US military course taught officers 'Islam is the enemy'

[Muslim Woman]

:sl:

Pentagon suspends course after study materials posted online suggested that Mecca and Medina may have to be obliterated



guardian.co.uk,



Friday 11 May 2012 08.28 BST

A course for US military officers has been teaching that America's enemy is Islam in general and suggesting that the country might ultimately have to obliterate the Islamic holy cities of Mecca and Medina without regard for civilian deaths, following second world war precedents of the nuclear attack on Hiroshima or the allied firebombing of Dresden.



The Pentagon suspended the course in late April when a student objected to the material. The FBI also changed some agent training last year after discovering that it, too, was critical of Islam.
The teaching in the military course was counter to repeated assertions by US officials over the past decade that the US is at war against Islamic extremists, not the religion itself.




"They hate everything you stand for and will never coexist with you, unless you submit," the instructor, Army Lt Col Matthew Dooley, said in a presentation last July for the course at Joint Forces Staff College in Norfolk, Virginia. The college, for professional military members, teaches mid-level officers and government civilians on subjects related to planning and executing war.



Dooley also presumed, for the purposes of his theoretical war plan, that the Geneva conventions that set standards of armed conflict, are "no longer relevant".
He adds: "This would leave open the option once again of taking war to a civilian population wherever necessary (the historical precedents of Dresden, Tokyo, Hiroshima, Nagasaki being applicable to the Mecca and Medina destruction decision point …)"




His war plan suggests possible outcomes such as "Saudi Arabia threatened with starvation ... Islam reduced to cult status".
A copy of the presentation was obtained and posted online by Wired.com's Danger Room blog. The college did not respond to The Associated Press' requests for copies of the documents, but a Pentagon spokesman authenticated the documents. Dooley still works for the college, but is no longer teaching, said Joint Chiefs Chairman, Gen Martin Dempsey. Dooley has refused to comment.



A summary of Dooley's military service record provided by Army Human Resources Command at Fort Knox, Kentucky, shows that he was commissioned as a second lieutenant upon graduation from the US military academy at West Point, New York, in May 1994. He has served overseas tours in Germany, Bosnia, Kuwait and Iraq. He has numerous awards including a Bronze Star Medal, the fourth-highest military award for bravery, heroism or meritorious service.




In what he termed a model for a campaign to force a transformation of Islam, Dooley called for "a direct ideological and philosophical confrontation with Islam", with the presumption that Islam is an ideology rather than just a religion.


He further asserted that Islam has already declared war on the west, and the US specifically.
"It is therefore illogical" to continue with the current US strategy, which Dooley said presumes there is a way of finding common ground with Islamic religious leaders, without "waging near total war", he wrote.
The course on Islam was an elective taught since 2004 and not part of the required core curriculum. It was offered five times a year, with about 20 students each time, meaning roughly 800 students have taken the course over the years.



Though Dooley has been teaching at the college since August 2010, it was unclear when he took on that particular class, called Perspectives on Islam and Islamic Radicalism.
The joint staff suspended the course after it had received a student complaint, and within days Dempsey ordered all service branches to review their training to ensure other courses do not use anti-Islamic material.



On Thursday, Dempsey said the material in the Norfolk course was counter to American "appreciation for religious freedom and cultural awareness".
"It was just totally objectionable, against our values, and it wasn't academically sound," Dempsey said when asked about the matter at a Pentagon news conference.



"This wasn't about ... pushing back on liberal thought; this was objectionable, academically irresponsible."
In his July 2011 presentation on "counterjihad", Dooley asserted that the rise of what he called a "military Islam/Islamist resurgence" compels the United States to consider extreme measures, "unconstrained by fears of political incorrectness".



He described his purpose as generating "dynamic discussion and thought", while noting that his ideas and proposals are not official US government policy and cannot be found in any current official defence department documents.



A Pentagon inquiry is seeking to determine whether someone above the professor's level is supposed to approve course materials and whether that approval process was followed in this case, said Col Dave Lapan, spokesman for Dempsey.



The problem of negative portrayals of Islam in federal government is not new. A six-month review the FBI launched into agent training material uncovered 876 offensive or inaccurate pages that had been used in 392 presentations, including a PowerPoint slide that said the bureau can sometimes bend or suspend the law in counterterror investigations.


That is significant because ever since the terrorist attacks of September 11, 2001, the FBI has stressed the importance of working with Muslim community leaders as an important part of the battle against terror. The FBI review began last September after Wired.com reported that the FBI had discontinued a lecture in which the instructor told agent trainees in Virginia that the more devout a Muslim is, the more likely he is to be violent
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2012...se-islam-enemy

[~ Sabr ~]

the country might ultimately have to obliterate the Islamic holy cities of Mecca and Medina without regard for civilian deaths,

Yeah, over 2.1 Billion Muslims' dead bodies!!! :raging:

[إحسان]

Why am I not surprised?

Was it not a sign of the ending years of this world when people will turn against Muslims? I say we're the targets and will be till the world ends. Just seeing how the media and western governments loathe our presence is obvious.

[M.I.A.]

well its obviously insane, sounds like the plan of a villain mastermind if anything.

anyway dont let it get under your skin, the last thing you want is to destroy the world.

so act accordingly.

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[Who Am I?]

Why am I not surprised?

Was it not a sign of the ending years of this world when people will turn against Muslims? I say we're the targets and will be till the world ends. Just seeing how the media and western governments loathe our presence is obvious.

:sl:

I think this is part of what Jesus talked about in the Bible. He said that the believers will be persecuted for their faith. Of course, modern Christians assume that he was referring to Christianity, but I see no reason why it doesn't apply to Muslims as well (since you know... Muslims are the true believers in God).

[Jedi_Mindset]

Well no suprise but the outcome is different, reading that US soldiers wearing diapers in Afghanistan made me laugh. (hope its true)
Anyway, they're known for their barbaric crimes against Muslims, they don't distinguish between a old man and a mujahid with a gun. We're ''sand******s'' or ''muzzies'' so yeah.... the world is against us but we're strong and Allah Subhana wa'a ta'ala is on our side, they can bomb us, they can imprison us but they can't kill the truth...never.

[User29123]

Here

http://news.bbc.co.uk/today/hi/today/newsid_9720000/9720257.stm

It is shocking, I hope those Saudis get up and say to America you can't have oil, they better start making bombs too now..

[dqsunday]

What really shocks me is it took 8 years for somebody to complain...or even notice the anti-islam rhetoric being taught to these agents. I am starting to think more Muslims shouuld deal with the extremists since the US government obviously is too blinded by bloodlust to really care if the masses they slaughter are innocent or not.

Then again, maybe it shouldn't shock me as much when it comes to inaccuracies in education since that seems to be a huge issue overall in the US. Children are just not getting a good education period, even in general subjects.

[TrueStranger]

They attacked Afghanistan and Iraq, killed hundreds of thousands of people and continue to kill people. We shouldn't be shocked by threats they are making when bombs are dropping on Muslims today.

[BadOlPuttyTat]

I just read of this earlier ironically the minute i woke up i saw this on a news blog. The comments all responded saying "well justified" or "killing every Muslim will rid this world of evil". People seriously dont know that atheist have killed more people then any "religious scourge ". A manw ith a tiny mustache comes to mind, Stalin, Ho Chee Min who was one of the worst, genghis khan, Rwandan, Dersim massacres, Vietnam, North Korea, Guatemala, US carpet bombing on Japan and Germany killing thousands non combatants, and Russia killing Afghans like cattle, . Fact still stands that secular genocides and murders are the greatest and if you say Islam is your enemy then that would be ignorant. America has made more bombings on countries on foreign soil and international death squad strikes by Spec Ops then any other country and the irony is we havent declared war on those attacks. America has been waging proxy battles on Islamic nations years before terrorism came to mind. The American opinion is "if you kill numerous amounts of civilians and innocent people then they wont be mad at you". Oh if only that was true. I have so many friends and their response is "i dont care what we do in foreign soil" sadly that thinking is very dangerous. In the GOP debates the first topic that came up was war, it was stated that America should quit the Afghan war and go on Cuba. Cuba "apparently" is "the greatest threat to the world", so let me repeat myself. "A NON-NUCLEAR nation that is 230 times SMALLER then America with an Army even smaller poses the greatest threat to America even though they have done nothing threatening and work with the US now". Oh politics are laughable and i feel ashamed to say I am an American so much ;D

[GuestFellow]

Salaam,

It is the sort of attitude expected from barbarians. When America is involved in a conflict, it is always good vs evil. A simplistic and pathetic analysis of conflicts.

[IslamicRevival]

Hardly suprising. This just confirms what most of us already knew. The whole 'War on terror' nonsense is just a fancy slogan to cover up the truth, their War in reality is really against Islam and always has been.

In our Nabi's, Peace be upon him time he, peace be upon him, his followers and companions, May Allah grant them Jannah were all persecuted. Their goal has always been to persecute the Muslims and defame Islam in whichever way they can but little do they know at the end of it, with Allah's blessing they will most definitely be the losers.

[Eric H]

Greetings and peace be with you Muslim Woman;

We are all created by the same God, and the same God hears all our prayers, when we harm someone, then we harm a part of God’s wonderful creation.

In the spirit of praying for justice for all people

Eric

[Pygoscelis]

I am starting to think more Muslims shouuld deal with the extremists since the US government obviously is too blinded by bloodlust to really care if the masses they slaughter are innocent or not.

The core of it is simple tribalism; Us vs Them thinking. We all have it in us to like those like us and band together against an external threat or opponent, "them". In this case, from the american public's point of view you had 9/11 which prompted americans to label muslims as the new "them". It used to be communists. The more right wing and tribal of them go on to beat the drums of war and indeed they don't care who is innocent and who is guilty, because "terrorist" just becomes a code word to them for brown people overseas. The same tribalism infects the less extreme as well, such as creeping into newscasting where you'll see reports on american dead but no reports on "enemy" dead (who are actually innocent victims most of the time but grouped as "them").

The same thing happens within all other societies to some extent, including yours and mine. It is basic to human nature. It is the the ugly flip side of empathy. We should always be on guard against it, in others and most importantly in ourselves.

[Pygoscelis]

When America is involved in a conflict, it is always good vs evil. A simplistic and pathetic analysis of conflicts.

Yes. This.

[Muslim Woman]

:sl:



the brutality of some / many US soldiers prove that how they are
' brainwashed ' - their hearts are full of hatred against Muslims . No wonder , this type of course syllabus is encouraging them to become more inhumane.

may be end time is near and we may watch the destruction of holy Kaaba during our lifetime ?

Signs of the Final Days

Destruction of Ka’aba

Muslim: Book 41, Number 6951:


Abu Huraira reported Allah's Messenger (may peace be upon him) as saying: The Ka'ba would be destroyed by an Abyssinian having two small shanks.‏


http://www.theonereligion.com/Signs%...nal%20Days.htm

[UnitedStates#1]

Can anyone give me one reason and one benefit that America would get if they for destroying Islam?
The war isn't fighting Muslims, get a grip this isn't genocide. **** me some of you people of deluded as hell

[Aprender]

The war isn't fighting Muslims, get a grip this isn't genocide. **** me some of you people of deluded as hell

You are the one who is deluded.

[Abz2000]

The war isn't fighting Muslims, get a grip this isn't genocide. **** me some of you people of deluded as hell

you really are an example of how the u.s government and it's trolls have a fear of a united Islam which will outshine their decadence.

they consistently CLAIM that they have no war against Islam,
while consistently PROVING that they do.

here's another example from a famous CIA piece, notice how they subtly use a fairytale in order to be able to claim innocence (unless you claim that the cia is in the business of writing fictional fairytales with taxpayers money (i mean - not the fairy tales they insert in the news and in the papers)).
also notice how they use the demonized "bin laden" / goldstein (who is innocent of their accusations) to create a generalization with Islam and it's core concepts such as Caliphate (Islamic government).
while inserting insidious suggestions for policies and approaches they can take - including sectarian violence and chaos:

here's a "lesson's" part of the nazi style brief

The appeal of a Caliphate among Muslims would vary from region to region, which argues for western countries adopting a differentiated approach to counter it.......................

http://www.foia.cia.gov/2020/2020.pdf

you may also find this to be interesting since it'll answer to some of your secret hates:

http://www.khilafah.com/index.php/th...-short-sighted

[joboman24]

Salaam,

It is the sort of attitude expected from barbarians. When America is involved in a conflict, it is always good vs evil. A simplistic and pathetic analysis of conflicts.

First off Islam is certainly not the enemy and any american,nato, or foreign military who is waging war in the middle east believing that should be ashamed of themselves. It is a war on radicalism and extremism and protecting the sovereignty of America and other countries that is all.

[joboman24]

Well no suprise but the outcome is different, reading that US soldiers wearing diapers in Afghanistan made me laugh. (hope its true)
Anyway, they're known for their barbaric crimes against Muslims, they don't distinguish between a old man and a mujahid with a gun. We're ''sand******s'' or ''muzzies'' so yeah.... the world is against us but we're strong and Allah Subhana wa'a ta'ala is on our side, they can bomb us, they can imprison us but they can't kill the truth...never.

jedi that is a gross and ignorant misinterpration of the American soldiers. Just like it is a gross and ignorant misinterpretaion to a decent amount of people in America that any muslim is a terrorist/radical. This is the type of ignorant and baseless logic the world doesn't need. I am as much a hindu or a muslim or a christian so I am not biased to anyone or anything but the fact is every group of people will have a certain minority who think that way including in the military but I promise you the majority of the military and the civilian population doesn't think this way. Look at how much freedom an average muslim has in America post 9/11. If you saw muslims being persecuted and being slaughtered then you have a point. But the fact of the matter is that muslims in America coexist with the white american population as well as any other religious sect would.

[Ar-RaYYan]

Hardly suprising. This just confirms what most of us already knew. The whole 'War on terror' nonsense is just a fancy slogan to cover up the truth, their War in reality is really against Islam and always has been.

Any muslim who believes in the War on terror needs to wake up. They have given us these labels of 'radical', 'extremist', 'moderate', 'liberal' etc to try create disunity between the muslim ummah, try to appease the muslim western puppets and justify these illegal wars but reality is they could care less whether you are an 'extremist' or 'moderate' muslim as long as you are a muslim you are the enemy.

[GuestFellow]

First off Islam is certainly not the enemy and any american,nato, or foreign military who is waging war in the middle east believing that should be ashamed of themselves. It is a war on radicalism and extremism and protecting the sovereignty of America and other countries that is all.

You cannot deny that there are people within America that believe it is acceptable to kill thousands of civilians in order to protect their own people and do view Islam as the enemy. The article does contain an element of truth that there are people that view Islam as the enemy. These people also tend to view conflicts as good vs evil. Some of these people can be referred to as neo-conservatives.

Yes, there are some Muslims that generalise and believe it is acceptable to kill thousands of civilians for their own motives. However, these wars are making things worse.

[M.I.A.]

i find it hard to believe there is any defense of america in this thread.

for once its not some persons opinion that can be brushed aside or refuted or argued to make yourselves feel better.

its an official document that has only been put out of practice because its been made public.


there is no justification for planned genocide.. yes that what it says.


seriously its like allowing the nazis because you were german.

seriously.


i suppose that its all just a fluke of circumstance that muslims feel persecuted,

the worst thing is there is no single government that can help muslims..or is in a position to help.

that is the state of islam.

i guess the angrier you get the more likely you are to play into there hands.


the comparison with the nazis is not that accurate, i would compare islam to the black community on america.

there are pictures of lynchings on the web for those not familiar with black history.

they almost got free before being ghetto'd.

its about how you fight for freedom and how you keep hold of your values.

[Aprender]

Look at how much freedom an average muslim has in America post 9/11. If you saw muslims being persecuted and being slaughtered then you have a point. But the fact of the matter is that muslims in America coexist with the white american population as well as any other religious sect would.

I appreciate the point that you are trying to put across here but this is not exactly true. Muslims in America don't really have as much freedom as you would like to think. Many American Muslims are profiled and watched by federal authorities simply because they are Muslim. Women who wear the hijab fear discrimination in employment and often times I have been met with awful words from some in the "white American population" simply because of my faith and the ignorance about it. And there are Muslims who are being wrongfully imprisoned in federal jails for speaking out against the hypocrisy. That is scary in a land where we all supposedly have "freedom of speech and religion".

I appreciate the understanding that you are trying to put across but I think you overstepped just a little bit as you don't really know what it's like to be a Muslim in America. No, we're not being slaughtered over here yet, but we are being persecuted in more ways than one and continuously marginalized in this society. Some American communities are better than others but it upsets me that if I ever get married and have children in this country I will have to teach my children that life will be a little bit more difficult for them than for other people because of this misguided political rhetoric against Islam. A majority of the civilian population probably does have incorrect views about Islam. I certainly did before I became a Muslim and much of it I learned in the public school system.

The sad part is that the voices of those who hate Islam and those who want to see most of American Muslims dead or locked away in some type of a concentration camp are a lot louder than the voices in America who want to preach coexistence and tolerance of other people. We are definitely marginalized. It's a cycle that repeats.

[Jedi_Mindset]

jedi that is a gross and ignorant misinterpration of the American soldiers. Just like it is a gross and ignorant misinterpretaion to a decent amount of people in America that any muslim is a terrorist/radical. This is the type of ignorant and baseless logic the world doesn't need. I am as much a hindu or a muslim or a christian so I am not biased to anyone or anything but the fact is every group of people will have a certain minority who think that way including in the military but I promise you the majority of the military and the civilian population doesn't think this way. Look at how much freedom an average muslim has in America post 9/11. If you saw muslims being persecuted and being slaughtered then you have a point. But the fact of the matter is that muslims in America coexist with the white american population as well as any other religious sect would.

Kinda nonsense about what you are saying, you don't see it because you aren't muslim or don't have a grasp on whats going on in this world. Muslims face massive discimination, get put in jails without evidence, get killed, watched by the feds and many other things by the ''white American folk''. And what about the 1,6 million iraqis killed? And almost a million of palestinians and afghans? Its clear: They have launched a war on islam, by creating false flag attacks from minor to major ones and they're still busy with it. They also created false flag attacks to try or launch other wars search: Operation northwoods, ''the tonkin incident''.

Don't put up a excuse that in war innocents will die, 1,6 million in iraq is more than just some killed innocents. Its pure genocide. Some american soldiers might be nice and friendly but the fact is that they all are fighting a war on us, and that they are invading other countries to spread their system. Everyone who does stand against their system is a terrorist and must be punished, thats their mentality. Everyone who doesn't accept western culture is a weirdo. And thats MASSIVE discrimination.

''You don't eat like we eat, you're weird''

[Pygoscelis]

It is discrimination and muslims in the west are marginalized and persecuted. There is no doubt about that. It is primarily the neo-conservatives and christian right acting on tribalism and banding together as "Us" to turn on "Them". Liberals therefore tend to defend the muslims, which sets up a very ironic and strange dynamic. There are liberal muslims (I was surprised to discover a muslim stripper) but in general muslims are conservatives and more in common with the far right conservative christians that hate them than the liberals who defend them.

[M.I.A.]

muslim stripper lol thats hilarious.

somebody should buy her out immediately.

im kidding but only just.

the things people have to do to stay alive.

instantly thought of "the wrestler" ...well whatever.

it is true though that the worst of things we say about the jews and christians are mirrored by the other side.
someday everybody will become the bigger man.

well actually im not sure it will ever happen but you can always try.

[Muhaba]

that man is a terrorist and is teaching terrorism in an american military college.

[Pygoscelis]

muslim stripper lol thats hilarious.

Yup, and believe it or not she told me she has 2 friends, who are also strippers and also muslim. So apparently there a few of them running around out there.

[MustafaMc]

more Muslims shouuld deal with the extremists

Which extremists are you talking about?

[Abz2000]

Yup, and believe it or not she told me she has 2 friends, who are also strippers and also muslim. So apparently there a few of them running around out there.

pygo, i appreciate the fact that she told u she was Muslim, but without veering too much off topic i'd like to clarify a misconception,
a Muslim is one who Submits To God, that is the meaning of the word Muslim,
and i'm sure you know that stripping is Forbidden in Islam and is no small transgression.
So as long as she knowingly strips, and makes no attempt to submit to God, she is NOT a Muslim,
she is either a Munafiq or a Kafir. stripping is not an addiction which one has to fight.

back to topic, it has become clear to me that they have ambiguously declared a war on Islam, and are only using rhetoric to keep the masses asleep until they have weakened or done away with the strongest opposition to their schemes.
they don't want the whole Muslim nation waking up in one go, and they also don't want the rest of the world to know that they fear Islam and are the aggressors themselves, which would certainly have people researching and coming to the conclusion that they are wrong and Islam is right.

but regardless of their evil plots, Allah will fulfill His light, however much they may hate it.

[MustafaMc]

In this case, from the american public's point of view you had 9/11 which prompted americans to label muslims as the new "them".

It all goes back to 9/11, doesn't it? What proof is there that Muslims caused 3,000 American deaths with the explosive collapse of 3 NYC skyscrappers? How did they get a super high technology explosive, nanothermite, and its signature residue, iron-rich microspherules, to show up in the WTC dust in enough quantity to suggest tons of nanothermite were used to bring the Twin Towers down? How did they implosively bring down WTC7, a 47-story building not hit by a plane?

[Abz2000]

they live in a "brave new world" brother, they'll pretend to be passionate about an issue just to argue a point, but will totally ignore the clear proof that none in government can or will explain, they'll just use terms like "conspiracy theorist" despite the overwhelming evidence they refuse to refute (because they can't), yet themselves peddle ridiculous conspiracy theories when a random cia/mossad style bombing occurs in syria or iran.

[Abz2000]

Which extremists are you talking about?

the poster was possibly referring to those few who are EXTREMELY angry at being treated like trash,
or maybe the EXTREMELY GOOD few people who stand for the truth despite the blame of the blamers.

coz to the u.s government, it seems a "moderate" "mozlem" is one who walks around half naked, is possibly a sodomite or a transvestite, doesn't believe in the Rule of God, mourns the death of illegally invading armies of Muslim lands, or at least doesn't have a problem with their lands being illegally invaded and their women dishonoured,

[UnitedStates#1]

1,6 million iraqis killed?

Let's not exaggerate, the figures are more like 100,000+. If that's extermination then it looks like we are doing a very hasty job! :omg:

Everyone who doesn't accept western culture is a weirdo.

Yeah what about the idiots in USA who want to impose your Muslim Shariah laws in my country? What about Europe and Australia? I guess it hurts when your people are guilty of the same thing. Heard of that Choudrey idiot?

jedi that is a gross and ignorant misinterpration of the American soldiers. Just like it is a gross and ignorant misinterpretaion to a decent amount of people in America that any muslim is a terrorist/radical. This is the type of ignorant and baseless logic the world doesn't need. I am as much a hindu or a muslim or a christian so I am not biased to anyone or anything but the fact is every group of people will have a certain minority who think that way including in the military but I promise you the majority of the military and the civilian population doesn't think this way. Look at how much freedom an average muslim has in America post 9/11. If you saw muslims being persecuted and being slaughtered then you have a point. But the fact of the matter is that muslims in America coexist with the white american population as well as any other religious sect would.

Pretty much this. The average Muslim in USA won't have their hands cut off, the choice to choose their own destiny and be integrated into a society where everyone understands each other.

Oh and I am surprised with the amount of people here claiming 9/11 to be fake. You are no different to the Neo Nazis claiming the mass murders in WW2 to be fake.
But if it helps taking your frustration on the USA then well I understand.

[MustafaMc]

Oh and I am surprised with the amount of people here claiming 9/11 to be fake.

Who said it was fake? I only ask you to explain how Muslims caused 1) the presence of nanothermite and iron microspherules in WTC dust, 2) implosive collapse at free-fall acceleration of WTC7.

[Jedi_Mindset]

Let's not exaggerate, the figures are more like 100,000+. If that's extermination then it looks like we are doing a very hasty job! :omg:



Yeah what about the idiots in USA who want to impose your Muslim Shariah laws in my country? What about Europe and Australia? I guess it hurts when your people are guilty of the same thing. Heard of that Choudrey idiot?




Pretty much this. The average Muslim in USA won't have their hands cut off, the choice to choose their own destiny and be integrated into a society where everyone understands each other.

Oh and I am surprised with the amount of people here claiming 9/11 to be fake. You are no different to the Neo Nazis claiming the mass murders in WW2 to be fake.
But if it helps taking your frustration on the USA then well I understand.

No, 1,6 million(now even more + the 500,000 killed in the first gulf war, mostly children) read it up. And even it were 100,000 then its still too many and still genocide, but its much more. And USA is still not your country, it is illegaly occupied by you Europeans a few centuries ago. Yes, but don't claim your government is full of ''muslims'' like many American people do, because your government create laws against muslims and islam. Muslims want shariah law yes, and its about time, we don't want your ''democracy'' and tyranny. We want REAL justice. Unlike your country when people only get put in prisons, living with the bad guys and they don't change, that isn't justice. There isn't shariah law in your puppet muslim countries of today, Afghans wanted to impose shariah law and they got bombed by you americans and allies.

Real justice is when someone commits a crime, he won't do it anymore afterwards.

[aamirsaab]

I'm glad that they've suspended the programme.

[UnitedStates#1]

No, 1,6 million(now even more + the 500,000 killed in the first gulf war, mostly children) read it up

You mentioned the figures, I'm interested in where you got them.

And even it were 100,000 then its still too many and still genocide, but its much more.

What our boys are doing does not fit the criteria of genocide. :)

And USA is still not your country

It belongs to law abiding citizens.

Muslims want shariah law yes, and its about time, we don't want your ''democracy'' and tyranny. We want REAL justice.

Hey, you Muslims want to implement the Shariah all over the world.

Unlike your country when people only get put in prisons, living with the bad guys and they don't change, that isn't justice.

Well we may as well abolish the justice system. ;D

Real justice is when someone commits a crime, he won't do it anymore afterwards.

Yeah it's called a life time sentence.

[Eric H]

Greetings and peace be with you UnitedStates#1; I have to say your responses trouble me

Let's not exaggerate, the figures are more like 100,000+. If that's extermination then it looks like we are doing a very hasty job! :omg:

Even if there are only a hundred thousand deaths, you seem to dismiss them as being meaningless. we are all created by the same God, and you are talking about killing a part of God's creation.

Oh and I am surprised with the amount of people here claiming 9/11 to be fake. You are no different to the Neo Nazis claiming the mass murders in WW2 to be fake.

Although you don't call the death of the Iraqi people as being fake, you seem to justify these deaths because the USA is always right, and that seems arrogant.

But if it helps taking your frustration on the USA then well I understand

The frustration is not against the USA, it is against injustice

In the spirit of praying for justice for all people

Eric

[Muhammad]

:sl:

pygo, i appreciate the fact that she told u she was Muslim, but without veering too much off topic i'd like to clarify a misconception,
a Muslim is one who Submits To God, that is the meaning of the word Muslim,
and i'm sure you know that stripping is Forbidden in Islam and is no small transgression.
So as long as she knowingly strips, and makes no attempt to submit to God, she is NOT a Muslim,
she is either a Munafiq or a Kafir. stripping is not an addiction which one has to fight.

We must be careful about declaring people to be kaafir in this way. without knowing any details about a person. Of course we denounce the action but we cannot immediately pass a judgement on the person concerned, especially as lay people and when we hardly know the situation. May Allaah (swt) forgive us for any wrong we may utter and guide this person and those like her to abandon their sins, Aameen.

[Muhammad]

Greetings,

Pretty much this. The average Muslim in USA won't have their hands cut off, the choice to choose their own destiny and be integrated into a society where everyone understands each other.

Contrary to what seems to be popular belief and purported by western media, Shariah Law is not about indiscriminately chopping people's hands off or executing them. Its penal system is based upon defined criteria and principles. It might also surprise some people to know that it governs other aspects of society, including the establishment of a proper welfare system and a finance system that is not based upon interest and debt. There is also protection for all citizens regardless of their belief and people are actually trialled with justice, not sent to highest security prisons based upon suspicion.

[UnitedStates#1]

the establishment of a proper welfare system and a finance system that is not based upon interest and debt.

Might be off topic but I am interested to know about the welfare and finance system Islam promotes, just curious here.

[MustafaMc]

USA#1, the primary reason that Islam is 'Public Enemy #1' in the USA is essentially derived from the events of 9/11. Why do you not answer my questions that call into question the very essence of this premise?

[Jedi_Mindset]

I'm glad that they've suspended the programme.

No they haven't, ofcourse not, don't believe what the media says, this course is still going on today.
The hate against us is increasing, and be prepared fro more false flags which they blame on us muslims. A false flag with such magnitude that the whole west will scream for war( false flags in which thousands will die like chemical or nuclear attacks or attacks widepsread over europe and USa and ''al-qaida'' will be blamed)

[Abz2000]

Might be off topic but I am interested to know about the welfare and finance system Islam promotes, just curious here.

Night Patrols of Caliph 'Umar ibn Al Khattab

During one of his regular night patrols Umar Bin khattab passed by a house and heard a child crying for a long time. So he went to the mother and told her

Umar Bin Khattab: Fear Allah and take care of your child

and then he leaves. Then the child is carrying on crying and crying and crying. Towards the end of the night he goes to her and says

Umar Bin Khattab: What kind of mother are you. You are an evil mother. Your child has been crying since the beginning of the night.

Mother: I am trying to wean him but he doesn’t want to eat the food.
(This child still wants to breastfeed and his mother is trying to convince him to eat, rather than breastfeed).

Umar Bin Khattab: Why are you trying to wean him? How old is he?

Mother: a few months

Umar bin Khattab: Why are you trying to wean him then
(because the complete period of breastfeed is two years).

Mother: Because Umar bin Khattab doesn’t start paying them until they are weaned.”
(she doesn’t know that its Umar Bin Khattab (The Caliph) who himself is speaking to her)

Umar bin khattab: woe to you Oh son of Khattab, what have you done?

He was so taken back by what happened that during Fajr Prayer people could not recognize his Recitation because of his crying.
After Fajr prayer he immediately issues a Government order to all the mothers around the Muslim world saying
“Do not wean your children too early because from now on you will receive a handout from the day your child is born”.


“How many Children have I killed?”. He said to himself “How many children have been killed because of you”. What is Umar bin Khattab saying? Who did he kill? Which children did he kill? This is a favor that he is doing to the people; he is giving them these handouts. He considers that he has harmed the Muslim infants because their mothers are trying to wean them sooner to get the handouts.

Can you think about such a Government? No citizen pays any taxes and you still receive handouts from the Government. Now Governments are ripping their people off. Taking 30% or more in taxes and they give you nothing. Supposedly they take this money to offer you services. Where does all of that money go?

In the Islamic Khalifah there was no such thing called “Taxes”. No taxes at all. They didn’t know the concept of taxes. This concept of Taxes existed among the Roman and the Persian rulers who used to tax the people of all the lands which they controlled, the people of the lands they conquered and the citizens of rome and persia. but in the Islamic Caliphate there were no taxes. All what would be taken from you is Zakat if you are capable of giving it and Customs for foreign businessman. Instead the Government gives you money. The moment your child is born you will start receiving those handouts.

[onetwo]

What a massive over reaction, we don't even know the context these quotes were in. It sounds like these were totally hypothetical situations since they start off with "If the Geneva conventions didn't apply", but hey anything in the media negative about the west = totally true whereas anything negative about islam = totally false.

[GuestFellow]

It all goes back to 9/11, doesn't it? What proof is there that Muslims caused 3,000 American deaths with the explosive collapse of 3 NYC skyscrappers? How did they get a super high technology explosive, nanothermite, and its signature residue, iron-rich microspherules, to show up in the WTC dust in enough quantity to suggest tons of nanothermite were used to bring the Twin Towers down? How did they implosively bring down WTC7, a 47-story building not hit by a plane?

Salaam,

I wonder what will happen if it it proven that Muslims were not behind the attacks...

Might be off topic but I am interested to know about the welfare and finance system Islam promotes, just curious here.

You can create another topic about other aspects of the Sharia.

[Muhammad]

Greetings,

Might be off topic but I am interested to know about the welfare and finance system Islam promotes, just curious here.

Thanks for your question. Islam promotes social welfare and fair distribution of wealth. One of the key ways that this occurs is through Zakah, which is one of the five pillars of Islam. For most purposes this involves the payment each year of 2.5% of one's capital, provided that this capital reaches a certain minimum amount that which is not consumed by its owner. A generous person can pay more than this amount, though it is treated and rewarded as voluntary charity (Sadaqah). This amount of money is provided to bridge the gap between the rich and the poor, and can be used in many useful projects for the welfare of the community.

In addition to this, there is a great emphasis in Islam on caring for those in need in the community, such as kindness to orphans, freeing slaves, attending to the needs of widows, being hospitable to the wayfarers, visiting the sick, good treatment of neighbours, relatives, spouses and parents. Many verses in the Qur'an teach these morals:

What will explain to you what the steep path is? It is to free a slave, to feed at a time of hunger, an orphaned relative or a poor person in distress, and to be one of those who believe and urge one another to steadfastness and compassion. [Qur'an 90:12-20]

Have you seen him who denies the Recompense? That is he who repulses the orphan (harshly), And urges not the feeding of AlMiskin (the poor)... [Qur'an 107:1-3]

And give to the kindred his due and to the Miskin (poor) and to the wayfarer. But spend not wastefully (your wealth) in the manner of a spendthrift .Verily, spendthrifts are brothers of the Shayatin (devils), and the Shaitan (Devil - Satan) is ever ungrateful to his Lord. [Qur'an 17:26-27]

Worship Allah and join none with Him in worship, and do good to parents, kinsfolk, orphans, Al-Masakin (the poor), the neighbour who is near of kin, the neighbour who is a stranger, the companion by your side, the wayfarer (you meet), and those (slaves) whom your right hands possess. Verily, Allah does not like such as are proud and boastful; Those who are miserly and enjoin miserliness on other men and hide what Allah has bestowed upon them of His Bounties. And We have prepared for the disbelievers a disgraceful torment. [Qur'an 17:36-37]


The distribution of wealth and resources constitutes the macro-economy of the Islamic economic model; the Qur’an repeatedly mentions distribution of resources and charity:

And those in whose wealth there is a known right, For the beggar who asks, and for the unlucky who has lost his property and wealth, (and his means of living has been straitened); [Qur'an 70:24-25]

And they give food, inspite of their love for it (or for the love of Him), to Miskin (poor), the orphan, and the captive, (Saying): "We feed you seeking Allah's Countenance only. We wish for no reward, nor thanks from you. [Qur'an 76:8-9]

The famous letter from a Rabbi found in Phillip Mansel’s book ‘Constantinople’, reflects the Qur’anic reality of distributing resources, "Here in the land of the Turks we have nothing to complain of. We possess great fortunes; much gold and silver are in our hands. We are not oppressed with heavy taxes and our commerce is free and unhindered. Rich are the fruits of the earth. Everything is cheap and every one of us lives in peace and freedom..."
Philip Mansel. 1995. Constantinople: City of the World's desire, 1453-1924. Penguin Books, p. 15

Justice, kindness, tolerance and the distribution of resources are just some of the cohesive values that are propagated in the Islamic social model. It can be concluded that under this model people lived under a cohesive society full of justice and kindness, the type of society that is needed today.


Regarding the finance system, here is an article which may shed some light on that: http://www.islam21c.com/finance/212-...ic-perspective


And Allaah (swt) knows best in all matters.

[Muslim Woman]

Salaam/ Peace

anything in the media negative about the west = totally true whereas anything negative about islam = totally false.

media is normally anti Islam & Muslim . When Islam is to blame for any alleged suspect , no specific religion or holy book is responsible for the proven criminal.

I have yet to see condemn of Bible or Jesus pbuh in media for what Hitler did . No media says Geeta is responsible for the destroying of century old Babri mosque or killing of pregnant Muslim women , cut of their stomacsh and throw the unborn babies in fire in Gujrat , India.

anyway , is there any protest from US that the news is false ?

[nasima]

This type of news is given on the media to inform the people, to terrorize the Muslims and to spread mischief against Islam!! At the same time the terrorists clear themselves by saying that they stopped that course. In fact if they were true in their saying then they would have shut the mouth of terrorist Dooly and wouldn’t bring the statement on the media. So they are all terrorists and are one and the same with Dooly!! Surely the media is in the hands of the infidels and they frequently spread false news about Islam, but truly, sun cannot be covered by one’s hands and the truth is clear to the world!

What is the truth?

In the present era the Islamic faith and practices are extremely limited. The real power is in the hands of the western infidels! Surely Allah has given them power to test them and to establish proof against them for the Day of Judgment as Allah is the Greatest of Judges. The infidel power holders have already confirmed their cruelty and wickedness and have filled up the land of Allah with bloodshed. There is no Muslim power to stop the killer infidels from massacres of innocent children, men, and women. Allah prohibited the killing of innocent people and Allah said that the killing of one person is like the killing of whole world and the saving of one person is like the saving of whole world! If there was a true Muslim Power then she would have surely struggled to save the innocents from the infidels! The infidel power-holders know this fact very well but they are very unfortunate because their hate and enmity for Islam is not ending, their hate and jealousy for Islam has no limits. So by such news they are threatening the Muslims that they intend to attack the very central worshipping places that is the Holy Kaaba Sharifa in Mecca and the Masjid An-Nabawi (Prophet’s Masjid) in Medina, Saudi Arabia. While threatening the Muslims about the use of atomic bomb on Makka and Madina, the terrorist blood shedders forget about their own fate! Look back at the history, do you see any pharaoh alive? One death comes to the innocent and also one death comes to the cruel killer and all will die at their ordained time!!

The infidels should know that a prophesy of the Final Prophet Muhammad صلى الله عليه و سلم told us that an army will proceed to attach the Kaaba Sharifa in Mecca and the army will be sunk alive in the earth!!

So you must know that Islam is a true religion of Allah for guidance of mankind and these great places are blessed by Allah and any attack on them is like fight against Allah, so the attackers will get a response from Allah in the form of a horrible Wrath.

Also we inform you o mankind , that Allah has given you and us time and freedom of action to test us but the freedom and time is not absolute. Allah has always given time to the nations and pharaohs but whenever the mischief of the infidels crossed bounds, Allah caught them. You can see the end of Pharoah who had been advised by Prophet Musa (Moses) عليهم السلام , and the nation of Prophet Nuh عليهم السلام (Noah) which was drowned in a tremendous flood.

If you don’t believe then see the history. Just about two months before the birth of the Final Prophet Muhammad صلى الله عليه و سلم a Christian king Abraha, due to his jealousy for Islam, had attacked the Kaaba Sharifa with a huge army with elephants. He observed clearly that his elephants refused to attack the Kaaba Sharifa and turned back. This was an indication that animals know their Creator and Lord and are thankful and obedient to their Lord. They respect the House of Allah but the infidel man has fallen down so low that he is now worse than animal. So was Abraha, the Christian King. So then Allah the All-Mighty sent on Abraha’s army small birds with stones in their claws and beaks. The stones were such that when a stone hit the enemy, it used to enter his skin and deep tissues and the tissues and organs would start melting and falling down on the earth. So the whole army along with the jealous cruel Christian king Abraha became like eaten hay.

So take heed o mankind and stop challenging God. The Truth is that God is one, Single, and Unique. There is none like Unto Him. God Allah is the Creator of the Heavens and the Earth and whatever is in and between them.

God Allah is the Absolute Owner of Power. He is the Sustainer and Provider and is extremely kind but is very Just. He is the Judge of Judges. And Allah is very quick in Retribution. Allah has no relative, no partner, no associate. He has not begetted and is not begotten. Allah likes justice and peace and does not like Corruption and mischief in the land.

The infidel authorities should know that Allah has given them power temporarily and will insha-Allah (God-willing) make them powerless in no time!

The Final Prophet Muhammad صلى الله عليه و سلم has told us about some signs that will appear one after the other, which will be:

1. Sinking in the earth
2. Changing of faces to those of apes and monkeys.
3. Stony wrath (wrath of stones) which will break the skulls of homosexuals and gays.
4. And many other signs will appear one after the other and no one will be able to control them.

So remain witnesses that we informed you about:

1. Islam is a true and the only true religion of Allah for all mankind to follow – stop messing with it.
2. The Wrath of Allah is ordained to come upon the mischievous transgressors.
3. After the transgressors are killed by wrath, it will not be the end – rather they will be transferred from here to the Hereafter for ever-lasting punishment in Hell.

So take heed o mankind, be sincere to yourselves and save yourself from the anger of All-Mighty Allah here and in the Hereafter.

This type of news is given on the media to inform the people, to terrorize the Muslims and to spread mischief against Islam!! At the same time the terrorists clear themselves by saying that they stopped that course. In fact if they were true in their saying then they would have shut the mouth of terrorist Dooly and wouldn’t bring the statement on the media. So they are all terrorists and are one and the same with Dooly!! Surely the media is in the hands of the infidels and they frequently spread false news about Islam, but truly, sun cannot be covered by one’s hands and the truth is clear to the world!

What is the truth?

In the present era the Islamic faith and practices are extremely limited. The real power is in the hands of the western infidels! Surely Allah has given them power to test them and to establish proof against them for the Day of Judgment as Allah is the Greatest of Judges. The infidel power holders have already confirmed their cruelty and wickedness and have filled up the land of Allah with bloodshed. There is no Muslim power to stop the killer infidels from massacres of innocent children, men, and women. Allah prohibited the killing of innocent people and Allah said that the killing of one person is like the killing of whole world and the saving of one person is like the saving of whole world! If there was a true Muslim Power then she would have surely struggled to save the innocents from the infidels! The infidel power-holders know this fact very well but they are very unfortunate because their hate and enmity for Islam is not ending, their hate and jealousy for Islam has no limits. So by such news they are threatening the Muslims that they intend to attack the very central worshipping places that is the Holy Kaaba Sharifa in Mecca and the Masjid An-Nabawi (Prophet’s Masjid) in Medina, Saudi Arabia. While threatening the Muslims about the use of atomic bomb on Makka and Madina, the terrorist blood shedders forget about their own fate! Look back at the history, do you see any pharaoh alive? One death comes to the innocent and also one death comes to the cruel killer and all will die at their ordained time!!

The infidels should know that a prophesy of the Final Prophet Muhammad صلى الله عليه و سلم told us that an army will proceed to attach the Kaaba Sharifa in Mecca and the army will be sunk alive in the earth!!

So you must know that Islam is a true religion of Allah for guidance of mankind and these great places are blessed by Allah and any attack on them is like fight against Allah, so the attackers will get a response from Allah in the form of a horrible Wrath.

Also we inform you o mankind , that Allah has given you and us time and freedom of action to test us but the freedom and time is not absolute. Allah has always given time to the nations and pharaohs but whenever the mischief of the infidels crossed bounds, Allah caught them. You can see the end of Pharoah who had been advised by Prophet Musa (Moses) عليهم السلام , and the nation of Prophet Nuh عليهم السلام (Noah) which was drowned in a tremendous flood.

If you don’t believe then see the history. Just about two months before the birth of the Final Prophet Muhammad صلى الله عليه و سلم a Christian king Abraha, due to his jealousy for Islam, had attacked the Kaaba Sharifa with a huge army with elephants. He observed clearly that his elephants refused to attack the Kaaba Sharifa and turned back. This was an indication that animals know their Creator and Lord and are thankful and obedient to their Lord. They respect the House of Allah but the infidel man has fallen down so low that he is now worse than animal. So was Abraha, the Christian King. So then Allah the All-Mighty sent on Abraha’s army small birds with stones in their claws and beaks. The stones were such that when a stone hit the enemy, it used to enter his skin and deep tissues and the tissues and organs would start melting and falling down on the earth. So the whole army along with the jealous cruel Christian king Abraha became like eaten hay.

So take heed o mankind and stop challenging God. The Truth is that God is one, Single, and Unique. There is none like Unto Him. God Allah is the Creator of the Heavens and the Earth and whatever is in and between them.

God Allah is the Absolute Owner of Power. He is the Sustainer and Provider and is extremely kind but is very Just. He is the Judge of Judges. And Allah is very quick in Retribution. Allah has no relative, no partner, no associate. He has not begetted and is not begotten. Allah likes justice and peace and does not like Corruption and mischief in the land.

The infidel authorities should know that Allah has given them power temporarily and will insha-Allah (God-willing) make them powerless in no time!

The Final Prophet Muhammad صلى الله عليه و سلم has told us about some signs that will appear one after the other, which will be:

1. Sinking in the earth
2. Changing of faces to those of apes and monkeys.
3. Stony wrath (wrath of stones) which will break the skulls of homosexuals and gays.
4. And many other signs will appear one after the other and no one will be able to control them.

So remain witnesses that we informed you about:

1. Islam is a true and the only true religion of Allah for all mankind to follow – stop messing with it.
2. The Wrath of Allah is ordained to come upon the mischievous transgressors.
3. After the transgressors are killed by wrath, it will not be the end – rather they will be transferred from here to the Hereafter for ever-lasting punishment in Hell.

So take heed o mankind, be sincere to yourselves and save yourself from the anger of All-Mighty Allah here and in the Hereafter.