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جوري
07-04-2012, 09:12 PM
Per title..
I am lost with political correctness..
since when is being averse to something so politically incorrect? and why don't these rules apply one size fits all?
I am just curious.. so what if you hate/detest/averse to something? and when does hatred turn into phobia as I often see them conspicuously attached even though they're pages and pages apart in the dictionary and even with why is developing a phobia so bad? do we not have phobias from perceived threats? Should I love tarantulas even when I hate them just to be a part of the pack and even if I have a phobia since let's face it, they can be deadly.. (I don't hate tarantulas at all I am just using an example) not that there should be anything wrong with hating them..
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glo
07-05-2012, 06:29 AM
There is no such thing as arachnoid rights (at least not yet) ;D

But there is something called human rights, which are commonly understood to be "fundamental rights to which a person is inherently entitled simply because she or he is a human being".

What rights does the Human Rights Act protect?

The right to life – protects your life, by law. The state is required to investigate suspicious deaths and deaths in custody.

The prohibition of torture and inhuman treatment – you should never be tortured or treated in an inhuman or degrading way, no matter what the situation.

Protection against slavery and forced labour – you should not be treated like a slave or subjected to forced labour.

The right to liberty and freedom – you have the right to be free and the state can only imprison you with very good reason – for example, if you are convicted of a crime.

The right to a fair trial and no punishment without law - you are innocent until proven guilty. If accused of a crime, you have the right to hear the evidence against you, in a court of law.

Respect for privacy and family life and the right to marry – protects against unnecessary surveillance or intrusion into your life. You have the right to marry and raise a family.

Freedom of thought, religion and belief – you can believe what you like and practise your religion or beliefs.

Free speech and peaceful protest – you have a right to speak freely and join with others peacefully, to express your views.

No discrimination – everyone’s rights are equal. You should not be treated unfairly – because, for example, of your gender, race, sexuality, religion or age.

Protection of property, the right to an education and the right to free elections – protects against state interference with your possessions; means that no child can be denied an education and that elections must be free and fair.
http://www.liberty-human-rights.org....-act/index.php

Every human being should have the same rights. And we should all benefits from these rights.
When people are unfairly imprisoned or tortured, human rights campaigners will fight on their behalf, based on the above rights.
When people are discriminated against because of their sexual orientation or religious beliefs, human rights campaigners will fight on their behalf, based on the above rights.

Basically, we don't have to like what other people do, say or believe. We may even find it quite repulsive. (It's our own right to do so)
But us feeling like that does not give us the right to discriminate against those people. We must give them the right and freedom to be who they are ... unless, of course, they affect our human rights with their actions ...
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glo
07-05-2012, 06:30 AM
I don't think love or hate come into human rights at all, so the title is a bit confusing ... it's simply about respect.
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ardianto
07-05-2012, 06:43 AM
Indonesian word for "hate" is "Benci". But people in my place twist "benci" into "BENar benar CInta" (really love).
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Aprender
07-05-2012, 06:48 AM
Originally Posted by glo
I don't think love or hate come into human rights at all, so the title is a bit confusing ... it's simply about respect.
The OP is not asking about human rights though. Just the rules on love and hate. It's a legitimate question and one that I wonder about sometimes too.

Even children who aren't into current "trends" in music or culture get called boring or stupid for not liking it because everyone else does. I personally don't think there is anything wrong with disliking something so long as it doesn't translate into a physical altercation. Verbally it's different because people take things a different way. One person might not find certain words offensive while others might be shocked.

Originally Posted by glo
We must give them the right and freedom to be who they are ... unless, of course, they affect our human rights with their actions ...
I see that you now brought up the gay thing. Well in a way I do think it can start to affect us. Because your religion prohibits these types of sexual acts, you would be labeled as backwards, homophobic and a BIGOT for standing by your religious beliefs and you turn into an "outsider" because you're not thinking like the rest of the group. Is this not discrimination? I would say so. Because you don't think and believe or behave the way everyone else does, you become the dumb, barbaric, backwards one for just trying to stick to your faith. You're no longer in the "in" crowd and you don't belong.

Respect goes both ways.

I think it's really quite silly to be honest and unfortunate that this groupthink behavior is on the rise. Tunnel vision isn't a good thing for the cognitive development of future generations.
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Aprender
07-05-2012, 07:02 AM
Originally Posted by glo
Basically, we don't have to like what other people do, say or believe. We may even find it quite repulsive. (It's our own right to do so)
But us feeling like that does not give us the right to discriminate against those people.
And just because we don't like what others do doesn't mean we should automatically be labelled as fearful of them either. Nor should we be labelled as stupid, hateful or discriminating against them for having a different opinion. The definition of phobia is changing.

During the civil rights movement in the U.S. and long before it there were a lot of people who discriminated and said hateful things towards black and African American people. Went so far as to lynch, burn them alive, beat and drag them behind horse carriages to death. Some of them didn't want segregation. Didn't think that blacks had any right to education or even to use the same drinking fountains. But this was called racism. History doesn't call those people blackophobic.

You speak out against homosexuality because of the religious beliefs that you hold or maybe you aren't religious and still don't agree with it but automatically you get thrown into the crap pile. Society sees you as less intelligent, hostile, fearful of homosexuals and discriminatory against them even if you don't advocate any type of persecution or call them names but simply disagree with their practices. It's quite sad really.
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جوري
07-05-2012, 07:13 AM
That's saying it like it should be said sr. Aprender.. Along with concession to what the soul is averse comes also a very unnecessary evolution of terms .. It's disturbing trend of additives and preservatives.
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ardianto
07-05-2012, 07:17 AM
We can love someone we ever hate. But we will never able to hate someone we (ever) love. Everytime hate heat our hearts, love will cool our hearts again.

Indeed, love is stronger than hate.

:)
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dqsunday
07-05-2012, 07:20 AM
"Fear is the path to the Dark Side. Fear leads to anger, anger leads to hate; hate leads to suffering. I sense much fear in you." - Yoda-Phantom Menace.
(sorry, couldn't resist tossing in this quote)



Seriously though, in my view Hate and Love are emotions and we are all entitled to feel them and to an extent, express them. At least till it infringes on the freedom of another. Acting out in hatred (ie verbally abusing somebody, or attacking them etc) is wrong. Same can be said with love. Its fine to love somebody (be it romantic love, family type love, friendship love or just a love of some object (ie a favorite food item) as long as you don't take some action that infringes on the freedom of others or other law (ie trying to have sex with a person you love who you are not married to).

I hate bees, hornets and wasps, but I don't feel any special desire to eradicate them from the face of the Earth because of it (well I may destroy their nests if they are on my home...but I always try to do this early so its really only just the queen, scare her away, destroy the nest and she will just build another one elsewhere). But people are different than animals...if you hate a particular person, stay away from them, if they won't leave you be well, take legal action. If they are just a pest but not breaking any laws. Either find a way to work things out so they will leave you alone, or move.

As for out right rules, I really don't think there are specific rules about whether you can love or hate something. Its more, what you do with the emotion. You can hate somebody or something but leave it alone, nothing wrong. If you pick on it, prosecute it etc. then its infringing on their freedoms...and legal issues come up. Of course these are generalizations, as different situations can have different rulings. Afterall you are most likely going to hate the guy who murdered your best friend and take great pleasure in seeing justice done.
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جوري
07-05-2012, 07:23 AM
The human right thing is quite funny not sure whether to laugh or use the ejection button?
Where are those human rights as far as gitmo or the sister who had her underwear scissored off by five w*ores three of whom were men who wanted to 'teach her a lesson' - Paris is so free of crime save for the unspeakable crime of wearing clothes!
People are just into florid but often vacuous terms. They write constitutions and bills which they obviously suspend for the groups they want to exclude- hypocrites at best and/or otherwise delusional!
It's the reverse order that now reigns supreme!
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glo
07-05-2012, 07:42 AM
Originally Posted by Aprender
I see that you now brought up the gay thing.
I didn't think this thread was about homosexuality.
I have seen too many of those kind of threads and I know where they end up ... :hmm:

My comments were about human rights. That's all I can contribute to this thread.

Salaam :)
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dysphoricrocker
07-05-2012, 07:46 AM
Originally Posted by Aprender
You speak out against homosexuality because of the religious beliefs that you hold or maybe you aren't religious and still don't agree with it but automatically you get thrown into the crap pile. Society sees you as less intelligent, hostile, fearful of homosexuals and discriminatory against them even if you don't advocate any type of persecution or call them names but simply disagree with their practices. It's quite sad really.
I feel this one. So true.
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Aprender
07-05-2012, 07:47 AM
Originally Posted by glo
I didn't think this thread was about homosexuality.
I have seen too many of those kind of threads and I know where they end up ...

My comments were about human rights. That's all I can contribute to this thread.

Salaam
I tend to read between the lines but nice save, glo.
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جوري
07-05-2012, 07:52 AM
I knew I shouldn't have had that last cup of coffee but the last bit has been entertaining :)
Thanks and fajr is just in :)
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ardianto
07-05-2012, 09:14 AM
Originally Posted by Aprender
But this was called racism. History doesn't call those people blackophobic.
Because that was hatred, not fear. Phobia is caused by fear, not hate.

If White people fear to Black people, they would not dare to oppress Black people.



I don;t have intention to racist. :)
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syed_z
07-05-2012, 09:34 AM
Originally Posted by ardianto
We can love someone we ever hate. But we will never able to hate someone we (ever) love. Everytime hate heat our hearts, love will cool our hearts again.

Indeed, love is stronger than hate.

:)

Salaam....

Love is stronger than hate no doubt however, we might also some day hate someone we love so dearly ....


Chapter 60

Being moderate in love and hatred
(2004)

أعََحْب سَِىبْ أَنَْ حب ييبَكَُكَ و نَ هَ وْنَ حًابِي بمََا كَ عَيَوَْ سمًا ى أمََا ن يَكُونَ بَغِيضَكَ يَوْمًا مَا وَأَبْغِضْ بَغِيضَكَ هَوْنًا مَا

Sayyidina Abu Huraira (RA) reported in a marfu’ from that the Prophet (SAW) said,

Love your friend with moderation; perhaps he might become contemptuous some day.And let your dislike (for anyone) be within limits, perhaps he might turn your friend one day.

(Tirmizi)
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ardianto
07-05-2012, 09:43 AM
There is proverb in Indonesia "Tak kenal, maka tak sayang" (not know/familiar, so (you will) not love".

Hatred toward other people caused because we don't know or not familiar with. If we have know (familiar with) we will find something that can reduce our hate.

I know many people, and I found, there's no "pure evil", there's no "pure angel". Every human has good side and bad side. Which side that dominant can be changed. Based on many factors like, personal experiences, emotional stability, religious level, etc.
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ardianto
07-05-2012, 09:47 AM
Originally Posted by syed_z
Being moderate in love
It's means: do not blind by love.

If we love our friend blindly, when he make trouble and people angry, we will defend him, not tell him to apologize.
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