PDA

View Full Version : The Man Who Challenged God.



Urban Turban
01-28-2013, 07:19 PM
:sl:

Great read, will inshaAllah increase your imaan [faith]. Well worth the time.

http://theijtema.wordpress.com/2012/12/19/the-man-who-challenged-god/


:wa:
Reply

Login/Register to hide ads. Scroll down for more posts
Ahmad H
01-28-2013, 09:45 PM
“The body has been sent for post-mortem examination. The police tried to stop him, but failed. The man was a psychiatric case,” Ghaziabad Superintendent of Police Shiv Shankar Singh Yadav said.

This is what the end of the article had written in it. If the man was psychiatric, and that is what the police said, then the man, although he challenged God, is not accountable to God if he was truly mentally ill. Allah has exempted anyone who is mentally ill, as well as the newborn and those who have never heard the message of Islam before. Thus, this man was mentally ill, and the police said he died insane. Allah knows best what the man was, but trying to use this case as a proof of the power of Allah is not useful. In fact, it runs contrary to Divine Law since Allah exempted this man, as I have just said. Therefore, this article isn't useful for boosting anyone's iman, but in fact it is really quite sad that someone mentally ill killed themselves.

I think you should read the words of Hazrat Rasul-e-Karim (saw), since he spoke the truth about this type of matter. The person who wrote this article did not understand this fact either. I will quote the Hadith saying this if you wish, but I can't right now since I am almost late to go to work.

Wassalaam. Peace be upon those who follow the truth.
Reply

Mustafa2012
01-28-2013, 11:28 PM
This is not a a challenge to Allaah.

What this man did is pure stupidness.

He wasted his whole life in trying to prove a point. Seems like he was just looking for attention.

But what benefit did it bring him?

Did Allaah lose anything by the man taking his own life?


O mankind! It is you who stand in need of Allah, but Allah is Rich (Free of all wants and needs), Worthy of all praise.
If He wills, He could destroy you and bring about a new creation
And that is not hard for Allah.


(Interpretation of the meaning. The Noble Qur'aan 35:15-17)


If you disbelieve, then verily, Allah is not in need of you, He likes not disbelief for His slaves.
And if you are grateful (by being believers), He is pleased therewith for you.
No bearer of burdens shall bear the burden of another.
Then to your Lord is your return, so He will inform you what you used to do.
Verily, He is the All-Knower of that which is in (men's) breasts.


(Interpretation of the meaning.the Noble Qur'aan 39:7)
Reply

Ahmad H
01-29-2013, 03:35 AM
If this man was aware of what he was doing, then he has done himself wrong by committing suicide by jumping off a building, since he will be doing that over and over again until the Day of Judgment when Allah brings forth everyone for judgment. however, i am saying that if the police were correct, that this man was clearly insane (meaning, he is ill in the head and didn't truly know what he was doing because of a mental disorder), then the man is exempt by Allah because Allah does not judge the deeds of a man who is mentally ill until he becomes sane. This is from a Hadith of Rasul-e-Karim (saw). I am not disagreeing with you on the man's foolishness. But, we cannot be judges on this matter, so it is merely a tragic case of someone doing something which brings about no result.

As for disbelief, we cannot judge that. Again, he may have been insane. It is part of faith to give people benefit of the doubt when it exists. Clearly, the benefit of the doubt exists according to the article. That is all I am saying. If the man was not regarded as insane, then he clearly committed an error and his failure is a clear sign from Allah. I hope you understand what I am trying to say. I presented you two options on what this story may mean. It is either one or the other, and it is not for us to decide what this man was based only on this. Allah is the Best of Judges.

May Allah reward you for your intention to show a sign from Him. I just think this situation was not a sign for sure, since again, there is doubt on this matter on whether the man was sane or not. I repeat this so you get my point. I am not trying to be rude if that's what you think. I only clear a misunderstanding on your part. The last little bit in this article is easy to miss. So read the last paragraph again and reflect. Allah is not at all unjust to His servants. He does what He wills. To Him we belong and to Him we shall return.
Reply

Welcome, Guest!
Hey there! Looks like you're enjoying the discussion, but you're not signed up for an account.

When you create an account, you can participate in the discussions and share your thoughts. You also get notifications, here and via email, whenever new posts are made. And you can like posts and make new friends.
Sign Up
Urban Turban
01-29-2013, 01:27 PM
^o)

The person in question wanted to determine his time of death.
Thereby, challenging the creator, those are his own words not mine nor the reporter who covered the story.
Anybody who does such things will be called a psycho case which here has been used loosely.
Period.

:wa:
Reply

Mustafa2012
01-29-2013, 02:39 PM
Originally Posted by Urban Turban
^o)

The person in question wanted to determine his time of death.
Thereby, challenging the creator, those are his own words not mine nor the reporter who covered the story.
Anybody who does such things will be called a psycho case which here has been used loosely.
Period.

:wa:
:salamext:

My comments were not directed at you specifically.

I was just talking about how stupid that man was to think he can challenge Allaah.

Psychotic would be a fitting description for someone like that.
Reply

Mustafa2012
01-29-2013, 02:47 PM
Originally Posted by Ahmad H
If this man was aware of what he was doing, then he has done himself wrong by committing suicide by jumping off a building, since he will be doing that over and over again until the Day of Judgment when Allah brings forth everyone for judgment. however, i am saying that if the police were correct, that this man was clearly insane (meaning, he is ill in the head and didn't truly know what he was doing because of a mental disorder), then the man is exempt by Allah because Allah does not judge the deeds of a man who is mentally ill until he becomes sane. This is from a Hadith of Rasul-e-Karim (saw). I am not disagreeing with you on the man's foolishness. But, we cannot be judges on this matter, so it is merely a tragic case of someone doing something which brings about no result.

As for disbelief, we cannot judge that. Again, he may have been insane. It is part of faith to give people benefit of the doubt when it exists. Clearly, the benefit of the doubt exists according to the article. That is all I am saying. If the man was not regarded as insane, then he clearly committed an error and his failure is a clear sign from Allah. I hope you understand what I am trying to say. I presented you two options on what this story may mean. It is either one or the other, and it is not for us to decide what this man was based only on this. Allah is the Best of Judges.

May Allah reward you for your intention to show a sign from Him. I just think this situation was not a sign for sure, since again, there is doubt on this matter on whether the man was sane or not. I repeat this so you get my point. I am not trying to be rude if that's what you think. I only clear a misunderstanding on your part. The last little bit in this article is easy to miss. So read the last paragraph again and reflect. Allah is not at all unjust to His servants. He does what He wills. To Him we belong and to Him we shall return.
:salamext:

I agree with some of what you said.

If he was insane (which we have no proof of) then :ia: he will be excused.

However there is a school of thought in psychology that believes that some people that commit terrible crimes for e.g. are not actually insane. They do it with full knowledge of what they are doing like Anders Brevik for e.g. The problem is that society cannot understand or handle the fact that such evil people exist so they just label them as psychos.

Since we don't have proof that this man was indeed a psycho, the possibility that he did what he did with full knowledge exists.

The other point you made about the ayah I posted about disbelief.

I posted that to show how Allaah is not in need of His creation. Rather they are in need of him.

I wasn't suggesting that he was a dis-believer for jumping off a building.

Everything happens by the will of Allaah.

It was the will of Allaah that this man died in this way.

Whether he was mentally ill or sane, he thought he was challenging Allaah by determining the time of his death.

The belief of a Muslim is that Allaah knew about his plan all along and let him go ahead and do what he wanted, because that was the will of Allaah.
Reply

Ahmad H
01-30-2013, 04:36 AM
Walaikum assalaam,

I see what your intention was with what you said then. I was just making sure that you kept an open mind about the matter. I agree that this situation shows that no matter what the will of Allah always reigns supreme. That I accept with full faith, since that is, I think, part of the Eman in Al-Qadar. Allah decrees everything, and He decreed the lifespan of every human being while they were in their mother`s wombs. I do not disagree with that point at all.

It was a very interesting article. I feel sorry for the guy even if he did challenge Allah knowing full well what he was doing, since he really didn`t know what he was getting into or how serious the consequence of his actions were. i truly pity that. His end was miserable in that case. You have to remember Pharaoh as well, he is a sorry case for a human being too, who challenged God and failed.
Reply

Hey there! Looks like you're enjoying the discussion, but you're not signed up for an account.

When you create an account, you can participate in the discussions and share your thoughts. You also get notifications, here and via email, whenever new posts are made. And you can like posts and make new friends.
Sign Up

IslamicBoard

Experience a richer experience on our mobile app!