What to do in the economic crisis ?

[marwen]

:salamext:


You all know that the world is living an economic crisis today. It started in the US and now it's taking over Europe, some countries or people don't feel it, but I'm sure it will touch everybody. I see many European Factories and societies closing today because the market is degraded and no one have money to buy their products (cars, etc.).

I'm not good in economics, so I need some ideas about how to prepare and survive in the next years crisis.

- should we try to be less involved in the capitalist economy ?
- should we retrieve all our money from banks and put them in concrete projects / or buy permanent goods (immovables, etc.) ?
- what projects will be more promising and less affected by the crisis ?
- are there some islamic rules or advices on how to deal in these conditions ?

[جوري]

It will only get worst - I was watching also all the environmental changes which are proposed to cause the death of 50 mil or so by the year 2030- mostly poor and impoverished as they often if not always pay the price!
Isn't it all part of the signs of the dajjal anyway? The heat, poverty, droughts, loss of crops etc.
so when such an individual comes the majority will see him as a savior and follow?
I am often reminded of the Hadith اخشوشنوا فإن النعم لا تدوم!
We should be able to do without 90% if the things we depend on and hold on to 100% of the things we forgo like books and fasting and exercise and fending fur ourselves from the knowledge that's innate and of the good of the earth.
It's really a sad situation - the tribulations we're in but as you see Syria itself - Allah swt us preparing those people for the best - surely suffrage raises men and makes men out if children!
Anyhow sorry for the grim views but as it's so long as .001% of the population are happy the rest of us should live in servitude and struggle!

:w:

[marwen]

bump :/:

[Futuwwa]

If you have spare cash, buy stocks. They're a real bargain now. ;D

Hey there! Looks like you're enjoying the discussion, but you're not signed up for an account.

When you create an account, you can participate in the discussions and share your thoughts. You also get notifications, here and via email, whenever new posts are made. And you can like posts and make new friends.
Sign Up

[glo]

I am not en economist, so perhaps I am missing the central point ... but what strikes me is that the government seems to forever push for people to buy more. If people buy, then stuff needs to be produced ... which means people have work ... which means people get paid ... which means they have more money to buy stuff ...

I get that.
But my problem is that I am quite a non-consumer at heart. Don't we have too much stuff already? How much more do we want??

Things are not made to last anymore. Or to be repairable.
We are supposed to buy something (TV, car, phone, clothes etc) only for a short while, and we are encouraged to not even wait until it breaks, but to buy a newer better model/version/fashion as soon as it comes out ...

Am I the only one who finds that crazy?

What's wrong with mending stuff? What about repair - reuse - recycle?

I much prefer to knit my own clothes, cook my own food, grow my own vegetables.
Our furniture is second-hand. I don't buy new clothes until the old ones are worn out. I don't give a hoot about fashion!

Perhaps if everybody thought like me, the economy would be rock bottom ... ^o)
Or perhaps we would have industries which focus on repairing instead of replacing.

[Futuwwa]

Perhaps if everybody thought like me, the economy would be rock bottom ... ^o)

Only if you end up piling up money and not using it for anything because of your thrift.

[Ramadan90]

As long as we have something to eat, beds to sleep on, books, roofs over our heads and a masjid near us then we should be happy with what we have. =) Alhamdulilah

[MustafaMc]

What's wrong with mending stuff? What about repair - reuse - recycle?

I much prefer to knit my own clothes, cook my own food, grow my own vegetables.
Our furniture is second-hand. I don't buy new clothes until the old ones are worn out. I don't give a hoot about fashion!

There is absolutely nothing wrong with this way of thinking, actually I believe it is the better way of living. We live in capitalist societies which is centered on using money to make money that ultimately drives toward the rich getting richer through exploitation of the world's resources. One element of this system is to make things as cheaply as possible and to sell them for as much as possible, which of course is dependent on an insatiable consumer who is willing to part with his money for those things. Unrestricted capitalism results in the accumulation of wealth, power and political influence into a progressively smaller group of people that accelerates the rate of inequality to the point where everyone is the slave of an extremely few individuals. Ultimately the masses are driven back to the point where they HAVE to live as you described because they have no other choice. In fact, we may be on the point of a global economic crisis precipitated by the collapse of the US dollar that will see the arrival of a New World Order that I believe will establish the False Messiah (Dajjal) as World Dictator. The Georgia Guidestones, that I have seen and touched, may be a blatant announcement for this:

"LET THESE BE GUIDESTONES TO AN AGE OF REASON"

1. MAINTAIN HUMANITY UNDER 500,000,000 IN PERPETUAL BALANCE WITH NATURE
2. GUIDE REPRODUCTION WISELY - IMPROVING FITNESS AND DIVERSITY
3. UNITE HUMANITY WITH A LIVING NEW LANGUAGE
4. RULE PASSION - FAITH - TRADITION - AND ALL THINGS WITH TEMPERED REASON
5. PROTECT PEOPLE AND NATIONS WITH FAIR LAWS AND JUST COURTS
6. LET ALL NATIONS RULE INTERNALLY RESOLVING EXTERNAL DISPUTES IN A WORLD COURT
7. AVOID PETTY LAWS AND USELESS OFFICIALS
8. BALANCE PERSONAL RIGHTS WITH SOCIAL DUTIES
9. PRIZE TRUTH - BEAUTY - LOVE- SEEKING HARMONY WITH THE INFINITE
10. BE NOT A CANCER ON THE EARTH - LEAVE ROOM FOR NATURE - LEAVE ROOM FOR NATURE

[dusk]

- should we try to be less involved in the capitalist economy ?

Depends you always have to compare before after. If there is a financial crisis and the economy slumps say 10% or simply doesn't grow like Japan, USA, EU today, is this so bad to drop everything. If the economy grow to 140 base points and drops 14 that is still way more prosperity than being at 80 but steadily and slowly growing by 1 point.
Most of the capitalist economy is built to facilitate fast growth. The leverage in money. Unbacked securities. It can slump but if you build too many houses after a bubble at the end you still have those houses. The question from a wealth perspective should be is the good growth worth it to have some crisis every once in a while. A shrunk US is still a worlds difference from Russia in wealth.

- should we retrieve all our money from banks and put them in concrete projects / or buy permanent goods (immovables, etc.) ?

Good idea (in general) if you have any good investment ideas. Money should always be invested somehow otherwise it just withers away. Economist aim for a 2% inflation at least so people don't leave money lying around. At the moment inflation in all industrialized countries is rather low but still your money is loosing value.

- what projects will be more promising and less affected by the crisis ?

If there was fool proof things the money would flow there. The big money doesn't pay Germany to hold on to their money for no reason.
Good idea is to look at the local real estate market and buy property if possible even against a loan. It depends on the market some are already overheating others are still cheap. Some cities have still lots of potential with some districts still cheap.
Stocks are also a good insurance against inflation as they are valued as part of a company, the value of the currency doesn't change the value of the company. Great is undervalued stocks of big established companies that won't just go away or are risky like new stocks.
A lot of things are only mildly affected by "the" crisis. There is still enough consumption if one finds a good business idea one should try. Interest rates are as low as can be.

[ardianto]

:sl:

Mid of 1997. A 'bomb' that called "monetary crisis" exploded in Asia. The effect hit Southeast and East Asia countries, but the country that got the worst damage was Indonesia. It's because corruption, collusion, and nepotism of Soeharto regime. He gave privilege to his cronies that used those privileges out of control.

Indonesian currency, Rupiah, was free falling from around 2,500 per 1 US$ into more than 11,000. The prices of all stuffs in the market was flying up very very high. Many many companies were closing, few millions workers lost their jobs, .... I lost my job too!. It made Indonesian people were very angry.

The first thing that Indonesian people did was 'put down' Soeharto regime. Success, although the cost was very high, more than one thousand killed in riot. It's happened in may 1998.

The root of the problem had been eliminated successfully. Then what? ..... back to work again! do something that we can do!

Frankly, I was selling food. I went to the marketplace, bought food ingredients, cooked at my house, and delivered it to the guy who I employ to sell that food. Many people who lost their job started their micro business too. That made Indonesian wheel of economic keep spinning.

Now, Alhamdulillah, economic in Indonesia is far better than in 98-99.

What to do in the economic crisis? .... keep working. Do something that you can do. If you lost your job and you cannot get new job because the companies are closing, create your own job. Throw away your pride. Many people who lost their job in Indonesia were working in offices, but they didn't shy to sell cheap stuff. Think simple, it's better sell hotdog in the park, than just stay at home wait for job opportunity as manager that maybe will not come.

Always maintain your productivity. Do not only thinking how to save your food to make you survive longer with the rest of the food you have, but thinking how to always have food.

[KDhieb]

:sl:
your post
reminded me of this :

If you seek in this world what suffices you, then the least of this world will suffice you. And if you seek what fulfills you and you can't be fulfilled by what suffices you, then nothing in this world will fulfill you - Abu Hazem

It will only get worst - I was watching also all the environmental changes which are proposed to cause the death of 50 mil or so by the year 2030- mostly poor and impoverished as they often if not always pay the price!
Isn't it all part of the signs of the dajjal anyway? The heat, poverty, droughts, loss of crops etc.
so when such an individual comes the majority will see him as a savior and follow?
I am often reminded of the Hadith اخشوشنوا فإن النعم لا تدوم!
We should be able to do without 90% if the things we depend on and hold on to 100% of the things we forgo like books and fasting and exercise and fending fur ourselves from the knowledge that's innate and of the good of the earth.
It's really a sad situation - the tribulations we're in but as you see Syria itself - Allah swt us preparing those people for the best - surely suffrage raises men and makes men out if children!
Anyhow sorry for the grim views but as it's so long as .001% of the population are happy the rest of us should live in servitude and struggle!

:w:

[MustafaMc]

Mid of 1997. A 'bomb' that called "monetary crisis" exploded in Asia.

As crazy as this will sound, I see that something very similar to this will also happen in USA.

[Cabdullahi]

What to do in the economic crisis ?


Buy cous cous sachets and tuna cans
use miswak
Go to debenhams and ask the ladies that work there you want to try some perfumes
take a shower at your friends house
tell your mother you're going to borrow her stockings
when outside buy 1 pound chicken wings and chips from the pakistani takeaway, and ask for tap water to drink(absolutely free).
enrol at the university of youtube and attend lectures at any time you feel like it, graduate when you become proficient in a subject.
if you're thinking about marriage.. which is perfectly natural...marry a divorcee with 7 kids - make sure she earns benefits.

I could list a whole lot

[Futuwwa]

As long as we have something to eat, beds to sleep on, books, roofs over our heads and a masjid near us then we should be happy with what we have. =) Alhamdulilah

Your modesty is admirable, but speaking as a recently (<1 year) married man, I beg to disagree. My wife absolutely loathes her current job, it leaves her depressed and exhausted. She will be able to leave it next year only because I have managed to secure a comfortable income for myself, and thus can afford to let her become a housewife.

[PurpleCup]

Capitalist Economy do not work well for the people. They work well for big business. What can people do? Stop shopping at big businesses and start shopping at only small businesses. Don't be such a sucker for named brand clothing like Gap, Hollister, Old Navy, and so forth. Simply stop shopping there. They make big corporations happy. Yes, big Corporations hire but they also lay off and that is a catch 22. People need steady jobs and steady jobs come from many many small businesses. If you look at the smart Middle East like Egypt which has alot of small businesses which keeps each family sustained, it also creates jobs for the people. In Egypt the Government puts a cap on how much each item can sell for! That means if the Egyptian Government says a sack of potatoes cannot sell MORE than $1.99 per bag then all the store owners in Egypt CANNOT sell those potatoes for more than $1.99 or the people will report them and they will get into a lot of trouble. They CAN however sell those potatoes for $1.50 a bag which keeps the prices of food, grocery, Health and Beauty Aids and other basic needs at a LOW price.
Unlike in stupid America where we have gas at one station selling for $3.50/gal and right across the street for $4.00/gal and down the street $5.00/gal which drives UP the cost of living for the people. The wages seldom keep up with the inflation. So if you spend $1,000 more each month to live and your wage stays the same. That means you will have to suffer, live without, or find another job.
I think Egypt will one day be a model society of example of how America should be.

The only thing Egypt may need is some more order and direction and they will be one lovely country.

I really really feel Muslims should buy from Muslims. When my son was growing up I would make it an effort to shop at the local shop which was owned by a Muslim rather than shopping at Walmart. And let me say places like Wal-mart are not cheapper alternative. They want to fool you they are.

Our local Dollar Store is owned by a Muslim and I have to say that is one cool fun store to shop in.

Forget big business. Forget them. Really if you care about the economy care about your small businesses only! Preferably the Muslim ones. :amin:

[Futuwwa]

Maximum prices like that are problematic for a number of reasons. If a price is forced to be below the market equilibrium price (where supply and demand meet), demand will exceed supply and there will be a shortage. That the price is low does you no good if the shelves of the shop are empty. And with the price being lower than it would otherwise be, there is less incentive to invest in new production that actually increases the supply of the good.

And why exactly would a small business have a higher propensity to be virtuous than a big one?

[جوري]

And why exactly would a small business have a higher propensity to be virtuous than a big one?

It isn't about 'virtue' it is about competition if two big monopolies control everything you'll lose as a consumer, they can set the prices they want and the type products are limited and you'll have no choice but accept options that may not serve your wallet nor your intended purpose of use.. & lastly about being your own boss rather than working like a mule for someone else's riches!

best,