn't include 'his parents make him Muslim', for being Muslim is the Universal Normality.
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