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TruthLogic
06-28-2012, 12:40 AM
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GM Foods - tampering with Allah (swt) perfection

Quran 4:119

وَلأُضِلَّنَّهُمْ وَلأُمَنِّيَنَّهُمْ وَلآمُرَنَّهُمْ فَلَيُبَتِّكُنَّ آذَانَ الأَنْعَامِ وَلآمُرَنَّهُمْ فَلَيُغَيِّرُنَّ خَلْقَ اللّهِ وَمَن يَتَّخِذِ الشَّيْطَانَ وَلِيًّا مِّن دُونِ اللّهِ فَقَدْ خَسِرَ خُسْرَانًا مُّبِينًا

"and I will lead them astray, and I will tempt them with false hopes, and I will command them, whereby they shall slit the ears of cattle, and I will command them, whereby they shall alter the creation of Allah.. Whoever takes the Satan for friend, instead of Allah, incurs an obvious loss."


Again we Muslims have a clear warning , it is obvious we can NOT improve on the perfect creations that surround us .*

It may sound like a horror movie , *DNA from animals into Plants which are Fed too us ,
Transgenic Fish which can wipe out , make instinct the natural spices ,
Plants that commit suicide , terminator genes ,


Astaffural , *all is TRUE and has been going on for nearly a decade ,

All has been conducted with out any laws or regulations *set in place , and controlled by a select few multinational companies .( namely monstanto )


Genetically modified food has been fed too us for 8 years .
Below is a excellent documentary , giving views from top academics and scientists.*


4 min report by RT-

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2RF7B...e_gdata_player

25 vid by max kiser on the evils of monsanto -
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eiK_R...e_gdata_player


35min Hindi/Urdu documentary for our south Asian users -
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9Qk9l...e_gdata_player
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جوري
06-28-2012, 01:23 AM
Semi good thread actually..
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MustafaMc
06-28-2012, 02:16 AM
Originally Posted by TruthLogic
Again we Muslims have a clear warning , it is obvious we can NOT improve on the perfect creations that surround us
I happen to disagree. I am a cotton breeder working to develop new and improved varieties for the USA cotton grower. Ma sha Allah, our new varieties are setting new standards for yield and ones soon to be released, in sha Allah, will set new standards for fiber quality and disease resistance. Other companies are likewise doing similar work and they may even have better varieties than we do in the pipeline to be released soon. We have made real improvements through conventional breeding methods that have been practiced to varying degrees for millenia though less scientifically and efficiently than now.

Genetically modified (GM) traits are not found naturally in those plants, but they are rigorously tested for bio-safety including feeding studies with animals before they are ever released for sale. There are distinct advantages to the grower for planting seed with GM traits, else they would plant other seed without those traits that are drastically cheaper. Companies such as Monsanto develop these GM traits to make a profit, per the Capitalist model, but they don't have the ulterior motives that you may fear. The terminator gene that you spoke about merely prevents farmers from saving seed from plants derived from seed purchased from Monsanto and preserves their capacity to make a profit through subsequent seed sales. In order to purchase GM seed all growers must sign an agreement that they will not save seed for subsequent planting. I am almost certain this technology has not been deployed. Farmers and gardeners have traditionally saved seed from one year to the next as I do in my own garden, but to legally plant a GM seed one must first sign the agreement saying they will not save seed.

If people want to eat non-GM food, then they MUST start now to save there heritage seeds from extinction and to support organic food production which most assuredly will be more expensive unless people resort to growing there own food locally. For example, I personally have a modest sized garden that is GMO-free and almost completely organic except for the occassional synthetic fertilizer.
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جوري
06-28-2012, 02:22 AM
Originally Posted by MustafaMc
If people want to eat non-GM food, then they MUST start now to save there heritage seeds from extinction and to support organic food production which most assuredly will be more expensive unless people resort to growing there own food locally. For example, I personally have a modest sized garden that is GMO-free and almost completely organic except for the occassional synthetic fertilizer.
Very true.. what do you recommend for odd varieties and people who don't know the first thing about zone what to plant which?
I saw some 'organic food tubs' bathtub size but not sure how that whole thing works..
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جوري
06-28-2012, 02:24 AM
btw, there was also an incident where the prophet PBUH told farmers in a particular area not to tamper with the fertilizing and harvest and as a result they lost all the crop and he apologized to them and enabled them to do as they were doing..
let me find the hadith...
although I don't agree with genes from fish in vegetables type tamper..
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Hulk
06-28-2012, 03:12 AM
Originally Posted by منوة الخيال
btw, there was also an incident where the prophet PBUH told farmers in a particular area not to tamper with the fertilizing and harvest and as a result they lost all the crop and he apologized to them and enabled them to do as they were doing..
I haven't read the actual hadith before but from what I have been told I think it was sort of like a situation where the Prophet pbuh was commenting about something they were doing and because of the comment they decided to do something else and when the crop was lost I think he told them something along the lines of "You know better about your work/affairs than I do".

Allahualam
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جوري
06-28-2012, 03:14 AM
^^ yes... I am trying to find it but really hate google...
Reply

MustafaMc
06-28-2012, 03:45 AM
Originally Posted by منوة الخيال
Very true.. what do you recommend for odd varieties and people who don't know the first thing about zone what to plant which?
That is a difficult question, particularly for those folks in the city. I personally strive to be as self-reliant as possible. I get ticked-off at people I know who could grow a garden, but don't because they can buy it at the store just as cheap. I happen to disagree with that attitude.
I saw some 'organic food tubs' bathtub size but not sure how that whole thing works..
I believe the whole organic foods movement is a knee-jerk reaction in people who have a gut-feeling uneasiness about relying upon others for their food. I think it is more hype than substance except from a philosophical perspective.
although I don't agree with genes from fish in vegetables type tamper..
Take for example what is known as Bt which is short for a bacterium, Bacillus thuringensis. Bt is a naturally occuring bacteria that has been cultured and used as a pesticide because it produces a toxin that disrupts the gut of the larvae of moths who eat it. For example, Dipel is such a pesticide used on organic tomatoes to kill tomato hornworms. Scientist have extracted the DNA for this toxin and re-engineered it with specific plant based gene promoters and terminators. They have used these casettes to modify various crop species including corn and cotton such that they express a bacterial gene and produce this toxin internal to the plant as opposed to it being externally applied as a spray or a dust. The traits are regulated by the government with various trials to show their suitability as food and feed, but this touches upon a deeper problem than was brought out in the OP.

The deeper problem is that government is getting smaller (except with regards to weaponry) and those in powerful positions in the banking and industry are moving into so-called governmental roles. The end result is deregulation of various ways and means of the capitalist system that makes it easier and easier for massive redistribution of wealth from the masses to the few elite. This inherent defect is what I believe is driving the world economy to the brink of total collapse. Unregulated capitalism is like a wildfire that consumes everything in its path with no concern for the effect on others. I believe that the concerns of the OP over the hazards of GM food is misplaced and the real hazard is the current New World Order and the capitalist economic system.
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جوري
06-28-2012, 03:54 AM
God I miss intelligent conversation ... Jazaka Allah khyran for that..
Reply

MustafaMc
06-28-2012, 04:27 AM
Ma sha Allah, wa eyakum.

On FaceBook one of my friends was complaining about Monsanto that the GM cotton they sell in India is driving farmers to commit suicide. I countered with additional info such as some of what I have provided here, which was basically confirmed by personal communication with a cotton breeder from India.

The current traits have been well tested and shown to be safe, but we don't know how thorough this testing will be in the future. Consider for example that the current US Secretary of Agriculture, Thomas Vilsack, "serves as a distinguished fellow at Iowa State University's Biosafety Institute for Genetically Modified Agricultural Products, where he sits on the advisory board with representatives of Monsanto, Dupont's Pioneer Hi-Bred, and the World Bank." http://www.organicconsumers.org/arti...icle_16160.cfm There are already examples where he has sided with these corporate interests over smaller groups such as organic alfalfa growers. The same issue happened to the deregulation of the banking industry that led to the economic crisis and near-collapse of 2008.
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Insaanah
06-28-2012, 07:29 PM
:sl:

Originally Posted by منوة الخيال
btw, there was also an incident where the prophet PBUH told farmers in a particular area not to tamper with the fertilizing and harvest and as a result they lost all the crop and he apologized to them and enabled them to do as they were doing..
let me find the hadith...
Originally Posted by Hulk
I haven't read the actual hadith before but from what I have been told I think it was sort of like a situation where the Prophet pbuh was commenting about something they were doing and because of the comment they decided to do something else and when the crop was lost I think he told them something along the lines of "You know better about your work/affairs than I do".
حَدَّثَنَا عَبْدُ اللَّهِ بْنُ الرُّومِيِّ الْيَمَامِيُّ، وَعَبَّاسُ بْنُ عَبْدِ الْعَظِيمِ الْعَنْبَرِيُّ، وَأَحْمَدُ بْنُ، جَعْفَرٍ الْمَعْقِرِيُّ قَالُوا حَدَّثَنَا النَّضْرُ بْنُ مُحَمَّدٍ، حَدَّثَنَا عِكْرِمَةُ، - وَهُوَ ابْنُ عَمَّارٍ - حَدَّثَنَا أَبُو النَّجَاشِيِّ، حَدَّثَنِي رَافِعُ بْنُ خَدِيجٍ، قَالَ قَدِمَ نَبِيُّ اللَّهِ صلى الله عليه وسلم الْمَدِينَةَ وَهُمْ يَأْبُرُونَ النَّخْلَ يَقُولُونَ يُلَقِّحُونَ النَّخْلَ فَقَالَ ‏"‏ مَا تَصْنَعُونَ ‏"‏ ‏.‏ قَالُوا كُنَّا نَصْنَعُهُ قَالَ ‏"‏ لَعَلَّكُمْ لَوْ لَمْ تَفْعَلُوا كَانَ خَيْرًا ‏"‏ ‏.‏ فَتَرَكُوهُ فَنَفَضَتْ أَوْ فَنَقَصَتْ - قَالَ - فَذَكَرُوا ذَلِكَ لَهُ فَقَالَ ‏"‏ إِنَّمَا أَنَا بَشَرٌ إِذَا أَمَرْتُكُمْ بِشَىْءٍ مِنْ دِينِكُمْ فَخُذُوا بِهِ وَإِذَا أَمَرْتُكُمْ بِشَىْءٍ مِنْ رَأْىٍ فَإِنَّمَا أَنَا بَشَرٌ ‏"‏ ‏.‏ قَالَ عِكْرِمَةُ أَوْ نَحْوَ هَذَا ‏.‏ قَالَ الْمَعْقِرِيُّ فَنَفَضَتْ ‏.‏ وَلَمْ يَشُكَّ

Sahih Muslim: English reference: Book 30, Hadith 5831, Arabic reference: Book 44, Hadith 6276
Source: http://www.sunnah.com/urn/363140

حدثنا علي بن محمد حدثنا عبيد الله بن موسى عن إسرائيل عن سماك أنه سمع موسى بن طلحة بن عبيد الله يحدث عن أبيه قال مررت مع رسول الله صلى الله عليه وسلم في نخل فرأى قوما يلقحون النخل فقال ما يصنع هؤلاء قالوا يأخذون من الذكر فيجعلونه في الأنثى قال ما أظن ذلك يغني شيئا فبلغهم فتركوه فنزلوا عنها فبلغ النبي صلى الله عليه وسلم فقال إنما هو الظن إن كان يغني شيئا فاصنعوه فإنما أنا بشر مثلكم وإن الظن يخطئ ويصيب ولكن ما قلت لكم قال الله فلن أكذب على الله

Sunan Ibn Maajah Hadeeth 2470 Source: http://www.islamweb.net/newlibrary/d...k_no=54&ID=874

Translations of three narrations from saheeh Muslim:

1. Hadîth #2361 – narrated from Talhah b. `Ubayd Allah:

I was with Allah’s Messenger (peace be upon him) when we passed by some people who were tending the tops of their date palms. He asked: “What are these people doing?”

(Some people) replied: “They are pollinating the trees by bringing the male parts into contact with the female parts.” Allah’s Messenger (peace be upon him) said: “I do not think that this brings any benefit.”

They were informed of this and abandoned the practice. Then Allah’s Messenger (peace be upon him) was informed of their abandoning it and said: “If that will benefit them, then they should practice it. Indeed I only ventured a thought. Do not hold me account to what I think. However, when I speak to you about anything regarding Allah, then accept it, for indeed I never speak falsely about Allah the Almighty.”

2. Hadîth #2362 – narrated from Râfi` b. Khurayj:

The Prophet (peace be upon him) had come to Madînah while they were cross-pollinating their date palms. He asked: “What are these people doing?”

They replied: “This is something that has been our practice.” He said: “Maybe if you were not to do so, it would be good.”

So they abandoned it and the crop that resulted was impoverished. They mentioned this to him and he said: “I am only a human being. When I command you with something regarding your religion, accept it. When I command you with something from my own opinion, then I am only a human being.”

`Ikrimah (one of the hadîth’s narrators) said: “He said that or something to that effect.”

3. Hadîth #2363 – narrated from Anas:

The Prophet (peace be upon him) passed by some people who were busy with pollination and said: “If they would not do this, then it would still come out right.”

The date crop that resulted was of a very poor quality. Then he passed by them and asked: “What is with your date palms?”

They said: “You had told us such-and-such…”

He said: “You know best the affairs of your worldly life.”

http://en.islamtoday.net/node/1691
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جوري
06-28-2012, 07:44 PM
^^ oh God I miss you...:) I was taken by a whirlwind..
Reply

TruthLogic
06-28-2012, 08:10 PM
Originally Posted by MustafaMc
I happen to disagree. I am a cotton breeder working to develop new and improved varieties for the USA cotton grower. Ma sha Allah, our new varieties are setting new standards for yield and ones soon to be released, in sha Allah, will set new standards for fiber quality and disease resistance. Other companies are likewise doing similar work and they may even have better varieties than we do in the pipeline to be released soon. We have made real improvements through conventional breeding methods that have been practiced to varying degrees for millenia though less scientifically and efficiently than now.

Genetically modified (GM) traits are not found naturally in those plants, but they are rigorously tested for bio-safety including feeding studies with animals before they are ever released for sale. There are distinct advantages to the grower for planting seed with GM traits, else they would plant other seed without those traits that are drastically cheaper. Companies such as Monsanto develop these GM traits to make a profit, per the Capitalist model, but they don't have the ulterior motives that you may fear. The terminator gene that you spoke about merely prevents farmers from saving seed from plants derived from seed purchased from Monsanto and preserves their capacity to make a profit through subsequent seed sales. In order to purchase GM seed all growers must sign an agreement that they will not save seed for subsequent planting. I am almost certain this technology has not been deployed. Farmers and gardeners have traditionally saved seed from one year to the next as I do in my own garden, but to legally plant a GM seed one must first sign the agreement saying they will not save seed.

If people want to eat non-GM food, then they MUST start now to save there heritage seeds from extinction and to support organic food production which most assuredly will be more expensive unless people resort to growing there own food locally. For example, I personally have a modest sized garden that is GMO-free and almost completely organic except for the occassional synthetic fertilizer.

Brother I suggest you read the latest scientific reports about mostano GM crops which were designed to be pest reistant but now the pests have adapted !

You clearly can't tamper with allahs creation purley for profit !

However there is indeed a darker side too this !

Think about it if you control the food supply like mosonto is trying too do you control the population !

It's very simple !

Monsnto gm crops fail :
http://rt.com/usa/news/superbug-mons...esistance-628/
Reply

TruthLogic
06-28-2012, 08:12 PM
Originally Posted by MustafaMc
Ma sha Allah, wa eyakum.

On FaceBook one of my friends was complaining about Monsanto that the GM cotton they sell in India is driving farmers to commit suicide. I countered with additional info such as some of what I have provided here, which was basically confirmed by personal communication with a cotton breeder from India.

The current traits have been well tested and shown to be safe, but we don't know how thorough this testing will be in the future. Consider for example that the current US Secretary of Agriculture, Thomas Vilsack, "serves as a distinguished fellow at Iowa State University's Biosafety Institute for Genetically Modified Agricultural Products, where he sits on the advisory board with representatives of Monsanto, Dupont's Pioneer Hi-Bred, and the World Bank." http://www.organicconsumers.org/arti...icle_16160.cfm There are already examples where he has sided with these corporate interests over smaller groups such as organic alfalfa growers. The same issue happened to the deregulation of the banking industry that led to the economic crisis and near-collapse of 2008.
Watch the last vid !

Indian farmers are resisting this new kind of debt which they are being forced into !!

Control the food supply
Control the population !

Monsonta is not after money but control !

Just imagine all the world farmers relying on one company for their seeds !

Can you NOT comprehend the power the control Monsanto wish too implant on the world ???

Think about it !
Reply

Abz2000
06-28-2012, 11:41 PM
i don't believe choosing good breeds and physically tampering with them and modifying their traits are the same thing

GM Grass Kills Cows In Texas: Cyanide Gas!

“Preliminary tests revealed the Tifton 85 grass, which has been here for years, had suddenly started producing cyanide gas, poisoning the cattle.”

although this was apparently not gm, it was a hybrid that seems to have been unable to deal with the extremely fast conversion and gone "haywire".

i don't know much about the topic of gmo, but it does feel like it is over-pushing nature into situations it can't naturally sustain.

in a mule - we usually notice the problem in the first generation - where they become infertile.
but with smaller changes in other cross species plants the disastrous consequences can be invisible until it's a reality.

btw, i wonder what type of food the rothschilds eat........... i don't think it's gm.
i know the royal family goes with organic anyway - i can't always avoid gm due to the huge price difference in some items, but get organic when it's practical. but i believe most people who can afford to usually stick with organic.
Reply

TruthLogic
06-29-2012, 11:42 AM
Originally Posted by Abz2000
i don't believe choosing good breeds and physically tampering with them and modifying their traits are the same thing

GM Grass Kills Cows In Texas: Cyanide Gas!

“Preliminary tests revealed the Tifton 85 grass, which has been here for years, had suddenly started producing cyanide gas, poisoning the cattle.”

although this was apparently not gm, it was a hybrid that seems to have been unable to deal with the extremely fast conversion and gone "haywire".

i don't know much about the topic of gmo, but it does feel like it is over-pushing nature into situations it can't naturally sustain.

in a mule - we usually notice the problem in the first generation - where they become infertile.
but with smaller changes in other cross species plants the disastrous consequences can be invisible until it's a reality.

btw, i wonder what type of food the rothschilds eat........... i don't think it's gm.
i know the royal family goes with organic anyway - i can't always avoid gm due to the huge price difference in some items, but get organic when it's practical. but i believe most people who can afford to usually stick with organic.

Cross breading and GM is totally different !

However we are at the very brink !

For example if some or just one of the Transgenic fish escaped into the natural population we could see the instiction of the natural speices in a few generations !

Your right organic food is a MUST !
Espicaly when the satanic Governments are not forcing monsonto to label their food !


These modifcations these little dajjals are making to the food chain would never occur naturally !
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